The end of the Football Bowl Subdivision expansion is close at hand

[TennesseeBoyintheRockies]

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[PantherRob82]

Honesty I think you're off base. UC-Davis, Cal Poly, and Montana were all rumored to the WAC and either said no, or essentially did (UC-D and CPU joining the Big Sky).

Neither of the Texas schools you mentioned (SFA and SHSU) can move up. It's just not feasible.

[FargoBison]

Utah State and La Tech will leave and the WAC will die.

[PantherRob82]

Montana State is in even less of a position to move up than Montana.

[JMUNJ08]

If we just killed the WAC (with its current members why not?) and this would be a moot point to discuss....

[UNHFan]

Hurry hurry Montana move up so you can be mashall an absolute nothing in college football your hand is forced!!!! To funny... Please give me a break. Move up mean nothing anymore with fcs getting more and more exposure 5-10 years at this pace people are going to wanting an fbs-fcs national championship game just look where 1-aa was 10 years ago and now.....

[mtbigdog]

Montana already said no thanks for now.We've already proven we're not that stupid. Maybe sometime in the future [who knows?].The only thing the wac needs is to be taken off life support and put out of its misery.

[FargoBison]

Yes, Montana did turn down the WAC which I think was a good move, but Karl Benson is sly.

Montana turned down the WAC when there was potential for high travel costs with Hawaii and Louisiana Tech as members. With Hawaii gone and La Tech in a WAC East division, Montana could be more susceptible. Also, when Montana turned down the WAC, Karl Benson was only looking at bringing in Montana. Montana wasn't going to leave the stability of the Big Sky.

I'm just tellin' you that it is VERY likely that Benson will aim to bring in Montana State and a slew of the Big Sky members in one swoop. Montana has a history in the Big Sky--a long one. As I'm sure you know, Montana and Motana State are the only two members still in the Big Sky since it formed in 1963. They have a great deal of devotion to the Big Sky. With that devotion they have much more going for them in that conference than upstart programs like Cal Davis, Cal Poly, and Portland State who are just now joining or doesn't have the tenure of the Montana schools.
Those schools are more prone to jump straight to the WAC because their tenures in the FCS level are not as storied as Montana's or Montana State's. It may not make a difference for them except as a WAC member, they'd be in college football's highest division.

I really think that Benson and the new WAC presidents will seek to systematically dismantle the Big Sky in an effort to survive as a conference.

Pretty sure Hawaii is the kind of team that would have had Montana excited about the WAC. Bringing that team to your stadium sells tickets, now the WAC has nothing. Time to pull the plug.

[Redhawk2010]

How many of these schools can afford to make the jump?

[GoAgs72]

Who is Cal Davis? Are they in the FCS?

[AppMAN04]

Who is Cal Davis? Are they in the FCS?
YES! They are the team that once moved from D2 and beat Stanford a few years back..

[TheRevSFA]

While I know SFA cannot afford to move up (neither can Sam at the moment)..I wouldn't want to move into the WAC..it's now become a glorified FCS conference..and I don't even think it'd rank high in FCS...

[DSUrocks07]

:) I guess I shoulda' said UC-Davis. Cal-Davis must be a name that the Aggie fans don't like or don't identify with. Ya' learn something new everyday!

Sorta like "UNC-Charlotte"? *hides*

[darell1976]

If the WAC dies I think Idaho should move back to the Big Sky, as for Big Sky teams moving up to the FBS...Montana was the best bet and they said no. UC Davis and or Cal Poly are not moving up along with UND (at least not yet;)) Maybe things will change in 5 or 10 years but not in the near future.

[Tod]

:) I guess I shoulda' said UC-Davis. Cal-Davis must be a name that the Aggie fans don't like or don't identify with. Ya' learn something new everyday!

Something else you should know; Weber State and Idaho State are also founding members of the Big Sky.

[chrisattsu]

If the WAC dies I think Idaho should move back to the Big Sky, as for Big Sky teams moving up to the FBS...Montana was the best bet and they said no. UC Davis and or Cal Poly are not moving up along with UND (at least not yet;)) Maybe things will change in 5 or 10 years but not in the near future.

UND, Poly, UC-Davis may want to wait another five years, but what happens if the WAC folds as an FBS conference. The new NCAA rules say that you will need a bonafide conference invite before you can move up. With the current footprint, the MWC (maybe the MAC for the xD schools) will be your only option.

Meaning that no, new FBS conferences can just materialize.

[darell1976]

UND, Poly, UC-Davis may want to wait another five years, but what happens if the WAC folds as an FBS conference. The new NCAA rules say that you will need a bonafide conference invite before you can move up. With the current footprint, the MWC (maybe the MAC for the xD schools) will be your only option.

Meaning that no, new FBS conferences can just materialize.

UND isn't close to move up. Maybe 10-20 years as there are big rumor talks about an upgrade to our old stadium and we have 8 years left on our 13,500 seat stadium lease then maybe UND's name could be on the FBS list. As for 5 years maybe UC Davis or Cal Poly or the Montana schools.

[TexasTerror]

Honesty I think you're off base. UC-Davis, Cal Poly, and Montana were all rumored to the WAC and either said no, or essentially did (UC-D and CPU joining the Big Sky).

Neither of the Texas schools you mentioned (SFA and SHSU) can move up. It's just not feasible.

He is off base...

I do not think anyone is going to put the Big Sky in unstable position. SHSU's feasibility study said we did not want to move to FBS until we get our budget to at least $15M annually with necessary upgrades. Our fans want to be competitive first at the FCS level on a yearly basis, not finish last like our friends in San Marcos did this year - just prior to the move up.


While I know SFA cannot afford to move up (neither can Sam at the moment)..I wouldn't want to move into the WAC..it's now become a glorified FCS conference..and I don't even think it'd rank high in FCS...

No joke - we'd both draw more for games against the SLC schools than Idaho, New Mexico State and San Jose State.

[Cocky]

If the WAC is really near death, they may make a play for App, JSU, Ga Southern, JMU, GSU, and a few other southern schools to survive.

[UNI Pike]

I can't see UC Davis making the move. They would need to seriously invest in facilities. They are still transitioning from DII, and are in the process of cutting varsity sports (both men's and women's).

Plus, they have attendance issues. Davis has this wacky quarter system which results in the FB team playing the first 2-3 games with no students on campus.

Cal Poly would be a better bet, though still doubtful.

[ChinStrapPenguin]

No joke - we'd both draw more for games against the SLC schools than Idaho, New Mexico State and San Jose State.

You are right. There is more interest in games that involve closer teams.

If the WAC does fold, I think that Idaho, New Mexico State, and San Jose State should consider dropping down to FCS.

[Nebuta]

Its ashame the CAA cant go to the FBS as an entire conference for football. CAA would represent and fair alot better then the some of the current bottom of the barrel FBS conferences. But that will NEVER happen.

[Sec310]

I can't see UC Davis making the move. They would need to seriously invest in facilities. They are still transitioning from DII, and are in the process of cutting varsity sports (both men's and women's).

Plus, they have attendance issues. Davis has this wacky quarter system which results in the FB team playing the first 2-3 games with no students on campus.

Cal Poly would be a better bet, though still doubtful.

There are a few schools, including Stanford & UCLA, that are on the quarter system. It's not that big of a deal.

[49RFootballNow]

Sorta like "UNC Charlotte"? *hides*

I fixed that for you. No hyphens.

[Nor Eastern]

Its ashame the CAA cant go to the FBS as an entire conference for football. CAA would represent and fair alot better then the some of the current bottom of the barrel FBS conferences. But that will NEVER happen.


The best of the CAA and the best of the SoCon could merge into a conference that would dwarf the SunBelt/WAC/MAC/ConfUSA in terms of quality teams.

[UNI Pike]

There are a few schools, including Stanford & UCLA, that are on the quarter system. It's not that big of a deal.

Stanford & UCLA - Stanford still hasn't sold out a game this year, even with the success they have had. (In fact, many years since last sellout). Many of their alums live in the SF bay area, population 5 million+.

UCLA has a huge alumni base to draw on in LA.

UC Davis has a town of 64,000 people to draw on - most who are not football types. They do get some draw from nearby Sacramento. Most UC Davis alumni are leaving the area after graduation.

I only point this out that you need to a reliable fanbase to fill the 15,000 seat attendance threshold for FBS (that still is in effect, correct)? Davis has been averaging +/- 8K per game this year.

[Appfan_in_CAAland]

The best of the CAA and the best of the SoCon could merge into a conference that would dwarf the SunBelt/WAC/MAC/ConfUSA in terms of quality teams.

I fully endorse this proposal!

[JSU02]

I'd like to see App State, Georgia Southern, Jax State, JMU, Georgia State, Liberty, ODU, and who ever else is the South/East that is upgrading football facilities to form a new conference and move up to FBS together in a few years. It would easily best the WAC/MAC/Sunbelt.

[LouiseBFree]

The thought that the WAC must raid the Southland for its pathetic existence clearly shows the absurdity of all of this. Die WAC, die! The sooner the better.


Man, you guys keep missing the point. You are suggesting that Sam Houston State and Stephen F. Austin would be hosting these West Coast schools? The WAC wouldn't even attempt to add anyone else from the Southland UNLESS there could be two divisions made. Would Sam Houston and Stephen F. Austin also fail to draw good crowds from say someone like Texas State, UTSA, Lamar, or Louisiana Tech (the highly rumored Eastern Division expansion of the WAC)?

I understand good crowds could not be expected from a west coast school especially one like Idaho or San Jose State, and Karl Benson knows that too. That's why these additional Southland schools are being looked at to begin with.

[blukeys]

Who is Cal Davis? Are they in the FCS?

Cal Davis is a CPA in Florida

http://www.merchantcircle.com/business/Cal.Davis.And.Associates.PA.CPA.Orange.Park.FL.904-264-5501

[henfan]

http://www.corbisimages.com/images/67/79451739-9E19-4C7A-B6A4-42E4AFFB7A43/HU061007.jpg

Don't we have playoffs to discuss?

[cpalum]

Just want to make sure I am reading this thread correctly Cal Poly (or UC Davis for that matter) are going to leave the Big Sky/Big West so that they can ditch rivalries with Sac State and UCSB..and no longer play lame teams like Montana, EWU, Montana St. Portland State etc.....so that we can "jump up" to play world beaters like UTSA, Texas St, SJSU and Idaho?

And along with this privilege we get to pony up 10 or so million to add 13,000 seats to Spanos Stadium...a new basketball facility....22 more scholarships?

I doubt itxnonox

If what is being discussed here comes to pass I would say the chances that the WAC folds are very high. I think the Big Sky moving to FBS as a conference with the addition of Idaho, SJSU and possibly NMSU is more likely. That way the teams could transition together, rivalries could remain and facilities could be improved at a realistic pace.....at some point there is no WAC to save.

[08LionBacker]

I could see the SunBelt taking UTSA and Texas St. That would give the conference 12 football schools and a good east west mixture of schools. Also a football championship game. The MWC could pick 2 teams from Idaho, Utah St, New Mexico St, and San Jose St.

[TexasTerror]

I could see the SunBelt taking UTSA and Texas St. That would give the conference 12 football schools and a good east west mixture of schools. Also a football championship game. The MWC could pick 2 teams from Idaho, Utah St, New Mexico St, and San Jose St.

MWC wouldn't want any of those WAC schools... outside of maybe Utah State.

Sun Belt does not want to add FCS schools, since they are not a league of newbies any longer.

[Redhawk2010]

I'm going to have to agree with this. The Mountain West has courted Utah State before, but USU was not willing to leave under the terms presented when it still had good schools to play in Boise, Nevada, and Fresno. Now that those schools and Hawaii will be gone, there's no way Utah State turns down the Mountain West again.

As for the Sun Belt, you are correct. They will only bring in an FCS transitional team under two conditions:

1. The new football member is already a member in other sports (ie. See South Alabama)
2. The league was in danger of collapsing which it's not even close.

Now if an FCS moves up on their own free will and spins time as an Independent, I think the Sun Belt would pick them up if they needed a home. Needing only two schools to fill the football piece to form a championship after USA moves up, the SBC will most likely stay on hold for a while. You never know. Arkansas-Little Rock could surprise everyone and start a football team too. If they did, they'd become the Sun Belt's 11th full member unless the SBC loses teams to CUSA by then which also highly rumored if CUSA loses a couple of buddies to the Mountain West.

I thought right now you had to have the invite of a FBS conference in order to move up? I didn't think an FCS school could make the jump and become independent at the FBS level? WKU did it a couple of years ago, but I thought since then they have changed the rules. Maybe not?

[LouiseBFree]

The Southland door is slammed shut, completely shut.


Yes, you do have playoffs, but this announcement is REALLY good news for the Southland Conference which I consider to be part of the FCS Discussion. I don't think Texas State and San Antonio will make the move now.

[1andDone]

No offense, but who would want the WAC schools, they are WACK

[emilimo701]

The Mountain West (after losing TCU) will be down to 10 members.

The Mountain West, after losing TCU, Utah (PAC10), and BYU (independant), and gaining Boise State, Fresno State, and Nevada will be down to 9 members. I'm not sure where you got your math from as you did not state any team besides TCU.

The WAC, after losing Nevada and Boise State, and adding Texas State, UTSA, and Denver will have 8 future members.

So that's 9 for MWC and 8 for the WAC.

Villanova still hasn't committed to FBS, so for this purpose, the Big East still has 9 future members.

With the Big 12 at 10, and Sun Belt at 9, you have 15 more spots to be filled before each conference is up to the magic dozen. I say it'll be quite a while before "the end" is near.

[Red & Black]

WAC's all but dead and gone. Next.

[NC Aggie]

Cal Davis is a CPA in Florida

http://www.merchantcircle.com/business/Cal.Davis.And.Associates.PA.CPA.Orange.Park.FL.904-264-5501

Good one. Have to remember that.

[DSPSelym]

I really hope we can make it into Conference USA at some point in Statesboro,GA.

[Sader87]

I really hope we can make it into Conference USA at some point in Statesboro,GA.

Oh to dream....

[I-16Bandit]

You'd be hard-pressed to find any school that ever sells their stadium out unless it is against the big conference rival. Alot of people can advertise their stadium as a "sell-out" but really it isn't.

Georgia Southern just this year averaged 19,000+ each game in a stadium that "seats" 18,000.