Fullerton: FBS level unsustainable, FCS playing bigger role in future

[TexasTerror]

Interesting quote from the Big Sky Commissioner...


“The moves we’ve made aren’t about protection,’’ Fullerton said. “If the talk out there is true that playing at the FBS level of football is unsustainable for many schools, then FCS will play an even bigger role in the future. The Big Sky presidents want the Big Sky to be the first major player coming from the FCS ranks.

“We have to change a lot of mindsets,’’ Fullerton added. “Every time someone from our division has sustained success, the national media believes that school has to move up to the FBS level, and that’s not the case.”

http://www.fightingsioux.com/ViewArticle.dbml?DB_OEM_ID=13500&ATCLID=205022618

[jacksfan29]

I saw this quote as the most interesting piece of the press release. If Montana doesn't go to the WAC how long before Utah State pushes for a MWC bid and Hawaii goes Independent. Take those two away, add the two Texas schools and what do you have? A dead conference. Some schools may drop FB (San Jose) before moving down but how about NMSU, La Tech and Idaho? The MAC has the worst attendance in FBS (EMU just over 5,000 per game in 2009) and the Sunbelt, well everyone knows how bad the Sunbelt is. Unless something changes could a number of FCS conferences look very different in a decade or less with some FBS rejects entering into the picture?

[TexasTerror]

I saw this quote as the most interesting piece of the press release. If Montana doesn't go to the WAC how long before Utah State pushes for a MWC bid and Hawaii goes Independent. Take those two away, add the two Texas schools and what do you have? A dead conference. Some schools may drop FB (San Jose) before moving down but how about NMSU, La Tech and Idaho? The MAC has the worst attendance in FBS (EMU just over 5,000 per game in 2009) and the Sunbelt, well everyone knows how bad the Sunbelt is. Unless something changes could a number of FCS conferences look very different in a decade or less with some FBS rejects entering into the picture?

Yep - things are not looking good.

The financial situations in individual states do not help matters. Not sure how a school like ULM surives at the FBS level. If not for the FBS guarantee games and completely underfunding their non-revenue sports, they would not be able to survive FBS. Would be nice to be competitive in all sports - football included - wouldn't it?

[Mr. C]

One of my biggest criticisms of FCS schools moving to FBS is the way they rob Peter to pay Paul. Almost always, taking a school to FBS means that the other programs will suffer, unless you do like Western Kentucky did and make a move for the sake of your basketball team, not your football program. People just don't want to look at the fact that very few schools have ever been successful with an FCS-to-FBS move.

[BlueHenSinfonian]

One of my biggest criticisms of FCS schools moving to FBS is the way they rob Peter to pay Paul. Almost always, taking a school to FBS means that the other programs will suffer, unless you do like Western Kentucky did and make a move for the sake of your basketball team, not your football program. People just don't want to look at the fact that very few schools have ever been successful with an FCS-to-FBS move.

Football and basketball are the sports that really matter as far as revenue, visibility, and enrichment of the general (non athlete) student experience go. Hockey and Lacrosse may have footholds that offer some of those benefits in some northeast schools, but by and large you get the most return on your investment from football and basketball programs. I'm not saying the other sports shouldn't be offered, but if having successful programs in the big two mean that track and field, swimming, and equestrian aren't quite as well funded, that isn't necessarily a bad deal for the institution as a whole.

As far as the success of transfer programs goes, too many schools try to make the jump too soon. If a school doesn't have a winning history and a solid fan base at the FCS level, one isn't going to magically appear moving to FBS. Making the jump into a bottom level FBS conference doesn't help the matters much.

If you look at the FBS programs that consistently perform well, most are primary state universities. Alabama, Florida, Ohio State, Michigan, Penn State, etc, are all the big schools with the most funding in general. Yes, sometimes non-primary level state programss like Auburn and Miami, or wealthy private schools like Notre Dame can have success at the level, but by and large schools like UTSA compared to Texas, and UL-Lafayette compared to LSU will be left out in the cold.

[Green26]

From Big Sky Commissioner Fullerton:

1. Letter agreement with USD is negotiated by parties and signed by the Big Sky. Is now in USD's approval process, i.e. the board of regents.

2. The conference presidents have a new vision of the conference and its potential. An opportunity to be a major player in the west. Will have a presence in many markets. Can be something special in the west.

3. There will be two divisions. No other way to do it. Will let the AD's figure out how to do it. SU may have to go south (which seemed to indicate that Weber might not). Will need to look at scheduling and travel, as well as airline connections. Wants to preserve rivalries.

4. No championship game.

5. Will let AD's figure out how to select auto-bid.

6. SU has wanted to be in the conference for 20 years (according to a question asked).

7. "We are working on some television initiatives." Markets being brought in have tv interest. Everything will soon be online.

8. Softball may be a conference sport (I think).

9. No knowledge that any school plans to leave conference. Expansion is intended to help keep existing schools.

10. Wasn't a mistake not to add the other two Dakota schools previously. Things have changed since that time.

11. What's changed in past 5 years? Realignment and the MW/WAC thing. Larger conferences. If you look at what conference is becoming, it makes sense to build your program within this conference. The potential for FCS. Moving up isn't necessarily something that successful FCS teams should do. Most teams have not been successful moving up, with exception of some of the conference schools. More support of FCS by NCAA.

12. Conference headquarters will likely stay in SLC, but staffing may have to increase. SLC is a very good airline hub, with good connections.

13. Have been quieting working with these 3 schools for some time.

14. The presidents were comfortable with these schools.

15. CP and Davis were added earlier for defensive reasons.

16. The entrance fee is $250,000 and a buy-in of the conference equity/current reserve ($50,000 - $60,000). Immediate revenue-sharing.

17. FCS is now more supported by the NCAA than before.

18. Conference NCAA hoops revenue was $145,000 per team last year.

19. There will be 5 teams in conference with baseball, but won't be a conference sport. Better to let those teams schedule on their own.

20. An even number of teams is desireable.

21. Basketball will likely involve 9, 10 or 11 conference home games. The CAA, ACC, Big East and now Pac-12 have uneven scheduling within the conference.

22. Want to leave enough OOC scheduling room for teams like Montana to have well-attended home games and other schools to have FBS money games.

[theasushow]

Personally i think this is really good news.

[jcf5445]

Football and basketball are the sports that really matter as far as revenue, visibility, and enrichment of the general (non athlete) student experience go. Hockey and Lacrosse may have footholds that offer some of those benefits in some northeast schools, but by and large you get the most return on your investment from football and basketball programs. I'm not saying the other sports shouldn't be offered, but if having successful programs in the big two mean that track and field, swimming, and equestrian aren't quite as well funded, that isn't necessarily a bad deal for the institution as a whole.

As far as the success of transfer programs goes, too many schools try to make the jump too soon. If a school doesn't have a winning history and a solid fan base at the FCS level, one isn't going to magically appear moving to FBS. Making the jump into a bottom level FBS conference doesn't help the matters much.

If you look at the FBS programs that consistently perform well, most are primary state universities. Alabama, Florida, Ohio State, Michigan, Penn State, etc, are all the big schools with the most funding in general. Yes, sometimes non-primary level state programss like Auburn and Miami, or wealthy private schools like Notre Dame can have success at the level, but by and large schools like UTSA compared to Texas, and UL-Lafayette compared to LSU will be left out in the cold.

FAIL

[ASUTodd]

Interesting quote from the Big Sky Commissioner...



http://www.fightingsioux.com/ViewArticle.dbml?DB_OEM_ID=13500&ATCLID=205022618

Propaganda... This is someone trying to tell others who are driving BMW's that their Pinto is the best thing ever...

[Jackman]

Moving to FCS is not more cost effective if FBS level facilities have already been constructed. No bowl money, no TV money, lower guarantees, fewer games (excluding a FCS semifinal appearance), and generally lower donations, lower attendance and lower ticket prices. For all that you get to move 22 scholarships of pretend money to the other side of the ledger, a pretend value of about $600,000 at a place like Idaho (though that's not a good example of "FBS level facilities already built").

If you could cut a few women's sports to go along with it, maybe you could balance it or get ahead, but good luck trying that. "You're keeping football but cutting women's sports?! See you in court!" Then your Title IX compliance gets a rectal exam and you get bad publicity, win or lose.

[Big Al]

FAIL

Maybe he was referring to Miami of Ohio?

[BlueHenSinfonian]

FAIL

Whoops, Miami is private, but it still works for the point I was trying to make as an exception from the other category.

[jcf5445]

Whoops, Miami is private, but it still works for the point I was trying to make as an exception from the other category.

Agreed.

[Aho_Old_Guy]

Propaganda... This is someone trying to tell others who are driving BMW's that their Pinto is the best thing ever...

This.

It's a load of crap xlolx You guys need to can this Jack-Wadd.

The Big Sky received $225k in BCS revenue this year (as do the other 7 primary FCS conferences) to distribute among its members. This level of funding has not risen in 5 years.

The Mountain West received $9.88 million last year --- the WAC got $7.8 million. Even the lowly Conference-USA got $2.7 million (with the Sunbelt at $1.6 million - LOL).

The six primary *BCS* conferences received $19.8-$24.3 million. Throw in conference TV contracts, corporate sponsors, athletic foundations, et. al., and these guys are money making machines. Just because the Sunbelt sucks does not mean the model is unsustainable.

As a matter of fact, nothing else is further from the truth. It pains me to say but the over-whelming majority of FCS loses money.

It's no surprise that the bottom feeders of FBS are struggling. It's not because of sustainability, it's because they produce a product that stinks to high heaven and no one wants to watch them, whether in-person or on TV.

And the sad thing about that is even the bottom 20% of FBS has average attendance greater than all but a handful of FCS teams.

[ASUTodd]

Just to clarify.... The Big Sky commissioner is the one driving the Pinto, trying to tell the BCSer's that their BMW's suck...

[DFW HOYA]

If Fullerton is to be believed, ask him the last I-A school to voluntarily move to I-AA.

Villanova in 1985...and they have second thoughts on the matter.

[henfan]

If Fullerton is to be believed, ask him the last I-A school to voluntarily move to I-AA.

Villanova in 1985...and they have second thoughts on the matter.

That's not accurate. Villanova cancelled it's I-A program after the 1980 season and restarted FB 5 years later in I-AA. It was not a simple reclassification from I-A to I-AA for VU.

There were several programs who did move from I-A to I-AA in the early '80's and several are still in the FCS, including McNeese, App, UTC, WCU, Furman, El Cid, the Ivies, etc.

[danefan]

That's not accurate. Villanova cancelled it's I-A program after the 1980 season and restarted FB 5 years later in I-AA. It was not a simple reclassification from I-A to I-AA for VU.

There were several programs who did move from I-A to I-AA in the early '80's and several are still in the FCS, including McNeese, App, UTC, WCU, Furman, El Cid, the Ivies, etc.

I may be wrong but technically I don't think any of those teams were ever IA. They had a choice to go to either IA or IAA when the classifications were drawn and all chose IAA. I believe, Florida A&M is the only team to go from IA to IAA and that was during a transition period when they changed their minds.

[DFW HOYA]

I may be wrong but technically I don't think any of those teams were ever IA. They had a choice to go to either IA or IAA when the classifications were drawn and all chose IAA. I believe, Florida A&M is the only team to go from IA to IAA and that was during a transition period when they changed their minds.

Villanova was I-A and while I understand the point about it cancelling their program, they could have, but did not go back to I-A upon their return.

[Sec310]

Villanova was I-A and while I understand the point about it cancelling their program, they could have, but did not go back to I-A upon their return.

Nova was a 1-AA school when they dropped the program.

[DFW HOYA]

Nova was a 1-AA school when they dropped the program.

Villanova has not been reclassified out of I-A in 1980 and played seven I-A teams that season: Maryland, Cincinnati, Navy, Boston College, Holy Cross (I-A through 1981), VMI (I-A through 1981), and Temple.