George Mason I-AA Football Possibility

[JMU Duke Dog]

George Mason looks to have an ultimate goal of fielding a Division I-AA football team by 2014 with an affiliation with the CAA (if it is still even around then). They plan to build a 15,000-seat football stadium ($48 million) with a parking structure ($21 million) at a total cost of $69 million.

More at http://facilities.gmu.edu/masterplans/athletics_masterplan_FEB05.pdf


Potential IAA football program with 15,000 seats

The Colonial Athletic Association is committed to the expansion of football in the conference. Therefore, considerations have been made to address the potential growth of the club football program to NCAA, Div I-AA status.

Remaining true to the idea of centralized athletics, the unused land on West Campus adjacent to Braddock Road became an obvious location. A possible alternate location on West Campus may be at the terminus of the new road created by the bridge linking Main Campus to West Campus. This location would mean a less efficient use of the available land because of the position of the stadium in the middle of the site. Locating the future stadium adjacent to Braddock Road provide easier access, better visibility and more efficient use of the land. A 15,000 seat stadium development with associated parking requires 25 to 40 acres, depending upon developable land area and surface to structured parking ratios.

The Shirley Gate site is best served by remaining available for future development opportunities. Without connection to the local sewer, sewage treatment on site is a development issue. Future development considerations may include football, baseball (in conjunction with a minor league franchise), recreation center, faculty and/or retirement housing and
research development park.

[blukeys]

This is an about face. The administration seemed hostile to the idea before and of course land costs in Fairfax are a real consideration.

Looks as if the ODU move is having an impact.

[ucdtim17]

It'd be nice if some schools out west would do this . . . everyone and their brother back east plays football

[ChickenMan]

Georgia St also is considering I-AA football. Who knows in a few years the CAA could have three brand new programs... ODU... Georgia St and George Mason.

Football may be coming to Georgia State. No one yet knows the exact date that a referee will signal a first down, but college football may be coming to Georgia State. The Board of Governors approved a Request for Proposal that will pay for a study to examine the feasibility of college football coming to Georgia State University.

http://www.gsusignal.com/vnews/display.v/ART/2006/01/31/43e03b7d8deeb

[Go...gate]

You see Ga St. ODU and GMU in the Colonial, you will see a new northeastern affiliation of schools and possibly additions to the Patriot League.

[blur2005]

You see Ga St. ODU and GMU in the Colonial, you will see a new northeastern affiliation of schools and possibly additions to the Patriot League.
Yeah, in the form of at least Richmond and Villanova.

If Mason, ODU, and GA St were to get football teams, the CAA could have nine football teams that are CAA in all sports, which would be the perfect set up.

My only concern with ODU and Mason getting football teams is the recruiting factor. JMU and W&M are the only I-AA schools with recruiting power (sorry Liberty) right now in the state of Virginia that aren't HBCUs, so two new competitors might be tough on JMU's recruiting.

[JMU Duke Dog]

Yeah, in the form of at least Richmond and Villanova.

If Mason, ODU, and GA St were to get football teams, the CAA could have nine football teams that are CAA in all sports, which would be the perfect set up.

My only concern with ODU and Mason getting football teams is the recruiting factor. JMU and W&M are the only I-AA schools with recruiting power (sorry Liberty) right now in the state of Virginia that aren't HBCUs, so two new competitors might be tough on JMU's recruiting.

There would be nine I-AA teams in Virginia! :eek:
- George Mason
- Hampton
- James Madison
- Liberty
- Norfolk State
- Old Dominion
- Richmond
- VMI
- William & Mary

[Go...gate]

Would it surprise anybody if Liberty ended up in the A-10/CAA, given Dr. Falwell's ambitions for Liberty's athletic program??

[JMU Duke Dog]

Would it surprise anybody if Liberty ended up in the A-10/CAA, given Dr. Falwell's ambitions for Liberty's athletic program??

Maybe. Liberty is putting a lot of money and focus into athletics now; however, I also know that money does not guarantee success. Also there are so many things up in the air with what will happen. Most certainly there will be a shakeup in the mid-Atlantic region. Schools like Appalachian State, Delaware, and James Madison might move up to I-A but then they might not. George Mason, Georgia State, and Old Dominion are guaranteed membership for CAA football as they are CAA members in other sports. This would result in a 15-team conference if all three end up with I-AA football programs. Something is going to happen. We will have to wait on when and what exactly happens.

[JMU Duke Dog]

Possible Future CAA Football Alignment:
Delaware*
George Mason
Georgia State
Hofstra
James Madison*
Northeastern
Old Dominion
Towson
William & Mary

Teams Left Out Of Possible CAA Alignment:
Maine
Massachusetts*
New Hampshire
Rhode Island
Richmond
Villanova

*These schools could possibly move to I-A in the near future.

[blukeys]

It'd be nice if some schools out west would do this . . . everyone and their brother back east plays football


I think the addition of UD, Towson, and Northeastern to the CAA lineup increased the pressure to sponsor football and increased pressure on the non-football Virginia and Southern schools to look seriously at football. There have a ready made conference, schedule and rivalries that carry over from other sports.

Out west you have no such built in advantages.

[blukeys]

There would be nine I-AA teams in Virginia! :eek:
- George Mason
- Hampton
- James Madison
- Liberty
- Norfolk State
- Old Dominion
- Richmond
- VMI
- William & Mary


Yes Virginia could start their own conference. :eek:

[colgate13]

Teams Left Out Of Possible CAA Alignment:
Maine
Massachusetts*
New Hampshire
Rhode Island
Richmond
Villanova


Most probable scenario IMO:

Maine
UMass
UNH
URI
Albany
Stony Brook
CCSU

Bucknell
Colgate
Fordham
Georgetown
Holy Cross
Lafayette
Lehigh
Richmond
Villanova
(of course with scholarships now allowed)

Folks, we need a 24 team playoff at that point!

[mainejeff]

America East Football is coming. Stay tuned.

[UNH_Alum_In_CT]

America East Football is coming. Stay tuned.

I'll believe it when I see something concrete and the playoff field expands.

[mainejeff]

I'll believe it when I see something concrete and the playoff field expands.

The same can be said about ODU, GMU, and Georgia State ;) .

[henfan]

America East Football is coming. Stay tuned.

As evidenced by what news report, release or link? UNH_Alum's skepticism appears very well founded. We all heard the same promises from the AEC back in the late '90's.

Even if we don't know the results, we at least know ODU's, GMU's and GSU's intentions. The AEC, OTOH... : smh :

[mainejeff]

As evidenced by what news report, release or link? UNH_Alum's skepticism appears very well founded. We all heard the same promises from the AEC back in the late '90's.

Even if we don't know the results, we at least know ODU's, GMU's and GSU's intentions. The AEC, OTOH... : smh :

Come on henfan.....You and I know there is a slight difference between schools going public with there intentions to start up football and conferences making major changes.

Did the CAA go public before they were all ready to add schools? :rolleyes: Obviously, the answer is no. Those type of things are very sensitive. We'll see if either or both of us are proven right with our claims.

[MarkCCU]

****....that'd make nine teams in Va..that state can be it's own conference. lol

[henfan]

Jeff, the CAA did indeed indicate its intentions to expand long before the actual initial expansion took place. Reports of which specific teams would be involved even leaked out and were picked up by several media outlets in the East before the actual announcement was made. Pretty typical stuff for D-I schools and conferences.

In fact, the day that expansion partners were announced, CAA Commish Yeager indicated in print that football was in the conference's scope. A couple dozen articles appeared from that point up until the CAA's official football announcement and, in each case, the CAA proclaimed its intention to add football. (At the time, I remember you poo-poo'ing the idea over and over and over again.) It was never, ever any sort of secret, as you are suggesting is now the case with the AEC.

Fact is there are indications that ODU, GSU and GMU have football on their radar. Whether anything comes of it remains to be seen. However, there is absolutely no indication whatsoever that the AEC is pursuing football, though it seems we'd both agree that it would make sense to, especially considering the circumstances should ODU, GSU or GMU follow through with programs.

Finally, I'm not sure to which claims you're referring. I've not made any. I merely stated that 3 CAA schools have publicly stated their intentions to investigate football and to date the AEC has not. Is that inaccurate? :confused:

[mainejeff]

Do you REALLY think that AE would come out with a press release announcing its intentions if it invloved schools from other conferences???

As far as "leaking" info.........that has already happened.

[henfan]

Do you REALLY think that AE would come out with a press release announcing its intentions if it invloved schools from other conferences???

A press release isn't necessary; a simple statement in passing to the press would be a start. The CAA discussed its plans for a football league in a general way quite often prior to expansion. It wasn't necessary to indentify exactly how they'd go about carrying out the plan, which teams would be involved, etc.


As far as "leaking" info.........that has already happened.

Really? Apparently, the press hasn't put much stock in the leaks to which you've alluded, since there's not been one word about it. Odd, don't you think?

[dbackjon]

Why does every thread about potentially new I-AA teams/upgrading teams turn into a CAA/AE pissing match?

We get the picture - AE members think/have inside info that AE football is coming, old AE members (i.e. Delaware) have a "Show-Me" attitude, and feel that the CAA is greatest thing since sliced bread.


Can we please stick to the thread topic???

[blukeys]

Why does every thread about potentially new I-AA teams/upgrading teams turn into a CAA/AE pissing match?

We get the picture - AE members think/have inside info that AE football is coming, old AE members (i.e. Delaware) have a "Show-Me" attitude, and feel that the CAA is greatest thing since sliced bread.


Can we please stick to the thread topic???


The thread topic is CAA football and George Mason. Can you be more specific about who is violating YOUR TERMS about who should be commenting?

[henfan]

Hey, don't get me wrong. I actually agree with Jeff that the America East football is a distinct possibility someday and may make some sense, especially for UMaine, Stony Brook, Albany and the CAA. As usual though, there's just been no evidence that the AEC is capable of being proactive. IMO, leagues like the CAA & AEC can never be "the greatest thing since sliced bread" so long as they include so many I-AAA schools.

[Sly Fox]

Thanks for the dig, blur. I guess that was to make sure we were paying attention.

As for the chances of Liberty ever joining the A-10, they would be zero. While it would make sense on many levels there is no chance the Cathloic administrations at the core A-10 schools would ever let a school connected with Jerry Falwell into their brotherhood.

Now the CAA is a horse of a different color. The CAA has been our #1 target for several years and remains our preferred affiliation (we applied during the most recent expansion). We would have natural rivalries with the Virginia schools and a historical connection with Towson.

But our much-publicized I-A plans likely will hurt our shortterm possibilties. But if a split in the super-sized CAA were to occur in advance of our preps to step up, we would certainly be jumping at the opportunity.

As for the All-Virginian league, we'd certainly be down with that. BUt obviously that's not in the cards.

I've seen mention a few times recently that JMU might consider stepping up along with Appy & others. That's certainly intriguing fodder.

[dbackjon]

The thread topic is CAA football and George Mason. Can you be more specific about who is violating YOUR TERMS about who should be commenting?

Actually it is George Mason I-AA Football Possibility..... :D, which is interesting enough in itself. The CAA/AE posts are identical to those found in about 100 other threads........

[saint0917]

Most probable scenario IMO:

Maine
UMass
UNH
URI
Albany
Stony Brook
CCSU


I see it more like this IMO:

Umass
Maine
UNH
URI
Duquesne
LaSalle

Duquesne and LaSalle already have an affiliation with the A10, Albany, Stony Brook and CCSU do not. But, I would be more than happy to add those 3 teams if it means getting away from the CAA and getting A10 football back. Nothing against the CAA but if Georgia St. ODU and Gearge Mason add football
your talking about 16-17 teams in the CAA and that's way to many.

[Dane96]

I see it more like this IMO:

Umass
Maine
UNH
URI
Duquesne
LaSalle

Duquesne and LaSalle already have an affiliation with the A10, Albany, Stony Brook and CCSU do not. But, I would be more than happy to add those 3 teams if it means getting away from the CAA and getting A10 football back. Nothing against the CAA but if Georgia St. ODU and Gearge Mason add football
your talking about 16-17 teams in the CAA and that's way to many.


La Salle doesnt have the money and facilities, Duquense the facilities. I would think Jeff is closer than you guys think. In truth, I forsee an even bigger shift of the landscape than what is being talked about. I believe a few UD fans mentioned a CAA North. Again, as talked about ad nauseum, I forsee a split in the CAA in the future on basketball and football lines. If and when that occurs, you will see some combination of the old Yankee/A-Ten/CAA football conferences along with some newbies (you'd have to throw in UA and SBU in that mix based upon the movements on those respective campus').

[GannonFan]

Yeah, I agree on LaSalle - no chance in hades that they beef up their football program - it's barely a program now. Dusquesne is a different case entirely.

[Dane96]

Yeah, I agree on LaSalle - no chance in hades that they beef up their football program - it's barely a program now. Dusquesne is a different case entirely.

Duquense builds a new facility...then they are ALL BUSINESS. Very good program, great recruiting area, in a nice media market....yeah, I'd say they would be attractive.

[blukeys]

Again, as talked about ad nauseum, I forsee a split in the CAA in the future on basketball and football lines. If and when that occurs, you will see some combination of the old Yankee/A-Ten/CAA football conferences along with some newbies (you'd have to throw in UA and SBU in that mix based upon the movements on those respective campus').


It appears that the football playing schools are winning the argument at least for now. But, You are quite correct that there is a split between the football and non football schools in the CAA. I also see that in all conferences that have non football playing members including the AE and the NEC.

I would much rather have Maine and UNH in an all sports conference then Virginia Commonwealth and Drexel as basketball "rivals".

[ChickenMan]

I would much rather have Maine and UNH in an all sports conference then Virginia Commonwealth and Drexel as basketball "rivals".

Ditto...

[Lehigh Football Nation]

Every once in a while you hear Drexel folks whisper about bringing back football... theoretically... they would be welcomed back in the CAA, no?

Now VCU, I have no idea. But Drexel at one time (long ago) had football, presumably sharing Franklin Field in a Jets/Giants sort of situation. Theoretically, it could come back?

[Ivytalk]

Isn't George Mason kind of a commuter school? Would that doom it to the slender fan-base fate of Northeastern, Temple and the like?

George Mason might want to hire John St Onge as its coach. Its law school has a strong Libertarian contingent! :D

[GannonFan]

Every once in a while you hear Drexel folks whisper about bringing back football... theoretically... they would be welcomed back in the CAA, no?

Now VCU, I have no idea. But Drexel at one time (long ago) had football, presumably sharing Franklin Field in a Jets/Giants sort of situation. Theoretically, it could come back?

In theory, sure, anything is possible. But in reality, there is no chance whatsoever that Drexel will ever play football. They're basically just a basketball school when it comes to athletics - they only have 16 sports in total (8 men, 8 women) and they don't put a lot of funding into those (i.e. no schollies for some). They dropped baseball just a few years ago because they couldn't afford it and it was a Title IX casualty. They could never support a football team and could never afford to lease Franklin Field. They barely keep their heads above water with basketball and they've decided that is going to be their major sport - they still play in a de facto high school gym, but that's a testament of how they fund their major sport. LaSalle has a better chance of having a fully funded scholarship football team than Drexel even has of having a club football team. Never will happen.

[henfan]

I would much rather have Maine and UNH in an all sports conference then Virginia Commonwealth and Drexel as basketball "rivals".

Double ditto.

Outside of ODU (who most certainly will have football by 2009), George Mason and Georgia State are the only two I-AAA schools in the CAA with even the remotest interest in football at this time. GMU & GSU are longshots to land teams in the next decade. UNCW and Virginia Commonwealth have expressed no interest and, as Gannonfan said, Drexel cannot possibly afford it. DU maintains a D-I athletic department for the purposes of supporting its D-I mens hoop program.

[HIU 93]

Yes Virginia could start their own conference. :eek:

That isn't a bad idea.

[HIU 93]

Isn't George Mason kind of a commuter school? Would that doom it to the slender fan-base fate of Northeastern, Temple and the like?



Yes, it is, and it would. They would have to schedule Hampton, JMU, NSU, and Howard just to get some butts in the seats.

[blukeys]

Yes, it is, and it would. They would have to schedule Hampton, JMU, NSU, and Howard just to get some butts in the seats.


They seem to get decent crowds for Basketball. Commuter schools can get decent football crowds if they are marketed well and are successful.

Temple's problems go way beyond commuter status. Northeastern's stadium does not help getting crowds out.

[DFW HOYA]

In theory, sure, anything is possible. But in reality, there is no chance whatsoever that Drexel will ever play football... LaSalle has a better chance of having a fully funded scholarship football team than Drexel even has of having a club football team. Never will happen.

FWIW, Drexel was playing football into the 1970's. The link below is for their school's coach from the 1960's named to the DU hall of fame.

http://www.drexeldragons.com/info/hof/list/Grebis.asp

[henfan]

Drexel dropped football in 1973. They were playing at the Small College level prior to that.

In their final years, they played schools like Hampden-Sydney, Upsala, Albright, Lafayette, Fordham, Lehigh, Gettysburg, PA Military College, King's Point, Delaware Valley, Juniata, Wilkes, etc.

[GannonFan]

FWIW, Drexel was playing football into the 1970's. The link below is for their school's coach from the 1960's named to the DU hall of fame.

http://www.drexeldragons.com/info/hof/list/Grebis.asp

I'm not saying that they didn't play football, just that reviving a football program is never, ever going to happen at Drexel.

[colgate13]

I'm not saying that they didn't play football, just that reviving a football program is never, ever going to happen at Drexel.

Or NYU, Chicago...

[GannonFan]

Or NYU, Chicago...

Yup, don't expect to see Jay Berwanger's alma mater resuccitate their program anytime soon either.