Lehigh Offense to Emphasize More Running?

[ngineer]

An interview with new HC Andy Coen in the Express-Times today seemed to show the coach's thinking regarding his offense. With a QB who can run very well, and a speedy tailback in Marques Thompson returning, we now add to the mix a big stud running back transfering from Kent State, where he redshirted as a freshman last year. Josh Pastore, 5'11-6' and 215 lbs lead his hs to two Ohio State championships. Lehigh has not had a 'big' back since Rabih Abdullah in the late 1990's. With Pastore pounding between the tackles this provides Lehigh with a lot more 'options'; plus with two good tight ends returning will allow the Mountain Hawks to throw from a two TE set keeping defenses off balance.
Spring practice will start for Lehigh the last weekend of March and will culminate with the Brown & White Game on April 22 in Goodman Stadium.

[carney2]

That would be quite a change. It's been Air Lehigh since Kim McQuilken got his first pilot's license back in the early 70's. Abdullah is the only top notch running threat that I can recall during those decades. Most of the others have been like Rath and Jean - very quick but a little too undersized to be a real threat between the tackles. They were there primarily to give defenses something to consider while the air force reloaded.

Here's the question - and I certainly don't have an answer - would a shift of offensive philosophy be a long term plus for the Lehigh football program? Since McQuilken, Lehigh has been able to recruit a seemingly endless stream of talented, strong armed QB's and a lot of solid receivers to complement them. The list reads like a series of knife wounds to my heart. They did it because they could honestly tell recruits that "We throw it and we throw it often." Will they be able to make that same promise and keep that Air Lehigh pipeline filled with a more "balanced" attack? Let's face it, QB's and receivers like to go where they will be showcased.

[Go Lehigh TU Owl]

I said it after this season that Lehigh needs to refocus on Defense and the running game. To be a serious contender nationally you have to be able to run the ball and control the clock i believe. Especially given the weather conditions the pop up in early December around the country. Lehigh was not able to come up with big defensive stops when they needed to this past year and it cost them in a big way. On offense they had trouble grinding out the clock and wearing down their opponents D like they were able to do 4-5 years ago. Lehigh is the odd man in this league when it comes to offensive strategies. Lafayette, Colgate and Bucknell are known for their running games and physical play. Gtown runs a lot more then they pass which has a lot to do with their QB situation and Fordham become more run orientated since clawson left. Lehigh is really the only finesse style team they run an offense similar to Urban Meyers at Florida. Lembo seemed like he thought he could beat teams with talent alone by running the other team off the field. If you were better prepared and execute the gameplan you should win and that wasn't always the case as it turned out. That to me was really his biggest downfall. Lehigh needed a big back to be able to do the things i mentioned. I thought Lehigh's most dangerous team was the 2003 team that didn't make it to the playoffs. They had a great defense and an offense that was just good enough, but had gotten better as the year went one. A team like that with a little more explosiveness on offense is what i want to see.

[colgate13]

I don't think we'll see that big of a change in offense for Lehigh. Coen was the OC back in the Air Lehigh days of old, no?

The running issue back situation could be a desire to bring some balance to the team, as well as it could have to do with personnel. Didn't Lehigh lose like 4-5 receivers to graduation? If so, you've sometimes got to go with what you have...

[blukeys]

I don't think we'll see that big of a change in offense for Lehigh. Coen was the OC back in the Air Lehigh days of old, no?

The running issue back situation could be a desire to bring some balance to the team, as well as it could have to do with personnel. Didn't Lehigh lose like 4-5 receivers to graduation? If so, you've sometimes got to go with what you have...

Agreed. It sounds like he is playing the hand he's been dealt.

[ngineer]

Lehigh will still be passing the ball, but will just run more. Rather than 60-40 pass/run, I think it will be more 50-50. When McQuilken played Lehigh still ran the ball more than passed. We had a great back, Jack Rizzo who teamed with Don Diorio for a hellava backfield--posted 506 yards rushing against Lafayette in 1971. That followed with a a few big backs--one Rod Gardner who ripped between the tackles..The 'Air Lehigh' didn't become so weighted toward the pass until Hank Small took over in 1986. Yes, Lehigh had some great QB's under Dunlap and Whitehead, but the run game still had just as much promenance.
As for WR's we do have one starter returning--Lee Thomas from Louisiana who had a very good year. There are some very good sophs who will now get their chance and may well surprise. With Threatt, you're going to see some 'run & shoot', shotgun and no-huddle, as Coen said in the article. The addition of Pastore gives Lehigh a dimension they haven't had for about 10 years. When Abdullah played, Lehigh still threw the ball, but now on third and three, teams will have to respect the run.

[colgate13]

Lehigh will still be passing the ball, but will just run more. Rather than 60-40 pass/run, I think it will be more 50-50.

Call me crazy, but the more I think about it isn't the 'Air Lehigh' image more image than reality lately? Looking at a few games last year:

Lehigh vs. Colgate (run to pass): 49-30
Lehigh vs. Lafayette: 42-39
Lehigh vs. Delaware: 37-53
Lehigh vs. Harvard: 40-39
Lehigh vs. Yale: 26-51
Lehigh vs. Fordham: 45-35
Lehigh vs. Holy Cross: 54-17

Looking at that list (I didn't do them all because I think I got my point), Lehigh's been fairly balanced to begin with. I know that with Threatt starting maybe some more run was thrown in there, but that doesn't explain Harvard.

I think the majority of PL teams are balanced. Bucknell comes to mind as the exception with their option focus.


As for WR's we do have one starter returning--Lee Thomas from Louisiana who had a very good year.

Thomas did have a good season. I forgot about him. You will need to find a #2 though to have things open up for Threatt.


With Threatt, you're going to see some 'run & shoot', shotgun and no-huddle, as Coen said in the article.

Related to above, but he needs a deep option or else teams will have a better chance to bottle him up.


The addition of Pastore gives Lehigh a dimension they haven't had for about 10 years.

Maybe Lehigh folks know more than the rest of us, but forgive me if I'm not too focused on a Kent State transfer. Maybe he'll pan out, but IMO your rushing hopes lie in the ability of Thompson to become the feature back.

[LUHawker]

Maybe Lehigh folks know more than the rest of us, but forgive me if I'm not too focused on a Kent State transfer. Maybe he'll pan out, but IMO your rushing hopes lie in the ability of Thompson to become the feature back.

I agree that Thompson will be the feature back, but for the first time in quite a while, Lehigh might have a power back to complement the scat back sets.

[colgate13]

I agree that Thompson will be the feature back, but for the first time in quite a while, Lehigh might have a power back to complement the scat back sets.

Maybe he's gained weight, but 5-11, 210 lbs. is 'normal' in my book, not power. He's got to put on another 10-15 to get in that 'power' range IMO.

But I do agree; he's (on paper at least) is of a different build than the Rath's of the world.

[LUHawker]

Maybe he's gained weight, but 5-11, 210 lbs. is 'normal' in my book, not power. He's got to put on another 10-15 to get in that 'power' range IMO.

But I do agree; he's (on paper at least) is of a different build than the Rath's of the world.

We haven't had a Jamaal Branch or Jordan Scott type in a while on South Mountain, so for us, 210 lbs. is "power".

[colgate13]

We haven't had a Jamaal Branch or Jordan Scott type in a while on South Mountain, so for us, 210 lbs. is "power".

Good point. Branch was listed at 225 (but I don't buy that - more like 230+). Scott is listed at 200, but I bet he's more like 205+. I actually don't consider Scott to be a power back as much as he's just a workhorse. But that also could be because I'm just used to Colgate football.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

We haven't had a Jamaal Branch or Jordan Scott type in a while on South Mountain, so for us, 210 lbs. is "power".

Rath, while not a traditional "power" back, not only performed that role for us, he did it extremely well.

Folks are also mentioning Abdullah as a "power back" - he wasn't one, strictly speaking. Rabih could have been the most athletic back Lehigh has ever had. He was big and tall (especially at our level at the time) but what really set him apart was his breakaway speed in the open field. Versus Cornell he broke the single-game rushing record with 2 huge breakaways for TDs. Sure, he could also run between the tackles, but I wouldn't call him a "power back" in the mould of Branch.

Hard to say, in February, what impact Pastore will have on Lehigh's offense - if any. I do know that Kent St. tried to convert him to safety, so he wasn't considered on the depth chart as a RB there. I also know that I'm quite happy to see a bunch of backs in camp, and Pastore's presence will enable the best guys to emerge.

It will make for a more interesting spring.

[ngineer]

Rath, while not a traditional "power" back, not only performed that role for us, he did it extremely well.

Folks are also mentioning Abdullah as a "power back" - he wasn't one, strictly speaking. Rabih could have been the most athletic back Lehigh has ever had. He was big and tall (especially at our level at the time) but what really set him apart was his breakaway speed in the open field. Versus Cornell he broke the single-game rushing record with 2 huge breakaways for TDs. Sure, he could also run between the tackles, but I wouldn't call him a "power back" in the mould of Branch.

Hard to say, in February, what impact Pastore will have on Lehigh's offense - if any. I do know that Kent St. tried to convert him to safety, so he wasn't considered on the depth chart as a RB there. I also know that I'm quite happy to see a bunch of backs in camp, and Pastore's presence will enable the best guys to emerge.

It will make for a more interesting spring.

Gotta correct you on that one LFN. Jack Rizzo versus Lafayette in 1971 rumbled for 313 on 31 carries. Abudullah's Cornell performance in 1995 was 266 on 22 carries. I give you Rabih had a higher yard/carry, but Jack still holds the single game record for rushing yards. I also got to witness both performances :D
If Kent tried to convert Pastore to safety, tells me he has some speed. 5'10/11" and 215 lb (as reported in Express-Times) is a 'big' back in Lehigh's recent history. I certainly see Marques as the 'feature' back with his blazing speed, but this additional presence should take away some of the focus from the defense. April 22 should be fun to watch.

[ngineer]

Call me crazy, but the more I think about it isn't the 'Air Lehigh' image more image than reality lately? Looking at a few games last year:

Lehigh vs. Colgate (run to pass): 49-30
Lehigh vs. Lafayette: 42-39
Lehigh vs. Delaware: 37-53
Lehigh vs. Harvard: 40-39
Lehigh vs. Yale: 26-51
Lehigh vs. Fordham: 45-35
Lehigh vs. Holy Cross: 54-17

Looking at that list (I didn't do them all because I think I got my point), Lehigh's been fairly balanced to begin with. I know that with Threatt starting maybe some more run was thrown in there, but that doesn't explain Harvard.

I think the majority of PL teams are balanced. Bucknell comes to mind as the exception with their option focus.



Thomas did have a good season. I forgot about him. You will need to find a #2 though to have things open up for Threatt.



Related to above, but he needs a deep option or else teams will have a better chance to bottle him up.



Maybe Lehigh folks know more than the rest of us, but forgive me if I'm not too focused on a Kent State transfer. Maybe he'll pan out, but IMO your rushing hopes lie in the ability of Thompson to become the feature back.

Some of those games have to be viewed in context. First pre versus post Threatt and secondly, nature of game. The Holy Cross game was the infamous Monsoon. I'm surprised we even tried 17 passes. Fordham was out of control by halftime, and Lembo ran the ball so not to embarrass an already embarrassed Ram squad. Harvard was also lopsided by the fourth quarter where the run took precedence. I think the run/pass stats can be misleading when you have a game where the outcome is virtually decided by either halftime or end of third quarter. When the game is still on the line, is best to determine what the real 'game plan' would be.
I do agree that Lehigh's WR's will have to 'step up' and fill a void, but supposedly we had some pretty good recruits there the past two years, so we'll see who has grown up.

[*****]

An interview with new HC Andy Coen in the Express-Times today...Link?

[blukeys]

Some of those games have to be viewed in context. First pre versus post Threatt and secondly, nature of game. The Holy Cross game was the infamous Monsoon. I'm surprised we even tried 17 passes. Fordham was out of control by halftime, and Lembo ran the ball so not to embarrass an already embarrassed Ram squad. Harvard was also lopsided by the fourth quarter where the run took precedence. I think the run/pass stats can be misleading when you have a game where the outcome is virtually decided by either halftime or end of third quarter.




Hmmm, so running the ball when a team is leading is a merciful way to end the game without embarassing the team. That's funny because when Delaware would do it with 2nd and 3rd line backs certain a retired Lehigh Valley reporter (initials PR) called this "running up the score"

Just another shot at my all time favorite UD hating reporter still waiting for the next opportunity to trash the Hens.:nod: :nod: :nod: :D
"running up the score

[blukeys]

Some of those games have to be viewed in context. First pre versus post Threatt and secondly, nature of game. The Holy Cross game was the infamous Monsoon. I'm surprised we even tried 17 passes. Fordham was out of control by halftime, and Lembo ran the ball so not to embarrass an already embarrassed Ram squad. Harvard was also lopsided by the fourth quarter where the run took precedence. I think the run/pass stats can be misleading when you have a game where the outcome is virtually decided by either halftime or end of third quarter.




Hmmm, so running the ball when a team is leading is a merciful way to end the game without embarassing the team. That's funny because when Delaware would do it with 2nd and 3rd line backs a certain retired Lehigh Valley reporter (initials PR) called this "running up the score"

Just another shot at my all time favorite UD hating reporter still waiting for the next opportunity to trash the Hens.:nod: :nod: :nod: :D

[ngineer]

Hmmm, so running the ball when a team is leading is a merciful way to end the game without embarassing the team. That's funny because when Delaware would do it with 2nd and 3rd line backs a certain retired Lehigh Valley reporter (initials PR) called this "running up the score"

Just another shot at my all time favorite UD hating reporter still waiting for the next opportunity to trash the Hens.:nod: :nod: :nod: :D

Hey, I agree with your view of Rheinhard. He always had a grouse about someone or something. And if you have a 'grouse' you might as well go after a 'hen'.;)

[ngineer]

Link?
Sorry Ralph. I don't have a link--I actually read the interview in the newsPAPER.:) If you 'Google' "Easton Express-Times" you'll probably get their website.

[blukeys]

Hey, I agree with your view of Rheinhard. He always had a grouse about someone or something. And if you have a 'grouse' you might as well go after a 'hen'.;)


LMAO

:lmao: :lmao: :lmao: :lmao:

:lmao: :lmao: :lmao: :lmao:

:lmao: :lmao: :lmao: :lmao:

I also think he and Tubby had a personality conflict and there was no need to "egg" the conflict on.

[colgate13]

Back to the subject of Lehigh in 2006, this thought has been sitting at the back of my mind for a bit. Let me bounce it off AGS and see how it flies!

Lembo left Lehigh for probably a host of reasons. Could one of them also be he saw what was coming in the program for the next year or two and thought he should go out as close to 'on top' as possible?

The reason I have this thought is because what happened at Fordham after Clawson left. Yes, there were plenty of reasons why he left, but one of them had to be that he saw some tougher years ahead now that his stars were graduating. Consequently, Fordham has had two tough years and, watching them play, I did see a lack of talent there that I'm sure Clawson did too.

Could Lembo have saw something similar? Threatt is your superstar in the making, but there will be a lot of change over this year. Could 2006 be a 'down' year for Lehigh football? Could Lembo have taken the Elon job because maybe it wouldn't have been around after a 6-5 or so season?

Just wondering out loud, no smack meant...

[Fordham]

Interesting spark for discussion gate, although it's one of those things that will obviously only be answered after we see how the season plays out. Even then it'll just be good message board fodder since a down season may be rationalized for any number of reasons that don't have to do with Lembo reading the tea leaves.

Regarding Clawson, who is revered by our program (given the results he produced in an environment where no one else has produced much of anything, I would argue deservedly so), I guess that's always the risk when you hire someone who clearly has the next job on his mind. There is an incentive there to scrap everything and play nearly all freshmen with the idea that the first two seasons don't matter but after that you'll have a bunch of kids who have alot of experience and you can make your run for a year or two. It also helps with recruiting since you can both promise and deliver on the opportunity to play as a freshman. The hole is whether or not there is enough of an incentive to build something sustainable versus having that great year or two and then moving on. I think we're clearly still trying to determine whether or not we're a program that should expect to compete every year or if we just caught lightning in an bottle in that 2 - 3 year run with Dave.

Much like my first comment, there's no way to tell though so it just becomes speculation. If Clawson had stayed would he have produced different results than Foley with the same group? Many posters think so but who knows?

When I read your comment it reminded me a bit of Herm Edwards with the Jets. It was likely that another bad or even mediocre year would have resulted in his dismissal but moving to the Chiefs gives him a fresh start and much more mid-term (3 - 4 years or more) job security than he would have had if he had stayed in NY.

[colgate13]

When I read your comment it reminded me a bit of Herm Edwards with the Jets. It was likely that another bad or even mediocre year would have resulted in his dismissal but moving to the Chiefs gives him a fresh start and much more mid-term (3 - 4 years or more) job security than he would have had if he had stayed in NY.

Good analogy.

Yes, it's all speculation. But fun to talk about in March none the less!

[Fordham]

No doubt.

Just like I'm sure the Lehigh guys would rather discuss who might be on Duke's short list should their HC job open up.

;)

[LEHIGH61]

Granted, Lembo probably had his most talented team in 2005, a team that suffered three extremely bizarre losses (hard to believe that (3) games like that could happen to one team in one season). They were, quite frankly, SNAKE-BITTEN. With any luck at all, they would have been ranked in the top 4 at season's end.

Sure, a lot of senior talent left last year, but recruiting has been excellent for a number of years, so Lehigh will be formidable for the foreseeable future. And the coaching staff is second to none. They should be able to trim the edges for another successful season in 2006 and on into the future.

Lembo had a very lucrative offer to go to Elon, and it was an opportunity he could not refuse.

[colgate13]

Granted, Lembo probably had his most talented team in 2005, a team that suffered three extremely bizarre losses (hard to believe that (3) games like that could happen to one team in one season). They were, quite frankly, SNAKE-BITTEN. With any luck at all, they would have been ranked in the top 4 at season's end.

Sure, a lot of senior talent left last year, but recruiting has been excellent for a number of years, so Lehigh will be formidable for the foreseeable future. And the coaching staff is second to none. They should be able to trim the edges for another successful season in 2006 and on into the future.

Lembo had a very lucrative offer to go to Elon, and it was an opportunity he could not refuse.

http://img3.buzznet.com/assets/users8/deepshadows/deepshadowspeople/gallery-msg-1121206611-2.jpg

"Lehigh's going to be the best! They should have won the whole thing last year! We've got the best coaches! The best recruits! Woo-hoo!"

[Lafalumni29]

Lehigh has a coaching staff that is second to none?????!!!!!! Whoa!!! A bit premature, don't you think? Just be sure you're around to take the firing squad when that staff can't live match the Higgins era.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

http://img3.buzznet.com/assets/users8/deepshadows/deepshadowspeople/gallery-msg-1121206611-2.jpg

"Lehigh's going to be the best! They should have won the whole thing last year! We've got the best coaches! The best recruits! Woo-hoo!"

Happy spring. :) Don't all fans here sound this way this time of year? "Jordan Scott's going to rush for 2,000 yards!" "Watch out for a 30-TD year from a healthy Brad Maurer next year!"

[LUHawker]

Back to the subject of Lehigh in 2006, this thought has been sitting at the back of my mind for a bit. Let me bounce it off AGS and see how it flies!

Lembo left Lehigh for probably a host of reasons. Could one of them also be he saw what was coming in the program for the next year or two and thought he should go out as close to 'on top' as possible?

The reason I have this thought is because what happened at Fordham after Clawson left. Yes, there were plenty of reasons why he left, but one of them had to be that he saw some tougher years ahead now that his stars were graduating. Consequently, Fordham has had two tough years and, watching them play, I did see a lack of talent there that I'm sure Clawson did too.

Could Lembo have saw something similar? Threatt is your superstar in the making, but there will be a lot of change over this year. Could 2006 be a 'down' year for Lehigh football? Could Lembo have taken the Elon job because maybe it wouldn't have been around after a 6-5 or so season?

Just wondering out loud, no smack meant...

13- That's an interesting thought, but I think, a misplaced one. Comparing the strength and relatively lengthy period of success of the Lehigh program at this level to that of Fordham's is probably unfair to Fordham and also to Lembo. Fordham hasn't established the track record of success that Lehigh has and Clawson was able to have a nice run with Eakin Dudley and Watson, but even under Lembo, Lehigh had a solid, established program. If Lembo was reading any tea leaves, it was his likely ouster, not the downfall of the program.

[colgate13]

13- That's an interesting thought, but I think, a misplaced one. Comparing the strength and relatively lengthy period of success of the Lehigh program at this level to that of Fordham's is probably unfair to Fordham and also to Lembo. Fordham hasn't established the track record of success that Lehigh has and Clawson was able to have a nice run with Eakin Dudley and Watson, but even under Lembo, Lehigh had a solid, established program. If Lembo was reading any tea leaves, it was his likely ouster, not the downfall of the program.

Thank you Hawker. That's the kind of reasoned response I was looking for.

I was just kinda speculating out loud...

Lehigh's been too good for too long to just fall flat, unless Lembo really f'd things up. But then I think we would have been hearing about it...

[ngineer]

Pete's reasons for leaving were as I stated earlier. He was getting 'heat' for not having a better season than everyone expected, including the loss to Lafayette. When you're considered 'bad' at 8-3, it takes a lot of joy out of going to work. At the same time, he knew he wasn't going to stay at Lehigh for the next 30 years,(he's only 35) either, and if someone is going to 'move up' the coaching food chain, one has to take a chance at what is perceived as an opportunity to embellish his resume. Elon is a no-lose proposition. He he turns that program into a winner in that conference--he'll be on his way to I-A. If not, than it will be seen as the institution's problem, since they haven't been able to win with what they've been investing to date.
Pete also told me before leaving that "Lehigh is in good shape". He was very high on Threatt last spring and saw him as another Brant Hall of the future; so there wasn't any 'cupboard is bare' concern that led to his leaving.

[Fordham]

Pete also told me before leaving that "Lehigh is in good shape". He was very high on Threatt last spring and saw him as another Brant Hall of the future; so there wasn't any 'cupboard is bare' concern that led to his leaving.

I agree with your post overall but got a little chuckle out of Pete saying that it's in good shape ... what do you think he's gonna say?

"Phew, thank God I got out of there in time! No offense, but the next guy will be a miracle worker if he gets a good season out of THAT mess!"

;)

[LUHawker]

Pete's reasons for leaving were as I stated earlier. He was getting 'heat' for not having a better season than everyone expected, including the loss to Lafayette. When you're considered 'bad' at 8-3, it takes a lot of joy out of going to work.

Pete's recent run of 8-3ish seasons and his feeling that those are great seasons are misleading. He failed to defeat an A-10 team since 2001, he lost to Lafayette 3 of the last 4 years and presided over teams that feel flat at times. Taking out the wins against weak competition like G-Town, Bucknell, Albany, Liberty, etc., Pete was at best 5-3 or even 4-3 against good teams. Not to demean the strength of that competition, but that type of record is hardly inspiring. In the end, Pete's squads defeated the teams they should have, occassionally defeated similarly-talented teams (ie Colgate, Fordham) and lost to (supposedly) better teams (UD, JMU, VU). I think when you peel back the onion, Pete's record was average.

[hawkineer]

When you're considered 'bad' at 8-3, it takes a lot of joy out of going to work.
You can whine about being underappreciated or you can take it as a challenge. Pete whined and left the University. His attitude about being constantly compared to Higgins was disgusting. Anyone who has a real job eventually follows someone who was a star in the company. Most successful people work their a$$ off the create their own legacy rather than whine about trying to live up to expectations set by their predecessor. Pete's focus was on looking backwards rather than forward. Hence, he was more worried about Higgins legacy than his own. A LOOOOOOSER with a winning record. See ya!

[ngineer]

I really don't disagree with any of the above posts. What I consider Lembo's primary problem was his 'thin skin'. A Head Football Coach at a program such as Lehigh is going to expected to produce, as well as be questioned when a game doesn't go the way 'we' expected. He was 'prickly' with the local press and alums whenever someone questioned any play calling or strategy. Being able to stand up and take such questions is part of the job description in a program where you have a lot of passionate alumni who want to see success. It will be interesting to see how he responds at Elon when the 'right side of the ledger' outweighs the left. At the same time, learning to deal with and overcoming losing is
going to be a learning experience for him, having started at the top at Lehigh.