Second Round Attendance

[superman7515]

North Dakota State Bison vs Montana State Bobcats - 14,277 - @ Montana St

Lehigh Mountain Hawks vs Delaware Fightin' Blue Hens - 13,649 @ Delaware

Western Illinois Leathernecks vs Appalachian State Mountaineers - 13,322 @ App St

Wofford Terriers vs Jacksonville State Gamecocks - 11,817 @ Jacksonville

Georgia Southern Eagles vs William & Mary Tribe - 8,243 @ William & Mary

New Hampshire Wildcats vs Bethune-Cookman Wildcats - 5,738 @ Bethune-Cookman

Villanova Wildcats vs Stephen F Austin Lumberjacks - 4,938 @ Stephen F Austin

Southeast Missouri State Redhawks vs Eastern Washington Eagles - 3,665 @ Eastern Washington

[DSUrocks07]

Low attendance across the board...what were the numbers for the second round (first round) last year?




Lehigh Mountain Hawks vs Delaware Fightin' Blue Hens - 13,649 @ Delaware


That can't be right...they weren't playing Del State, which I heard that UD fans don't care about and would be their lowest attended game of any season...xrolleyesx

[Wildcat80]

Cold weather and travel distances affected most. Surprised by Del-Lehigh though??

[TheBisonator]

3,665 at EWU and we travel to them next week. I bet Bison fans can potentially make up 2/3 of the crowd.

BISON HOME GAME!!!

[BlueHenSinfonian]

I never understood why playoff games are less attended than regular season games. Everything is on the line for every playoff game, those are the ones that should have you camping out for tickets and sitting on the edge of your seat throughout. Who cares if it's a bit chilly?

[stevdock]

With those attendence numbers how much longer is it going to be until every game is a bid process instead of the non-seeded games?? NDSU probably would have had a home crowd bigger than all of today's game if they were at home.

[superman7515]

I've heard a lot of excuses, some more reasonable than others (obviously not all apply for every game this weekend). Students have to pay for tickets, it's too close to the holidays and people have other things that the money is needed for, it's cold, the games are available on tv/internet for viewing, unfamiliar opponents, distances to travel to games, etc.

[ASU_Fanatic]

Sad that we had our worst crowd of the year by 14,000+ but still had the third biggest crowd of the day at a playoff game.

[KiddBrewer]

i thought the crowd was pretty dang solid (and loud) in boone today, considering the weather conditions. xthumbsupx

[Old Cat Fan]

With those attendence numbers how much longer is it going to be until every game is a bid process instead of the non-seeded games?? NDSU probably would have had a home crowd bigger than all of today's game if they were at home.

Thats part of the problem bidding, UNH at home would of had 10000+ can't get a game cause were always outbid, or our stadium sucks, so the diehard fans that support the program year in and year out gets the shaft

[UNHFan]

Its also students being on campus. This is our down fall with having the best system in college football :) Just as the BCS has its flaws I dont see FCS ever getting around this fact. Look at App state if students where on campus ESPN would have been proud to cover its game its just timing. Would love to hear constructive thoughts on this topic. How does the FCS get around play-offs being held during vacations?

[ElonAlum]

WOW those numbers are pathetic! What happened at Eastern Washington!?? Most playoff HIGH SCHOOLS have that many fans there!

I really hope things look better next weekend!

[superman7515]

By % of stadium filled -

GSU @ W&M - 96.4%
NDSU @ Montana St - 94.8%
Wofford @ JSU - 78.7%
Lehigh @ Delaware - 62%
WIU @ App St - 61.5%
UNH @ BC - 57.3%
Nova @ SFA - 32.9%
SEMO @ EWU - 31.3%

[stevdock]

Its also students being on campus. This is our down fall with having the best system in college football :) Just as the BCS has its flaws I dont see FCS ever getting around this fact. Look at App state if students where on campus ESPN would have been proud to cover its game its just timing. Would love to hear constructive thoughts on this topic. How does the FCS get around play-offs being held during vacations?

For most schools, I thought they did when they added the play-in games??

[apaladin]

Keep in mind attendance announced is what has to be paid for. There are no inflated figures. These figures are what were actually paid for. No freebies, even students have to pay.

[Side Judge]

By % of stadium filled -

GSU @ W&M - 96.4%
NDSU @ Montana St - 94.8%
Wofford @ JSU - 78.7%
Lehigh @ Delaware - 62%
WIU @ App St - 61.5%
UNH @ BC - 57.3%
Nova @ SFA - 32.9%
SEMO @ EWU - 31.3%

I was at the Delaware game - the Tub was more than 62% full...

[Big Dawg]

Economy, maybe...I mean how much does it cost for fans to travel and buy tickets to a game?

[citdog]

I was at the Delaware game - the Tub was more than 62% full...

so were you I would hazard

[superman7515]

I was at the Delaware game - the Tub was more than 62% full...

I was at the Delaware game. I don't think it was.

[BlueHenSinfonian]

Economy, maybe...I mean how much does it cost for fans to travel and buy tickets to a game?

You may have a point for the visiting team attendance, but for the teams that regularly draw capacity home crowds, like Delaware and App State, there doesn't seem to be as much of an excuse. Fall session is still going on at UD, so the students should still be there, and at the end of the day, the students don't make up the majority of attendance. Plus, the game vs. Lehigh was an old school rivalry that the older fans should've eaten up, so the non-traditional opponent argument (even if that is valid, which it shouldn't be, a new opponent should be more exciting, not less so) doesn't play here.

[PurpleOut]

North Dakota State Bison vs Montana State Bobcats - 14,277 - @ Montana St

Lehigh Mountain Hawks vs Delaware Fightin' Blue Hens - 13,649 @ Delaware

Western Illinois Leathernecks vs Appalachian State Mountaineers - 13,322 @ App St

Wofford Terriers vs Jacksonville State Gamecocks - 11,817 @ Jacksonville

Georgia Southern Eagles vs William & Mary Tribe - 8,243 @ William & Mary

New Hampshire Wildcats vs Bethune-Cookman Wildcats - 5,738 @ Bethune-Cookman

Villanova Wildcats vs Stephen F Austin Lumberjacks - 4,938 @ Stephen F Austin

Southeast Missouri State Redhawks vs Eastern Washington Eagles - 3,665 @ Eastern Washington

Where did you come up with these numbers? You're not even close. SFA game was around 14,000 probably.

[VUCats02]

I can't believe everyone ACTUALLY believes these figures. All of them are WAY under-reported. A guy on the SFA board said there were around 15K at the game. These numbers are absolutely wrong. I talked to someone who was at the Delaware game. He said it was about 80-90% full.

[Anovafan]

The nova sfa number is absolutely wrong. I was there. It was 12k at least.

[superman7515]

I can't believe everyone ACTUALLY believes these figures. All of them are WAY under-reported. A guy on the SFA board said there were around 15K at the game. These numbers are absolutely wrong. I talked to someone who was at the Delaware game. He said it was about 80-90% full.

Bwa ha ha ha. I was at the UD game also, same seats as my regular season seats, and no way it was 80-90% full.

[superman7515]

The nova sfa number is absolutely wrong. I was there. It was 12k at least.

Those are the official attendance figures. Take it up with your AD if he is lying to the NCAA.

[PurpleOut]

Those are the official attendance figures. Take it up with your AD if he is lying to the NCAA.

And where did you see those? SFA still hasn't posted it yet. So...

[El Gato]

Where did you come up with these numbers? You're not even close. SFA game was around 14,000 probably.

ESPN has that number, and the box score off the Villanova website also has the same attendance numbers. From what I saw from the TV shots of the stands, it didn't look like 15K.

[VUCats02]

Those are the official attendance figures. Take it up with your AD if he is lying to the NCAA.

Ohhhhh okay. So since they are the official attendance figures we should all just accept that fact that they are true. Seriously, I will take the opinion of 3 people who were at the Nova vs SFA game than the "official attendance figures." What they are saying is TEN THOUSAND more people were at the game than reported. I doubt they are making this up.

[UNHFan]

The nova sfa number is absolutely wrong. I was there. It was 12k at least.

I watched this game going to make a post about this!

[El Gato]

And where did you see those? SFA still hasn't posted it yet. So...

http://scores.espn.go.com/ncf/boxscore?gameId=303382617
http://www.villanova.com/sports/m-footbl/stats/2010-2011/game12.html

[PurpleOut]

Ha, ok, if it's ESPN then it HAS to be right! ha

[PurpleOut]

I think they probably just left the 1 off the front. It was probably our 2nd largest crowd this season (Lamar was first, they brought a lot of fans, and that game was 16k).

[El Gato]

Ha, ok, if it's ESPN then it HAS to be right! ha

I really hate sarcasm....ugh...

never said it HAS to be right. Someone asked a question on where those numbers came from and I just answered for them.
Like I said, from what I saw of clips online it wasn't 15K but definitely looked larger than 5K.

[VUCats02]

There was a NDSU guy on their thread from last week's game who said he will spend his winter break literally counting 1 by 1 the amount of people in the stands. He said he has a picture of every section. He said he is sure that the official number reported for the game was way under. If someone is willing to do this, obviously he is sure there were more people at the game than reported. These playoffs games are always under-reported and it just boggles my mind that everyone believes them. Everyone is thinking up of excuses of why the regular season games have more attendance than post-season games. It's ridiculous.

[Old Cat Fan]

Don't teams under report crowd size so The NCAA Bosses don't get the cut they are looking for

[BlueHenSinfonian]

I really hate sarcasm....ugh...

never said it HAS to be right. Someone asked a question on where those numbers came from and I just answered for them.
Like I said, from what I saw of clips online it wasn't 15K but definitely looked larger than 5K.

It's hard to judge scale from TV. SFA's stadium only holds 14K, and it certainly wasn't fully packed, and with no real end zone seating, the main stands will always look more full, but I do agree it looked like more than 5K from the TV shots I saw.

[VUCats02]

It's hard to judge scale from TV. SFA's stadium only holds 14K, and it certainly wasn't fully packed, and with no real end zone seating, the main stands will always look more full, but I do agree it looked like more than 5K from the TV shots I saw.

I could be wrong, but I'm pretty sure their stadium holds a lot more than 14K...

[PurpleOut]

1. It's hard to judge our stadium if you just see a "clip" or something.
2. There is a HUGE concourse that goes around the field and a lot of people stand/walk around.
3. There are hills on each side of the stands, and then a grass slope all around the track where a lot of the frats/sororities sit.
4. Our record attendance is ~26k I believe.

[PurpleOut]

Also, regarding counting people...the attendance also includes media and workers. At least the FBS does it that way.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

Lehigh Mountain Hawks vs Delaware Fightin' Blue Hens - 13,649 @ Delaware

Villanova Wildcats vs Stephen F Austin Lumberjacks - 4,938 @ Stephen F Austin

4,938 * 3 = 14,814. Damn I was close!

[PurpleOut]

4,938 * 3 = 14,814. Damn I was close!

No you weren't.

[PurpleOut]

You can see what I'm talking about regarding the grass/concourse/whatever in these pics

http://sfajacks.cstv.com/genrel/081505aaa.html

[Mattymc727]

These figures have to be off. App state and Del might have under performed, but i bet the others were better than reported. UNH definately would have had twice the amount that BCU held according to those numbers, but I cant believe that is true. If it is, why would UNH bid so low? its a very poor stadium but there definately would have been more than 10,000 there. We averaged 8,000 a game this season. For a playoff game, it definately would have been over 10k. This is why it is so crucial UNH gets a new stadium, people want to go, but there is not atmosphere

[dudeitsaid]

Tragically, EWU doesn't have very good attendance ever, except for maybe the games against the Griz, and that's because the Griz bring more people than the Eagles do. That being said, under 4000 is one of the lowest attended games I've seen. If I were to chalk it up to anything, it would be the Apple Cup being played a few hours later. Seems people have a tradition of getting more interested in UW, WSU rivalry game that ultimately means very little, than the Eastern Eagles. I've heard some Eagles fans complain about the local Newspaper coverage compared to Wazzu, but just look at the difference in fan support. Wonder what next week's game will show, with last day of finals on Friday, and many people being done on Weds and Thurs. Students are gone, and that was a large contingent of the meager fanbase today.

[Twentysix]

Tragically, EWU doesn't have very good attendance ever, except for maybe the games against the Griz, and that's because the Griz bring more people than the Eagles do. That being said, under 4000 is one of the lowest attended games I've seen. If I were to chalk it up to anything, it would be the Apple Cup being played a few hours later. Seems people have a tradition of getting more interested in UW, WSU rivalry game that ultimately means very little, than the Eastern Eagles. I've heard some Eagles fans complain about the local Newspaper coverage compared to Wazzu, but just look at the difference in fan support. Wonder what next week's game will show, with last day of finals on Friday, and many people being done on Weds and Thurs. Students are gone, and that was a large contingent of the meager fanbase today.

A News caster told me NDSU brought 2k to MSU. I would say 14,000 ish for MSU was pretty accurate. Wouldnt underreporting your gate take possibly effect future atlarge bids?

[El Gato]

I think they probably just left the 1 off the front. It was probably our 2nd largest crowd this season (Lamar was first, they brought a lot of fans, and that game was 16k).

Lamar was your biggest attended game of the season, but even then there were not 16K, it was actually 13,281 (http://sfajacks.cstv.com/sports/m-footbl/stats/2010-2011/lamar.html)

And your yearly attendance was as follows:
vs. Albany 9,483
vs. UCA 7,938
vs. TxState 11,435
vs. NWST 11,687

Average: 10,765

You did have a bye week, but then again it is a playoff game you would think more people would show up?

However, you guys did only have 8,224 in your home playoff game last year (and you averaged 11,688 that year), so maybe the number isn't to far off. Probably closer to 8-10K.

[ZableNoise]

By % of stadium filled -

GSU @ W&M - 96.4%


8243 out of 12259 is 67.2%. And that is the absolute MOST the stadium had at any point during the game

[AAadict]

I think there was 17k+ at UD yesterday. Lehigh traveled very well and it only seemed like a 5-7k drop off from the typical CAA matchup during the season (season tickets). It's hard to get the fraction of families that decide to go on game day to pony up $10-20 to park and pay $120+ for 4 seats to sit in cold weather.

[darell1976]

What is the criteria to get an at large bid?

[tractorapp]

App charges students $5 for a playoff game and everyone else the normal $25. My question is, does the NCAA get $5/ticket or is App supplementing the student's ticket cost? I'm pretty sure our regualar season student attendence is a much higher % than most schools and student attendence was way off. Also, Boone is on a weather island, compared to where our alumni live and yesterday we had steady snow/sleet throughout the game. Many of our folks have to be concerned with getting down the mountain after the game.

[van]

Was at the Tub yesterday, 62% sounds about right, do they count the bands?

Was surprised at how few students attended considering the enrollment at DE, how much do they charge students? DE ticket prices much higher than I am used to at Lehigh home games + parking fees that we don't have. Makes me appreciate our venue all the more.

[Tribe4SF]

Thats part of the problem bidding, UNH at home would of had 10000+ can't get a game cause were always outbid, or our stadium sucks, so the diehard fans that support the program year in and year out gets the shaft

Are you kidding? I was at Cowell for the W&M game. That was a big game for UNH, with alot on the line, and there were 6,000 there. Last time you had a home playoff game you had 8,400, but you were ranked #1 at the time.

[aust42]

I was at the Delaware game. There were at least 17k there. The reported attendance figure of 13k is a joke.

[cowboy91]

Some people don't know yet that every single team under-reports their playoff attendance figures?

[cruyf]

Early NJ article indicated Student tickets for the playoffs were $5. Long lines reported during the week when they went on sale. Not bad student attendence for a playoff game and it looked like part of the South Endzone was roped off because Delaware was selling Gen Adm tickets for both end zones.


Was at the Tub yesterday, 62% sounds about right, do they count the bands?

Was surprised at how few students attended considering the enrollment at DE, how much do they charge students? DE ticket prices much higher than I am used to at Lehigh home games + parking fees that we don't have. Makes me appreciate our venue all the more.

[cowboy91]

The student section was the most into the game yesterday since that 2003 playoff run. Would like to see a repeat of the 03 Wofford vs. UD semifinal game.

[millwoga1]

The student section was the most into the game yesterday since that 2003 playoff run. Would like to see a repeat of the 03 Wofford vs. UD semifinal game.

Yeah still pissed we had to play you on the road that year. Might not have mattered though as that Del. team was loaded. Wofford's only loss that year prior to playoff loss was to Air Force.

[cowboy91]

If I remember right Delaware was the #2 seed so they had home-field throughout the playoffs.

[heath]

Ohhhhh okay. So since they are the official attendance figures we should all just accept that fact that they are true. Seriously, I will take the opinion of 3 people who were at the Nova vs SFA game than the "official attendance figures." What they are saying is TEN THOUSAND more people were at the game than reported. I doubt they are making this up.

3 that "tailgated" and were seeing, say......double or triple. I saw the same numbers on ESPN and Rivals

[SpeedkingATL]

It will be very interesting to see how many App fans make it to the Nova game this weekend. If that matchup doesn't get you motivated nothing will. I know a lot of great fans that decided not to travel from Atlanta this weekend for WIU that are going to make the trip for Nova. Would love to see the normal 28-29K at The Rock.

[ur2k]

Thats part of the problem bidding, UNH at home would of had 10000+ can't get a game cause were always outbid, or our stadium sucks, so the diehard fans that support the program year in and year out gets the shaft

Get a seed and you don't have this problem. Or tell your AD to pony up for a game

[wmmii]

8243 out of 12259 is 67.2%. And that is the absolute MOST the stadium had at any point during the game

This is correct and I was at the game, Superman7515 was way off on his numbers he posted for percentage of seats sold.

[millwoga1]

If I remember right Delaware was the #2 seed so they had home-field throughout the playoffs.

You are correct- Delaware was the #2 seed , I just thought Wofford deserved one of the top two seeds that year-Wofford was a 3 seed

[AAadict]

Was at the Tub yesterday, 62% sounds about right, do they count the bands?

Was surprised at how few students attended considering the enrollment at DE, how much do they charge students? DE ticket prices much higher than I am used to at Lehigh home games + parking fees that we don't have. Makes me appreciate our venue all the more.

I don't think they count bands since they perform during halftime and attendance reported is paid attendance.

UD has a large stadium and a top level FCS program so we are accustomed to paying to park. Free parking at Lehigh would be a nice feature and would love to play a game up there again sometime (been a while). The higher ticket price is for the playoffs. The playoffs tend to be money losers for teams. I think that is why Colgate chose to play all road games in 2003.

Other than the impact to you wallet I hope you enjoyed your visit to UD. It's a special place to be a football fan.

[Mattymc727]

Are you kidding? I was at Cowell for the W&M game. That was a big game for UNH, with alot on the line, and there were 6,000 there. Last time you had a home playoff game you had 8,400, but you were ranked #1 at the time.

We have had some down games for sure. But I thought UNH had like 12,000 at the NOVA game last year and I know the Colonial clash has almost 33,000, so the potential is there. Perhaps because of the stadium, people dont feel like showing up anymore

[wocorebel]

If I remember right Delaware was the #2 seed so they had home-field throughout the playoffs.

I believe this to be correct, but in the rankings Wofford was the higher ranked team at the end of the season which made a lot of Wofford fans mad that we had to go on the road before the championship. I know the weather had a little factor because I talked to Kevious Johnson about it when he got back to campus. I am hoping for a rematch, going to get my travel plans ready to drive to Delaware if you guys can win but if not I wouldn't mind hosting another playoff game. Good luck to everyone, except GSU.

[cowboy91]

Well, Delaware is currently the #5 team, but a #3 seed. Meanwhile the #1 team EWU is the #4 seed. Go figure.

[PurpleOut]

I know that they do under-report a lot, but apparently they do it even more extreme during the playoffs to make sure they guarantee that bid they put in to the NCAA. That's kind of annoying, makes us look even worse after yesterday. Sigh.

You'll just have to take everyones word for it that went, it was over double of the "called in attendance." Annoying.

[TheRevSFA]

I find it amusing that the Bobcat fan is talking about our attendance when they can't even come close to filling their stadium..but yet they are FBS material.

I'll put some photos up of the home side. It was pretty full. I sat at the 50 yard line on the visitors side behind some Nova fans, and the Visitors side did have more empty spots.

But 5K wouldn't have filled the home side.

[El Gato]

I find it amusing that the Bobcat fan is talking about our attendance when they can't even come close to filling their stadium..but yet they are FBS material.

I'll put some photos up of the home side. It was pretty full. I sat at the 50 yard line on the visitors side behind some Nova fans, and the Visitors side did have more empty spots.

But 5K wouldn't have filled the home side.

And I find it amusing that you need to resort to talking smack when all I am doing is posting facts and not BS like you.

But since you opened up that subject let's look at some numbers to counter your argument, with once again real data and no BS:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Despite having a horrendous season this year, Texas State attendance for 2010:
UCA 10,120
NWST 14,008
NSU 12,994
SUU 13,742
CAU 13,727

2010 Texas State Average 12,918 despite a 4-7 (1-6 SLC) record
2010 SFA Average 10,675 with a 9-3 record.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
2009 Texas State attendance
14,116 ASU
12,754 TSU
12,003 SLU
13,013 MSU
9,118 SHSU

Texas State 2009 Average 12,201
Stephen F Austin 2009 Average 11,111
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
2008 Texas State Attendance
13,952 ASU
12,301 SUU
11,561 TSU
10,418 UCA
9,100 NWST
10,016 SHSU

Texas State 2008 Average 11,225
Stephen F. 2008 Average 8,577
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
2007 Texas State Average 11,408
2007 Stephen F. Average 8,420
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
2006 Texas State Average 12,886 including a nearly sold out home opener following a successful playoff run the year before.
2006 Stephen F. Average 7,686
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
2005 Texas State Attendance
10,014 Delta State
10,002 SUU
12,781 SDSU
13,787 Ok Panhandle
13,852 NWST
11,904 MSU
15,288 SHSU
10,000 Georgia Southern
15,411 Cal Poly
15,712 UNI


2005 Texas State Average 12,875 Including two sell outs for playoff games, unlike the past two years of SFA home playoff games.
2005 Stephen F. Average 8,472
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From 2005-2010 Texas State has averaged 12,725 people in attendance.
From 2005-2010 Stephen F.A. has averaged 9,182 people in attendance.


So before you open your mouth, first realize that I have been in agreement that your numbers were clearly way to low, but I threw an average based on what I saw on TV and given your history as seen above.

Second, don't talk about Texas State not filling it's stadium when it's clear that in the past 5 years there have been numerous top 10 stadium attendance numbers and during that same time frame we have averaged 3,543 more fans than SFA at our home games.

[JohnStOnge]

I never understood why playoff games are less attended than regular season games. Everything is on the line for every playoff game, those are the ones that should have you camping out for tickets and sitting on the edge of your seat throughout. Who cares if it's a bit chilly?

I agree. I've noticed that for years. In the past I thought maybe it was that it was the Thanksgiving weekend/break but this year it's not. I noticed SFA having around 4,000 last night. You've got a team that is in the playoffs only for the second time in the past 20 years hosting the defending national champion. The Lumberjacks averaged 10,155 during the regularr season. They had 11,687 for the last game of the regular season against Northwestern State. Then <5,000 in a playoff game?

It makes no sense.

[TexasTerror]

Second, don't talk about Texas State not filling it's stadium when it's clear that in the past 5 years there have been numerous top 10 stadium attendance numbers and during that same time frame we have averaged 3,543 more fans than SFA at our home games.

TXST has FBS aspirations.
TXST has twice the student body (and presumably much larger alumni)
TXST is tucked between Austin and San Antonio.

If you ask me - successful years or not - TXST should be clearly outdrawing the SLC in football and EVERY other sport. Their fans have not consistently supported the team. It's clear that there's a ceiling and it's not one that can be broken at the FCS level.

Got to wonder if it goes up much at the FBS level - have a hard time believing the Bobcat bumpkins show up in drives for Idaho and San Jose State like they did Sam Houston State and McNeese State. May have to get StatMom to crunch the numbers... ;)

[Anovafan]

I agree. I've noticed that for years. In the past I thought maybe it was that it was the Thanksgiving weekend/break but this year it's not. I noticed SFA having around 4,000 last night. You've got a team that is in the playoffs only for the second time in the past 20 years hosting the defending national champion. The Lumberjacks averaged 10,155 during the regularr season. They had 11,687 for the last game of the regular season against Northwestern State. Then <5,000 in a playoff game?

It makes no sense.

I'll say it again, the 4,000 is absolutely wrong, I was there. They had around 12,000 fans. For whatever reason, they under-reported the number. I don't know all the ins and outs of playoff football ticket sales, but it most likely has something to do with money as to why they under-report. All the reported numbers looked lower than actual attendance.

[biggie]

If we are complaining about these numbers, it will be ugly for the 4k in Frisco.

[mcveyrl]

Here's the thing about the playoffs. We should not gauge the fans' on this site's interest as "the norm." Take my family for instance. I was told, at the beginning of the season, that my wife would not be attending playoff games. She love JMU, she loves football and she loves going to the games, but she plans for 5 or 6 games a year and she's done. I, on the other hand, have both an AGS and CS account, love football, love JMU and won't miss a playoff game unless something critical is happening at home. I've even considered making the trip over to Boone on Saturday for what should be one of the best playoff games of the year.

There are many fans that have my wife's mentality, particularly when you have to travel like we do (hotel, gas, food every game). I think most of your local fans are going to come out, but a team like App, for example, probably loses a lot of the Charlotte, Raleigh, Greensboro alums that just don't want to make that trip over after the regular season.

[JSU02]

Here's the thing about the playoffs. We should not gauge the fans' on this site's interest as "the norm." Take my family for instance. I was told, at the beginning of the season, that my wife would not be attending playoff games. She love JMU, she loves football and she loves going to the games, but she plans for 5 or 6 games a year and she's done. I, on the other hand, have both an AGS and CS account, love football, love JMU and won't miss a playoff game unless something critical is happening at home. I've even considered making the trip over to Boone on Saturday for what should be one of the best playoff games of the year.

There are many fans that have my wife's mentality, particularly when you have to travel like we do (hotel, gas, food every game). I think most of your local fans are going to come out, but a team like App, for example, probably loses a lot of the Charlotte, Raleigh, Greensboro alums that just don't want to make that trip over after the regular season.

With attendance down across the board, I have to agree with ya. Most casual football fans will make plans during the spring or summer to attend the 5-6 home games at that time. Once the regular season ends, you are smack dab in the middle of the busy holiday season. Early start times make it even worse as fans who live at some distance from campus who may have been willing to make a day trip of it, will opt not to go, as they aren't willing to spend the extra hotel money during an expensive time of year. Although I had previously thought the NCAA grossly under estimated attendance, I would say the estimate for JSU's game of 11k+ was spot on. Although I did see some people at our game who did not attend much or any during the regular season and were attracted by the playoff nature of the game, there were far more Birmingham and Atlanta alums that didn't make it for whatever reason, hence we were about 7,000 below our regular season average :(

[El Gato]

TXST has FBS aspirations.
TXST has twice the student body (and presumably much larger alumni)
TXST is tucked between Austin and San Antonio.

If you ask me - successful years or not - TXST should be clearly outdrawing the SLC in football and EVERY other sport. Their fans have not consistently supported the team. It's clear that there's a ceiling and it's not one that can be broken at the FCS level.

Got to wonder if it goes up much at the FBS level - have a hard time believing the Bobcat bumpkins show up in drives for Idaho and San Jose State like they did Sam Houston State and McNeese State. May have to get StatMom to crunch the numbers... ;)

of course. I've got a reply for you, but have to wait till I get home.xnonox

[OhioHen]

Plus, the game vs. Lehigh was an old school rivalry that the older fans should've eaten up, so the non-traditional opponent argument (even if that is valid, which it shouldn't be, a new opponent should be more exciting, not less so) doesn't play here.

Most of the older fans who remember the days of Delaware vs. Lehigh as a rivalry pack up their houses and head to Florida for the winter on the Monday following the last home game of the regular season. Always have, don't see it changing any time soon.

[asknoquarter21]

Here's the thing about the playoffs. We should not gauge the fans' on this site's interest as "the norm." Take my family for instance. I was told, at the beginning of the season, that my wife would not be attending playoff games. She love JMU, she loves football and she loves going to the games, but she plans for 5 or 6 games a year and she's done. I, on the other hand, have both an AGS and CS account, love football, love JMU and won't miss a playoff game unless something critical is happening at home. I've even considered making the trip over to Boone on Saturday for what should be one of the best playoff games of the year.

There are many fans that have my wife's mentality, particularly when you have to travel like we do (hotel, gas, food every game). I think most of your local fans are going to come out, but a team like App, for example, probably loses a lot of the Charlotte, Raleigh, Greensboro alums that just don't want to make that trip over after the regular season.

Would love to see you in Boone!

I know exactly what you mean about the wife not coming. Something about standing in the cold and snow for 3 hours she isn't real excited about.

I was most suprised with the students that didn't attend the game. I don't think they realize just how special it is to be attending a school that is the hunt for a national championship.

[El Gato]

aww shucks, I'm glad we have TT here to join in the discussions. A Texas State fan arguing with another SLC school fan, figures you would show up to put in your two cents. First things first though before I respond.

What does your post have to do in regards to the second round attendance numbers, and most importantly SFA v. Villanova (since that is the game that I have been discussing)? ...That's what I thought...


TXST has FBS aspirations.
TXST has twice the student body (and presumably much larger alumni)
TXST is tucked between Austin and San Antonio.

Wow. I didn't realize that. Amazing.xrolleyesx
http://adirectresponse.files.wordpress.com/2010/07/obvious3.jpg



If you ask me - successful years or not - TXST should be clearly outdrawing the SLC in football and EVERY other sport. Their fans have not consistently supported the team. It's clear that there's a ceiling and it's not one that can be broken at the FCS level.

And if you ask me or any of the other 15,000 fans that showed up to multiple sold out games, the Cats do show up when there is a product/opponent worth watching on the field. Over 14,000 showed up for the "WAC visit" homecoming game against NWST. 14,000 + in 2006 for a Div II in opener after a FCS Semi Final run. 15,000+ for the quarter final and semi final FCS (1AA at the time) playoff game.


Got to wonder if it goes up much at the FBS level - have a hard time believing the Bobcat bumpkins show up in drives for Idaho and San Jose State like they did Sam Houston State and McNeese State. May have to get StatMom to crunch the numbers... ;)

Funny thing is, Bobcat fans show up in droves for FBS games. TCU, SMU, Baylor, Texas A&M, and UH have all been highly attended games, and they have all been on the road. IF fans will show up for WAC commish Karl Benson, and we actually win some games, then I don't see why they don't show up for San Jose or Idaho. Maybe not in droves, but better than what we currently average. Baseball is proof of this. Nice stadium, competitive program + wins equals awesome attendance. And you are completely wrong about TxState not outdrawing the SLC in every other sport.

[El Gato]

Now to elaborate and shine some light on your fallacious statements:
Again, some numbers:

Going back and looking at the past five years for SLC football attendance...
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
2005
SLC Team/FCS National Rank/Avg. Att
TxState 16/ 12875
SHSU 36/ 9269
SFA 42/ 8472
NWST 45/ 8383
MSU 48/ 7896
SLU 53/ 7347
NSU 72/ 5580
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
2006
TxState 16/ 12886
MSU 29/ 10882
SHSU 38/ 9469
NWST 40/ 9061
SFA 51/ 7686
SLU 66/ 5961
NSU 81/ 4573
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
2007 (Wright era and crap Bobcat teams)
MSU 20/ 12818
TxState 28/ 11408
SHSU 38/ 9627
SFA 43/ 8480
NWST 46/ 7976
NSU 74/ 5382
SLU 78/ 4950
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
2008
MSU 14/ 13829
TxState 23/ 11225
SHSU 29/ 10076
NWST 43/ 8615
SFA 44/ 8577
NSU 67/ 5868
SLU 73/ 5441
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
2009
MSU 20/ 12948
TxState 22/ 12488
SFA 25/ 11111
NWST 6642
SLU 5592
NSU 5498
SHSU 5370
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
2010
TxState 12918
MSU 12404 w/out a 19,000 attended Lamar game, otherwise it's 13770
SFA 10675
NWST 8131
SHSU 6336
SLU 4772
NSU ?

So over the last 5 years Texas State and McNeese have led the conference in football attendance. Overall we have "outdrawn" the the SLC with a 12,300 5 year average as opposed to MSU's 12,000 average (that's with the Lamar game).Which leads me to a question for the great Texas Terror. McNeese has proven that they draw just as well as TxState, sometimes way less, sometimes high (but not by much as you can see). Knowing this, if they were making the move, can you honestly tell me you would be making this exact same argument against them. Or even better, Villanova is rumored to be moving to the Big East, yet they have averaged 8,849 in the same five year span, good for 40-60th best in the FCS. Would you dare throw out a post like this against them, because you sure as **** have no qualms with taking shots (and inaccurate ones at that as we can see) at my fine university?

Don't bother with a response because I know the answer: no. It's called hypocrisy and it happens because of your inherent bias towards Texas State. And we both know that this is true, as I have called you out on it using your very own words on this subject before, so you cannot deny it.

And yes, Texas State is "outdrawing" SLC teams in other sports as well. Volleyball has been one of the top D1 schools in the nation, and Baseball/Softball outdraws the rest of the SLC as well and too have been ranked nationally.

2005-2010 SLC Volleyball averages
Txstate 762*
UTSA 432
TAMUCC 349
UTA 345
UCA 335
SFA 324
SHSU 263
NWST 226
MSU 217
NSU 183
SLU 158
*This includes a 1,129 avg. in 2009 which was in the Top 50 in the nation, 541 above the No. 2 SLC team.

2008-2010 SLC Baseball Averages
TxState 752*
SLU 722
Lamar 502
MSU 439
SHSU 408
NWST 380
UTA 354
TAMUCC 322
SFA 307
NSU 303
UTSA 256
UCA 245
*This includes a 918 average in 2009, 300 above the No. 2 SLC school.

2006-2009 SLC Softball Averages
Tired of looking up numbers, but a quick look at national numbers and Texas State again leads the conference clearly by the fact that we were ranked 19, 43, 44, 36 of all Division 1 schools in the nation (no other SLC school are even ranked). Don’t have 2010 rankings but with the average for this past year only 100 less than the No. 19 ranking yr. I’m pretty sure we will be ranked again (probably like No. 30).

Given the attendance of these sports it is safe to assume that if the basketball team could get its act together you would see similar numbers. As it is even as horrible as they are they still rank in the top 3 in the SLC going back three years.

*Notice to all* In order that this post at least attempt to stay on topic and still rebut TT's post, the football attendance numbers can provide some insight on to the topic discussion for this thread. The SFA numbers and even the Villanova numbers that I mentioned at one point can help to provide some info towards this discussion.

[BlueHenSinfonian]

Here's the thing about the playoffs. We should not gauge the fans' on this site's interest as "the norm." Take my family for instance. I was told, at the beginning of the season, that my wife would not be attending playoff games. She love JMU, she loves football and she loves going to the games, but she plans for 5 or 6 games a year and she's done. I, on the other hand, have both an AGS and CS account, love football, love JMU and won't miss a playoff game unless something critical is happening at home. I've even considered making the trip over to Boone on Saturday for what should be one of the best playoff games of the year.

There are many fans that have my wife's mentality, particularly when you have to travel like we do (hotel, gas, food every game). I think most of your local fans are going to come out, but a team like App, for example, probably loses a lot of the Charlotte, Raleigh, Greensboro alums that just don't want to make that trip over after the regular season.

You could have a point there. I probably took it for granted when I lived in DE that I was only a couple miles from the stadium, so there was never any real planning needed to go to the games other than buying tickets ahead of time to get a good seat. Delaware also has a more condensed fan base than some of the other schools - the vast majority of the state lives in New Castle county where Newark is, and even those in Dover are only a 30 - 45 minute shot straight up route 1 to get to Newark.

Still, you have places like Duke where students camp out in the cold for days to get tickets to basketball games, and the top FCS powers can't even sell out a playoff game? It's one thing for the FBS fans to not understand and appreciate FCS football, but I'm a bit disappointed in the FCS fanbase that we can't support our own teams in the most important games of the year.

[Waco Kid]

With attendance down across the board, I have to agree with ya. Most casual football fans will make plans during the spring or summer to attend the 5-6 home games at that time. Once the regular season ends, you are smack dab in the middle of the busy holiday season. Early start times make it even worse as fans who live at some distance from campus who may have been willing to make a day trip of it, will opt not to go, as they aren't willing to spend the extra hotel money during an expensive time of year. Although I had previously thought the NCAA grossly under estimated attendance, I would say the estimate for JSU's game of 11k+ was spot on. Although I did see some people at our game who did not attend much or any during the regular season and were attracted by the playoff nature of the game, there were far more Birmingham and Atlanta alums that didn't make it for whatever reason, hence we were about 7,000 below our regular season average :(

I think you have hit the nail on the head here. For most FCS teams we don't have 90% die hards and 10% casual. Its more like 50/50 in most cases. I think that is what AppMan was trying to point out in the Montana vs ASU fans thread, but it didn't come across the right way.

[Waco Kid]

App charges students $5 for a playoff game and everyone else the normal $25. My question is, does the NCAA get $5/ticket or is App supplementing the student's ticket cost? I'm pretty sure our regualar season student attendence is a much higher % than most schools and student attendence was way off. Also, Boone is on a weather island, compared to where our alumni live and yesterday we had steady snow/sleet throughout the game. Many of our folks have to be concerned with getting down the mountain after the game.

The NCAA charges $15 for student tickets so the school is already paying $10 per student. The school needs to let that be known to the students so they know the school is trying to help get them in the game. I would hope most of our kids could afford $15 to go to 3 playoff games.

[Walkon79]

App charges students $5 for a playoff game and everyone else the normal $25. My question is, does the NCAA get $5/ticket or is App supplementing the student's ticket cost? I'm pretty sure our regualar season student attendence is a much higher % than most schools and student attendence was way off. Also, Boone is on a weather island, compared to where our alumni live and yesterday we had steady snow/sleet throughout the game. Many of our folks have to be concerned with getting down the mountain after the game.

MSU charged $7 for the students, which impacted they're attendance, but the large contingent from NDSU made up for that. Looked like a sellout to me on TV.