Schmidt: OVC to Invite UNA, NKU

[TexasTerror]

Pretty reliable Dave Schmidt of Senior Reports just posted on his web site (http://www.theseniorreports.com/ncaad2.htm)...


According to sources - University of North Alabama and Northern Kentucky University will receive OVC invites sometime in mid- to late-July.

Hard to state how accurate this is considering UNA's concerns regarding meeting benchmarks for Division I. Perhaps UNA has some things going on behind the scenes that make this most realistic than some people associated with the program are saying elsewhere...

[kperk014]

Pretty reliable Dave Schmidt of Senior Reports just posted on his web site (http://www.theseniorreports.com/ncaad2.htm)...



Hard to state how accurate this is considering UNA's concerns regarding meeting benchmarks for Division I. Perhaps UNA has some things going on behind the scenes that make this most realistic than some people associated with the program are saying elsewhere...

Believe it or not, I'm sure UNA has been in discussions with many money sources or they wouldn't be attempting this. To just dismiss their ability off-handed without knowing what was going on behind the scenes was strange. Schools in towns with populations less than the Shoals 148,000 have made the move successfully so considering the years of study preceding this announcement, I have no doubt they have covered the bases. Some of these "associated people" were either just the first three letters of "ASSociated" or people who have their own agenda about staying D2 even though D2 is dead in our area of the country.

[WestCoastAggie]

This move was/is expected.

[TexasTerror]

Believe it or not, I'm sure UNA has been in discussions with many money sources or they wouldn't be attempting this. To just dismiss their ability off-handed without knowing what was going on behind the scenes was strange. Schools in towns with populations less than the Shoals 148,000 have made the move successfully so considering the years of study preceding this announcement, I have no doubt they have covered the bases. Some of these "associated people" were either just the first three letters of "ASSociated" or people who have their own agenda about staying D2 even though D2 is dead in our area of the country.

You are correct...

UNA must be talking to some very legitimate sources of money, because that is the only way this would work with a fan base that has become fractured. The overwhelming majority of the UNA fan base is against the move with the group of board members being the ones pushing an agenda. It'll be a big day for those board members if they can 'check off' the conference on the list of benchmarks and perhaps put some of those who feel this is a bad move to ease.

What are OVC fans thinking about adding a football member and a non-football member to the mix, if this information is accurate?

[kperk014]

You are correct...

UNA must be talking to some very legitimate sources of money, because that is the only way this would work with a fan base that has become fractured. The overwhelming majority of the UNA fan base is against the move with the group of board members being the ones pushing an agenda. It'll be a big day for those board members if they can 'check off' the conference on the list of benchmarks and perhaps put some of those who feel this is a bad move to ease.

What are OVC fans thinking about adding a football member and a non-football member to the mix, if this information is accurate?

Where do you get the "overwhelming" part from? The same fools who told you we couldn't afford it? You might want to get more reliable sources. LOL

[Redhawk2010]

What are OVC fans thinking about adding a football member and a non-football member to the mix, if this information is accurate?

I text my dad this afternoon after reading this. He's an EIU grad. His response was first "do they have football?" When I told him NKU did not, his response was "then they shouldn't be let in!"

Personally I agree, but at the same time I don't know if letting in a school without football is worse or letting in another DII school is worse. So I would probably have to say NKU is out completely. I wasn't a huge fan of the OVC adding SIUE either..

[msupigskin]

OVC admitted Belmont in the last several weeks, another school that does not play football. So, the precedent is in place.

[bp44]

Hey Trxas Terror, have you heard any updates on Lamar and SamHouston joining the Wac ???

[TexasTerror]

Where do you get the "overwhelming" part from? The same fools who told you we couldn't afford it? You might want to get more reliable sources. LOL

I've got pretty reliable sources... I do not want to show too much of my hand. ;)


I text my dad this afternoon after reading this. He's an EIU grad. His response was first "do they have football?" When I told him NKU did not, his response was "then they shouldn't be let in!"

Personally I agree, but at the same time I don't know if letting in a school without football is worse or letting in another DII school is worse. So I would probably have to say NKU is out completely. I wasn't a huge fan of the OVC adding SIUE either..

Guess - 14 is better than having 13? Divisions for all sports?


Hey Trxas Terror, have you heard any updates on Lamar and SamHouston joining the Wac ???

Bobcat Report is stating that Lamar could receive an invite soon...

I would suspect that Lamar will be the next school to receive an invite based on the promise(s) made to La Tech. It'll also make the 'Texas Twins' happy to have another Texas school. The WAC will then try all their Big Sky options again and see if anything shakes out from other avenues (particularly current FBS schools). If nothing turns up, SHSU will be the next in line... the WAC needs two football schools because having eight conference games is VERY ideal for scheduling and bowl qualifying.

[kperk014]

I've got pretty reliable sources... I do not want to show too much of my hand. ;)


I can trump that. I live here. The only naysayers I hear from wouldn't know a football from a footlong....hotdog.

[Redhawk2010]

OVC admitted Belmont in the last several weeks, another school that does not play football. So, the precedent is in place.

This is true. And the OVC allows schools to compete in other sports except football as well. Morehead State being a current one and Austin Peay being a previous one. Like I said, not a fan of the SIUE move and wasn't a huge fan of the Belmont invite. The Belmont move makes me think Tennessee State is leaving soon and the OVC wanted to keep that Nashville presence...

[JSU02]

This is true. And the OVC allows schools to compete in other sports except football as well. Morehead State being a current one and Austin Peay being a previous one. Like I said, not a fan of the SIUE move and wasn't a huge fan of the Belmont invite. The Belmont move makes me think Tennessee State is leaving soon and the OVC wanted to keep that Nashville presence...

I would have invited David Lipscomb before NKU. At least they are D-1

[dgtw]

I grew up in Florence and my wife went to Jax State so I'm a big fan of this move. This will give the OVC 14 teams, with ten for football.

I'm not a fan of leagues having non-football teams, it creates a divide between the factions and leads to leagues being too big to manage. Look at the Big East.

It will be expensive and they should have done it when Jax St. and Troy were leaving. DII is dying in the South. They may bring in a couple Florida panhandle schools and New Orleans, which are several hours away. Now they'll have old friend Jax St with five schools in Tennessee and OOCs in Samford (Terry Bowden used to coach there) and Alabama A&M is ust an hour away.

[TexasTerror]

It will be expensive and they should have done it when Jax St. and Troy were leaving. DII is dying in the South. They may bring in a couple Florida panhandle schools and New Orleans, which are several hours away. Now they'll have old friend Jax St with five schools in Tennessee and OOCs in Samford (Terry Bowden used to coach there) and Alabama A&M is ust an hour away.

Jacksonville State is on the 'fast track' to FBS...

With Jax State and Troy playing FBS by the time UNA becomes a full member of Division I, the Lions will be left behind once more. They'll get some of their older rivals, but would presume that playing Jax State and Troy annually in home-and-homes would be preferred.

The big disadvantage this go around is that they are Division I as well (like Jax State, Troy and several other schools in the immediate vicinity) and outside of football, won't be able to 'cash in' on the amount of transfers that they used to in other sports. Look for West Alabama and Alabama-Huntsville to prosper even more across the board in sports not named football with UNA's move up (if it occurs).

[dgtw]

Even if/when Jax St leaves, UNA will be better off in the FCS. They'd at least be able to get money games with FBS schools and travel overall will be much better.

[TexasTerror]

Even if/when Jax St leaves, UNA will be better off in the FCS. They'd at least be able to get money games with FBS schools and travel overall will be much better.

There's no question about getting better guarantee games and travel being significantly easier... the question is whether they have the money in place to even be competitive in the OVC on a consistent basis across the board.

The OVC is not a strong league by any means - particularly in football - but UNA's budget plans would not put it in the best positions as it enters that league. They'd need to increase the pot a bit more to get to the average of OVC football schools. UNA's projected budget would not fare much better in any other FCS scholarship league sans the SWAC.

[eiu1999]

For the OVC, they should not have added non football programs (SEIU) but now have the precedent and I agree that the conference is looking out for when a few of the current members jump.

[dbackjon]

I can't help but think more moves are in the works. 10/14 doesn't make a lot of sense - if you are going to have some non-football schools, then 9/12 works well, which is what the OVC did have. To leave that must mean that they are anticipating losing members - likely Jax State for sure. 9/14 might work as well, if Jax State left, then bring in Lipscomb

[VBR_Productions]

Any word on whether the OVC is also looking at Charlotte?

It seems like every time Charlotte is mentioned, the conversation devolves into a pissing match. I feel the need to explicitly state that this was not a shot in any way at the 49ers or their fanbase.

[MoreheadEagle]

I personally don't know how I feel about this. NKU is D-I in all but name already with facilities better than all OVC schools and national championships and rankings in most sports. UNA brings good football which will be beneficial but from a membership numbers standpoint I don't see the point in adding two more teams unless a member or two is leaving. Unless Jax State and TSU are leaving I don't see what a 14 member (10 football) conference does to boost the OVC. 12 (9 football) was perfect.

Also something to think about, with the additions of SIU-E, Belmont, and possibly NKU the OVC will have three schools that sponsor men's soccer. Will the conference add that sport?

[Redhawk2010]

I personally don't know how I feel about this. NKU is D-I in all but name already with facilities better than all OVC schools and national championships and rankings in most sports. UNA brings good football which will be beneficial but from a membership numbers standpoint I don't see the point in adding two more teams unless a member or two is leaving. Unless Jax State and TSU are leaving I don't see what a 14 member (10 football) conference does to boost the OVC. 12 (9 football) was perfect.

Also something to think about, with the additions of SIU-E, Belmont, and possibly NKU the OVC will have three schools that sponsor men's soccer. Will the conference add that sport?

University of Wisconsin-Whitewater is a powerhouse D3 school that has nicer facilities than much of the OVC as well. The only exception would be their basketball gym. They are also "D1 is everything but name" really.

And actually with SIUE, Belmont, and possibly NKU joining the conference that would actually make 4 schools with men's soccer. EIU competes in the MVC for men's soccer as it is..

[dgtw]

A conference needs to have six schools playing a sport before they can officially sponsor the sport and crown a champion. The GSC in Division II will just have five in football this year, but I think the NCAA is letting it slide for a year until Shorter comes aboard. The Big Ten (+2) will sponsor hockey once Penn State upgrades their program in a couple years.

I doubt three more schools will suddenly start a men's soccer team. doing so would require either dropping another sport or adding another sport for women.

I don't see why ten football teams is a problem. Granted, nine lets you play a full round robin with four home and away games, but with one team only playing seven games, you don't have that now.

[MoreheadEagle]

10 football teams won't be as big a problem as 14 teams in other sports (namely basketball). But, then again, you could do two divisions of 7 or go the A-10 (14) for scheduling.

[kperk014]

Jacksonville State is on the 'fast track' to FBS...

With Jax State and Troy playing FBS by the time UNA becomes a full member of Division I, the Lions will be left behind once more. They'll get some of their older rivals, but would presume that playing Jax State and Troy annually in home-and-homes would be preferred.

The big disadvantage this go around is that they are Division I as well (like Jax State, Troy and several other schools in the immediate vicinity) and outside of football, won't be able to 'cash in' on the amount of transfers that they used to in other sports. Look for West Alabama and Alabama-Huntsville to prosper even more across the board in sports not named football with UNA's move up (if it occurs).

I see you are reposting your same unintelligent posts from before. GOOD JOB! LOL

[kperk014]

There's no question about getting better guarantee games and travel being significantly easier... the question is whether they have the money in place to even be competitive in the OVC on a consistent basis across the board.

The OVC is not a strong league by any means - particularly in football - but UNA's budget plans would not put it in the best positions as it enters that league. They'd need to increase the pot a bit more to get to the average of OVC football schools. UNA's projected budget would not fare much better in any other FCS scholarship league sans the SWAC.

I would like for you to tell everyone how you know so much about UNA's finances. Of course you know absolutely NOTHING but don't let that stop you from the silly posts.

[kperk014]

Even if/when Jax St leaves, UNA will be better off in the FCS. They'd at least be able to get money games with FBS schools and travel overall will be much better.

No need to argue with him. He knows EVERYTHING (nothing) about UNA.

[TSUMadness]

I text my dad this afternoon after reading this. He's an EIU grad. His response was first "do they have football?" When I told him NKU did not, his response was "then they shouldn't be let in!"

Personally I agree, but at the same time I don't know if letting in a school without football is worse or letting in another DII school is worse. So I would probably have to say NKU is out completely. I wasn't a huge fan of the OVC adding SIUE either..

I agree Redhawk. I don't have a problem with UNA, they've been pretty good in football, but SIUE and NKU makes no sense. The OVC is selling itself short going after these d-II programs. There are division I programs far better suited for the OVC who are established and willing to join the OVC.

SIUE will probably turn out to be a great b-ball program given time, but when trying to upgrade your conference they were a bad choice.

[Cocky]

If were adding non-football schools, why isn't ETSU being mentioned. UNCC would be a terrible add in football only. I have no idea about NKU or any of their sports. TUNA is a good add.

[Redhawk2010]

I agree Redhawk. I don't have a problem with UNA, they've been pretty good in football, but SIUE and NKU makes no sense. The OVC is selling itself short going after these d-II programs. There are division I programs far better suited for the OVC who are established and willinging to join the OVC.

SIUE will probably turn out to be a great b-ball program given time, but when trying to upgrade your conference they were a bad choice.

SIUE was likely added to help "gain" that St. Louis market a little more. Austin Peay has no problem recruiting that market and SEMO and EIU are close enough too. But having somebody IN St. Louis is better than being 2 hours away. And really EIU is a non-factor in the STL for the most part-- they're rather recruit from Chicago.

[TSUMadness]

Getting the St. Louis market is what I gathered was the strategy of the OVC as well. I hope it pays off.

[BEAR]

As for UNA, all I can say is the OVC will be better with that university playing football in it. In UCA's former GSC days, schools like UNA and Valdosta really helped bring up UCA's talent and skill level. They taught the Bears how to recruit and how to play on the field (wiping away years of AIC level play) because nearly everytime UNA hit that field, it wasn't a matter of will they win, but by how much and Lion players let the opponents know it. I'm grateful for those two schools but dread seeing them or just one of them in the FCS. UNA WILL be a huge asset to the FCS level of college football. As for their finances, hopefully like UCA, the donors will come out of the woodwork and it will all work out for them. xnodx

[eiu1999]

SIUE was likely added to help "gain" that St. Louis market a little more. Austin Peay has no problem recruiting that market and SEMO and EIU are close enough too. But having somebody IN St. Louis is better than being 2 hours away. And really EIU is a non-factor in the STL for the most part-- they're rather recruit from Chicago.

Pretty true, not too many kids from downstate Illinois.

[kperk014]

As for UNA, all I can say is the OVC will be better with that university playing football in it. In UCA's former GSC days, schools like UNA and Valdosta really helped bring up UCA's talent and skill level. They taught the Bears how to recruit and how to play on the field (wiping away years of AIC level play) because nearly everytime UNA hit that field, it wasn't a matter of will they win, but by how much and Lion players let the opponents know it. I'm grateful for those two schools but dread seeing them or just one of them in the FCS. UNA WILL be a huge asset to the FCS level of college football. As for their finances, hopefully like UCA, the donors will come out of the woodwork and it will all work out for them. xnodx

I appreciate that post. Coming from someone who's actually very familiar with UNA IS important. So many of the naysayers really know very little about UNA and the fact that we've always been a basketball and baseball power too. It would be fun to get a game or two with you guys in the future. Power to the Purple!

[TexasTerror]

From the Senior Reports...


(7-25-11) - According to my contact on Friday, OVC AD meetings are today and tomorrow and he thinks UNA and NKU will get tabled until Sept, but both schools were asked to submit membership proposal and both institutions did submit. He told me it will definitely happen for NKU, UNA ...could be interesting there were comments made by Dr. Cale at the GSC Awards Banquet that have reached back to the OVC, but the press did not pick up on.

Looks like my sources were accurate re: UNA based on what I was informed by multiple sources a month or so ago...

Don't expect the OVC to take a risk until they see hard evidence that UNA can make their progress to Division I. If doubts are coming from the top and filter out, that'll be tough to accomplish.

[TexasTerror]

kperk -any comments re: the Senior Reports information that came out?

[dgtw]

Do you have a link to the full article? What were the comments made by Dr. Cole?

If UNA made a big announcement they were moving up without having all their ducks in a row then everyone involved needs to be shown door.

[TexasTerror]

Do you have a link to the full article? What were the comments made by Dr. Cole?

I posted the whole story from the Senior Reports (http://www.theseniorreports.com/ncaad2.htm). They tend to post links to stories unless they have a specific scoop. Evidently, the Dr. was not 100% sure that they would be going to Division I per Dave's scoop.


If UNA made a big announcement they were moving up without having all their ducks in a row then everyone involved needs to be shown door.

Remember... the UNA Board of Regents (or whichever their governing board is) made this decision. It was not unanimous and came against the wishes of the student body, faculty and staff of the institution - in addition to a climate pretty divided amongst UNA fans and alum.

While the AD, President and others may believe something else (and according to Senior Reports' sources - that may base the case), but they have been tasked with following through - so they have to present a very positive spin to what is occurring.

I give kudos to those concerned for making sure that benchmarks need to be in place and feel bad for those tasked with the duties of getting the benchmarks accomplished, since until proven otherwise - there is just not clarity on whether they can be reached. The UNA athletic department is very much, one in limbo. They have to abide by D2 rules and continue to be D2 until the pieces are in place. The OVC won't touch them unless their are greater assurances, so that may be a few months or even years out.

And what do you if you are a student-athlete? You are not sure when/if you are going to be able to compete for championships. The longer this thing goes on, the longer student-athletes are in a bad spot. The coaches are too...

Talked to a guy that has plenty of family and others contacts in Florence. Said they were all 100% against the move to Division I. This is still very much a divided issue with some of the D2 people hopping on board with the D1 bandwagon because they want to go along with the flow as that is what "is best for the institution".

Time will tell... UNA has to show progression towards the benchmarks or this could be a big mess... will be fun to watch! ;)

[kperk014]

I posted the whole story from the Senior Reports (http://www.theseniorreports.com/ncaad2.htm). They tend to post links to stories unless they have a specific scoop. Evidently, the Dr. was not 100% sure that they would be going to Division I per Dave's scoop.



Remember... the UNA Board of Regents (or whichever their governing board is) made this decision. It was not unanimous and came against the wishes of the student body, faculty and staff of the institution - in addition to a climate pretty divided amongst UNA fans and alum.

While the AD, President and others may believe something else (and according to Senior Reports' sources - that may base the case), but they have been tasked with following through - so they have to present a very positive spin to what is occurring.

I give kudos to those concerned for making sure that benchmarks need to be in place and feel bad for those tasked with the duties of getting the benchmarks accomplished, since until proven otherwise - there is just not clarity on whether they can be reached. The UNA athletic department is very much, one in limbo. They have to abide by D2 rules and continue to be D2 until the pieces are in place. The OVC won't touch them unless their are greater assurances, so that may be a few months or even years out.

And what do you if you are a student-athlete? You are not sure when/if you are going to be able to compete for championships. The longer this thing goes on, the longer student-athletes are in a bad spot. The coaches are too...

Talked to a guy that has plenty of family and others contacts in Florence. Said they were all 100% against the move to Division I. This is still very much a divided issue with some of the D2 people hopping on board with the D1 bandwagon because they want to go along with the flow as that is what "is best for the institution".

Time will tell... UNA has to show progression towards the benchmarks or this could be a big mess... will be fun to watch! ;)

UNA and Florence is no different from any other school or city. They have their share of p**sies including your guy, his family and friends and you can tell them I said so. No offense intended. The only description that's adequate. If those "people" want to support a D2 school, let them drive several hundred miles away to find one and support it.

[TexasTerror]

No response related to the alleged remarks made your President? ;)

[kperk014]

I have no idea what he's said if it's something new. From what I've heard him say recently, it seems he's trying to straddle the fence. He doesn't want to tick off the pro-growth group OR the pro-rot group. Not the kind of president I like but he has the title. ;)

http://glitternight.com/2011/07/28/whered-everybody-go-life-in-the-depleted-gulf-south-conference/

[kperk014]

Do you have a link to the full article? What were the comments made by Dr. Cole?

If UNA made a big announcement they were moving up without having all their ducks in a row then everyone involved needs to be shown door.

You have to remember, some on here.....scratch that. ONE on here has an obvious axe to grind and he's gonna keep grinding it as long as he can on behalf of his gutless, clueless friends. Once again I'm not meaning that as an insult, merely a solid fact.

[TexasTerror]

I have no idea what he's said if it's something new. From what I've heard him say recently, it seems he's trying to straddle the fence. He doesn't want to tick off the pro-growth group OR the pro-rot group. Not the kind of president I like but he has the title. ;)

http://glitternight.com/2011/07/28/whered-everybody-go-life-in-the-depleted-gulf-south-conference/

Of interest, an article from Shorter states that Union (Tenn.) is examining adding football...

"Also joining the Gulf South Conference is Union University (Tenn.), which like Shorter has been affiliated with the NAIA. A long-time power in the TranSouth Conference, Union is reportedly in discussions about starting a football program." (Credit: Shorter Athletics (http://goshorterhawks.com/features/072911transition))

So, already got Shorter and possibly Union.

On top of that, West Florida is moving ahead with plans to add football as is New Orleans, which is putting out football info. As a Southland fan, this is great news, as it provides more D2 opponents for guarantee games in the region and quite frankly, more competitive OOC games than the SWAC can give us.

Was never impressed with the Arkansas schools in football, so this may be a great thing for UNA if they continue to have issues with the finances and the internal side of things (as obvious by comments by the President).


You have to remember, some on here.....scratch that. ONE on here has an obvious axe to grind and he's gonna keep grinding it as long as he can on behalf of his gutless, clueless friends. Once again I'm not meaning that as an insult, merely a solid fact.

No axe to grind. I am not a fan of the OVC or North Alabama - so I have no reason to pick a side here. I'm just hearing from repeated sources, including the Senior Reports that the school has some serious financial hurdles to overcome... if a school is not going to be able to financially commit to being a Division I institution, why bother?

[kperk014]

Of interest, an article from Shorter states that Union (Tenn.) is examining adding football...

"Also joining the Gulf South Conference is Union University (Tenn.), which like Shorter has been affiliated with the NAIA. A long-time power in the TranSouth Conference, Union is reportedly in discussions about starting a football program." (Credit: Shorter Athletics (http://goshorterhawks.com/features/072911transition))

So, already got Shorter and possibly Union.

On top of that, West Florida is moving ahead with plans to add football as is New Orleans, which is putting out football info. As a Southland fan, this is great news, as it provides more D2 opponents for guarantee games in the region and quite frankly, more competitive OOC games than the SWAC can give us.

Was never impressed with the Arkansas schools in football, so this may be a great thing for UNA if they continue to have issues with the finances and the internal side of things (as obvious by comments by the President).



No axe to grind. I am not a fan of the OVC or North Alabama - so I have no reason to pick a side here. I'm just hearing from repeated sources, including the Senior Reports that the school has some serious financial hurdles to overcome... if a school is not going to be able to financially commit to being a Division I institution, why bother?

IF West Florida adds football, you can bet they will put themselves on a fast track for DI. Union is a giant IF about adding football and UNO is not much better. I still say Johnny Williams said it best when he said, "You're either green and growing or you're ripe and rotting." We aren't rotting but we definitely have little enthusiasm for D2 sports anymore. As an ardent supporter of 45 years, it's hard to get excited about where we are now. We have accomplished much more than most and more than practically any school still in D2. The plans that have been laid out ARE exciting not only for athletics but the university in general and more and more people are beginning to see it that way. With the estimated growth in enrollment and the accompanying building projects will be a huge shot in the arm to our economy. The people who want us to remain in neutral are short-sighted and gutless including Cale if he thinks that way. Sure it will take a lot of hard work but the benefits for northwest Alabama, northeast Mississippi and south central Tennessee will be well worth it.

[TexasTerror]

Response from Schmidt... "It went from being a done deal to, submit an application and we will discuss."

[dgtw]

Dave's website looks like it was put together by a junior high school computer class.

[TexasTerror]

Dave's website looks like it was put together by a junior high school computer class.

It's pretty 'amateur' looking, but it is a great reference point for articles regarding realignment at the D2, D3, NAIA/others level. Probably the most comprehensive 'one stop shopping' for such information to the point that College Sports Info uses the site regularly to cover the non-D1 happenings.

Further, I've talked to people throughout the NCAA that actually utilize the site and Schmidt even tends to interview some of those same people. I do not think we all realize how much the NCAA, conference offices, institutions, etc. play around on such sites.