Can a fan dislike the head coach, without being labled a "bad fan"?

[Wolfman]

If any of you have visited the Montana Grizzly message board, you would immediately become emersed into the on-going soap opera there between the "Hauck haters", and the sugar coaters who think the man is the second coming.

The legions of sugar coaters who reside there, led by their self-appointed leader, Green26, have pinned the "bad fan" lable on any poster who dares to be critical of Bobby Hauck, our O-coordinator Rob Phenicie, or any other coach, for that matter.

my question to the national FCS fan base is this one.... "can a fan dislike the head coach of his team, and still be a "good fan"????

[PantherRob82]

shut up. xrolleyesx

[NoCoDanny]

I never understood the mentality that you are only a fan if you support the team with rose colored glasses no matter what.

If the coach sucks and you think he sucks then speak up I say but then again our coach sucks so it's easy to say.

[ursus arctos horribilis]

If any of you have visited the Montana Grizzly message board, you would immediately become emersed into the on-going soap opera there between the "Hauck haters", and the sugar coaters who think the man is the second coming.

The legions of sugar coaters who reside there, led by their self-appointed leader, Green26, have pinned the "bad fan" lable on any poster who dares to be critical of Bobby Hauck, our O-coordinator Rob Phenicie, or any other coach, for that matter.

my question to the national FCS fan base is this one.... "can a fan dislike the head coach of his team, and still be a "good fan"????

Yes of course he could if he were to use facts instead of fallacy. A fan that nitpicks against the coach because of some personal problem probably won't get much respect. Try refuting facts or backing up claims you make when they are disproven by others and you would have some credibility. Also using "sugarcoaters" constantly makes a person look like a one trick pony with very little in the tool box.

[Wolfman]

shut up. xrolleyesx


classy post....dude

[ursus arctos horribilis]

I never understood the mentality that you are only a fan if you support the team with rose colored glasses no matter what.

If the coach sucks and you think he sucks then speak up I say but then again our coach sucks so it's easy to say.

If you had a program that had a good amount of success before your coach arrived 6 yrs. ago and then continued to keep the program at a reasonable level of success like Hauck has would your every reason for being be to besmirtch the coach with every stroke of your keyboard?

[uofmman1122]

http://www.mtstandard.com/articles/2008/12/23/sports/hjjbihhgjaeijd.txt


I don't know what Bobby Hauck said — if anything — to Montana Grizzly fans after his team fell 24-7 to Richmond in the championship game Friday night.

I don't know how he felt about the loss. I don't know how he's felt about the fans in his six years as football coach at the University of Montana.

But I know what I would have said if I was in Hauck's shoes.

After approaching the podium waving my double-barreled Butte salute, my speech would go like this: "To heck with you. I am sick and tired of you wishy-washy so-called Grizzly fans who think you know everything about football. Most of you know about as much about the game I love as the average grandma in knitting class.

"Yeah, I'm being a little hard on Griz fans. I know the vast majority of you are great supporters. It's the vocal minority, though, who need a talking to.

"You know who you are. You're the guy who shakes my hand and tells me ‘Good game, coach,' when we the Grizzlies win. Then you put a ‘for sale' sign in my yard in the middle of the night on those extremely rare occasion when the Grizzlies lose.Wow, that sounds a lot like a certain Griz poster during the last four rounds of the playoffs.

This article pretty much sums up how I feel. xlolx

[Wolfman]

Yes of course he could if he were to use facts instead of fallacy. A fan that nitpicks against the coach because of some personal problem probably won't get much respect. Try refuting facts or backing up claims you make when they are disproven by others and you would have some credibility. Also using "sugarcoaters" constantly makes a person look like a one trick pony with very little in the tool box.


First of all, I could care less about getting "respect". Second, none of my "claims" have been "disproven" by others. Your post is a joke, and shows that you have a person agenda against me, just like the supposed personal agenda you suggest I may have against Bobby Hauck. Kinda like the pot and the kettle, don't you think, dude?

The fact that Bobby Hauck can't win the big one, and the fact that Bobby Hauck signs criminals dropped from IA teams, can't really be "disproven by others", now, can they?

So, if YOU wish to get some respect, then try making a sensible post that is not filled with weak, and obvious personal venom towards me.

I guess, according to you, I must remain a 'bad fan". Gee, I won't sleep tonight! xeyebrowx

[GrizFanStuckInUtah]

If any of you have visited the Montana Grizzly message board, you would immediately become emersed into the on-going soap opera there between the "Hauck haters", and the sugar coaters who think the man is the second coming.

The legions of sugar coaters who reside there, led by their self-appointed leader, Green26, have pinned the "bad fan" lable on any poster who dares to be critical of Bobby Hauck, our O-coordinator Rob Phenicie, or any other coach, for that matter.

my question to the national FCS fan base is this one.... "can a fan dislike the head coach of his team, and still be a "good fan"????

Yes, but there is a line that many seem to cross. I don't spend much time on egriz, but do post and read there every so often. It seems that if you are a fan and happy with Hauck, you label them as a sugar coater and if someone dislikes Hauck, they are a bad fan. I have no problems with someone being critical, they just better be prepared to deal with the backlash and/or back it up. I dunno what else to say, except people need to stop being so judgmental and take boards for what they are. We are fans, not coaches and we get to complain to some degree. If I beleived that Hauck didn't care and didn't' take his job seriously, I'd have a problem with him. Since I do believe he busts his butt and cares, he has my respect. xpeacex

[GrizFanStuckInUtah]

http://www.mtstandard.com/articles/2008/12/23/sports/hjjbihhgjaeijd.txt

Wow, that sounds a lot like a certain Griz poster during the last four rounds of the playoffs.

This article pretty much sums up how I feel. xlolx


Hahahaha that article is hilarious. Just enough truth in it to make it believable. xreadx xthumbsupx

[mtgrizfan4life]

Wolfie, I will not go as far as calling you a bad fan. You are entitled to your opinion. With that said though, after this season you are in a very small minority in GRIZNATION against Hauck.

Prior to this season, there were way more Hauck Haters/bashers, and there are still a few. However, the majority of those bashers in the last month have given the man his due and some respect. I applaud them for doing so. The ones bashing you are the ones that are tired of hearing the same song and dance from you, especially after what this team did this year. It was by far the best coaching job of his career, and argueably the best coaching job ever at Montana.

I have been guilty of getting on Hauck for his loyality to Phenicie, but honestly to GOD, there was not alot to bash this year offensively. I have put my Phenecie bashing to rest from this years results.

Of course I am hurt and bitter we lost the championship. However, that was more of Richmond coming with their "A" game in beating us soundly. The better team won that night. Not a whole lot any coach could do about any team playing a near perfect game. Congrats to Richmond for that.

I think a few in GRIZNATION would like to see you put aside your personal opinions of Hauck this year and at the very least give him some credit for what the GRIZ accomplished this year. In my opinion that is why GRIZNATION is upset at you. This year the bashing is not justified as the year turned out.

[ursus arctos horribilis]

First of all, I could care less about getting "respect". Second, none of my "claims" have been "disproven" by others. Your post is a joke, and shows that you have a person agenda against me, just like the supposed personal agenda you suggest I may have against Bobby Hauck. Kinda like the pot and the kettle, don't you think, dude?

The fact that Bobby Hauck can't win the big one, and the fact that Bobby Hauck signs criminals dropped from IA teams, can't really be "disproven by others", now, can they?

So, if YOU wish to get some respect, then try making a sensible post that is not filled with weak, and obvious personal venom towards me.

I guess, according to you, I must remain a 'bad fan". Gee, I won't sleep tonight! xeyebrowx

No personal agenda against you Wolfman. The thing is that there are things that you post that have merit. The ones mentioned in your post about recruiting being one of them. It's pretty hard to listen to anything that you say since you just say the same things over and over, that's all. You are overboard with emotional strife over Hauck and I think even you know that. You may some real good insight to offer but you never do. You just attack anything and everything that you can about Hauck. You have been proven wrong way more than right in the ppsts that I've seen from you...or maybe not proven wrong so much as just came out with the short end of the stick in the exchanges. If you'd like me to I could go and dig up some of your post from Aug., Sept., and Oct., to show you what I'm talking about.

If you weren't looking for some form of respect then why the concern over being labeled a bad fan? I'm not trying to hurt your feelings there big fella but your act is just so tired that you are a very easy person to dislike as a board poster. At least if you're gonna run the gimmick that you are try to make it a little humorous or something...like AlphaGriz does. He runs the same gimmick but does it with a sense of style and humor.

[Green26]

Would any of you other teams out there like Wolfman for a "fan"?

Any person who disses his team and coaches as much as this poster is not even a fan in my book. He roots against his supposed team, so his predictions of doom can be deemed correct. He is obsessed with dissing the coach.

When you've been predicting doom and gloom, and your team goes 14-2 and to the national championship game, it must be very frustrating.

[mtgrizfan4life]

Wolfie, I will lead by example here. Read the post below from me and the date of it (after the 1st Weber State game) I remember this post well, and said I hoped they proved me "WRONG". Well they proved me wrong. "THANK YOU GRIZ for proving this fan WRONG!!!!!!!!" By the way that crow tastes good.


My maroon colored glasses are off now - 10-04-2008, 09:27 PM
I went into the Weber State game thinking this would be a tell tale game for the GRIZ. Now that it is over. We will be lucky to better 5-3 in conference play this year. GRIZ prove me wrong and I will never be so happy being wrong. No this is not going to turn into a coach bashing thread, this team is young and has ALOT to learn and work on!

I had a VERY bad feeling about this game, and honestly thought we would lose. I said so, but being someone took my pick in score I said WTF I will pick the GRIZ! This week my rose colored glasses came off. As much as I hate to admit this team has alot of problems, the least of which is what all us thought was our biggest weakness a few weeks ago. The brightside is we have a solid kicker now!

Seriously, we have way too many things to work on, come together, and fall into place. I do not know if I am being negative or flat honest. I guess as the season plays on we will all know, but here are my thoughts, and yes they are hard to post here, but here it goes.

The only strength on this team right now is our WR depth, and passing game, when CB gets time to throw that is. I honestly feel Reynolds has all the tools to be a very good rb, but not in this system and not with our OL not being able to jell. Individually, our OL is outstanding, but as a unit they very seldom perform in unity. TBF will never get back to the level we seen prior to his injury. Schmidt is good for smashmouth ball, but only if the OL performs to their potential.

In past years could tell 1 or 2 things that we needed work on, but this year we need work and improvement on everything.

Special teams- We need to work on blocking without penalties. Honestly to GOD I believe Mariani has lost over 200 return yards this year thanks to penalites. Kickoff coverage is suprisingly inconsistent. On the brightside the kicking game appears to have overcome early season problems, McKnight has the talent to continue the kicking tradition. Shulte and Mariani are both very good returners, but that does no good when we get so many penalties.

Defense- Where do I start? Colt Anderson is the only positive consistently. Unfortunately for him, he cannot be everywhere, and his teammates are not helping him. Our youth is really showing to the point where we cannot hide or scheme around the weakness. Our pass defense SUCKS and I think we are too young to do what I want us to do. We have no physical corners due to our youth. We are too afraid of getting beat deep. Damnit, what do we have to lose? Trumaine is a good sized corner, can we have him play tighter and can we at least try checking WRs' off the line? We have enough depth at Safety, and Anderson is fast enough to play corner, would it hurt to use him, Stoll, and Schillinger on the field at the same time, and have Anderson knock the living daylights out of WRs off the line? Is there any hope Ciarre Campbell gets more PT?

WE have our moments on run defense, and we contain the outside better than normal. However we are too small at LB and do not have the right DL combination to keep blockers off our LBS. Can Stadnyk play some interior line if needed? He defends the run well from DE. Can we rotate some bigger LBS now and then, where we can be bigger now and then. As for pass rush, can we put the other Campbell in as a rover type LB and use him blitz schemes? He is the one player that is athletic enough and fast enough to be a difference maker on defense. Just get him on the field!

Defensively , for some reason this year we have good pieces but we have not figured out how to use the pieces together. Sounds like our OL.

Offensively, I actually feel the playcalling overall has improved. However, our offense begins and ends with OL play. They just do not work together. I am encouraged we are utilizing the TEs more and we are going deep more. However, hand in hand with that, year in year out we very seldom run quick hits, slants, flares, wheel routes, and screens. Our passing game hls the potential, depth, and talent to be lethal if we ever learn to use some creative route running. Also I like the potential matchup problems teams face with Schulte being used like the Eagles use Westbrook. Why on Gods earth did we not stick with moving Schulte all over? When we use him as a decoy or get him the ball in many positions our offense does well every game. Mariani, Schulte, Ferriter, Palmer and any one TE is difficult to defend for any defense.

I pray by end of the season this team proves me wrong, but as of right now, I feel we have way too many things to work on that needs improvement on all 3 teams. I honestly do not see how it all comes together this year. Based on what I have seen this year, I feel we will be fortunate to be 5-3 in conference play this year, which will get us a playoff spot. I honestly feel 4-4 might be the outcome this year, and our playoff run ends. By the way I am not pissed at the coache or anyone on this team. I just do not see it happening this year. I also will be the 1st to thank this team for proving me wrong if we go better than 5-3 in conference play this year.

On the brightside, OL and defense cannot get worse, can it? They can only improve.

[mtgrizfan4life]

double posts, sorry.

[SeattleGriz]

If any of you have visited the Montana Grizzly message board, you would immediately become emersed into the on-going soap opera there between the "Hauck haters", and the sugar coaters who think the man is the second coming.

The legions of sugar coaters who reside there, led by their self-appointed leader, Green26, have pinned the "bad fan" lable on any poster who dares to be critical of Bobby Hauck, our O-coordinator Rob Phenicie, or any other coach, for that matter.

my question to the national FCS fan base is this one.... "can a fan dislike the head coach of his team, and still be a "good fan"????

Why are you bringing your eGriz arguments here?

[Grizalltheway]

Why are you bringing your eGriz arguments here?

He has to change trolling grounds every so often or he gets bored. xlolx

[GolfingGriz]

First of all, I could care less about getting "respect". Second, none of my "claims" have been "disproven" by others. Your post is a joke, and shows that you have a person agenda against me, just like the supposed personal agenda you suggest I may have against Bobby Hauck. Kinda like the pot and the kettle, don't you think, dude?

The fact that Bobby Hauck can't win the big one, and the fact that Bobby Hauck signs criminals dropped from IA teams, can't really be "disproven by others", now, can they?

So, if YOU wish to get some respect, then try making a sensible post that is not filled with weak, and obvious personal venom towards me.

I guess, according to you, I must remain a 'bad fan". Gee, I won't sleep tonight! xeyebrowx

You say Hauck can't win the big game, but that isn't exactly fair. I know you are probably only referring to his 0-2 record in Chattanooga, but he has won some big games this year. Winning on the road against Cal Poly was a big win, beating the Cats by 32 was a big win, beating a team that has already dominated you that season is certainly a big win, and finally winning a road semifinal game is definately a "big one."

What Hauck and his staff did this year was nothing short of amazing and deserves more credit than some people will ever be willing to give. Its too bad, but theres nothing that anybody can do. Some people are all or nothing people, and if their isn't that gold trophy at the end of the year it was a failure.

[Hood]

I'm a Saints fan and a staunch supporter of having Sean Payton removed since he coaches like a 14 year old playing Madden on a Playstation.

[813Jag]

I'm a Saints fan and a staunch supporter of having Sean Payton removed since he coaches like a 14 year old playing Madden on a Playstation.
It's OK for you to do that, you've suffered enough as a Saints fan. xlolx Without jumping into the Griz-ument, I'll say if the coach doesn't have the team prepared to play or doesn't recruit well, then you won't be a bad fan. But if your coach had a successful season then you're just nitpicking.

[I-AA Fan]

classy post....dude

I think he was being sarcastic, as in, of course ...why even ask the question. I feel the same way.

[Uncle Buck]

I didn't bother reading the entire thread but i'll say this...I wish i could hate my coach for getting us to the title game.

[Georgia Griz]

If any of you have visited the Montana Grizzly message board, you would immediately become emersed into the on-going soap opera there between the "Hauck haters", and the sugar coaters who think the man is the second coming.

The legions of sugar coaters who reside there, led by their self-appointed leader, Green26, have pinned the "bad fan" lable on any poster who dares to be critical of Bobby Hauck, our O-coordinator Rob Phenicie, or any other coach, for that matter.

my question to the national FCS fan base is this one.... "can a fan dislike the head coach of his team, and still be a "good fan"????

Yes, of course, a person can have dislikes about his team and still be a good fan. xnodx But, many of the Griz fans aren't going to let you get away with it. xnonono2x I've experienced that for the last several days.xmadx

[Wolfman]

Would any of you other teams out there like Wolfman for a "fan"?

Any person who disses his team and coaches as much as this poster is not even a fan in my book. He roots against his supposed team, so his predictions of doom can be deemed correct. He is obsessed with dissing the coach.

When you've been predicting doom and gloom, and your team goes 14-2 and to the national championship game, it must be very frustrating.


No need to lie in your posts about me to try and elevate your position as the biggest name dropper and jock sniffer in Grizland. I NEVER root against the Griz, and I NEVER dis any players on the team.

As Alpha has stated, all of the glossy 14-2 records in the world do not change the fact that you can not win the big one. So, while the pedestrian Griz fan is happy with Hauck's wonderful coaching job, and Phenicie suddenly becoming an offensive genius five years later, this fan understands that the days of winning a National Championship under this coaching regime are over.

Hauck and Phenicie panicked last Friday in the second quarter. A calm coach who stuck to his game plan would have allowed his team to have a chance to come back. Richmond's coach London showed what sticking to your game plan can do in their game against Northern Iowa, where they just kept doing what had been successful all season, and prevailed at the end. What a difference in coaching ability. But then, we can always count on going 4-0 next season with our annual parade of home games against Division II patsies, while Richmond plays its annual tough schedule with actual road games and games against FBS teams.

I guess I'll just have to remain a "bad fan". And, that's alright with me. ;)

[andy7171]

If you guys don't want him, I know a CAA school that would take 16 straight trips to the post season in a heartbeat.

[JohnStOnge]

I don't think a fan is necessarily a "bad" fan if he or she dislikes the head coach but I also, looking at it from the outside, haven't seen any indication that the Montana program's suffered under Hauk. It looks to me like the program's pretty much sustained the same high level it's been at for many years. Richmond's a very good team.

[Wolfman]

If you guys don't want him, I know a CAA school that would take 16 straight trips to the post season in a heartbeat.


Let me assure you that you would eat your words if you had him and his buddy, O-coordinator Rob Phenicie coaching your team. You don't seem to understand that any coach plugged into the Montana program can duplicate Hauck's record. There are only two other FCS schools who have the tremendous recruiting advantages over their competitors that Montana does (Delaware and App. State). Is it any wonder why all three of these schools are consistantly competing for the NC?

Put Hauck/Phen Phen at Coastal Carolina, UT Chattanooga, or Northeastern, and they disappear. Onr thing, though, is you could count on signing a bunch of mis-fit IA drop-downs into your programs.

[griz8791]

I didn't see much evidence of that tremendous recruiting advantage in either the JMU or Richmond games. And I intend this as a compliment to JMU and Richmond, not as a slam on our guys.

[uofmman1122]

This thread reeks of

http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t109/Marty_Grant1122/BeatDeadHorse.gif

[JALMOND]

As we all gather for our pre-game tailgate parties at the hotel or in the stadium parking lot, then during the game itself, and afterward in the parking lot or back at the hotel, we find ourselves, with our beer bellies hanging over our belt buckles, brimming with emotion about whatever outcome occured in the game. A win and we are world beaters who can give the New England Patriots a good game, if we ever were given a chance. A loss and the coach should have done this, and if I was the coach, I would have done the fly pattern sooner, or kept running the ball up the middle until it was stopped, or taught better tackling techniques, or some other advice, and by God that coach better listen to me or we are never winning a game ever again. Is this a "bad fan"? I say not, just simply a fan. We all have a bit of the Wolfman in all of us when it comes down to our team. I myself was critical of both Glanville and Davis this year at Portland State, yet they have been coaching since before I was born, so they must know something about the game. If someone off the street were to come up to you in your profession with a beer in one hand (none for you) and ask you why you did something one way or another in relation to your job, would you actually listen to them? Not a bad fan, just simply a fan.

[MacThor]

That depends.....does the fan make stuff up that didn't really happen in a game to bolster his case against the coach?

[Proud Griz Man]

I don't think a fan is necessarily a "bad" fan if he or she dislikes the head coach but I also, looking at it from the outside, haven't seen any indication that the Montana program's suffered under Hauck. It looks to me like the program's pretty much sustained the same high level it's been at for many years. Richmond's a very good team.

Nice post, you Sugarcoater. yummmm ... sugar

JSO put things in perspective (sustained high level).

Consider that wolfie-pickel-boy is an extremely unhappy person, who finds it necessary to spew his venom at coach Hauck despite a 14-2 season where the Griz make it to the chipper in a year when they were commonly projected to finish 2nd in the BSC, projected to possibly miss the 2008 playoffs, and consensus was to expect a 7-5 or 8-4 record in 2008.

I like Bob Hauck, and like his staff. I don't always agree with them, but I like the job they do with the program. yummmm ..... sugar

[LacesOut]

You sure can. That's part of being a fan, being critical (as well as being supportive).

I'm an Eagles fan and would love to see Andy Reid get his fat azz tossed outta Philly.

[Montanan]

...
my question to the national FCS fan base is this one.... "can a fan dislike the head coach of his team, and still be a "good fan"????

well, since you asked, and i'm limiting my response to your case only, NO! that said, glad I could assist you in this matter. xlolx

[SeattleGriz]

I may be wrong here, but Wolfie sounds like poster colsteveAustin on egriz. If this is true, then he is the same person that went to the University of Washington board to lay out one falsehood after another about the Griz program.

He must have done it just in case the Washington AD was reading his posts on the Husky board, so they would now know that Hauck would be a bad fit for the glorious head coach position at that dump of a program, UW.

Who goes to another board (hint hint) and spreads Montana trash - other than obviously me, who got sucked into this one.

To keep this short. The person (Wolfie/colsteveaustin) basically said that the reason Montana was successful was because some wealthy guy with a tractor built the stadium. That's it - no effort needed other than a nice stadium. Forget the fact that Don Read, the coach who won our first national championship built the team up, or all the other coaches that maintained that level.

If Wolfie, you are indeed colsteveaustin, then yes, you are a bad fan. Someone who has apparently never played a competitive sport in your life and spreads nothing but hate and discontent.

As stated by other posters, at least with Alpha, he backs up his facts.

[eaglesrthe1]

Let me assure you that you would eat your words if you had him and his buddy, O-coordinator Rob Phenicie coaching your team. You don't seem to understand that any coach plugged into the Montana program can duplicate Hauck's record. There are only two other FCS schools who have the tremendous recruiting advantages over their competitors that Montana does (Delaware and App. State). Is it any wonder why all three of these schools are consistantly competing for the NC?

Put Hauck/Phen Phen at Coastal Carolina, UT Chattanooga, or Northeastern, and they disappear. Onr thing, though, is you could count on signing a bunch of mis-fit IA drop-downs into your programs.

Jerry Moore coached at ASU for 16 years before the Mountaineers even made it to the title game, and a large contingent of their fans were screaming for his head just the year before they won their first one. He is not an example to use as "proof" of your position.

If you think that "it's the program" that gives a coach every thing it takes... then look at GSU.

[Green26]

Here's the play-by-play for UM in the 2nd quarter. You can decide yourself whether this is evidence of panic by the UM coaches in the 2nd quarter.

Down by 7 (note the penalty and the down and distance):

U 1-10 U25 MONTANA drive start at 14:53.
U 1-10 U25 [SHOT], Cole Bergquist sideline pass complete to Steve Pfahler for 14 yards
to the UM39 (Derek Hatcher), PENALTY UM illegal block 12 yards to the
UM13, NO PLAY.
U 1-22 U13 [SHOT], Chase Reynolds rush over right guard for 2 yards to the UM15 (Martin
Parker;C. McConaghy).
U 2-20 U15 [SHOT], Cole Bergquist middle pass incomplete to Chase Reynolds.
U 3-20 U15 [SHOT], Cole Bergquist rush right for 6 yards to the UM21 (C. McConaghy).
U 4-14 U21 Ken Wood punt 34 yards to the RICHMOND45, Derek Hatcher return 21 yards to
the UM34 (George Mercer).

Down by 14 (the sideline pass was a swing pass):

U 1-10 U26 MONTANA drive start at 11:23.
U 1-10 U26 [I], Cole Bergquist sideline pass incomplete to Marc Mariani (Derek
Hatcher).
U 2-10 U26 Chase Reynolds rush over left guard for 6 yards to the UM32 (Michael
Ireland).
U 3-4 U32 [SHOT], Cole Bergquist middle pass complete to Marc Mariani for 11 yards to
the UM43, 1ST DOWN UM (Seth Williams).
U 1-10 U43 [SHOT], Cole Bergquist sideline pass complete to Mike Ferriter for 2 yards
to the UM45 (Derek Hatcher).
U 2-8 U45 [SHOT], Cole Bergquist pass incomplete.
U 3-8 U45 [SHOT], Cole Bergquist sacked for loss of 1 yard to the UM44 (Pierre
Turner).
U 4-9 U44 Ken Wood punt 41 yards to the RICHMOND15, Derek Hatcher return 10 yards to
the RICHMOND25 (Dan Beaudin).

Down 21 (note that there's only 2 minutes left and 75 yards to go):

U 1-10 U25 MONTANA drive start at 02:08.
U 1-10 U25 Cole Bergquist rush for 4 yards to the UM29, fumble forced by Martin Parker,
fumble by Cole Bergquist recovered by RICHMOND Michael Ireland at UM29,
Michael Ireland for loss of 2 yards to the UM31 (Chase Reynolds).

[GrizFanStuckInUtah]

Here's the play-by-play for UM in the 2nd quarter. You can decide yourself whether this is evidence of panic by the UM coaches in the 2nd quarter.

Down by 7 (note the penalty and the down and distance):

U 1-10 U25 MONTANA drive start at 14:53.
U 1-10 U25 [SHOT], Cole Bergquist sideline pass complete to Steve Pfahler for 14 yards
to the UM39 (Derek Hatcher), PENALTY UM illegal block 12 yards to the
UM13, NO PLAY.
U 1-22 U13 [SHOT], Chase Reynolds rush over right guard for 2 yards to the UM15 (Martin
Parker;C. McConaghy).
U 2-20 U15 [SHOT], Cole Bergquist middle pass incomplete to Chase Reynolds.
U 3-20 U15 [SHOT], Cole Bergquist rush right for 6 yards to the UM21 (C. McConaghy).
U 4-14 U21 Ken Wood punt 34 yards to the RICHMOND45, Derek Hatcher return 21 yards to
the UM34 (George Mercer).

Down by 14 (the sideline pass was a swing pass):

U 1-10 U26 MONTANA drive start at 11:23.
U 1-10 U26 [I], Cole Bergquist sideline pass incomplete to Marc Mariani (Derek
Hatcher).
U 2-10 U26 Chase Reynolds rush over left guard for 6 yards to the UM32 (Michael
Ireland).
U 3-4 U32 [SHOT], Cole Bergquist middle pass complete to Marc Mariani for 11 yards to
the UM43, 1ST DOWN UM (Seth Williams).
U 1-10 U43 [SHOT], Cole Bergquist sideline pass complete to Mike Ferriter for 2 yards
to the UM45 (Derek Hatcher).
U 2-8 U45 [SHOT], Cole Bergquist pass incomplete.
U 3-8 U45 [SHOT], Cole Bergquist sacked for loss of 1 yard to the UM44 (Pierre
Turner).
U 4-9 U44 Ken Wood punt 41 yards to the RICHMOND15, Derek Hatcher return 10 yards to
the RICHMOND25 (Dan Beaudin).

Down 21 (note that there's only 2 minutes left and 75 yards to go):

U 1-10 U25 MONTANA drive start at 02:08.
U 1-10 U25 Cole Bergquist rush for 4 yards to the UM29, fumble forced by Martin Parker,
fumble by Cole Bergquist recovered by RICHMOND Michael Ireland at UM29,
Michael Ireland for loss of 2 yards to the UM31 (Chase Reynolds).

I have personally never said the coaches panicked, but felt they got away from the run too soon. That play by play above, only has what I would call 2 rushing plays. The ones by Cole were passes that he had to run with. xpeacex

[appstate38]

Jerry Moore coached at ASU for 16 years before the Mountaineers even made it to the title game, and a large contingent of their fans were screaming for his head just the year before they won their first one. He is not an example to use as "proof" of your position.

If you think that "it's the program" that gives a coach every thing it takes... then look at GSU.

Beat me to it. It is ok to disagree with the coach but facts usually present a better argument than just emotional response. Yeah in '04 Coach Moore and company had a bad year. But is was still a winning season. Fans will always be fans and critical of just about any and everything. Winning will keep them quiet for a time but they are always hanging around ready to pounce.

[Green26]

Utah, show us all the pass plays that should have been runs. Don't think you can point out very many.

[GrizFanStuckInUtah]

Utah, show us all the pass plays that should have been runs. Don't think you can point out very many.


Here's the play-by-play for UM in the 2nd quarter. You can decide yourself whether this is evidence of panic by the UM coaches in the 2nd quarter.

Down by 7 (note the penalty and the down and distance):

U 1-10 U25 MONTANA drive start at 14:53.
U 1-10 U25 [SHOT], Cole Bergquist sideline pass complete to Steve Pfahler for 14 yards
to the UM39 (Derek Hatcher), PENALTY UM illegal block 12 yards to the
UM13, NO PLAY.
U 1-22 U13 [SHOT], Chase Reynolds rush over right guard for 2 yards to the UM15 (Martin
Parker;C. McConaghy).
U 2-20 U15 [SHOT], Cole Bergquist middle pass incomplete to Chase Reynolds.
U 3-20 U15 [SHOT], Cole Bergquist rush right for 6 yards to the UM21 (C. McConaghy).
U 4-14 U21 Ken Wood punt 34 yards to the RICHMOND45, Derek Hatcher return 21 yards to
the UM34 (George Mercer).

Down by 14 (the sideline pass was a swing pass):

U 1-10 U26 MONTANA drive start at 11:23.
U 1-10 U26 [I], Cole Bergquist sideline pass incomplete to Marc Mariani (Derek
Hatcher).
U 2-10 U26 Chase Reynolds rush over left guard for 6 yards to the UM32 (Michael
Ireland).
U 3-4 U32 [SHOT], Cole Bergquist middle pass complete to Marc Mariani for 11 yards to
the UM43, 1ST DOWN UM (Seth Williams).
U 1-10 U43 [SHOT], Cole Bergquist sideline pass complete to Mike Ferriter for 2 yards
to the UM45 (Derek Hatcher).
U 2-8 U45 [SHOT], Cole Bergquist pass incomplete.
U 3-8 U45 [SHOT], Cole Bergquist sacked for loss of 1 yard to the UM44 (Pierre
Turner).
U 4-9 U44 Ken Wood punt 41 yards to the RICHMOND15, Derek Hatcher return 10 yards to
the RICHMOND25 (Dan Beaudin).

Down 21 (note that there's only 2 minutes left and 75 yards to go):

U 1-10 U25 MONTANA drive start at 02:08.
U 1-10 U25 Cole Bergquist rush for 4 yards to the UM29, fumble forced by Martin Parker,
fumble by Cole Bergquist recovered by RICHMOND Michael Ireland at UM29,
Michael Ireland for loss of 2 yards to the UM31 (Chase Reynolds).

The sack goes as a rush for sure stat wise, but is a passing play IMO. The other 2 I can't say for sure were passes that ended up rushes or a qb draw or a designed run. I'd have to see a replay but he got a lot of pressure and had to scramble a lot. I am not trying to defend Wolfman and his behavior, just having a good discussion is how I look at this xpeacex I'm proud of the Griz and have no complaints about this season. I do see how it could be argued we didn't run it as much as we should have. It's still to painful for me to watch the replay :D

[Wolfman]

The sack goes as a rush for sure stat wise, but is a passing play IMO. The other 2 I can't say for sure were passes that ended up rushes or a qb draw or a designed run. I'd have to see a replay but he got a lot of pressure and had to scramble a lot. I am not trying to defend Wolfman and his behavior, just having a good discussion is how I look at this xpeacex I'm proud of the Griz and have no complaints about this season. I do see how it could be argued we didn't run it as much as we should have. It's still to painful for me to watch the replay :D


defend Wolfy and his "behavior"???? Oh Puh-leasssse. What, is this kindergarter?

[rob_p469]

If any of you have visited the Montana Grizzly message board, you would immediately become emersed into the on-going soap opera there between the "Hauck haters", and the sugar coaters who think the man is the second coming.

The legions of sugar coaters who reside there, led by their self-appointed leader, Green26, have pinned the "bad fan" lable on any poster who dares to be critical of Bobby Hauck, our O-coordinator Rob Phenicie, or any other coach, for that matter.

my question to the national FCS fan base is this one.... "can a fan dislike the head coach of his team, and still be a "good fan"????

I wouldn't say you could be LABELED (Wolfies education comes through again) a bad fan for disliking a coach, but you can be labeled a bad fan if you dislike him for the wrong reasons. I understand that you want the big personality guys back, like your Don Read's or Joe Glenn's. Hauck will never be one of those guys. But we are in a different era. Disliking a head coach because his style or personality don't suit you as a fan can get you labeled a bad fan no doubt. What other coach would you rather have had that could have posted a 65-16 record over the last 6 years? It is perfectly ok to dislike the coach, but to lay waiting in the weeds for him to slip up so you can jump all over him is a bit harsh. Hauck is a GOOD coach, not a GREAT coach, and that is ok. Great coaches are few and far between, but so are good ones. How many other FCS schools out there would love to have a Bobby Hauck? Just my 2 bits... Carry on xcoffeex

[Screamin_Eagle174]

Of course you can dislike a coach and not be a bad fan. I'm pretty sure the entire die-hard fan base of Northern Colorado hates their coach... but for justified. When there's a couple or a small group of fans that lambast their coach for going 14-2 because he could've done more... well, that's just pathetic and lame.

Go become a "fan" of Northern Colorado.

[Screamin_Eagle174]

And it's LABEL. LABELED. LABELING.

[Jerbearasu]

I wouldn't say you could be LABELED (Wolfies education comes through again) a bad fan for disliking a coach, but you can be labeled a bad fan if you dislike him for the wrong reasons. I understand that you want the big personality guys back, like your Don Read's or Joe Glenn's. Hauck will never be one of those guys. But we are in a different era. Disliking a head coach because his style or personality don't suit you as a fan can get you labeled a bad fan no doubt. What other coach would you rather have had that could have posted a 65-16 record over the last 6 years? It is perfectly ok to dislike the coach, but to lay waiting in the weeds for him to slip up so you can jump all over him is a bit harsh. Hauck is a GOOD coach, not a GREAT coach, and that is ok. Great coaches are few and far between, but so are good ones. How many other FCS schools out there would love to have a Bobby Hauck? Just my 2 bits... Carry on xcoffeex

I agree with you 100% on this post but you said it yourself he is a good coach not a great coach. If you ask most people they would say Montana is a great program so would they not deserve a great coach? It is tough to knock a guy that has taken his team to 2 NC games in his 6 years and failed to make the playoffs but for great programs that is expected. This is why Georgia Southern dumped their coach back in 05 so you definitely do need to be careful what you wish for...

[Wolfman]

I wouldn't say you could be LABELED (Wolfies education comes through again) a bad fan for disliking a coach, but you can be labeled a bad fan if you dislike him for the wrong reasons. I understand that you want the big personality guys back, like your Don Read's or Joe Glenn's. Hauck will never be one of those guys. But we are in a different era. Disliking a head coach because his style or personality don't suit you as a fan can get you labeled a bad fan no doubt. What other coach would you rather have had that could have posted a 65-16 record over the last 6 years? It is perfectly ok to dislike the coach, but to lay waiting in the weeds for him to slip up so you can jump all over him is a bit harsh. Hauck is a GOOD coach, not a GREAT coach, and that is ok. Great coaches are few and far between, but so are good ones. How many other FCS schools out there would love to have a Bobby Hauck? Just my 2 bits... Carry on xcoffeex


You asked the question "what other coach could have posted a 65-16 record over the last six years"? Answer, with Hauck's penchant for playing non-conference body bag games, his refusal to ever play tough non-conference away games (the Cal Poly game this year was the first non-conference test Hauck has agreed to in the past 4 years), and the weakness of the Big Sky, almost any good high school coach in Montana could have accomplished that record. You think i'm kidding on this, but i'm not.

[rob_p469]

No need to lie in your posts about me to try and elevate your position as the biggest name dropper and jock sniffer in Grizland. I NEVER root against the Griz, and I NEVER dis any players on the team.

As Alpha has stated, all of the glossy 14-2 records in the world do not change the fact that you can not win the big one. So, while the pedestrian Griz fan is happy with Hauck's wonderful coaching job, and Phenicie suddenly becoming an offensive genius five years later, this fan understands that the days of winning a National Championship under this coaching regime are over.

Hauck and Phenicie panicked last Friday in the second quarter. A calm coach who stuck to his game plan would have allowed his team to have a chance to come back. Richmond's coach London showed what sticking to your game plan can do in their game against Northern Iowa, where they just kept doing what had been successful all season, and prevailed at the end. What a difference in coaching ability. But then, we can always count on going 4-0 next season with our annual parade of home games against Division II patsies, while Richmond plays its annual tough schedule with actual road games and games against FBS teams.

I guess I'll just have to remain a "bad fan". And, that's alright with me. ;)

At least you can finally admit it. By the way, who were the 4 division II patsies we played this year? Did Cal Poly drop to Division II? Oh wait, Wolfies making stuff up? Im shocked... poor little wolfie

[Wolfman]

And it's LABEL. LABELED. LABELING.

typos are always a big deal for non-athletes.........

[rob_p469]

You asked the question "what other coach could have posted a 65-16 record over the last six years"? Anser, with Hauck's penchant for playing non-conference body bag games, his refusal to ever play tough non-conference away games (the Cal Poly game this year was the first non-conference test Hauck has agreed to in the past 4 years), and the weakness of the Big Sky, almost any good high school coach in Montana could have accomplished that record. You think i'm kidding on this, but i'm not.


I know your not kidding, just misguided. And bitter. And possibly a little slow, at least on the spelling. Me fail English? Thats unpossible!

[Wolfman]

I wouldn't say you could be LABELED (Wolfies education comes through again) a bad fan for disliking a coach, but you can be labeled a bad fan if you dislike him for the wrong reasons. I understand that you want the big personality guys back, like your Don Read's or Joe Glenn's. Hauck will never be one of those guys. But we are in a different era. Disliking a head coach because his style or personality don't suit you as a fan can get you labeled a bad fan no doubt. What other coach would you rather have had that could have posted a 65-16 record over the last 6 years? It is perfectly ok to dislike the coach, but to lay waiting in the weeds for him to slip up so you can jump all over him is a bit harsh. Hauck is a GOOD coach, not a GREAT coach, and that is ok. Great coaches are few and far between, but so are good ones. How many other FCS schools out there would love to have a Bobby Hauck? Just my 2 bits... Carry on xcoffeex


Wolfies UM education comes through again. Your smug little comments have not gone unnoticed. My degree from UM is in biology, with a minor in chemistry. I graduated with a 3.6 GPA, got an MCAT score in the 74th percentile, and have founded and sold two medical device companies for multi-millions of dollars. Perhaps you should get some of my "education", Rob.

[rob_p469]

I agree with you 100% on this post but you said it yourself he is a good coach not a great coach. If you ask most people they would say Montana is a great program so would they not deserve a great coach? It is tough to knock a guy that has taken his team to 2 NC games in his 6 years and failed to make the playoffs but for great programs that is expected. This is why Georgia Southern dumped their coach back in 05 so you definitely do need to be careful what you wish for...

Of course I believe Montana deserves a great coach. But I believe that great coaches come along once in a decade, maybe. So in the glorious absence of great coaches knocking down our door, Hauck is as good as it gets at Montana. And as for Montana having a recruiting advantage? 75% Montana kids, 20% Washington and Idaho kids, and 5% percent Cali/Arizona. It's what the coaches get out of the kids that makes them good coaches. And these coaches got a lot out of their young kids this year.

[rob_p469]

Wolfies UM education comes through again. Your smug little comments have not gone unnoticed. My degree from UM is in biology, with a minor in chemistry. I graduated with a 3.6 GPA, got an MCAT score in the 74th percentile, and have founded and sold two medical device companies for multi-millions of dollars. Perhaps you should get some of my "education", Rob.

If all that education makes you a pompous prick, I will pass. I will stick to good ole common sense. I am a junior at the U right now and I know plenty of stupid ignorant people that have a lot of education. The sad thing is that you think by telling people this they will have to respect you in some sense. I know you are a smart, intelligent guy. You are also ignorant to any stats or facts that don't back up your form of reality. ALl the education in the world isn't going to change the fact that anybody with enough sense can see through your smoke screen. Pumping yourself up like you do in this post is just another way to hide insecurities. It's ok. We need fans like you to remind us other griz fans not to get too full of ourselves. I would hate to have more of us with such ridiculous expectations.

[GrizFanStuckInUtah]

Wolfies UM education comes through again. Your smug little comments have not gone unnoticed. My degree from UM is in biology, with a minor in chemistry. I graduated with a 3.6 GPA, got an MCAT score in the 74th percentile, and have founded and sold two medical device companies for multi-millions of dollars. Perhaps you should get some of my "education", Rob.

There is that behavior that I am not defending in kindergarten again. I'm not gonna make it personal and don't think it ever needs to be with the coaches either. That is where you always seem to cross the line Wolfman. Discretion is the better part of valor. xthumbsupx

Count me out of this discussion, it's like infinity * http://ui31.gamespot.com/1214/deadhorsebeat_4.gif

[Screamin_Eagle174]

typos are always a big deal for non-athletes.........

When you repeatedly spell it incorrectly, it becomes less of a typo and more of a blatant misspelling.

But that's right... I forgot you were a catcher with the UM's Men's Baseball Team. Or was it for the team? One of the two. xlolx

[Green26]

Contrary to what Wolfman said, UM does not play many body bag games and the Big Sky conference has not been weak.

During Hauck's tenure, UM played Fort Lewis twice, West Washington once, and Central Washington this year. CWU was a very good team. UM has also played So. Utah several times. SU is a western team, and a team that many good teams plays. SU had some wins this year.

In addition, during Hauck's tenure, UM has played:
Maine (twice)
No. Dak. St.,
Sam Houston (3 times)
Idaho,
Cal Poly (5 or 6 times)
West. Ill.
Hofstra,
Northwestern St.
New Hampshire
James Madison (twice)
Oregon
So. Dak. St. (twice)
Iowa
McNeese
So. Ill.
UMass
Albany
Wofford
UC Davis
Texas State
Richmond

The Big Sky conference was one of the top 3 conferences this year. The conference was down in '07, but it was the top-rated conference in the prior 4-year period.

[DuckDuckGriz]

Wolf,

The problem is that you get facts presented to you case after case and you make a lame attempt to dodge them. The problem is that you have some weird personal issue with Hauck and people on eGriz, and guess what, no one really cares what you have to gripe about this time.

What's funny about this is - if Montana had won the national championship on Friday, you would be nowhere to be found. I found it rather convenient that you disappeared during the playoff run as well.

Another problem with you is that you attempt to elevate yourself, name drop from time to time (no one cares who you've dined with or how much you claim to make) - as this is what you have done when you're backed into a corner and have no response. Or, revert to some kind of personal attack, say "jock sniffer" etc.

[DuckDuckGriz]

Contrary to what Wolfman said, UM does not play many body bag games and the Big Sky conference has not been weak.

During Hauck's tenure, UM played Fort Lewis twice, West Washington once, and Central Washington this year. CWU was a very good team. UM has also played So. Utah several times. SU is a western team, and a team that many good teams plays. SU had some wins this year.

In addition, during Hauck's tenure, UM has played:
Maine (twice)
No. Dak. St.,
Sam Houston (3 times)
Idaho,
Cal Poly (5 or 6 times)
West. Ill.
Hofstra,
Northwestern St.
New Hampshire
James Madison (twice)
Oregon
So. Dak. St. (twice)
Iowa
McNeese
So. Ill.
UMass
Albany
Wofford
UC Davis
Texas State
Richmond

The Big Sky conference was one of the top 3 conferences this year. The conference was down in '07, but it was the top-rated conference in the prior 4-year period.


Once again, facts. Good luck getting a valid response on this one.

[Green26]

Utah, the 3 plays you hightlighted (and suggested should not have started as passes) are as follows:

3rd and 20
3rd and 8
1st and 10 (from UM's 25 yd line with 2:08 to go in the half).

With all due respect, all of those should have been passes, like they were.

[DuckDuckGriz]

Wolfies UM education comes through again. Your smug little comments have not gone unnoticed. My degree from UM is in biology, with a minor in chemistry. I graduated with a 3.6 GPA, got an MCAT score in the 74th percentile, and have founded and sold two medical device companies for multi-millions of dollars. Perhaps you should get some of my "education", Rob.

It's posts like this why no one takes you seriously. It's evident that your social skills may need some tweaking.

[Wolfman]

It's posts like this why no one takes you seriously. It's evident that your social skills may need some tweaking.



Whatever, rubber duckie. I am very comfortable in my skin. Most posters who know the game of football, and are not the arm-chair pedestrian type, like you, whose feet have never graced an athletic playing field, know that my observations about Bobby Hauck are valid.

All of the confirmation I need come from the many unbiased posts made on this board about Montana getting outcoached from FCS fans who watched the NC game. My son, who is not even a Griz fan, attended the game in person, and the first thing he said to me after the game was "how can a coach let his QB get sacked 7 times without ever throwing a screen pass, or running a draw play"? Pretty much sums it up.

[Wolfman]

Once again, facts. Good luck getting a valid response on this one.


What is a "valid response"? Is that one which agrees with your opinion that directional Washington I and II, and Southern Utah, who has won about 3 games during the past four seasons means the Griz have played a good schedule?

Why don't you and your buddy Greenie tell us how many AWAY GAMES Hauck's teams have played against FCS teams ranked in the Top 20 nationally during the past six years? The only reason the Griz agreed to play Cal Poly in Santa Barbara this season was that they had already bought-out two promised away games with them in the recent past. How could they face them again if they tried to do it a third time??? I hope you will not forget that your boy, Bobby, told everyone, including the media, that his Griz team would lose that Cal Poly game, in advance. Talk about trying to cover one's arse before the loss!!!! Pathetic, coming from a head coach whose team was ranked in the Top 5-6 in the country at that time!

Anyone who even ATTEMPTS to spin the Griz schedule as being a strong one, is snorting Frosted Flakes.

[SeattleGriz]

What is a "valid response"? Is that one which agrees with your opinion that directional Washington I and II, and Southern Utah, who has won about 3 games during the past four seasons means the Griz have played a good schedule?

Why don't you and your buddy Greenie tell us how many AWAY GAMES Hauck's teams have played against FCS teams ranked in the Top 20 nationally during the past six years? The only reason the Griz agreed to play Cal Poly in Santa Barbara this season was that they had already bought-out two promised away games with them in the recent past. How could they face them again if they tried to do it a third time??? I hope you will not forget that your boy, Bobby, told everyone, including the media, that his Griz team would lose that Cal Poly game, in advance. Talk about trying to cover one's arse before the loss!!!! Pathetic, coming from a head coach whose team was ranked in the Top 5-6 in the country at that time!

Anyone who even ATTEMPTS to spin the Griz schedule as being a strong one, is snorting Frosted Flakes.

Must be the Santa Barbara campus of Cal Poly San Luis Obispo. xthumbsupx

As for the Griz schedule, you must not be aware of the budget deficit that UM had to overcome which did nothing to help scheduling.

[Wolfman]

Must be the Santa Barbara campus of Cal Poly San Luis Obispo. xthumbsupx

As for the Griz schedule, you must not be aware of the budget deficit that UM had to overcome which did nothing to help scheduling.



Whatever. Posters like you lurk in wait to try to catch some menial little point to make a big deal of. All this shows is that you have nothing to say........xeyebrowx

[Wolfman]

Must be the Santa Barbara campus of Cal Poly San Luis Obispo. xthumbsupx

As for the Griz schedule, you must not be aware of the budget deficit that UM had to overcome which did nothing to help scheduling.

You have been duped by the O'Day budget machine. This is the stock excuse for scheduling the parade of patsies that shuttle into the friendly confines every Saturday in September to provide amusement for the drunken legions. Very similar to the Roman Coliseum.

O'Day and Hauck duck every invitation to play a quality team away, preferring to use the ole' "budget problems" mantra to dumb-down the fans who desire a competitive schedule. And, even if O'Day promises a home-n-home with a strong team, he makes them come to Missoula first, then uses the ole' "budget thing" again to buy out the return away game. Ask Cal Poly, Maine, and South Dakota State their opinions of O'Day's football scheduling! That budget B.S. was paid off years ago. Yet, they are still getting mileage out of it. Jeesh, the pedestrian Griz fan is not very smart. xnonono2x

[agsadmin]

I am not going to put my moderators and myself in a position where we have to continually clean up the same thread. Enough posts in this thread were a violation of TOS with several warnings and strikes thrown out to those deemed as going a bit too far.