Will NCAA force any conferences to FCS?

[Lehigh Football Nation]

Will they?

[msusig]

UL-Monroe, Idaho, and some MAC schools should be forced to move to FCS. Or at least be put on notice that if they don't improve they will be forced to move down.

[appfan2008]

I would like to see the attendance requirement for fbs schools actually be enforced... but as for moving whole conferences down I dont see that happening...

[GannonFan]

They're not going to move anyone, nor should they. Play at whatever level you want, IMO. The NCAA shouldn't and most likely won't have anything to say about that.

[MaximumBobcat]

I would like to see the attendance requirement for fbs schools actually be enforced... but as for moving whole conferences down I dont see that happening...

Most teams seem to hit their 15k average once every two years.

Who are you talking about that you like to see the rules enforced upon?

[darell1976]

Most teams seem to hit their 15k average once every two years.

Who are you talking about that you like to see the rules enforced upon?

Most MAC teams don't meet the 15,000. However Florida Int'l average in 2008 is 13,852 and 10,204 in 2009...so why aren't their sactions against them.

[aust42]

What's with all these topics of 1A teams moving down and 1AA teams being invited to the MAC, WAC etc? No 1A team is going to drop down a level period. And good luck getting an invite to any conference other than the SunBelch which in reality is a 1AA Conference anyway.

[henfan]

I've said it before and I'll say it again. The FBS attendance requirement is a complete joke. The NCAA doesn't enforce its own regulations. If they began to do that, schools would simply artificially inflate their attendance numbers to meet the requirements. The numbers are self-audited, so it's a meaningless regulation.

[darell1976]

I've said it before and I'll say it again. The FBS attendance requirement is a complete joke. The NCAA doesn't enforce its own regulations. If they began to do that, schools would simply artificially inflate their attendance numbers to meet the requirements. The numbers are self-audited, so it's a meaningless regulation.

Then get rid of the rule.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

What's with all these topics of 1A teams moving down and 1AA teams being invited to the MAC, WAC etc? No 1A team is going to drop down a level period. And good luck getting an invite to any conference other than the SunBelch which in reality is a 1AA Conference anyway.

You illustrate the hypocrisy perfectly. The WAC and Sun Belch are widely regarded as (in reality) FCS conferences, or at best FBSINO's. Yet the common thought process is "no FBS team will drop down." Well, yeah, that's correct. Without any oversight, no FBS school will willingly reclassify.

Unless the NCAA gives them a push. And IMO there is reason to believe that the NCAA will be giving them a push. It's already been happening at the lower levels with Centenary and New Orleans reclassifying, thanks to push from the NCAA. Why wouldn't it happen with FBS football, too?

[JMUNJ08]

You illustrate the hypocrisy perfectly. The WAC and Sun Belch are widely regarded as (in reality) FCS conferences, or at best FBSINO's. Yet the common thought process is "no FBS team will drop down." Well, yeah, that's correct. Without any oversight, no FBS school will willingly reclassify.

Unless the NCAA gives them a push. And IMO there is reason to believe that the NCAA will be giving them a push. It's already been happening at the lower levels with Centenary and New Orleans reclassifying, thanks to push from the NCAA. Why wouldn't it happen with FBS football, too?

Because only boosters and agents have control over major college football in this country. The NCAA only steps in to sanction schools after the fact while the players go on to make millions. They are a truly backwards group that I wouldn't trust to give me the correct change at McDonalds

[aust42]

You illustrate the hypocrisy perfectly. The WAC and Sun Belch are widely regarded as (in reality) FCS conferences, or at best FBSINO's. Yet the common thought process is "no FBS team will drop down." Well, yeah, that's correct. Without any oversight, no FBS school will willingly reclassify.

Unless the NCAA gives them a push. And IMO there is reason to believe that the NCAA will be giving them a push. It's already been happening at the lower levels with Centenary and New Orleans reclassifying, thanks to push from the NCAA. Why wouldn't it happen with FBS football, too?

Why wouldn't it happen in FBS? I guess because the NCAA's "push" via attendance requirements (amoung other things) that they tried to enact a few years ago was rigorously resisted by those 1A schools it would affect. The NCAA quickly backed down and also put a 5 year moratorium on 1AA schools moving up. The NCAA was tired of 1AA schools moving up and "watering down" 1A's level of play. I don't see the NCAA having the balls to make an attempt at forcing any school to drop down at this point.

[henfan]

Then get rid of the rule.

The rule was instituted with good intentions as part of a comprehensive Division I FB study but was gutted after the low level FBS conferences excercised their voting power. Oddly, many of those conferences and schools supported the measure at first.

IMO, the only possible purpose for keeping the attendance requirement at this point is to serve as an additional barrier for any FCS schools thinking about reclassification, especially those hovering just below the 15K average range.

[MaximumBobcat]

The WAC and Sun Belch are widely regarded as (in reality) FCS conferences, or at best FBSINO's.

Among whom? Maybe among the internet-nerd football message board types like us.


I can only comment on the people I've dealt with in my life, but among the general public that I've dealt with (in Texas, Colorado, Wyoming and Utah), Sunbelt and Mac are considered bottom rung "D-I" conferences, with the WAC, C-USA and MWC regarded as "ok" "D-I" conferences.

Everything below that is "D-II".

[SpeedkingATL]

The BCS is the tail that wags the dog of NCAA football. Within a decade you will have 5 or 6 "Super BCS" conferences with all the TV money, bowl money, large % of other football related revenues, and then everyone else. It's almost that way today with the exception of Boise State and TCU (who haven't played for the Championship yet either) and those teams along with a few others will be a part of the "Super BCS" soon enough. If you don't make the cut then you will enter the twilight zone known as FCS.

[furpal87]

Too many easy wins for the big conferences among the Sun Belt (SEC, ACC whipping boys) and MAC (Big 10 favorites (and also Big South xlolx). They need those teams so they don't have to play real games against each other.

[NovaWildcat]

The BCS is the tail that wags the dog of NCAA football. Within a decade you will have 5 or 6 "Super BCS" conferences with all the TV money, bowl money, large % of other football related revenues, and then everyone else. It's almost that way today with the exception of Boise State and TCU (who haven't played for the Championship yet either) and those teams along with a few others will be a part of the "Super BCS" soon enough. If you don't make the cut then you will enter the twilight zone known as FCS.

Exactly.

And you might even change NCAA football to NCAA athletics.

[Jackman]

There is really no need for the separation between FBS and FCS anymore. The powerful football universities got the separation they wanted with the creation of the BCS. The FBS/FCS subdivisions in 1978 didn't accomplish what they wanted, except perhaps the irrelevancy of the Ivy League.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

The BCS is the tail that wags the dog of NCAA football. Within a decade you will have 5 or 6 "Super BCS" conferences with all the TV money, bowl money, large % of other football related revenues, and then everyone else. It's almost that way today with the exception of Boise State and TCU (who haven't played for the Championship yet either) and those teams along with a few others will be a part of the "Super BCS" soon enough. If you don't make the cut then you will enter the twilight zone known as FCS.


There is really no need for the separation between FBS and FCS anymore. The powerful football universities got the separation they wanted with the creation of the BCS. The FBS/FCS subdivisions in 1978 didn't accomplish what they wanted, except perhaps the irrelevancy of the Ivy League.

Wouldn't this be a compelling argument that the NCAA will have no choice but to separate the BC$ and "the rest", making teams either jump up to a BCS conference, or reclassify as FCS? You'd seem to agree with me that non-BCS FBS is an endangered species. The WAC, MAC and Sun Belt never were BCS conferences, and never will be.

[wkelly42]

So within 10 years we have the BCS and the PCS (Playoff Championship Subdivision)? I don't see it ever being BCS and then FCS, mainly because there are too many minor bowl games that would end up going away, and those sponsors don't want that to happen. That's too much money for the NCAA to give up.

Only way it would work is if those sponsors end up sponsoring a playoff game or something. And without the naming rights, I'm not sure they'll put up as much money as they're doing now.

[Cat79]

Wouldn't this be a compelling argument that the NCAA will have no choice but to separate the BC$ and "the rest", making teams either jump up to a BCS conference, or reclassify as FCS? You'd seem to agree with me that non-BCS FBS is an endangered species. The WAC, MAC and Sun Belt never were BCS conferences, and never will be.

This will never work because there are DII teams wanting to move up for the basketball money. The NCAA is not going to demote FBS teams without a legal fight. These teams have invested tons of cash on facilities upgrades and will not accept being downgraded.

The problem with FCS is money. The NCAA has it's hands on the gate receipts when the playoffs happen. The NCAA has claimed that TV coverage uses all the money up in FCS. A few years back U. Mass had won the FCS/I-AA Championship and lost 1 million dollars. If the NCAA does not correct the FCS money problem more teams will want to move up. Even the New Orleans Bowl which has the Sunbelt Champion facing another conference pays more that any team winning the National Title in FCS.

[Cat79]

There is really no need for the separation between FBS and FCS anymore. The powerful football universities got the separation they wanted with the creation of the BCS. The FBS/FCS subdivisions in 1978 didn't accomplish what they wanted, except perhaps the irrelevancy of the Ivy League.

Jackman,

You have that right. The BCS system has the ability to separate the haves from the have nots.

[youwouldno]

My guess is that eventually FCS will be eliminated, except maybe for non-scholarship programs. The FBS requirements get watered down even more so scholarship FCS programs make the cut. The post-season will be like basketball was early on- a smaller 'BCS' tournament to crown the champ, and a bigger tourney so more programs get to participate in the post-season. It's the simplest format that serves the interests of the power brokers, without ticking too many other people off.

[Twentysix]

Most MAC teams don't meet the 15,000. However Florida Int'l average in 2008 is 13,852 and 10,204 in 2009...so why aren't their sactions against them.

What about 07 and 10?

[darell1976]

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/63513-low-attendance-threatens-fbs-status-for-some-college-football-teams

Here is an article on the so-called attendance rule from 2008.


If your favorite college team can't average 15,000 people to a game once every two years, the NCAA technically can drop your team from what used to be called Division I-A to I-AA.

[Western_101]

Eastern Michigan needs to stop pretending to be a FBS program. They are far worse than half the FCS programs. Eastern Michigan would be better suited to join the MVFC (yikes even then they would never be better than mediocre).

North Texas is also exceptionally wretched year in and year out. North Texas would be a good fit for the Southland.

[heath]

Most teams seem to hit their 15k average once every two years.

Who are you talking about that you like to see the rules enforced upon?
Utah ST, E. Mich, Rice, Idaho, Kent St, FIU are only the ones that come to mind, sure they are others." Rules are made to be broken "

[Lehigh Football Nation]

This will never work because there are DII teams wanting to move up for the basketball money. The NCAA is not going to demote FBS teams without a legal fight. These teams have invested tons of cash on facilities upgrades and will not accept being downgraded.

The problem with FCS is money. The NCAA has it's hands on the gate receipts when the playoffs happen. The NCAA has claimed that TV coverage uses all the money up in FCS. A few years back U. Mass had won the FCS/I-AA Championship and lost 1 million dollars. If the NCAA does not correct the FCS money problem more teams will want to move up. Even the New Orleans Bowl which has the Sunbelt Champion facing another conference pays more that any team winning the National Title in FCS.

If the only problem with college football were that the occasional athletic department loses $1 million the year they win an NCAA-sanctioned national championship, I think the NCAA would be thrilled. It's life in those non-BCS FBS schools where many are hemorraging more than $1 million a year for football that there is grave danger.

[glsjunior]

I think that eventually congress will force FBS to have a playoff. In my world it would work like this

Each of the 11 conference champions would get an automatic bid. Then you take 5 wild cards picked by the NCAA committee.

The Bowls would then serve as an NIT of sorts. Each bowl would have a conference affiliation and you would take the best teams not in the playoffs. i.e Alabama would get the Automatic SEC bid, and the Sugar bowl would take Auburn (unless they got a wild card) and say Clemson.

I think fans of both teams would still watch the bowl game and we would get the playoff games that we want to see.

[GeauxLions94]

UL-Monroe, UL-Lafayette and Tulane are the three FBS schools in Louisiana that ought to move down.

[JDC325]

No way no how.

[Sam Adams]

i agree that the distinction b/w non-bcs fbs and fcs is getting to be nonexistent in many respects. i can definately foresee a future in which that distinction is eliminated. perhaps a new fcs super conference and upgrade to fbs would be the catalyst for the change? It would be great to see the NCAA fix the money issues and make FCS more feasible for playoff teams.