FIG Ruling: Chinese Gymnast Was Underage; IOC To Determine Fate Of Medal

[UNHWildCats]

In 2000. They have struck all her results from the 2000 Sydney games by the International Gymnastics Federation. Results of their investigation will be forwarded to the IOC who will decide whether to strip China's bronze medal.

The United States finished 4th in 2000.

At this rate we can expect rulings on the 2008 team by around 2018 xrulesxxrulesxxrulesxxrulesxxrulesx

http://nbcsports.msnbc.com/id/35610686/ns/sports-olympic_sports/

[danefan]

Not surprising.

The IOC needs to do a better job protecting these young girls from an overzealous government athletic department.
xsmileyclapx

[Grizzaholic]

A little late, but GREAT JOB IOC. It is about time. I would love to hear the reasoning on why they shouldn't be stripped of their medals......

[UNHWildCats]

A little late, but GREAT JOB IOC. It is about time. I would love to hear the reasoning on why they shouldn't be stripped of their medals......
It hasnt been decided, though if u read the whole article there is a quote from the IOC that makes it sound as if the medals will be stripped.

The ruling was not made by the IOC, but the gymnastics ruling body. Their report has been forwarded to the IOC, once they review it their actions will be taken,.

[CopperCat]

China has got to be one of the most corrupt nations in the modern age. Economics, politics, foreign relations, and now they use gymnasts that are barely old enough to know how to read? Where does it stop?

Maybe the IOC should ban government sponsored athletic programs. That way crap like this wouldn't happen. In my mind it's just a small step above human trafficking the way China is using it's athletes.

[Syntax Error]

Not surprising.
The IOC needs to do a better job protecting these young girls from an overzealous government athletic department.

Like the USA, Dawes was underage in Barcelona. xrulesx xrolleyesx

[T-Dog]

Like the USA, Dawes was underage in Barcelona. xrulesx xrolleyesx

Age limit was 15 in 1992 and Dawes was 15 in Barcelona 1992 (born Nov 1976). xrulesx

[GannonFan]

Wow, I'm shocked, just shocked, that there was systematic cheating done by China in the Olympics. What a stunner. xlolx

[Big Al]

Y'know, if there's one thing we can learn from all of this, it's that while the athletes are amazingly talented and dedicated individuals who are worthy of admiration for their athletic achievements, they're surrounded by Olympic "officials" who are pretty much the definition of sycophants, cheats and all-around sleaze.

I read a really good article about the USOC and how the USA's success at the Vancouver winter games is pretty much in spite of the constant dysfunction and disarray that is the USOC.

[AggieFinn]

I read a really good article about the USOC and how the USA's success at the Vancouver winter games is pretty much in spite of the constant dysfunction and disarray that is the USOC.

Do you have a link to that article? Sounds like an interesting read. xreadx

[Big Al]

Do you have a link to that article? Sounds like an interesting read. xreadx

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2010/olympics/2010/writers/selena_roberts/02/25/usoc.olympians/index.html

[Syntax Error]

Like the USA, Dawes was underage in Barcelona. xrulesx xrolleyesx

Dawes was underage in Barcelona. Unless you think 15 is adult age. I didn't say she was legal for competition back then, but she was still underage. Carry on with your racial and nationalistic banter fellas. Bye.

[danefan]

Dawes was underage in Barcelona. Unless you think 15 is adult age. I didn't say she was legal for competition back then, but she was still underage. Carry on with your racial and nationalistic banter fellas. Bye.

Uhhhh......I thought this was a discussion about the Chinese gymnasts being too young to compete not about whether they were adults............maybe I'm just confused?:o

[Bogus Megapardus]

All those doped-up East German women from the Olympics in the 70s? Is it "racist" to say the Germans cheated? Let's face the facts: as a matter of national policy, the Germans tried to bend the rules and conceal it. So did the Chinese.

You can lay blame on the Americans to trying to "buy" the Salt Lake Olympics as well. I'm not being anti-American by recognizing that fact and that it was wrong. It was an American misdeed and Americans have to shoulder the blame. Likewise, the Chinese ought to play by the same rules as the rest of us.

[Grizzaholic]

I bet there is a country out there where 15 is considered legal age of adult.

[andy7171]

I bet there is a country out there where 15 is considered legal age of adult.

Yes. West Virginia.

[GannonFan]

All those doped-up East German women from the Olympics in the 70s? Is it "racist" to say the Germans cheated? Let's face the facts: as a matter of national policy, the Germans tried to bend the rules and conceal it. So did the Chinese.

You can lay blame on the Americans to trying to "buy" the Salt Lake Olympics as well. I'm not being anti-American by recognizing that fact and that it was wrong. It was an American misdeed and Americans have to shoulder the blame. Likewise, the Chinese ought to play by the same rules as the rest of us.

There's a difference between back door dealing to win the rights to host the Games versus a systematic approach to cheat in the actual events (as the East German's did many times and now apparently the Chinese have done a few times).

[Bogus Megapardus]

There's a difference between back door dealing to win the rights to host the Games versus a systematic approach to cheat in the actual events (as the East German's did many times and now apparently the Chinese have done a few times).

Yeah but I had to try to think of something negative to say about the U.S. in order to make the "racist" point and that's the best (or worst?) I could do. I should have stuck to Foreigners Around the World.

[SideLine Shooter]

I bet there is a country out there where 15 is considered legal age of adult.

Mexico!

[danefan]

I bet there is a country out there where 15 is considered legal age of adult.

Actually, believe it or not the age of consent in China is...................................wait for it...........................................14. xeyebrowx

[UNHWildCats]

Actually, believe it or not the age of consent in China is...................................wait for it...........................................14. xeyebrowx
some Age of Consent laws make u scratch ur head. Theres a few countries at 12 years old. Then theres New Mexico where the AOC is 17... unless its a male/male or female/female pairing in which case the AOC is... 13

[ursus arctos horribilis]

Dawes was underage in Barcelona. Unless you think 15 is adult age. I didn't say she was legal for competition back then, but she was still underage. Carry on with your racial and nationalistic banter fellas. Bye.

xlolxxlolxxlolx

This is a terrific example of when you see a guy get knocked out, then he struggles for days to get back up, and when he does he says something to the effect of "YOU GOT LUCKY AND YOU BETTER NOT CROSS MY PATH AGAIN!!"

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/multimedia/photo_gallery/2005/06/13/tyson.history/tyson_2.jpg

xlolxxlolxxlolx

Man, that is a fantastic attempt to save some dignity.xbowx

[dbackjon]

I see AGS censorship is alive and well. My post, along with others, that correctly pointed out the fallacy of Syntax Error's "logic" have been deleted.


I guess nothing has changed.

[GannonFan]

I see AGS censorship is alive and well. My post, along with others, that correctly pointed out the fallacy of Syntax Error's "logic" have been deleted.


I guess nothing has changed.

Well, at least on the bright side, the fact that China cheated and got caught is still on full dsiplay. There's something to be said for that.

[Gil Dobie]

Age limit was 15 in 1992 and Dawes was 15 in Barcelona 1992 (born Nov 1976). xrulesx

Then it wasn't cheeting if Dawes and the USA abided by the rules.

[T-Dog]

Okay, who deleted my post. xnonono2x

[andy7171]

Okay, who deleted my post. xnonono2x

You ain't the only one. xnonono2xxnonono2x

[Gil Dobie]

Okay, who deleted my post. xnonono2x

Who is on first. :p

[dbackjon]

Who is on first. :p


Hu?

[Gil Dobie]

Hu?

T-Dog said "Who deleted his posts"

I said Who is on first

Who's on First Youtube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sShMA85pv8M)

[dbackjon]

T-Dog said "Who deleted his posts"

I said Who is on first

Who's on First Youtube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sShMA85pv8M)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EUU7vOqK0DM

(We take you now to the Oval Office.)


George: Condi! Nice to see you. What's happening?

Condi: Sir, I have the report here about the new leader of China.

George: Great. Lay it on me.

Condi: Hu is the new leader of China.

George: That's what I want to know.

Condi: That's what I'm telling you.

George: That's what I'm asking you. Who is the new leader of China?

Condi: Yes.

George: I mean the fellow's name.

Condi: Hu.

George: The guy in China.

Condi: Hu.

George: The new leader of China.

Condi: Hu.

George: The Chinaman!

Condi: Hu is leading China.

George: Now whaddya' asking me for?

Condi: I'm telling you Hu is leading China.

George: Well, I'm asking you. Who is leading China?

Condi: That's the man's name.

George: That's who's name?

Condi: Yes.

George: Will you or will you not tell me the name of the new leader of China?

Condi: Yes, sir.

George: Yassir? Yassir Arafat is in China? I thought he was in the Middle East.

Condi: That's correct.

George: Then who is in China?

Condi: Yes, sir.

George: Yassir is in China?

Condi: No, sir.

George: Then who is?

Condi: Yes, sir.

George: Yassir?

Condi: No, sir.

George: Look, Condi. I need to know the name of the new leader of China. Get me the Secretary General of the U.N. on the phone.

Condi: Kofi?

George: No, thanks.

Condi: You want Kofi?

George: No.

Condi: You don't want Kofi.

George: No. But now that you mention it, I could use a glass of milk. And then get me the U.N.

Condi: Yes, sir.

George: Not Yassir! The guy at the U.N.

Condi: Kofi?

George: Milk! Will you please make the call?

Condi: And call who?

George: Who is the guy at the U.N?

Condi: Hu is the guy in China.

George: Will you stay out of China?!

Condi: Yes, sir.

George: And stay out of the Middle East! Just get me the guy at the U.N.

Condi: Kofi.

George: All right! With cream and two sugars. Now get on the phone.

(Condi picks up the phone.)

Condi: Rice, here.

George: Rice? Good idea. And a couple of egg rolls, too. Maybe we should send some to the guy in China. And the Middle East. Can you get Chinese food in the Middle East?

[dbackjon]

http://9.media.collegehumor.com/collegehumor/ch6/7/2/collegehumor.aaed37e782722e719f8ac73230e0ddc4.jpg

[MplsBison]

Sorry if this was already asked...why is there an age limit?

[GannonFan]

Sorry if this was already asked...why is there an age limit?

Two reasons - 1) younger gymnast have a performance advantage over older, more developed girls. They can more easily tumble, flip, etc, and on things like the balance beam, they can fit on the equipment more easily. 2) The sport's governing body determined that it is not appropriate for young girls to be exposed to the rigors of international competition - a 12 year old competing on the world stage against people almost twice her age is not a desireable situation. Kinda like how most sports have an age minimum (women's tennis ran into this situation in the past). Basically, they don't want to ruin young girls by having them compete when they are still children.

China apparently thinks otherwise. xsmhx

[Syntax Error]

China apparently thinks otherwise.No proof offered again.

[Grizzaholic]

I wonder how this thread is FCS related....

[andy7171]

No proof offered again.

http://nbcsports.msnbc.com/id/35610686/ns/sports-olympic_sports/
xeyebrowx

[tribe_pride]

Isn't this the proof

http://nbcsports.msnbc.com/id/35610686/ns/sports-olympic_sports/

Also, no need to be FCS related in the Other Sports forum.

Edit: ****. Beaten to it but I am keeping my answer too.

[MplsBison]

Two reasons - 1) younger gymnast have a performance advantage over older, more developed girls. They can more easily tumble, flip, etc, and on things like the balance beam, they can fit on the equipment more easily. 2) The sport's governing body determined that it is not appropriate for young girls to be exposed to the rigors of international competition - a 12 year old competing on the world stage against people almost twice her age is not a desireable situation. Kinda like how most sports have an age minimum (women's tennis ran into this situation in the past). Basically, they don't want to ruin young girls by having them compete when they are still children.

China apparently thinks otherwise. xsmhx

If a 12 year old truly has an advantage over an 18 year old, what does that say about the sport?

Sound kinda like arguing that 1st graders should be banned from the world tricycle competition.



Make the apparatus bigger, longer, whatever to shift the advantage to girls of appropriate age.

[GannonFan]

No proof offered again.

Uh, the sport's own Federation has concluded that China cheated. Take the blinders off, man. xlolx

[GannonFan]

If a 12 year old truly has an advantage over an 18 year old, what does that say about the sport?

Sound kinda like arguing that 1st graders should be banned from the world tricycle competition.



Make the apparatus bigger, longer, whatever to shift the advantage to girls of appropriate age.

I'm not a huge fan of gymnastics so I can't really vouch too much for it. But even women's tennis had this problem and they ended up establishing a minimum age after the Hingis's and Capriatti's came through. It's not unheard of to have minimum age requirements in order to protect younger athletes. Both the NBA and the NFL have rules that pretty much establish this. What does that say about those sports?

[Syntax Error]

Uh, the sport's own Federation has concluded that China cheated. Take the blinders off, man.

That isn't the sport's federation, it is a USA group. Take the flag off and take a look. The Olympic one will decide, not this two-bit fed.

[tribe_pride]

That isn't the sport's federation, it is a USA group. Take the flag off and take a look. The Olympic one will decide, not this two-bit fed.

"Recognised by the International Olympic Committee and its officials, the Fédération Internationale de Gymnastique (FIG) is the supreme authority on international gymnastics.

The Federation is comprised of national and associated federations which are recognised as the governing bodies for gymnastics in their respective countries. The FIG acknowledges a single federation per country, which must be recognised by its respective national authority on physical education and sport.

...

The Secretary General, elected by the Executive Committee, heads up the FIG Secretariat based in Lausanne, Switzerland.

..."

http://www.fig-gymnastics.com/vsite/vnavsite/page/directory/0,10853,5187-190956-208179-nav-list,00.html

The Executive Committee even has a Chinese on it.

[Syntax Error]

The Executive Committee even has a Chinese on it.Does it have a United States on it too? xlolx

"“We can confirm that we have received the ruling from the FIG in the case concerning Dong Fangxiao and Yang Yun, and we take due note of their decision,” IOC spokesman Mark Adams said. “Clearly, we need to take time to consider the findings before the Executive Board can consider the matter. We would like to thank the FIG for their work and we would refer further inquiries to them.”

The United States was fourth at the Sydney Games. "

[tribe_pride]

Does it have a United States on it too? xlolx

"“We can confirm that we have received the ruling from the FIG in the case concerning Dong Fangxiao and Yang Yun, and we take due note of their decision,” IOC spokesman Mark Adams said. “Clearly, we need to take time to consider the findings before the Executive Board can consider the matter. We would like to thank the FIG for their work and we would refer further inquiries to them.”

The United States was fourth at the Sydney Games. "

It does and people from other countries as well. I was just trying to make the point that it was not a USA group as you claimed.

In reality, it used to be called the European Federation of Gymnastics with Belgium, France, and Netherlands as its sole 3 countries until 1921 when non-European countries were admitted and the name was changed.

By the way I am not arguing for or against the US (the US has broken rules in different sports before as well) I was just dealing with that one point that you said.

[Syntax Error]

... By the way I am not arguing for or against the US (the US has broken rules in different sports before as well) I was just dealing with that one point that you said.

Yes, I am not arguing that the USA has not broken rules in most sports either. Just this baiting fixation among certain members here on China is hypocritical. BTW, the FIG is a heavily slanted group to the West... ie: USA

[tribe_pride]

Yes, I am not arguing that the USA has not broken rules in most sports either. Just this baiting fixation among certain members here on China is hypocritical. BTW, the FIG is a heavily slanted group to the West... ie: USA

Are you at least going to acknowledge that there is a possibility that a Chinese gymanst may have been younger than the rules allowed? It seems that some of the baiting is because it seems that you are making it seem that there is no way that the Chinese violated any rules when there is at least some proof of that happening.

[Syntax Error]

Are you at least going to acknowledge that there is a possibility that a Chinese gymanst may have been younger than the rules allowed? It seems that some of the baiting is because it seems that you are making it seem that there is no way that the Chinese violated any rules when there is at least some proof of that happening.

Oh no. I have never said that. There may be further violations against the Chinese teams here but I just said this bashing any other country (as long as they are not the USA) before anything is proven, especially when they are a different race than Caucasian, is disgusting (and usually veiled racial). Was a gymnast in this case outside of the rules and should have their Olympic medal removed? The Olympic committee will decide. If you think that these matters are decided in the public arena "there is no way that the Chinese violated any rules when there is at least some proof of that happening" I think you may be wrong.

and all you cscommers can just go ahead and keep neg repping me for my opinions, matters so much

[GannonFan]

Yes, I am not arguing that the USA has not broken rules in most sports either. Just this baiting fixation among certain members here on China is hypocritical. BTW, the FIG is a heavily slanted group to the West... ie: USA


Oh no. I have never said that. There may be further violations against the Chinese teams here but I just said this bashing any other country (as long as they are not the USA) before anything is proven, especially when they are a different race than Caucasian, is disgusting (and usually veiled racial). Was a gymnast in this case outside of the rules and should have their Olympic medal removed? The Olympic committee will decide. If you think that these matters are decided in the public arena "there is no way that the Chinese violated any rules when there is at least some proof of that happening" I think you may be wrong.

and all you cscommers can just go ahead and keep neg repping me for my opinions, matters so much

Come on man, now anyone that says that China cheated is "usually" a racist? And the FIG is heavily slanted towards the US? You do realize that each country only has one vote in any international sports governing body? Most sports bodies may be slanted toward the West, but that just means they are slanted towards Europe, and as decisions like the location of upcoming Olympics, the inclusion of more women's sports (i.e. ski jumping), and the removal of sports like baseball and softball, the US is hardly catered to in those organizations.

The FIG said that China cheated, and the evidence looks pretty straight forward. Sure the Olympic committee may not revoke the medals, but the evidence is what it is. If the US did this they'd be called to the mat (pun entirely intended) right away - of course, birth records in the US are much easier to track down so you'd almost never see cheating in this way in the US. But the US has had plenty of athletes caught for cheating in many ways (PED the most frequent) so there's nothing racist about calling out cheating when it happens - China cheated, the FIG has proven that. Whether the medals are stipped is just a side story now.

[danefan]

I'll reiterate something I got neg repped for (blindly I might add).....

The IOC needs to do a better job protecting young athletes from overzealous state-sponsored and run athletic organizations like the Chinese Gymnastics Association.

[MplsBison]

I'm not a huge fan of gymnastics so I can't really vouch too much for it. But even women's tennis had this problem and they ended up establishing a minimum age after the Hingis's and Capriatti's came through. It's not unheard of to have minimum age requirements in order to protect younger athletes. Both the NBA and the NFL have rules that pretty much establish this. What does that say about those sports?

I guarantee that 12 years have no advantage over 20 year olds in football and basketball.

[GannonFan]

I'll reiterate something I got neg repped for (blindly I might add).....

The IOC needs to do a better job protecting young athletes from overzealous state-sponsored and run athletic organizations like the Chinese Gymnastics Association.

Well, the Chinese aren't necessarily alone in this - you probably have the same fervor in America, but it's isolated to individual parents and the like who try to push their kids. Granted, in the US the national organizations would never get away with trying to falsify ages to the extent the Chinese have.

[GannonFan]

I guarantee that 12 years have no advantage over 20 year olds in football and basketball.

I agree, certainly, but there are still minimum age requirements for both the NBA and the NFL. In those cases they are in there to protect the integrity of the college game, but they are also there to protect kids who may be 16, 17, 18 who could physically make those leagues but would certainly face an uphill struggle to strive there, especially on the emotional side of things.

[Rob Iola]

eh, China Schmina...

When does the topic turn to Caster Semenya?

[danefan]

Well, the Chinese aren't necessarily alone in this - you probably have the same fervor in America, but it's isolated to individual parents and the like who try to push their kids. Granted, in the US the national organizations would never get away with trying to falsify ages to the extent the Chinese have.

I agree and my comments are not limited to the Chinese. This is just one of what I am sure is a rampant problem, especially in the Eastern European state-run athletics programs.

I don't really have as much of a problem with it when its not state-run. Overzealous parents are everywhere and anywhere you find world-class athletes. However, I wonder how many parents know what goes on behind the closed doors of the training facilities of organizations like the Chinese Gymnastics Association? And how many of those parents would have the realistic opportunity to remove their children without fear of governmental retribution, especially if their child is a star athlete?

[MplsBison]

I agree, certainly, but there are still minimum age requirements for both the NBA and the NFL. In those cases they are in there to protect the integrity of the college game, but they are also there to protect kids who may be 16, 17, 18 who could physically make those leagues but would certainly face an uphill struggle to strive there, especially on the emotional side of things.

So what you're saying is that the age limit for gymnastics is solely in place to protect the emotional well being of 12 year olds who win olympic gold medals and has absolutely nothing to do with protecting the competitiveness of older athletes?

Come on...

[GannonFan]

So what you're saying is that the age limit for gymnastics is solely in place to protect the emotional well being of 12 year olds who win olympic gold medals and has absolutely nothing to do with protecting the competitiveness of older athletes?

Come on...

No, I didn't say that. I think the age limit is in there for both reasons you mention. :)

[PantherRob82]

http://www.asianjoke.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/07/funny_chinese_strong_man.jpg

[Skjellyfetti]

The NCAA... err, IOC.... needs to put China on probation for 2012

[Gil Dobie]

The NCAA... err, IOC.... needs to put China on probation for 2012

Maybe they are already on double secret probation. xlolx
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_TkR-KeU-T2A/RfGqZ2rczbI/AAAAAAAAAg4/IbQFywB_mwM/s320/dean+wormer.bmp

[uofmman1122]

http://www.asianjoke.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/07/funny_chinese_strong_man.jpgWoah! Woah!

That guy is Japanese. Let's not confuse our non-communist, East-Asian nations. :p

[MplsBison]

No, I didn't say that. I think the age limit is in there for both reasons you mention. :)

I don't, it seems obvious to me that the sport's apparatus have not evolved with human beings. We've gotten bigger since the last 100 years.

A modern 12 year old probably is the same size as a 16-18 year old from 100 years ago.


Make the apparatus bigger and the entire issue goes away.