Hofstra as an all-sports A10 member?

[Fordham]

There's a thread on our board about a radio appearance that Hofstra's basketball coach had with Mike Francesca where they were supposedly discussing the move of Hofstra to the A10.

Any Hofstra fans know if this is just some typical no-substance back and forth or if there might be something to it?

Wonder how a move like that would impact football? You have to assume that the CAA has no room for football-only members.

Again, I have no idea if there's substance to the discussion or not but it sounds like it was certainly a topic that was discussed openly on a well known NY radio show.

[89Hen]

Hmmmm, very interesting. Now if we can just get Northeastern to leave the CAA... xeyebrowx xeyebrowx

[Dukie95]

There's a thread on our board about a radio appearance that Hofstra's basketball coach had with Mike Francesca where they were supposedly discussing the move of Hofstra to the A10.

Any Hofstra fans know if this is just some typical no-substance back and forth or if there might be something to it?

Wonder how a move like that would impact football? You have to assume that the CAA has no room for football-only members.

Again, I have no idea if there's substance to the discussion or not but it sounds like it was certainly a topic that was discussed openly on a well known NY radio show.

I don't know about any of that, but the CAA has plenty of football-only members.

Nova, Richmond, Maine, UNH, URI, UMass

[89Hen]

I don't know about any of that, but the CAA has plenty of football-only members.

Nova, Richmond, Maine, UNH, URI, UMass
And when ODU starts and if GSU gets going, it would be nice to part ways with football affiliates. Not that I don't like them, but I dislike the thought of 14 teams more.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

And when ODU starts and if GSU gets going, it would be nice to part ways with football affiliates. Not that I don't like them, but I dislike the thought of 14 teams more.

xeekx xeekx xeekx

Whuh? 89hen, don't tell me you've seen the light about the CAA being too big? xsmiley_wix

[danefan]

Very very interesting.

[Dukie95]

I don't know guys...Mike Francesa typically interviews himself with guests on the phone. He could have very easily put words into Pecora's mouth.

I would have to hear the interview to know how much stock to put into it.

[89Hen]

xeekx xeekx xeekx

Whuh? 89hen, don't tell me you've seen the light about the CAA being too big? xsmiley_wix
You've never heard me defend the size of the CAA. I hate it, always have. I just don't think it's a big deal when it comes time for at-larges. xpeacex

I would just love to see one conference, one set of teams, all playing each other.

[danefan]

I don't know guys...Mike Francesa typically interviews himself with guests on the phone. He could have very easily put words into Pecora's mouth.

I would have to hear the interview to know how much stock to put into it.

sounds like exactly what happened. Here's what was posted on the Fordham board:


Mike Francesa had Hofstra coach Tom Pecora on this afternoon. A pretty good college basketball interview, all in all. Lots of talk about local teams. They both thought a NY league like Philly's Big 5 and an annual NY area tournament would be a great things for NY college hoops. Among the other topics, Francesa asked about Hofstra moving up to a better league and he specifically mentioned a move to the A-10. He said Hofstra's president is a smart guy, getting the presidential debate and a medical school for Hofstra. He said his next project should be getting the Pride into a better conference and the A-10 would be a great fit. Just what Fordham needs...

[Fordham]

sounds like exactly what happened. Here's what was posted on the Fordham board:

danefan beat me to the punch here. i do think it was planted by Francesca or the comment originated with him but I also believe it wasn't something that was put to rest by Pecora either. Not that he has to squash it on the spot but the fact that it was openly discussed made me wonder whether or not any Hofstra fans in here might have heard the same.

[purplepeopleeaterv2]

Originally Posted by An Old Coach
He said his next project should be getting the Pride into a better conference and the A-10 would be a great fit. Just what Fordham needs...

Wow, talk about a smack in the face of the CAA. xbawlingx

[Lehigh Football Nation]

Looks like Mr. Francesca is not only trying to make some news, he's laboring under the outdated myth that A-10 basketball is better than CAA basketball. I mean, come on, is the A-10 that much better? I personally don't believe that. And how will that serve the football program to go to an affiliate scenario with the CAA? Answer: it doesn't serve it at all.

I think Mr. Fransesca thinks that Hofstra is a basketball school. They're not. And that's why they will never go to the A-10. End of story.

[89Hen]

I mean, come on, is the A-10 that much better?
No. And there were actually a couple years recently where the CAA was ranked higher. :)

[GannonFan]

Looks like Mr. Francesca is not only trying to make some news, he's laboring under the outdated myth that A-10 basketball is better than CAA basketball. I mean, come on, is the A-10 that much better? I personally don't believe that. And how will that serve the football program to go to an affiliate scenario with the CAA? Answer: it doesn't serve it at all.

I think Mr. Fransesca thinks that Hofstra is a basketball school. They're not. And that's why they will never go to the A-10. End of story.

The A10's still better than the CAA - the CAA made a run at them in the past few years but I don't think they ever did pass them, and now with the CAA looking like their going to have a dreadful year, it's possible the gap is widening again. They aren't significantly far apart, but they aren't equal yet either.

[bostonspider]

Well the A-10 had 3 teams in the NCAA's this past year, and the CAA had its usual 1. GMU's run to the Final 4 was thrilling, but in more years than not the CAA still gets screwed out of an at-large to the NCAA Basketball Tourney (witness VCU last year). Also look at Xavier ranked in the top 15 again this year, after an Elite 8 run last year. You do not see that out of the CAA.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

I think my point is made. While Xavier had a nice run last year, it's not like they're a million miles from CAA basketball. And moving to the A-10 would throw Hofstra's football team in disarray. They'd be trading full CAA representation for partial representation in the CAA (or Patriot League, or some sort of CAA North configuration) in football. I don't think that's what they want.

Also not to be underestimated is the personal animus between Fordham and Hofstra, the animus which prevents these two schools from playing each other every year in football and basketball (in the sort of "Big 5" situation that Mr. Fransceca is talking about).

Incidentally, that NY "Big 5" proposal also seems more like a pipe dream, too. Fordham, Hofstra, St. John's - and who else? Seton Hall? Manhattan? Wagner? Columbia? - just feels forced. There isn't the same academic thread running through these schools the same way the Philadelphia "Big 5" (LaSalle, Penn, Villanova, St. Joe's, Temple) has. Fordham (and Columbia too), for whatever reason, has felt that Hofstra isn't worthy of their presence.

[Dukie95]

Well the A-10 had 3 teams in the NCAA's this past year, and the CAA had its usual 1. GMU's run to the Final 4 was thrilling, but in more years than not the CAA still gets screwed out of an at-large to the NCAA Basketball Tourney (witness VCU last year). Also look at Xavier ranked in the top 15 again this year, after an Elite 8 run last year. You do not see that out of the CAA.

I agree with you and GannonFan that the CAA isn't quite there, but it's also not as far apart as you make it out to be...and the CAA is just really bad this year.

In the year Mason made their run, they were an at-large selection. The only reason the A-10 had two teams that year was because Pops Mensah-Bonsu was injured and missed the A-10 tournament, where GW lost their only A-10 game of the year in the final...I now forget who the A-10 winner was that year.

[danefan]

I think my point is made. While Xavier had a nice run last year, it's not like they're a million miles from CAA basketball. And moving to the A-10 would throw Hofstra's football team in disarray. They'd be trading full CAA representation for partial representation in the CAA (or Patriot League, or some sort of CAA North configuration) in football. I don't think that's what they want.

Also not to be underestimated is the personal animus between Fordham and Hofstra, the animus which prevents these two schools from playing each other every year in football and basketball (in the sort of "Big 5" situation that Mr. Fransceca is talking about).

Incidentally, that NY "Big 5" proposal also seems more like a pipe dream, too. Fordham, Hofstra, St. John's - and who else? Seton Hall? Manhattan? Wagner? Columbia? - just feels forced. There isn't the same academic thread running through these schools the same way the Philadelphia "Big 5" (LaSalle, Penn, Villanova, St. Joe's, Temple) has. Fordham (and Columbia too), for whatever reason, has felt that Hofstra isn't worthy of their presence.


I would love to see an Upstate vs. Downstate holiday bball tourney at the Garden!

Sort of a psuedo-NY State championship....The Governor's Cup.

Upstate
Albany, Siena, Buffalo, Colgate, St. Bonaventure, Binghamton, Marist, Iona (to even it out, and New Rochelle is upstate to Long Islanders).

Downstate
Stony Brook, Fordham, Hofstra, Columbia, Manhattan, Wagner, St. Francis (NY), LIU

You could also throw in Syracuse and St. John's but I doubt they'd be interested.

[DFW HOYA]

One thought: maybe it's travel costs. Most of the A-10 schools are bus trips, but it's expensive to be sending non-revenue sports to Georgia State, UNCW, the Virginia schools, etc.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

One thought: maybe it's travel costs. Most of the A-10 schools are bus trips, but it's expensive to be sending non-revenue sports to Georgia State, UNCW, the Virginia schools, etc.

True, but with the A-10 you still have Xavier, Dayton, Saint Louis, UNCC... still a lot of frequent-flyer miles.

[whitey]

One thought: maybe it's travel costs. Most of the A-10 schools are bus trips, but it's expensive to be sending non-revenue sports to Georgia State, UNCW, the Virginia schools, etc.


I dunno. They'd still have to make trips to Charlotte, St. Louis, Cincinnati, Dayton & Richmond.

[Tim James]

Yes I'd love to see Hofstra in the A10 for basketball and have Fordham finally come to their senses and join the Patriot for all sports.

[Jackman]

The A10 already has 14 members. I only see such a move happening if Fordham was kicked out. Which is conceivable, given the poor quality of athletic department and their refusal to do anything about their facilities. It's been speculated that the A10 might institute certain "minimum requirements" aimed at giving Fordham a kick in the pants. The funny thing is, most Fordham fans seem to be hoping that happens, they want to see progress happen one way or another. In a Fordham vs. Hofstra battle though, the advantage Fordham has is they're Catholic, and the A10 is run by the Catholic schools.

As for football, keep in mind that Hofstra typically plays more non-CAA members per season than full CAA members. If CAA Football splits up, does Hofstra really want to be the northern outpost? They'd lose their conference games against UMass, UNH, Maine, URI and maybe Villanova. Sure, there's still Northeastern, but who knows how long they're going to hang in there. The mood on the NU board is grim, there now seems to be more fans calling for ending the football program than improving it (though maybe those are just the loudest fans).

[Cobblestone]

Well, Hofstra did beat Fordham last night 60-40.

Yeah, I say let them in.

[Appfan_in_CAAland]

True, but with the A-10 you still have Xavier, Dayton, Saint Louis, UNCC... still a lot of frequent-flyer miles.

Not for long. I guarantee Xavier, Dayton, and Charlotte don't plan on being in the A-10 any longer than they have too. Perhaps Hofstra can have one of the spots vacated by one of them.

Personally, I think App State or College of Charleston would be a better fit as full time members in the CAA than Hofstra or Northeastern any way.

[ur2k]

Not going to happen unless this big conference shake-up ever happens. The a10 is too big as it is and they have a rep in the NY market already in Fordham.

[henfan]

Top to bottom across all sports, the CAA is a better conference competitively than the A-10. It just is. Not that the A-10 isn't also an exceptional mid-major conference with, admittedly, marginally superior MBB...

Conference moves are made with all sports in mind, not just FB or MBB. Of course the MBB coach at a given school is going to have a myopic view of what's best for his particular program, right or wrong. HU isn't likely to make a move because of one sport or another.

I can almost guarantee that, in the outside chance it ever came to the A-10 attempting to lure HU away, the CAA would put considerable pressure on HU not to make that move. My guess is that the state of their FB membership would absolutely be on the line. The UR & UMass analogies wouldn't apply. After spending years as a D-I indy, I can't believe HU would relish a return to split conference membership status or, worse still, independence.

[dennisdent]

Top to bottom across all sports, the CAA is a better conference competitively than the A-10. It just is.

Evidence to support this statement: What sports? Which teams?

Thanks

[DFW HOYA]

Not for long. I guarantee Xavier, Dayton, and Charlotte don't plan on being in the A-10 any longer than they have too.

Other than Charlotte and aspirations of C-USA, I'm not sure there's anywhere for X and Dayton to go, short of reforming the MCC.

[Jackman]

X and Dayton would head to the basketball half of the Big East if it ever split up. Probably St. Louis too.

[Longhorn]

Well, Hofstra did beat Fordham last night 60-40.

Yeah, I say let them in.


Hell, JMU beat Fordham by 20 at Fordham the other night, and we all know how poor JMU MBB has been this decade.

FWIW...I don't see Hofstra's going anywhere in the immediate future, at least not until ODU and GSU are both playing FB. HU fought hard to get into the CAA, and a jump to the A10 for MBB would be the kiss of death for their other teams like LAX.

[Jackman]

How would it hurt Hofstra lax? If the CAA pushed Hofstra or anyone else out of the lax conference, they'd lose their AQ and UMass and Penn State would leave as well, dropping the CAA to only 3 lax members and pretty much disbanding the conference.

[mainejeff]

How would it hurt Hofstra lax? If the CAA pushed Hofstra or anyone else out of the lax conference, they'd lose their AQ and UMass and Penn State would leave as well, dropping the CAA to only 3 lax members and pretty much disbanding the conference.

Exactly. I'm sure that America East would welcome Hofstra, UMass and Penn State lacrosse with open arms. :)

[89Hen]

I can almost guarantee that, in the outside chance it ever came to the A-10 attempting to lure HU away, the CAA would put considerable pressure on HU not to make that move. My guess is that the state of their FB membership would absolutely be on the line.
You're saying the CAA would kick somebody out? xeyebrowx That would go against everything you've said in the past on this subject. :)

[Appfan_in_CAAland]

X and Dayton would head to the basketball half of the Big East if it ever split up. Probably St. Louis too.

I think its pretty much a given that if the bigtime football-less Catholic basketball schools from the Big East were ever to break away, the bigtime football-less Catholic basketball schools of Xavier and Dayton would fit in nicely to round out the conference (St Louis and St Joe's, too).

[Longhorn]

How would it hurt Hofstra lax? If the CAA pushed Hofstra or anyone else out of the lax conference, they'd lose their AQ and UMass and Penn State would leave as well, dropping the CAA to only 3 lax members and pretty much disbanding the conference.


It would "hurt" only in the sense that HU would once again find its sports programs competing/spread out amongst two or more conferences. And lacking membership in an "all-sports" conference makes marketing/developing a fan base against rivals more problematic. Again, I don't see HU going anywhere. HU's admin likes being in the CAA for all sports, and HU has been a solid member of the CAA. The A10 really is not a good fit for them.

[DetroitFlyer]

I think its pretty much a given that if the bigtime football-less Catholic basketball schools from the Big East were ever to break away, the bigtime football-less Catholic basketball schools of Xavier and Dayton would fit in nicely to round out the conference (St Louis and St Joe's, too).

I sure would like to see 'football-less" Dayton kick some you know what in Boone one day.... Better yet, come to Dayton for some real fun. We'll see who is "football-less" then!

And Dayton would kill App in men's basketball. Does App even have a men's basketball team? From what I hear, App's basketball program, (if there is one), is pretty much the towel boy(s) for another fine PFL school, Davidson!

[tribe_pride]

I sure would like to see 'football-less" Dayton kick some you know what in Boone one day.... Better yet, come to Dayton for some real fun. We'll see who is "football-less" then!

And Dayton would kill App in men's basketball. Does App even have a men's basketball team? From what I hear, App's basketball program, (if there is one), is pretty much the towel boy(s) for another fine PFL school, Davidson!

xflaggedx xflaggedx

30 yards for Smack talk about basketball in an FCS Discussion thread

[henfan]

Evidence to support this statement: What sports? Which teams?

Thanks

FB and MLAX come to mind. How has the A-10 faired recently in those sports compared with the CAA?xrolleyesx

In MBB & WBB, the differences in the two leagues are marginal, IMO, though the A-10 holds a significant advantage historically. But in what other sports in which the two leagues actually compete does the A-10 hold any significant competitive advantage? Volleyball?

Top to bottom, all sports considered, the CAA is a better, more complete conference, IMO. Again, I'm not slagging the A-10. It's a nice mid-major conference.

As for Hofstra MLAX holding any bargining chip with the CAA... ah, see ya. As CAA all sports membership: Hoffy out, Albany or Stony Brook in. Do AEC fans really want to see thier conference decimated yet again by the CAA? Be careful what you wish for.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

Top to bottom, all sports considered, the CAA is a better, more complete conference, IMO. Again, I'm not slagging the A-10. It's a nice mid-major basketball conference.

Fixed it for you. BTW, I'm in total agreement with you.

[mainejeff]

As for Hofstra MLAX holding any bargining chip with the CAA... ah, see ya. As CAA all sports membership: Hoffy out, Albany or Stony Brook in. Do AEC fans really want to see thier conference decimated yet again by the CAA? Be careful what you wish for.

Do you REALLY think that a Southern based conference is going to invite ANOTHER Northern school in these difficult economic times? xconfusedx

I'm sure that Virginia schools, UNCW, and Georgia State would relish the thought of sending their non-revenue teams back to Long Island or up to Albany. xrolleyesx

[bostonspider]

Mid Major Basketball conferences do not regularly put 3 teams in the NCAA tournament. Since 1998 the A10 has averaged 2.7 bids to the NCAA and 2.5 more to the NIT, including 3 NCAA and 4 NIT last year. In those 11 season, the A10 has only gotten 1 NCAA bid 2 years. 5 years of 3 bids, 2 years of 2 bids and one year each of 4 and 5 bids. For the CAA, they have average 1.2 NCAA bids and 1.5 NIT bids, with 1 NCAA and 1 NIT last season. They have received 2 NCAA bids in 2006 and 2007, and only 1 every other year.

[Uncle Buck]

Whoa, i go away from the boards for a few days and Hofstra decided to move to the A-10 in hoops!

From what i know, and i know someone in the know, there has been no talk about a hoops move to the A-10. But then again, what do i know.

[Appfan_in_CAAland]

I think its pretty much a given that if the bigtime football-less Catholic basketball schools from the Big East were ever to break away, the bigtime football-less Catholic basketball schools of Xavier and Dayton would fit in nicely to round out the conference (St Louis and St Joe's, too).


I sure would like to see 'football-less" Dayton kick some you know what in Boone one day....

Calm down there Flyer, I've always defended Dayton and the PFL on this board. I orginially inserted the word "bigtime" for a reason. I wasn't as clear as I'd should have been, but I was intending to destinguish between the Big East's football members and the various FCS and non-football schools involved including Dayton as well as Georgetown and Villanova. Sorry if I offended.

[andy7171]

Hell, JMU beat Fordham by 20 at Fordham the other night, and we all know how poor JMU MBB has been this decade.

FWIW...I don't see Hofstra's going anywhere in the immediate future, at least not until ODU and GSU are both playing FB. HU fought hard to get into the CAA, and a jump to the A10 for MBB would be the kiss of death for their other teams like LAX.

Hostra could jump ship from the CAA in all sports and still be welcome as LAX only. xpeacex
The CAA isn't stupid to give up the Long Island connection.

[andy7171]

I sure would like to see 'football-less" Dayton kick some you know what in Boone one day.... Better yet, come to Dayton for some real fun. We'll see who is "football-less" then!

And Dayton would kill App in men's basketball. Does App even have a men's basketball team? From what I hear, App's basketball program, (if there is one), is pretty much the towel boy(s) for another fine PFL school, Davidson!

Didn't Jacksonville get rung up 56-6 in Boone? How'd ya'll fare against the 'Phins?

[Seawolf97]

Hostra could jump ship from the CAA in all sports and still be welcome as LAX only. xpeacex
The CAA isn't stupid to give up the Long Island connection.

I believe Penn State will play in the CAA this spring for lacrosse only. So it can be done. What about the Prides nationally ranked wrestling program? I suspect Hofstra will stay where they are for the immediate future.

[henfan]

Do you REALLY think that a Southern based conference is going to invite ANOTHER Northern school in these difficult economic times? xconfusedx

I'm sure that Virginia schools, UNCW, and Georgia State would relish the thought of sending their non-revenue teams back to Long Island or up to Albany. xrolleyesx

I've not read many complaints from CAA member schools about travel, which is why they've not adopted divisional splits for Olympic sports. Probably similar to UMaine not complaining a whole lot about having to board flights to Binghamton, LI and Baltimore, for example.

It was a completely hypothetical scenario that was presented, but I've demonstrated how the HU-to-the-A-10 fantasy scenario could be easily remedied. Replacing one NY school with another would represent little difference to the status quo.

That said, HU is going nowhere.

[Kymermosst]

FB and MLAX come to mind. How has the A-10 faired recently in those sports compared with the CAA?

Well, let's see...The A-10 is undefeated in both sports, while the CAA has put up some impressive numbers but still has a higher losing percentage.

Personally, if I were Hofstra, I wouldn't even want to consider the move. The A-10 might be a good fit for the Olympic sports, but they'd still have to be a CAA affiliate for FB and MLAX, and A-10/14 basketball is already overcrowded. Then again, depending on the MBB game on the 20th, I may decide that it'd be nice to see even more of Hofstra in Amherst.