Big Sky Welcomes Its Newest Members:

[darell1976]

North Dakota and Southern Utah!!!!!!!!

http://www.bigskyconf.com/news/2010/11/1/GEN_1101105326.aspx


OGDEN, UTAH (November 1, 2010) - The Big Sky Conference is privileged to announce that the University of North Dakota and Southern Utah University have accepted invitations to become core members of the Division I conference.



Both institutions will officially join the Big Sky on July 1, 2012. However, representatives from both institutions will begin working immediately with the currently membership on scheduling, marketing, and other conference matters (The exact date of the end of UND's transition period!!)


The Big Sky Conference is also on the verge of announcing the addition of the University of South Dakota as a 12th core member.


North Dakota began the transition from Division II to Division I in 2007, and will be eligible for all Big Sky and NCAA Championships in 2012-2013. North Dakota currently competes in the Great West Conference for most of its sports. Its football program won the Division II national championship in 2001, and was second in 2003. The Fighting Sioux won 24 Division II North Central Conference football championships.
xhurrayxxhurrayxxhurrayx

[Jacked_Rabbit]

Still no word on USD, huh? That's interesting...

[Lehigh Football Nation]

The University of South Dakota figures to be the final piece in the Big Sky expansion. The Coyotes of Vermillion, S.D., also compete in the Great West Conference for football. South Dakota and North Dakota are formal Division II rivals in the North Central Conference.

Like North Dakota, South Dakota began the transition to Division I in 2007 and will be eligible for Big Sky and NCAA Championships starting with the 2012-13 season.

“We are negotiating with South Dakota,’’ Fullerton said. “They want to be part of the Big Sky Conference and we want them to be a member. They are just awaiting a final approval process. Approval processes are different at each school.’’

Looks like South Dakota will also be joining.. soon.

[nwFL Griz]

Still no word on USD, huh? That's interesting...

There is. Read the article...some ways down it says they expect to add USD as well, just waiting on some kind of approval process (on USDs end).

[Jacked_Rabbit]

There is. Read the article...some ways down it says they expect to add USD as well, just waiting on some kind of approval process (on USDs end).

My bad! I didn't read all the way to the bottom... I just assumed they'd be coming out with their announcement at the same time. Good for the Big Sky!

[darell1976]

My bad! I didn't read all the way to the bottom... I just assumed they'd be coming out with their announcement at the same time. Good for the Big Sky!

Its that whole Summit buyout thing is what slowed down South Dakota. UND was never in the Summit and SUU wanted out of the Summit ASAP.

[Walkon79]

Welcome UCD, Poly, SUU and UND, (and hopefully South Dakota soon). Now let the the discussion about divisional alignment truly begin.

xnodxxnodxxnodx

[BlueHenSinfonian]

Is there any talk of adding NDSU and SDSU ? It would make sense to keep all of the Dakota schools together.

[darell1976]

Is there any talk of adding NDSU and SDSU ? It would make sense to keep all of the Dakota schools together.

No talk and I don't think Jacks and Bison fans want to leave a conference like the MVFC. Its a solid conference and their recruiting is perfect in the midwest as UND's recruiting area is in the west.

[Walkon79]

I think they're happy in the current conference. With divisional alignment, they should be able to play each other with some regularity.

[darell1976]

Welcome UCD, Poly, SUU and UND, (and hopefully South Dakota soon). Now let the the discussion about divisional alignment truly begin.

xnodxxnodxxnodx

2012 we can talk playoffs. xnodxxnodx

[Sec310]

No mention of what SUU will have to pay the Summit, if any, for leaving? Or did they give enough notice, that there is no penalty?

[F'N Hawks]

No mention of what SUU will have to pay the Summit, if any, for leaving? Or did they give enough notice, that there is no penalty?

I am so sick of hearing SU fans bellowing about the buyout, who cares. Its nothing considering they get a conference for the next how many decades. So pathetic. Its happening and USD obviously thinks the buyout is worth more than the Summit.

[GtFllsGriz]

Welcome to the Big Sky! All are great additions.

[UNI Pike]

Congrats on getting that monkey off your back UND & SUU, Hopefully USD gets its ticket punched also.

[Sec310]

Reread my post again. I was talking about SOUTHERN UTAH. Oh, I'm not a SUU fan. I was just asking a question about SUU. There are exit fees and/or penalities for members leaving a conference- look at Neb, CU, Fresno St. and Nevada- so, with USD maybe having to pay a $500K buyout, it would be reasonable to assume SOUTHERN UTAH, may also have to pay a buy out, or they could have given enough notice, that there will be no buyout.

[jacksfan29]

Reread my post again. I was talking about SOUTHERN UTAH. Oh, I'm not a SUU fan. I was just asking a question about SUU. There are exit fees and/or penalities for members leaving a conference- look at Neb, CU, Fresno St. and Nevada- so, with USD maybe having to pay a $500K buyout, it would be reasonable to assume SOUTHERN UTAH, may also have to pay a buy out, or they could have given enough notice, that there will be no buyout.

You just learned why neither XDSU were overly interested in having UND in the MVFC or Summit. As for an SUU exit fee, the Summit has wanted SUU out for years. The Summit leadership are jumping for joy now that SUU have found a new home. They were way out of the footprint of the conference and the remaining members likely would have paid to have SUU leave if the opportunity had been there to do so. USD is a different story, at the same time I doubt the Summit or USD want to burn that bridge. The delay in USD is likely based more on a SD Board of Regents approval process.

[RabidRabbit]

Reread my post again. I was talking about SOUTHERN UTAH. Oh, I'm not a SUU fan. I was just asking a question about SUU. There are exit fees and/or penalities for members leaving a conference- look at Neb, CU, Fresno St. and Nevada- so, with USD maybe having to pay a $500K buyout, it would be reasonable to assume SOUTHERN UTAH, may also have to pay a buy out, or they could have given enough notice, that there will be no buyout.

IIRC, there was no buyout provisions for the Summit League EXISTING members when NDSU, SDSU, and IPFW joined 3 years ago. I'm pretty certain that Centenary, which is dropping to D-III were hit with no penalties. In expansion talks/discussions by the Summit Commissioner, there has been a very STRONG support by the remaining schools to want SUU not part of the Summit. Not because of their level of play, but because they were so far outside the rest of the Summit footprint.

I hope that Summit/MVFC is talking REALLY fast about retaining USD. They would be a Great addition to the Summit, and a respectable FB addition.

[I Bleed Purple]

14 members is not a bad amount for football. 7 team divisions allow six divisional games. 3 home. 3 away. Fill it out with two from the other division. Shouldn't be too difficult. I don't know the logistics of doing 14 inter-divisional games, though.

12 teams in basketball isn't bad, either. I don't like the idea of having to go all the way to North Dakota every year in basketball, though. NAU has a partner now, so that's nice. Still leaves Sac St. and UNC with no travel partners, though.

The above is assuming South Dakota joining the Big Sky.

[F'N Hawks]

Reread my post again. I was talking about SOUTHERN UTAH. Oh, I'm not a SUU fan. I was just asking a question about SUU. There are exit fees and/or penalities for members leaving a conference- look at Neb, CU, Fresno St. and Nevada- so, with USD maybe having to pay a $500K buyout, it would be reasonable to assume SOUTHERN UTAH, may also have to pay a buy out, or they could have given enough notice, that there will be no buyout.

It had nothing to do with you, my apologies. There has been numerous posts on message boards all worried about making sure everybody has to pay their exit fees.

[Polywog]

My take on the divisional lineup:

North Division
Montana
Montana State
North Dakota
South Dakota
Idaho State
Eastern Washington
Portland State

South Division
Cal Poly
UC Davis
Sac State
Weber
Southern Utah
Northern Colorado
Northern Arizona


What I'd actually prefer but don't think will happen:

Pacific Division
Poly
Davis
Sac State
PSU
EWU
NAU
ISU

Mountain Division
Montana
Montana State
North Dakota
South Dakota
Weber
SUU
Northern Colorado

[I Bleed Purple]

Why is everyone wanting to break up a two hour bus ride from Pocatello to Ogden?

[Polywog]

I didn't realize Pocatello and Ogden were so close. In that case, swap ISU and UNC in my Pacific/Mountain scenario.

[mksioux]

SUPER DUPER!!! xhurrayxxhurrayx

UND has a long and storied tradition, but the transition has certainly been tough on UND. This is simply fantastic news that hopefully will restore the excitement. I'm confident UND will become a great conference mate and ease some of the consternation with this eastward expansion.

Time to to do some research and learn more about our future conference mates. Also trying to decide which school I want to visit first for a football game.

[I Bleed Purple]

SUPER DUPER!!! xhurrayxxhurrayx

UND has a long and storied tradition, but the transition has certainly been tough on UND. This is simply fantastic news that hopefully will restore the excitement. I'm confident UND will become a great conference mate and ease some of the consternation with this eastward expansion.

Time to to do some research and learn more about our future conference mates. Also trying to decide which school I want to visit first for a football game.

You definitely want to go to Greeley first. :p

[RabidRabbit]

You definitely want to go to Greeley first. :p

Probably already made that trip numerous times in the NCC days.

[Walkon79]

Why is everyone wanting to break up a two hour bus ride from Pocatello to Ogden?

That's why I like this East/West (Or Mountain/Pacific) better, except this also breaks up a rather storied rivalry between UM and EWU, but they could probably still play every year if they wanted. The 4 remaining original BSC members would all be in the east.

EAST
MSU
UM
UNC
UND
USD
WSU
ISU

WEST
EWU
PSU
SAC
NAU
SUU
POLY
UCD

[DirtyBird]

SUU to Weber 4 hours, SUU to Idaho State 6 hours, both are easy driving on I-15. SUU to NAU 6 hours hard mountain driving on state roads, no fun. I would much rather be paired with those two teams than NAU. Plus Weber is much more of a rival than NAU. Not that we will have much say on the matter but that is one fans wishes.

[darell1976]

14 members is not a bad amount for football. 7 team divisions allow six divisional games. 3 home. 3 away. Fill it out with two from the other division. Shouldn't be too difficult. I don't know the logistics of doing 14 inter-divisional games, though.

12 teams in basketball isn't bad, either. I don't like the idea of having to go all the way to North Dakota every year in basketball, though. NAU has a partner now, so that's nice. Still leaves Sac St. and UNC with no travel partners, though.

The above is assuming South Dakota joining the Big Sky.

It will be worse if you have to leave North Dakota with a loss.:D

[I Bleed Purple]

Probably already made that trip numerous times in the NCC days.

I am aware of that. That's part of why I posted it. :p

[I Bleed Purple]

It will be worse if you have to leave North Dakota with a loss.:D

Unless you're good, Weber State rarely loses to Big Sky teams in basketball.

[darell1976]

Unless you're good, Weber State rarely loses to Big Sky teams in basketball.


So far UND rarely beats Big Sky teams or any team in basketball. Transistion hasn't been good to our bball team. xsmhx

[I Bleed Purple]

That's why I like this East/West (Or Mountain/Pacific) better, except this also breaks up a rather storied rivalry between UM and EWU, but they could probably still play every year if they wanted. The 4 remaining original BSC members would all be in the east.

EAST
MSU
UM
UNC
UND
USD
WSU
ISU

WEST
EWU
PSU
SAC
NAU
SUU
POLY
UCD

And that's the big problem.

We know for certain that the three California schools and the SUU/NAU combo will be in one division. The Dakotas and Montana schools will be in the other. That leaves five schools to break up. PSU and EWU are partners in basketball, can bus to each other's places, and play all over Washington and Oregon. They have a history. Do you break that up?

WSU and ISU are as mentioned, a two hour bus ride from each other. They're also two of the four remaining charter members. It's not a big rivalry since we beat ISU all the time, even in our 1-10 seasons, but the proximity is too close to split.

This leaves UNC. Geographically, it belongs in North/East, but do they bus anywhere? Maybe to Ogden. Maybe to the Montana schools and ISU. A Bear fan/alum may need to provide more information here.

The problem with pairing EWU and PSU is that it eliminates the bus ride from Cheney to Missoula (and I assume Bozeman). No easy solutions.

I'd be really tempted to throw UNC with the California schools and call it good, especially if UNC flies everywhere anyway.

I'd also be tempted to put PSU with the Eastern schools and put WSU/ISU together with the Calis, southern two, and UNC.

[Western_101]

Congrats, to SUU. They were nothing special in basketball, or football, decent though.

It felt to me for a long time that Big Sky was the perfect geographical fit for SUU, it also seemed to me that the Big Sky was snubbing SUU for the longest time as if they were not good enough for the Big Sky (Hogwash).

I am also glad that the other Dakota schools are going to the Big Sky. I didn't want the Geographical center of the MVFC to shift. AKA I did not want 4 Dakotas.

I want the MVFC to look South NOT North, I would really like the MVFC to offer membership to The University of Central Arkansas. UCA is an outstanding institution, better than Arkansas State IMO, and their football program is real good.

[Jacked_Rabbit]

Congrats, to SUU. They were nothing special in basketball, or football, decent though.

It felt to me for a long time that Big Sky was the perfect geographical fit for SUU, it also seemed to me that the Big Sky was snubbing SUU for the longest time as if they were not good enough for the Big Sky (Hogwash).

I am also glad that the other Dakota schools are going to the Big Sky. I didn't want the Geographical center of the MVFC to shift. AKA I did not want 4 Dakotas.

I want the MVFC to look South NOT North, I would really like the MVFC to offer membership to The University of Central Arkansas. UCA is an outstanding institution, better than Arkansas State IMO, and their football program is real good.

Central Arkansas in the MVFC - really?!?! I'm not sure I'm with you on that one...

[ST_Lawson]

Yea, I don't really see the MVFC adding anyone in the near future. If they were considering anyone in the short term, it might have been U of South Dakota before their (probably upcoming) move to the Big Sky, but that's a big IF.

Central Arkansas is kinda an outlier in their own conference, being much closer to the Missouri border of Arkansas than the Texas or Louisiana sides. They would be fairly close to Missouri State and Southern Illinois, but they just feel a bit too "out of the region" for me.

I've always personally considered the MVFC conference to be more of the FCS version of the Big 10. One of the top conferences in their division, all (or nearly all) public "state" schools, covering the northern half of the midwest. If we're seeing about adding anyone, I'd prefer to see someone that fits within most of those criteria. If the NCAA were to force a few of the bottom FBS teams down to FCS, I could see us going for one of the directional Michigan schools (Eastern, Central, Western). They're not doing well up in FBS, they all draw less than 20K average per game, and any of them would open up a Michigan market that is currently not covered by any FCS teams. Other options along those lines could include Ball State, or really, just about any MAC team that gets forced down, ideally within the region, but not right next to any other MVFC school (which would probably exclude Kent State and Akron, both within 50 miles of Youngstown State).

The other possibility is that of a good Div. II team deciding to move up, possibly someone from the MIAA (like Northwest Missouri State or University of Central Missouri), or the GLIAC (like Grand Valley State).

Anyway, congrats to Southern Utah. As a fan of a Summit League school, I'm kinda happy to see them go, not because they're a bad team (they're not, I've never had a problem with the school itself), but because they're so far away from everyone else (the nearest schools are SDSU and Oral Roberts, each about 950 miles away: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:SummitLeagueLocations.png). The Big Sky is a much better fit for them regionally, and a great conference to be in all around.

[Gil Dobie]

Congrats to the new BSC members

[Western_101]

Good Post ST Lawson,

If the MVFC were to grow you made three outstanding possibilities, Grand Valley, Northwest Missouri, Central Missouri, all are outstanding programs in DII and I think would compete very well in the Valley.

As far as your comment about UCA being an outlier or on the fringe, UCA is actually closer to Macomb than NDSU, SDSU, and YSU.

[ST_Lawson]

Good Post ST Lawson,

If the MVFC were to grow you made three outstanding possibilities, Grand Valley, Northwest Missouri, Central Missouri, all are outstanding programs in DII and I think would compete very well in the Valley.

As far as your comment about UCA being an outlier or on the fringe, UCA is actually closer to Macomb than NDSU, SDSU, and YSU.

I also did a little checking on attendance for those three Div. II teams.
Grand Valley
stadium seats - 8,550
average attendance last year - 9,957

Northwest Missouri
stadium seats - 6,500
average attendance last year - 6,819

Central Missouri
stadium seats - 10,000
average attendance last year - 7,025

The smallest stadium in the conference currently is Indiana State's Memorial Stadium, listed at 12,464, so the schools may have to do a few small additions to their stadium if they wanted to get up to a comparable size, although it looks like all three have very nice facilities for their size. And their 2009 attendance numbers put the lowest, Northwest Missouri, right about at the level that Illinois State is drawing for games this year, and above what Indiana State is averaging. For any of them, if they're able to add a few more stands, either on the ends of their fields, or to the top or sides of existing "away side" stands, then they'd be right up there with many of current MVFC teams.

And anyone who pays attention to Div. II is aware of how good of teams they are (Grand Valley State is 130-14 since 2000, with 4 Div. II national championships).

UCA is relatively close to some of the other schools (very close to Missouri State), but I guess they just don't really fit with what my "image" of the conference is/should be. To me, they just feel too far south to be part of the "Big 10 of the FCS". That's just my opinion though.

[BearsCountry]

While very good on the field, Northwest Missouri is your classic D2 school. They don't have the budget, tv market or overall athletic programs to make a move up. Now Central Missouri could. They are basically the Missouri version of Western Illinois, expect better at basketball. Their budget could easily be made into a D1 budget as well. Not to mention they are 30 minutes from Kansas City. If I was the Summit League I would be putting a bug in their ear. Grand Valley State is a duh, they really should be in D1. Nebraska-Omaha is another one to look for.

Of course Wichita State adding football would be the most prefered expansion team outside of Drake going scholarship.