Ridiculous

[Tailbone]

I've witnessed the questionable wisdom and (lack of) results of the "prevent defense" and long considered it to be the most foolish of competitive strategies.....until tonight, when I saw the "prevent offense".

Can there be a more questionable strategy? :confused:

[skinny_uncle]

Honestly, it wouldn't fly here, but each coach has to make their own decisions. At SIU, Coach Kill has a go for it mentality and lives with it. The majority of fans would not have it any other way. Last year, against NIU, we were down 1 in the closing seconds and went for a 2 point conversion to win. We lost the game but I would have done the same thing in his shoes.

[JohnStOnge]

Won't get any argument from me. You've got a run/pass threat at quarterback, have had about 440 yards of offense to that point, and have a chance to try to play it so you have the last offensive possession of the game but you're going to go into overtime and let a UNI offense that's killed you all night back on the field?

[golionsgo]

Honestly, it wouldn't fly here, but each coach has to make their own decisions. At SIU, Coach Kill has a go for it mentality and lives with it. The majority of fans would not have it any other way. Last year, against NIU, we were down 1 in the closing seconds and went for a 2 point conversion to win. We lost the game but I would have done the same thing in his shoes.


Our coach, Dennis Roland, is the same way. He plays to win and never flinches when an aggressive decision backfires. Sure, it's cost us a time or two but overall, our players have adopted his "take no prisoners" attitude and know that he'll never play "not to lose" under any circumstance. I never tolerate losing but I'd much rather be on the short end of game where my coach was aggressive, than coming up short and questioning why we didn't go for the jugular.

[blackfordpu]

I've witnessed the questionable wisdom and (lack of) results of the "prevent defense" and long considered it to be the most foolish of competitive strategies.....until tonight, when I saw the "prevent offense".

Can there be a more questionable strategy? :confused:

Didn't see the game but was keeping up with the score via blackberry. Can you explain what you are talking about for me please?

[Panther93]

Didn't see the game but was keeping up with the score via blackberry. Can you explain what you are talking about for me please?

UNI ties the game with 1:30 or so left. TxSt has 3 time outs, UNI has none and TxSt has the ball at about their 25. They just take a knee and don't try to move the ball. TxSt has no turnovers at that point in the game and really haven't had any big mistakes on offense.

I think you at least run the ball and if they break it, you have a chance.

[*****]

UNI ties the game with 1:30 or so left. TxSt has 3 time outs, UNI has none and TxSt has the ball at about their 25. They just take a knee and don't try to move the ball. TxSt has no turnovers at that point in the game and really haven't had any big mistakes on offense.

I think you at least run the ball and if they break it, you have a chance.They threw an INT on a 2pt conversion and had been stopped on downs...

[blackfordpu]

UNI ties the game with 1:30 or so left. TxSt has 3 time outs, UNI has none and TxSt has the ball at about their 25. They just take a knee and don't try to move the ball. TxSt has no turnovers at that point in the game and really haven't had any big mistakes on offense.

I think you at least run the ball and if they break it, you have a chance.

Oh wow, that is nuts. I can not believe that Baliff made that decision especially with Nealy behind center. Baliff will not be fired but will have a mob of people demanding an explination tomorrow.

What was his excuse after the game? Can we say fixed?

[*****]

...Can we say fixed?ENOUGH! UNI WON The Game, TXST Didn't LOSE It.

[blackfordpu]

ENOUGH! UNI WON The Game, TXST Didn't LOSE It.

I know ralph, I agree. Just trying to stir the pot a little. ;) :nod:

[golionsgo]

UNI ties the game with 1:30 or so left. TxSt has 3 time outs, UNI has none and TxSt has the ball at about their 25. They just take a knee and don't try to move the ball. TxSt has no turnovers at that point in the game and really haven't had any big mistakes on offense.

I think you at least run the ball and if they break it, you have a chance.


Not only that, they scored on something like 6 of 10 possessions if I'm not mistaken and only needed about 45 to 50 yards to get into reasonable FG territory, with the wind I might add. Even if they just line up in the shotgun and let Nealy run a draw or scramble around, you still have a chance for him to make a big running play. Or they could have tried a couple of shots down field on first and second downs and if they didn't move the ball, could have run it on third down and punted. UNI wouldn't have had much time to do anything with no times out. It was basically a gutless decision for lack of a better description. That's not to demean Bailiff personally in anyway, I think he's an outstanding football coach, but the decision itself lacked courage and conviction in his football team.

[blackfordpu]

Not only that, they scored on something like 6 of 10 possessions if I'm not mistaken and only needed about 45 to 50 yards to get into reasonable FG territory, with the wind I might add. Even if they just line up in the shotgun and let Nealy run a draw or scramble around, you still have a chance for him to make a big running play. Or they could have tried a couple of shots down field on first and second downs and if they didn't move the ball, could have run it on third down and punted. UNI wouldn't have had much time to do anything with no times out. It was basically a gutless decision for lack of a better description. That's not to demean Bailiff personally in anyway, I think he's an outstanding football coach, but the decision itself lacked courage and conviction in his football team.

To be fair, the bobcats kicker has been less than steller.

[golionsgo]

Oh wow, that is nuts. I can not believe that Baliff made that decision especially with Nealy behind center. Baliff will not be fired but will have a mob of people demanding an explination tomorrow.

What was his excuse after the game? Can we say fixed?


I will say this about Bailiff, he stood up like a man during the postgame interview and explained why he made his decision. I don't agree with his reasoning, but he was classy and showed no hostility towards the sideline reporter for asking the question.

[blackfordpu]

I will say this about Bailiff, he stood up like a man during the postgame interview and explained why he made his decision. I don't agree with his reasoning, but he was classy and showed no hostility towards the sideline reporter for asking the question.

What was his reasoning?

[golionsgo]

What was his reasoning?


Essentially, he said he was "playing the percentages" and wanted to take his chances in OT. I just think they had more than a reasonable chance to score given the time left and the numbers of times out remaining. He basically forfeited a solid chance to win the game in regulation and made it a 50/50 proposition in OT with a team he had trouble stopping all night long. That's going against the percentages in my book.

[Black and Gold Express]

ENOUGH! UNI WON The Game, TXST Didn't LOSE It.

Who knew Ralph's become a UNI fan? Seems that trip to UNH did something to the boy... ;)

UNI made the plays when they needed to, but if you could not see the emotional curtain being droped on every single player and fan of Texas State when the kneedowns were called for, you need to get into an eye doctor's office fast. There is absolutely no doubt at all that choice made a big difference in the outcome of the game. Then Nealy tried to do too much with the ball with a tying FG in his back pocket, and it's game over.

Yes, UNI won the game, but Texas State, or more specifcially Coach Bailiff, had a lot to do with it as well.

[ravens]

Essentially, he said he was "playing the percentages" and wanted to take his chances in OT. I just think they had more than a reasonable chance to score given the time left and the numbers of times out remaining. He basically forfeited a solid chance to win the game in regulation and made it a 50/50 proposition in OT with a team he had trouble stopping all night long. That's going against the percentages in my book.


yeah, I don't understand his " percentages" either and will not take him on my next Vegas trip. :)

[GoGSU]

It goes like this:

UNI W
TX St L


TX State loses!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[arkstfan]

Honestly, it wouldn't fly here, but each coach has to make their own decisions. At SIU, Coach Kill has a go for it mentality and lives with it. The majority of fans would not have it any other way. Last year, against NIU, we were down 1 in the closing seconds and went for a 2 point conversion to win. We lost the game but I would have done the same thing in his shoes.

I watched that game and while I thought it was a gutsy call I thought it was a mistake before the play was run. In that case I understood the logic, disagreed with it but understood it.

Texas State, if they had been facing half the time and maybe only one time out, I would have understood the logic of conceding OT.

[JohnStOnge]

Not only that, they scored on something like 6 of 10 possessions if I'm not mistaken and only needed about 45 to 50 yards to get into reasonable FG territory, with the wind I might add. Even if they just line up in the shotgun and let Nealy run a draw or scramble around, you still have a chance for him to make a big running play. Or they could have tried a couple of shots down field on first and second downs and if they didn't move the ball, could have run it on third down and punted. UNI wouldn't have had much time to do anything with no times out. It was basically a gutless decision for lack of a better description. That's not to demean Bailiff personally in anyway, I think he's an outstanding football coach, but the decision itself lacked courage and conviction in his football team.

I don't know if it was gutless. To me it was pretty brave to not to try to avoid going into the overtime format with the way UNI moved the ball all night.

Last week the same move in the same situation would've given the Bobcats the highest likelihood of winning because they were in a game that was close on the scoreboard but they had been moving the ball much better than the opposition had been. Last night that was not the case.

[JohnStOnge]

yeah, I don't understand his " percentages" either and will not take him on my next Vegas trip. :)

Yep. That's the key. Given the nature of the game I think any reasonable person that thinks about it for a while would say his chances of scoring were higher than his chances of turning the ball over. It's pretty easy to see empirically. When they had possessions they scored a lot higher percentage of the time than they turned it over...even counting the turnover on the two point conversion attempt and allowing for limited time (given three time outs and the college rule stopping the clock on third down). And he was in control of the situation so that he could've managed the clock to make sure UNI didn't have enough time left to do anything.

The biggest risk was not a turnover but, instead, stopping the clock too much and having to punt with too much time left. But he was in position to minimize the risk of that happening through play selection while using the timeouts to stop the clock if it looked like things were panning out.

Percentages. I don't see how he possibly could've thought his percent chance going into overtime was better than 50.

[MCFAN]

I don't know if it was gutless. To me it was pretty brave to not to try to avoid going into the overtime format with the way UNI moved the ball all night.

Last week the same move in the same situation would've given the Bobcats the highest likelihood of winning because they were in a game that was close on the scoreboard but they had been moving the ball much better than the opposition had been. Last night that was not the case.
It seemed TSU got conservative on the last UNI drive in regulation. I thought going after Sanders and not giving him time had worked better for them in the 2nd half than staying with a 4 man rush. Still, it was a great drive by UNI at crunch time.