Sox Strike Another Deal" Lugo To Cardinals For Chris Duncan

[UNHWildCats]

Don't know much about Duncan but all I can say about the Cards right now is...


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[UNHWildCats]

HAHHAHAHAHAHA Sox also get a player to be named.

[ISUMatt]

and the Cards and their fans are saying the same to Boston...Duncan is an absolute HACK in the field, see hi-lites of the 2006 WS when he missed everything including routine fly balls...He makes Soriano look like a gold glover Left Fielder

[UNHWildCats]

and the Cards and their fans are saying the same to Boston...Duncan is an absolute HACK in the field, see hi-lites of the 2006 WS when he missed everything including routine fly balls...He makes Soriano look like a gold glover Left Fielder
ya but we are getting a PTBNL too PLUS St Louis coulda had Lugo for major league minimum in a few days.

[ISUMatt]

Dont think the Cards are worried about money...also says that another NL Central team was interested and the Cards needed to move now

[NHwildEcat]

Why in the hell would anyone be interested in Lugo...total bum!!!

[gmoney55]

ya but we are getting a PTBNL too PLUS St Louis coulda had Lugo for major league minimum in a few days.

But Boston is paying the entire salary, so they got him for nothing.

[OSBF]

Duncan can't play the outfield and won't hit 250, enjoy Boston, enjoy.

You could of had him for a bucket of BP balls and a box of used jock straps.

[ElSissy]

The word is that Daddy Duncan is all bent out of shape about the trade. Stay tuned for drama.

[NHwildEcat]

Duncan can't play the outfield and won't hit 250, enjoy Boston, enjoy.

You could of had him for a bucket of BP balls and a box of used jock straps.

Have you seen Lugo? Have fun with that.

[OSBF]

Have you seen Lugo? Have fun with that.

No, but he can't be as bad as duncan.

[OSBF]

The word is that Daddy Duncan is all bent out of shape about the trade. Stay tuned for drama.


Doesn't matter, LaRussa and Duncan are not coming back after this year.

[OSBF]

Ok, I'm not an AL follower at all, had to actually look up some info on lugo. Seems his bat is still pretty solid, defensive range is the problem, I can live with that, we need bats and right now don't have a back-up SS on the 25 man.

Question for you AL guys: Is lugo a decent guy or a tool? Isn't this the guy that got run out of houston for beating his wife, or am I having a brain cramp.

[ISUMatt]

Lugo was hitting .283 in a very limited role...If he can do that in STL, they will be happy with him...Lugo needed a new start and the fans of STL will treat him well, unlike the fans of BOS...BTW Duncan is SOOOOOOO good, he was sent to AAA Pawtucket

[NHwildEcat]

Ok, I'm not an AL follower at all, had to actually look up some info on lugo. Seems his bat is still pretty solid, defensive range is the problem, I can live with that, we need bats and right now don't have a back-up SS on the 25 man.

Question for you AL guys: Is lugo a decent guy or a tool? Isn't this the guy that got run out of houston for beating his wife, or am I having a brain cramp.

IMO he is a tool. He will be happy if he starts and plays everyday...otherwise he will whine!! Not what I would consider a team-oriented type of guy.

Hey...here is a trade offer for you...Youkilis for Pujols?? HAHA

[UNHWildCats]

But Boston is paying the entire salary, so they got him for nothing.
they were doing that anyway once they designated him last week

[UNHWildCats]

No, but he can't be as bad as duncan.
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Within a week Cardinals fans will kidnap Lugo and plaster him with Return to Sender labels.

[OSBF]

Hey...here is a trade offer for you...Youkilis for Pujols?? HAHA


Throw in Pedroia and pappelbon and Beckett and that deal gets done. We aren't going to be able to keep albert after next year anyway. I'll bet he gets traded next year. A small market team like the cards just can't pay him what he will command out there on the open market.

[UNHWildCats]

Lugo was hitting .283 in a very limited role...If he can do that in STL, they will be happy with him...Lugo needed a new start and the fans of STL will treat him well, unlike the fans of BOS...BTW Duncan is SOOOOOOO good, he was sent to AAA Pawtucket
Boston may have acquired him to be their 4th or 5th OF next season since Baldelli and Kotsay are only signed for this season.

Of course Kotsay is unlikely to survive past tomorrow when the Sox have to make a roster spot for LaRoche.

That will of course leave Boston short a 5th OF for a month until rosters expand.

[OSBF]

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Within a week Cardinals fans will kidnap Lugo and plaster him with Return to Sender labels.


You haven't seen dunc play. Cards fans won't treat any player wearing the birds on the bat that way, we have something you aren't used to seeing out of fans in boston or NY, class, pride, dignity, and respect.

[UNHWildCats]

Throw in Pedroia and pappelbon and Beckett and that deal gets done. We aren't going to be able to keep albert after next year anyway. I'll bet he gets traded next year. A small market team like the cards just can't pay him what he will command out there on the open market.
I think St Louis would have to bite the bullet and just get the comp picks for him when he walks.... Pujols is the kind of player you cant give up on and trade... you gotta negotiate with him right up to the minute he agrees on a contract with someone else... or re-signs.

As for your response on the package.... Papelbon and Beckett wouldnt be out of reach in a deal, but Pedroia would be. Perhaps toss in Lars Anderson and another pitching prospect... of course Boston would want a 72 hour window to work ouit an extension.

[NHwildEcat]

You haven't seen dunc play. Cards fans won't treat any player wearing the birds on the bat that way, we have something you aren't used to seeing out of fans in boston or NY, class, pride, dignity, and respect.

There is nothing wrong with getting on players...seems to work well for most of the players who roll thru Boston and NY...I prefer it to letting terrible players get a round of applause when they suck...

I also do not understand much about the NL...not really my scene, kind of boring IMO...so maybe the "class, dignity, and respect" have to do with NL squads and cities.

As for the "pride" aspect...we have plenty of that up here xthumbsupx

[NHwildEcat]

I think St Louis would have to bite the bullet and just get the comp picks for him when he walks.... Pujols is the kind of player you cant give up on and trade... you gotta negotiate with him right up to the minute he agrees on a contract with someone else... or re-signs.

As for your response on the package.... Papelbon and Beckett wouldnt be out of reach in a deal, but Pedroia would be. Perhaps toss in Lars Anderson and another pitching prospect... of course Boston would want a 72 hour window to work ouit an extension.

The SOX know that Papelbon will more than likely be gone once he hits free agency...his goal is to be paid the top money...and he will not fin that in Boston. Not with a younger guy by the name of Bard standing by!

[OSBF]

As for the "pride" aspect...we have plenty of that up here xthumbsupx

fine line between pride and east coast arrogance

Treating all players with professional respect, no matter in they're on your team or the visitor is just the way it is in st lou. I was at a game when griff jr came into town and got a 3 min standing ovation, was pretty cool to be part of.

[UNHWildCats]

The SOX know that Papelbon will more than likely be gone once he hits free agency...his goal is to be paid the top money...and he will not fin that in Boston. Not with a younger guy by the name of Bard standing by!
exactly why they would trade him if they had a chance to land someone like Pujols or Joe Mauer

[OSBF]

The numbers for the next pujols contract being bantered about on st lou sports radio are staggering. They are estimating 8 to 10 years and 160 to 200 mil. That pretty much means only the yanks, red sox, cubs, dodgers, and angels will be in the bidding.

[UNHWildCats]

The numbers for the next pujols contract being bantered about on st lou sports radio are staggering. They are estimating 8 to 10 years and 160 to 200 mil. That pretty much means only the yanks, red sox, cubs, dodgers, and angels will be in the bidding.
I would like to see the Cards get creative, because Pujols in St Louis for his whole career should happen.

Maybedo 10 years $200 million and defer $5 million each season for the 10 years following the deal. Could St Louis afford $15 million per for 10 and then $5 million + interest per for another 10 afterwards?

[OSBF]

Last year total team salary was 100mil, this year at 77 mil. They are going to have to pay Rasmus,Molina, Wainwright, ludwick, and Shoemaker. Trick is that Albert says that at this point of his career he's chasing rings not dollars. If paying him means that Toad Wellemyer stays in the st lou rotation, Albert doesn't have to be a rocket scientist to see a problem there. He's ultimately going to go where he will have the chance to win multiple WS.

I just don't see how the team payroll will crack 100 mil anytime in the near future.

[UNHWildCats]

MLB needs a salary cap

[OSBF]

MLB needs a salary cap

Agree 100% it works in the NFL, NBA, and NHL no reason it wouldn't work in MLB

[tribe_pride]

Agree 100% it works in the NFL, NBA, and NHL no reason it wouldn't work in MLB

NBA doesn't have a salary cap really. I don't understand what they have but for some reason, I think the Knicks were 30-40 million over the cap this year and a lot of teams are too. Way too many exceptions.

Whatever they have, it doesn't work. Agree that the NHL and NFL caps work well though.

[UNHWildCats]

Agree 100% it works in the NFL, NBA, and NHL no reason it wouldn't work in MLB
well the NBA salary cap is crap... with all the exceptions and stuff teams are reguarly over the cap... a couple seasons back New York was something like $40 million over the cap... I would prefer a solid cap like the NFL

[NHwildEcat]

NBA doesn't have a salary cap really. I don't understand what they have but for some reason, I think the Knicks were 30-40 million over the cap this year and a lot of teams are too. Way too many exceptions.

Whatever they have, it doesn't work. Agree that the NHL and NFL caps work well though.

Yeah the NBA worked out a terrible "salary cap" but the luxury tax some of the big spenders have to pay is crazy!

[UNHWildCats]

NBA doesn't have a salary cap really. I don't understand what they have but for some reason, I think the Knicks were 30-40 million over the cap this year and a lot of teams are too. Way too many exceptions.

Whatever they have, it doesn't work. Agree that the NHL and NFL caps work well though.
lol we had the exact same thought.

[CollegeSportsInfo]

Don't know much about Duncan but all I can say about the Cards right now is...


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I'm confused? You think the Red Sox made out on this deal?

They have to pay Lugo's contract for this season and next AND have to pay Duncan's contract. In other words, the Cardinals dumped a player they were looking to get rid of while getting a utility player they wanted...and they don't have to spend a dime...the Red Sox spend all the money.

[gmoney55]

I'm amazed we're now at four pages for a Julio Lugo/Chris Duncan trade....I thought the one-page discussion on Ryan Church/Jeff Francouer was long.

[OSBF]

I'm amazed we're now at four pages for a Julio Lugo/Chris Duncan trade....I thought the one-page discussion on Ryan Church/Jeff Francouer was long.

Red Sox and Cardinal fans are some of the most passionate in the game, and I think have a mutual respect for each other for that reason.

[CollegeSportsInfo]

they were doing that anyway once they designated him last week

Yes, AND they are paying Duncan's salary which St. Louis no longer wanted to spend money on.

This isn't a push...this is a clear-cut steal for the Cardinals as they get a player they want, dump a player they don't, and get it all with the Red Sox flipping the bill.

Boston went from having to pay for Lugo regardless of where he goes. Instead, they will pay for him AND pay for Duncan (who St. Louis was prepared to cut and have to pay for).

People are laughing at an organization, but not at St. Louis.

[gmoney55]

Red Sox and Cardinal fans are some of the most passionate in the game, and I think have a mutual respect for each other for that reason.

I'm j/k, I love baseball and would read about any trade. Hell, I'm the one tracking whether the Mets have more homers than shutouts this month.

[CollegeSportsInfo]

Agree 100% it works in the NFL, NBA, and NHL no reason it wouldn't work in MLB

There are enough problems with salary caps in other leagues:

NFL: there is no salary cap scheduled yet for next year. In all likelihood, there will be no cap.

NBA: what a joke the NBA is! As mentioned, there is the luxury tax...just like MLB has. But the NBA is a joke when it comes to rosters and trades and exceptions. Teams trade for retired players who are on the "books". Other players are included in trades just for salary cap issues, and it's agreed already that they'll be cut and free to resign with their original team. The NBA system makes about as much sense as the BCS.

NHL: this league still exists??? I miss the glory days...or even the sad days when we had a glowing puck.

[UNHWildCats]

I'm confused? You think the Red Sox made out on this deal?

They have to pay Lugo's contract for this season and next AND have to pay Duncan's contract. In other words, the Cardinals dumped a player they were looking to get rid of while getting a utility player they wanted...and they don't have to spend a dime...the Red Sox spend all the money.
The Red Sox designated Lugo last week... no matter what they had to pay his salary the rest of this year and next year. Actually getting something in return is great. Ya Duncan may not be great but he did have power a couple seasons ago with a combined 43 HRs over 2006 and 2007 that covered a total of 746 at bats. Plus his career OBP isnt bad and he's only 28, he certainly could return back to his 06/07 numbers... Plus the Red Sox also get a PTBNL.

The key here is that Boston had to pay Lugo no matter what so getting anything useful back was great....

[NHwildEcat]

I'm confused? You think the Red Sox made out on this deal?

They have to pay Lugo's contract for this season and next AND have to pay Duncan's contract. In other words, the Cardinals dumped a player they were looking to get rid of while getting a utility player they wanted...and they don't have to spend a dime...the Red Sox spend all the money.

In my eyes both teams made out...sure the Cards got it the best...they spend no money, but the Red Sox get rid of a terrible liability on the field. Either way the Sox were going to be paying for Lugo...this way they get something. Duncan may not be great but he shows more upside than Lugo.

Lugo was a terrible deal to begin with...Epstein had too much of a crush on him...

[OSBF]

Duncan is a perfect fit in the AL as a LH DH. You just can't put him out there in the field.

The reason the numbers fell so sharply is that he's played the last 2 years with a ruptured disk in his neck. Had some sort of experimental surgical procedure and claimes to be free of pain but hasn't gotten his stroke back.

He came up through the system as a 1B, but the converted him to OF as PT at 1B is hard to get in st lou right now, they got this guy over there...............

[CollegeSportsInfo]

The Red Sox designated Lugo last week... no matter what they had to pay his salary the rest of this year and next year. Actually getting something in return is great. Ya Duncan may not be great but he did have power a couple seasons ago with a combined 43 HRs over 2006 and 2007 that covered a total of 746 at bats. Plus his career OBP isnt bad and he's only 28, he certainly could return back to his 06/07 numbers... Plus the Red Sox also get a PTBNL.

The key here is that Boston had to pay Lugo no matter what so getting anything useful back was great....

But big picture, Boston is paying for a guy they designated AND are now paying for a guy the Cardinals hoped to designate. So sure, you can look at it as "at least Boston got something back". But it's the WHAT they got back that's questionable.

And if St. Louis wanted to rid themselves of Duncan and were able to do so with Boston paying his salary, the Cardinals are the clear winner of this deal as they got ALL things they wanted.

[UNHWildCats]

But big picture, Boston is paying for a guy they designated AND are now paying for a guy the Cardinals hoped to designate. So sure, you can look at it as "at least Boston got something back". But it's the WHAT they got back that's questionable.

And if St. Louis wanted to rid themselves of Duncan and were able to do so with Boston paying his salary, the Cardinals are the clear winner of this deal as they got ALL things they wanted.
well its not like Duncan is making millions of dollars. The flip side is that Boston could be paying Lugo and have nothing in return... actually getting two players... one who makes less then a million and will be under Boston control through 2012 and a second player yet to be namedis a great return for Boston.

[mcveyrl]

well its not like Duncan is making millions of dollars. The flip side is that Boston could be paying Lugo and have nothing in return... actually getting two players... one who makes less then a million and will be under Boston control through 2012 and a second player yet to be namedis a great return for Boston.

I think labeling it a great return for Boston is looking through rose colored glasses. The bottom line is that it's a gamble. If Duncan takes off, he's locked in until '12. If he stinks, they just bought a pile of stink and are still paying for a pile of stink that they unloaded.

But, I do agree that it's probably better to get cheap potential instead of just paying Lugo.

Then again, if Lugo takes off...(although Lugo would have to drink 457 Red Bulls to soar to the point that his contract was worth it).

Also, I'm wagering the player to be named is not going to be named Pujols...

[OSBF]

This was sort of like when you take a pick em up truck full of your crap to the flea market, and then fill'er up again with other peoples crap and drive back home again. What was once somebody elses crap is now your crap, but you somehow manage to convince yerself that its better crap than the crap you started off the day with.

[UNHWildCats]

I think labeling it a great return for Boston is looking through rose colored glasses. The bottom line is that it's a gamble. If Duncan takes off, he's locked in until '12. If he stinks, they just bought a pile of stink and are still paying for a pile of stink that they unloaded.

But, I do agree that it's probably better to get cheap potential instead of just paying Lugo.

Then again, if Lugo takes off...(although Lugo would have to drink 457 Red Bulls to soar to the point that his contract was worth it).

Also, I'm wagering the player to be named is not going to be named Pujols...
in the context that they had already designated Lugo and in three days he would have had to be released and any team could have had him for no players, then yes it is a great return for Boston. Heck a bag of baseballs would have been a great return xlolxxlolxxlolxxlolxxlolxxlolx

[UNHWildCats]

&*$&%*^#$*%&^#$&%^ YOU LUGO

[ISUMatt]

2-5 with a HR for Lugo...not too shabby a start Id say

[NHwildEcat]

2-5 with a HR for Lugo...not too shabby a start Id say

Don't let him fool you...haha he just doubled his production in one game! He is an NL guy...has it written all over him!

[ngineer]

Lugo has gone nuts against the Phils. Batting about .500 against the 'Big Red'..looks like decent pick up to me.

[UNHWildCats]

Lugo has gone nuts against the Phils. Batting about .500 against the 'Big Red'..looks like decent pick up to me.
&#$^Q#^$(*Q#^%*(^#$*($^&*Q#%^&*^%*(&W$*(%&*(@$^&*^#@$%@$*(%&@#$&()&@#*()*()%*&$@#*(&$*( %^*(*(*(*(*(*(*(*(&)%*()*&$*(@#&$)&*()@#*%

[ElSissy]

There's still a lot of baseball to be played, but Lugo wouldn't be the first guy who resurrected his career after coming to the Cardinals.

[OSBF]

Had him playing 2B instead of SS.

[CollegeSportsInfo]

Red Sox dump former Cards OF Chris Duncan

The Boston Red Sox released former Cardinals outfielder Chris Duncan on Thursday, less than a month after he was acquired for infielder Julio Lugo. Duncan hit .185 in 85 at-bats with two home runs and 10 RBIs for Boston's Triple-A Pawtucket team since the July 22 trade. -- St. Louis Post-Dispatch (http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/sports/stories.nsf/cardinals/story/AC72554E533FA11086257619001C0EBA?OpenDocument)

[NHwildEcat]

Red Sox dump former Cards OF Chris Duncan

The Boston Red Sox released former Cardinals outfielder Chris Duncan on Thursday, less than a month after he was acquired for infielder Julio Lugo. Duncan hit .185 in 85 at-bats with two home runs and 10 RBIs for Boston's Triple-A Pawtucket team since the July 22 trade. -- St. Louis Post-Dispatch (http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/sports/stories.nsf/cardinals/story/AC72554E533FA11086257619001C0EBA?OpenDocument)

Still a great trade...Lugo had to go and they would take anything for him.

The defense looks much better now with A-Gon playing short!

[UNHWildCats]

Was trying to figure if there was another move behind this (clearing a spot on the 40 man) but he was apparently placed on waivers at some point and cleared and was then outrighted to Pawtucket on August 12 and removed from the 40 man roster.

Guess he just sucked so bad.

[NHwildEcat]

Was trying to figure if there was another move behind this (clearing a spot on the 40 man) but he was apparently placed on waivers at some point and cleared and was then outrighted to Pawtucket on August 12 and removed from the 40 man roster.

Guess he just sucked so bad.

Yeah, seems like it.

[CollegeSportsInfo]

Still a great trade...Lugo had to go and they would take anything for him.

The defense looks much better now with A-Gon playing short!

So to recap...

Boston traded Lugo, paying his salary for the year
Boston takes Chris Duncan and pays his salary for the year
Boston cuts Duncan, still having to pay him

Boston could have just let Lugo walk and saved some money rather than paying (2) players who aren't on their team.

[UNHWildCats]

So to recap...

Boston traded Lugo, paying his salary for the year
Boston takes Chris Duncan and pays his salary for the year
Boston cuts Duncan, still having to pay him

Boston could have just let Lugo walk and saved some money rather than paying (2) players who aren't on their team.
they still get either a PTBL or cash from St. Louis.

Still hard to argue with the deal... best case scenerio Duncan came around in a new enviornment and gave Boston an OK bat, worst case scenerio they will get another player or cash in return. They had to pay Lugo either way, so getting something in return even if it doesnt work out is better then just letting him walk.

[NHwildEcat]

So to recap...

Boston traded Lugo, paying his salary for the year
Boston takes Chris Duncan and pays his salary for the year
Boston cuts Duncan, still having to pay him

Boston could have just let Lugo walk and saved some money rather than paying (2) players who aren't on their team.

If they were to have lt Lugo walk it would not have been for another year...so they would have to pay it anyways...this way it clears up a roster spot.

[CollegeSportsInfo]

So what's the "cash" figure?

Because basic logic would say that it needs to be more than what they owe Duncan in order for it to make any sense. Because as we know, Lugo could have been cut it would have cost the same as trading him (and agreeing to pay his salary).

[UNHWildCats]

Havent seen a cash figure anywhere, so I got no idea.

[OSBF]

Heard on today's pre-game show, "Cardinals Live", that the Cards will be taking Duncan back into their minor league system but will not put him on the 40 man. Might put him at AA Springfield, Mo for the rest of the year just to get a few AB's.