Apparently it is down to Chattanooga and Frisco as host of the National Championship

[chattanoogamocs]

(thanks to my co-admin, GoMocs, on Mocfans for all the leg work)

Some news breaking, Missoula Montana has been eliminated, Frisco has been told they are a finalist.

http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/APStories/stories/D9C5HTP04.html

http://billingsgazette.com/sports/college/article_6a514176-d892-11de-9ac0-001cc4c002e0.html

http://dallas.bizjournals.com/dallas/stories/2009/11/23/daily6.html

Chattanooga still has a shot at continuing to host the FCS national championship game.

http://www.timesfreepress.com/news/2009/nov/23/chattanooga-finalist-future-title-games/

It is not known what cities remain in contention for the championship game, but is known that both Missoula and Spokane have been eliminated.

http://billingsgazette.com/sports/college/blogs/catgrizinsider/article_10a23176-d88d-11de-a510-001cc4c002e0.html

It is down to Frisco and Chattanooga for all the marbles....

By Associated Press

7:01 PM CST, November 23, 2009
LITTLE ROCK, Ark. (AP) - Little Rock's War Memorial Stadium is not a finalist to host the Football Championship Subdivision title game.

Central Arkansas athletic director Brad Teague, whose school was part of a group trying to bring the game to the state capital, said Monday that Little Rock was not a finalist.

Teague said he wasn't sure why the bid fell short, but he suspected War Memorial might be too big for the FCS title game. The stadium holds over 50,000, and last season's FCS championship game between Richmond and Montana drew 17,823.

[93henfan]

Those look like the two best choices. I'd be fine staying with Chatty, but it seems like Frisco has a lot of big guns behind their proposal.

[utcfan]

Go Chattanooga. FCS NC game has grown in its 13 years in Chattanooga. Bring it back.

[henfan]

Win-win for the FCS. The two best choices prevail.

[Bogus Megapardus]

Pizza Hut Park, huh? I can't wait for the smirks and giggles.

[Skjellyfetti]

Yep. I agree with everyone else. These are the best two venues. I hope Chattanooga keeps it, but I don't think I'd be disappointed with Friscoe.

[chattanoogamocs]

Those look like the two best choices. I'd be fine staying with Chatty, but it seems like Frisco has a lot of big guns behind their proposal.

I said a number of times going into this that Frisco was the only one that really worried me.

I worry a bit (a lot) because of all the places that have bid in the last couple of times (including Cedar Falls and San Antonio in the past)...Frisco has the best chance to knock Chattanooga off the the throne (they have no real weakness except experience).

I further worry that NCAA will pin themselves in a corner if the *don't* give it to Frisco...because after a while, people will quit bidding if Chattanooga retains every time.

On the other hand, they could be pretty happy with Chattanoog and really want to keep it there, but by opening the process, it forces Chattanooga to give even more (which they did...they doubled the guarantee from the last contract)

The good news for Chattanooga is, it doesn't have to make money...the city is smart enough to realize the millions that are spent over the weekend are well worth the small amount of money they may be lost to guarantee a big dollar amount to the NCAA.

And on a side note...the last real problem that Finley has had (the speakers) have finally been properly replaced. The last half of the season you could hear the PA from 2 blocks away...it is AWESOME. That is one thing that Chattanooga has done well. Anytime there has been a problem, they have gone over expectations to get it right. Hopefully the NCAA will remember that.

[McTailGator]

Pizza Hut Park, huh? I can't wait for the smirks and giggles.


Not as bad as The University of Phoniex Stadium when the BCS is in town every 4 years.

Damn school doesn't even play football xsmiley_wix

[89Hen]

They are the only two legit candidates IMO, but Chatty > Frisco...

1. They've earned the right to keep it, keep building it up.

2. No need to move it to a place where just about everyone would have to fly.

3. Frisco did NOT support the NCAA championship they hosted (don't give me the crap about "it was soccer" because they couldn't draw as much as they could for their miserable MLS team).

xtwocentsx

[Bogus Megapardus]

Not as bad as The University of Phoniex Stadium when the BCS is in town every 4 years.

Damn school doesn't even play football xsmiley_wix

I feel badly for the NFL Cardinals, and for the broadcasters who must repeat that name. I don't know how they do it with a straight face.

[KiddBrewer]

i personally wouldnt mind it being in Frisco if it has to be. I've always wanted a reason to go to Texas, and that place looks pretty awesome for a NC game.

[Esko]

Sounds like the best two places are in the finals. I'm fine with either, the ease of the drive to 'Nooga, or flying to Texas and being right where my dad lives.

[LacesOut]

Move it.

Give another city/venue a chance.

[Reign of Terrier]

where is Frisco?

[KiddBrewer]

now, refresh me, when would these changes be put in place if it's moved?xscanx

[KiddBrewer]

where is Frisco?

near dallas

[Esko]

where is Frisco?

North of Dallas. and west of McKinney, Allen and Plano. Actually a pretty nice area and with the game moving to January I think it would actually make a great place for the NC game.

[McTailGator]

where is Frisco?

Dallas

[KiddBrewer]

oh and if you dont get it yet, its near dallas.

[Skjellyfetti]

Where's Dallas?

[DFW HOYA]

Nothing wrong with rotating sites.

The west could use a site as well...Portland, anyone?

[Eight Legger]

Whose home field is Pizza Hut Park, anyone's? Or is it just a multi-purpose stadium?

[MplsBison]

Move it.

Give another city/venue a chance.

This is the biggest thing.


Above all else, Chatty should not get to keep the game just because it's been there.


If Frisco can't support the game, then move it back to Chatty. But let someone else try.

[Esko]

Whose home field is Pizza Hut Park, anyone's? Or is it just a multi-purpose stadium?

Built as a soccer stadium but really a multi-purpose thing. They host concerts and all kinds of stuff.

http://www.pizzahutpark.com/

[KiddBrewer]

Whose home field is Pizza Hut Park, anyone's? Or is it just a multi-purpose stadium?

ha FC Dallas (MLS)

[HiHiYikas]

Whose home field is Pizza Hut Park, anyone's? Or is it just a multi-purpose stadium?
Dallas' MLS team plays there, the Dallas Meh

[KiddBrewer]

This is the biggest thing.


Above all else, Chatty should not get to keep the game just because it's been there.


If Frisco can't support the game, then move it back to Chatty. But let someone else try.

kinda agreexchinscratchxxsmileyclapx

[Bogus Megapardus]

If it goes to Pizza Hut Park, will it become the Pasta Bowl?

[UNH Fanboi]

Missoula was actually in the running at one point?! I thought that was a joke when I heard it mentioned earlier. Having the game there would be terrible. I hope the NCAA's stated reason of them only bidding for one year was just a nice way of saying "You're in the middle of nowhere." What lengths the Grizz will go to avoid a road game.

[LacesOut]

What lengths the Grizz will go to avoid a road game.

What the eff does that statement have to do with this????!!!

[SumItUp]

Take it to Frisco. I understand that Chatty has done a good job (based on other's posts), but Frisco and the associated funding could help take the FCS championship to another level. After watching the NCAA Selection show on ESPNU, it is obvious that FCS needs better exposure.

[FargoBison]

I am cheering for Frisco, time to give another location a shot and thankfully it is one near a major airport.

[Keenan]

Whose home field is Pizza Hut Park, anyone's? Or is it just a multi-purpose stadium?

I guess I'm the only person on this board that has actually been to Pizza Hut Park. It is the home of FC Dallas of Major League Soccer. Soccer,high school football and concerts are all held there. I attended MLS Cup there a few years ago between the LA Galaxy and New England Revolution. I was very impressed with the stadium and believe it would be a perfect venue in terms of location and size for the FCS National Championship game. It would certainly offer a neutral site unlike Chattanooga in recent years where Appalachian State has had a decided "home" field advantage. Frisco is approximately a 45 minute drive north of Dallas. Dallas is very cheap to fly to from most anywhere in the country and there are many more attractions for fans to go to. One might be able to parlay a weekend of the FCS Championship game and a home Dallas Cowboys game at the beautiful new Texas Stadium in nearby Arlington. Overall, I think it's a no brainer to move the game to Frisco. I think people hanging on to Chattanooga are either (A) from Chattanooga (B) someone within driving distance of Chattanooga whose team has a chance to go there every year or (C) someone that doesn't like change. Most people avoid change at all costs which is very natural, but I believe that moving the game to Frisco would help grow FCS football. Just my .02! xreadx

[BDKJMU]

Interesting:

"(The 2010 championship game will be held Jan. 7, 2011 next season)."
http://www.kfbb.com/sports/local/71979712.html

Jan 7 is a FRIDAY.

The 2010 season, BCS title game will be on Mon, Jan 10, 2011.
http://www.bcsfootball.org/bcsfb/future

So apparently the FCS Title game WON'T BE HELD ON THE EVE OF THE BCS TITLE GAME but rather the Friday before.

So no reason to worry about it being held on Sun, Jan 9th as we had previously discussed in the last thread on this topic several months ago.

[chattanoogamocs]

I think people hanging on to Chattanooga are either (A) from Chattanooga (B) someone within driving distance of Chattanooga whose team has a chance to go there every year or (C) someone that doesn't like change. Most people avoid change at all costs which is very natural, but I believe that moving the game to Frisco would help grow FCS football. Just my .02! xreadx

And most of the people for change have probably never actually been to the championship game in Chattanooga.

[Keenan]

And most of the people for change have probably never actually been to the championship game in Chattanooga.

You got me there Mocs, but consider this. Dallas,TX vs. Chattanooga,TN. In January. Do some logical thinking and I think it's easy to see that the game will be moved to Dallas next season. Nothing personal, but it will be a step up. Chattanooga was a step up from Youngstown,OH and Huntington,WV but don't try to compare Chattanooga against Dallas.

[chattanoogamocs]

You got me there Mocs, but consider this. Dallas,TX vs. Chattanooga,TN. In January. Do some logical thinking and I think it's easy to see that the game will be moved to Dallas next season. Nothing personal, but it will be a step up. Chattanooga was a step up from Youngstown,OH and Huntington,WV but don't try to compare Chattanooga against Dallas.

Maybe you should actually take a moment to go back and read my posts before spouting off your vast knowledge and logic.

First, I never tried to compare Chattanooga to Dallas.

Second, I said I was very nervous about this because, except for experience, Frisco has no weaknesses in their bid.

Trust me, I know more about what's going on than you do...well, unless you have a degree in sports management and have actually worked on a number of NCAA organizing committee (I have).

[AtlantaMountaineer]

Obviously, most of you have no idea what Dallas weather is like in January. I lived in Texas for 10 years and the winters in Dallas are brutal. Wind, ice and snow, mostly ice. If you think Chatty is cold in December wait til you go to North Dallas in January.

[Keenan]

In the month of January according to weather.com

Frisco Avg.High 53
Chatty Avg.High 49

But here's the kicker

Frisco Avg.2.43in precip
Chatty Ave.5.40in precip

Higher probability of better weather in Frisco as compared to Chattanooga. There is 120% more precipitation during January in Chattanooga compared to Frisco.

[SumItUp]

For those that did not read the previous discussion about Frisco, you can read the thread here http://www.anygivensaturday.com/forum/showthread.php?t=64915&highlight=frisco

With the finalists being Chattanooga and Frisco, I don't think FCS will lose if either is selected.

[chattanoogamocs]

Either Chattanooga or Frisco could be sunny and 70 or windy, cold and raining. It is all luck on game day.

I have been to a couple of Cotton Bowls...and I have gotten a sunburn once or been bundled up like an eskimo at another...same with Chattanooga...I have been running in shorts and T-Shirt in January or it might be freezing cold.

Weather arguments are pretty much a wash between Chattanooga and Frisco, they are almost in the exact same pattern (and about the same distance south from the pole). Dallas is typically more windy because it is on the plain...but that's not a big deal either.

The only time weather would be a real argument was if you were comparing Dallas or Chattanooga to Florida or...well, Montana/Spokane.

[txstatebobcat]

Obviously, most of you have no idea what Dallas weather is like in January. I lived in Texas for 10 years and the winters in Dallas are brutal. Wind, ice and snow, mostly ice. If you think Chatty is cold in December wait til you go to North Dallas in January.


I wouldn't say "winters" as in all winter long because that just isn't true. When a cold front comes in, it can get very cold but usually thats maybe 2-3 days. In this case it would all depend on luck, if a cold front comes in at the same time as the game, then game time would see temperatures in the mid 20's. Otherwise, temps should be in the low to mid 40's.

[paytonlives]

I wouldn't say "winters" as in all winter long because that just isn't true. When a cold front comes in, it can get very cold but usually thats maybe 2-3 days. In this case it would all depend on luck, if a cold front comes in at the same time as the game, then game time would see temperatures in the mid 20's. Otherwise, temps should be in the low to mid 40's.


I too lived in Texas, for 4 years. The humidity is a killer... 35 and 90% humidity is like Missoula when its 10 below.

[paytonlives]

However, that stadium in Dallas, is Awesome and would be a great venue...

Ive never been to Chatty but hear it is a great town.

[chattanoogamocs]

For those that did not read the previous discussion about Frisco, you can read the thread here http://www.anygivensaturday.com/forum/showthread.php?t=64915&highlight=frisco

With the finalists being Chattanooga and Frisco, I don't think FCS will lose if either is selected.

I wholeheartedly agree.

Chattanooga has experience and familiarity on it's side, along with a nice stadium and a city that stands behind it.

Frisco has a top notch facility and is an easier destination city.

The only downside to Frisco, travel-wise, is for students...who typically pile, en masse, into a car and drive. Dallas is a much longer haul for most FCS schools (if you look at a map, Chattanooga is near the geographic center of FCS...which is why so many drive here).

Frisco also has the one thing that other larger cities that have bid don't have...a smaller venue (that is what ultimately killed San Antonio a couple of years ago).

Win or lose...competition is good. When Chattanooga got the title game, no one else even wanted it. Chattanooga has done a lot to make it into an event that others now want. I was on the committee that brought it Chattanooga, it is amazing what a different environment it is now. I am happy there was so much interest this time around...even if it leaves Chattanooga.

[Bronco]

I've seen all the sights in Nooga...I'd be up for a new place.
It's probably easier to fly into I assume for us that are far away.

[Dallas Demon]

I live 15 minutes away from the stadium, it would be a perfect venue with lots of things to do nearby. You never know about the weather in January here, it could be cold or warm. Easy to get here and an endless supply of restaurants/shopping/events to keep busy when you come to town.

[Poker Alan]

Missoula was actually in the running at one point?! I thought that was a joke when I heard it mentioned earlier. Having the game there would be terrible. I hope the NCAA's stated reason of them only bidding for one year was just a nice way of saying "You're in the middle of nowhere." What lengths the Grizz will go to avoid a road game.

xbangxxthumbsdownxxconfusedx:(

[Torgo]

Go 'Nooga, they deserve it.

[onbison09]

Built as a soccer stadium but really a multi-purpose thing. They host concerts and all kinds of stuff.

http://www.pizzahutpark.com/

And high school football games.

[onbison09]

I too lived in Texas, for 4 years. The humidity is a killer... 35 and 90% humidity is like Missoula when its 10 below.

Not so much here. We rarely get 90% humidity. It can happen but it's nowhere close to the Houston area.

[bluehenbillk]

Frisco is listed as a 3-2 favorite, Chatty at 4-1.

[Poker Alan]

Frisco is listed as a 3-2 favorite, Chatty at 4-1.

bummer for Chatty, if true.

[bluehenbillk]

The first line in the Chatty paper says a lot for me: "Chatty still has a shot to host"

[89Hen]

The west could use a site as well...Portland, anyone?
Humanitarian Bowl, anyone? xthumbsdownx

[89Hen]

I think people hanging on to Chattanooga are either (A) from Chattanooga (B) someone within driving distance of Chattanooga whose team has a chance to go there every year or (C) someone that doesn't like change.
(D) People that have actually been to the NC game in Chatty.xreadx

[89Hen]

Dallas,TX vs. Chattanooga,TN. In January. Do some logical thinking and I think it's easy to see that the game will be moved to Dallas next season. Nothing personal, but it will be a step up. Chattanooga was a step up from Youngstown,OH and Huntington,WV but don't try to compare Chattanooga against Dallas.
Frisco is not Dallas. And I'm not sure what you're getting at with the "In January" comment....

Frisco = 43 degrees
Chatty = 37 degrees

6 degrees may work for Kevin Bacon, but it doesn't mean a whole lot IMO.

[89Hen]

Frisco has no weaknesses in their bid
Except for location, lack of support of a previous NCAA Championship and being a strip mall suburb.

[McTailGator]

Obviously, most of you have no idea what Dallas weather is like in January. I lived in Texas for 10 years and the winters in Dallas are brutal. Wind, ice and snow, mostly ice. If you think Chatty is cold in December wait til you go to North Dallas in January.

That is why my choice would hae been the new Dynamo Stadium near Minutemad Park in Hosuton, or my 2nd choice of the Alamo Dome on the Riverwalk in San Antonio.

They have the ability to tarp off the upper decks and make the place look and feel smaller for a nice atmosphere.

And San Antonio is very nice in January.

[UCABEARS75]

oh and if you dont get it yet, its near dallas.

Or, about 6 hrs SW of Little Rock.

[henfan]

Regardless of which city lands the bid, I just hope it's not a long-term deal. Make the potential host cities work for the bids and earn the right to keep it once they get it.

If Frisco ends up hosting, they had better put on a great event in Year 1 because Chattanooga raised the bar pretty high, IMO.

[MplsBison]

And most of the people for change have probably never actually been to the championship game in Chattanooga.

Maybe moving to a new location will help get some more people out for the NC game?

[Saint3333]

Maybe moving to a new location will help get some more people out for the NC game?

Yeah right. The only thing that draws people are the two teams envolved, unless we move it to Vegas.

[89Hen]

The only thing that draws people are the two teams envolved, unless we move it to Vegas.
xnodx except for the last part.

[Dallas Demon]

Not so much here. We rarely get 90% humidity. It can happen but it's nowhere close to the Houston area.

Correct. Very little humidity problems here. Someone made a comment about strip malls? How about huge shopping complexes consisting of very large shopping malls and surrounding stores/restaurants/town centers. Frisco is the new wave of city building, and was basically built from the ground up over the last 20 years. This is a very nice location on the far north side of the Dallas area. BTW, the game will be a sellout in Frisco, it doesn't matter what teams are playing.

[henfan]

BTW, the game will be a sellout in Frisco, it doesn't matter what teams are playing.

Dallas Demon, can we count on you hosting a huge tailgate at the Frisco NC game?xprayx;)

[89Hen]

BTW, the game will be a sellout in Frisco, it doesn't matter what teams are playing.
xrolleyesx xrolleyesx xrolleyesx xrolleyesx xrolleyesx

[MplsBison]

Yeah right. The only thing that draws people are the two teams envolved, unless we move it to Vegas.

Hopefully, we'll get to test your theory!

[Saint3333]

Hopefully, we'll get to test your theory!

The proof is already out there the game has been at over 5 sites by my count and I'm sure the attendance numbers can be found as well.

[Dallas Demon]

Dallas Demon, can we count on you hosting a huge tailgate at the Frisco NC game?xprayx;)

I will certainly be there along with a lot of folks from my neighborhood. People don't seem to understand about Texas and its football. If there is a game and as long as it is not head-to-head with the Dallas Cowboys, local people will show up to watch.

[JohnStOnge]

Obviously I'm pulling for Frisco for many reasons.

[Dallas Demon]

Dallas Demon, can we count on you hosting a huge tailgate at the Frisco NC game?xprayx;)

Absolutely for the Blue Hens! xhurrayx

[MplsBison]

The proof is already out there the game has been at over 5 sites by my count and I'm sure the attendance numbers can be found as well.

How many of those were in Frisco TX? Yeah, didn't think so.

The history is irrelevant unless we're talking about moving the game back to one of those places.

[McNeese75]

Regardless of which city lands the bid, I just hope it's not a long-term deal. Make the potential host cities work for the bids and earn the right to keep it once they get it.

If Frisco ends up hosting, they had better put on a great event in Year 1 because Chattanooga raised the bar pretty high, IMO.

Were you there for the first game in Chatty? (:o sorry that was 97). Well the Cowboys were in town for that one and there was nothing special about how the event was handled by the City and there was almost no support from the locals. I would bet Frisco will step up a lot faster then Chatty did.

[chattanoogamocs]

Were you there for the first game in Chatty? (:o sorry that was 97). Well the Cowboys were in town for that one and there was nothing special about how the event was handled by the City and there was almost no support from the locals. I would bet Frisco will step up a lot faster then Chatty did.

That was over a decade ago (and I will admit, the city did not support it like it does now...it grew). And ironically, that is the best argument for those who think it should rotate. It is rare that anyone hits it out of the park in their first at bat. It takes time to develop. If it moves, it will take time to develop there too. No matter how many events you manage, there are different problems and circumstances for each event.

I must say, McNeese brought some of the most fun...and least obnoxious...fans ever. They all just wanted to have a good time. Plenty of cajun-style hospitality (I have never been offered so much food in my life...and I don't think I turned anyone down :)).

But, it's not how you start, it's how you finish. You would be amazed how much different it is now.

[McNeese75]

That was over a decade ago (and I will admit, the city did not support it like it does now...it grew). And ironically, that is the best argument for those who think it should rotate. It is rare that anyone hits it out of the park in their first at bat. It takes time to develop. If it moves, it will take time to develop there too. No matter how many events you manage, there are different problems and circumstances for each event.

I must say, McNeese brought some of the most fun...and least obnoxious...fans ever. They all just wanted to have a good time. Plenty of cajun-style hospitality (I have never been offered so much food in my life...and I don't think I turned anyone down :)).

But, it's not how you start, it's how you finish. You would be amazed how much different it is now.

xbawlingx I sure wish I was more acquainted with how it is lately. I understand there are different rules for tailgating, etc now but the first year was something special and a fond memory for all of us who attended xnodx

[AppMan]

Considering the last ten championship games have been dominated by teams from the South and Mid Atlantic states I'd say moving the game to Texas makes perfect sense. ;>)

[Pard4Life]

Frisco would be a good move.

Mainly, it is easier to fly into with cheap deals to be had at times.

Experience hosting is not a big a deal. The stadium has hosted the NCAA Mens Soccer Championship. Furthermore, doesn't the NCAA lead organization and run the event? The operations would simply move. If not, the soccer experience would help, albeit different sports.

Also, isn't this the central hot bed of football, with more opportunites to attract the casual fan? That way, if you get a weird title match, like Colgate-Wofford, two teams with small followings, how can you possibly fill the stadium?

The biggest concern though, as someone alluded to, is that Chatty seems to be the centerpoint of all FCS teams.

[AppMan]

Frisco would be a good move.

Mainly, it is easier to fly into with cheap deals to be had at times.

Experience hosting is not a big a deal. The stadium has hosted the NCAA Mens Soccer Championship. Furthermore, doesn't the NCAA lead organization and run the event? The operations would simply move. If not, the soccer experience would help, albeit different sports.

Also, isn't this the central hot bed of football, with more opportunites to attract the casual fan? That way, if you get a weird title match, like Colgate-Wofford, two teams with small followings, how can you possibly fill the stadium?

The biggest concern though, as someone alluded to, is that Chatty seems to be the centerpoint of all FCS teams.

It is my understanding the 2008 NCAA Men's Soccer Championships drew a mere 8,000. That's kind of shabby for a designated soccer training facility and home to a professional soccer franchise.

[19Duke97]

Unless you like to eat or shop, Frisco is just an extension of a dreadful suburban sprawl around Dallas. I lived in Plano from 80-84, and Frisco was a cow field, then I had the misfortune to move back to Allen from 2000-2002. When my wife and I left, we did not look back at all. January in Dallas is dreary - gray skies and a cold wind blowing through the area almost always. As stated, ice storms are somewhat common in this area as well in January. By contrast, the Chatty area is quite lovely and has some decent culture to boot. I prefer to have the host stadium be an actual college football stadium, not some multi-function HS/MLS/Concert location. Yes, Dallas is easier to travel to, but IMHO not an ideal location. if in Texas, San Antonio or Austin would have been much nicer. All I can say about Dallas is that at least it's not Houston. I will say one thing postive though - the people are very nice.

[AppMan]

Unless you like to eat or shop, Frisco is just an extension of a dreadful suburban sprawl around Dallas. I lived in Plano from 80-84, and Frisco was a cow field, then I had the misfortune to move back to Allen from 2000-2002. When my wife and I left, we did not look back at all. January in Dallas is dreary - gray skies and a cold wind blowing through the area almost always. As stated, ice storms are somewhat common in this area as well in January. By contrast, the Chatty area is quite lovely and has some decent culture to boot. I prefer to have the host stadium be an actual college football stadium, not some multi-function HS/MLS/Concert location. Yes, Dallas is easier to travel to, but IMHO not an ideal location. if in Texas, San Antonio or Austin would have been much nicer. All I can say about Dallas is that at least it's not Houston. I will say one thing postive though - the people are very nice, as long as you don't get cornered into hearing about Jesus.

You had me right up until that last line.

[19Duke97]

You had me right up until that last line.

FYI I am Catholic -- in Texas, apparently that's not Christian, and so I got to hear about it - sorry it was irritating. But I did edit it b/c the comment may be misconstrued.

[Pards Rule]

Where was it before Chatty??

[Pards Rule]

North of Dallas. and west of McKinney, Allen and Plano. Actually a pretty nice area and with the game moving to January I think it would actually make a great place for the NC game.

It was, up until the Great Recession, the fastest growing city in Texas..

[Waco Kid]

I hope it stays in Chatty... the city has embrassed the game and put a lot of effort into making it a big event. No need to start over in a town that knows nothing about FCS football, and isn't within driving distance of 95% of the schools in FCS. Almost all of the teams that have to fly now will still have to fly so I don't see what the difference is.

[sharkeycox]

And most of the people for change have probably never actually been to the championship game in Chattanooga.

I have been to Chattanooga twice. It is a lovely town, but I am ready for a move. I like the fact that Dallas(Frisco) is 6 hours closer to McNeese.

Better airport, more attractions in the DFW metroplex.xtwocentsx

[Dallas Demon]

It is my understanding the 2008 NCAA Men's Soccer Championships drew a mere 8,000. That's kind of shabby for a designated soccer training facility and home to a professional soccer franchise.

Soccer gets zero visibility here. It's all about football. I had no idea that the 2008 NCAA Men's Soccer Championships were held in Frisco.

[onbison09]

Correct. Very little humidity problems here. Someone made a comment about strip malls? How about huge shopping complexes consisting of very large shopping malls and surrounding stores/restaurants/town centers. Frisco is the new wave of city building, and was basically built from the ground up over the last 20 years. This is a very nice location on the far north side of the Dallas area. BTW, the game will be a sellout in Frisco, it doesn't matter what teams are playing.
I'm not so sure. That would be my only worry.

[Bogus Megapardus]

a weird title match, like Colgate-Wofford

Now wouldn't that one be a kick in the cajones. xnodx

[txstatebobcat]

The Dallas-Ft. Worth metroplex is huge with probably hundred thousand+ FCS alumni within an hour's drive from the stadium. This alone should guarantee around 10,000+ locals at game time. With this in mind I don't see any reason why 20,000 shouldn't be the average game attendance at Frisco.

[ASU_Fanatic]

It needs to stay in Chatty...btw where the heck is Frisco? What school is it?

[MplsBison]

It needs to stay in Chatty...btw where the heck is Frisco? What school is it?

That would be the most convenient for App fans xrolleyesx

[ASU_Fanatic]

That would be the most convenient for App fans xrolleyesxSo where is Frisco?

[jmufan999]

no problem with rotating sites, but since 80% of all FCS schools are on the east coast (or in very nearby states like TN), how would Frisco make sense? want to put it somewhere in Kansas or something, fine. but think about your last few national champs and the state they're from:

98 (Mass)
99 (Georgia)
00 (Georgia)
01 (Montana... ok, i'll give you one out west)
02 (Kentucky)
03 (Delaware)
04 (Virginia)
05 (NC)
06 (NC)
07 (NC)
08 (Virginia)

anyone see any trends there? must be that pesky "east coast bias" again. just don't see how moving it to Frisco would make sense, unless they're working in conjunction with the airlines in order to drum up a ton of business. that was sarcasm for those that didn't catch it.

[Torgo]

So where is Frisco?

Suburb of Dallas.


I'm not a fan of the location though. I knew Missoula didn't have much of a chance...I'm surprised that they stayed in the running so long, to be honest being out in the middle of nowhere with nothing but a regional airport to bring fans in with...but I was rooting for Little Rock from a city standpoint. That would be a football-crazy environment with an interesting city and a larger airport right there...but no way that stadium sells out unless its something like Montana vs. Appalachian State...and even then it may not fill up.


I'm sure Frisco would sell out more or less, but I am fairly worried about the local support aspect. Texas is dominated by football, which helps...but the FCS isn't going to top the NFL (a given), the 'major' colleges (there's a ton in Texas), or high school (religion) in most places, and Frisco is without a legitimate host school. For that reason, and that reason alone I'm pushing for Chattanooga. Its a little more than conceivable to think of this game as a major event in a place like Chattanooga...in Dallas? Not so much.

It sure as hell would be easier for me to get to Frisco than Chattanooga though.

[yosef1969]

no problem with rotating sites, but since 80% of all FCS schools are on the east coast (or in very nearby states like TN), how would Frisco make sense? want to put it somewhere in Kansas or something, fine. but think about your last few national champs and the state they're from:

98 (Mass)
99 (Georgia)
00 (Georgia)
01 (Montana... ok, i'll give you one out west)
02 (Kentucky)
03 (Delaware)
04 (Virginia)
05 (NC)
06 (NC)
07 (NC)
08 (Virginia)

anyone see any trends there? must be that pesky "east coast bias" again. just don't see how moving it to Frisco would make sense, unless they're working in conjunction with the airlines in order to drum up a ton of business. that was sarcasm for those that didn't catch it.

I agree with your premise for the most part but you can't ignore the opponents in those games. Several were west coast teams and some folks (not myself) would argue that the travel east and the virtual "home game" played a role in the results shown above.

[89Hen]

I will certainly be there along with a lot of folks from my neighborhood. People don't seem to understand about Texas and its football. If there is a game and as long as it is not head-to-head with the Dallas Cowboys, local people will show up to watch.
Demon, no offense, but that's BULLSHYTE. There are PLENTY of I-A teams that draw 50-65% capacity. xthumbsdownx

[89Hen]

I would bet Frisco will step up a lot faster then Chatty did.
I woudn't. They DIDN'T step up when they hosted the NCAA soccer championships. They had LESS people there then for their LAST PLACE MLS team. xnonox

[89Hen]

Unless you like to eat or shop, Frisco is just an extension of a dreadful suburban sprawl around Dallas.... I will say one thing postive though - the people are very nice.
As I said in a previous thread about this, they always say someplace "is a nice place to visit but I'd never want to live there".... I'm guessing Frisco is the opposite... a nice place to live, but I wouldn't want to visit there. xpeacex

[89Hen]

guarantee around 10,000+ locals at game time.
xblahblahxxblahblahxxblahblahx

I wish I had a dollar for every empty promise about attendance at different locations with NO basis in reality. xcoffeex

[Panther88]

People don't seem to understand about Texas and its football. If there is a game and as long as it is not head-to-head with the Dallas Cowboys, local people will show up to watch.

Nice post.

Hope Frisco wins out. I was just near the stadium last week having a lunch and I must admit that it's an awfully, awfully nice area. xbowx 1st class facility.

[GannonFan]

I woudn't. They DIDN'T step up when they hosted the NCAA soccer championships. They had LESS people there then for their LAST PLACE MLS team. xnonox

Just asking - what have been the attendance at prior NCAA soccer championships at other venues before Frisco? It's all fine and well to compare it to the attendance of the local MLS team, but is NCAA soccer any real draw when it comes to the number of people in attendance? Most the NCAA soccer games I see for a second or two before I change the channel seem to be played in places where there aren't even stands because there are too few people there to warrant building anyplace for them to sit (and this is from a guy who actually likes soccer). Just askin.

[Tod]

no problem with rotating sites, but since 80% of all FCS schools are on the east coast (or in very nearby states like TN), how would Frisco make sense? want to put it somewhere in Kansas or something, fine. but think about your last few national champs and the state they're from:

98 (Mass)
99 (Georgia)
00 (Georgia)
01 (Montana... ok, i'll give you one out west)
02 (Kentucky)
03 (Delaware)
04 (Virginia)
05 (NC)
06 (NC)
07 (NC)
08 (Virginia)

anyone see any trends there? must be that pesky "east coast bias" again. just don't see how moving it to Frisco would make sense, unless they're working in conjunction with the airlines in order to drum up a ton of business. that was sarcasm for those that didn't catch it.

But aren't you ignoring the teams that lost the NC game in that time period?

Montana - 3
UNI - 1
McNeese - 1

Granted, that's six of 20 teams, or only 30%, but I see no reason, based on those numbers, that the game has to stay in the east.

If you want to use the numbers, then we need to consider other locations, further to the west, IMO, at least some of the time.

That said, I have no problem with Chatty. :D

[89Hen]

Just asking - what have been the attendance at prior NCAA soccer championships at other venues before Frisco?
Record attendance was when UVA played in the finals at Richmond. That alone should tell you all you need to know about where the game should be.

As for using NCAA compared to MLS, I think it's VERY valid. Dallas FC was a last place team when they hosted the College Cup, yet they STILL outdrew the NCAA's. That tells me a LOT about whether the locals will support an NCAA event when the participants are not local. Don't forget, there were FOUR schools involved, not just two.

[GannonFan]

But aren't you ignoring the teams that lost the NC game in that time period?

Montana - 3
UNI - 1
McNeese - 1

Granted, that's six of 20 teams, or only 30%, but I see no reason, based on those numbers, that the game has to stay in the east.

If you want to use the numbers, then we need to consider other locations, further to the west, IMO, at least some of the time.

That said, I have no problem with Chatty. :D

Where out west would you put it, though? If you're considering Frisco as west, okay, but that's still a plane trip (or a real long drive) for anyone outside of the Southland. Geography just means that gobs of East Coast teams will be much closer to wherever they have it in the East versus the West, where the teams are far fewer and the land area is significantly larger.

[bluehenbillk]

89-

I aprreciate your enthusiasm.

But, for the love of God, can you please stop injecting soccer into the conversation, to say its comparing apples to oranges is being kind.

[GannonFan]

Record attendance was when UVA played in the finals at Richmond. That alone should tell you all you need to know about where the game should be.

As for using NCAA compared to MLS, I think it's VERY valid. Dallas FC was a last place team when they hosted the College Cup, yet they STILL outdrew the NCAA's. That tells me a LOT about whether the locals will support an NCAA event when the participants are not local. Don't forget, there were FOUR schools involved, not just two.

But you're still talking about soccer, and soccer in Texas. Not being from there, is there any real support of soccer in Texas at all? Just because some people show up for the Dallas FC team (and from what you say it's paltry support at best) has little bearing on who would show up for an NCAA event with teams that aren't local. People there, apparently, barely even watch their local team in a sport that isn't big in Texas. That may not be the best predictor of how people will support a sport that they actually watch even when their own team is not involved.

As for the 4 teams involved in the NCAA - is that important? Do people other than the parents of the players involved even travel to these events? Does it matter that there are 4 groups of parents as opposed to two groups when you're talking maybe 100-200 people?

[NDB]

89-

I aprreciate your enthusiasm.

But, for the love of God, can you please stop injecting soccer into the conversation, to say its comparing apples to oranges is being kind.

more like spheres (truncated icosahedrons?) to prolate spheroids with pointed ends

[Saint3333]

How many of those were in Frisco TX? Yeah, didn't think so.

The history is irrelevant unless we're talking about moving the game back to one of those places.

Try thinking outside of the box. There is a strong correlation between the teams playing in the championship game and the proximity to the schools. What school in the last 20 years was near Frisco? This has Epic Fail written all over it.

[Tod]

Where out west would you put it, though? If you're considering Frisco as west, okay, but that's still a plane trip (or a real long drive) for anyone outside of the Southland. Geography just means that gobs of East Coast teams will be much closer to wherever they have it in the East versus the West, where the teams are far fewer and the land area is significantly larger.

Well, that's why I said I have no problem with Chatty. It works just fine.

But I also said "more west", not "out west". I'd like to be able to drive it in two days, but that would probably mean a lot more driving for the teams involved as well. Their fans, anyway. Chatty is a pretty fair location.

Now, if UM happens to get the game sometime, I can walk it! :D


I won't, but i could...

[MplsBison]

Try thinking outside of the box. There is a strong correlation between the teams playing in the championship game and the proximity to the schools. What school in the last 20 years was near Frisco? This has Epic Fail written all over it.

Texas is football crazy. As long as it's not when the Cowboys or the FBS teams are playing, people will come.


If you build it...

[MplsBison]

Any further mention about attendance for a soccer game, as if it somehow has relevance to a football game...in the state of TEXAS....should require that person be dismissed from the discussion.

Talk about a strawman...

[HiHiYikas]

I don't really consider Chattanooga the East Coast. East, maybe, but not coast. It's further West than Detroit and Cleveland, and only about 100 miles to the east of Indianapolis and Chicago.

I guess if you have to divide the country into an East half and a West half, it's in the East. Still, I wouldn't think there would be a lot of "East Coast" complaints if the game were in Louisville or Cincinnati.

[89Hen]

89-

I aprreciate your enthusiasm.

But, for the love of God, can you please stop injecting soccer into the conversation, to say its comparing apples to oranges is being kind.
C'mon Bill. I'm comparing soccer to SOCCER, not football. The FACT remains that less people came to an NCAA championship in that stadium than for the last place professional team that plays in that stadium. Now I'm guessing that a LOT of fans that went to the Championship came from the schools participating. That means that even fewer locals came. The locals did NOT support an event to the level they supported their local, last-place team. xreadx

[89Hen]

But you're still talking about soccer...
See above. I could be talking about Tiddly Winks... the sport is insignificant because I am comparing it to ITSELF.

[89Hen]

As for the 4 teams involved in the NCAA - is that important? Do people other than the parents of the players involved even travel to these events? Does it matter that there are 4 groups of parents as opposed to two groups when you're talking maybe 100-200 people?
C'mon Gannon. xthumbsdownx

[Dallas Demon]

C'mon Bill. I'm comparing soccer to SOCCER, not football. The FACT remains that less people came to an NCAA championship in that stadium than for the last place professional team that plays in that stadium. Now I'm guessing that a LOT of fans that went to the Championship came from the schools participating. That means that even fewer locals came. The locals did NOT support an event to the level they supported their local, last-place team. xreadx

Nobody cares about soccer around here UNLESS:

1) You have a daughter
2) Your son is either 4 - 5 years old and there is no choice for playing football (actually, I believe they are now playing at 4)
3) You previously lived in Mexico and you haven't had a chance to convert over to American football.

Just last weekend, in Round 2 of the high school playoffs, Allen vs. Southlake Carroll drew 40,000+.

It probably doesn't matter what you or I think, I suspect that the people that are making a decision are looking for fresh blood and a way to leapfrog the current interest level. For example, 1% of the nearly 7M DFW population is 70,000 - half the population of Chattanooga. Plus, DFW is really easy to get to from any major city. Not to mention a major media outlet, DFW is the #5 media market in the U.S.

I believe that the FCS (I-AA) has been treated like a second-class citizen, and we need to do something different in order to start getting the attention we deserve. Maybe this is a start.

[colorless raider]

Nobody cares about soccer around here UNLESS:

1) You have a daughter
2) Your son is either 4 - 5 years old and there is no choice for playing football (actually, I believe they are now playing at 4)
3) You previously lived in Mexico and you haven't had a chance to convert over to American football.

Just last weekend, in Round 2 of the high school playoffs, Allen vs. Southlake Carroll drew 40,000+.

It probably doesn't matter what you or I think, I suspect that the people that are making a decision are looking for fresh blood and a way to leapfrog the current interest level. For example, 1% of the nearly 7M DFW population is 70,000 - half the population of Chattanooga. Plus, DFW is really easy to get to from any major city. Not to mention a major media outlet, DFW is the #5 media market in the U.S.

I believe that the FCS (I-AA) has been treated like a second-class citizen, and we need to do something different in order to start getting the attention we deserve. Maybe this is a start.

I am an east coast fan and I would go for this. There is no better "hotbed" for football than Texas and I support such a move. p.s. It snowed when Gate played in the Championship.

[ronpayne]

I keep hearing people talk about how you can fly into DFW for the game, but the problem is that airplane tickets are prohibitively expensive. If the game stays, as it should, in Chattanooga, MOST teams and fans can drive to the game; if it moves to Frisco, the most fans will have to fly to see their team, and in this economy, I doubt most of us can spring $700+ for 2 tickets, when gas, round trip might cost $200 total ($300 if you drive a real guzzler).

Chattanooga has really stepped its game up the last several years and deserves to keep the game, imo.

[MplsBison]

I keep hearing people talk about how you can fly into DFW for the game, but the problem is that airplane tickets are prohibitively expensive. If the game stays, as it should, in Chattanooga, MOST teams and fans can drive to the game; if it moves to Frisco, the most fans will have to fly to see their team, and in this economy, I doubt most of us can spring $700+ for 2 tickets, when gas, round trip might cost $200 total ($300 if you drive a real guzzler).

Chattanooga has really stepped its game up the last several years and deserves to keep the game, imo.

What you mean is, if the game stays in Chatty then ASU fans can continuing driving while everyone else continues to fly in.

Chatty is very convenient for App.

[Grizo406]

Frisco might be a wise choice, but I just can't see how they'll top the hospitality that Chattanooga offers!

An amazing town, that puts on a pretty good show! And given the chance, I'm sure Frisco will try and do the same...should they get the bid.xtwocentsx

[89Hen]

Nobody cares about soccer around here UNLESS:

Thanks for completely ignoring the point. "Soccer" isn't the crux. xthumbsdownx

[89Hen]

Just last weekend, in Round 2 of the high school playoffs, Allen vs. Southlake Carroll drew 40,000+.
Who was in the stands?

[HiHiYikas]

What you mean is, if the game stays in Chatty then ASU fans can continuing driving while everyone else continues to fly in.

Chatty is very convenient for App.
App fans can only be App fans, and can only speak from experience as App fans. And that experience includes several recent trips to Chattanooga.

It's just as easy for a Southern Illinois fan to get from Carbondale to Chattanooga as it is an App fan to get there from Boone. But SIU fans haven't been there, so they can't say much about it. That's nothing against the Salukis, of course - I'd love to see them win it all if App can't. Then they can talk about how convenient it is.

Really, almost anybody could talk about how convenient Chatty is. It's equally near/distant for pretty much everybody in the mean population center of the United States.

I drive 10-11 hours to Chattanooga, and I generally set my "drive to a game" cap at 14 hours. Almost every school in six conferences - MVFC, OVC, SoCon, Southland, MEAC, and CAA is within the 12-hour range.

The Big Sky is the only serious outlying conference, and Frisco is only about an hour closer to all those schools than Chattanooga is. Those folks would almost need to fly no matter where it's held.

[89Hen]

I drive 10-11 hours to Chattanooga, and I generally set my "drive to a game" cap at 14 hours. Almost every school in six conferences - MVFC, OVC, SoCon, Southland, MEAC, and CAA is within the 12-hour range.
I have mpls on ignore so I couldn't see his comment which is of course once again full of baseless opinion and no facts. He likes to ignore that a majority of the teams that have played in Chatty have driven there.

[ronpayne]

App fans can only be App fans, and can only speak from experience as App fans. And that experience includes several recent trips to Chattanooga.

It's just as easy for a Southern Illinois fan to get from Carbondale to Chattanooga as it is an App fan to get there from Boone. But SIU fans haven't been there, so they can't say much about it. That's nothing against the Salukis, of course - I'd love to see them win it all if App can't. Then they can talk about how convenient it is.

Really, almost anybody could talk about how convenient Chatty is. It's convenient for pretty much everybody in the mean population center of the United States.

I drive 10-11 hours to Chattanooga, and I generally set my "drive to a game" cap at 14 hours. Almost every school in six conferences - MVFC, OVC, SoCon, Southland, MEAC, and CAA is within the 12-hour range.

The Big Sky is the only serious outlying conference, and Frisco is only about an hour closer to all those schools than Chattanooga is. Those folks would almost need to fly no matter where it's held.

Thank you for explaining exactly my point. To the proponents of Frisco, how many schools are within 12 hour range of Frisco? Therein lies the problem I have with Frisco. I'm sure its wonderful, but who can afford to fly to get there?

[HiHiYikas]

I have mpls on ignore so I couldn't see his comment which is of course once again full of baseless opinion and no facts. He likes to ignore that a majority of the teams that have played in Chatty have driven there.
Yeah, the idea that App is among a small number of schools that can drive to Chattanooga is patently absurd.

I don't necessarily think proximity has to be the deciding factor, but it's a good thing to keep in mind. There's no place to put it that's close to everybody, though, so it might as well be about 8-12 hours from pretty much everybody.

Thank you for explaining exactly my point. To the proponents of Frisco, how many schools are within 12 hour range of Frisco? Therein lies the problem I have with Frisco. I'm sure its wonderful, but who can afford to fly to get there?
I don't know much about flying into Dallas. I wouldn't mind the game being near a relatively cheap airport, like, say, Atlanta. That's not really any closer than I am to Chatty, but I'd fly there because it would only cost me about $120.

Now, if I have to rent a car when I get there or take a 45 minute shuttle ride to some suburb, that's no good either. That's no good for anybody.

[Monarch History]

Thank you for explaining exactly my point. To the proponents of Frisco, how many schools are within 12 hour range of Frisco? Therein lies the problem I have with Frisco. I'm sure its wonderful, but who can afford to fly to get there?

That's the reason I favor Chattanooga!

[chattanoogamocs]

http://www.championshipsubdivisionnews.com/?disp=fcsmap

When you check out the map linked above, you can't see Chattanooga (if you expand it out to see the whole country), but I promise you, there is a "C" buried in the middle of all those FCS teams.

I can see "Dallas" just fine, no team close by to block the view. ;)

[HiHiYikas]

http://www.championshipsubdivisionnews.com/?disp=fcsmap

When you check out the map linked above, you can't see Chattanooga (if you expand it out to see the whole country), but I promise you, there is a "C" buried in the middle of all those FCS teams.

I can see "Dallas" just fine, no team close by to block the view. ;)
Yeah, that map makes it as clear as day.

You ever see that thing in the cartoons where everybody's beating on somebody, and it's one of those "cloud of smoke" fights, and the one who's supposed to be on the receiving end of the beating sneaks out of the pile away from everything?

In this case, "wandering out" might not be such a good thing.

[chattanoogamocs]

I was curious, so I checked out Mapquest...in the last 12 years only 3 schools would have a shorter drive to Frisco than to Chattanooga.

Montana to Frisco is 401 miles closer.

McNeese fans would be another big winner, it is 290 miles closer to Frisco than Chattanooga.

UNI is a "push", there is only a 19 mile difference between Frisco and Chattanooga.

[McTailGator]

http://www.friscomarketcenter.com

Although I would perfer it to be in Houston for a couple of reasons.

This place will do a good job and will probably be better than Chatty.

Look folks, I have been to Chatty twice and I loved it.

But this place will no doubt do a better job for the simple reason of resources and walking distance venues.


DFW and Love Field are also big a plus, especially if the SLC can get SW Airlines and or American to offer some deals.

Remember, there will be time for a 2 week advanced airfare with the NC game moving past the New Year.

[phillyAPP]

I was curious, so I checked out Mapquest...in the last 12 years only 3 schools would have a shorter drive to Frisco than to Chattanooga.

Montana to Frisco is 401 miles closer.

McNeese fans would be another big winner, it is 290 miles closer to Frisco than Chattanooga.

UNI is a "push", there is only a 19 mile difference between Frisco and Chattanooga.


12 years, nice job Moc. Now i know you will lose the NC game. The NCAA never does anything because it makes sense !!!!

Good luck anyway and Happy Thanksgiving. You all should be thankful for the gift of a very good coach in Chattanooga !!!

[chattanoogamocs]

I also find the whole argument that people will attend just because people in Texas are "football crazy."

There are no FCS teams near Dallas...and the best drawing FCS team in Texas this year drew 12,250...heck, Chattanooga averaged 10,500 this season.

I see evidence that Texas is Dallas Cowboy crazy and BCS football crazy and high school football crazy. But no one can "guarantee" (I always love it when fans "guarantee" something with zero empirical evidence) anyone in Dallas will give a crap about going to see two FCS teams that they don't specifically root for.

[chattanoogamocs]

12 years, nice job Moc. Now i know you will lose the NC game. The NCAA never does anything because it makes sense !!!!

Good luck anyway and Happy Thanksgiving. You all should be thankful for the gift of a very good coach in Chattanooga !!!

Thanks Philly, happy thanksgiving to you too...hope to see you guys in Chattanooga again this year.

[Dallas Demon]

I also find the whole argument that people will attend just because people in Texas are "football crazy."

There are no FCS teams near Dallas...and the best drawing FCS team in Texas this year drew 12,250...heck, Chattanooga averaged 10,500 this season.

I see evidence that Texas is Dallas Cowboy crazy and BCS football crazy and high school football crazy. But no one can "guarantee" (I always love it when fans "guarantee" something with zero empirical evidence) anyone in Dallas will give a crap about going to see two FCS teams that they don't specifically root for.

It's all about possibilities. Even if a very small percentage of the locals show up for the game it would be a sellout. You can't say that about Chattanooga, and the past numbers back that up.

Besides, driving distance for the average team that has made the playoffs in the past is probably down on the list of things being considered for making the switch I would bet. There's more to it like money and exposure, like it or not.

[Dallas Demon]

Thanks for completely ignoring the point. "Soccer" isn't the crux. xthumbsdownx

You're implying that because a soccer match wasn't attended well that a football game won't be attended well - there is absolutely no relationship with regards to attendance projections between the two.

This is obviously a religious argument, I'm sure all that can easily drive to Chattanooga will want to keep it there. If you have to fly, it is much easier to fly into DFW. Personally, I would go every year if it was moved to Frisco regardless of the teams participating and so would many people that I know in my neighborhood.

[89Hen]

It's all about possibilities. Even if a very small percentage of the locals show up for the game it would be a sellout. You can't say that about Chattanooga, and the past numbers back that up....

Personally, I would go every year if it was moved to Frisco regardless of the teams participating and so would many people that I know in my neighborhood
xnonono2x xnonono2x xnonono2x Rely on conjecture all you want and keep pretending to not understand the NCAA Championship arguement by saying "it's soccer". Cracks me up all the people that can guarantee sellouts, more support, better coverage, etc.... We can only rely on past experience with regards to having it someplace not close to either school (attendance SUCKED) or with a certain towns support of an NCAA Championship (not great).

[89Hen]

The statements that have no basis in reality that we've heard time and time again....


"I'd go if it were in X and so would a lot of other people."

"The locals would support it better than Chatty does."

"Chatty is lousy, dated, too hard to get to, etc..." from people who have never been.

[MplsBison]

App fans can only be App fans, and can only speak from experience as App fans. And that experience includes several recent trips to Chattanooga.

It's just as easy for a Southern Illinois fan to get from Carbondale to Chattanooga as it is an App fan to get there from Boone. But SIU fans haven't been there, so they can't say much about it. That's nothing against the Salukis, of course - I'd love to see them win it all if App can't. Then they can talk about how convenient it is.

Really, almost anybody could talk about how convenient Chatty is. It's equally near/distant for pretty much everybody in the mean population center of the United States.

I drive 10-11 hours to Chattanooga, and I generally set my "drive to a game" cap at 14 hours. Almost every school in six conferences - MVFC, OVC, SoCon, Southland, MEAC, and CAA is within the 12-hour range.

The Big Sky is the only serious outlying conference, and Frisco is only about an hour closer to all those schools than Chattanooga is. Those folks would almost need to fly no matter where it's held.

OK I give up, you win.

Chatty is a very good location.



I have two primary complaints with the game being in Chatty that can't be resolved without moving the game away from Chatty:

1 - game is being played in a current FCS team's home stadium. This prevents the game from being a truely neutral site.

Nothing you can say will change this, you can only choose to ignore it.


2 - the game isn't "big time" enough and can never be in a small, mountain town market like Chatty.

Dallas is one of the biggest markets in the US and smack-dab in the middle of the most football fanatic section of the US. The game can grow there.




For what it's worth.

[MplsBison]

xnonono2x xnonono2x xnonono2x Rely on conjecture all you want and keep pretending to not understand the NCAA Championship arguement by saying "it's soccer". Cracks me up all the people that can guarantee sellouts, more support, better coverage, etc.... We can only rely on past experience with regards to having it someplace not close to either school (attendance SUCKED) or with a certain towns support of an NCAA Championship (not great).

Soccer is a strawman argument.

You can not make a single, relevant conclusion about potential **FOOTBALL** attendance based on a different sport.

[MplsBison]

89 is by far the most staunch and fierce defender of Chatty.

Couple odd things about this:

- he's never given any details about how "great" his experiences have been that would lead to such a firey, religious defense of the location

- what is his true motivation? Is he a part-owner of a restaurant in Chatty or something? What does 89 stand to lose when the game eventually does move...?

[AppAlum2003]

It's all about possibilities. Even if a very small percentage of the locals show up for the game it would be a sellout. You can't say that about Chattanooga, and the past numbers back that up.

Besides, driving distance for the average team that has made the playoffs in the past is probably down on the list of things being considered for making the switch I would bet. There's more to it like money and exposure, like it or not.

Wait... I'm confused. Who is this game for? the fans of the teams present or for the locals? What good is the game with 80% locals and 20% fans of the teams? Proximity to the greatest number of schools should be #1 priority.

Although, I'm not sure why I just posted that because the only response I'll receive is "well, you just want it in Chatty because you're an ASU fan."

[FargoBison]

My favored location for the title game is Orlando, nice weather and easy/cheap to fly into. I don't really care if the city would roll out the red carpet, that location is ideal.

Getting back to this debate, I think Frisco should be given a chance. What is the risk? It isn't like the NCAA is signing a lifetime contract, it will be a three year deal and if it fails move on to somewhere else.

I don't think any city should be given the game just because that is where it has been for a while. I do think the people out west need to be represented in this debate. Chatty is neither cheap nor easy to get to. Dallas is and I'm sure there are other eastern locations that would be easier to fly into.

[HiHiYikas]

1 - game is being played in a current FCS team's home stadium. This prevents the game from being a truely neutral site.

Nothing you can say will change this, you can only choose to ignore it.

2 - the game isn't "big time" enough and can never be in a small, mountain town market like Chatty.

Dallas is one of the biggest markets in the US and smack-dab in the middle of the most football fanatic section of the US. The game can grow there.
Those are actually cogent arguments.

Like I said, I don't know that the NCAA is interested in central proximity when it comes to picking a location. If that's their top priority, Chattanooga is about as good as it gets.

If they're looking for an honest-to-goodness neutral site, they could do better than Chattanooga. If they're looking to break into a bigger market, they could probably do better than Chattanooga. The problem comes when you move the game farther away from your core market. Seems like a pretty foolish thing to do to risk alienating a hard-core CAA fan in hopes of courting a disengaged Dallas-area football fan.

I don't know what the committee is thinking, so I can't say what their priorities are. I would be interested in knowing their criteria.

With no real way to calculate it, I would guess that tens of thousands of people who actually follow championship football teams would be less likely to attend the game in Dallas than in Chattanooga.

FargoBison makes a good point, too - while Chattanooga is relatively easy for the majority of FCS football teams to get to, there are some places that are just far away from everything. There's no decent place to have the game that's an easy drive for Big Sky fans. But it could at least be in a place that's cheaper to fly into. Someplace with something larger than a regional airport.

[MplsBison]

It would take a pretty bitter person to refuse going to the NC game just because it was in Frisco, instead of Chatty. 89 is the only one that immediately comes to mind (good, don't want him there).

[HiHiYikas]

It would take a pretty bitter person to refuse going to the NC game just because it was in Frisco, instead of Chatty. 89 is the only one that immediately comes to mind (good, don't want him there).
What makes you think bitterness has anything to do with it? That's a pretty foolish conclusion you're jumping to, there.

Load a car with four fans, drive 7 to 10 hours - that's something like 3 or 4 tanks of gas for the round trip, more or less. That's maybe $150 in gas, split 4 ways. And you can pack your grill, your cooler, and your tailgate tent.

Turn it into a must-fly location, such as Dallas is for lots and lots of teams North and East of Chattanooga - those same four fans have to drive an hour and a half to the airport, pay $175 for each plane ticket (if you're lucky enough to fly on Airtran or Jetblue), $15 a pop for checked bags, $100 for the extra night in the hotel, $50 for shuttle from the airport. You don't get to take your grill. You don't get to take your cooler.

So a trip you can do for around $150 a fan turns into something like $500-$600 per fan. That's going to prevent some fans from being able to go.

[MplsBison]

I don't see that applying to many people in the long run.

95% of people going to the game were either going to fly anyway or drive anyway, and this wouldn't change that.


Certainly not 10k fans being put out.

[McTailGator]

What makes you think bitterness has anything to do with it? That's a pretty foolish conclusion you're jumping to, there.

Load a car with four fans, drive 7 to 10 hours - that's something like 3 or 4 tanks of gas for the round trip, more or less. That's maybe $150 in gas, split 4 ways. And you can pack your grill, your cooler, and your tailgate tent.

Turn it into a must-fly location, such as Dallas is for lots and lots of teams North and East of Chattanooga - those same four fans have to drive an hour and a half to the airport, pay $175 for each plane ticket (if you're lucky enough to fly on Airtran or Jetblue), $15 a pop for checked bags, $100 for the extra night in the hotel, $50 for shuttle from the airport. You don't get to take your grill. You don't get to take your cooler.

So a trip you can do for around $150 a fan turns into something like $500-$600 per fan. That's going to prevent some fans from being able to go.



Whoa Nelly!


Lake Charles is a good 13 hour drive from Chatty,

Many of our Alumni (including myself live in Houston, so add another 3 hours on to that (16 hrs).

Now except for Georgia Southern, and App State, NO ONE ELSE has come close to the 8K - 10K McNeese has brought to that game in 97 and 02.

And we did that by loading in a car and driving for an entire day. And by Chartering Jets. and paying last minute airfares.

So the bottom line is, if you are any fan loves their team, they will be there REGARDLESS OF THE TIME OR EXPENSE!

Dallas, and the extra 2 weeks between the Semi's and the NC Game now offer an opportunity for a 2 week advanced airfare on at least two major airlines that have hubs in Dallas (American and Southwest). And the very fact that SW is there, many other airlines meet or beat their prices.

FRISCO will be no different for the fans, and this game will be sold out even if Geo Southern, App State, or McNeese don't play in the finals. BECAUSE THE COMMUNITY WILL SUPPORT IT NO MATTER WHAT.

Hell, I'll drive up to see the game now, regardless of who is in it. I need a reason to go visit our offices about 5 miles away anyway.

[HiHiYikas]

Whoa Nelly!


Lake Charles is a good 13 hour drive from Chatty,

Many of our Alumni (including myself live in Houston, so add another 3 hours on to that (16 hrs).

Now except for Georgia Southern, and App State, NO ONE ELSE has come close to the 8K - 10K McNeese has brought to that game in 97 and 02.

And we did that by loading in a car and driving for an entire day. And by Chartering Jets. and paying last minute airfares.

So the bottom line is, if you are any fan loves their team, they will be there REGARDLESS OF THE TIME OR EXPENSE!

Dallas, and the extra 2 weeks between the Semi's and the NC Game now offer an opportunity for a 2 week advanced airfare on at least two major airlines that have hubs in Dallas (American and Southwest). And the very fact that SW is there, many other airlines meet or beat their prices.

FRISCO will be no different for the fans, and this game will be sold out even if Geo Southern, App State, or McNeese don't play in the finals. BECAUSE THE COMMUNITY WILL SUPPORT IT NO MATTER WHAT.

Hell, I'll drive up to see the game now, regardless of who is in it. I need a reason to go visit our offices about 5 miles away anyway.
The idea that spending more money to follow your team means you love your team more is a fallacy, plain and simple. Some folks just don't have an extra $600 or a couple extra days off to use on entertainment.

I'm not voicing my opinion here, just stating some facts. None of us can predict what will happen if they move it to Frisco. I'm not even saying it shouldn't be in Frisco. I'm just looking at a map, a list of airline fares, and drawing from previous travel experience. I'm trying, as best I can, to keep speculation out of my arguments (I wish I could expect the same from others).

It is a fact that a majority of FCS teams are farther from Dallas than Chattanooga. It is a fact that dramatically higher costs will discourage some people from going.

[McTailGator]

The idea that spending more money to follow your team means you love your team more is a fallacy, plain and simple. Some folks just don't have an extra $600 or a couple extra days off to use on entertainment.

I'm not voicing my opinion here, just stating some facts. None of us can predict what will happen if they move it to Frisco. I'm not even saying it shouldn't be in Frisco. I'm just looking at a map, a list of airline fares, and drawing from previous travel experience. I'm trying, as best I can, to keep speculation out of my arguments (I wish I could expect the same from others).

It is a fact that a majority of FCS teams are farther from Dallas than Chattanooga. It is a fact that dramatically higher costs will discourage some people from going.


MY POINT IS:

Dallas will not cost any more than Chatty.


And the time thing will be quite different after the new year anyway.

I don't quite have that figured out yet myself. I take 2 weeks off starting the day before the NC game in every December and go back to work just after New Years.

I guess the new schedule will just start eating into my new years vacation and holiday time.

[Cincy App]

MY POINT IS:

Dallas will not cost any more than Chatty.




It costs substantially more to fly than to drive to a game. In an average year, more participating team fans can drive to Chattanooga than to Dallas. As a result, Dallas costs much more than Chattanooga.

I prefer Chattanooga for selfish reasons although a move to Dallas would have some advantages. For instance, it would be much easier for an ASU fan to get tickets!

[NSUDemon98]

As I said in a previous thread about this, they always say someplace "is a nice place to visit but I'd never want to live there".... I'm guessing Frisco is the opposite... a nice place to live, but I wouldn't want to visit there. xpeacex

You really are going a little overboard with this and is boarder line offensive. I've never been to Delaware but you won't find me bashing it. My parents live in Flower Mound, Tx(Lewisville) and is about 10 minutes down the road on 121 and I like the Frisco area. I would much rather live around here than in rural East Texas where I currently live.

[DFW HOYA]

One thing to consider as well: there is no I-AA awareness in the DFW area. There hasn't been a I-AA program in the area since North Texas left for the Sun Belt a decade ago, and the closest I-AA school to Frisco is SFA (200 miles south)

By 2011 there will be three bowls in the local area, so the NCAA has to promote this, otherwise it'll be be lost in translation.

[89Hen]

It would take a pretty bitter person to refuse going to the NC game just because it was in Frisco, instead of Chatty. 89 is the only one that immediately comes to mind (good, don't want him there).
xnonono2x Yet again providing further example of why having you on ignore is a good thing. You can't understand arguements, you jump to conclusions and you speak out your arse.

All it would take somebody to not go to Frisco is if they had to fly where they could have otherwise driven. Same goes for any location vs to one they could have driven. A person from SFA might drive and go to Frisco, but decide they can't/won't fly to Chatty.

The discussion here is Chatty vs Frisco. I have nothing against Frisco. I just don't see it as being a better option than Chatty.

As for seeing me at the NC... I've been. Have you?

[89Hen]

You really are going a little overboard with this and is boarder line offensive. I've never been to Delaware but you won't find me bashing it. My parents live in Flower Mound, Tx(Lewisville) and is about 10 minutes down the road on 121 and I like the Frisco area. I would much rather live around here than in rural East Texas where I currently live.
Saying it's a nice place to live is borderline offensive? If so, you have thin skin. xeyebrowx

[89Hen]

It costs substantially more to fly than to drive to a game. In an average year, more participating team fans can drive to Chattanooga than to Dallas. As a result, Dallas costs much more than Chattanooga.

I prefer Chattanooga for selfish reasons although a move to Dallas would have some advantages. For instance, it would be much easier for an ASU fan to get tickets!
Highest attended NC games have been when it's near at least one of the teams very close by. Lowest attendance has been when both teams and fans had to fly. This isn't rocket science.

[89Hen]

FRISCO will be no different for the fans, and this game will be sold out even if Geo Southern, App State, or McNeese don't play in the finals. BECAUSE THE COMMUNITY WILL SUPPORT IT NO MATTER WHAT.

Hell, I'll drive up to see the game now, regardless of who is in it. I need a reason to go visit our offices about 5 miles away anyway.
Another empty promise. xcoffeex

[appheel]

I just don't get the reasoning for Frisco. What difference does it make if the game is sold out by locals, if hardly any of the fans of the two teams playing can afford to go? Yeah, the NCAA still makes money off attendance, but the atmosphere of the game will be terrible because nobody there will give a crap who wins. And as an App fan, of course Chatty is more convenient for me. But apparently it was also pretty covenient for the thousands Delaware, UMass and UNI fans at the three games I've been to.

[FargoBison]

I just don't get the reasoning for Frisco. What difference does it make if the game is sold out by locals, if hardly any of the fans of the two teams playing can afford to go? Yeah, the NCAA still makes money off attendance, but the atmosphere of the game will be terrible because nobody there will give a crap who wins. And as an App fan, of course Chatty is more convenient for me. But apparently it was also pretty covenient for the thousands Delaware, UMass and UNI fans at the three games I've been to.

Frisco is an hour shorter drive and much cheaper/easier flight for UNI than Chatty. This argument of getting to Dallas is a bit ridiculous when those of us out west have to use a small regional airport at Chatty. People out east will get to fly into a major airport if the game is at Frisco.

[CatMom07]

Just some minor clarifications. Frisco is where SLC headquarters is located. TXST is 253 miles while SAM and SFA are both at 201.

I think a lot of you underestimate the SLC fans/alum and those that would attend. Those folks would pick sides, so there wouldn't be a lack of "fans" rooting for one team or the other, whomever it may be. I know I'd go and bring others with me...though I am 46 miles closer than TXST itself.

I understand the "most of the teams are east of the Mississippi" argument. I understand the weather argument. I also am from NJ originally and I'll take TX in January over TN, any day.

It won't hurt for the game to be moved around, other than folks arguing about their expenses. I can't go to a NC game now because I can't afford it, either. And I'd love to, no matter who the teams are. So, what will it hurt to let others, like SLC fans that may not even have a stake, afford to actually attend once in a while? I can drive 253 miles in less than 4 hours and find a hotel to stay in fairly inexpensively (or my nephews place.) I can't afford airfare, a rental car and a hotel in Chatty.

It may get back to Chatty (assuming it went to Frisco) eventually and I won't be able to get there, again.

Whichever city get's it will have earned it and best of luck to both.

So, now I'm rambling and I best end this. Not arguing one way or the other, just adding my perspective

BTW - HS playoffs will be over and the Cowboys won't get into the playoffs, so those are non-issues. xnodx

[89Hen]

Just some minor clarifications. Frisco is where SLC headquarters is located. TXST is 253 miles while SAM and SFA are both at 201.

I think a lot of you underestimate the SLC fans/alum and those that would attend. Those folks would pick sides, so there wouldn't be a lack of "fans" rooting for one team or the other, whomever it may be. I know I'd go and bring others with me...though I am 46 miles closer than TXST itself.
More empty promises. No offense, but I'd make a bet that less than 50% of the people who said "I'd go to the game no matter who is playing." would acutally go.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the Southern Conference all around Chatty and don't they have similar, if not better, fan bases than the Southland?


1. Appalachian St. 25,161
5. Ga. Southern 18,168
14. McNeese St. 13,829
19. Citadel 12,261
23. Texas St. 11,225
29. Sam Houston St. 10,076
30. Furman 10,073
43. Northwestern St. 8,615
44. Stephen F. Austin 8,577
47. Western Caro. 8,320

What makes you think the Southland would support the game better than the SoCon? The truth is, NEITHER would support it if their team is not in the game.

[MR. CHICKEN]

IF YER GOIN' TA SAN FRANCISCO......BE SURE TA WEAR.....UH...ER...UMMM......:o.....NAH!

[MplsBison]

Does anyone really think for a second that the NCAA awarded the game to Chatty because it was going to be the easiest for most people to drive there?

The NCAA gave the game to Chatty because they figured they could make the most money there.


The same will happen this time. The NCAA will award the game to the site that can get the NCAA the most money.




Does anyone else have anything new to add? I don't think so. Everyone knows where everyone else is at.

No one is budging.


You have the group that thinks new sites are acceptable and that a new location should get a chance.

You have the group that refuses to listen to any reason why moving the game away from Chatty could ever result in anything good.



Enough. Done.

End this thread.

[Saint3333]

Anyone have a seating chart for the Frisco stadium? As it is a soccer stadium I would imagine the endzone seating would be greater, another negative vs. a football stadium.

[SumItUp]

Anyone have a seating chart for the Frisco stadium? As it is a soccer stadium I would imagine the endzone seating would be greater, another negative vs. a football stadium.

It won't be a negative. The stadium is a first class facility.

View Seating Chart (http://www.pizzahutpark.com/Home/TheStadium/SeatingChart/tabid/105/Default.aspx)

[AppAlum2003]

Awesome... I can see the Marquee right now:

TONIGHT: MILEY CYRUS
TOMORROW NIGHT: SOME JV FOOTBALL GAME (when does high school football start back up?)

[Saint3333]

It won't be a negative. The stadium is a first class facility.

View Seating Chart (http://www.pizzahutpark.com/Home/TheStadium/SeatingChart/tabid/105/Default.aspx)

I'm sure it is, but for football games the best seats are on the 50 yard line, the worst are in the endzone. It seats less than Nooga and they don't have any permanent endzone seating so guess which one has better seating for football? It looks like almost 1/3 of the seats would be worse.

[Monarch History]

Any news on location of NC game next year?

[FCS_pwns_FBS]

Frisco makes no sense. The fan bases of App. State, GSU, Delaware, JMU, and other east coast powers will not travel better to Frisco than Chattanooga.

Moving it to Frisco will hurt attendance. The only way it might not is if you have two teams east of the Mississippi playing for the NC, but we haven't had that since, what, 1994?

[whoanellie]

w/ championship game moving to "Bowl Week" it ought to be played in a warmer area. no one wants an icebowl final. step up Tampa Area.

[BEAR]

Not that anyone on this board wants to connect with the FBS, but since it's for the national championship in NCAA football Division I, wouldn't it be best if it were played in the same stadium as the FBS bowl championship? Maybe the morning of and make the fbs game the night of? Just an idea. xcoffeex

[FargoBison]

w/ championship game moving to "Bowl Week" it ought to be played in a warmer area. no one wants an icebowl final. step up Tampa Area.

I am all for Orlando, cheap airfare to there from Fargo.

[Horseshoe App]

Not that anyone on this board wants to connect with the FBS, but since it's for the national championship in NCAA football Division I, wouldn't it be best if it were played in the same stadium as the FBS bowl championship? Maybe the morning of and make the fbs game the night of? Just an idea. xcoffeex

I do not think that would be a good idea. Not only logistics of the game, but the overall expense involved. Imagine if the FBS championship game is the Rose Bowl and Richmond-ASU is our championship. We might have 5000 people in a 100,000 seat venue. We would look like total chumps. Just my thoughts on the situation.

[Spiderbone]

I think you will see attendance go down SIGNIFICANTLY by moving it to a place like Frisco. Reasons..

1-It is in the middle of nowhere-nobody from any school in FCS can reasonably drive there, I don't see a large student population forking over a bunch of cash to fly out to Texas in December before XMAS (if it stays on that date) or in January if it moves.

2-It is outside the major popluation base of FCS schools.

--28 of 31 of the Championships in FCS football since 1978 have been from schools East of the Mississippi
--25 of 31 of those champs were in the eastern time zone.
--21 of 31 of the runner-ups were from East of the Mississippi.

Good luck getting anyone from the SoCon, CAA, Patriot, etc to get out there. Look at the fiasco this year with all the snow storms! ugh. I think it is good for the schools out west though for obvious reasons, it is closer to them.

3-It is in Texas....in the high plains...pretty boring. There is NO lure for fans to just GO to the Championship game just to be there (not that Chatty was either, you would think they would pick a place in Florida, Coast of Georgia, Even the Gulf Coast of Texas, or California....to Draw people there for more than the game.

4-Who cares about size of the stadium, a dome would be great to play a championship in even if it was in a cool city.

5-They have no experience in hosting a game.

Don't get me wrong Chatty wasn't a Glamorous venue either but it was convenient for many fans. Inevitably it was always cold and rainy, I mean come on who plays a championship game every year in the mountains of tennessee in December...

Bottom line.....Expect the NCAA to LOSE money and attendance to go down if it goes to Frisco...You will get die hard fans only but NOT general fans.

It will help the Montanas of the FCS, but they travel well anyway, it will hurt attendance at all of the other schools/conferences that tend to be in the championship.

[Wildcat80]

Frisco too far and in worst time zone! What about the warm south????

[3PeatNation]

i would hope someday they would place it near south florida, i'd love to watch a game there

[McNeese75]

There are a lot of pretty weak arguments on here for not having the game in Frisco xeyebrowx. Why not just move the game to Maine or Northeastern's campus (neutral site now) then all the East Coast FCS population would be happy I guess xcoolx

[State Line Liquors]

America's Safest Cities (http://www.walletpop.com/mortgages/safest-cities)

Found Frisco on this list earlier today. It's an interesting comparison to some of those who've mentioned that they don't feel very safe on some streets in Chatty.

[Big Dawg]

The game should be in Orlando.

[jmufan999]

The game should be in Orlando.

you know what, i'm actually ok with that.

and spiderbone, you made some unbelievable points. i totally agree with you on all of them. i think it's kind of ridiculous to have the game there, but on the other hand... i'd probably still go there if JMU made it back to the NC game. i'd probably go just about anywhere. still, it'd be nice if it were closer, just for selfish reasons.

but having it in Florida in December... i can TOTALLY see that. actually, the more i think about it, the better that sounds. can we make it SOUTH Florida though? man, that would actually be pretty sweet. Many of us would fly there, but who cares, with that kind of weather awaiting...

[GeauxColonels]

Frisco too far and in worst time zone! What about the warm south????
"In worst time zone" WTF does that mean? It's in the central time zone, one hour behind eastern.

I'm not saying that I would prefer it there because I don't think I would. But come up with a better argument against it.

[WVAPPmountaineer]

Actually, the perfect place for this game would be Charleston - refurbished stadium - destination city - great restaurants - great history - the beach and home to FCS football with The Citadel - weather is usually decent in Charleston in the winter - But I guess that is just not going to happen ----

[DFW HOYA]

I think you will see attendance go down SIGNIFICANTLY by moving it to a place like Frisco. Reasons..

1-It is in the middle of nowhere-nobody from any school in FCS can reasonably drive there, I don't see a large student population forking over a bunch of cash to fly out to Texas in December before XMAS (if it stays on that date) or in January if it moves.

And that same group would pay twice as much to get into Chattanooga?



2-It is outside the major popluation base of FCS schools.
--28 of 31 of the Championships in FCS football since 1978 have been from schools East of the Mississippi
--25 of 31 of those champs were in the eastern time zone.
--21 of 31 of the runner-ups were from East of the Mississippi.

Good luck getting anyone from the SoCon, CAA, Patriot, etc to get out there. Look at the fiasco this year with all the snow storms! ugh. I think it is good for the schools out west though for obvious reasons, it is closer to them.

Then why not hold the event in Boone?



3-It is in Texas....in the high plains...pretty boring. There is NO lure for fans to just GO to the Championship game just to be there (not that Chatty was either, you would think they would pick a place in Florida, Coast of Georgia, Even the Gulf Coast of Texas, or California....to Draw people there for more than the game.

Frisco is about 400 miles east of the high plains. What has more lure, the 4th largest metropolitan area in the US... or Chattanooga?



4-Who cares about size of the stadium, a dome would be great to play a championship in even if it was in a cool city.

Outside of UNI, any takers?



5-They have no experience in hosting a game.

Aside from hosting numerous soccer games, concerts, the MLS All-Star game, and the NCAA soccer championships, no experience.




Bottom line.....Expect the NCAA to LOSE money and attendance to go down if it goes to Frisco...You will get die hard fans only but NOT general fans.

I actually agree with this. An event like this can get lost in a metro region that will have three I-A bowls by 2011. However, the solution is to rotate the game across 4-5 sites: Chattanooga, Norfolk, Frisco, Las Vegas, Portland all come to mind with comparably sized facilities. I'd add a recomemndation for Princeton Stadium as well.

[Pards Rule]

Fort Myers would be a great venue :)

[danefan]

You can name all the cities in the world but you are guys are missing the big point here:

Frisco and Chatty are the only two cities that actually want the game bad enough to put a bid high enough to be finalists.

There are prob. 30 locations that would be better for fans, but the fact is those cities don't want the game.

Chatty does.
Frisco does.

That's the choice. There is no other option.


And, BTW, the announcement will come in March. Final presentations are made in February.

[jstclmet]

Did anybody watch the "Music City Bowl" in Nashville last night??? The folks in the stands looked like the Michelin Tire Man the way they were wrapped up in all of their cold weather gear. If the NC game is in Chatty during that first week of Jan, the weather will undoubtedly be far worse than it usually is on that 3rd Fri in Dec.

Any place warm or indoors has to be a step in the right direction.

[UAalum72]

Fort Myers would be a great venue :)
What venue? Other than the Twins' and Red Sox spring training stadiums (too small) there are no outdoor facilities worth mentioning.

If Florida Gulf Coast ever starts up football, then maybe you could bring up Lee County.

Weather's great in January, though.

[bluehenbillk]

My parents snowbird in Ft Myers, about 5 min from the new Red Sox spring training site. Can't complain about the weatjer there.

I see that FGCU now has a D-1 top 20 baseball team, its only a matter of time for them to play football.

I vote for Frisco.

[GaSouthern]

Actually, the perfect place for this game would be Charleston - refurbished stadium - destination city - great restaurants - great history - the beach and home to FCS football with The Citadel - weather is usually decent in Charleston in the winter - But I guess that is just not going to happen ----

I completely agree

[Bronco]

You can name all the cities in the world but you are guys are missing the big point here:

Frisco and Chatty are the only two cities that actually want the game bad enough to put a bid high enough to be finalists.

There are prob. 30 locations that would be better for fans, but the fact is those cities don't want the game.

Chatty does.
Frisco does.

That's the choice. There is no other option.


And, BTW, the announcement will come in March. Final presentations are made in February.

Thank you...
The only time to name new cities is when it comes up for a bid again...and then they need to bid...Otherwise it's a total waste of time.

I also appreciate the time line you listed...good information

[onbison09]

I think you will see attendance go down SIGNIFICANTLY by moving it to a place like Frisco. Reasons..

1-It is in the middle of nowhere-nobody from any school in FCS can reasonably drive there, I don't see a large student population forking over a bunch of cash to fly out to Texas in December before XMAS (if it stays on that date) or in January if it moves.

2-It is outside the major popluation base of FCS schools.

--28 of 31 of the Championships in FCS football since 1978 have been from schools East of the Mississippi
--25 of 31 of those champs were in the eastern time zone.
--21 of 31 of the runner-ups were from East of the Mississippi.

Good luck getting anyone from the SoCon, CAA, Patriot, etc to get out there. Look at the fiasco this year with all the snow storms! ugh. I think it is good for the schools out west though for obvious reasons, it is closer to them.

3-It is in Texas....in the high plains...pretty boring. There is NO lure for fans to just GO to the Championship game just to be there (not that Chatty was either, you would think they would pick a place in Florida, Coast of Georgia, Even the Gulf Coast of Texas, or California....to Draw people there for more than the game.

4-Who cares about size of the stadium, a dome would be great to play a championship in even if it was in a cool city.

5-They have no experience in hosting a game.

Don't get me wrong Chatty wasn't a Glamorous venue either but it was convenient for many fans. Inevitably it was always cold and rainy, I mean come on who plays a championship game every year in the mountains of tennessee in December...

Bottom line.....Expect the NCAA to LOSE money and attendance to go down if it goes to Frisco...You will get die hard fans only but NOT general fans.

It will help the Montanas of the FCS, but they travel well anyway, it will hurt attendance at all of the other schools/conferences that tend to be in the championship.
Yeah it's in the Dallas Metroplex.

[sharkeycox]

Frisco makes no sense. The fan bases of App. State, GSU, Delaware, JMU, and other east coast powers will not travel better to Frisco than Chattanooga.

Moving it to Frisco will hurt attendance. The only way it might not is if you have two teams east of the Mississippi playing for the NC, but we haven't had that since, what, 1994?

Maybe next yearxcoffeex

[19Duke97]

Moving it to Texas would cause a "Friasco". Haha. Seriously though, anyone who claims about better weather there has never been to Northern Texas in January. Gray, brown, and flat, with a cold wind, and a good chance of ice- hmmm sounds like a blast.

[UNH Fanboi]

Moving it to Texas would cause a "Friasco". Haha. Seriously though, anyone who claims about better weather there has never been to Northern Texas in January. Gray, brown, and flat, with a cold wind, and a good chance of ice- hmmm sounds like a blast.

The weather in Frisco in January is, on average, better than in Chatty. It's not much better, but it's indisputably better assuming that warmer and drier is better:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chattanooga,_Tennessee (scroll down to climate)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Climate_of_Dallas

[JDC325]

The game should be in Orlando.

Certainly beats Chatt and Friscoe.

[Pards Rule]

What venue? Other than the Twins' and Red Sox spring training stadiums (too small) there are no outdoor facilities worth mentioning.

If Florida Gulf Coast ever starts up football, then maybe you could bring up Lee County.

Weather's great in January, though.

thats what I thought they were doing at FGCU in the next year...Its technically in Estero I know but I said Ft Myers cause not too many people know of Estero.

[DX Man]

Actually, the perfect place for this game would be Charleston - refurbished stadium - destination city - great restaurants - great history - the beach and home to FCS football with The Citadel - weather is usually decent in Charleston in the winter - But I guess that is just not going to happen ----


Great location!

I think Orlando would be a great location also, but the game would get more attention in Charleston because it wouldn't be competing with so many other entertainment options.

[19Duke97]

The weather in Frisco in January is, on average, better than in Chatty. It's not much better, but it's indisputably better assuming that warmer and drier is better:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chattanooga,_Tennessee (scroll down to climate)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Climate_of_Dallas

Not sure how much water 5 degrees (roughly) holds water. I think I saw a comparison to Florida. Point is, the weather is not great. If weather was motivation, then neither of these sites should have been be up for bids. Either way, I still prefer Nooga, for many reasons beyond weather. xpeacex

[ngineer]

Moving it to Texas would cause a "Friasco". Haha. Seriously though, anyone who claims about better weather there has never been to Northern Texas in January. Gray, brown, and flat, with a cold wind, and a good chance of ice- hmmm sounds like a blast.

No question about that. When Lehigh beat Jacksonville State for the D-II Championship in 1977, the game was played at Wichita Falls, Texas. The weather was brutal. Pictures from the game show everyone bundled up. HC Whitehead looked like Nanook of the North on the sideline.xnodx

[onbison09]

No question about that. When Lehigh beat Jacksonville State for the D-II Championship in 1977, the game was played at Wichita Falls, Texas. The weather was brutal. Pictures from the game show everyone bundled up. HC Whitehead looked like Nanook of the North on the sideline.xnodx

Wichita Falls is quite a bit north of Frisco. Usually a couple degrees colder.

[JohnStOnge]

If they award bids on the basis of proximity to either the largest number of schools overall or to places where teams that have made the championship game have come from it'll stay in Chattanooga. By my count 25 percent of the teams that have historically been to the title game have been from west of the Mississippi River. Also, by my count, about 26 percent of the schools with FCS programs that would potentially participate in the playoffs are west of the Mississippi.

But, hopefully, proximity to the largest number of schools is not a major factor. If it is that would put most of the country in terms of area at a disadvantage.

[CSN-info]

There have been 64 participants in the history of the D-I championship game. Many several times.

45 (70.3%) of the participants are from East of the Mississippi (17 teams), 19 (29.7%) West (11 teams).

Approx. 75% of the FCS is East of the Mississippi and only a few schools are more than one State away from the Mississippi in the West.

EAST
Appalachian St.
Appalachian St.
Appalachian St.
Colgate
Delaware
Delaware
Delaware
Eastern Ky.
Eastern Ky.
Eastern Ky.
Eastern Ky.
Florida A&M
Furman
Furman
Furman
Ga. Southern
Ga. Southern
Ga. Southern
Ga. Southern
Ga. Southern
Ga. Southern
Ga. Southern
Ga. Southern
James Madison
Lehigh
Marshall
Marshall
Marshall
Marshall
Marshall
Marshall
Massachusetts
Massachusetts
Massachusetts
Richmond
Southern Ill.
Villanova
Western Caro.
Western Ky.
Youngstown St.
Youngstown St.
Youngstown St.
Youngstown St.
Youngstown St.
Youngstown St.

WEST
Arkansas St.
Boise St.
Boise St.
Idaho St.
La.-Monroe
Louisiana Tech
McNeese St.
McNeese St.
Montana
Montana
Montana
Montana
Montana
Montana
Montana
Montana St.
Nevada
S. F. Austin
UNI

[doolittledog]

How many places submitted bids?

If it is down to Chatty and Frisco, then the NCAA felt those were the two best bids. Chatty has experiance hosting the final, know how to run a good show, and have a nice stadium. Frisco has experiance running the Dallas Cup and MLS Cup, know how to run a good show, and have a nice stadium. Both will do fine if they get the bid.

If the people that run the FIU stadium in Miami, or Lockhart Stadium in Ft. Lauderdale, or the UCF stadium in Orlando want to host the game. Or any other place in a warm weather locale, then they need to submit a bid. Otherwise, our choices are Chatty and Frisco. And both of those options are pretty decent places.

[texcap]

Wichita Falls is quite a bit north of Frisco. Usually a couple degrees colder.

Wichita Falls is only about 50 miles North of Frisco. It is hhowever about 90 miles west of Frisco. The weather in Wichita Falls will be somewhaat similar to Frisco.

[CollegeSportsInfo]

How many places submitted bids?

If it is down to Chatty and Frisco, then the NCAA felt those were the two best bids. Chatty has experiance hosting the final, know how to run a good show, and have a nice stadium. Frisco has experiance running the Dallas Cup and MLS Cup, know how to run a good show, and have a nice stadium. Both will do fine if they get the bid.

If the people that run the FIU stadium in Miami, or Lockhart Stadium in Ft. Lauderdale, or the UCF stadium in Orlando want to host the game. Or any other place in a warm weather locale, then they need to submit a bid. Otherwise, our choices are Chatty and Frisco. And both of those options are pretty decent places.

I hear ya. It's too bad no Florida cities submitted bids. The fans of FCS schools would be so much better off if the championship game was in a desirable location. In the past, us fans have had 1 week to book a trip to see out team play in the final. And regardless of if you are living in Boston, NY, Des Moines, Missoula or LA, Chattanooga is hardly the ideal destination. They've been a fine host. But if you are a fan of an FCS team and traveling for the game, a better location would be ideal. At least in FL, you have things to do in addition to the game and bring the family to enjoy.

[Ud1Hens]

I cannot speak for anyone else so I'll give my personal story as small as it may be. In 2007 when Delaware went to the title game, myself and 9 friends got in a couple of cars and drove the 12 hours to Chatty on Thursday night. We piled into 2 hotel rooms, brought some tailgating food and liquid essentials and had a friggin' blast. Yeah, we lost, but my point is that 10 students were able to make it to see their school play for the National Title for under $100 a person (gas, hotel, food, beer, tickets, etc.). If the game was in Dallas, my 9 friends and I would not have been able to afford round trip plane tickets, game tickets, rental car (which we'd be too young to rent anyway), etc. the week of Christmas.

I understand that students are wayyy down on the totem poles in terms of game location but I wonder how many fans that were students of recent FCS Championship team participants could afford the trip?

[CollegeSportsInfo]

I cannot speak for anyone else so I'll give my personal story as small as it may be. In 2007 when Delaware went to the title game, myself and 9 friends got in a couple of cars and drove the 12 hours to Chatty on Thursday night. We piled into 2 hotel rooms, brought some tailgating food and liquid essentials and had a friggin' blast. Yeah, we lost, but my point is that 10 students were able to make it to see their school play for the National Title for under $100 a person (gas, hotel, food, beer, tickets, etc.). If the game was in Dallas, my 9 friends and I would not have been able to afford round trip plane tickets, game tickets, rental car (which we'd be too young to rent anyway), etc. the week of Christmas.

I understand that students are wayyy down on the totem poles in terms of game location but I wonder how many fans that were students of recent FCS Championship team participants could afford the trip?

Luckily the good folks in Montana are used to drives that long since they are so isolated compared to the east coasters.

[odubum]

I agree that I don't think folks would travel as much to Frisco as they would Chattanooga. Still, Texas is a state where football is huge and maybe Texans would sell the game out. If so the NCAA would still get there money so in the end they probably wouldn't care that more locals were there than actual team fans. Cash is king and as long as the NCAA gets theirs I don't think they will be concerned as to the make-up in the stands.

[putter]

Does it make a lot of difference? This year you had Villanova - Montana and what, 14,000 showed up. The location only works if both teams are in close proximity because if it did not then more eastern FCS fans would have shown up to support the game.

[JohnStOnge]

Does it make a lot of difference? This year you had Villanova - Montana and what, 14,000 showed up. The location only works if both teams are in close proximity because if it did not then more eastern FCS fans would have shown up to support the game.

If all they cared about was attendance they could just hold the championship game at the home field of one of the participants. At the extreme they could wait and see who's going to be in the final game then pick the home field based on which school is likely to draw the biggest home crowd.

But it's supposed to be a neutral site. It's been held in the same basic region for 21 years in a row now. It was in Statesboro, Georgia 1989 - 1991, in Huntington, West Virginia 1992- 1996, then it was in Chattanooga 1997 - 2009. Nothing wrong with moving it to a different region for a while.

[GOKATS]

I cannot speak for anyone else so I'll give my personal story as small as it may be. In 2007 when Delaware went to the title game, myself and 9 friends got in a couple of cars and drove the 12 hours to Chatty on Thursday night. We piled into 2 hotel rooms, brought some tailgating food and liquid essentials and had a friggin' blast. Yeah, we lost, but my point is that 10 students were able to make it to see their school play for the National Title for under $100 a person (gas, hotel, food, beer, tickets, etc.). If the game was in Dallas, my 9 friends and I would not have been able to afford round trip plane tickets, game tickets, rental car (which we'd be too young to rent anyway), etc. the week of Christmas.

I understand that students are wayyy down on the totem poles in terms of game location but I wonder how many fans that were students of recent FCS Championship team participants could afford the trip?

A bit off topic, but I missed any follow up from the five App. St. students who were road tripping to Missoula in a Jeep Wrangler for the playoff game. Any update from that poster?

[doolittledog]

Hmm, thinking about moving the game to warm Florida??? 46 degrees tonight in Orlando for the Champ Sports Bowl!!! :D:D:D

[WWII]

Well it's snowing in Frisco tonight.

[BDKJMU]

1-It is in the middle of nowhere-

3-It is in Texas....in the high plains...pretty boring.

I want it kept in Chatty for selfish reasons, but to correct some of what you were spouting, Frisco isn't in the middle of nowhere. It is in the Dallas-Fort Worth Metroplex, which is one of the 5 largest metro areas in the country. Lots of stuff to do in Dallas and Fort Worth, far more than Chatty.

[BDKJMU]

you know what, i'm actually ok with that.

and spiderbone, you made some unbelievable points. i totally agree with you on all of them. i think it's kind of ridiculous to have the game there, but on the other hand... i'd probably still go there if JMU made it back to the NC game. i'd probably go just about anywhere. still, it'd be nice if it were closer, just for selfish reasons.

but having it in Florida in December... i can TOTALLY see that. actually, the more i think about it, the better that sounds. can we make it SOUTH Florida though? man, that would actually be pretty sweet. Many of us would fly there, but who cares, with that kind of weather awaiting...

99, as you and many others have stated how you wish its was in FL, etc, the bottom line is the 2 finalists are Chatty and Frisco. PERIOD. No matter how much people on this board say it should be in FL, FL ISN'T being considered. No sense on discussing having it in FL which is irrelevant.xpeacex

[BDKJMU]

You can name all the cities in the world but you are guys are missing the big point here:

Frisco and Chatty are the only two cities that actually want the game bad enough to put a bid high enough to be finalists.

There are prob. 30 locations that would be better for fans, but the fact is those cities don't want the game.

Chatty does.
Frisco does.

That's the choice. There is no other option.

And, BTW, the announcement will come in March. Final presentations are made in February.

Ditto. And I bet there's still going to be retards saying how it should be moved to FL.xrolleyesx

[BDKJMU]

I cannot speak for anyone else so I'll give my personal story as small as it may be. In 2007 when Delaware went to the title game, myself and 9 friends got in a couple of cars and drove the 12 hours to Chatty on Thursday night. We piled into 2 hotel rooms, brought some tailgating food and liquid essentials and had a friggin' blast. Yeah, we lost, but my point is that 10 students were able to make it to see their school play for the National Title for under $100 a person (gas, hotel, food, beer, tickets, etc.). If the game was in Dallas, my 9 friends and I would not have been able to afford round trip plane tickets, game tickets, rental car (which we'd be too young to rent anyway), etc. the week of Christmas.

I understand that students are wayyy down on the totem poles in terms of game location but I wonder how many fans that were students of recent FCS Championship team participants could afford the trip?

12 hrs from Baltimore? Mapquest says less than 10 1/2. In 04' drove to Chatty from the Philly area in about 11 hrs drivetime.

[BDKJMU]

Does it make a lot of difference? This year you had Villanova - Montana and what, 14,000 showed up. The location only works if both teams are in close proximity because if it did not then more eastern FCS fans would have shown up to support the game.

14k+ tickets were sold, but that included several k tickets bought by ASU fans before the semis that went unused. There wasn't close to 14k butts in seats.

[Syntax Error]

14k+ tickets were sold, but that included several k tickets bought by ASU fans before the semis that went unused. There wasn't close to 14k butts in seats.

Were you there? 14,328 is the correct attendance number. http://tiny.cc/Sf4sF

[Ud1Hens]

12 hrs from Baltimore? Mapquest says less than 10 1/2. In 04' drove to Chatty from the Philly area in about 11 hrs drivetime.

True...from Baltimore. However we were UD students and driving from Delaware. There was some crazy fog too that night and we were pretty sure we were going to drive off of I-81. Add in some bathroom/stretch breaks and you get around 12 hours

[BDKJMU]

Were you there? 14,328 is the correct attendance number. http://tiny.cc/Sf4sF

14,328 wasn't the amount of butts in seats. That was tickets sold. Butts in seats vs tickets sold = 2 often very different things. If you believe there was even close to 14k butts in seats, then you're delusional. Just like last year there wasn't close to 17+k butts in seats that was the announced attendance because several k tickets had been bought by ASU and JMU fans who got burned when their their teams didn't make it (I wasn't one of those btw).

I've been to games, both pro and college, several sports, where the the actual butts in seats was a fraction of the actual attendance.

[BDKJMU]

True...from Baltimore. However we were UD students and driving from Delaware. There was some crazy fog too that night and we were pretty sure we were going to drive off of I-81. Add in some bathroom/stretch breaks and you get around 12 hours

10-4, I wasn't including the several hours worth of stops we made on the way down, just drive time.

[Syntax Error]

14,328 wasn't the amount of butts in seats. That was tickets sold. Butts in seats vs tickets sold = 2 often very different things. If you believe there was even close to 14k butts in seats, then you're delusional.

I asked if you were there and stated the official attendance number. I don't count butts. Do you? xwhistlex I was there when JMU won, how many butts were there then?

[ur2k]

14,328 wasn't the amount of butts in seats. That was tickets sold. Butts in seats vs tickets sold = 2 often very different things. If you believe there was even close to 14k butts in seats, then you're delusional. Just like last year there wasn't close to 17+k butts in seats that was the announced attendance because several k tickets had been bought by ASU and JMU fans who got burned when their their teams didn't make it (I wasn't one of those btw).

I've been to games, both pro and college, several sports, where the the actual butts in seats was a fraction of the actual attendance.

So how many were there the last 2 years? xcoffeex

[Saint3333]

I asked if you were there and stated the official attendance number. I don't count butts. Do you? xwhistlex I was there when JMU won, how many butts were there then?

Nice backtraking SE, you know BDK is right. You ask questions not associated to the original claim to detract from the topic, classic SE.

[Pards Rule]

They should count actual attendance! WTF - it sounds like Enron accounting!!

[Tribe4SF]

They should count actual attendance! WTF - it sounds like Enron accounting!!

xlolxProbably more the opposite of Enron if the money's in the bank.

[BDKJMU]

I asked if you were there and stated the official attendance number. I don't count butts. Do you? xwhistlex I was there when JMU won, how many butts were there then?

Attendance in 04' was listed at 16,771. Butts in seats was probably close to that. 08' and 09' stand out because in 07' a lot of ASU fans weren;t able to get tickets. So in 08' you had mostly ASU (and some JMU) fans buying up severalk tickets figuring as the #1 and #2 seeds their teams would make it. Same thing with ASu fans this past season.

Bottom line is 99% of the people that watched the Nova-Montana game on national TV don't know the attendance was listed at over 14k in a almost 21k stadium. They do know what the cameras showed- that the stadium looked about 3/4 full on the Montana side and about 1/4 full on the Nova side.- ie about 1/2 full.

[89Hen]

Lots of stuff to do in Dallas and Fort Worth, far more than Chatty.
Like what? If there are hotels, a bar or two and parking lots around a football stadium, that's pretty much all you need. Everyone seems to forget that the date of the NC game is moving to the week after 90% of the US takes off. There aren't going to be a lot of extended vacations around the NC game. As it is now, most people are in and out, if anything, it's going to be even moreso in the future.

[doolittledog]

Like what? If there are hotels, a bar or two and parking lots around a football stadium, that's pretty much all you need. Everyone seems to forget that the date of the NC game is moving to the week after 90% of the US takes off. There aren't going to be a lot of extended vacations around the NC game. As it is now, most people are in and out, if anything, it's going to be even moreso in the future.

So, then you might want the game in a larger metro area...one that is football crazy, that might be able to bring in some casual fans to help fill the stadium since there might not be as many fans from the schools that are in the game!!!

[MaximumBobcat]

Like what?

Link (http://home.flash.net/~whaugen/dfwthingstodo.htm)

Around Dallas

Age of Steam Railroad Museum - Fair Park.
American Museum of the Miniature Arts, formerly Dallas Dollhouse Museum - Sharp Gallery, Hall of State, Fair Park Dallas.
Aquarium at Fair Park
Arboretum - White Rock Lake, beautiful gardens, seasonal concerts, afternoon tea.
Dallas Children's Museum
Dallas Convention and Visitors Bureau
Dallas Firefighters Museum - Parry Avenue, Fair Park.
Dallas Heritage Village at Old City Park - Historic homes and structures from Dallas past - Near downtown Dallas.
Dallas Historical Society - Local Historic Site Tours.
Dallas Museum of Art - Arts District, downtown.
Dallas Puppet Theater - Visit web site for performance schedule and locations.
Dallas World Aquarium & Zoological Garden - downtown Dallas.
DART - Take a train ride.
Fair Park - Lots of places to explore plus home of State Fair every September and October.
Farmers Market - Fresh seasonal fruits and vegetables - Downtown.
Federal Reserve Bank of Dallas Tour - By appointment, Tu & Th, 10AM & 2PM, Min Group 15, Max 45 - Downtown.
Fountain at Fountain Place - On a hot afternoon it is one of the best places to visit.
(Located at NE Corner Ross and Field Street, Downtown)
Frontiers Of Flight Museum - at Love Field (Artifacts from the Hindenburg and Wright Brothers First Flight Plane).
Heritage Farmstead - Plano - Historic house and 4 acre living farm.
Ice Skating - Galleria Mall.
Ice Skating - Plaza of the Americas, downtown.
International Museum of Cultures
Mary Kay Museum - Addison - At Mary Kay corporate headquarters, open M-F 9AM-5PM 972-687-5720.
Mary Kay Cosmetics Manufacturing Plant tour - 1330 Regal Row at I-35, Dallas - M, Tu, Th, F by appointment 972-687-5720 or 214-638-6750.
Pegasus Plaza - Urban Park - Main and Akard - Downtown.
Moon Rock - From Apollo 17 Mission. Also only meteorite ever discovered in Dallas county. Planetarium at Fair Park.
Neiman Marcus - Visit the legendary original downtown store.
Old Red Museum - Old Red Courthouse, downtown Dallas.
Reunion Tower - Hyatt Regency downtown Dallas - Great views of Dallas from top of landmark tower.
Samuell Farm - Mesquite.
Sandy Lake Amusement Park - Open April to September.
The Sixth Floor Museum - downtown Dallas. Honors The Life and Times of President John F. Kennedy.
Slappy's Playhouse - Puppet and Clown Shows - Galleria Mall, 3rd Level, Dallas 214-369-4849.
Southfork Ranch - The Famous home of the Ewing Family from the Dallas TV Series.
Southern Methodist University
Texas Buckeye Trail - Primitive nature trail in Rochester Park Trinity River bottom near downtown Dallas (Additional Trails in Outdoor Recreation).
Texas Discovery Gardens - Greenhouse and 7 acre grounds - Fair Park, just east of Museum of Nature & Science (formerly The Science Place).
Texas Stadium - Take a Tour of the stadium 972-438-7676 - Irving.
Thanks-Giving Square - A Fun place to visit in downtown Dallas.
Trinity Railway Express - Ride the train between Dallas and Fort Worth - runs every day except Sunday.
Trinity River Audubon Center - Visitor Center, Hiking Trails - 6500 S Loop 12, SW Dallas.
White Rock Skate - Go Roller Skating - NEC Shoreview & Thurgood 214-341-6660.
Back to page top

Around Fort Worth

Billy Bob's Texas - The World's Largest Country Music Nightclub.
Botanic Gardens - Beautiful 109 acre grounds, includes Japanese, Rose and other gardens.
Casa Manana Playhouse
Forest Park Miniature Train - Located by the Fort Worth Zoo
Fort Worth Convention & Visitors Bureau - Find out what's going on in Fort Worth.
Fort Worth Nature Center & Refuge - Hiking and Visitor Center - check for canoeing and hay rides.
Grapevine Vintage Railroad - Train runs from Grapevine to Fort Worth and Back.
Japanese Garden - In the Fort Worth Botanic Gardens - Very fun to feed the Koi.
Joe T. Garcia's - One of the most popular and probably best known restaurants in the area.
Log Cabin Village - Near Fort Worth Zoo - Living Pioneer town from late 19th century.
Monnig Meteorite Collection - TCU Campus.
Mrs. Bairds Bread Bakery Tour - Tue and Thu, Reservation Required 817-615-3050.
National Cowgirl Museum & Hall of Fame - One of Annie Oakley's rifles on display. Make your own bronc riding video.
Pate Museum of Transportation - 18501 S Highway 377, Cresson, TX 76035, 817-922-9504.
Stockyards National Historic District
Stock Show And Rodeo - Mid January to Early February.
Sundance Square - Downtown.
Texas Christian University
Thistle Hill - Cattle barron mansion built 1904 - Near downtown.
Trinity Railway Express - Ride the train between Fort Worth and Dallas - runs every day except Sunday.
U. S. Treasury Western Currency Facility - Tour facility where paper money made, also visitor center with history of U.S. paper money.
Vintage Flying Museum - Mecham Field, Fort Worth.
Water Gardens - Located just south of the Convention Center downtown, Climb down into a waterfall - its a great break from the summer heat.
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Around Mid Cities

Cowboy Stadium Tours - Tours of new Cowboy stadium - Arlington.
Doogoland - Grand Prairie.
Glassblowing Demonstrations - Vetro Art Glass Studio - Grapevine.
Grapevine Vintage Railroad - Train runs to Fort Worth and Back.
Hurricane Harbor Water Park - Arlington.
Legends of the Game Baseball Museum - Ballpark Stadium, Arlington.
Maverick Speakers Series - UTA Arlington.
Mustangs of Las Colinas - Bronze Sculpture and Museum - Las Colinas, Irving.
NRH20! Water Park - North Richland Hills, TX.
River Legacy Park & Living Science Center - Arlington.
Six Flags Over Texas - Arlington.
C R Smith Aviation Museum - at American Airlines.
University of Texas at Arlington
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Especially For Kids

American Museum of the Miniature Arts, formerly Dallas Dollhouse Museum - Sharp Gallery, Hall of State, Fair Park Dallas.
Children's Concerts - Dallas Arboretum, May to August.
Children's Medical Center - Largest model train display in America on display in Lobby, Dallas, Texas.
Dallas Children's Museum
Dallas Heritage Village at Old City Park - Historic homes and structures from Dallas past - Near downtown Dallas.
Dallas Puppet Theater - Visit web site for performance schedule and locations.
DART - Take a train ride.
Dinosaur Valley State Park - Glen Rose - Some of the best dinosaur tracks in the world with great swimming & hiking .
Doogoland - Grand Prairie.
Dr Pepper Museum - Waco - Invented in Waco, learn history of Dr Pepper and have a Dr Pepper at the soda fountain.
Forest Park Miniature Train - Located by the Fort Worth Zoo.
Fort Worth Nature Center & Refuge - Hiking and Visitor Center - check for canoeing and hay rides.
Fort Richardson - Old west fort 1867-1878. Check calendar for living history re-enactments. 60 miles NW Fort Worth on TX-199 Jacksboro Hwy - Jacksboro.
Fountain at Fountain Place - On a hot afternoon it is one of the best places to visit.
(Located at NE Corner Ross & Field Street, Downtown Dallas.)
Fossil Rim Animal Preserve - Glen Rose - Feed Zebras, Ostriches, Giraffes and other animals - Great day.
Glassblowing Demonstrations - Vetro Art Glass Studio - Grapevine.
Heritage Farmstead - Plano - Historic house and 4 acre living farm.
Horseback Riding
Ice Skating - Galleria Mall, Dallas.
Indoor Rock Climbing - Climbing locations around Dallas/Fort Worth area.
Japanese Garden - In the Fort Worth Botanic Gardens - Very fun to feed the Koi (Koi look like giant goldfish about a foot in length).
Legends of the Game Baseball Museum - Ballpark Stadium, Arlington.
Model Train Show - Scale model Train shows - Mid January in Plano and mid November in Fort Worth.
Moon Rock - From Apollo 17 Mission. Also only meteorite ever discovered in Dallas county. Fair Park Planetarium.
Mrs. Bairds Bread Bakery Tour - Fort Worth, Tue and Thu, Reservation Required 817-615-3050.
Museum of Nature & Science and IMAX Theater (formerly The Science Place) - Fair Park, Dallas.
National Cowgirl Museum & Hall of Fame - Make your own bronc riding video. One of Annie Oakley's rifles on display.
National Scouting Museum - Las Colinas - History of scouting, original Norman Rockwell paintings.
Pate Museum of Transportation - 18501 S Highway 377, Cresson, TX 76035, 817-922-9504.
River Legacy Park & Living Science Center - Arlington.
Roller Skating - Locations around DFW & Texas.
Samuell Farm - Mesquite.
Santa Land - Tyler, TX - Open Nov. - Dec.
Sandy Lake Amusement Park - Open April to September.
Sharkarosa Wildlife Ranch - Open Saturdays March to November - Pilot Point, about 15 miles NE of Denton.
Six Flags Over Texas - Arlington.
Slappy's Playhouse - Puppet and Clown Shows - Galleria Mall, 3rd Level, Dallas 214-369-4849.
Star Party - Astronomy Observations - See the Rings of Saturn and Jupiter's Moons.
For anytime astronomy observations get a Night Sky Map, also helps to have compass to orient map.
Studio Arts - Art classes, art parties, summer day camps - Lake Highlands, Dallas.
Texas Conservatory for Young Artists - Conservatory for talented young pianists grades six to twelve, annual June classes and performances - Plano.
Texas Discovery Gardens - See banana, coffee and other plants in greenhouse and 7 acre grounds - Fair Park, just east of Museum of Nature & Science (formerly The Science Place), Dallas.
Texas Freshwater Fisheries Center - Athens - Visitor center, aquarium, fish hatchery and wetlands hiking trail. Also in Athens East Texas Arboretum.
Trinity Railway Express - Ride the train between Dallas and Fort Worth - runs every day except Sunday.
Waco Mammoth Site - Visit Exhibit at Mayborn Museum, Waco - Mammoth Exhibit, casts of mammoth bones and large screen film.
White Rock Skate - Go Roller Skating - NEC Shoreview & Thurgood, Dallas 214-341-6660.
Zoo - Dallas.
Zoo - Fort Worth.
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[89Hen]

So, then you might want the game in a larger metro area...one that is football crazy, that might be able to bring in some casual fans to help fill the stadium since there might not be as many fans from the schools that are in the game!!!
xrolleyesx Nobody in Dallas will give a rats arse about the I-AA NC game.

[89Hen]

Link (http://home.flash.net/~whaugen/dfwthingstodo.htm)

Around Dallas
It was a rhetorical question...


There aren't going to be a lot of extended vacations around the NC game. As it is now, most people are in and out, if anything, it's going to be even moreso in the future.

[bluehenbillk]

Dallas also has the world-famous restaurant.....Bonedaddy's. MMMMMMMM

Imagine Hooters with way better food & way better looking women.

[Poker Alan]

Luckily the good folks in Montana are used to drives that long since they are so isolated compared to the east coasters.

I was one of those that took the road-trip to Chatty from Misssoula this year, it was a brutal drive, with only two people driving straight through. Chatty is a good city host...but...


But it's supposed to be a neutral site. It's been held in the same basic region for 21 years in a row now. It was in Statesboro, Georgia 1989 - 1991, in Huntington, West Virginia 1992- 1996, then it was in Chattanooga 1997 - 2009. Nothing wrong with moving it to a different region for a while.

[BDKJMU]

Link (http://home.flash.net/~whaugen/dfwthingstodo.htm)


I don't see in the list one of the 1st things I would mention to people when going to
Dallas:
http://www.jfk.org/

Forth Worth (after the Stockyards Historic District and Billy Bobs):
If you're at all intersted in Western, Cowboy and Indian art:
http://www.cartermuseum.org/works-of-art/highlights/remington-and-russell
and this comes from a guy who almost never goes to art museums and is the furthest thing from the artsy fartsy type.

[SoCon48]

Frisco nor Dallas would draw flies for FCS football. Chattanooga has proven its merits.

[89Hen]

Frisco nor Dallas would draw flies for FCS football.
Not true. We have at least a dozen people here who have given guarantees of sellouts in Frisco. Surely all 12 will show up and bring 2,000 of their closest friends. xwhistlex

[bobcatfan06]

Like someone else said, if there isn't a Cowboys game, Frisco will sell out the FCS national champ game.

[Skjellyfetti]

Like someone else said, if there isn't a Cowboys game, Frisco will sell out the FCS national champ game.

Why were neither of the bowl games in the DFW Metroplex sold out? And that's with a nearby SEC team, nearby Big XII team, in state Conference USA team?

[89Hen]

Like someone else said, if there isn't a Cowboys game, Frisco will sell out the FCS national champ game.
xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xcoffeex

[89Hen]

Why were neither of the bowl games in the DFW Metroplex sold out? And that's with a nearby SEC team, nearby Big XII team, in state Conference USA team?
And the Dallas Lonestar Classic between Texas Southern and UAPB only filled 20% of the Cotton Bowl. But we think UNI vs W&M is going to bring out the Texans? xlolx

[putter]

If all they cared about was attendance they could just hold the championship game at the home field of one of the participants. At the extreme they could wait and see who's going to be in the final game then pick the home field based on which school is likely to draw the biggest home crowd.

But it's supposed to be a neutral site. It's been held in the same basic region for 21 years in a row now. It was in Statesboro, Georgia 1989 - 1991, in Huntington, West Virginia 1992- 1996, then it was in Chattanooga 1997 - 2009. Nothing wrong with moving it to a different region for a while.

gotcha JSO,

Neutral site aside, people keep talking about Nooga being more central of a location to most of the FCS schools. I am saying, it really is not an advantage for the game unless you have App/Richmond etc. IMO, the argument would hold more water if the NC game almost always sold out because of the central location. However, I didn't see a whole lot of JMU, UR, App, fans at the game supporting the FCS because the location was so close for them.

[89Hen]

people keep talking about Nooga being more central of a location to most of the FCS schools. I am saying, it really is not
Compared to what? xconfusedx

[putter]

Compared to what? xconfusedx

Frisco

[89Hen]

Frisco
Chattanooga is not more centrally located compared to Frisco? xeyebrowx

[100%GRIZ]

It is if your team is located back east!

[89Hen]

It is if your team is located back east!
Are many I-AA's located in the east?

[ur2k]

It is if your team is located back east!

Do you mean the same East where the large majority of FCS programs are located?