Is Davidson in?

[Lehigh Football Nation]

I'm so curious that I'm going to start a poll on it.

I think they're in. Only Billy Packer could be rooting against them.

[GannonFan]

I have them out - only win of note was West Virginia, lost 4 of their last 10, including two losses to C of C and a bad loss to The Citadel, at home, by 18 points. Let's face it, if they didn't have a player by the name of Curry, this wouldn't even be talked about.

[danefan]

Niagra should be in over Davidson, but neither will get in.

Niagra
26-7
RPI 51
SOS 156

Davidson
25-7
RPI 69
SOS 165

[wkuhillhound]

I don't think so when Cleveland State did the unthinkable. Cleveland State is not a bad team, but in comparison to what Davidson has done this year they are about equal IMO.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

What Davidson has that Niagara doesn't is two things: Stephen Curry, and a missed three-point shot last year in the Elite Eight that had them come oh-so-close to beating the eventual national champion.

Don't get me wrong, Niagara is a really good team, but they're unknown outside the northeast. But everyone knows Curry and Davidson.

[Franks Tanks]

I don't think so when Cleveland State did the unthinkable. Cleveland State is not a bad team, but in comparison to what Davidson has done this year they are about equal IMO.

Good point. Butler will get an at-large (I would think) so having Cleveland State get the auto takes a spot from a bubble team like Davidson. I think Davidson is a no unfortunantly, especially because the committe heavily weight the last 10-15 games.

[GannonFan]

I don't think so when Cleveland State did the unthinkable. Cleveland State is not a bad team, but in comparison to what Davidson has done this year they are about equal IMO.


What Davidson has that Niagara doesn't is two things: Stephen Curry, and a missed three-point shot last year in the Elite Eight that had them come oh-so-close to beating the eventual national champion.

Don't get me wrong, Niagara is a really good team, but they're unknown outside the northeast. But everyone knows Curry and Davidson.

Yeah, last year ain't going to matter that much, especially when Davidson hasn't looked like the team that did well in the tourney last year. Cleveland State all but about ended any glimmer of hope for Davidson, not that there was a lot of hope before then anyway.

[gmoney55]

What Davidson has that Niagara doesn't is two things: Stephen Curry, and a missed three-point shot last year in the Elite Eight that had them come oh-so-close to beating the eventual national champion.

Don't get me wrong, Niagara is a really good team, but they're unknown outside the northeast. But everyone knows Curry and Davidson.

Which means to put Davidson in the committee would have to go against everything that they've always said. Look at this year's resume and it's not that pretty, esepcially since the win over WVA was without Ruoff.

[Ivytalk]

I have them out - only win of note was West Virginia, lost 4 of their last 10, including two losses to C of C and a bad loss to The Citadel, at home, by 18 points. Let's face it, if they didn't have a player by the name of Curry, this wouldn't even be talked about.

'Zactly!xcoolx

[813Jag]

What Davidson has that Niagara doesn't is two things: Stephen Curry, and a missed three-point shot last year in the Elite Eight that had them come oh-so-close to beating the eventual national champion.

Don't get me wrong, Niagara is a really good team, but they're unknown outside the northeast. But everyone knows Curry and Davidson.
Last year doesn't mean much and it shouldn't especially when most of those guys are gone. They had a chance to get it done and didn't get to the tourney final, which hurts alot. They're NIT bound.

[wkuhillhound]

Last year doesn't mean much and it shouldn't especially when most of those guys are gone. They had a chance to get it done and didn't get to the tourney final, which hurts alot. They're NIT bound.

Florida State's resume just got better with WKU Sun Belt Championship! :D WKU's RPI is at 47 according to Sportsline.com. xthumbsupx

[Lehigh Football Nation]

Which means to put Davidson in the committee would have to go against everything that they've always said. Look at this year's resume and it's not that pretty, esepcially since the win over WVA was without Ruoff.

The committee goes against itself all the time, so consistency isn't an argument I would go with here. xlolx

What I'm really surprised about is that folks are talking about their two losses to CoC as a reason to exclude them. CoC is a pretty damned good team, even though Chatty beat them on their home court. ("Neutral" xrolleyesx ) I mean, I see The Citadel loss and I agree that's not a great loss, but honestly I don't see anything else.

Crucial here is the following: how do you judge their relatively close losses to two of the best teams in the country, Duke and Oklahoma? Personally, I put a lot of stock in that. Those two losses are better than any of the wins that, say USC has (all home wins against Arizona, Arizona State, and Cal).

[813Jag]

Florida State's resume just got better with WKU Sun Belt Championship! :D WKU's RPI is at 47 according to Sportsline.com. xthumbsupx
Thanks, but those two wins over Clemson but them over the top. xlolx

[wkuhillhound]

Thanks, but those two wins over Clemson but them over the top. xlolx

Better seed possibly. I hope that WKU doesn't play y'all again. It's certainly possible with the projections in some sports sites. xnodx

[813Jag]

The committee goes against itself all the time, so consistency isn't an argument I would go with here. xlolx

What I'm really surprised about is that folks are talking about their two losses to CoC as a reason to exclude them. CoC is a pretty damned good team, even though Chatty beat them on their home court. ("Neutral" xrolleyesx ) I mean, I see The Citadel loss and I agree that's not a great loss, but honestly I don't see anything else.

Crucial here is the following: how do you judge their relatively close losses to two of the best teams in the country, Duke and Oklahoma? Personally, I put a lot of stock in that. Those two losses are better than any of the wins that, say USC has (all home wins against Arizona, Arizona State, and Cal).
You also can't overlook the Butler loss, which isn't as "good" since they lost to CSU.

[813Jag]

Better seed possibly. I hope that WKU doesn't play y'all again. It's certainly possible with the projections in some sports sites. xnodx
Right now, I don't care who they play as long as they're in the Dance, 1998 is a long time to sit on the sidelines.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

You also can't overlook the Butler loss, which isn't as "good" since they lost to CSU.

Which is another good reason that this focus on RPI is such a load of crap. Is there any doubt that Butler is a good team? But they lose their tournament to Cleveland State and magically their RPI craters. And it extends to Davidson since they lost to them.

Davidson has 7 losses to 6 teams. Three of those teams are a lock for the tournament (Duke, Oklahoma, Purdue). One is borderline (Butler). The other losses came to The Citadel (RPI 174) and CoC (RPI 104, and will definitely be playing in the postseason somewhere).

Davidson scheduled tough, came out with a few good wins and close losses en route to a 25-7 record. But they're going to be denied the tournament because of Cleveland State?

[gmoney55]

Which is another good reason that this focus on RPI is such a load of crap. Is there any doubt that Butler is a good team? But they lose their tournament to Cleveland State and magically their RPI craters. And it extends to Davidson since they lost to them.

Davidson has 7 losses to 6 teams. Three of those teams are a lock for the tournament (Duke, Oklahoma, Purdue). One is borderline (Butler). The other losses came to The Citadel (RPI 174) and CoC (RPI 104, and will definitely be playing in the postseason somewhere).

Davidson scheduled tough, came out with a few good wins and close losses en route to a 25-7 record. But they're going to be denied the tournament because of Cleveland State?

Davidson is so far down the pecking order IMO that the Cleveland State game was pretty much meaningless. Need to have some Ws.

[GannonFan]

Which is another good reason that this focus on RPI is such a load of crap. Is there any doubt that Butler is a good team? But they lose their tournament to Cleveland State and magically their RPI craters. And it extends to Davidson since they lost to them.

Davidson has 7 losses to 6 teams. Three of those teams are a lock for the tournament (Duke, Oklahoma, Purdue). One is borderline (Butler). The other losses came to The Citadel (RPI 174) and CoC (RPI 104, and will definitely be playing in the postseason somewhere).

Davidson scheduled tough, came out with a few good wins and close losses en route to a 25-7 record. But they're going to be denied the tournament because of Cleveland State?

Davidson also gets killed by their conference - the Southern was certainly one of the lesser conferences this year and that just drags Davidson down. Sure, Davidson scheduled pretty well, but they didn't win enough (only one W against a quality foe) in those OOC games and then 22 games against a conference where no one other than Davidson was even a top 150 team.

[813Jag]

Which is another good reason that this focus on RPI is such a load of crap. Is there any doubt that Butler is a good team? But they lose their tournament to Cleveland State and magically their RPI craters. And it extends to Davidson since they lost to them.

Davidson has 7 losses to 6 teams. Three of those teams are a lock for the tournament (Duke, Oklahoma, Purdue). One is borderline (Butler). The other losses came to The Citadel (RPI 174) and CoC (RPI 104, and will definitely be playing in the postseason somewhere).

Davidson scheduled tough, came out with a few good wins and close losses en route to a 25-7 record. But they're going to be denied the tournament because of Cleveland State?
I'm talking about Butler beating Davidson in bracket busters at Davidson. That loss hurts when you look at the CSU game. No matter how you spin it Davidson will most likely be in the NIT.

[ASUMountaineer]

NIT bound is Davidson. I, for one, couldn't be happier. xnodx Hoping Curry goes pro. The SoCon has never gotten an "at-large" team in the field. I don't see, especially with Cleveland State's win, how Davidson gets in. Especially if a team like Miami, Auburn, Michigan, or Arizona wins their conference tournament.

[PhoenixMan]

Davidson doesn't get in, although I would like to see 2 SoCon teams in for the first. The bad loss to The Citadel, when they only scored 46 pts. (without Curry due to injury of course) will sway the committee. Too many other bubble teams that should go in first.

[JMU Newbill]

I already gave my two cents about this on another thread. I voted "yes", I think they will get in b/c the media is in love with Curry.

However, I personally don't think they are even close to deserving to get in. All the points have already been made, so I won't beat a dead horse.... but only 1 top 100 win... give me a break.

Let's compare this just real quick to a handful of teams and see how many wins vs. top 100 schools they have... shall we??

JMU (2)
Delaware (2)
W&M (1)
App State (0) *** sorry guys
Albany (3)
Towson (1)
Hofstra (2)
College of Charleston (3)
Wofford (0) ***sorry again
Chattanooga (1)
Jacksonville State (0) ***eh.. sorry
New Hampshre (0)
Montana (0)
Georgia Southern (1)
VMI (1)
Youngstown State (2)

Probably all meaningless to most... but I find it interesting that Davidson gets consideration when they have less, or within 1, Top 100 wins than these teams that obviously will not make the tourney... some of which won't even be considered for the NIT.

[JMU Newbill]

ok with the exception of college of charleston... i know they get the autobid... sue me

[Lehigh Football Nation]

I already gave my two cents about this on another thread. I voted "yes", I think they will get in b/c the media is in love with Curry.

However, I personally don't think they are even close to deserving to get in. All the points have already been made, so I won't beat a dead horse.... but only 1 top 100 win... give me a break.

Let's compare this just real quick to a handful of teams and see how many wins vs. top 100 schools they have... shall we??

JMU (2)
Delaware (2)
W&M (1)
App State (0) *** sorry guys
Albany (3)
Towson (1)
Hofstra (2)
College of Charleston (3)
Wofford (0) ***sorry again
Chattanooga (1)
Jacksonville State (0) ***eh.. sorry
New Hampshre (0)
Montana (0)
Georgia Southern (1)
VMI (1)
Youngstown State (2)

Probably all meaningless to most... but I find it interesting that Davidson gets consideration when they have as less, or within 1, Top 100 wins than these teams that obviously will not make the tourney... some of which won't even be considered for the NIT.

Davidson has 2 (NC State, West Virginia). And as you inadvertently point out, nine of these teams you mention have 1 or 0 wins vs. top 100 teams.

In addition, they've only lost to 1 team with an RPI below 150 (Citadel again, and as you said it was without Curry). I doubt that any other team listed there can say that.

It's funny that "history" is invoked for exclusion (no SoCon team has ever gotten an at-large) - but it's laughed off when it's used for inclusion (Davidson made the Elite Eight last year).

I happen to think Davidson has a case for inclusion, and not a bad one.

(I happen to think CoC would have been a great pick for a first-round upset had they managed to beat Chatty. I think way too much stock is being put in the losses to CoC and Butler as "bad losses" when they are, in actuality, anything but.)

[JMU Newbill]

ah... I stand corrected..... NC State is now exactly ranked #100 in the RPI (according to sportsline). Thanks for the help!

And just for the record... I wasn't trying to say that any of these teams deserve to be in the tournament. I think they all suck (including CoC, but they won the tourney so they are in).

My point is that Davidson rarely played anyone decent (Top 100), and when they did, usually lost. My point was just to show which other crappy teams had just about as many Top 100 wins as they did.

On one side note... want to know a team that would beat Davidson by 50 points, and will not be in the tourney??? Georgetown. Yea... I know... 16-14, losing record in their conference. But hey, they only played TWO teams all year with an RPI > 200.

Georgetown has 7 wins versus the top 100... including 4 against top 25 teams. I can't see the 12th place team in the Big East getting in.... but they sure would kick the crap out of any team from the CAA or SoCon.

[813Jag]

ah... I stand corrected..... NC State is now exactly ranked #100 in the RPI (according to sportsline). Thanks for the help!

And just for the record... I wasn't trying to say that any of these teams deserve to be in the tournament. I think they all suck (including CoC, but they won the tourney so they are in).

My point is that Davidson rarely played anyone decent (Top 100), and when they did, usually lost. My point was just to show which other crappy teams had just about as many Top 100 wins as they did.

On one side note... want to know a team that would beat Davidson by 50 points, and will not be in the tourney??? Georgetown. Yea... I know... 16-14, losing record in their conference. But hey, they only played TWO teams all year with an RPI > 200.

Georgetown has 7 wins versus the top 100... including 4 against top 25 teams. I can't see the 12th place team in the Big East getting in.... but they sure would kick the crap out of any team from the CAA or SoCon.
Davidson beat them in the tourney last year, that would carry over to this year. Seeing as Georgetown isn't as good as they were. But Davidson should get ready for a trip to the O'Connell Center in the NIT/

[proasu89]

ok with the exception of college of charleston... i know they get the autobid... sue me

Chattanooga won the SoCon.

[GannonFan]

Davidson has 2 (NC State, West Virginia). And as you inadvertently point out, nine of these teams you mention have 1 or 0 wins vs. top 100 teams.

In addition, they've only lost to 1 team with an RPI below 150 (Citadel again, and as you said it was without Curry). I doubt that any other team listed there can say that.

It's funny that "history" is invoked for exclusion (no SoCon team has ever gotten an at-large) - but it's laughed off when it's used for inclusion (Davidson made the Elite Eight last year).

I happen to think Davidson has a case for inclusion, and not a bad one.

(I happen to think CoC would have been a great pick for a first-round upset had they managed to beat Chatty. I think way too much stock is being put in the losses to CoC and Butler as "bad losses" when they are, in actuality, anything but.)


Come on, man, Kentucky's got a lot more quality wins than Davidson and there's no way Kentucky is dancing. Davidson's not even in the discussion at this point, outside of this thread. NIT bound, no doubt about it.

[SideLine Shooter]

NO!

[griz37]

Would I like to see Curry in the tourney, yes, but they will not & should not get in. They have one good victory, over WVU w/o Ruoff. The only 2 mid-major bubble teams who have any hope of an at-large are St. Mary's & Creighton, Butler is already in if you ask me.

[813Jag]

Would I like to see Curry in the tourney, yes, but they will not & should not get in. They have one good victory, over WVU w/o Ruoff. The only 2 mid-major bubble teams who have any hope of an at-large are St. Mary's & Creighton, Butler is already in if you ask me.
It would be a crime if Butler didn't get in.

[Appfan_in_CAAland]

Appalachian State proved in 2007 that no SoCon team will ever get an at-large bid.
25-6, Top 50 RPI, Top 10 toughest non-conference schedule, 4-1 v. teams in the tournament that year, and no NCAA bid.

[appmaj]

Appalachian State proved in 2007 that no SoCon team will ever get an at-large bid.
25-6, Top 50 RPI, Top 10 toughest non-conference schedule, 4-1 v. teams in the tournament that year, and no NCAA bid.

I have a bad feeling Davidson could still get in...App deserved it more but The Curry show is more likely a tourney draw.

[Go Lehigh TU Owl]

If Davidson gets in over Temple i'll go nuts. There would be no justification for that one. Richards, their pg from last year made the Wildcats tick. As they are this year I doubt they win more than a game in the NIT.

[wkuhillhound]

NIT bound is Davidson. I, for one, couldn't be happier. xnodx Hoping Curry goes pro. The SoCon has never gotten an "at-large" team in the field. I don't see, especially with Cleveland State's win, how Davidson gets in. Especially if a team like Miami, Auburn, Michigan, or Arizona wins their conference tournament.

At least Arizona's out of their conference tournament. xbowxxbowxxbowx