CSN Way: Chuck's Stab At the 20-Team Field

[Lehigh Football Nation]

http://www.collegesportingnews.com/entry.php?116-Chuck-s-Stab-At-the-20-Team-Field

xhurrayx

[lehidude]

First one I've seen where we avoid the first round. I'm not sure how likely that will be.

[ToTheLeft]

I'll drink (some water) to that!

[PantherRob82]

Look's pretty good, Chuck. Cap'n almost called you today.

[Green26]

The picks of my 13 year old son and myself, by conference:

For sure (15 teams):

Big Sky - Mont St and EWU

Big South - Coastal (or whoever the auto-bid is). This is a very weak conference and doesn't deserve a second team. Liberty beat Ball St (4-8), but played a very weak schedule and was 51 in the Sagarins last week.

CAA - Del, W&M, UNH and Villanova

MEAC - Bethune-Cookman. This is a very weak conference. They don't deserve a second team. So Car St is a weak team, played a very weak schedule (except Geo Tech), wasn't in the GPI top 25 last week, was 84th in the Sagarins last week and doesn't deserve to be in the playoffs.

MV - No Iowa

NE - Robert Morris (or whoever has the auto-bid)

Ohio Val - SE Mo St

Patriot - Lehigh

Southern - App St and Wofford

Southland - SFA

The other 5 teams will come from these 6 teams:

Montana, Cal Poly, West Ill, No Dak St, Jacksonville St, Geo So. I don't think Central Ark has a realistic chance, as they were 39th in the Sagarins last week.

I think CP gets left out. They finished the season with a fairly bad loss last week, were 23rd in the SN poll last week, were not in the GPI top 25 last week and were 36nd in the Sagarin last week. Strong conferences deserve to get more teams in. For example, the CAA, Big Sky, Southern and MV deserve more teams, and shouldn't be penalized for strong teams beating each other in the conference. Weak conferences don't deserve to be rewarded with two teams in the playoffs, unless the second team has played a stronger schedule and has done something special. The Pioneer conference (Jacksonville and Dayton) is very weak and doesn't deserve a playoff team. Jacksonville and Dayton were 32 and 49 in the Sagarins last week. Montana was 12th in the GPI last week, had close losses to two top 8 teams, and had no bad losses. Yes, I know they had only 6 D-I wins, but that is only one factor of many.

[tribe_pride]

The other 5 teams will come from these 6 teams:

Montana, Cal Poly, West Ill, No Dak St, Jacksonville St, Geo So. I don't think Central Ark has a realistic chance, as they were 39th in the Sagarins last week.

I think CP gets left out. They finished the season with a fairly bad loss last week, were 23rd in the SN poll last week, were not in the GPI top 25 last week and were 36nd in the Sagarin last week. Strong conferences deserve to get more teams in. For example, the CAA, Big Sky, Southern and MV deserve more teams, and shouldn't be penalized for strong teams beating each other in the conference. Weak conferences don't deserve to be rewarded with two teams in the playoffs, unless the second team has played a stronger schedule and has done something special. The Pioneer conference (Jacksonville and Dayton) is very weak and doesn't deserve a playoff team. Jacksonville and Dayton were 32 and 49 in the Sagarins last week. Montana was 12th in the GPI last week, had close losses to two top 8 teams, and had no bad losses. Yes, I know they had only 6 D-I wins, but that is only one factor of many.

Not that I think it'll happen, but if you are going to start putting 6 win (D-I) teams in there, JMU probably leads the pack with wins over Va Tech, W&M, and Liberty and its worst loss is to either Richmond or UMass with the other losses to playoff teams you take your pick but both are 6-5 teams). If Montana make it in over them, it'll only be because of tradition or $$$

[DSUrocks07]

If a six (D-I) win team makes it, it'll be JMU easily.

[walliver]

I think the committee will stick to the 7 win guideline. Once that benchmark is breached, they can never go back.

If a school wants post-season play with 6 wins, it can always move to the other subdivision and play in the Preparation H Toilet Bowl.

[Green26]

Darn. My son and I got 19 of the 20 selections right, but missed on our team Montana. I still believe the following:

"So Car St is a weak team, played a very weak schedule (except Geo Tech), wasn't in the GPI top 25 last week, was 84th in the Sagarins last week and doesn't deserve to be in the playoffs."

Taking two teams from this weak conference, and only two teams from the Big Sky--both of whom are top 5 seeds--just doesn't seem right. And contrast this to taking three 7-4 teams from the MV (which I am fine with).

Yes, I know that UM didn't have 7 D-I wins. However, their losses were close or fairly close losses to two top 5 seeds, a top 25 team, and to a decent Weber team (with a winning record). Oh well, our star running back who had 180 yards yesterday despite a bad shoulder injury, probably couldn't have played in the playoffs, or early rounds, anyway, due to re-injury yesterday, and he's the guy who makes the offense go. He missed being the all-time leading rusher at UM by 3 yards.

Congrats and good luck to all the playoff teams.

[ejjones]

Darn. My son and I got 19 of the 20 selections right, but missed on our team Montana. I still believe the following:

"So Car St is a weak team, played a very weak schedule (except Geo Tech), wasn't in the GPI top 25 last week, was 84th in the Sagarins last week and doesn't deserve to be in the playoffs."

Taking two teams from this weak conference, and only two teams from the Big Sky--both of whom are top 5 seeds--just doesn't seem right. And contrast this to taking three 7-4 teams from the MV (which I am fine with).

Yes, I know that UM didn't have 7 D-I wins. However, their losses were close or fairly close losses to two top 5 seeds, a top 25 team, and to a decent Weber team (with a winning record). Oh well, our star running back who had 180 yards yesterday despite a bad shoulder injury, probably couldn't have played in the playoffs, or early rounds, anyway, due to re-injury yesterday, and he's the guy who makes the offense go. He missed being the all-time leading rusher at UM by 3 yards.

Congrats and good luck to all the playoff teams.

That's why we have the playoffs...stop team bashing. UM isn't in the playoffs because you beat NOBODY all year...all of your wins are against the bottom of the barrel BSC and a mediocre ND. There no such thing as a good loss. Have a good off season, and hope to see UM back next year.

[aceinthehole]

That's why we have the playoffs...stop team bashing. UM isn't in the playoffs because you beat NOBODY all year...all of your wins are against the bottom of the barrel BSC and a mediocre ND. There no such thing as a good loss. Have a good off season, and hope to see UM back next year.

Look at the SCSU schedule. They beat NO ONE and according to you they don't have 2 "good losses." :)

[ejjones]

Look at the SCSU schedule. They beat NO ONE and according to you they don't have 2 "good losses." :)

I'm not the one arguing....If we were left out, I would not have posted anything. We play in a overall weak conference...our 3-4 upper teams are pretty decent. Bottom line, we beat the few good folks on our schedule. We have no good loses, but we're 8-1 against FCS opponents. UM lost to 4 FCS opponents and played no FBS team.

[Green26]

Okay, buddy, if you want to continue the discussion"

So Car St was 78th in the Sagarins last week. What a joke. I have no problem with any of the other teams being selected over Montana, but selecting So Car St was a mistake. Montana would be 10-1 with So Car St's schedule, and would crush So Car St.

[WrenFGun]

Darn. My son and I got 19 of the 20 selections right, but missed on our team Montana. I still believe the following:

"So Car St is a weak team, played a very weak schedule (except Geo Tech), wasn't in the GPI top 25 last week, was 84th in the Sagarins last week and doesn't deserve to be in the playoffs."

Taking two teams from this weak conference, and only two teams from the Big Sky--both of whom are top 5 seeds--just doesn't seem right. And contrast this to taking three 7-4 teams from the MV (which I am fine with).

Yes, I know that UM didn't have 7 D-I wins. However, their losses were close or fairly close losses to two top 5 seeds, a top 25 team, and to a decent Weber team (with a winning record). Oh well, our star running back who had 180 yards yesterday despite a bad shoulder injury, probably couldn't have played in the playoffs, or early rounds, anyway, due to re-injury yesterday, and he's the guy who makes the offense go. He missed being the all-time leading rusher at UM by 3 yards.

Congrats and good luck to all the playoff teams.

Classy post, IMO. While I don't think that Montana was deserving when compared to other 6 DI win teams (JMU, UMass), it surprised me just a bit that Montana didn't get in.

[WrenFGun]

I'm not the one arguing....If we were left out, I would not have posted anything. We play in a overall weak conference...our 3-4 upper teams are pretty decent. Bottom line, we beat the few good folks on our schedule. We have no good loses, but we're 8-1 against FCS opponents. UM lost to 4 FCS opponents and played no FBS team.

South Carolina State had no right to be in the playoffs. Of the qualified teams, SC State's wins do not compare to Jacksonville, Dayton or Liberty. This is simply a case of voters not doing their job of adjusting for resume. I'm so tired of the "they looked good in the first round of 2009." Well, Craig Ochs was a Jesus in 2003/4, doesn't mean Montana should get in in 2010.

[Henwatcher]

Good try Chuckster. I wish you had been right.

[Green26]

Classy post, IMO. While I don't think that Montana was deserving when compared to other 6 DI win teams (JMU, UMass), it surprised me just a bit that Montana didn't get in.

The difference between Montana and those 6 D-I teams is that those teams had 5 losses. 6-5 teams never get into the playoffs, except as an auto-bid. Montana lost to two top 5 seeds. Yesterday, UM lost by 5 points, after fumbling on the MSU 1 and 2, and throwing 2 picks in the redzone, all in the second half. (The second pick was a desperaton pass.) UM held MSU to 57 yards in the second half. UM's top back, Reynolds, was hurt badly, but kept coming back in the game and ended up with 180 yards on 21 carries. UM lost to EWU by essentially 3 points. (EWU kicked a FG with a few seconds left. After the kickoff, UM got one more play with no time left due to a penalty, the qb fumbled the ball, and EWU ran it in for a TD. UM had 6 turnovers in the game.) As was said, while UM didn't have impressive wins, it had no bad losses and several close (and yes good) lossses. So Car St had not good wins and no good/close loses.

Also, the CAA gets credit for being a tough conference, and gets 4 loss teams in the playoffs. They got 4 teams in this year. There was no reason to select 5 or 6 CAA teams this year. There was reason to select 3 Big Sky teams--especially giving how weak the 20th selected team So Car St was. The Big Sky was one of the strongest conferences this year, usually rated 2nd or 3rd, and they get in only 2 teams. The MEAC is a very weak conference, and they get in two teams. What's wrong with this picture?

[inpsite1919]

SCSU is in the playoffs. Montana is home get over it. Yes our conferance is weak overall, but our team is a good team overall. Don't be blinded by the two loses. The loss to GA Tech was closer than the score. If you were at the game you would have understand, but that lose to BCU was just ugly the offense was no where to be found. Long should have been benched that game, but hey he wasn't and we lost. Saying that Montana would beat SCSU or finish 10-1 with there schedule is unfonded. Unless they play the games it will never be none.

[Green26]

SCSU is in the playoffs. Montana is home get over it. Yes our conferance is weak overall, but our team is a good team overall. Don't be blinded by the two loses. The loss to GA Tech was closer than the score. If you were at the game you would have understand, but that lose to BCU was just ugly the offense was no where to be found. Long should have been benched that game, but hey he wasn't and we lost. Saying that Montana would beat SCSU or finish 10-1 with there schedule is unfonded. Unless they play the games it will never be none.

No, the Big Sky is strong, got 2 of the top 5 seeds, and was consistently rated as the top 2 or 3 conferences this year. The MEAC is a weak conference, almost a joke. So Car St is a weak team. Didn't deserve to get in the playoffs. I hope the Geo So kicks their butts.

[nevadagriz]

Green give it a rest! Montana did not deserve to get in the playoffs noway no how!
We as Griz fans should congratulate the teams that made it and look forward to next year. bashing a team in the playoffs is classless and makes you and griz nation look bad. people like you are why people are soooo happy to see the griz fail and why nonone on boards like this have taken the time to congratulate Montana on the previous seventeen years of playoff football! Go back to celebrating the fact the griz are not going to the wac and leave the playoff talk to the teams that are in it.

Since you have soo much pull and a inside position with griz athletics tell them to build a new lockerroom a weight room and get local buisnesses to pony up some more dough. The cash cow is dead for this year and if some changes aren't made then it may be awhile before we are back in the playoffs! Money needs to go back into the football program or we will slip into the back of the big sky pack thats fact Jack!

[ejjones]

Green give it a rest! Montana did not deserve to get in the playoffs noway no how!
We as Griz fans should congratulate the teams that made it and look forward to next year. bashing a team in the playoffs is classless and makes you and griz nation look bad. people like you are why people are soooo happy to see the griz fail and why nonone on boards like this have taken the time to congratulate Montana on the previous seventeen years of playoff football! Go back to celebrating the fact the griz are not going to the wac and leave the playoff talk to the teams that are in it.

Since you have soo much pull and a inside position with griz athletics tell them to build a new lockerroom a weight room and get local buisnesses to pony up some more dough. The cash cow is dead for this year and if some changes aren't made then it may be awhile before we are back in the playoffs! Money needs to go back into the football program or we will slip into the back of the big sky pack thats fact Jack!

Thanks for the post...much appreciated. The committee picked the 20 teams. We as fans should not enjoy the show and not debate who got "woofed".

[Green26]

Green give it a rest! Montana did not deserve to get in the playoffs noway no how!
We as Griz fans should congratulate the teams that made it and look forward to next year. bashing a team in the playoffs is classless and makes you and griz nation look bad. people like you are why people are soooo happy to see the griz fail and why nonone on boards like this have taken the time to congratulate Montana on the previous seventeen years of playoff football! Go back to celebrating the fact the griz are not going to the wac and leave the playoff talk to the teams that are in it.

Since you have soo much pull and a inside position with griz athletics tell them to build a new lockerroom a weight room and get local buisnesses to pony up some more dough. The cash cow is dead for this year and if some changes aren't made then it may be awhile before we are back in the playoffs! Money needs to go back into the football program or we will slip into the back of the big sky pack thats fact Jack!

Give it a rest, yourself. I can have an opinion that So Car St is a weak and underserving team and am willing to support my team. If you would both to look, my initial post today did congratulate all playoff teams and wish then good luck, and the post was described as classy by another poster: z9"Congrats and good luck to all the playoff teams." and "Classy post, IMO.") Then, several So Car St posters had to make some snippy posts. I'm not one to put up with what I think is BS, and I will probably respond to posts like theirs and yours.

Again, So Car St was 84th in the Sagarins, and 50th in the more important GPI, last week. UM was 12th in the GPI last week. So Car St didn't even play a team with any credible ranking in the GPI. UM lost by 5 on Saturday to a top 5 seed, and a team that had been ranked 7th in the GPI last week. UM had previously lost to teams ranked 3rd, 22nd and 25th in the GPI, and had beaten teams ranked 13th and 22nd in the GPI. Thus, UM had 6 games against top 25 GPI teams.

[Green26]

Thanks for the post...much appreciated. The committee picked the 20 teams. We as fans should not enjoy the show and not debate who got "woofed".

Are you serious? The Internet and message boards are made for discussing, debating and disagreeing with everything there is to do with sports, including playoff selections. Message boards are not designed to have only cheerleading, and blind cheerleading, for all decisions, including those by the playoff selection committee.

[ejjones]

Darn. My son and I got 19 of the 20 selections right, but missed on our team Montana. I still believe the following:

"So Car St is a weak team, played a very weak schedule (except Geo Tech), wasn't in the GPI top 25 last week, was 84th in the Sagarins last week and doesn't deserve to be in the playoffs."

Taking two teams from this weak conference, and only two teams from the Big Sky--both of whom are top 5 seeds--just doesn't seem right. And contrast this to taking three 7-4 teams from the MV (which I am fine with).

Yes, I know that UM didn't have 7 D-I wins. However, their losses were close or fairly close losses to two top 5 seeds, a top 25 team, and to a decent Weber team (with a winning record). Oh well, our star running back who had 180 yards yesterday despite a bad shoulder injury, probably couldn't have played in the playoffs, or early rounds, anyway, due to re-injury yesterday, and he's the guy who makes the offense go. He missed being the all-time leading rusher at UM by 3 yards.

Congrats and good luck to all the playoff teams.

Here's a quote from the NCAA selection committee chairman and another reason not to use GPI as a reference or barometer for who got selected:
Jon(Cedar Falls): Does the committee use the Gridiron Power Index as criteria?
Jim O'Day: The committee did not use the GPI - or any other external polls - to select, pair or seed any of the championship teams.

[WestCoastAggie]

If SC State wins, this debate is moot.

It is what it is.

[Green26]

Here's a quote from the NCAA selection committee chairman and another reason not to use GPI as a reference or barometer for who got selected:
Jon(Cedar Falls): Does the committee use the Gridiron Power Index as criteria?
Jim O'Day: The committee did not use the GPI - or any other external polls - to select, pair or seed any of the championship teams.

The committee does in fact use and look at the GPI, as well as other ratings like the Sagarins and the polls. Of course, they don't exclusively make selections based on the GPI or the polls, but that is part of the process. The GPI is more influential than any one poll. I have heard O'Day speak and say this multiple times, including yesterday by phone from Indianapolis as well as in person. This is one of the ways the committee determines strenght of schedule and makes comparisons.

[Green26]

If SC State wins, this debate is mute.

It is what it is.

No, the debate is not "mute". It continues. It may be "moot", though. Nice try. Maybe you should look up the two words.

[WestCoastAggie]

No, the debate is not "mute". It continues. It may be "moot", though. Nice try. Maybe you should look up the two words.

xlolx