Letter from Villanova's President

[NovaWildcat]

This should straighten up the FACTS as we know it today regarding a potential Villanova move. Fr. Peter Donahue sent this yesterday...
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Dear Faculty and Staff:

I am writing to share with you some recent conversations that have taken place regarding the Villanova Football program and its relationship with the Big East Conference. As you know, the program currently competes in the Football Championship Subdivision (FCS), formerly known as Division I-AA. The student-athletes, coaches, and administrators are excellent representatives of the University and have established a winning tradition that culminated with a national championship last year.

The landscape of college athletics continues to face dramatic changes and there has been a great deal of speculation over the past few months regarding conference realignments nationwide. The Big East Conference has not been immune to such speculation and Villanova’s position regarding football has been frequently discussed on the internet, in the media, and among alumni around the country.

Prior to Labor Day, Big East Commissioner John Marinatto paid a visit to Villanova and reported that the football schools were interested in adding Villanova as a football member of the Conference. We currently compete in the Big East in all other varsity sports, however, joining the Conference as a football member would require that the program move up to the Football Bowl Subdivision (FBS), formerly known as Division I-A. This would represent a significant change for the University and its Athletic Department.

As part of the University’s Strategic Planning process, the Board of Trustees Athletic Committee has been studying all of our athletic programs. After consulting with our Board’s leadership and the President’s Cabinet, we have decided that the most prudent course of action is to expedite our timeframe and embark upon an in-depth and thorough evaluation of this opportunity presented by the Big East. This is a complicated issue with many multi-dimensional factors that come into play, and it is important that we investigate scenarios related to making—or not making—such a move.

More than likely, you will read or hear speculation from outside sources as we conduct this assessment. I ask you to consider it just that – speculation. As we undertake this evaluation, I can assure you that a decision will be made only after the Board of Trustees conducts a careful and complete analysis. We will do what’s right for Villanova and will not jeopardize our community-wide commitment to meeting the University’s strategic objectives.

I will keep you informed as we move forward through this process.

Sincerely,
Father Peter Donohue, O.S.A.
President

Source: http://vuhoops.com/2010/09/10/football-officially-invited-to-big-east/

[Go...gate]

Looks like the pot is boiling.

[ElonAlum]

I dont think its boiling at all.


Nova is going to the Big East.......or there FREAKING NUTS!

Why would they NOT go?? If the big conference comes calling you answer!

Congrats to Nova!

[T-Dog]

If I was Nova, the question I would ask is "When can we start?"

Automatic entry into a BCS conference with numerous bowl tie-ins would be a no-brained in my opinion.

[TokyoGriz]

Very good situation for Nova if they can make the $$ make sense for them. Really hope this helps them get a bigger fan base as well....... Im would think it would but you never know.

[Oldhen]

Deja vu.

So how'd the Big Time work for them last time around? I'm not at all sure being in a conference will make things different.

I agree, it's a complicated issue, and they need to do their homework.

[TexasTerror]

Very good situation for Nova if they can make the $$ make sense for them. Really hope this helps them get a bigger fan base as well....... Im would think it would but you never know.

I agree...

It comes down to making sure the dollars and cents add up. If Villanova can increase their revenue and feel they can compete at the level while staying out of the red - and not become a Temple - than they have no choice, but to do it.

[ngineer]

Deja vu.

So how'd the Big Time work for them last time around? I'm not at all sure being in a conference will make things different.

I agree, it's a complicated issue, and they need to do their homework.

Absolutely. "When will they ever learn?" Memories of failure fade, memories of glory are forever embellished. Nova has no financial basis to make such an investment. They don't draw more than 7-9,000 a game as it is. Any attempt at this would have to include them using the Linc. Temple already uses it in addition to the Eagles. The surface by mid season is in bad shape. I doubt the powers that be would want another 5-6 games played on it. Nova certainly doesn't have the wherewithall to build a new stadium financially or acreage-wise, to accomodate the requirements of FBS. FCS football has its priorities in better alignment as to what college football is to be in relation to the academic process and one would think 'nova will see that.

[Elon Fightin' Christians]

More from today's Philly Inquirer:
http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/colleges/20100910_BIG_UPS_.html

[jlcharles]

Deja vu.

So how'd the Big Time work for them last time around? I'm not at all sure being in a conference will make things different.

I agree, it's a complicated issue, and they need to do their homework.

The state of football has drastically changed since 1980.

That said, we lose ~$5million a year as it is now, so whether we lose it playing in FBS or FCS doesn't matter one iota. And the school couldn't care less about football. This is purely for the sake of the basketball team. In order to stay relevant when the Big East inevitably splits, they'll sacrifice the football program and let them wallow as a doormat in the Big East.

I loathe FBS football, but I'm resigned to the fact that we will be moving up to protect the basketball program. At least we got to win a National Championship before it happened.

[bluehenbillk]

'Nova would be crazy not to move up. Now that it's been put out there, if they say no, I think it would really hurt their program, not that too many of its few fans would stop going. The biggest hurdle they have is where physically to play as there is not a FBS stadium option for them currently or in the forseeable future. Still, if I'm them I'm crazy to say no to a BCS level league.

[henfan]

And the school couldn't care less about football. This is purely for the sake of the basketball team.

Care to explain how what is likely to be a money-siphoning FBS FB program will improve the competitiveness of VU MBB program? How will FBS FB at VU prevent WVU or Rutgers or Pitt from leaving the conference for, say, the Big 10?

BTW, there is no way any FCS school loses $5M per year on FB. No way.


Now that it's been put out there, if they say no, I think it would really hurt their program, not that too many of its few fans would stop going.

Really? How badly did VU FB suffer (competitively or from the standpoint of selling tickets) that last time VU turned down the BEC? My recollection is that it had no impact at all.

[jlcharles]

Care to explain how what is likely to be a money-siphoning FBS FB program will improve the competitiveness of VU MBB program? How will FBS FB at VU prevent WVU or Rutgers or Pitt from leaving the conference for, say, the Big 10?

BTW, there is no way any FCS school loses $5M per year on FB. No way.

By keeping us in a relevant league when the Big East splits. Villanova has no desire whatsoever to get jettisoned with the rest of the basketball-only schools. Basketball is king and the board will do what is necessary to protect it. The Big East, from a football perspective, is a piece of crap, but maybe a balanced schedule saves it from completely falling apart. VU moving up doesn't stop WVU or Pitt from leaving. Rutgers, on the other hand, can sink to the bottom of the ocean for all I care.

I can't seem to find the NCAA database with all of the expenses and revenue for every NCAA sport at every college right now. I can't remember the exact losses we incur, but it's a lot.

[Sycamore51]

Could they play at Franklin Field maybe? That is big enough to support Big East football. I'm a season ticket holder at U of L and before our expansion Papa John's was only about 40k, ISU plays at Cinci this weekend and it's only in the low 30's.

[Husky Alum]

They're as good as gone from FCS football. Couple partners in my firm are 'Nova alumni and they're privy to some info. From what they tell me, Nova would play a couple of games on campus, a couple of games in Chester and a game or two in CBP in November.

Nova apparently is working on getting some "money" games in its transition years to mitigate the costs. Rumor here in Boston is that they're trying to line up playing at BC in 2013 or 2014 for a decent payday.

[RookieWill]

I posted lots of things about this previously, and the UD fans told me I was dilusional. I will still be surprised if (when) it happens, but it is very much being considered and evaluated. As far as the conversation for where to play, Franklin Field is probably the most likely location, but PPL Park (brand new soccer stadium) and Citizens Bank Park will be considered for select games. If Villanova is finding it is consistently averaging 20K or less, it will shift more games to PPL, if it is consistently averaging 30K, more games to Franklin Field. It will play some games at the Phillies park, once their season is over.

Most relevant to AGS readers, is what happens if Villanova SAYS NO. When you embark on such an evaluation, you really need to evaluate the entire program. If VU decides to not accept the upgrade, will they decided to remain at the current level, OR will they decide to downgrade to a patriot league-type level, or eliminate the program entirely. I obviously don't think either would happen, but I wouldn't be surprised if all options were put on the table

[JMUNJ08]

Could they play at Franklin Field maybe? That is big enough to support Big East football. I'm a season ticket holder at U of L and before our expansion Papa John's was only about 40k, ISU plays at Cinci this weekend and it's only in the low 30's.

I know we discussed this in a previous thread at nauseum. Now that the offer is officially back out there, if they can settle on a home field, they are moving up. But that is a MAJOR hurdle right now unless the Linc goes artificial which I highly doubt.

[NovaWildcat]

It's a matter of association. In its current format, the Big East is GUARANTEED to split. Too much money at stake for the football schools and not enough contribution from the basketball schools.

No one knows who/if the Big 10 will poach from, however a move to FBS puts ourselves on the right side of the curve. Villanova DOES NOT want to be a part of the Catholic equivalent of the A-10. That's what happens after the inevitable split. And for those who say, "there's nothing wrong with the A10" - while that is correct, and it IS possible to be successful there (Xavier), it becomes incredibly more difficult on a consistent basis. The University has seen what it's like to be the top dogs, and likes that position.

[NovaWildcat]

if they can settle on a home field, they are moving up. But that is a MAJOR hurdle right now unless the Linc goes artificial which I highly doubt.

I don't know how many times this needs to be said, but THE ISSUE IS NOT A STADIUM. Villanova can and will find a place to play. There are options.

This is a matter of whether or not Villanova can afford the move. Increased scholarships (for men and women..title IX), improved football facilities, coaches salaries, recruiting..this is the MAJOR hurdle.

[Dane96]

I'd say it's a done deal for NUMEROUS reasons mentioned here. Look, Temple can't get big time schools to come play them for a multitude of reasons, so I am not dare pointing out Temple (nor should others) as an attendance comparison. Furthermore, there are people who love college football and absolutely wont be driving to Happy Valley from Philly to see Penn State. Give them the option of seeing 'Nova vs. Notre Dame...or 'Nova vs. BC....or 'Nova vs. Rutgers...and you can get people in the stands. Boston is a notoriously NON-COLLEGE sports town. BC students are jackasses and do not make the primary fan base of the 44,000 fans that fill Alumni Field on Saturdays. Yes, the Stadium is on campus...but again, the majority of seats (probably 38,000) go to non-students. IF BC CAN DO IT...so CAN 'Nova. And same from UCONN (Stadium is about 30-45 minutes from campus on a non-traffic day).

You add in "scheduling arrangements" for 'Nova hoops (we will come play you if you play us in football in Philly)...and you have more big name schools coming in. You not only would you get a nice Big East Schedule that would spur fan interest (including easy road trips for Rutgers fans)...but you likely will have some sort of scheduling arrangement with BYU, Notre Dame, Army, Navy, Boston College and other schools with east coast interests. Hell, it would not shock me to see Wisconsin, USC and other schools with NY, NJ and PA recruiting interests come out to play in 2 for 1's.

On pay day alone, Villanova will be able to build the program. Local fans of rival teams will fill the seats. And there is no doubt the teams I mentioned above would prefer to have an east coast game by playing a more than winnable "road game" in prime recruiting territory. Would you rather play Rutgers, Maryland, WVU, UConn, etc...for an East Coast "recruiting trip"...or newly promoted 'Nova.

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/news/story?id=5553575

[Sycamore51]

I agree that the split will happen as well. I look at Nova becoming the 9th and then possibly Memphis or UCF becoming a 10th and that will put the football machine in motion.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

My initial thought is that Villanova's prez is right to go public with the letter - and by saying, too, that they "need to do their homework".

But, sorry, I still get stuck on the stadium situation. I just can't see a three-headed home stadium for Villanova football games - paying three rents. I maintain that Union Stadium isn't big enough, CBP's schedule doesn't work, and Franklin Field is Penn's home already and it's too old.

While not a perfect comparison, Syracuse pays $17 million on football and receives about $17 million (again, thanks to the EADA reports). Syracuse, however, owns the Carrier Dome. I'd guess that the budget for football would bloat to more than than for Villanova - not to mention the extra Title IX scholarships that would result.

It's interesting if they could make this work, but I agree - they "need to do their homework".

[DFW HOYA]

And while Georgetown sleeps, it could soon be on the outs with two conferences.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

I'd say it's a done deal for NUMEROUS reasons mentioned here. Look, Temple can't get big time schools to come play them for a multitude of reasons...

... Local fans of rival teams will fill the seats. And there is no doubt the teams I mentioned above would prefer to have an east coast game by playing a more than winnable "road game" in prime recruiting territory. Would you rather play Rutgers, Maryland, WVU, UConn, etc...for an East Coast "recruiting trip"...or newly promoted 'Nova.

Huh? Why on earth would they play Nova when you just said two paragraphs before that they won't play Temple? Doesn't the same thing apply? "Local fans of rival teams will fill the seats..." That's what they've been saying ever since Penn State and Temple signed a deal. What's so materially different about Villanova, except for the fact that Nova has been out of FBS football for almost thirty years?

[Dane96]

I think UCF is a sleeping frickin giant. Easy to get to for fans and teams on plane flights. "Destination" for fans ("Honey, let's go to Disney for a few days or a week...then watch (fill in fan's team) play UCF).

It has the second largest enrollment (last I heard) of the public schools in Florida. The new hoops arena is awesome. Baseball team is really good...I mean...they are a no brainer with the I-10 rival game with USF that could develop (about 45 min-1hr down the road from one another). The real question is: Does S.Florida greenlight them.

[Dane96]

LFN,

No, the same thing doesnt apply. Dont compare Temple hoops with 'Nova hoops. Completely two seperate animals right now. And no, I am not disparing Temple hoops...but from a national prestige standpoint...Wright's program is upper echelon while Temple is perceived just below that...a solid second tier program.

As for football...Penn State doesn't have to play Temple for "recruiting access." Wisconsin (heavily recruits NJ and PA), USC, etc...do. Again, would USC rather play Penn State...or 'Nova?

[JMUNJ08]

I don't know how many times this needs to be said, but THE ISSUE IS NOT A STADIUM. Villanova can and will find a place to play. There are options.

This is a matter of whether or not Villanova can afford the move. Increased scholarships (for men and women..title IX), improved football facilities, coaches salaries, recruiting..this is the MAJOR hurdle.

There are options but no one can settle on 1 place for ALL games. Musical stadiums cannot be fun for fans or the team...

While more money is needed for all the things you mentioned above, improved football facilities and Title IX are the real hurdles besides $$ and a permanent home.

[Dane96]

DFW...sadly, I think G'Town is making a major mistake not trying to do something about football. I do think that there is going to be a massive re-alignment soon...whether it is a Big East type of super conference of all-sport football schools with 16 teams (like the PAC-10 tried)...or a split much smaller of the hoop and football schools.

Not that G'Town would be in a bad football conference with the likes of Marquette, St. John's etc...but without the philly market...that conference will be meh. Maybe it does become an all catholic conference with ND hoops, St. Joe's, St. John's, G'Town, St. Louis, etc.

As an SJU fan since a child, this all makes me get the willies...but it is what it is.

[henfan]

By keeping us in a relevant league when the Big East splits. Villanova has no desire whatsoever to get jettisoned with the rest of the basketball-only schools. Basketball is king and the board will do what is necessary to protect it. The Big East, from a football perspective, is a piece of crap, but maybe a balanced schedule saves it from completely falling apart. VU moving up doesn't stop WVU or Pitt from leaving. Rutgers, on the other hand, can sink to the bottom of the ocean for all I care.

I can't seem to find the NCAA database with all of the expenses and revenue for every NCAA sport at every college right now. I can't remember the exact losses we incur, but it's a lot.

But again, how will reclassifying the FB program IMPROVE the competitivenes of the MBB program? Conversely, how would VU MBB competitiveness be necessarily damaged if VU again decides not to reclassify?

How better positioned would VU sports be if WVU and/or Pitt bolt? Would causal Philly area sports fans flock by the tens of thousands to Franklin Field to watch VU take on Syracuse, Cincinnati, USF & Louisville? They sure didn't do it when those types of opponents were facing Temple at the Vet & Linc.

BTW, VU's most recent EADA report showed $0 loss on football. While I doubt that's accurate, considering VU attendance, there is absolutely no way VU loses $5M on FCS FB.

Here's the link: http://ope.ed.gov/athletics/

[Sycamore51]

I think UCF is a sleeping frickin giant. Easy to get to for fans and teams on plane flights. "Destination" for fans ("Honey, let's go to Disney for a few days or a week...then watch (fill in fan's team) play UCF).

It has the second largest enrollment (last I heard) of the public schools in Florida. The new hoops arena is awesome. Baseball team is really good...I mean...they are a no brainer with the I-10 rival game with USF that could develop (about 45 min-1hr down the road from one another). The real question is: Does S.Florida greenlight them.

You are exactly right Dane. If the Big East doesn't grad UCF they are stupid! The question will be, will they stop at adding 2 schools and making the split or pick up Temple and somebody else and hope nobody gets plucked from what they already have. I really don't think any conference is going to get past 12 schools. I think it'll stop at 12, just a hunch though.

[Dane96]

henfan,

Not speaking for charles...but I dont think he is saying that. I think he is trying to say this helps simply prep for the breakup or potential breakup of the BE. I also thinks he means an "association" strengthening (perception of course). I think he probably means to say it will help them schedule hoops OOC games.

Those are all, for the most part, very pertinent concepts.

While I am saying this will happen, IMHO, and while I do believe in 10 years 'Nova will likely have some sort of nice fan base...I dont necessarily agree with the move per se.

[DFW HOYA]

DFW...sadly, I think G'Town is making a major mistake not trying to do something about football. I do think that there is going to be a massive re-alignment soon...whether it is a Big East type of super conference of all-sport football schools with 16 teams (like the PAC-10 tried)...or a split much smaller of the hoop and football schools.

Georgetown cannot stay afloat competing with basketball-only schools. And if the PL gives the green light on scholarships, it will soon have no football home, either. Any room in the NEC?

[Dane96]

Just to clarify, are you saying G'Town cant survive playing in a hoop only league? Not sure I understand that...if indeed that is what you were inferring.

[JMUNJ08]

Georgetown cannot stay afloat competing with basketball-only schools. And if the PL gives the green light on scholarships, it will soon have no football home, either. Any room in the NEC?

The NEC has partial schollies already...

Hope someone wakes up and moves you guys to the Big East for football too! Nice partner with Nova...

[RookieWill]

1. As far as Musical stadiums are concerned, it absolutely CAN work as evidenced by VILLANOVA's basketball team. They play 2/3 of their games on campus and 1/3 of their games in the downtown arena. The down-town arena works wonders for them, particularly for weekend games, as their strong NYC and NJ alumni base easily access the stadium

2. The EADA reports are garbage from a revenue side, as they include "direct institutional subsidies" (e.g., funded losses), but exclude dollars donated because of the football program. For Villanova's current revenue, it's pretty simple - take 7 games, multiple it by $15 / ticket, and multiply it by 6,000 people = $650K in revenue. That is it. Everything else is direct instiutional subsidies, or a loss

[Sycamore51]

The BE split will do more to the rest of us than any Big 10, Pac 10, or Big 12 additions ever will. I can see a lot of Big East non FB schools joining with some eastern A-10 schools which will have the western A-10 schools (X, Dayton, and St. Lou) looking for a home. They hopefully will look at the Valley and maybe bring Butler with them. If that happens who knows, mayber Dayton and Butler may look at adding football scholarships and joining the MVFC as well. Just a dream I'm sure, but who knows, stranger things have happened.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

1. As far as Musical stadiums are concerned, it absolutely CAN work as evidenced by VILLANOVA's basketball team. They play 2/3 of their games on campus and 1/3 of their games in the downtown arena. The down-town arena works wonders for them, particularly for weekend games, as their strong NYC and NJ alumni base easily access the stadium.

That is completely different and you know it. A basketball arena can easily home multiple teams, the one in question a historic Big 5 venue, and as you point out it's downtown. CBP and PPL parks are NOT central locations AT ALL. Franklin Field is sort-of central, but it's hell for tailgating - and, as I mentioned, Penn plays their already.

[GannonFan]

I don't know how many times this needs to be said, but THE ISSUE IS NOT A STADIUM. Villanova can and will find a place to play. There are options.

This is a matter of whether or not Villanova can afford the move. Increased scholarships (for men and women..title IX), improved football facilities, coaches salaries, recruiting..this is the MAJOR hurdle.

And again, the stadium is an issue because the finances which you even agree are the major hurdle are directly impacted by the stadium issue. Paying rent in 3 different stadiums and not getting significant revenue from those stadiums is a huge, huge issue.

Frankly, I think nova takes the offer and they join the Big East. However, I also see them dropping football in about 10 years or so after they've been left adrift when schools like 'Cuse and Pitt and others leave anyway when the biggies. Eventually, it does come to money, and there's no way to see nova being successful financially in the market they are in, with the lack of a real stadium from which to draw significant revenue, and without that they will be what's left behind when the teams in the Big East that do have the resources are gobbled up by the Super Conferences.

[DFW HOYA]

Just to clarify, are you saying G'Town cant survive playing in a hoop only league? Not sure I understand that...if indeed that is what you were inferring.

The financial base of Georgetown's $28 million program is built on filling a 20,000 seat basketball arena (with the second highest rent in the nation) and receiving significant TV revenue to support its 29 teams. Games with DePaul or Providence will not draw. It has no on-campus arena to fall back on. It has no practice facility, even though it was conceived three years ago and hasn't moved forward. A league of Big East leftovers will not get a TV deal a third of what it has now. Do the math.

Oh, and it's been five years as of next week since construction was "temporarily" halted on its football facility.

[bostonspider]

I think Georgetown is too much of a "brand name" to not be invited if the B.E. splits. I could most definitely see 9 Football schools (Current B.E. + Nova) splitting off and inviting ND, Georgetown and Saint John's (NYC Market + MSG) as non football members. That way you have one H&H conference for football and then two divisions for all other sports, which can cut down on travel for members. This of course leaves Marquette, Depaul, Providence, and SHU out in the cold to join up with choice A10 teams.

[Dane96]

LFN....

CBP is next to the Arena Nova plays in...

Not saying its perfect...but stop distorting reality.

I will give you PPL (if I remember correctly about 15 miles from the Wachovia Center).

[Sycamore51]

I think Georgetown is too much of a "brand name" to not be invited if the B.E. splits. I could most definitely see 9 Football schools (Current B.E. + Nova) splitting off and inviting ND, Georgetown and Saint John's (NYC Market + MSG) as non football members. That way you have one H&H conference for football and then two divisions for all other sports, which can cut down on travel for members. This of course leaves Marquette, Depaul, Providence, and SHU out in the cold to join up with choice A10 teams.

This makes a lot of sense to me. I still see the MVC picking up two teams out of this one way or the other. Maybe it will be Marquette or Depaul with St. Lou, who knows.

[henfan]

For Villanova's current revenue, it's pretty simple - take 7 games, multiple it by $15 / ticket, and multiply it by 6,000 people = $650K in revenue. That is it. Everything else is direct instiutional subsidies, or a loss

I would agree that, given support, it's logical that VU FB loses some amount of money, perhaps even a significant amount. I'll state for the third time that there is no way they are losing $5M, as was suggested.

[Dane96]

Boston Spider-

And...why would they do that? That would be reverting to the past and offers no benefit.

[Dane96]

I totally agree with henfan. THE EADA is a joke. There is no standardized reporting. If that were the case, then Albany hasnt been losing money...so i dont know why the adminstration is *****ing about budget cuts and not moving to 63 rides; the EADA says we are even.

[Sycamore51]

Boston Spider-

And...why would they do that? That would be reverting to the past and offers no benefit.
Because they are mid west basketball schools and the MVC is a mid west basketball conference. Where else would they go? They won't join the A-10 with the other million teams. You take U of L, G-town, Cuse, Cinci, Pitt, UConn, and Nova out of the mix and you're stuck with some bad basketball schools. I can't see where else they would go if they get left out.

[Franks Tanks]

I'd say it's a done deal for NUMEROUS reasons mentioned here. Look, Temple can't get big time schools to come play them for a multitude of reasons, so I am not dare pointing out Temple (nor should others) as an attendance comparison. Furthermore, there are people who love college football and absolutely wont be driving to Happy Valley from Philly to see Penn State. Give them the option of seeing 'Nova vs. Notre Dame...or 'Nova vs. BC....or 'Nova vs. Rutgers...and you can get people in the stands. Boston is a notoriously NON-COLLEGE sports town. BC students are jackasses and do not make the primary fan base of the 44,000 fans that fill Alumni Field on Saturdays. Yes, the Stadium is on campus...but again, the majority of seats (probably 38,000) go to non-students. IF BC CAN DO IT...so CAN 'Nova. And same from UCONN (Stadium is about 30-45 minutes from campus on a non-traffic day).

You add in "scheduling arrangements" for 'Nova hoops (we will come play you if you play us in football in Philly)...and you have more big name schools coming in. You not only would you get a nice Big East Schedule that would spur fan interest (including easy road trips for Rutgers fans)...but you likely will have some sort of scheduling arrangement with BYU, Notre Dame, Army, Navy, Boston College and other schools with east coast interests. Hell, it would not shock me to see Wisconsin, USC and other schools with NY, NJ and PA recruiting interests come out to play in 2 for 1's.

On pay day alone, Villanova will be able to build the program. Local fans of rival teams will fill the seats. And there is no doubt the teams I mentioned above would prefer to have an east coast game by playing a more than winnable "road game" in prime recruiting territory. Would you rather play Rutgers, Maryland, WVU, UConn, etc...for an East Coast "recruiting trip"...or newly promoted 'Nova.

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/news/story?id=5553575

Nobody in Philly ever came out to see Temple vs Miami or other such games.

[JMUNJ08]

Nobody in Philly ever came out to see Temple vs Miami or other such games.

Wasn't Temple involved in those games? Nova being a full fledged BE member and a more national brand should help...

[NovaWildcat]

Let's put the Temple/Nova comparisons to bed. First of all, when Temple was in the Big East, they could not win a game. No one would pay to see that. You have to assume that Nova can win more games.

Rest assurred, Villanova can attract big time opponents. Whereas Temple gets Penn State or UConn on occasion - almost every Nova home game would be of that caliber. Last night, 15k showed for Temple-Central Michigan. And that was just gate receipts.

The Big East will draw in itself. Syracuse, Louisville, UConn, Rutgers all have rivalries with Villanova. Their fans will come out for those games. As will ours. These are 2 NAME schools...sorry, but the CAA doesn't cut it with that regard (and yes, I know, the football is great).

Out of conference - Villanova will have no difficulty bringing in a contigent of private, big name schools. Schools like to play their own. Vanderbilt, Northwestern, Stanford, Wake Forest, Boston College and even Army, Navy could be great draws for Villanova. Temple does not/did not have this calling card. Again, these are big name schools that will draw a Philly crowd.

You can say all you want about the support, but at the end of the day, Villanova is becoming a brand name and will certainly have a certain amount of appeal to the local fans wherever we decide to play...

IF the administration can finance it. For a typically highly secretive operation that is run by the Nova athletic department, when there's smoke...

[Franks Tanks]

Temple was also a member of the Big East and never generated much football interest.

[Go...gate]

I posted lots of things about this previously, and the UD fans told me I was dilusional. I will still be surprised if (when) it happens, but it is very much being considered and evaluated. As far as the conversation for where to play, Franklin Field is probably the most likely location, but PPL Park (brand new soccer stadium) and Citizens Bank Park will be considered for select games. If Villanova is finding it is consistently averaging 20K or less, it will shift more games to PPL, if it is consistently averaging 30K, more games to Franklin Field. It will play some games at the Phillies park, once their season is over.

Most relevant to AGS readers, is what happens if Villanova SAYS NO. When you embark on such an evaluation, you really need to evaluate the entire program. If VU decides to not accept the upgrade, will they decided to remain at the current level, OR will they decide to downgrade to a patriot league-type level, or eliminate the program entirely. I obviously don't think either would happen, but I wouldn't be surprised if all options were put on the table

You scooped the rest of us. Well done.

This also clarifies the situation to those among us that felt that Villanova would ever join the Patriot League in football.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

Let's put the Temple/Nova comparisons to bed. First of all, when Temple was in the Big East, they could not win a game. No one would pay to see that. You have to assume that Nova can win more games.

....

The Big East will draw in itself. Syracuse, Louisville, UConn, Rutgers all have rivalries with Villanova. Their fans will come out for those games. As will ours. These are 2 NAME schools...sorry, but the CAA doesn't cut it with that regard (and yes, I know, the football is great).


Temple was also a member of the Big East and never generated much football interest.

I agree, the contradictions in the same breath by AGS posters are getting tiring.

[Franks Tanks]

Let's put the Temple/Nova comparisons to bed. First of all, when Temple was in the Big East, they could not win a game. No one would pay to see that. You have to assume that Nova can win more games.

Rest assurred, Villanova can attract big time opponents. Whereas Temple gets Penn State or UConn on occasion - almost every Nova home game would be of that caliber. Last night, 15k showed for Temple-Central Michigan. And that was just gate receipts.

The Big East will draw in itself. Syracuse, Louisville, UConn, Rutgers all have rivalries with Villanova. Their fans will come out for those games. As will ours. These are 2 NAME schools...sorry, but the CAA doesn't cut it with that regard (and yes, I know, the football is great).

Out of conference - Villanova will have no difficulty bringing in a contigent of private, big name schools. Schools like to play their own. Vanderbilt, Northwestern, Stanford, Wake Forest, Boston College and even Army, Navy could be great draws for Villanova. Temple does not/did not have this calling card. Again, these are big name schools that will draw a Philly crowd.

You can say all you want about the support, but at the end of the day, Villanova is becoming a brand name and will certainly have a certain amount of appeal to the local fans wherever we decide to play...

IF the administration can finance it. For a typically highly secretive operation that is run by the Nova athletic department, when there's smoke...


Sure Nova has cache, but do you really think people in Philly will care much about Nova/Wake Forest. Philly just isnt into college football. I am sure Nova can make it work if they desire, but I dont see Philly being a college football town.

There was just an article by Shaugennsy about how nobody in Boston cares about BC or college football in general. Philly is simialr.

[Go...gate]

And while Georgetown sleeps, it could soon be on the outs with two conferences.

And the PL continues to twist slowly in the wind.

[Franks Tanks]

I agree, the contradictions in the same breath by AGS posters are getting tiring.

Temple is not Nova, and the plight of one will not necessarily follow the other. However is it not prudent to look at former Big East members in your own city?

[JMUNJ08]

Sure Nova has cache, but do you really think people in Philly will care much about Nova/Wake Forest. Philly just isnt into college football. I am sure Nova can make it work if they desire, but I dont see Philly being a college football town.

There was just an article by Shaugennsy about how nobody in Boston cares about BC or college football in general. Philly is simialr.

But like it was said earlier...BC still plays in the FBS right? while not a stellar rabid fan base, they can still put enough fannies in the seats to justify playing at the top. Nova should be the same way...

While the BE is a notch below the ACC, Nova draws more eyes than Temple did when they were in the Big East. More eyes = more paying customers = this is not Temple. You CANNOT compare the two schools. The alumni bases, catholic/public, funding, national interest, etc. all make the comparisons null and void. The ONLY thing you can compare is the Philly area. You cannot tell me that they can't get 20K into the seats if Rutgers/Pitt/Syracuse come to play with how large the Philly area is.

Plus, what we are forgetting is that it will be something 'New'. Many don't know Nova sits in the dungeon of FCS around the country (much to our chagrin). A middle of the road BE Nova team will be a better draw then a NC FCS Nova team. When and if that first game happens, a good product on the field will keep the new fans coming to sustain the move to FBS. UCONN didn't show up and play a bunch of 1-11 seasons upon making the move. If they did I doubt it would be as popular (only comparing the move up and not the different dynamics).

[Dane96]

Frank...why did you say Wake Forest?

Also, nobody cares about BC football is correct. Believe me, BC is hated in Boston by many; god forbid you meet a double "eagle"...and kill yourself if your interviewing with a "triple" eagle. The fan base is arrogant (seemingly fogetting their middle-class Irish/Italian Catholic roots), their administration sucks...and quite frankly, Chestnut Hill residents have ****ed them everywhich way but loose...but yet they get 44k people per game. I think that says it all....

[Anovafan]

To clarify a few things, Nova's football "budget" or "loss" or whatever you want to call it is around the $4M mark. Around $2M is on scholarships and the rest is for a national recruiting budget (they go to CA and a few other states on the west coast), coaches salaries and cars, playoff money, 2 guaranteed away game flights each year, and other travel costs. The BE payout is reportedly right around $4M that Nova would share from day 1, plus bowl revenue on top of the $4M.

[NovaWildcat]

I agree, the contradictions in the same breath by AGS posters are getting tiring.


And once again. Villanova in the Big East DOES NOT EQUAL Temple in the Big East.

Temple's BE record from 1991-2004: 14-80
Temple's record from 1991-2004: 38-160

In 14 years, they went WINLESS in conference in 6.
Won 3 games in conference, only ONCE - 1997 - and was 3-8 (3-4) that year.

How many fans do you think showed up for that nonsense??

Temple was kicked out of the Big East because they couldn't compete, at all. What is the presendent for that? Has this happened since?

Temple is not a model for Villanova to use.

[JBB]

I will hate to see 'Nova leave. Best of luck!

[Lehigh Football Nation]

http://lehighfootballnation.blogspot.com/2010/09/friday-water-cooler-year-of-big.html

I talk at length about the big Villanova announcement here - and exactly what might Lehigh fans have in store for the weeks to come? First Drake's announcement of the game in Africa, and now this?

[SalukiJim]

This makes a lot of sense to me. I still see the MVC picking up two teams out of this one way or the other. Maybe it will be Marquette or Depaul with St. Lou, who knows.

The Billikens NEED to rejoin the Valley-nobody here cares about the swings to Philly and Pittsburgh to play Duquesne, Temple, etc...

[Husky Alum]

Don't think that Villanova will sell football tickets. Whether people show up or not is a different story.

At BC, if you want tickets to the Duke or NC hoops game or the ACC Hoops Tournament - you better be a football season ticket holder. You want tickets to the Beanpot (big hockey tournament in Boston among the four D-I hockey schools in town) - you better pony up for football tickets.

I could see Villanova telling people "You want to go to the Big East Tournament - fork over some cash for football tickets. You want to go to the Syracuse hoops game at Wachovia, let's see your Syracuse football tickets." If preserving hoops is the rationaly for FBS Football, then you leverage the asset.

As Shaughnnesy wrote in his column, Boston isn't a CFB town - it's an event town. BC-Miami = EVENT. BC-Florida State=EVENT. Even when schools like Clemson or Wake come to town, you see plenty of fans - and Philly's on a similar playing field as Boston for a fall weekend destination. However, with Nova in the Big East, you'll see a ton of UConn and Rutgers and Cuse and Pitt fans at the games. BC gets ND every few years.

Somone posted this earlier, but wth 8 BE games (4 home), all Nova needs is to get 1 or 2 name home games a year (BYU, ND, Army, BC, Navy) to sell 30,000 tickets and they should be in good shape. A Nova-ND game would be on TV easily. You don't think Michigan would play Nova? C'mon.

As long as the increased scholarship money doesn't bankrupt Nova, they'll be just fine.
I could see 'Nova

[heath]

The avg. minimum attendance of 15,000 a game over a 2 year period for seems out of reach, but if visiting Big East teams travel well, its possible. Seems like a natural fit.

[RookieWill]

I would agree that, given support, it's logical that VU FB loses some amount of money, perhaps even a significant amount. I'll state for the third time that there is no way they are losing $5M, as was suggested.

I never suggested it. Look at the EADA report and see how much "revenue" there is, subtract about $600K to $1mm, and that is likely what the "loss" really is. I really dont' care how much Villanova loses

[Dane96]

Because they are mid west basketball schools and the MVC is a mid west basketball conference. Where else would they go? They won't join the A-10 with the other million teams. You take U of L, G-town, Cuse, Cinci, Pitt, UConn, and Nova out of the mix and you're stuck with some bad basketball schools. I can't see where else they would go if they get left out.

Sorry...I didnt state what I was getting at. Why would the BE split but keep the hoops school. That goes back to the original status.

[EmeryZach]

Just say no to FBS!

Isn't there quite a big problem of where they would play? Temple has the Linc and PPL Park isn't big enough.

[henfan]

I never suggested it. Look at the EADA report and see how much "revenue" there is, subtract about $600K to $1mm, and that is likely what the "loss" really is. I really dont' care how much Villanova loses

Never said you did suggest that VU loses $5M on FB, Will. However, JLCharles, to whom I originally responded, stated exactly that:


The state of football has drastically changed since 1980.

That said, we lose ~$5million a year as it is now, so whether we lose it playing in FBS or FCS doesn't matter one iota. And the school couldn't care less about football.

I completely understand that you, as a fan, "don't care how much Villanova loses" but those responsible for balancing budgets do. They'll be the ones that make the final recommendation, not the fans and certainly not message board experts like us.

[Go Lehigh TU Owl]

Temple plays UCONN next week at the Linc so it'll be interesting to see what kind of crowd we draw.

The biggest thing for Villanova is they have absolutely no blueprint to go off. No school in their situation has attempted to move up since the University of Tampa some 30+ years ago. They'd being attempting the move on blind faith.

I just don't see anyway this works out for Villanova. There just isn't that much interest in college sports in Philly. Before Wright got 'Nova back in the top 25 'Nova wasnt drawing well for bball. I went to a couple Syracuse-'Nova games at the Wells Fargo in the early 2000's and there were nearly as many 'Cuse fans as 'Nova supporters. In total there might have been 8k people there.

[Jackman]

The real issue for Villanova is what happens to their fledgling FBS football program if some combination of Rutgers, Syracuse and Pitt head to the Big Ten? Do the rest of the BE members run for the lifeboats as well? It is not an outlandish suggestion that Villanova could end up in a football conference with Cinci, Memphis, ECU, USF, UCF, Louisville, and Marshall, and be without a BCS AQ.

[Sycamore51]

They can always do what Louisville used to do. If you want basketball season tickets, you have to buy football season tickets too. They did that for several years and it sold a ton of tickets! Nova can do the same thing because the basketball fan base will buy them

[Franks Tanks]

The real issue for Villanova is what happens to their fledgling FBS football program if some combination of Rutgers, Syracuse and Pitt head to the Big Ten? Do the rest of the BE members run for the lifeboats as well? It is not an outlandish suggestion that Villanova could end up in a football conference with Cinci, Memphis, ECU, USF, UCF, Louisville, and Marshall, and be without a BCS AQ.

That is very true. The "marquee" programs in the current Big East may not be in the Big East for all that long. That would be the worse case scenario for Nova and certainly something that is going into their decision process.

[GannonFan]

That is very true. The "marquee" programs in the current Big East may not be in the Big East for all that long. That would be the worse case scenario for Nova and certainly something that is going into their decision process.

That's the part I don't understand - if they want to make this move in order to protect their basketball program, why does this help or not help? The old idea was that the Big East football schools would break away and form their own conference, and the non-basketball schools would be screwed. But that's not likely anymore. What is much more likely is that the Big East will be raided and individual programs will leave. When that happens, no one's going to raid the Big East and try to steal away a nova program that is being propped up to FBS standards by the conference itself. They'll steal Pitt and Syracuse and Louisville and West Virginia and South Florida and maybe even UConn. After those teams leave, what does the Big East have left?

The reality is, this move will not in anyway impact where nova's basketball program is in the next 5-10 years - the Big East won't split football/non-football - if changes happen, the Big East will just fade away.

[GannonFan]

And what's intriguing is if nova did have the Linc (or similar size stadium) to play in, this would be an absolute slam dunk - they could actually then bring in biggies like ND and Penn St to play at nova, and they could actually be an attractive school to pick out of the Big East when that conference is raided in the next few years. But without the stadium, none of that happens.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

That's the part I don't understand - if they want to make this move in order to protect their basketball program, why does this help or not help? The old idea was that the Big East football schools would break away and form their own conference, and the non-basketball schools would be screwed. But that's not likely anymore. What is much more likely is that the Big East will be raided and individual programs will leave. When that happens, no one's going to raid the Big East and try to steal away a nova program that is being propped up to FBS standards by the conference itself. They'll steal Pitt and Syracuse and Louisville and West Virginia and South Florida and maybe even UConn. After those teams leave, what does the Big East have left?

The reality is, this move will not in anyway impact where nova's basketball program is in the next 5-10 years - the Big East won't split football/non-football - if changes happen, the Big East will just fade away.

I disagree with you that it's "unlikely" that the Big East FB schools will break off and form their own conference if Villanova comes on board. And the presence of Villanova would be a decent glue to keep most, if not all, of those football schools together. For example, is Syracuse or UConn really going to leave a league with Villanova in it as well unless everything completely falls apart?

[jmufan999]

GOD.... i wanted this spot for JMU. i realize we're not nearly as highly coveted as Nova, but one can dream. DANG. no way they take 2 FCS schools in one "go". doubtful, anyway.

[GannonFan]

I disagree with you that it's "unlikely" that the Big East FB schools will break off and form their own conference if Villanova comes on board. And the presence of Villanova would be a decent glue to keep most, if not all, of those football schools together. For example, is Syracuse or UConn really going to leave a league with Villanova in it as well unless everything completely falls apart?

Yes, they would leave. Money drives everything, and the Big East, in any shape or form (current setup or one with football schools breaking off) don't now and won't ever come close to the revenue capabilities of the super conferences. If the Big Ten comes calling and dangles $20M a year in Big Ten tv revenues to someone like Syracuse they would be nuts not to take it. And if they don't take it, they would look to the lesser members of the Big East for concessions (ala Texas and the Big 12) for the honor of them staying. The Big East's revenues pale in comparison to the Big 10, ACC, SEC, and the Pac-10 and the stability of that conference, in any form, will always be at risk because of that. Money rules the day and the Big East doesn't have as much as everyone else.

[UNH Fanboi]

GOD.... i wanted this spot for JMU. i realize we're not nearly as highly coveted as Nova, but one can dream. DANG. no way they take 2 FCS schools in one "go". doubtful, anyway.

I suspect this may be why some Delaware fans seem so adamant about shooting this idea down. It hurts them to see a program with a fraction of the fan support and football tradition getting the nod over them. Kind of like working at a company for 20 years and losing out on the promotion to the CEO's 25 year old son.

[GannonFan]

I suspect this may be why some Delaware fans seem so adamant about shooting this idea down. It hurts them to see a program with a fraction of the fan support and football tradition getting the nod over them. Kind of like working at a company for 20 years and losing out on the promotion to the CEO's 25 year old son.

I'm sure there's some jealousy out there, but that's not the reason you see UD fans on this thread. For one, most UD fans are right in the Philly market, so it's a local story - we know quite a lot about it. And two, UD never had a shot at a Big East invite, ever, so it's not like we were holding out hope for something like this. Heck, there are plenty of UD fans who have no aspirations of the program ever going to the FBS level.

[henfan]

I suspect this may be why some Delaware fans seem so adamant about shooting this idea down.

Has nothing to do with it. Most UD fans realize that UD did little to position itself for a move into an FBS conference, nor has the school ever desired it. There's no reason to be envious about something UD doesn't deserve and hasn't wanted.

For the most part, what you're seeing from some UD fans is rational discussion on why this could be a bad move for VU. It's hard to dismiss the bold face facts about VU's historic lack of support for FB at both the I-A and I-AA/FCS levels, the seeming absence of an adequate FBS stadium, and the tenuous funding situation.

If VU wants to return to 'big time' college football, they can have it. It's all in front of them.

[Cocky]

If you can go BCS it would be a no brainer to me.

Do what Nova thinks is best for Nova.

[superman7515]

Sorry to see you go Nova. I'd like to take this opportunity to welcome Fordham and/or Albany to the CAA. See you in 2013.

[superman7515]

And while Georgetown sleeps, it could soon be on the outs with two conferences.

Ivan Maisel and Beano Cook said there is an open invitation to any of the basketball schools, specifically including Georgetown.

[jlcharles]

Never said you did suggest that VU loses $5M on FB, Will. However, JLCharles, to whom I originally responded, stated exactly that:



I completely understand that you, as a fan, "don't care how much Villanova loses" but those responsible for balancing budgets do. They'll be the ones that make the final recommendation, not the fans and certainly not message board experts like us.

Does it really matter if the losses are $4M or $5M? It's still a ton of money. My recollection of earlier EADA reports had a loss in the $4M-$5M range. Not the break even nonsense that everyone knows isn't true.

Look, I hate the move, but the fact is, the basketball program becomes a mid-major without doing something. It could still go down the crapper even if we move up, but they wouldn't be sitting idly by watching it happen.

And, maybe as stated earlier, they'll do the smart thing and require football tickets to get basketball tickets. No one ever accused that idiot Nicastro of being smart though...

[henfan]

Does it really matter if the losses are $4M or $5M?

No way it's $4M either. Agreed that it might be a ton of money but bigger losses potentially lie ahead in the BEC if VU is poorly supported and is forced to rent FB and soccer stadiums.

Again, not sure I buy the argument that VU's MBB program will be gutted if this falls through. VU MBB is always going to be strong, regardless. Now if they do make the move, the BEC splits or several FB teams leave the BEC (particularly Pitt, WVU and/or Rutgers), the move is really going to blow up.

Big decisions ahead.

[jlcharles]

No way it's $4M either. Agreed that it might be a ton of money but bigger losses potentially lie ahead in the BEC if VU is poorly supported and is forced to rent FB and soccer stadiums.

Again, not sure I buy the argument that VU's MBB program will be gutted if this falls through. VU MBB is always going to be strong, regardless. Now if they do make the move, the BEC splits or several FB teams leave the BEC (particularly Pitt, WVU and/or Rutgers), the move is really going to blow up.

Big decisions ahead.

Again, the Big East as it is now will not exist in 5 years. If the football schools don't jump ship to the big 10, they will split from the non-football schools and we'll be stuck in a crap basketball league not much different from the A-10. They won't sit around and let that happen. And should they move up and the Big 10 raids the BE and they get stuck with the same conference, they'll just abandon the football program again since we all know the school doesn't care about football. For football fans it sucks, but it's a no lose situation for the school, especially if the BE ponies up money to help with a move up as I've been hearing they will.

[DFW HOYA]

VU MBB is always going to be strong, regardless.

Tell that to St. John's. (Or North Carolina State. Or Michigan.)

If Jay Wright goes to the NBA, Villanova's fortunes can change dramatically.

[ngineer]

They're as good as gone from FCS football. Couple partners in my firm are 'Nova alumni and they're privy to some info. From what they tell me, Nova would play a couple of games on campus, a couple of games in Chester and a game or two in CBP in November.

Nova apparently is working on getting some "money" games in its transition years to mitigate the costs. Rumor here in Boston is that they're trying to line up playing at BC in 2013 or 2014 for a decent payday.

Heck, they don't average 9,000 on campus, they aint going to draw with 'home games' being an hour's drive from campus. (Yes, maybe only 20 miles, but in Philly, that is an hour's drive). FBS football requirements will drain a hell of a lot more than $5mil from the athletic budget. I shake my head at the egos involved in academia.

[Belleair Boy]

Deja vu.

So how'd the Big Time work for them last time around? I'm not at all sure being in a conference will make things different.

I agree, it's a complicated issue, and they need to do their homework.

5 Bowl appearances?

[Belleair Boy]

ALEHIGH WILL SHINE TONIGHT, LEHIGH WILL SHINE!
Patriot League Champions: 1993, 1995, 1998, 1999, 2000, 2001, 2004, 2006
NCAA Playoff Appearances: D-II 1973, 1975, 1977 NCAA Champions
D-IAA 1979 (Finalist), 1980, 1998, 1999, 2000, 2001, 2004.
How is Lehigh shining today?

[Belleair Boy]

I suspect this may be why some Delaware fans seem so adamant about shooting this idea down. It hurts them to see a program with a fraction of the fan support and football tradition getting the nod over them. Kind of like working at a company for 20 years and losing out on the promotion to the CEO's 25 year old son.
True about current fan support, but don't lump tradition in with that. Villanova has a long and storied Div 1 history. 5 bowl appearances, filled up JFK Stadium with 100,000 crowds, etc. Delaware can't compete with that tradition. The main tradition here however is Nova's long history as a member of the Big East in all sports save football. Blue Hens don't have that either.

[Dane96]

Tell that to St. John's. (Or North Carolina State. Or Michigan.)

If Jay Wright goes to the NBA, Villanova's fortunes can change dramatically.

As someone with very good indirect connection to Jay Wright, I for one would say I would be shocked...shocked...shocked if he went the NBA route. Not saying he wouldn't listen...but frankly I would think that would be years...if any down the road.

He loves and is wired for the college game. The only NBA teams I could see making a play for his services and him really giving thought: Sixers, Knicks and the new Brooklyn Nets. Other than that, just don't see it.

However, the premise of your statement is correct. 'Nova would be significantly worse for the wear without Jay Wright. He may go down as more important to that program than Rollie if he wins a title.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

True about current fan support, but don't lump tradition in with that. Villanova has a long and storied Div 1 history. 5 bowl appearances, filled up JFK Stadium with 100,000 crowds, etc. Delaware can't compete with that tradition. The main tradition here however is Nova's long history as a member of the Big East in all sports save football. Blue Hens don't have that either.

I got news for anyone who thinks Villanova is going to be a credible attendance player on the FBS level: check the game film of the Lehigh game. Yes, the students were on campus on their day of service, but of the 8,000+ fans at Lehigh this weekend, a pittance came to Bethlehem to enjoy the Sands and watch a football game. I'd go as far as to say if you told me Nova brought 2,000 fans I'd scream "You lie!" and show you my photos from the game.

[Belleair Boy]

I got news for anyone who thinks Villanova is going to be a credible attendance player on the FBS level: check the game film of the Lehigh game. Yes, the students were on campus on their day of service, but of the 8,000+ fans at Lehigh this weekend, a pittance came to Bethlehem to enjoy the Sands and watch a football game. I'd go as far as to say if you told me Nova brought 2,000 fans I'd scream "You lie!" and show you my photos from the game.
I don't doubt you
Then again Nova won't be playing Lehigh if they move up. People who say Philly isn't a college football town have to look back to the 1950s (Penn) or 30s and 40s (Nova) to see a real quality product. There is a reason the area adopted Penn State and people drive 3 hours to see the Lions play. Can Nova put a high quality product on the field. I think so