Rutgers to the Patriot League!

[colgate13]

Well, if this guy (http://www.dailyorange.com/media/paper522/news/2005/10/13/Sports/Rutgers.1000.Fights.Big.Spending.As.Focus.Drifts.F rom.Academics-1019312.shtml) had his way anyway. :)

Typical Ivory Tower type that is so out of touch with reality. This quote is classic:


Dowling pointed to the Scarlet Knights' 1961 football season, arguably its most successful, as an example of what he believes should be the model for Rutgers. RU went undefeated, was nationally ranked and had consensus All-American Alex Kroll while facing mostly current Ivy League and Patriot League schools.

As Dowling continues to regroup his efforts and form a new Rutgers 1000, many of the former members continue to believe RU should forsake the lure of television contracts and national exposure and return to the model that worked so well for the university in 1961.

Yup, just turn the clock back 44 years and all will be well. I wonder what will happen if the Patriot goes to football scholarships? Will he settle for the Ivy League then? :p So dellusional...

[GannonFan]

There's been a movement by Rutgers faculty for years to drop sports or to certainly de-empasize them. As long as the BCS money and the smaller March Madness money keeps flowing in, Rutgers ain't going nowhere (which is appropriate really, as their football team never goes anywhere either, especially without Temple to be around anymore to kick around).

[colgate13]

There's been a movement by Rutgers faculty for years to drop sports or to certainly de-empasize them.

I know. I remember hearing about this 10 years ago. This guy is so out of touch with reality though. Try this quote on for size:


"Right now we're kind of regrouping," Dowling said. "I think eventually the internalized pressure from this campaign will force Rutgers out of the Big East. It'll just be a delayed victory."

Is this guy in a Monty Python movie? xlolx

[GannonFan]

He'll be pushing up daisies and Rutgers will still have a big-time (in name only) football team. But, hey, it gives him something to do during the week - he may only have 2 or 3 lectures a week so he needs something to keep him busy. Oh, the Ivory Tower.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

I've seen Rutgers' football stadium and basketball fieldhouse. There is no way they are de-emphasizing sports, especially football. They've sunk a lot of money in there. This Rutgers 1000 guy is living in a pipe dream world.

There's no reason why Rutgers cannot be successful in I-A football or basketball. This is not a Temple situation where there is no fan support, no stadium, utter mismanagement and a basketball legacy with a long shadow. Rutgers' problem lies in recruiting and coaching. I'm convinced the right coaches in charge would turn things around in a heartbeat.

As much as I'd like to see it, there is a 0% chance of Rutgers reclassifying.

[henfan]

There's no reason why Rutgers cannot be successful in I-A football or basketball.

Sure there is: they're Rutgers! I don't care how much money they pour into athletics, they'll always be Rutgers. They're a school without any football success at the major college level. They've eeked out 4 winning seasons (4!) since they began playing a major college schedule around 1980.

Wacky though he may be, Dowling's right. Frankly, PL or CAA for football would be a good idea but RU wouldn't dare do it. The ego associated with major conference affiliation will prevent them from ever reclassifying, despite the fact that they lose over $2M a year on football and have suffered years of negative publicity. Hey, whatever floats your boat.

[colgate13]

CAA? That's more in line for RU than the PL. If it was CAA vs. Big East, then you could have some serious discussions about what's best. The PL schools have nothing in common with Rutgers, which is one reason it is so laughable. (not a dig on RU academics BTW)

[Lehigh Football Nation]

CAA? That's more in line for RU than the PL. If it was CAA vs. Big East, then you could have some serious discussions about what's best. The PL schools have nothing in common with Rutgers, which is one reason it is so laughable. (not a dig on RU academics BTW)

This starts to delve into "what does the future hold for the Big East" question, in both football and basketball. If the Big East falls apart, there are some interesting questions to pose in regads to FB and BB teams and where they would go. Should that happen, you could see Villanova and Georgetown head directly to the Patriot League in all sports - the PL's dream scenario. RU would be a marginally better fit for the CAA, but it's very difficult to picture them at I-AA level in football. Same with UConn and Syracuse.

[GannonFan]

I still think nova won't move to the Patriot for football under any scenario - their fanbase (what it is) despises IAA football and hates playing the teams they play now (they begrudgingly like the matchup with UD though). They want IA football and a move to the Patriot, even if they start issuing scholarships, is going to be seen by their members as a step down (not commenting on my view of the Patriot, just anticipating what nova fans would see of the Patriot). They'd probably drop football before going to what they perceive is a less competitive environment (again, not my view, but what their view would be based on their boards).

Oh wait, I just saw that you also said nova could contemplate going to the Patriot for all sports? Basketball included? Now that's just insane. While I may hate nova football, nova basketball is entirely different - they're a national program with a long history of success - heck, they're a top 5 team this year and could win the national title - they would close the school before they downgrade their basketball program to that level. It's certainly a dream scenario as it has no basis of ever happening.

[colgate13]

Nova/Georgetown to the PL in all sports is certainly a dream scenario. I think the PL needs about 10 more Bucknell/Kansas games before we start dreaming like that. It is my ultimate dream, but I'm also realistic.

Colgate and ultimately Lafayette offering basketball scholarships is a good start, but places like Colgate also have to do something drastic about attendance. Until both of those things happen, it will remain a dream scenario.

[njhoya]

Wow, haven't heard that one yet. W/ the addition of Louisville, Cincy, et al you could easily make an argument that the BE is the best BB conference in the country (no disrespect to the ACC). As far as RU football goes, the recruiting has gotten better and they're keeping more of the Jersey kids (certainly not all and not the very best) in state. Schiano is a good guy and a good motivator but I don't believe he's a good game day coach. Had they gotten an Urban Meyer or Charlie Weiss they may have been vying for a championship in 5 years.

[colgate13]

The Big East is an AWESOME baskeball conference. The real test would be though, does basketball have enough to hold it together if football fell apart or became a non BCS conference? The Big East could easily split into two good conferences, one of which would be the Catholic dream league that I heard talked about from time to time.

[LBPop]

That's less likely than Rutgers coming to the PL. With John Thompson III coaching and with the quality he's recruiting, Georgetown is positioned to become a national power once again in hoops. Hopefully that will generate some additional revenue and maybe some of that will find its way to the football program. :rolleyes:

[DFW HOYA]

Georgetown and Villanova are not PL candidates; in fact, recent moves by the PL to eliminate associate memberships in sports other than football suggests they're not looking for schools like Georgetown at all. When Holy Cross (eventually) leaves, it may prove difficult to find any Eastern schools that still fit the PL all-sports platform.

Ten of Georgetown's 27 sports are full scholarship. The PL does not support this model.

[colgate13]

When Holy Cross (eventually) leaves, it may prove difficult to find any Eastern schools that still fit the PL all-sports platform.

Ten of Georgetown's 27 sports are full scholarship. The PL does not support this model.

You lost me twice there DFW.

First, what makes you think HC is going to go anywhere? They are enjoying success in hoops, which is their #1 sport and the rest of the league is improving their hoops, so the PL is only going up there. Also, where in the heck would the Saders go that is an improvement?

Next, the Patriot League allows scholarships in all sports except football (for now). Why can't 10 of Georgetown's sports be full scholarship and the rest non scholarship? There are plenty of pick and choose scholarships sports in the Patriot League.

[DFW HOYA]

First, what makes you think HC is going to go anywhere? They are enjoying success in hoops, which is their #1 sport and the rest of the league is improving their hoops, so the PL is only going up there. Also, where in the heck would the Saders go that is an improvement?

Next, the Patriot League allows scholarships in all sports except football (for now). Why can't 10 of Georgetown's sports be full scholarship and the rest non scholarship? There are plenty of pick and choose scholarships sports in the Patriot League.

I think that, at some point, HC will consider an A-10 style league where it can further develop its men's basketball program.

How many sports other than basketball are there full scholarship teams? Are there any sports ramped up to full grants? It would be unrealistic to assume that the PL would welcome full scholarship Villanova and Georgetown teams in track, cross country, soccer, lacrosse, etc. that other PL teams simply won't have.

[colgate13]

I think that, at some point, HC will consider an A-10 style league where it can further develop its men's basketball program.

How many sports other than basketball are there full scholarship teams? Are there any sports ramped up to full grants? It would be unrealistic to assume that the PL would welcome full scholarship Villanova and Georgetown teams in track, cross country, soccer, lacrosse, etc. that other PL teams simply won't have.

I'm biased, but I see the PL as that league. I don't see any other options right now for HC.

As for the rest of the PL, there are full scholarships in everything but football. Colgate is giving out scholarships in soccer, lax, softball, field hockey, swimming, etc. American does too. Bucknell will be following shortly IMO. Lafayette will roll out a full scholarship 'Colgate-like' plan this spring. Holy Cross and Lehigh won't wait too long to follow.

The Patriot League is positioning itself strategically to be a very attractive place where schools that care about academics and athletics can have their cake and eat it too. It will take time of course to improve the stature of the league in some sports, but we are definitely on the move. Look at PL Lax for example...

[arkstfan]

Rutgers sponsors something like 29 sports.

I have heard the claim that they use an "equity funding" model spending the same amount per athlete on every sport.

[Marcus Garvey]

As long as Jesuit priests are running Holy Cross, they won't leave the PL for an A-10 (I'm referring to Olympic Sports). The Alumni aren't happy, but the clergy in charge have a long standing policy of not giving a ***** about what the alumni think. Incidently, HC was invited to join the Big East when the conference was being formed in the late 70's. They were still, arguably, the biggest basketball school in New England. They've since been passed by Seton Hall, UConn and BC.

As for the "Rutgers 1000." These guys have had an effect on Rutgers in the Big East. While they're not getting their full wish to remove Rutgers from I-A and "Big Time" college sports, they've helped keep the basketball and football teams down for years. I read an article about 5 years ago that said that Rutgers has stricter academic standards for football players than Michigan. I'm sure faculty like the Rutgers 1000 guys had something to do with that.