Grambling sandbagging for Eugene

[SeattleGriz]

Does anyone else feel that Grambling kept Eugene in today to boost his stats? I see he was still the QB even when the score was 68-7 against Concordia. He had 417 yds and 5 TD's.

Eugene is a good player, but this is just obvious sandbagging.

[dwtime]

Does anyone else feel that Grambling kept Eugene in today to boost his stats? I see he was still the QB even when the score was 68-7 against Concordia. He had 417 yds and 5 TD's.

Eugene is a good player, but this is just obvious sandbagging.


One should really look at the competition also instead of just stats, SWAC is a weak conference, fact not opinion. Granted Grambling did play Washington St. and Eugene is excellent but still....

Someone with excellent stats from a good competitive conference should get the nod. I'm a UNH fan and of course pulling for Santos or Ball but I realistically think they probably hurt each others chances coming from the same team. Ball is great but I think it will be a QB. Id rather see Meyer or Santos get it over Eugene.

Also before this weekend Eugene only had a 56% completion percentage compared to 72% for Santos and 67% for Meyer.

[mikebigg]

IMO, Coach Spears isn't doing this to get Bruce any votes. I honestly don't think Bruce would get the required votes regardless of what he did...that was proven during the season that he finished 2nd despite having better numbers than the winners. In fact, he was named MVP on some teams but not first team All-American.

Spears is gonna run his offense regardless of score...some don't like it. I do! For one thing we are somewhat dayum if we do and dayum if we don't. Our league gets criticized for being weak. If we win a close game the comments are "see they only bet XXX by such and such"...when we win big, it's "they sandbag against weak teams".

So I take Spears approach...run your offense and your program to how you feel best. We recruit talent and we don't hold it back... it's been successful for him and has been beneficial to our recruiting. Folk don't like it...but I'm glad that Spears doesn't care what outsiders think. At least he's not a hypocrite who pretends to evaluate our players fairly and without bias.

[SeattleGriz]

IMO, Coach Spears isn't doing this to get Bruce any votes. I honestly don't think Bruce would get the required votes regardless of what he did...that was proven during the season that he finished 2nd despite having better numbers than the winners. In fact, he was named MVP on some teams but not first team All-American.

Spears is gonna run his offense regardless of score...some don't like it. I do! For one thing we are somewhat dayum if we do and dayum if we don't. Our league gets criticized for being weak. If we win a close game the comments are "see they only bet XXX by such and such"...when we win big, it's "they sandbag against weak teams".

So I take Spears approach...run your offense and your program to how you feel best. We recruit talent and we don't hold it back... it's been successful for him and has been beneficial to our recruiting. Folk don't like it...but I'm glad that Spears doesn't care what outsiders think. At least he's not a hypocrite who pretends to evaluate our players fairly and without bias.

Thanks for the input Mike. I have seen your posts before and know you don't make crap up.

[Eagle22]

I don't think it's sandbagging ..... but it might be stat-padding ...

In years past when Georgia Southern was running up some ugly scores (like today), you'd never see the starting backfield in during the 4th quarter. Otherwise, the Payton award that Westbrook deservedly won, might have been closer contested had Adrian Peterson played all 60 minutes each game that season.

BTW, in today's contest against Morehead St, our 3rd string QB played the last 16:39 of the game, with our second string QB logging 18:09 in the game.

Sometimes it pays to develop those guys who will suit up for you next season ... as well as those who may need some game-reps.

[GSUISBACK]

Third quarter

TD 9:12 CLYDE EDWARDS 27 YD PASS FROM BRUCE EUGENE (FAILED 2PT RUSH) Drive info: 7 plays, 63 yards.
7 68

FAILED 2PT RUSH FAILED 2PT RUSH FAILED 2PT RUSH FAILED 2PT RUSH FAILED 2PT RUSH FAILED 2PT RUSH 3 quarter 68 - 7

The same team that wanted a hurricane affected school to forfeit the game rather then rescheadule.

[putter]

I don't think it's sandbagging ..... but it might be stat-padding ...

In years past when Georgia Southern was running up some ugly scores (like today), you'd never see the starting backfield in during the 4th quarter. Otherwise, the Payton award that Westbrook deservedly won, might have been closer contested had Adrian Peterson played all 60 minutes each game that season.

BTW, in today's contest against Morehead St, our 3rd string QB played the last 16:39 of the game, with our second string QB logging 18:09 in the game.

Sometimes it pays to develop those guys who will suit up for you next season ... as well as those who may need some game-reps.

I understand what you are saying but they scored 82 POINTS !!! there was no reason to keep him in there that long. It is just bad.... :mad:

[Tod]

Third quarter

TD 9:12 CLYDE EDWARDS 27 YD PASS FROM BRUCE EUGENE (FAILED 2PT RUSH) Drive info: 7 plays, 63 yards.
7 68

FAILED 2PT RUSH FAILED 2PT RUSH FAILED 2PT RUSH FAILED 2PT RUSH FAILED 2PT RUSH FAILED 2PT RUSH 3 quarter 68 - 7

The same team that wanted a hurricane affected school to forfeit the game rather then rescheadule.

You're saying that up 68-7, Grambling attempted a two-point conversion? That's just sad. :mad: :mad: :mad:

[bobcatfan06]

They kept him in to prove to the Air Force coach that "black athletes are just faster.":)

[Eagle22]

I understand what you are saying but they scored 82 POINTS !!! there was no reason to keep him in there that long. It is just bad.... :mad:

I wasn't defending him ... I agree he shouldn't have been in there padding stats ... and that's what it is unless all your backups are unavailable for the game.

[R.A.]

Doesn't Grambling play Southern soon in the Bayou Classic?

[AppGuy04]

It doesn't matter who they play, If I was a voter, I would not vote for him just because of their schedule. And this incident just adds fuel to the fire.

[R.A.]

It doesn't matter who they play, If I was a voter, I would not vote for him just because of their schedule. And this incident just adds fuel to the fire.

-I'm just saying... I'm pretty sure that leaving Boo-Hoo in had little to do with post season awards, and more to do with staying on point for Southern.

[AppGuy04]

-I'm just saying... I'm pretty sure that leaving Boo-Hoo in had little to do with post season awards, and more to do with staying on point for Southern.

That could possibly be true, but the perception by others might look at that totally different

[R.A.]

That could possibly be true, but the perception by others might look at that totally different

-In all honesty, he's come so close twice already... if he doesn't win it this time, it will look more like he was shafted by the committee, then anything else.

[Pantherpower]

Eugene doensn't deserve it. The only one's getting the "shaft" would be the players on teams who put up big time numbers in big time games in big time conferences. Eugene??? Ha! Nope, nope, & NOPE!!!!!! Big numbers against Concordia??? So freaking what!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Tribe4SF]

Who the hell is Concordia-Selma?

They are not listed as a Div. II, Div. III or NAIA. A google yields a website that is unavailable.

Who do they play and what is Grambling doing playing this school?

[R.A.]

-You're making it seem as if this dude isn't a really football player because he's in the SWAC.

[Hansel]

Who the hell is Concordia-Selma?

They are not listed as a Div. II, Div. III or NAIA. A google yields a website that is unavailable.

Who do they play and what is Grambling doing playing this school?
I beleive it is their second year of football, don't know their classification

[Hansel]

-You're making it seem as if this dude isn't a really football player because he's in the SWAC.
He is a good football player, but his Stats get inflated by throwing multiple 4th Q TD's against Prairie View and Concordia (AL)

[Tribe4SF]

I doubt anyone would say Bruce is not good, but the stat padding is shameless. Against Prarie View, he tossed a 74 yd. TD pass with less than 5 minutes to go in the game.

When you look at his stats against the better teams Grambling has played, they're not Payton Award calibre.

[Tribe4SF]

Just checked stats (as of last week). Eugene's backup has thrown a grand total of 3 passes, even with all the blowouts.

[TexasTerror]

First off...Concordia-Selma (AL) is NAIA. My institution was set to play them in BKB before the Katrina slaughtered our athletics program...

Secondly, I've talked to the local media that cover the SWAC. They say they are just running up the score to give Eugene more prestige, recognition and such for the university.

[Coopernh]

Santos was 8 of 11 for 153 0 td's..He was pulled out 36 seconds into the 2ND QUARTER. YES 2ND QUARTER.. The score was 29-0 at the time. BTW Ball had 2 catches for 42 Yds. They both sat for the rest of the day.

[R.A.]

1.) Boo-Hoo deserves to be up for the Payton.
2.)What happen was classless, but it shouldn't affect Boo- Hoo's Payton drive that much. Blame the coach, not the player.
3.)I feel that Spears did it in preparation for Southern, not for Boo-Hoo's Payton stats.

-I'm not defending what happen, just saying you shouldn't blame the worker for what the Boss told him to do.

[bobcatfan06]

Too bad the SWAC can't (won't) play in the playoffs then we would see what he could do against real competition.

[R.A.]

Too bad the SWAC can't (won't) play in the playoffs then we would see what he could do against real competition.

-So the SWAC teams are imaginary competition? (By the way- I saw Gameday yesterday... they brought up Texas State)

[Tribe4SF]

What happened against Concordia is nothing new.

Grambling has had 5 blowout wins this year. Eugene's average stats in those games.

Attempts: 38.6...Completions: 23.8...Yards: 459.2...Ints: 0...Pctg.: 61.7%

In their three competitive wins and their one loss, his average stats are...

Attempts: 33.5...Completions: 17.25...Yards: 244.5...Ints: 3...Pctg.: 51.5%

When a team wins in a blowout, you usually see their starting QB throw fewer passes than his average. Eugene belongs on the Payton watch list, but you won't see him win it by running up big numbers against crappy teams.

[AppGuy04]

-So the SWAC teams are imaginary competition? (By the way- I saw Gameday yesterday... they brought up Texas State)

Voting for the Payton should be just like the playoffs, you have to take SOS into consideration

[grizband]

I beleive it is their second year of football, don't know their classification
They are Concordia College, from Selma AL. They are an NAIA team.

[SUjagTILLiDIE]

Bruce deserves the Payton Award. Isn't that award suppose to go to the best player in 1-aa. All that other stuff some of you guys are bringing up doesn't matter. Didn't the man that the award was named after come from the swac. Hell all of the top 1-aa NFL players came from the swac. Payton, Rice, Mel Blount, Tank Younger, Steve Air McNair, etc.

P.S. Washington State fans came to the swacpage after the game with Gram and said that Bruce was the best QB that they had face in some time, even better than USC's QB.

[Mr. C]

Bruce Eugene is a great player, but he isn't close to being even the best I-AA quarterback, let alone the best offensive player in I-AA. When he was a Payton finalist after his junior year, he wasn't even first or second team All-SWAC (Quincy Richard of Southern and Donald Carrie were). I doubt he will be anywhere close to the top three this year who are chosen to go to Chattanooga for the award announcement. The Payton will come down to Erik Meyer of EWU, Richie Williams of ASU, Travis Lulay of MSU and Ricky Santos of UNH. Ingle Martin of Furman is also way more deserving of the Payton than Eugene. As a voter for the Payton Award, I can tell you that Eugene wouldn't be even close to the top-five on my ballot. I'm not fooled by big numbers against second-rate competition.

[Mr. C]

P.S. Washington State fans came to the swacpage after the game with Gram and said that Bruce was the best QB that they had face in some time, even better than USC's QB.
You've got to be kidding. So I guess the NFL scouts will pick Bruce over Matt Leinert (the reigning Heisman Trophy winner) with the first pick of the draft?

[Retro]

P.S. Washington State fans came to the swacpage after the game with Gram and said that Bruce was the best QB that they had face in some time, even better than USC's QB.

That shows you how educated wash state fans are! :rolleyes:

[*****]

They are Concordia College, from Selma AL. They are an NAIA team.They are a first year football program and ASPIRE to be NAIA someday. Grambling sought them out for homecoming this year.

[SUjagTILLiDIE]

They are a first year football program and ASPIRE to be NAIA someday. Grambling sought them out for homecoming this year.
Grambling played Texas Southern for homecoming. Gram. couldn't find anyone to fill in the date so they had no choice but to play them.

[SUjagTILLiDIE]

Bruce Eugene is a great player, but he isn't close to being even the best I-AA quarterback :D :confused: :( :mad: shame shame shame. Just wondering, how did you feel about Steve McNair when he was at Alcorn. I heard some of the same things from people about him.

[Mr. C]

I thought McNair should have won the Heisman. McNair was probably the best I-AA quarterback of all time. I wasn't a Payton voter at that time, but I would have given him my vote. Bruce isn't close to being as talented as McNair.

[GSUISBACK]

"P.S. Washington State fans came to the swacpage after the game with Gram and said that Bruce was the best QB that they had face in some time, even better than USC's QB."

Great joke!!!!!

[FCS_pwns_FBS]

"P.S. Washington State fans came to the swacpage after the game with Gram and said that Bruce was the best QB that they had face in some time, even better than USC's QB."

Great joke!!!!!

USC's QB is not that good anyways, he's just like Tom Brady in the NFL - he gets all the credit for what his team does. With a team like his, most quarterbacks in division I could throw 10 bombs a game and win with their weak schedule.

[SUjagTILLiDIE]

I thought McNair should have won the Heisman. McNair was probably the best I-AA quarterback of all time. I wasn't a Payton voter at that time, but I would have given him my vote. Bruce isn't close to being as talented as McNair.
I agree. McNair is the best QB I have seen in person ever. Its funny because Charlie Ward said the same thing and he won the heisman. He came to the SU vs Alcorn game with Warrick Dunn(they were teammates and Dunn is from Baton Rouge). FSU had an off week. McNair killed Southern but we won the game because of dropped passes. Ward was interviewed by a local TV station and said he never in his life saw a Qb do the things that McNair did and he was by far the best he had ever seen.

[SUjagTILLiDIE]

USC's QB is not that good anyways, he's just like Tom Brady in the NFL - he gets all the credit for what his team does. With a team like his, most quarterbacks in division I could throw 10 bombs a game and win with their weak schedule. I thought I was the only person that noticed that. Any QB would look good with that talent. You put him with Gramblings team and line up against Washington State. I promise you he wouldnt come close to doing what Bruce did in that game.

[R.A.]

Grambling played Texas Southern for homecoming. Gram. couldn't find anyone to fill in the date so they had no choice but to play them.

-I don't see anyone in 1-AA jumping at the chance to play Grambling... I mean, let be real here... They're still Grambling w/ the storied history and National reputation. And they do have Bruce Eugene as their QB... If Grambling would have put a mid- major on the schedule like Ball State, New Mexico State, even Bowling Green (Two "heisman" candidates), they may have had a much closer outcome.

[*****]

Grambling played Texas Southern for homecoming. Gram. couldn't find anyone to fill in the date so they had no choice but to play them.Oh, that info was from the Concordia/Selma A.D.

[*****]

-I don't see anyone in 1-AA jumping at the chance to play Grambling... I mean, let be real here... They're still Grambling w/ the storied history and National reputation... :rolleyes: Ask McNeese State and others ...

[Mr. C]

Grambling mostly ducks the other I-AAs in Louisiana, so why do you think they would want to play the elite teams like Montana, Georgia Southern etc.? Southern does the same thing. The folks at McNeese State are still steamed that Southern canceled the game this season (don't go using the hurricane excuse, the game could have been played).

[R.A.]

:rolleyes: Ask McNeese State and others ...

- They usually play McNeese State too. So does Southern. It's not like they're dodging anyone... like some A-10 schools I know.

[R.A.]

The folks at McNeese State are still steamed that Southern canceled the game this season (don't go using the hurricane excuse, the game could have been played).

-Hurricanes are excuses now... :rolleyes:

[Mr. C]

- They usually play McNeese State too. So does Southern. It's not like they're dodging anyone... like some A-10 schools I know.
Grambling didn't want to continue its two-game series with McNeese State after getting clubbed twice and don't expect Southern to make up the game it pulled out of with the Cowboys this year. Yes, they do dodge those teams. Schools like Georgia Southern, App State, Montana etc. would jump at the chance to play Grambling home and home, because of the crowds the Tigers would draw. But you won't see that happen, because Grambling doesn't want to play teams like that when it can have a glossy record by beating up on Concordia.

[*****]

- They usually play McNeese State too. So does Southern. It's not like they're dodging anyone... like some A-10 schools I know.Uh like when does Southern usually play McNeese? The first time they played was the last time. McNeese beat GSU twice and Southern recently.

[SUjagTILLiDIE]

Uh like when does Southern usually play McNeese? The first time they played was the last time. McNeese beat GSU twice and Southern recently.
we played Nicholls and Northwestern countless times.

[SUjagTILLiDIE]

Grambling mostly ducks the other I-AAs in Louisiana, so why do you think they would want to play the elite teams like Montana, Georgia Southern etc.? Southern does the same thing. The folks at McNeese State are still steamed that Southern canceled the game this season (don't go using the hurricane excuse, the game could have been played).
Mann no way could we have played that game. :mad:

[R.A.]

Uh like when does Southern usually play McNeese? The first time they played was the last time. McNeese beat GSU twice and Southern recently.


-Well that's what I meant. Maybe usually wasn't the term to use.

[SUjagTILLiDIE]

Schools like Georgia Southern, App State, Montana etc. would jump at the chance to play Grambling home and home, because of the crowds the Tigers would draw. But you won't see that happen, because Grambling doesn't want to play teams like that when it can have a glossy record by beating up on Concordia.
unfair statement

[*****]

anyway, you LA I-AA teams should play each other regularly than playing Lincoln, Allen, Concordia/Selma...

[SUjagTILLiDIE]

anyway, you LA I-AA teams should play each other regularly than playing Lincoln, Allen, Concordia/Selma...
I agree we shouldn't play those teams. SU has a hard time finding teams to come to Mumford. With SU's large crowd support, SU doesn't like to schedule home and home series unless playing that school benefits SU . The problem has been resolved and SU is adding traditional rivials back to the schedule ie Famu, Tenn. st. But anyway this conversation is about Big Bruce. See for yourself. Watch this game against Bama St.
http://www.alasu.edu/ASU%5FHOME/default.aspx?id=28

click hornet football vs grambling for the full game.

[SUjagTILLiDIE]

Bruce for Heisman :D

[1gsufan]

Thats exactly right. Adrian Peterson from 98-01 averaged just 3.2 quarters played per game and still became Division 1's all time leading rusher. I have been to games when he played 2 minutes of the 3rd and he was done for the day. When his 100 yard streak was on the line in Boone in 01, coach Johnson took him out in the 4th because he knew the game was in hand. That stopped a streak of 36 straight 100 yard games. I say all of this to make the point that if the game is in hand, individual accomplishment is not as important as team wins. You need youre best players for the next game.

GO EAGLES!!!!

[*****]

... SU has a hard time finding teams to come to Mumford. With SU's large crowd support, SU doesn't like to schedule home and home series unless playing that school benefits SU...Do you have the return games against McNeese and SDSU that played at your school but didn't get a return game though they were home and home contracts? Hint, Southern lost at home to both schools... that may be what isn't liked?

[mikebigg]

Third quarter

TD 9:12 CLYDE EDWARDS 27 YD PASS FROM BRUCE EUGENE (FAILED 2PT RUSH) Drive info: 7 plays, 63 yards.
7 68

FAILED 2PT RUSH FAILED 2PT RUSH FAILED 2PT RUSH FAILED 2PT RUSH FAILED 2PT RUSH FAILED 2PT RUSH 3 quarter 68 - 7

The same team that wanted a hurricane affected school to forfeit the game rather then rescheadule.

That failed two point conversion was due to a botched kick... The call for a forfeit I didn't agree with but that was out of frustration. The administration at Alcorn waited until the 11th hour to cancel the game. Initially, they discussed with Grambling the possibility of moving the game to Grambling. Then they said, "wait a minute, we think we'll play it here on Sunday"...then they came back and said.."oh, we don't have lights we're gonna reschedule".

I understand their right to seek rescheduling, but in all honesty they were stalling to keep from playing the game because quite frankly they knew they weren't ready. Yes, they had some players affected by the storm (not trying to trivialize that because it was traumatic down here). BUT, Spears was frustrated and didn't respond well. Be aware that he's an alumni of Alcorn and felt that the administration was being less than fortright in their reason for cancelling the game. I don't agree with his request for a forfeit, but in all honesty, I think he was trying to avoid having to play a late season game one week after our rivalry game and one week before a possible (and as it turned out definite) berth in the SWAC Championship game.

[mikebigg]

I understand what you are saying but they scored 82 POINTS !!! there was no reason to keep him in there that long. It is just bad.... :mad:

Actually there is a reason... here's the full deal on the qb situation at Grambling:

Our two backups are Brandon Landon (who played last year when Bruce was injured as a true 17 year old freshman) and Larry Kerlegan who was a prop player last year (this is his first year of action...no spring training due to being a prop). Spear's desire is to redshirt both of them...definitely Landers. He has played Kerlegan for a couple of snaps in the first two games of the season and wanted to redshirt him as well (first year players can play in the early games and still get a redshirt...but even if not, he's simply not ready).

Some would say, just let him hand the ball off. I suppose so, there's something to consider there as well. It may sound somewhat like justification but here goes... We are not very deep at running back...especially behind Ab Kuuan who is our everydown back. Our pre-season All-American fullback Ruben Mayes has been out since the first week in October with a knee injury. We couldn't risk injury to either of them, especially Kuuan who averages about 17 touches (15 runs/ 2 catches) per game. That may not seem like much, but his 670 plus yards are about 5 yards per carry and keep teams somewhat honest.

Another reason we continue to pass is because that's our offense. We recruit for the passing game (even with Bruce leaving, we're gonna run the same offense with Landers next year...he's being groomed and he ran a similar offense in high school). What do we tell the backup receivers who have been busting their azz running routes from April til now while being told to work hard and be ready. They've been studying film, learning routes, being quizzed and grilled on reading coverages (our receivers and qb's study together in film sessions) so that they will know what to do. Then you put them in the game and hand the ball off. That wouldn't be good for team morale...that is what Spears has to be concerned with and not how folk perceive him in terms of running up the score.

Spears (and this is my sincere opinion) was trying to get the score to the point that the refs would go to a running clock. After 2 1/2 qtrs, he finally decided to just pull Bruce and bring in Kerlegan. We score again on a punt return and the refs go to a running clock. Kerlegan threw a pass but there's no way that kid was gonna come in and not want to get in on the action. Maybe Spears could have had him run the ball...but he didn't and that's just how it went. :deadhorse :deadhorse

[mikebigg]

Grambling didn't want to continue its two-game series with McNeese State after getting clubbed twice and don't expect Southern to make up the game it pulled out of with the Cowboys this year. Yes, they do dodge those teams. Schools like Georgia Southern, App State, Montana etc. would jump at the chance to play Grambling home and home, because of the crowds the Tigers would draw. But you won't see that happen, because Grambling doesn't want to play teams like that when it can have a glossy record by beating up on Concordia.

Doug Williams decided he didn't want to play McNeese. He stated that he wanted to seek games against traditional opponents in Neutral site Classics. Melvin Spears has gone on record as saying he wants to play in state schools. In fact, negotiations are underway with ULM and Northwestern.

Also we didn't get clubbed twice by McNeese. True they won both games. The first one was all McNeese during Bruce's first season as the full-time starter when we had only two offensive starters returning (a sophomore te who was later moved to linebacker and the center). The next year we had a hard fought battle that Grambling missed on a pass in the endzone that would have given us a 4 point lead. Our all American receiver Tramon Douglas caught 17 passes and Bruce was on fire...unfortunately, his last pass skipped off Douglas's hand as he made a lunging attempt in the endzone.

Give McNeese credit, Vic King made a long run on the next drive against a demoralized team and McNeese eventually scored to make it a 10 point margin...however, noone there from McNeese will say it was a clubbing. Just wanted to set the record straight since you seem so willing to speculate. However, your prior posts have already stated your opinion of Bruce, whatever the reason. But know this...we duck no one. Have Montana give us a call...they can see about doing a home and home.

[Tribe4SF]

Actually there is a reason... here's the full deal on the qb situation at Grambling:

Our two backups are Brandon Landon (who played last year when Bruce was injured as a true 17 year old freshman) and Larry Kerlegan who was a prop player last year (this is his first year of action...no spring training due to being a prop). Spear's desire is to redshirt both of them...definitely Landers. He has played Kerlegan for a couple of snaps in the first two games of the season and wanted to redshirt him as well (first year players can play in the early games and still get a redshirt...but even if not, he's simply not ready).

Some would say, just let him hand the ball off. I suppose so, there's something to consider there as well. It may sound somewhat like justification but here goes... We are not very deep at running back...especially behind Ab Kuuan who is our everydown back. Our pre-season All-American fullback Ruben Mayes has been out since the first week in October with a knee injury. We couldn't risk injury to either of them, especially Kuuan who averages about 17 touches (15 runs/ 2 catches) per game. That may not seem like much, but his 670 plus yards are about 5 yards per carry and keep teams somewhat honest.

Another reason we continue to pass is because that's our offense. We recruit for the passing game (even with Bruce leaving, we're gonna run the same offense with Landers next year...he's being groomed and he ran a similar offense in high school). What do we tell the backup receivers who have been busting their azz running routes from April til now while being told to work hard and be ready. They've been studying film, learning routes, being quizzed and grilled on reading coverages (our receivers and qb's study together in film sessions) so that they will know what to do. Then you put them in the game and hand the ball off. That wouldn't be good for team morale...that is what Spears has to be concerned with and not how folk perceive him in terms of running up the score.

Spears (and this is my sincere opinion) was trying to get the score to the point that the refs would go to a running clock. After 2 1/2 qtrs, he finally decided to just pull Bruce and bring in Kerlegan. We score again on a punt return and the refs go to a running clock. Kerlegan threw a pass but there's no way that kid was gonna come in and not want to get in on the action. Maybe Spears could have had him run the ball...but he didn't and that's just how it went. :deadhorse :deadhorse

First, when Kerligan saw the field early this season, his redshirt was blown. I don't think Grambling has a special set of rules from the NCAA.

Second.........team morale???.........running clock????.......(snicker). xidiotx

[TexasTerror]

The SWAC has many special rules it seems, if someone would investigate them...

We played a team from there a few years back and we do in various sports. We were shocked at who was suiting up for them because we recruited some of the same players and there were ineligible, yet there they were on the field the fall after they had signed. How they turned up NCAA eligible was beyond us...

[AppGuy04]

Just a question- SInce you guys from so-called "power conferences" seem to hate the SWAC so much, why don't you ban together to get the I-AA awards names changed? The awards are named after Payton (Jackson State) and Buchanan (Grambling). These are both SWAC schools. If the SWAC is so terrible, then why should it be an honor to receive awards named after two SWAC players?

quit trying to start stuff, people are discussing Eugene, he plays in the SWAC, which is one of the worst conferences in the country. This has to be taken into consideration when voting, that is all.

[AppGuy04]

No, it STARTED as a discussion of Eugene, then it morphed into a discussion of how weak the SWAC is. In fact, YOU said that Eugene shouldn't win the Payton because his competition in the SWAC was horrible. BTW, didn't you say you were going to stop replying to me?

well, honestly, Eugene playing in the SWAC has to be a consideration for voters, weak competition inflates stats

I will respond to anything you say in a discussion manor, but nothing concerning race

[Catmendue2]

Doug Williams decided he didn't want to play McNeese. He stated that he wanted to seek games against traditional opponents in Neutral site Classics. Melvin Spears has gone on record as saying he wants to play in state schools. In fact, negotiations are underway with ULM and Northwestern.

Also we didn't get clubbed twice by McNeese. True they won both games. The first one was all McNeese during Bruce's first season as the full-time starter when we had only two offensive starters returning (a sophomore te who was later moved to linebacker and the center). The next year we had a hard fought battle that Grambling missed on a pass in the endzone that
would have given us a 4 point lead. Our all American receiver Tramon Douglas caught 17 passes and Bruce was on fire...unfortunately, his last pass skipped off Douglas's hand as he made a lunging attempt in the endzone.

Give McNeese credit, Vic King made a long run on the next drive against a demoralized team and McNeese eventually scored to make it a 10 point margin...however, noone there from McNeese will say it was a clubbing. Just wanted to set the record straight since you seem so willing to speculate. However, your prior posts have already stated your opinion of Bruce, whatever the reason. But know this...we duck no one. Have Montana give us a call...they can see about doing a home and home.



Mike they won't play Grambling and you know why. All these so called power teams love to talk, they play PV, UAPB and TSU but they look the other way when its Grambling, ASUs, and Southern. The Southland team other than Nicholls St and NWST and MCneese avoid GSU like the plague, but plays MVSU and Alcorn at a moment notice. I hope to see some A-10 teams venture down to the Hole in the near future, but unless its home and home forget it. Georgia Southern talked about playing, but once it was obvious that they would have to come to the hole all talks stopped. Until they can put their teams where their mouths are its just talk. There is no team in 1-AA this year that can contain Grambling offense, and there is no player in 1-AA with the skills of BRUgene. IMHO app04 got a problem with everything thats not ASU. Once ASU is blasted in the playoffs he will hide out until next spring, actually what does ASU have to be so proud of, they are truly not YSU, GSU or EKU. Please!

[dwtime]

Bruce deserves the Payton Award. Isn't that award suppose to go to the best player in 1-aa. All that other stuff some of you guys are bringing up doesn't matter. Didn't the man that the award was named after come from the swac. Hell all of the top 1-aa NFL players came from the swac. Payton, Rice, Mel Blount, Tank Younger, Steve Air McNair, etc.

P.S. Washington State fans came to the swacpage after the game with Gram and said that Bruce was the best QB that they had face in some time, even better than USC's QB.


Sorry SUjag, the SWAC of the 60's, 70's and 80's is not the SWAC of today. Some great players still come out of the SWAC but not great teams. Grambling is probably a very good team but nobody can tell because they play a plethora of weak teams.

[GannonFan]

With Eugene's history of being hurt, I'm actually kind of shocked that they keep him in games so long, especially with the Southern game coming up. Having him on national tv against your biggest rival would seem to be pretty important, and at this point in the season, saying that they need him in there to avoid a letdown or to get some more reps just rings pretty hollow. No doubt he's one of the top 5 if not top 3 players in IAA today - whether he's the best, well, obviously that's debatable.

[Catmendue2]

Sorry SUjag, the SWAC of the 60's, 70's and 80's is not the SWAC of today. Some great players still come out of the SWAC but not great teams. Grambling is probably a very good team but nobody can tell because they play a plethora of weak teams.


Grambling plays conference teams as all 1-AA teams does. The same weak teams that plays Grambling, also plays a plethora of OOC teams that dodge Grambling in favor of sure wins. Sign the contracts and Grambling won't have to play Mid Majors 1-A and make sure the contract you sign have home and home stipulations. Otherwise, you are just talking. ;)

[Catmendue2]

With Eugene's history of being hurt, I'm actually kind of shocked that they keep him in games so long, especially with the Southern game coming up. Having him on national tv against your biggest rival would seem to be pretty important, and at this point in the season, saying that they need him in there to avoid a letdown or to get some more reps just rings pretty hollow. No doubt he's one of the top 5 if not top 3 players in IAA today - whether he's the best, well, obviously that's debatable.


Eugene has only had one injury in his whole college career. Eugene has passed and rushed for more yards in combination than any player in college football in the last four years, period. Eugene has earned the Payton Award and he will get his due, no matter what some of you naysayers think. Of all the 1-AA players this year, he is the one most likely to succeed at the next level.

[mikebigg]

The SWAC has many special rules it seems, if someone would investigate them...

We played a team from there a few years back and we do in various sports. We were shocked at who was suiting up for them because we recruited some of the same players and there were ineligible, yet there they were on the field the fall after they had signed. How they turned up NCAA eligible was beyond us...

Sounds like sour grapes to me... Why didn't yall turn them into the NCAA so that it could be checked out? With the negative approach that most of yall have toward the SWAC, I'm sure the thought has crossed your mind. But then again, maybe it never happened at all...unsubstantiated allegations concerning the SWAC is nothing new. Especially here where the "amen" corner never questions anything. Maybe it's a regional/cultural bias thing or some type of insecurity. I've rarely noticed much anti-Swac bias from the posters from the Big Sky conference. Maybe, it's because we don't recruit against them head to head.

As far as the redshirt thing, someone who follows NCAA rules on the matter might be able to shed some light. I do know that I was listening to a sports talk show here in BR and a caller mentioned that LSU's Ryan Perrilloux might get some snaps in an early game and still be redshirted. I remember at one time that first year players were allowed a certain percentage of snaps and still eligible to be redshirted, provided the snaps happened in the first two or three games of the season.

[gram4life]

Grambling mostly ducks the other I-AAs in Louisiana, so why do you think they would want to play the elite teams like Montana, Georgia Southern etc.? Southern does the same thing. The folks at McNeese State are still steamed that Southern canceled the game this season (don't go using the hurricane excuse, the game could have been played).

I guess it ok for you to just makeup stuff about Grambling, we mostly duck other I-AA SCHOOLS in Louisiana, who have we ducked and what proof do you have. Check your history, we have played McNesse and Nicholls. We are not ducking SE La or Northwestern. But it's ok for you just to throw anything outhere Wow!

[Catmendue2]

I guess it ok for you to just makeup stuff about Grambling, we mostly duck other I-AA SCHOOLS in Louisiana, who have we ducked and what proof do you have. Check your history, we have played McNesse and Nicholls. We are not ducking SE La or Northwestern. But it's ok for you just to throw anything outhere Wow!


Other than Mcneese what other SFL teams has beaten Grambling since our playoff days. Other than TSTU and Mcneese what other team in the SFL could even stay on the filed with Grambling? After LSU and LaTech what schools in Louisiana even comes close in recruiting to Grambling and Mcneese. So, why run? The last BigSky team Grambling played was Portland State and I think they were rated and they lost at home in Portland Oregon. As for NWST they not on Grambling level and neither is Nicholls St, however 1-AA polls always seems to have them ranked ahead of Grambling and neither has beaten Gramblimg in many years. Just my 2 cents.

[AppGuy04]

I guess it ok for you to just makeup stuff about Grambling, we mostly duck other I-AA SCHOOLS in Louisiana, who have we ducked and what proof do you have. Check your history, we have played McNesse and Nicholls. We are not ducking SE La or Northwestern. But it's ok for you just to throw anything outhere Wow!

hey gram, how is this any different than the SWAC fans saying that people are ducking Grambling without proof? Its a 2-way street, and its pure conjecture

[TexasTerror]

You know, I've worked for a SWAC school in the past. Not a professional operation at all and I've worked NAIA and NCAA in the past.

I understand the lack of resources (which are widely known by fans and the media), but they could do much better with the same resources if they chose how to use them wisely especially as it relates to the personnel they hire.

Nice people, no doubt, but they leave much to be desired...

[gram4life]

You know, I've worked for a SWAC school in the past. Not a professional operation at all and I've worked NAIA and NCAA in the past.

I understand the lack of resources (which are widely known by fans and the media), but they could do much better with the same resources if they chose how to use them wisely especially as it relates to the personnel they hire.

Nice people, no doubt, but they leave much to be desired...


So one SWAC school makes all the SWAC schools the same, what is the point of this statement. Oh you just wanted to put your 2 cents in to down the SWAC as a whole. I get it.

[BayouColonel]

Grambling plays conference teams as all 1-AA teams does. The same weak teams that plays Grambling, also plays a plethora of OOC teams that dodge Grambling in favor of sure wins. Sign the contracts and Grambling won't have to play Mid Majors 1-A and make sure the contract you sign have home and home stipulations. Otherwise, you are just talking. ;)

Nicholls State would take that deal in a heartbeat. We would love to play a home and home with GSU. Southern won't play us anymore and backed out of our last aggreement that was supposed to be home and home after we beat them in B.R. and they didn't return the trip to Thibodaux. The funny thing is we have played GSU twice both times in Thibodaux and both times were GSU victories yet no return trip to GSU. Texas Southern, Valley, Alcorn doesn't excite me as a fan as much as a Gram, SU or possibly Jackson State game would. Maybe Gram fans feel the same way about lil ol' Nicholls State but I know we would draw more interest than Concordia.

[SUjagTILLiDIE]

Do you have the return games against McNeese and SDSU that played at your school but didn't get a return game though they were home and home contracts? Hint, Southern lost at home to both schools... that may be what isn't liked?
Southern never had a home and home with SDSU.

[TexasTerror]

So one SWAC school makes all the SWAC schools the same, what is the point of this statement. Oh you just wanted to put your 2 cents in to down the SWAC as a whole. I get it.

It was not just one SWAC school. Working for one, you learn about the others, especially when talking to the media that follows said schools...

[gram4life]

Nicholls State would take that deal in a heartbeat. We would love to play a home and home with GSU. Southern won't play us anymore and backed out of our last aggreement that was supposed to be home and home after we beat them in B.R. and they didn't return the trip to Thibodaux. The funny thing is we have played GSU twice both times in Thibodaux and both times were GSU victories yet no return trip to GSU. Texas Southern, Valley, Alcorn doesn't excite me as a fan as much as a Gram, SU or possibly Jackson State game would. Maybe Gram fans feel the same way about lil ol' Nicholls State but I know we would draw more interest than Concordia.

But can or would you guys play us this late in the Season with conference games in play?

[grizband]

They are a first year football program and ASPIRE to be NAIA someday. Grambling sought them out for homecoming this year.
Oh, okay. I got my information from cfbdatawarehouse.com

[TexasTerror]

I was actually shocked to see TxSo play UTEP and Grambling play a I-AA game in Washington...not so much Grambling.

I wish the SWAC schools would play more I-AAs instead of hitting the road to play Div II or NAIA. Wouldn't a win over an I-AA help in the Sheridan especially if it was a solid I-AA? I just don't see the reasoning behind some teams hitting the road to play sub-Div I teams in FB when there are I-AA teams that'd do home-and-home without problem.

Any word to the rumors that SHSU is set to play Mississippi Valley St again in FB? We had a home-and-home a few years back.

[gram4life]

I was actually shocked to see TxSo play UTEP and Grambling play a I-AA game in Washington...not so much Grambling.

I wish the SWAC schools would play more I-AAs instead of hitting the road to play Div II or NAIA. Wouldn't a win over an I-AA help in the Sheridan especially if it was a solid I-AA? I just don't see the reasoning behind some teams hitting the road to play sub-Div I teams in FB when there are I-AA teams that'd do home-and-home without problem.

Any word to the rumors that SHSU is set to play Mississippi Valley St again in FB? We had a home-and-home a few years back.

What team HIT THE ROAD to play Div II or NAIA? Grambling plays I-A or I-AA games when on the road. Wow. Name those teams that have played D2 or NAIA on the road please.

[gram4life]

It was not just one SWAC school. Working for one, you learn about the others, especially when talking to the media that follows said schools...

Again what was the point of the statement????????? You need to get your dig in about SWAC schools, oh that's what it is.

[TexasTerror]

What team HIT THE ROAD to play Div II or NAIA? Grambling plays I-A or I-AA games when on the road. Wow. Name those teams that have played D2 or NAIA on the road please.

PVA&M went to Lincoln (MO) this year and Paul Quinn last year. In 2002, they lost on the road to both Paul Quinn and Div II Texas A&M Kingsville (65-0). In 2002, TxSo went to Stillman.

That's just off the top of my head since 2002...

[gram4life]

PVA&M went to Lincoln (MO) this year and Paul Quinn last year. In 2002, they lost on the road to both Paul Quinn and Div II Texas A&M Kingsville (65-0). In 2002, TxSo went to Stillman.

That's just off the top of my head since 2002...

Thanks for the info so 2 of the lowest ranked SWAC schools played D2 on the road but those same teams have played Southland teams. What about GSU, SU, AAMU, ASU, MVSU, JSU, Alcorn?

[BayouColonel]

But can or would you guys play us this late in the Season with conference games in play?
I'm not saying we should have been your opponent for the HC game against Concordia but we would defintely play GSU early in the season. The way I understand the last game in Thibodaux was a last minute convenience game with both of us having a hole in our schedules to fill but I used to like the old SU/ Nicholls rivalry back in the 80's and early 90's. I had a friend from Houma who's wife was a GSU alum and I would always get tickets for the SU game in Thibodaux. (BTW they always cheered against SU)They would always ask me why doesn't Nicholls try to schedule GSU. It's just something that as a fan I would like to see. As far as when to schedule the game, There was a time when we would have played anyone at anytime but the last few years we have been in contention for a conference title or playoffs so I am sure the powers that be at NSU would rather it be earlier in the season.

[TexasTerror]

Thanks for the info so 2 of the lowest ranked SWAC schools played D2 on the road but those same teams have played Southland teams. What about GSU, SU, AAMU, ASU, MVSU, JSU, Alcorn?

They are SWAC schools, are they not? I think so...

And PVA&M has not played an SLC team in some time. TxSo played McN this year after NW State was cancelled. They have no reason not to play SLC every year.

Why won't those two schools play the Texas SLC schools? Short travel (especially for a TxSo team that was to play home games in Longview and Beaumont), would it not? They both refuse to play SHSU in MBB.

[gram4life]

They are SWAC schools, are they not? I think so...

And PVA&M has not played an SLC team in some time. TxSo played McN this year after NW State was cancelled. They have no reason not to play SLC every year.

Why won't those two schools play the Texas SLC schools? Short travel (especially for a TxSo team that was to play home games in Longview and Beaumont), would it not? They both refuse to play SHSU in MBB.

You are attempting lump all the SWAC schools in the same boat, it's dishonest. So do you play any D2 schools?

[TexasTerror]

You are attempting lump all the SWAC schools in the same boat, it's dishonest. So do you play any D2 schools?

SHSU does play D2 schools...however, we do not go on the road for such contests. I wonder how that works when a I-AA goes to a D2? Can the D2 give them a nice guarantee?

Why should I not lump all SWAC schools into the same boat? You are a scholarship I-AA conference. It's not like your non-scholarship, is it?

There's obviously some disparity in terms of funding, but what conference does not? Have you seen the difference between Texas St Univ and Nicholls St? There's some FB-playing members of the SLC that have a budget that is equal or less than some non-FB playing institutions...

So, why should I lump them in different boats? :confused:

[gram4life]

SHSU does play D2 schools...however, we do not go on the road for such contests. I wonder how that works when a I-AA goes to a D2? Can the D2 give them a nice guarantee?

Why should I not lump all SWAC schools into the same boat? You are a scholarship I-AA conference. It's not like your non-scholarship, is it?

There's obviously some disparity in terms of funding, but what conference does not? Have you seen the difference between Texas St Univ and Nicholls St? There's some FB-playing members of the SLC that have a budget that is equal or less than some non-FB playing institutions...

So, why should I lump them in different boats? :confused:

Because it's a lie, we(GSU) don't play D2 on road and we are in the SWAC. SU doesn't play D2 on the road and they are in the SWAC. No need to go on, its clear you just want to get your digs in on the SWAC based on PV and TxSo.

[mikebigg]

Nicholls State would take that deal in a heartbeat. We would love to play a home and home with GSU. Southern won't play us anymore and backed out of our last aggreement that was supposed to be home and home after we beat them in B.R. and they didn't return the trip to Thibodaux. The funny thing is we have played GSU twice both times in Thibodaux and both times were GSU victories yet no return trip to GSU. Texas Southern, Valley, Alcorn doesn't excite me as a fan as much as a Gram, SU or possibly Jackson State game would. Maybe Gram fans feel the same way about lil ol' Nicholls State but I know we would draw more interest than Concordia.

We have two available dates on our schedule, the third weekend in Sept and the 2nd weekend in November. The Sept date is out of the question because we typically use that date to play a D1 ($500k to play Wazzou this year) or a classic like last year when we played Bethune Cookman at neutral site for a nice payday. The November date has possibilities...but you guys are in your conference schedule by then. Granted, we played McNeese once (I believe that was a 12 game year) to open the season and the following year, we were able to get a game with them on the third date (we opened with San Jose in August).

I was disappointed when the rest of D1AA opted not to pursue the 12 game option made available by the NCAA. I would hope that the SWAC could successfully petition the NCAA to give our league an exemption so that we could have a 12 game schedule. That would allow us to comply with our conference's 9 game mandate and have 3 games to schedule out of conference. Perhaps then we could play a D1 game, a MEAC classic, and other state schools. Oh well...not likely. Seems that the powers rest of D1AA never votes with any regard to the SWAC. Case in point...the disregard for allowing the SWAC to complete it's regular season and particpate in the playoffs.

[TexasTerror]

Because it's a lie, we(GSU) don't play D2 on road and we are in the SWAC. SU doesn't play D2 on the road and they are in the SWAC. No need to go on, its clear you just want to get your digs in on the SWAC based on PV and TxSo.

Yet, your the only I-AA scholarship conference that has members that go on the road for D2 games. Explain that? Again, how do you not lump the whole conference in together in general for it's lack of playing non-HBCUs and non-I-AA schools? The conference in general does not do it.

Let's count this year:
McN vs Southern
SELA vs Alcorn
NWSt (became McN) vs TxSo

MEAC this year played six I-AA opponents:
Delaware St vs Coastal Carolina and James Madison
Hampton vs Gardner-Webb
Morgan St vs Towson
NC A&T vs. Elon
SC State vs Coastal Carolina

It's that SWAC mandate. I don't see why you have got to play all nine teams when there is a SWAC title game. Keep the important rivalries intact with divisional play (as they are) and do some cross-division battles. Have some I-AA games in the one or two extra OPEN dates and there ya go!

[GannonFan]

I was disappointed when the rest of D1AA opted not to pursue the 12 game option made available by the NCAA. I would hope that the SWAC could successfully petition the NCAA to give our league an exemption so that we could have a 12 game schedule. That would allow us to comply with our conference's 9 game mandate and have 3 games to schedule out of conference. Perhaps then we could play a D1 game, a MEAC classic, and other state schools. Oh well...not likely. Seems that the powers rest of D1AA never votes with any regard to the SWAC. Case in point...the disregard for allowing the SWAC to complete it's regular season and particpate in the playoffs.

Not to be dragged into this, but that type of a comment is the kind that brings out the world's tiniest violin. Everyone else in IAA doesn't vote with regard to the SWAC? When did the SWAC start caring about IAA? Heck, even on boards like this the majority (not all) of the SWAC posters rip on the IAA playoffs and boast about the money and national attention they get from the Classic games, and now we are to believe that the SWAC is a victim by the intentional actions of the rest of IAA? The SWAC, like the Ivy before them, has made it very clear they don't care much about the rest of IAA and they consider their own priorities to be different. Hey, that's perfectly fine and more power to you - just don't try to cast it as being that the rest of IAA is intentionally pursuing policies to exclude the SWAC, because then you're just crying sour grapes.

[gram4life]

Yet, your the only I-AA scholarship conference that has members that go on the road for D2 games. Explain that? Again, how do you not lump the whole conference in together in general for it's lack of playing non-HBCUs and non-I-AA schools? The conference in general does not do it.

Let's count this year:
McN vs Southern
SELA vs Alcorn
NWSt (became McN) vs TxSo

Man make up your mind, you say we are afraid of La I-AA (proved to be a lie), then you say SWAC SCHOOLS(meaning all) plau D2 on the road (proved to be a lie), now you on this kick about non-HBCU I-AA. Tell me what is your real issue because you keep changing it.

So playing HBCU I-AA means nothing and playing I-A WSU means nothing. Oh well

[TexasTerror]

Man make up your mind, you say we are afraid of La I-AA (proved to be a lie), then you say SWAC SCHOOLS(meaning all) plau D2 on the road (proved to be a lie), now you on this kick about non-HBCU I-AA. Tell me what is your real issue because you keep changing it.

So playing HBCU I-AA means nothing and playing I-A WSU means nothing. Oh well


I said schools from the SWAC do play D2 on the road. And it is proven true (two schools from the SWAC in fact) as there are multiple schools. Key word, schools is plural...

I said the Texas SWAC schools refuse to play I-AAs that are not HBCUs. When you fellas going to play Texas I-AAs? You have two SWAC I-AAs in Texas and several more in Louisiana. You refuse to do that. Never did I say the SWAC schools refuse to play Louisiana I-AAs. Heck, we have MSVU vs SELA this weekend, right?

Playing HBCUs from I-AA are great. I-As are great too, no doubt.

[WhereDoITypeMyUsername?]

So again, if the SWAC is so weak, why do you folk form the "power conferences" INSIST on naming your awards after two players from SWAC schools?
That's like trying to argue, "Penn and Georgia Tech are a couple of the greatest college football teams in the country, in any division. If they aren't, then why is the Heisman named after a guy who played and coached for those teams? Hmmmmmm?" Dumb. It just might be possible that the SWAC of today isn't quite like the SWAC of 30-40 years ago, relative to the rest of I-AA.


I suspect that Eugene might be a good I-AA player, but it sucks that we just don't know. The one semi-legit team that GSU played this year, Washington State, totally shut him down (he had under 200 yards and 1 score). SOS and cross-division games lead one to believe that WSU would be a middle-of-the-pack Great West or Big Sky team this year if they weren't in the Pac-10.

Unfortunately, we don't get to see Eugene play many games against serious competition, so it's hard to judge just how good he really is. But I do know this: the contention that he's even as good as, much less better than, the Pac-10 quarterbacks that have been beating the stuffing outta the Cougs this year is laughable.

[GSUISBACK]

We have two available dates on our schedule, the third weekend in Sept and the 2nd weekend in November. The Sept date is out of the question because we typically use that date to play a D1 ($500k to play Wazzou this year) or a classic like last year when we played Bethune Cookman at neutral site for a nice payday. The November date has possibilities...but you guys are in your conference schedule by then. Granted, we played McNeese once (I believe that was a 12 game year) to open the season and the following year, we were able to get a game with them on the third date (we opened with San Jose in August).

I was disappointed when the rest of D1AA opted not to pursue the 12 game option made available by the NCAA. I would hope that the SWAC could successfully petition the NCAA to give our league an exemption so that we could have a 12 game schedule. That would allow us to comply with our conference's 9 game mandate and have 3 games to schedule out of conference. Perhaps then we could play a D1 game, a MEAC classic, and other state schools. Oh well...not likely. Seems that the powers rest of D1AA never votes with any regard to the SWAC. Case in point...the disregard for allowing the SWAC to complete it's regular season and particpate in the playoffs.
The ALcorn St president voted against the 12 game too representing the swac so take your disappointment to them.

[gram4life]

I said schools from the SWAC do play D2 on the road. And it is proven true (two schools from the SWAC in fact) as there are multiple schools. Key word, schools is plural...

I said the Texas SWAC schools refuse to play I-AAs that are not HBCUs. When you fellas going to play Texas I-AAs? You have two SWAC I-AAs in Texas and several more in Louisiana. You refuse to do that. Never did I say the SWAC schools refuse to play Louisiana I-AAs. Heck, we have MSVU vs SELA this weekend, right?

Playing HBCUs from I-AA are great. I-As are great too, no doubt.

In your mind SWAC schools equal all not just PV and TxSo. When has GSU refused to play any Texas I-AA? You like to play word games but the fact of the matter is that not all SWAC schools refused to play Texas I-AA schools. It was your attempt to put all SWAC schools in the same boat I took issue with.

[TexasTerror]

The ALcorn St president voted against the 12 game too representing the swac so take your disappointment to them.

It just would not have worked at I-AA if we wanted our playoff system...

Why should the SWAC have a waiver to play 12? The I-AA folks would rather the SWAC become fully playoff-eligible. 12 games wouldn't have helped that situation at all, would it?

[blueballs]

So again, if the SWAC is so weak, why do you folk form the "power conferences" INSIST on naming your awards after two players from SWAC schools?

Because the awards are named after individuals and football is a team game.

Those individuals were among the greatest players ever but the current crop of SWAC teams don't appear to be that strong.

Personally, I believe that if you choose to exclude your teams from the playoffs your individuals should be excluded from any post season recognition in the same vein as those playoff conferences.

Case in point: Eugene has put up big #'s against suspect competition. Richie Williams has led a good App State team through a minefield schedule and put up good #'s. Who would you rather have? Eugene or Williams?

What I'm trying to say is that there should be awards for the individuals in the playoff conferences, a seperate set of awards for non-playoff conferences, and still another set for non-schollie/mid major conferences and teams.

[mikebigg]

Not to be dragged into this, but that type of a comment is the kind that brings out the world's tiniest violin. Everyone else in IAA doesn't vote with regard to the SWAC? When did the SWAC start caring about IAA? Heck, even on boards like this the majority (not all) of the SWAC posters rip on the IAA playoffs and boast about the money and national attention they get from the Classic games, and now we are to believe that the SWAC is a victim by the intentional actions of the rest of IAA? The SWAC, like the Ivy before them, has made it very clear they don't care much about the rest of IAA and they consider their own priorities to be different. Hey, that's perfectly fine and more power to you - just don't try to cast it as being that the rest of IAA is intentionally pursuing policies to exclude the SWAC, because then you're just crying sour grapes.

No sour grapes...just pointing out that the SWAC is not a true part of 1AA. Sad that it's gotten that way, regardless of whose fault it is. I'm not gonna get into the who's the blame or whose position is what when it comes to playing in the playoffs. But we know that the playoffs do not benefit us...not in it's present format. So on that one, let's agree to disagree.

But this thread initially dealt with Bruce and whether or not the coach was trying to pad the stats. Why would he do that? Don't you think Spears knows that the voters are not gonna give Bruce the benefit of the doubt? The stats will always be questioned because of an inherent bias and growing dislike toward Grambling and the SWAC. You may not agree, but I my heart of heart I feel that "it is what it is"

Enuff on that here...Check out my related thread that I'm about to start. I would like some serious discussion on the subject of possible future games.

[AppGuy04]

No sour grapes...just pointing out that the SWAC is not a true part of 1AA. Sad that it's gotten that way, regardless of whose fault it is. I'm not gonna get into the who's the blame or whose position is what when it comes to playing in the playoffs. But we know that the playoffs do not benefit us...not in it's present format. So on that one, let's agree to disagree.

But this thread initially dealt with Bruce and whether or not the coach was trying to pad the stats. Why would he do that? Don't you think Spears knows that the voters are not gonna give Bruce the benefit of the doubt? The stats will always be questioned because of an inherent bias and growing dislike toward Grambling and the SWAC. You may not agree, but I my heart of heart I feel that "it is what it is"

Enuff on that here...Check out my related thread that I'm about to start. I would like some serious discussion on the subject of possible future games.

I have no problem with this post other than the word "bias"
There is no bias

[*****]

Southern never had a home and home with SDSU.That's right, sorry... it was a consideration to play at SDSU. Do you think they will play there? ;)

[Retro]

Not to be dragged into this, but that type of a comment is the kind that brings out the world's tiniest violin. Everyone else in IAA doesn't vote with regard to the SWAC? When did the SWAC start caring about IAA? Heck, even on boards like this the majority (not all) of the SWAC posters rip on the IAA playoffs and boast about the money and national attention they get from the Classic games, and now we are to believe that the SWAC is a victim by the intentional actions of the rest of IAA? The SWAC, like the Ivy before them, has made it very clear they don't care much about the rest of IAA and they consider their own priorities to be different. Hey, that's perfectly fine and more power to you - just don't try to cast it as being that the rest of IAA is intentionally pursuing policies to exclude the SWAC, because then you're just crying sour grapes.

well said!

[Retro]

That's right, sorry... it was a consideration to play at SDSU. Do you think they will play there?

About as much chance as Southern fulfilling their home and home with Mcneese.. Something Mcneese has already tried to re-schedule for this season and next to no result!

[*****]

I said schools from the SWAC do play D2 on the road. And it is proven true (two schools from the SWAC in fact) as there are multiple schools. Key word, schools is plural...

I said the Texas SWAC schools refuse to play I-AAs that are not HBCUs. When you fellas going to play Texas I-AAs? You have two SWAC I-AAs in Texas and several more in Louisiana. You refuse to do that. Never did I say the SWAC schools refuse to play Louisiana I-AAs. Heck, we have MSVU vs SELA this weekend, right?

Playing HBCUs from I-AA are great. I-As are great too, no doubt.Thanks for your patience with gram4life. He is trying very hard to twist what you wrote and put words in your mouth. You are dealing with it nicely. :nod:

[gram4life]

Thanks for your patience with gram4life. He is trying very hard to twist what you wrote and put words in your mouth. You are dealing with it nicely. :nod:

Oh really, he attempting to lump SWAC schools in the same boat and as so much as says so. Yet I'm changing what he said. Wow. It's Ok to generalize about SWAC SCHOOLS. Because GENERALLY WE PLAY D2 SCHOOLS ON THE THE ROAD. The SWAC schools are made up of more than just PV and TxSo.

"I wish the SWAC schools would play more I-AAs instead of hitting the road to play Div II or NAIA. Wouldn't a win over an I-AA help in the Sheridan especially if it was a solid I-AA? I just don't see the reasoning behind some teams hitting the road to play sub-Div I teams in FB when there are I-AA teams that'd do home-and-home without problem."


"Why should I not lump all SWAC schools into the same boat? You are a scholarship I-AA conference. It's not like your non-scholarship, is it?"

"Yet, your the only I-AA scholarship conference that has members that go on the road for D2 games. Explain that? Again, how do you not lump the whole conference in together in general for it's lack of playing non-HBCUs and non-I-AA schools? The conference in general does not do it."

[txstatebobcat]

So again, if the SWAC is so weak, why do you folk form the "power conferences" INSIST on naming your awards after two players from SWAC schools?

Because SWAC schools are in I-AA.

The SWAC and MEAC are shadows of their former selfs. 30-40 years ago HBCU football athletes were just just as good or better than BCS level athletes, however thats just not the case anymore.

Don't get me wrong, the SWAC and MEAC still have good players. Its just that they don't have the same number of NFL prospects that they used to have.

[Catmendue2]

Because SWAC schools are in I-AA.

The SWAC and MEAC are shadows of their former selfs. 30-40 years ago HBCU football athletes were just just as good or better than BCS level athletes, however thats just not the case anymore.

Don't get me wrong, the SWAC and MEAC still have good players. Its just that they don't have the same number of NFL prospects that they used to have.


SFL got good players, but they have never equaled the Swac players, period. ;)

[TexasTerror]

SFL got good players, but they have never equaled the Swac players, period. ;)

Pre-1990...sure.

Post-1990...questionable, a toss-up.

Oh, SFL doesn't exist. Come on now, your a I-AA fan, big-time. You should know better considering it hasn't existed in like four years!

[Catmendue2]

Pre-1990...sure.

Post-1990...questionable, a toss-up.

Oh, SFL doesn't exist. Come on now, your a I-AA fan, big-time. You should know better considering it hasn't existed in like four years!


It hasn't existed since the NFL went to 8 draft rounds. BCS players gets drafted, we sign as free agents in 1-AA. Still Grambling is putting folks in the league, there was 90 plus 1-AA teams last year that had no drafted players. Grambling talents hasn't died, speak for your self. Grambling players like the rest of 1-AA has been blackballed by the NFL. The round selections was cut in half and free agency is cheap. It aint got nuthin to do with talent in the SWAC. ;)

[Mr. C]

You would have to be crazy to say that the SWAC still has as much talent as it used to during its glory days. No one in the NFL is blackballing I-AA talent. There are still plenty of I-AA players drafted every year and the Pro Bowl is filled with players who are I-AA alums.

Getting back to the original thread, Bruce Eugene is a great player. He just isn't worthy of the Payton Award.

[*****]

It hasn't existed since the NFL went to 8 draft rounds. BCS players gets drafted, we sign as free agents in 1-AA. Still Grambling is putting folks in the league, there was 90 plus 1-AA teams last year that had no drafted players. Grambling talents hasn't died, speak for your self. Grambling players like the rest of 1-AA has been blackballed by the NFL. The round selections was cut in half and free agency is cheap. It aint got nuthin to do with talent in the SWAC. ;)2005 NFL Opening Day Roster Players from Current I-AA Member Schools
http://i-aa.org/article.asp?articleid=72339

10.27% of NFL opening day rosters are filled by former I-AA student-athletes from current I-AA member schools. Every NFL team has at least two former I-AA student-athletes on their opening day roster. Every I-AA Conference is represented.
(Source: NFL.com)

2045 total players
210 from current member schools, 10.27%

By Conference:
29, GFC
23, A10
23, SWAC
22, BSC
22, MEAC
18, OVC
17, GWFC
17, IVY
16, SLC
14, SOCON
2, BSOUTH
2, NEC
2, PFL
2, PL
1, MAAC

Teams with at least four:
8 Western Illinois
7 North Carolina A&T
7 Northern Iowa
6 Northern Arizona
5 Montana
5 Northwestern State
5 Western Kentucky
4 Alcorn State
4 Arkansas-Pine Bluff
4 Grambling
4 Northern Colorado
4 Pennsylvania
4 Sacramento State
4 South Carolina State
4 South Dakota State
4 Stephen F. Austin
4 Western Carolina

[SUjagTILLiDIE]

2005 NFL Opening Day Roster Players from Current I-AA Member Schools
http://i-aa.org/article.asp?articleid=72339

10.27% of NFL opening day rosters are filled by former I-AA student-athletes from current I-AA member schools. Every NFL team has at least two former I-AA student-athletes on their opening day roster. Every I-AA Conference is represented.
(Source: NFL.com)

2045 total players
210 from current member schools, 10.27%

By Conference:
29, GFC
23, A10
23, SWAC
22, BSC
22, MEAC
18, OVC
17, GWFC
17, IVY
16, SLC
14, SOCON
2, BSOUTH
2, NEC
2, PFL
2, PL
1, MAAC

Teams with at least four:
8 Western Illinois
7 North Carolina A&T
7 Northern Iowa
6 Northern Arizona
5 Montana
5 Northwestern State
5 Western Kentucky
4 Alcorn State
4 Arkansas-Pine Bluff
4 Grambling
4 Northern Colorado
4 Pennsylvania
4 Sacramento State
4 South Carolina State
4 South Dakota State
4 Stephen F. Austin
4 Western Carolina
Thanks for posting this. And for people to say the swac is inferior and can't compete is just sad. This is proof in the pudding.

[SAME OLD G]

Not to be dragged into this, but that type of a comment is the kind that brings out the world's tiniest violin. Everyone else in IAA doesn't vote with regard to the SWAC? When did the SWAC start caring about IAA? Heck, even on boards like this the majority (not all) of the SWAC posters rip on the IAA playoffs and boast about the money and national attention they get from the Classic games, and now we are to believe that the SWAC is a victim by the intentional actions of the rest of IAA? The SWAC, like the Ivy before them, has made it very clear they don't care much about the rest of IAA and they consider their own priorities to be different. Hey, that's perfectly fine and more power to you - just don't try to cast it as being that the rest of IAA is intentionally pursuing policies to exclude the SWAC, because then you're just crying sour grapes.

Now see, I wasn't going to be dragged into this bullisht topic until I read this bullisht.

Lets get something straight. Don't confuse our (the SWAC) choice not to participate in the D-1AA playoffs with not being concerned about the decisions that are made regarding D1-AA. We are a D1-AA conference, and we conduct our football business as such. So just because we have made the decision not to play in your precious playoffs doesn't mean we don't have a say in how D1-AA can be conducted.

[SAME OLD G]

The SWAC and MEAC are shadows of their former selfs. 30-40 years ago HBCU football athletes were just just as good or better than BCS level athletes, however thats just not the case anymore.

Yep! You can thank some black guy named Sam Cunningham and the 1970 USC Trojans for that ass whippin' that they gave Bear Bryant and his good ole Alabama Crimson Tide. Them Bama "red necks" in the stands called Sam Cunningham every every name they could think of, except Sam. Well 12 carries, 2TDs and 135 yards later in a 42-12 rout of Bama, the people from Bama went to Bear Bryant and told him, "Coach, we want you to go out and get us some of them next year".

After the game, Coach Bryant asked Cunningham to stop by the Alabama locker room. Addressing his all-white squad, The Bear pointed to Cunningham and said “Men, this is what a football player looks like.”

HBCU football would never be the same after that.

[*****]

... Don't confuse our (the SWAC) choice not to participate in the D-1AA playoffs with not being concerned about the decisions that are made regarding D1-AA. We are a D1-AA conference, and we conduct our football business as such. So just because we have made the decision not to play in your precious playoffs doesn't mean we don't have a say in how D1-AA can be conducted.SWAC IS I-AA. THEY ARE YOUR I-AA PLAYOFFS TOO! PLEASE CUT THE "OUR" AND "YOUR" DIVISIVE LANGUAGE.

[Grizo406]

Someone sounds cranky, or is it just me?

[SAME OLD G]

The ALcorn St president voted against the 12 game too representing the swac so take your disappointment to them.

Yeah MB, I forgot to tell you this. That dumb bastard Bristow actually voted for this without giving any thought as to how it would effect the SWAC schools.

[*****]

Someone sounds cranky, or is it just me?Yep, dang cranky with this divisive stuff within I-AA.

[*****]

Yeah MB, I forgot to tell you this. That dumb bastard Bristow actually voted for this without giving any thought as to how it would effect the SWAC schools.Careful how you lump SWAC schools together... peops are angry about this! :rolleyes:

[blueballs]

Yep! You can thank some black guy named Sam Cunningham and the 1970 USC Trojans for that ass whippin' that they gave Bear Bryant and his good ole Alabama Crimson Tide. Them Bama "red necks" in the stands called Sam Cunningham every every name they could think of, except Sam. Well 12 carries, 2TDs and 135 yards later in a 42-12 rout of Bama, the people from Bama went to Bear Bryant and told him, "Coach, we want you to go out and get us some of them next year".

After the game, Coach Bryant asked Cunningham to stop by the Alabama locker room. Addressing his all-white squad, The Bear pointed to Cunningham and said “Men, this is what a football player looks like.”

HBCU football would never be the same after that.

There was a great article in Sports Illustrated last week about the trailblazers who were the first black athletes in southern programs and the turmoil and scorn they endured. They are better men than I.

[TexasTerror]

Careful how you lump SWAC schools together... peops are angry about this! :rolleyes:

You'd think they weren't a conference or something... :confused:

[gram4life]

You'd think they weren't a conference or something... :confused:

BS

[TexasTerror]

BS

I'm sorry, but you told us not to put all of the SWAC in the same boat...did you not?

What should we call the SWAC and company? And how should we divide the conference? I'm just going by what I see in the fishwraps, the SWAC is a I-AA conference. But, I guess we can make exceptions since bunching the schools altogether is not desired... ;)

[gram4life]

I'm sorry, but you told us not to put all of the SWAC in the same boat...did you not?

What should we call the SWAC and company? And how should we divide the conference? I'm just going by what I see in the fishwraps, the SWAC is a I-AA conference. But, I guess we can make exceptions since bunching the schools altogether is not desired... ;)

BS, you want to play word games. Say what you really mean instead of trying to get a dig in but Ralph will just poo poo that away. Oh well.

[Catmendue2]

You would have to be crazy to say that the SWAC still has as much talent as it used to during its glory days. No one in the NFL is blackballing I-AA talent. There are still plenty of I-AA players drafted every year and the Pro Bowl is filled with players who are I-AA alums.

Getting back to the original thread, Bruce Eugene is a great player. He just isn't worthy of the Payton Award.


After he wins it, you will be saying the same thing. I heard the same story about Doug Williams 20 years ago. He's now a Superbowl MVP. ;)


Gramblings 2005 version of the Tigers might be the most talented team since the 1960's teams and thats not just talk my friend.

BTW, I am speaking specifically about/of Grambling, not the entire SWAC.

[AppGuy04]

Gramblings 2005 version of the Tigers might be the most talented team since the 1960's teams and thats not just talk my friend.

BTW, I am speaking specifically about/of Grambling, not the entire SWAC.

which is exactly my point: it will hurt him to have no competition

[Catmendue2]

which is exactly my point: it will hurt him to have no competition


They said Doug didn't have any either and he was in the top three in the Heisman race. What you have is an opinion and thats it an opinion. ;)

[SAME OLD G]

They said Doug didn't have any either and he was in the top three in the Heisman race. What you have is an opinion and thats it an opinion. ;)
Its just a cultural bias that these people can't admit they have.

[AppGuy04]

Its just a cultural bias that these people can't admit they have.

ofcourse you would bring it to that

[AppGuy04]

Now we are told we are too good to play at Black schools, and we should only play at White schools, because Black schools just can't give us what we need. But things have changed for the better, RIGHT? :rolleyes:

where was this said anywhere in this thread?

[Catmendue2]

ofcourse you would bring it to that



You fu-king aye better believe it buddy :D

[AppGuy04]

You fu-king aye better believe it buddy :D

why? why does everything have to end up being about color?

[henfan]

Looks like Spears might have cost his guy some votes by running up the score on a weak opponent. Sad.

[Catmendue2]

why? why does everything have to end up being about color?



Cause everybody is a color and some colors don't make reconizable colors when they are mixed. :D

[AppGuy04]

Cause everybody is a color and some color don't make reconizable colors when they are mixed. :D

which is why you need to look at everything in grayscale

[Catmendue2]

:eek:
which is why you need to look at everything in grayscale



No, I am looking at things as they should be and don't give a damn about what you think. You come in here with all that covert negativity and hate to get called on it. Its just that plain and simple. :rolleyes:

[SAME OLD G]

why? why does everything have to end up being about color?

Why deny that color doesn't have anything to do with a lot of things?

[SAME OLD G]

No, I am looking at things as they should be and don't give a damn about what you think. You come in here with all that covert negativity and hate to get called on it. Its just that plain and simple. :rolleyes:

Its called a cultural bias.

[AppGuy04]

:eek:



No, I am looking at things as they should be and don't give a damn about what you think. You come in here with all that covert negativity and hate to get called on it. Its just that plain and simple. :rolleyes:

really, so you know me by reading my internet message board posts about football, none of which have anything to do with Bruce Eugene's color

thats an interesting theory

[AppGuy04]

Why deny that color doesn't have anything to do with a lot of things?

you are right, color does have to do with some things, but not this.....

[SAME OLD G]

you are right, color does have to do with some things, but not this.....
Sure it does.

[AppGuy04]

Sure it does.

please explain

[Catmendue2]

you are right, color does have to do with some things, but not this.....


Ok DOC, explain it to me then. Inquiring minds would like to know what you really feel and think.

[jstate83]

Why do ya'll fall for this "SWAC is inferior", "SWAC shouldn't be allowed to play football", SWAC ain't this, SWAC ain't that from this board.
Start out as a so-called "TOPIC", and within 3 post, the same clowns come in with the same crap.

The SWAC ain't in ya'll's party. :deadhorse

It's amazing how much people THINK they know about something they claim to hate. We don't waste time talking about ya'll, why all the time and BULLSHAT pointed at us.....................again, ya'll are a :deadhorse to us. :)

Ya'll are past commical. :)

[AppGuy04]

Ok DOC, explain it to me then. Inquiring minds would like to know what you really feel and think.

there is nothing to explain

we were discussing Eugene, and I don't feel he will win the Payton b/c his stats are inflated by bad competition, that is all, no color involved

[SAME OLD G]

please explain
Dude, there is no need. I have tried several times, but you and the rest would find every excuse not to understand.

But I will say this...again. Just because its about race, doesn't mean it is racial.

[SAME OLD G]

there is nothing to explain

we were discussing Eugene, and I don't feel he will win the Payton b/c his stats are inflated by bad competition, that is all, no color involved

So in other words, the award is based on stats and not the ability of the player right?

[AppGuy04]

Dude, there is no need. I have tried several times, but you and the rest would find every excuse not to understand.

But I will say this...again. Just because its about race, doesn't mean it is racial.

but thats my point, this isn't about race, this is about football, there isn't some secret conspiracy for people to not like Eugene for the Payton just b/c he's a black guy

[AppGuy04]

So in other words, the award is based on stats and not the ability of the player right?

stats are an indicator of ability, yes, but just like the GPI, polls, and playoff selection, its never based on one issue

but when voting for an individual award, stats play a big part, yes, otherwise no one would care thet Eugene was left in the game, the whole point of this thread from the beginning

[AppGuy04]

Dude, you REALLY need to wake up!

when it comes to football, it is not a black and white issue, those who try to make it that way are the ones who need to wake up

[SAME OLD G]

but thats my point, this isn't about race, this is about football, there isn't some secret conspiracy for people to not like Eugene for the Payton just b/c he's a black guy I didn't say there was.

[GannonFan]

So in other words, the award is based on stats and not the ability of the player right?

Jumping in again - technically speaking, these award (both the Payton and the Buchanan) are extremely stat-weighted, or so is the opinion of the guys from Sports Network. Most of the people who vote on these haven't seen half of the guys who they're voting on - it's like the IAA polls in that way. IAA football is still not widely circulated so even if you do see a player it may just be a game. Because of that, stats are almost the sole criteria when it comes to voting. Hence why you almost never see a great defensive back win the Buchanan - a good defensive back can't get the stats that a defensive lineman can get. The awards ain't perfect, not that that's a surprise.

[AppGuy04]

You're right. It is because he plays at a Black school.

Playing at Grambling only hurts him b/c of the rest of the SWAC and how bad they are, not b/c its a black school

[TexasTerror]

Black school or not...why are they throwing the ball with a few minutes left in the 4Q when they're up by 40+?

Even Mike Leach understands you don't do that or he'd have dropped 100 on the Kats...

Spears is clueless and I hope it comes back to bite him in the butt when teams roll up 60+ on them when they're down in the dirt...

[SAME OLD G]

stats are an indicator of ability, yes, but just like the GPI, polls, and playoff selection, its never based on one issue

but when voting for an individual award, stats play a big part, yes, otherwise no one would care thet Eugene was left in the game, the whole point of this thread from the beginning

So if a QB ends a game 25-50, but 10 of those passes were dropped despite being right on point for the WR to catch them, that is an indicator of the QB's ability?

[AppGuy04]

So if a QB ends a game 25-50, but 10 of those passes were dropped despite being right on point for the WR to catch them, that is an indicator of the QB's ability?

do you really think that any of the voters know exactly how many passes were dropped or tipped or whatever, come on man

[SAME OLD G]

when it comes to football, it is not a black and white issue, those who try to make it that way are the ones who need to wake up

Hmmmm, only a handful of black coaches at D1A programs,but it is not a black and white issue. I think I get it now. :confused:

[AppGuy04]

Youngster, this country's racial history does not allow for us to "leave race out of..." everything as you suggest.

it does for me, b/c I am the "new generation" that is being taught that you should see through color

thats what I will teach my children

I can't make up for the transgressions of my ancestors, but I will do my part

and sports is one place where race should never be an issue, I don't see how this is hard to understand

[Hamptongal]

So if a QB ends a game 25-50, but 10 of those passes were dropped despite being right on point for the WR to catch them, that is an indicator of the QB's ability?
Funny thing about this argument. I bet all of you care far more than he does about getting this award. Most players would rather get to the next level than worry about an award. An award is great, sure but this is probably more to him about doing the best he can at impressing the scouts that are checking him out. Maybe that's why they are throwing it with a few minutes left. For a lot of these guys this is their life's dream we are talking about, not just a game.

[AppGuy04]

Hmmmm, only a handful of black coaches at D1A programs,but it is not a black and white issue. I think I get it now. :confused:

coaches are chosen by their qualifications, not b/c they are black or white, but i'm not gonna get into that, this is obviously pointless

its just another thing for you guys

[TexasTerror]

I think the issue is...

Is SPEARS right in leaving Eugene in and letting him pass the ball when Grambling is clearly up by 30-40 points in the fourth quarter?

It's not about the Payton. Spears has become the I-AA (wait, some of the Grambling folks on here don't like that)...SWAC version of Mike Leach of Texas Tech. Run up the score and who cares about the opposition! That's the Grambling way? Seriously...have some respect!

[Hamptongal]

Youngster, this country's racial history does not allow for us to "leave race out of..." everything as you suggest.
At the same time it does not ask us to make a bigger role in certain areas than it needs to be. To assume that we know what is going on in the heads of others and their beliefs and choices is a dangerous line to walk. If somebody doesn't believe that they have racial motivations behind their thought process, then you aren't going to change their mind by telling them that indeed it is about race. I think most people are aware that race is in the picture, and because of our not so distant past that we still have a long way to go, but to alienate people by accusing them of something that may be completely untrue is not only unfair to that person but also unfair to the other posters on this board. Just my two cents.

[SAME OLD G]

do you really think that any of the voters know exactly how many passes were dropped or tipped or whatever, come on man

Exactly, so how the hell can you make the statement that stats be considered and then on top of that try to justify a person's stats based on the level of competition he plays in.

You know what...now that I think about it. Why the hell would any of you even bother to make Eugene a candidate for the award if you know before the season even starts the so called "level of competition" isn't to your liking in the first place? Please tell me that.

And if you are doing it to be politically correct...I am playing the race card. Yeah, I said it!

[TexasTerror]

Funny...all the folks are ignoring my points...which I've brought up twice, if not thrice...may as well post it again until the ignorant realize it...

I think the issue is...

Is SPEARS right in leaving Eugene in and letting him pass the ball when Grambling is clearly up by 30-40 points in the fourth quarter?

It's not about the Payton. Spears has become the I-AA (wait, some of the Grambling folks on here don't like that)...SWAC version of Mike Leach of Texas Tech. Run up the score and who cares about the opposition! That's the Grambling way? Seriously...have some respect!

[AppGuy04]

Exactly, so how the hell can you make the statement that stats be considered and then on top of that try to justify a person's stats based on the level of competition he plays in.

You know what...now that I think about it. Why the hell would any of you even bother to make Eugene a candidate for the award if you know before the season even starts the so called "level of competition" isn't to your liking in the first place? Please tell me that.

And if you are doing it to be politically correct...I am playing the race card. Yeah, I said it!

if you don't use stats, how else do you judge who should win the award?

the "level of comeptition" is based on this year's games, so we don't know until the season progresses and see how things shake out

and I'll disregard that last comment b/c I'm trying to be civil about this

[PDXCat]

Eugene has only had one injury in his whole college career. Eugene has passed and rushed for more yards in combination than any player in college football in the last four years, period. Eugene has earned the Payton Award and he will get his due, no matter what some of you naysayers think. Of all the 1-AA players this year, he is the one most likely to succeed at the next level.

This is way off. I hope the best for him but, at this point, it doesn't look too good.

[TexasTerror]

If Eugene is deservant of the Payton...

Tech's QBs should have won the Heismann these last few years...

MARCUS SPEARS is SWAC's equivalent of MIKE LEACH!

Read the above posts for more...

[AppGuy04]

If that is the case, then why do you CONSTANTLY berate the MEAC and the SWAC? I don't see you berating ANY other conference in ANY other Division. Yes, you berate Coastal- I will give you that- but you have NEVER berated an ENTIRE conference like you do the MEAC and SWAC, which, coincidentally are made up of HBCUs. On other posts, you have also berated other organizations which are predominantly made up of Blacks, but there is not the same hate and fervor against organizations predominantly made up of whites. No need to reply, since you aren't going to talk about race (your words, remember). Just think about it in your day to day musings about life.

I could say the same thing about you always making posts about race

I don't think I have seen a handful, if any at all, of posts that weren't about some sort of racial issue, so look in the mirror there bud

I have expressed my opinion about the MEAC and SWAC conferences, and these opinions are based solely on performance, and a little on the fans. Fans of Hampton, SC State, and Grambling have expressed how good they think their teams are, which I'm not arguing, they should do that if they are a true fan. But when you point out how horrible the conference is, all of the sudden hate the b/c they are black, this is what ticks me off

and even threads like this that have nothing to do with race tend to turn into it

and I live with myself fine thanks

[SAME OLD G]

if you don't use stats, how else do you judge who should win the award?

Uhhhhh.....how about having some voters actually go to the games and watch him play.

I know a guy who follows the SWAC quite a bit. He use to get a ballot for the Payton and Buchannan awards, but for some reason, he hasn't gotten a ballot from the fine folks at TSN the past 2 years.

Why is that Ralph? :confused:

[AppGuy04]

"...you guys..."- But it's not about race, right?

you guys, referring to the SEVERAL people arguing with me

once again, jumping the gun

[TexasTerror]

I know a guy who follows the SWAC quite a bit. He use to get a ballot for the Payton and Buchannan awards, but for some reason, he hasn't gotten a ballot from the fine folks at TSN the past 2 years. Why is that Ralph? :confused:

Ralph is not with TSN. Does he vote in the polls too? If you vote in the polls, you vote in the others...

Also, when you going to start reading my posts about Grambling running up the score? Or did I prove my case to be right...

[SAME OLD G]

If Eugene is deservant of the Payton...

Tech's QBs should have won the Heismann these last few years...

MARCUS SPEARS is SWAC's equivalent of MIKE LEACH!

Read the above posts for more...

Marcus Spears plays with the Dallas Cowboys. What are you talking about?

[TexasTerror]

Marcus Spears plays with the Dallas Cowboys. What are you talking about?

I meant Melvin Spears...

Sorry, Marcus used to play for the Texans as well, so the name is on my mind...

Melvin Spears loves to run up that score though, all the same. He won't even run the ball when they're up 40. He keeps gunning it, who cares how much time is left? No class! Classless! Reason enough if I was a voter to vote AGAINST Eugene and Spears for awards...

[Catmendue2]

sports is one place where race should never be an issue, I don't see how this is hard to understand

Tell MLB that it took them 50 years, while they constantly said the Negro league was inferior. Who actually was inferior?

[SAME OLD G]

He won't even run the ball when they're up 40.

How do you know?

[AppGuy04]

Uhhhhh.....how about having some voters actually go to the games and watch him play.

I know a guy who follows the SWAC quite a bit. He use to get a ballot for the Payton and Buchannan awards, but for some reason, he hasn't gotten a ballot from the fine folks at TSN the past 2 years.

Why is that Ralph? :confused:

i'm sure all voters don't have that kind of time or money

[AppGuy04]

Tell MLB that it took them 50 years, while they constantly said the Negro league was inferior. Who actually was inferior?

that was then, this is now

how can we change the present and the future if you live in the past

[TexasTerror]

How do you know?

Against TxSo, Grambling hit a 43 yard pass with about 34 seconds left. Why not kneel the ball? 51-21 not good enough?

GRAMBLING-TD, K Hills 43 YD PASS FROM B Eugene 14:26 4th
Qtr

And with Concordia with a 62-7 lead, Eugene was still in the game! And having more pass attempts than rushing attempts on that given drive. Heck, Mack Brown would've had Matt Nordgren in then!

http://www.swac.org/05-06/football/stats/gsu1112.htm

[SAME OLD G]

that was then, this is now

how can we change the present and the future if you live in the past How can there possibly be change if you ignore the past?

[SAME OLD G]

Against TxSo, Grambling hit a 43 yard pass with about 34 seconds left. Why not kneel the ball? 51-21 not good enough?

GRAMBLING-TD, K Hills 43 YD PASS FROM B Eugene 14:26 4th
Qtr

And with Concordia with a 62-7 lead, Eugene was still in the game! And having more pass attempts than rushing attempts on that given drive. Heck, Mack Brown would've had Matt Nordgren in then!

http://www.swac.org/05-06/football/stats/gsu1112.htm

So how do you know we are not rushing?

[TexasTerror]

So how do you know we are not rushing?

I just linked you to the play-by-play...showed more passing attempts with score 62-7 and EUGENE still in the game. One more TD to 'grow on', eh? Then you went mostly rush...but still passed from time to time. Go figure!

[Catmendue2]

that was then, this is now

how can we change the present and the future if you live in the past


People like you talk slick, but we can see through your rose colored exterior and thats why things won't change.

Who gives you the right to rate the SWAC against MEAC or anybodyelse. What make all the other conferences so much better than BCF teams. Why isn't Hampton #1? Its all about opinions. Not facts.

[TexasTerror]

Who gives you the right to rate the SWAC against MEAC or anybodyelse. What make all the other conferences so much better than BCF teams. Why isn't Hampton #1? Its all about opinions. Not facts.

Hampton is not #1 based on STRENGTH OF SCHEDULE...

If they're good, we have a thing called the playoffs for I-AA conferences that have scholarships and don't put themselves above I-AA or have academic concerns (like the Ivy and SWAC). They can take care of their business then...

No mythical title such as the BCS or HBC, where the title is typically not won on a field. A real title, played out on the field like it is in Div II, Div III and NAIA...and most certainly, I-AA!

[Catmendue2]

At the same time it does not ask us to make a bigger role in certain areas than it needs to be. To assume that we know what is going on in the heads of others and their beliefs and choices is a dangerous line to walk. If somebody doesn't believe that they have racial motivations behind their thought process, then you aren't going to change their mind by telling them that indeed it is about race. I think most people are aware that race is in the picture, and because of our not so distant past that we still have a long way to go, but to alienate people by accusing them of something that may be completely untrue is not only unfair to that person but also unfair to the other posters on this board. Just my two cents.

What make you think he not being racist, After 500 posts and all 500 having the same slick slant its obvious. Plus, he gets his motivation from whence he come.

[Hamptongal]

Hamptongal, you and I agree more than we disagree, but this will be a major disagreement here. I have been fighting this fight and running this race for a very long time. In the words of an old person I really respect "If it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck, its a duck." AppGuy04 is not the only one on here or in society BY FAR, but there are those that ALWAYS find a way to criticize Black folk or Black organizations EXCLUSIVELY, and then say "I am not racist." You're right about one thing- I'm not in AppGuy04's head (Thank God! ;) ), but I am reading what he has written. I can only go by that.
But if you really, truly feel that way you aren't going to convince him by telling him that is what he is doing. All he sees is that you are so focused on race that you believe everything is about race. Very rarely are people convinced that they are what you think them to be unless you can show them, not tell them. Unless you have some hard proof he will never be convinced no matter how convincing his words are to you. The arguments made simply make him feel ostracized by you and create an even bigger gap between yourself and him, so he is less and less apt to see your point and will only fight harder to prove to you that he is not biased, as you believe him to be.

[Catmendue2]

Hampton is not #1 based on STRENGTH OF SCHEDULE...

If they're good, we have a thing called the playoffs for I-AA conferences that have scholarships and don't put themselves above I-AA or have academic concerns (like the Ivy and SWAC). They can take care of their business then...

No mythical title such as the BCS or HBC, where the title is typically not won on a field. A real title, played out on the field like it is in Div II, Div III and NAIA...and most certainly, I-AA!


Thats the problem, strenght of schedule is being determined in somebody head not on the field. BCF is no weaker than the A-10 or BigSKy just in the minds of certain people. Don't Hate just cause you can.

[AppGuy04]

I'm not trying to convince him of anything. He is going to think what he wants, regardless. I, however, am not going to let him spew trash out of his mouth about Black folk and Black organizations without a fight.

my "spewing" is about the MEAC and the SWAC b/c of their football prowess, not b/c they are black or black organizations

this is what you fail to understand, and when you try and tell me what I think, thats just ridiculous

i have said it 1000 times, this is not a black and white issue, its a football issue

this is all i have to say, good day

[TexasTerror]

Thats the problem, strenght of schedule is being determined in somebody head not on the field. BCF is no weaker than the A-10 or BigSKy just in the minds of certain people. Don't Hate just cause you can.


This is why we need games played between BCF programs and others...

Unfortunately, there's not much to go by. The games we have to go by don't say much. McN beat TxSo. The most marquee matchup was SC State falling at home to Coastal Carolina. What more do we know? Not much.

The SWAC mandate eliminates them from competing much outside of conference and the MEAC does play a handful, but they are themselves in a different league than the SWAC, since we're not allowed to put them in the same boat...

[Catmendue2]

I'm not trying to convince him of anything. He is going to think what he wants, regardless. I, however, am not going to let him spew trash out of his mouth about Black folk and Black organizations without a fight.


Thank you Brother, its time for someone to check his crap. Its been going on long enough. Apparently, HamptonGal needs to read some of his other post. He shows obvious disdained for anything associated with Black. You don't see him bashing the OVC do you, a conference with no decent teams.

[gram4life]

This is why we need games played between BCF programs and others...

Unfortunately, there's not much to go by. The games we have to go by don't say much. McN beat TxSo. The most marquee matchup was SC State falling at home to Coastal Carolina. What more do we know? Not much.

The SWAC mandate eliminates them from competing much outside of conference and the MEAC does play a handful, but they are themselves in a different league than the SWAC, since we're not allowed to put them in the same boat...

Nevermind

[Hamptongal]

Thats the problem, strenght of schedule is being determined in somebody head not on the field. BCF is no weaker than the A-10 or BigSKy just in the minds of certain people. Don't Hate just cause you can.
I think the questions will be answered in the playoffs. As far as Hampton goes, they are a great team, but they had a crappy out of conference schedule this year. 11-0 is impressive but would be more impressive against teams with higher win percentages. I love Hampton but I am not sure they would have beat Montana or UNH had they been on the schedule, especially not how they were playing in some of the early games this season. We were down against Howard. The team has improved as their O-Line (3 new starters) has improved and they have becoming increasingly balanced between the run and the pass. As a Hampton fan who would be insanely pleased if they won the championship, I would have a difficult time putting money on that fact at this point. :rolleyes:

[Hamptongal]

Thank you Brother, its time for someone to check his crap. Its been going on long enough. Apparently, HamptonGal needs to read some of his other post. He shows obvious disdained for anything associated with Black. You don't see him bashing the OVC do you, a conference with no decent teams.
No, I have read his posts, I feel like he runs around the posts and disagrees with what I say sometimes. I have even told him that it wouldn't be a day without him remarking on my posts. However, I still think it's extremely dangerous to try and convince somebody that they are a certain way when they don't believe they are. I never said that it was or wasn't true, I just said we'll never know, so all it can do is make him more defensive and aggressive towards anything ShellShock has to say.

[Catmendue2]

This is why we need games played between BCF programs and others...

Unfortunately, there's not much to go by. The games we have to go by don't say much. McN beat TxSo. The most marquee matchup was SC State falling at home to Coastal Carolina. What more do we know? Not much.

The SWAC mandate eliminates them from competing much outside of conference and the MEAC does play a handful, but they are themselves in a different league than the SWAC, since we're not allowed to put them in the same boat...


TSU is the worst team in SWAC, Coastal also beat your 1-AA champ on the field after being left out of the playoff the year before. But you can put SCSU in the playoffs where they belong. You can also leave all the 3 and 4 lost teams out of the top 25. You could do a lot but you don't. ;)

[Catmendue2]

No, I have read his posts, I feel like he runs around the posts and disagrees with what I say sometimes. I have even told him that it wouldn't be a day without him remarking on my posts. However, I still think it's extremely dangerous to try and convince somebody that they are a certain way when they don't believe they are. I never said that it was or wasn't true, I just said we'll never know, so all it can do is make him more defensive and aggressive towards anything ShellShock has to say.


Who cares what he thinks, give him a dime for a cup of coffee. Please. :cool:

[Hamptongal]

This is why we need games played between BCF programs and others...

Unfortunately, there's not much to go by. The games we have to go by don't say much. McN beat TxSo. The most marquee matchup was SC State falling at home to Coastal Carolina. What more do we know? Not much.

The SWAC mandate eliminates them from competing much outside of conference and the MEAC does play a handful, but they are themselves in a different league than the SWAC, since we're not allowed to put them in the same boat...
You aren't allowed to put them in the same boat because they aren't in the same boat. If you have seen other posts about the top teams in the MEAC you would see that if done fairly and properly Hampton and SCSU would love to get rivalries with out of conference teams going. Often the reply has been that a weak MEAC team can't demand fairness and should take whatever the almighty A10 has to offer. (That was the argument about Hampton v. JMU falling through.) Hampton will continue to try and create better schedules as their AD, also the head coach, creates more prestige in this program, as they gain respect by going further in the playoffs and scheduling strong teams from other conferences to go along with their conference play. Hampton would indeed enjoy seeing the MEAC as a whole strengthen, but making wild conjectures about how good a team is that hasn't played other teams much is ridiculous especially when I hear crap like Hampton doesn't have the speed of any A10 team, (which has been said) or they just don't have the talent and depth. Yet then we see that with less teams in their conference the MEAC has basically the same amount of players in the NFL that the other conferences have. Therefore, all these arguments are moot because they cannot be proven until the teams go head to head. Once again like I said before, if and when Hampton loses in the playoffs you can talk about how much better other teams are than they are until then the only team that can discuss their dominance against Hampton is William and Mary.

[TexasTerror]

Well, if Hampton loses in the first round, the MEAC will continue their tough run against the best of I-AA since 2000. Would love to see more conferences break into the A10, Big Sky and Southern. But, the MEAC has not been successful in the I-AA playoffs these last five years. We'll see what Hampton and SC State do...

2004 - #3 WILLIAM & MARY 42, Hampton 35
2003 - Florida Atlantic 32, BETHUNE-COOKMAN 24 and #3 WOFFORD 31, North Carolina A&T 10
2002 - Ga. Southern 34, Bethune-Cookman 0
2001 - Ga. Southern 60, Florida A&M 35
2000 - Western Ky. 27, Florida A&M 0

[TxSt02]

some say ghetto teams do ghetto things...

[SUjagTILLiDIE]

which is exactly my point: it will hurt him to have no competition
The swac is just as strong as any other 1-aa conference according to this.2005 NFL Opening Day Roster Players from Current I-AA Member Schools
http://i-aa.org/article.asp?articleid=72339

10.27% of NFL opening day rosters are filled by former I-AA student-athletes from current I-AA member schools. Every NFL team has at least two former I-AA student-athletes on their opening day roster. Every I-AA Conference is represented.
(Source: NFL.com)

2045 total players
210 from current member schools, 10.27%

By Conference:
29, GFC
23, A10
23, SWAC
22, BSC
22, MEAC
18, OVC
17, GWFC
17, IVY
16, SLC
14, SOCON
2, BSOUTH
2, NEC
2, PFL
2, PL
1, MAAC

Teams with at least four:
8 Western Illinois
7 North Carolina A&T
7 Northern Iowa
6 Northern Arizona
5 Montana
5 Northwestern State
5 Western Kentucky
4 Alcorn State
4 Arkansas-Pine Bluff
4 Grambling
4 Northern Colorado
4 Pennsylvania
4 Sacramento State
4 South Carolina State
4 South Dakota State
4 Stephen F. Austin
4 Western Carolina
__________________
I-AA ALL THE WAY!

[gram4life]

The swac is just as strong as any other 1-aa conference according to this.2005 NFL Opening Day Roster Players from Current I-AA Member Schools
http://i-aa.org/article.asp?articleid=72339

10.27% of NFL opening day rosters are filled by former I-AA student-athletes from current I-AA member schools. Every NFL team has at least two former I-AA student-athletes on their opening day roster. Every I-AA Conference is represented.
(Source: NFL.com)

2045 total players
210 from current member schools, 10.27%

By Conference:
29, GFC
23, A10
23, SWAC
22, BSC
22, MEAC
18, OVC
17, GWFC
17, IVY
16, SLC
14, SOCON
2, BSOUTH
2, NEC
2, PFL
2, PL
1, MAAC

Teams with at least four:
8 Western Illinois
7 North Carolina A&T
7 Northern Iowa
6 Northern Arizona
5 Montana
5 Northwestern State
5 Western Kentucky
4 Alcorn State
4 Arkansas-Pine Bluff
4 Grambling
4 Northern Colorado
4 Pennsylvania
4 Sacramento State
4 South Carolina State
4 South Dakota State
4 Stephen F. Austin
4 Western Carolina
__________________
I-AA ALL THE WAY!

Man you didn't know, the SWAC doesn't prepare anyone one for the next level. Because they play in such a weak conference.

[TxSt02]

some say your sheet is showing...

I wasnt talking to you...

[Retro]

Yep! You can thank some black guy named Sam Cunningham and the 1970 USC Trojans for that ass whippin' that they gave Bear Bryant and his good ole Alabama Crimson Tide. Them Bama "red necks" in the stands called Sam Cunningham every every name they could think of, except Sam. Well 12 carries, 2TDs and 135 yards later in a 42-12 rout of Bama, the people from Bama went to Bear Bryant and told him, "Coach, we want you to go out and get us some of them next year".

There's more to that story...

Before this game happened, Bear Bryant already knew he needed to start getting the good black athletes into his program.. The only problem was convincing his team, fans and boosters of the same necessity to compete at the highest level... So, he flew out to L.A. and met with John McKay at an airport bar knowing he had already been succesful with black RB's. He told john he wanted them to come play AT alabama so the bama fans could see his rb in person, regardless of the possile outcome. (Remember this is when very few games were on national tv per year)...

So after USC came out there and won. Bear Bryant said "That's why we need to start recruiting black athletes here!"s

Here's a link to an article that actually mentions a little about that event.. Scroll down to the last couple of paragraphs of the article..

bear bryant article (http://espn.go.com/page2/s/halberstam/021220.html)

[Retro]

Gram4life, We've discussed this before and the fact is, having a few more individual players in the NFL over another conference doesn't indicate quality teams in the conference from top to bottom, nor does it indicate a quality team when 1 player becomes a high draft pick.

The only way to truly measure a team and conferences quality is via games againest opponents from other conferences in the regular season and in the playoffs, where only the best make it to. Until the SWAC get on board with the rest of I-AA and become a regular participant in the post season, then all your talk is just that....... Talk!

[TxSt02]

You were talking about HBCUs, you were talking to me. There's that dang sheet again! Man, you know you need to hide that. You won't intimidate anyone when you go "midnight riding" if everyone knows who you are! :lmao:

You are funny and easy to figure out... You really do live in the past and dont help out with forward progression of your movement...

you missed my point of the original post...

[SUjagTILLiDIE]

Gram4life, We've discussed this before and the fact is, having a few more individual players in the NFL over another conference doesn't indicate quality teams in the conference from top to bottom, nor does it indicate a quality team when 1 player becomes a high draft pick.

The only way to truly measure a team and conferences quality is via games againest opponents from other conferences in the regular season and in the playoffs, where only the best make it to. Until the SWAC get on board with the rest of I-AA and become a regular participant in the post season, then all your talk is just that....... Talk!
BS

man you're funny as hell . First its weak competition and no talent. Then when its proven that the SWAC is amongst the leaders of 1-aa in putting players in the league yall come with something else. :deadhorse

[TexasTerror]

Gram4life, We've discussed this before and the fact is, having a few more individual players in the NFL over another conference doesn't indicate quality teams in the conference from top to bottom, nor does it indicate a quality team when 1 player becomes a high draft pick.

The only way to truly measure a team and conferences quality is via games againest opponents from other conferences in the regular season and in the playoffs, where only the best make it to. Until the SWAC get on board with the rest of I-AA and become a regular participant in the post season, then all your talk is just that....... Talk!


AMEN!

Can't compares apples and oranges until you put them in the same barrel..

MEAC doesn't get slammed because they have the chutzpah to step in the ring called the I-AA playoffs...

SWAC needs to lay off the mandate and show they stack up...or it's all TALK!

[gram4life]

AMEN!

Can't compares apples and oranges until you put them in the same barrel..

MEAC doesn't get slammed because they have the chutzpah to step in the ring called the I-AA playoffs...

SWAC needs to lay off the mandate and show they stack up...or it's all TALK!

Nevermind, we will not play anyone outside the MEAC. Your are right we are afriad. LOL

[TexasTerror]

Nevermind, we will not play anyone outside the MEAC. Your are right we are afriad. LOL

Not afraid. Just put the SWAC "above" everyone else...

Refuse to play more than two out of conference opponents due to a SWAC mandate. Refuse to participate in I-AA playoffs. Complain I-AA did not look out for SWAC interests by adding more games to the schedules...

[gram4life]

Not afraid. Just put the SWAC "above" everyone else...

Refuse to play more than two out of conference opponents due to a SWAC mandate. Refuse to participate in I-AA playoffs. Complain I-AA did not look out for SWAC interests by adding more games to the schedules...

So how are the schools refusing if the conference made the mandate. Note Jackson state had to drop Northwestern. I agree by choosing the SCG we(the SWAC) are not able to participate in the playoffs, Only one person made that suggestion.

[McNeese75]

xcoffeex New thread, same ole BS.

[siugrad99]

This is pathetic, you'd think this player was the second coming of God himself. Bottomline is until you play with the rest of the talent in the 1AA ranks noone will know how good or how bad you truly are. We bitch about Hampton's schedule and will find out in 2 weeks if our comments are warranted. Grambling has this "I'm better than you attitude" about themselves and that is their choice. They can continue to talk, but just as they claim others won't do, THEY need to step up and play a top quality 1AA program IF they want to be respected as a solid 1AA program. This however will never happen and they will continue doing things their own way and be content with running up scores on teams that aren't even affiliated with the NCAA or NAIA. Putting X # of players in the NFL is great and shows you have some top notch "individuals", but as far as "Teams"... another story that won't be told since you don't play well with others in November & December :) If Grambling or Southern truly wanted to be part of 1AA they would do something to ensure their annual game was played after the playoffs or mid season. Try to tell me it isn't possible and i'll tell you that your making excuses. All other teams in 1AA find ways to play their rivalry game during the season and still be involved in the playoff process, but I guess GSU & SU are just too good to have to follow the lead of others. :rolleyes:

[*****]

Its called a cultural bias.and you exude it...

[*****]

Uhhhhh.....how about having some voters actually go to the games and watch him play.

I know a guy who follows the SWAC quite a bit. He use to get a ballot for the Payton and Buchannan awards, but for some reason, he hasn't gotten a ballot from the fine folks at TSN the past 2 years.

Why is that Ralph? :confused:You indeed are confused. I have voted since I started covering I-AA.

[*****]

I interviewed Bruce at his last Payton Awards show and he was a very good kid. He has a lot of talent too. Let's leave the race thing out of this and as this thread is to be closed let's try in the future to keep race out of our football discussions here on this board.

Thanks.