Rank the conferences (2008)!!!

[TheBisonator]

How do you think the conferences will end up ranked in the GPI in 2008?? Who's the best conference?? I think it'll be the Gateway, but the SoCon and CAA both will try to challenge that spot this year.

I also want to send out my 2008 predictions:

I'm personally looking for the Southland to start making a comeback this season. McNeese is tough as ever, and Sam Houston I believe will make a lot of noise, along with Central Arkansas. The Gateway I believe will be a log jam at the top between NDSU, UNI, SIU and Youngstown, and I see the CAA South with a lot of dominant teams, probably most of that division will be tight to the end. The CAA North will see New Hampshire top that end.

App and Georgia Southern will battle for the top of the SoCon, and the Griz will dominate the Big Sky like always. I also predict Cal-Poly to win the GWFC with Davis and UND close behind. I'm picking Jacksonville State to win the OVC and Lafayette to win the Patriot. I think Coastal will take another Big South title. I see Hampton at the top of the MEAC, Yale to win the Ivy, Albany to win the NEC, Southern to win the SWAC, and the Pioneer?? WHO CARES!! They don't even give scholarships!!!xlolx xlolx xlolx (Just kidding, Dayton will win that)

Here's my list for 2008:

1) Gateway
2) CAA
3) SoCon
4) Southland
5) Big Sky
6) Great West
7) OVC
8) MEAC
9) Big South
10) Patriot
11) NEC
12) Ivy
13) SWAC
14) Pioneer

What do you think??

[JoshUCA]

Those look great to me!

[DLS]

it will be app and elon for the top of the socon

[andy7171]

How soon until someone brings up the PFL beating the NEC and the PL champion?

[813Jag]

I know us non-playoff types don't really count but I don't see the MEAC being #8, last year the SWAC finished ahead of the MEAC and the OVC. I think it'll be the same this season.

[813Jag]

How soon until someone brings up the PFL beating the NEC and the PL champion?
Dayton did beat Albany. xreadx





















































xlolx

[danefan]

How soon until someone brings up the PFL beating the NEC and the PL champion?

Yeah. Can't wait.

But in all seriousness, I do think the PFL will be back at the bottom this year. Losing their league's two top players Hyong and Johnson will expose what non-scholarship programs are hurt the most by - lack of depth.

Is there anyone to step in for Hyong, who by himself probably won 6 games for Dayton last year?

There's no one that can fill the shoes of Josh Johnson so its not even worth looking.

If you think about it - those two guys have really carried the PFL.

Its tough to tell what will happen in other leagues. The problem of course is the voting bias. The IVY's will likely be ranked high because they'll have huge numbers against themselves and its a win-win situation for voters to rank Ivy's high. They'll never be proven wrong.

[ATrain]

1) CAA
2) Gateway
3) SoCon
4) Big Sky
5) Great West
6) Southland
7) Big South
8) OVC
9) Patriot
10) MEAC
11) IVY
12) NEC
13) Pioneer
14) SWAC

[elcid96]

1) SoCon
2) CAA
3) Gateway
4) Big Sky
5) Great West
6) Southland
7) Big South
8) OVC
9) Patriot
10) MEAC
11) IVY
12) NEC
13) Pioneer
14) SWAC

[ButlerGSU]

1) SoCon
2) CAA
3) Gateway
4) Big Sky
5) Great West
6) Southland
7) Big South
8) OVC
9) Patriot
10) MEAC
11) IVY
12) NEC
13) Pioneer
14) SWAC

Looks about right to me...

[DetroitFlyer]

Yeah. Can't wait.

But in all seriousness, I do think the PFL will be back at the bottom this year. Losing their league's two top players Hyong and Johnson will expose what non-scholarship programs are hurt the most by - lack of depth.

Is there anyone to step in for Hyong, who by himself probably won 6 games for Dayton last year?

There's no one that can fill the shoes of Josh Johnson so its not even worth looking.

If you think about it - those two guys have really carried the PFL.

Its tough to tell what will happen in other leagues. The problem of course is the voting bias. The IVY's will likely be ranked high because they'll have huge numbers against themselves and its a win-win situation for voters to rank Ivy's high. They'll never be proven wrong.

Do not count the PFL out just yet.... Dayton has a 5th year senior that will probably start at QB. His "back-up" is an extremely athletic and VERY fast junior.... At USD, there is so much QB talent that the kid that transferred in from FBS Utah is not even in the running, he is hoping to become a wide receiver. As I mentioned in another thread, Davidson will have Ryan Alexander back for a rare 5th year. Butler has had great back to back recruiting classes and should be improved. Morehead State had the best run defense in all of FCS last year, ( Dayton was second ), and both should be good again in 2008. Drake should settle down now that they have a permanent coach. I expect JU to be improved, (the App State game will tell ), and Valpo is also looking up. MAYBE, Campbell pulls us down a bit as a first year program. On balance, I would expect the PFL to be neck and neck with the NEC at the end of the season.

[danefan]

1) SoCon
2) CAA
3) Gateway
4) Big Sky
5) Great West
6) Southland
7) Big South
8) OVC
9) Patriot
10) MEAC
11) IVY
12) NEC
13) Pioneer
14) SWAC

Interesting to look at the tiers of conferences.

In no order:

First Tier:
Socon
CAA
Gateway
Big Sky
Great West
Southland
__________



BIG GAP



__________

Second Tier:
Big South
OVC
Patriot
MEAC
IVY
NEC
Pioneer
SWAC


It also appears, that to some extent the third tier of 5 years ago has disappeared.

[813Jag]

I honestly don't think the SWAC is the #14 conference, I don't think it's ever been that low.

[89Hen]

First Tier:
CAA
Gateway
Big Sky
Great West
Southland
__________



BIG GAP



__________

Second Tier:
Big South
OVC
Patriot
MEAC
IVY
NEC
Pioneer
SWAC


It also appears, that to some extent the third tier of 5 years ago has disappeared.
There still are three tiers IMO...
First Tier:
CAA
Gateway
Southern (you forgot them)

Second Tier:
Big Sky
Southland
Ivy
Patriot

Third Tier:
Big South
OVC
SWAC
MEAC
NEC
Pioneer


Great West - can't rank them yet. Only three full-time I-AA's so far and one is abysmal.

[AppStFan76]

1) SoCon
2) CAA
3) Gateway
4) Big Sky
5) Great West
6) Southland
7) Big South
8) OVC
9) Patriot
10) MEAC
11) IVY
12) NEC
13) Pioneer
14) SWAC

I'm with ya, elcid!!xthumbsupx

[UAalum72]

The OVC was ranked below the MEAC, Big South and SWAC and WELL below the Ivy and Patriot League last year, and they won't be appreciably helped by losing Samford (who will slightly hurt the SoCon average). Stony Brook will help the BSo. xDSUs boost the Gateway and the Great West is almost out of it (or do the xDUs count this year?)

1) Gateway
2) CAA
3) SoCon
4) Southland
5) Big Sky
6) Patriot
7) Ivy
8) Big South
9) Great West
10) MEAC
11) NEC
12) OVC
13) SWAC
14) Pioneer

[danefan]

There still are three tiers IMO...
First Tier:
CAA
Gateway
Southern (you forgot them)

Second Tier:
Big Sky
Southland
Ivy
Patriot

Third Tier:
Big South
OVC
SWAC
MEAC
NEC
Pioneer


Great West - can't rank them yet. Only three full-time I-AA's so far and one is abysmal.

I'm really surprised to see your tiers. Ivy and Patriot in the second tier?

I do sort of agree now that I see it that the Big Sky and Southland may in fact be the second tier.

My tiers (revised):

First Tier:
Socon
CAA
Gateway
Great West


Second Tier:
Big Sky
Southland


Second Tier:
Big South
OVC
Patriot
MEAC
IVY
NEC
Pioneer
SWAC

[89Hen]

My tiers (revised):
You forgot the Southern again, and how can you rank the GWFC with only CalPoly, UC Davis and Southern Utah??

[AZGrizFan]

1) CAA
2) Gateway
3) SoCon
4) Big Sky
5) Great West
6) Southland
7) Big South
8) OVC
9) Patriot
10) MEAC
11) IVY
12) NEC
13) Pioneer
14) SWAC


1) SoCon
2) CAA
3) Gateway
4) Big Sky
5) Great West
6) Southland
7) Big South
8) OVC
9) Patriot
10) MEAC
11) IVY
12) NEC
13) Pioneer
14) SWAC

I guess we'll find out about 4/5 in the first few weeks, huh?

[AZGrizFan]

You forgot the Southern again, and how can you rank the GWFC with only CalPoly, UC Davis and Southern Utah??

And how can YOU include Ivy and Patriot in with Big Sky and Soutland? That's laughable.

Your ECB just keeps shining through, Hen. xsmhx xsmhx xsmhx xsmhx

[andy7171]

I'm really surprised to see your tiers. Ivy and Patriot in the second tier?

I do sort of agree now that I see it that the Big Sky and Southland may in fact be the second tier.

My tiers (revised):

First Tier:
CAA
Gateway
Great West


Second Tier:
Big Sky
Southland


Second Tier:
Big South
OVC
Patriot
MEAC
IVY
NEC
Pioneer
SWAC
DaneFan has a personal vandetta against the SoCon! xlolx

[danefan]

You forgot the Southern again, and how can you rank the GWFC with only CalPoly, UC Davis and Southern Utah??


DaneFan has a personal vandetta against the SoCon! xlolx

I refuse to recognize the SoCon as long as Citdog refuses to recognize that the Civil War ended many years ago..xcoolx





In all seriousness. I went back and fixed it.

[89Hen]

And how can YOU include Ivy and Patriot in with Big Sky and Soutland? That's laughable.

Your ECB just keeps shining through, Hen. xsmhx xsmhx xsmhx xsmhx
All in 20's
1. Colonial Athletic Association (21.71)
2. Southern Conference (23.92)
3. Great West Football Conference (28.88)
4. Gateway Football Conference (28.95)


BIG GAP

All in 40's
5. Big Sky Conference (41.39)
6. Southland Conference (42.07)
7. Patriot League (47.02)
8. Ivy League (48.94)

All the rest
9. Big South Conference (54.50)
10. Southwestern Athletic Conference (55.44)
11. Mid-Eastern Athletic Conference (55.77)
12. Ohio Valley Conference (57.10)
13. Pioneer Football League (63.71)
14. Independents (65.75)
15. Northeast Conference (68.82)
16. Metro Atlantic Athletic Conference (79.13)

[andy7171]

I refuse to recognize the SoCon as long as Citdog refuses to recognize that the Civil War ended many years ago..xcoolx

Nice comeback! xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx

[AZGrizFan]

All in 20's
1. Colonial Athletic Association (21.71)
2. Southern Conference (23.92)
3. Great West Football Conference (28.88)
4. Gateway Football Conference (28.95)


BIG GAP

All in 40's
5. Big Sky Conference (41.39)
6. Southland Conference (42.07)
7. Patriot League (47.02)
8. Ivy League (48.94)

All the rest
9. Big South Conference (54.50)
10. Southwestern Athletic Conference (55.44)
11. Mid-Eastern Athletic Conference (55.77)
12. Ohio Valley Conference (57.10)
13. Pioneer Football League (63.71)
14. Independents (65.75)
15. Northeast Conference (68.82)
16. Metro Atlantic Athletic Conference (79.13)

I thought you weren't a big fan of these kind of computer rankings? xconfusedx xconfusedx xconfusedx

[danefan]

...and how can you rank the GWFC with only CalPoly, UC Davis and Southern Utah??

You're right about the GWFC. Darn Dakotas moving in and out are killing me.

Here's where I'm at now (in no order within tiers):
First Tier:
Socon
CAA
Gateway

Second Tier:
Big Sky
Southland


Second Tier:
Great West (counting the xDU's).
Big South
OVC
Patriot
MEAC
IVY
NEC
Pioneer
SWAC

[93henfan]

First Tier

1) CAA
2) SoCon
3) Gateway

Second Tier

4) Big Sky
5) Great West
6) Southland
7) Patriot

Third Tier

8) Ivy
9) Big South
10) SWAC
11) MEAC
12) OVC
13) Pioneer
14) NEC

[andy7171]

First Tier

1) CAA
2) SoCon
3) Gateway
4) Big Sky

Second Tier

5) Southland
6) Ivy
7) Patriot
8) Big South
9) OVC

Third Tier

10) Great West (because of the lack of teams)
11) NEC
12) SWAC
13) MEAC
14) Pioneer

[89Hen]

I thought you weren't a big fan of these kind of computer rankings? xconfusedx xconfusedx xconfusedx
I'm not, but they are the only ones that actually rank the conferences. If you can find some polls that do it, I'd be happy to use those. xpeacex

[jstate83]

I honestly don't think the SWAC is the #14 conference, I don't think it's ever been that low.


Don't fall for it man. xlolx
We are automatically last here because we don't go to the playoff's. xlolx

Just let it be. xnodx

[93henfan]

Here were Jeff Sagarin's final computer rankings for 2007:

CONFERENCE CENTRAL MEAN

1 SOUTHEASTERN (A) = 81.99
2 PAC-10 (A) = 79.47
3 BIG 12 (A) = 78.62
4 BIG EAST (A) = 77.46
5 ATLANTIC COAST (A) = 75.21
6 BIG TEN (A) = 74.63
7 MOUNTAIN WEST (A) = 70.95
8 I-A INDEPENDENTS (A) = 61.74
9 WESTERN ATHLETIC (A) = 61.29
10 SOUTHERN (AA)= 60.50
11 CONFERENCE USA (A) = 59.54
12 COLONIAL (AA)= 59.52
13 SUN BELT (A) = 59.19
14 MID-AMERICAN (A) = 58.37
15 GATEWAY (AA)= 56.05
16 GREAT WEST (AA)= 54.99
17 PATRIOT LEAGUE (AA)= 45.91
18 SOUTHLAND (AA)= 45.46
19 BIG SKY (AA)= 44.85
20 IVY LEAGUE (AA)= 43.90
21 BIG SOUTH (AA)= 41.03
22 SOUTHWESTERN (AA)= 40.04
23 MID-EASTERN (AA)= 39.80
24 OHIO VALLEY (AA)= 36.80
25 PIONEER (AA)= 35.38
26 I-AA INDEPENDENTS (AA)= 30.86
27 NORTHEAST (AA)= 30.85
28 METRO ATLANTIC (AA)= 21.98
29 ***UNRATED*** (**)= -90.00

[citdog]

1) SoCon
2) CAA
3) Gateway
4) Big Sky
5) Great West
6) Southland
7) Big South
8) OVC
9) Patriot
10) MEAC
11) IVY
12) NEC
13) Pioneer
14) SWAC

i agree with 96. any conference where all the teams don't play each other cannot by definition be the best.xrulesx xrulesx

[mmiller_34]

First Tier

1) CAA
2) SoCon
3) Gateway
4) Big Sky

Second Tier

5) Southland
6) Ivy
7) Patriot
8) Big South
9) OVC

Third Tier

10) Great West (because of the lack of teams)
11) NEC
12) SWAC
13) MEAC
14) Pioneer



I wouldn't put the Great West THAT low just because of lack of teams. yes they only have Cal Poly, UC Davis, SUU, and the UXD's (if you wanna count them)...But Cal Poly IMO, is going to have an amazing team this year... i would switch the Great West with the Patriot.

The Great West will have a couple of down years until the UXD's get a foot in the door. then I would probably put them in Tier 1 again under the CAA, SoCon, Gateway. Soooo...

2008

Tier 1

CAA
SoCon
Gateway
Big Sky

Tier 2

Southland
Ivy
Great West
Big South
Patriot
OVC

Tier 3

NEC
SWAC
MEAC
Pioneer

... and in a couple of years the Great West will probably rejoin the top conferences again in Tier 1 xtwocentsx

[TheBisonator]

Here's my tiers.

1st Tier:

Gateway
SoCon
CAA

2nd Tier:

Big Sky
Southland
Great West

The Rest:

OVC
Patriot
Big South
MEAC
NEC
Ivy
SWAC
Pioneer

[citdog]

the Civil War





In all seriousness. I went back and fixed it.


I'm not familiar with that termxconfusedx xconfusedx xconfusedx


If only that were possible! xnodx xnodx xlolx xrotatehx

[89Hen]

I wouldn't put the Great West THAT low just because of lack of teams.

... and in a couple of years the Great West will probably rejoin the top conferences again in Tier 1 xtwocentsx
I simply choose not to rank them. 3 teams does not a conference make. Once we the UxD's are official and we see how they will do, then I will rank them. xtwocentsx

[93henfan]

i agree with 96. any conference where all the teams don't play each other cannot by definition be the best.xrulesx xrulesx

So by the same criteria you must certainly feel that the Pac-10 is better than the SEC in FBS then, right?

[citdog]

So by the same criteria you must certainly feel that the Pac-10 is better than the SEC in FBS then, right?

FBS? What's that?xlolx xlolx

[RabidRabbit]

I simply choose not to rank them. 3 teams does not a conference make. Once we the UxD's are official and we see how they will do, then I will rank them. xtwocentsx

As a CONFERENCE, the Great West will suffer immensely this year with two non-counters, USD & UND. So 89 is right to call it a "3-team league" this year. In fact, Cal Poly & UC-Davis are not playing the "full league" because of the possibility of getting excluded from the play-offs because of playing two non-counters.

The three top leagues,
CAA
Gateway
SoCon
will be tough to establish who's the best, until the play-offs.

The other "autobid" leagues that have a shot at more than one to the play-offs appear to be:
Big Sky
Southland
OVC

The following leagues will be playing for one slot or none, per their own guidelines.
Patriot
Big South
Great West
MEAC
SWAC
Ivy
NEC
Pioneer

[89Hen]

So by the same criteria you must certainly feel that the Pac-10 is better than the SEC in FBS then, right?
Touche! xbowx

[AZGrizFan]

So by the same criteria you must certainly feel that the Pac-10 is better than the SEC in FBS then, right?

Not by the same criteria, but YES. xnodx xnodx xnodx

[andy7171]

I wouldn't put the Great West THAT low just because of lack of teams. yes they only have Cal Poly, UC Davis, SUU, and the UXD's (if you wanna count them)...But Cal Poly IMO, is going to have an amazing team this year... i would switch the Great West with the Patriot.

The Great West will have a couple of down years until the UXD's get a foot in the door. then I would probably put them in Tier 1 again under the CAA, SoCon, Gateway. Soooo...

2008

Tier 1

CAA
SoCon
Gateway
Big Sky

Tier 2

Southland
Ivy
Great West
Big South
Patriot
OVC

Tier 3

NEC
SWAC
MEAC
Pioneer

... and in a couple of years the Great West will probably rejoin the top conferences again in Tier 1 xtwocentsx

I understand what you are saying. But take Cal Poly out of the GW does it fall in the rankings? One team shouldn't determine where the conference is ranked. Cal Poly the team, will be ranked high, it doesn't mean the rest of the league should be. Would you say the AFC East is one of the best because the Patriots are in it?

[UAalum72]

The other "autobid" leagues that have a shot at more than one to the play-offs appear to be:
Big Sky
Southland
OVC
By what possible criteria should the OVC have any shot at an at-large bid for THE THIRD YEAR IN A ROW?

[NDB]

I understand what you are saying. But take Cal Poly out of the GW does it fall in the rankings? One team shouldn't determine where the conference is ranked. Cal Poly the team, will be ranked high, it doesn't mean the rest of the league should be. Would you say the AFC East is one of the best because the Patriots are in it?

shouldn't that be the same as the big sky?

why not just evaluate conference by the average number of playoff teams they've had in the past five years?

[93henfan]

shouldn't that be the same as the big sky?

why not just evaluate conference by the average number of playoff teams they've had in the past five years?

Because it wouldn't be fair for the CAA to be #1 practically every year.xnodx

[andy7171]

shouldn't that be the same as the big sky?

why not just evaluate conference by the average number of playoff teams they've had in the past five years?

I'm just saying, that EWU, NAU and MSU hold up their end of the BSC to keep the conference ranked higher if Montana left, compared to Cal Poly leaving the Great West.

BTW, I think EWU has the coolest most unique logo!

[89Hen]

BTW, I think EWU has the coolest most unique logo!
Not exactly unique. They have in state competition...

http://www.grizzoulian.com/EWU.jpg http://www.coughockey.com/Site/images/wsu.jpg

[hawkeye]

By what possible criteria should the OVC have any shot at an at-large bid for THE THIRD YEAR IN A ROW?

I hope you have all the criteria you need at the end of the season.

[danefan]

I hope you have all the criteria you need at the end of the season.

Unlikely.

We still haven't seen the criteria for the OVC's at-large at the end of the last season....even after it was awarded!

[AZGrizFan]

Because it wouldn't be fair for the CAA to be #1 practically every year.xnodx

If our conference had 35 teams, we'd be ranked #1 practically every year for playoff participation too.... xrolleyesx

[appstate38]

1) CAA
2) Gateway
3) SoCon
4) Big Sky
5) Great West
6) Southland
7) Big South
8) OVC
9) Patriot
10) MEAC
11) IVY
12) NEC
13) Pioneer
14) SWAC

The top 4 are about right in just about any order. I really don't care as long as the Apps are the last one standing in December.

[Jag4Life]

Don't fall for it man. xlolx
We are automatically last here because we don't go to the playoff's. xlolx

Just let it be. xnodx

xlolx xlolx xlolx RIGHT!

[skinny_uncle]

Here were Jeff Sagarin's final computer rankings for 2007:

CONFERENCE CENTRAL MEAN

1 SOUTHEASTERN (A) = 81.99
2 PAC-10 (A) = 79.47
3 BIG 12 (A) = 78.62
4 BIG EAST (A) = 77.46
5 ATLANTIC COAST (A) = 75.21
6 BIG TEN (A) = 74.63
7 MOUNTAIN WEST (A) = 70.95
8 I-A INDEPENDENTS (A) = 61.74
9 WESTERN ATHLETIC (A) = 61.29
10 SOUTHERN (AA)= 60.50
11 CONFERENCE USA (A) = 59.54
12 COLONIAL (AA)= 59.52
13 SUN BELT (A) = 59.19
14 MID-AMERICAN (A) = 58.37
15 GATEWAY (AA)= 56.05
16 GREAT WEST (AA)= 54.99
17 PATRIOT LEAGUE (AA)= 45.91
18 SOUTHLAND (AA)= 45.46
19 BIG SKY (AA)= 44.85
20 IVY LEAGUE (AA)= 43.90
21 BIG SOUTH (AA)= 41.03
22 SOUTHWESTERN (AA)= 40.04
23 MID-EASTERN (AA)= 39.80
24 OHIO VALLEY (AA)= 36.80
25 PIONEER (AA)= 35.38
26 I-AA INDEPENDENTS (AA)= 30.86
27 NORTHEAST (AA)= 30.85
28 METRO ATLANTIC (AA)= 21.98
29 ***UNRATED*** (**)= -90.00
Interesting, but a lot has changed since last year. The Dakota chools joining the Gateway is a big change.

[mmiller_34]

I understand what you are saying. But take Cal Poly out of the GW does it fall in the rankings? One team shouldn't determine where the conference is ranked. Cal Poly the team, will be ranked high, it doesn't mean the rest of the league should be. Would you say the AFC East is one of the best because the Patriots are in it?


True true. both UC Davis and SUU will have better years this year than last.. and i guess we'll have see about the UXD's. I suppose i'd just call the Great West.. average.

[SUjagTILLiDIE]

xlolx xlolx xlolx RIGHT!
xlolx xlolx Every single FCS award is named after a SWAC player. Im confident the SWAC is in the top 3 as far as players sent to the NFL. You can't judge a conference because of mostly 1 teams(Jackson State) failure in the playoffs. Its really comical. xlolx

[TxState_GO_CATS!]

1) SoCon
2) CAA
3) Gateway
4) Big Sky
5) Great West
6) Southland
7) Big South
8) OVC
9) Patriot
10) MEAC
11) IVY
12) NEC
13) Pioneer
14) SWAC

looks good to me. xthumbsupx Southland's about right--no way they are top 5 IMO.

[McNeese75]

1) SoCon
2) CAA
3) Gateway
4) Big Sky
5) Great West
6) Southland
7) Big South
8) OVC
9) Patriot
10) MEAC
11) IVY
12) NEC
13) Pioneer
14) SWAC

I don't see the GW ahead of the Southland this year. But, Cal Poly is playing the whole conference I think so we will know if a few months :D

[89Hen]

I hope you have all the criteria you need at the end of the season.

Unlikely.

We still haven't seen the criteria for the OVC's at-large at the end of the last season....even after it was awarded!
We need criteria BEFORE playoff selecion. Here is the full OVC OOC slate. Which of these games do you see the OVC winning and which will establish the OVC as worthy of an at-large...

EKU - Cincy, WKU, Morehead
JSU - Georgia Tech, AAMU, Chattanooga
EIU - Central Michigan, Illiois, Indiana State, Illinois State
UTM - South Florida, Auburn, Baker
TSU - AAMU, Southern, Jackson State, FAMU
Murray - Indiana, WKU, Illinois State, Lambuth
TTU - Louisville, Western Michigan, Gardner-Webb
SEMo - Missouri, Missouri State, Indiana State, Southwest Baptist
AP - NDSU, Georgia Southern, Gardner-Webb

[813Jag]

We need criteria BEFORE playoff selecion. Here is the full OVC OOC slate. Which of these games do you see the OVC winning and which will establish the OVC as worthy of an at-large...

EKU - Cincy, WKU, Morehead
JSU - Georgia Tech, AAMU, Chattanooga
EIU - Central Michigan, Illiois, Indiana State, Illinois State
UTM - South Florida, Auburn, Baker
TSU - AAMU, Southern, Jackson State, FAMU
Murray - Indiana, WKU, Illinois State, Lambuth
TTU - Louisville, Western Michigan, Gardner-Webb
SEMo - Missouri, Missouri State, Indiana State, Southwest Baptist
AP - NDSU, Georgia Southern, Gardner-Webb
I see lots of FBS games that will hurt some teams. AP has a shot if they were to somehow beat NDSU and Georgia Southern (but I don't see that happening) and of course 3 SWAC games wouldn't help TSU much (but they only won 1 of the 3 last year)

[Blue Hen Nation]

Here's my list for 2008:

1) CAA
2) Gateway
3) SoCon
4) Southland
5) Big Sky
6) Great West
7) OVC
8) MEAC
9) Big South
10) Patriot
11) NEC
12) Ivy
13) SWAC
14) Pioneer

What do you think??

I fixed it for you Homer.

[JDC325]

1) SoCon
2) CAA
3) Gateway
4) Big Sky
5) Great West
6) Southland
7) Big South
8) OVC
9) Patriot
10) MEAC
11) IVY
12) NEC
13) Pioneer
14) SWAC

Ditto App is the defending champ and fav this year (that hurt) , GSU should be getting back to normal by mid year and Elon is now pretty good.

[udchuck]

Ditto App is the defending champ and fav this year (that hurt) , GSU should be getting back to normal by mid year and Elon is now pretty good.

1) Pioneer
2) SoCon
3) CAA
4) Gateway
5) Big Sky
6) Great West
7) Southland
8) Big South
9) OVC
10) Patriot
11) MEAC
12) IVY
13) NEC
14) SWAC

Just a slight adjustment taking academics as a added criteria.xlolx xpeacex

[danefan]

We need criteria BEFORE playoff selecion. Here is the full OVC OOC slate. Which of these games do you see the OVC winning and which will establish the OVC as worthy of an at-large...


IMO, for the OVC to warrant an at-large the second place team must have only one league loss, to the league champion (who went undefeated in league play and had good OOC) and must also win the following OOC corresponding to team:

EKU - Cincy or WKU, Morehead
JSU - Georgia Tech (or close game), AAMU, Chattanooga
EIU - Central Michigan or Illinois (or close games), Indiana State, Illinois State
UTM - South Florida or Auburn, Baker
TSU - AAMU, Southern, Jackson State, FAMU
Murray - Indiana or WKU, Illinois State, Lambuth
TTU - Louisville or Western Michigan, Gardner-Webb
SEMo - Missouri, Missouri State, Indiana State, Southwest Baptist
AP - NDSU or Georgia Southern (with respectable showing in the loss), Gardner-Webb


I think you'll end up with JSU losing to GTech, but running through the OVC with a close game at EKU.

If that is true, and EKU loses to both Cincy and WKU, I don't think EKU deserves an at-large. Morehead as a sole OOC win is not good enough for me.

EIU needs to win one of its FBS games to warrant consideration.

UTM has to win one of its FBS games.

TSU needs to win all of its OOC games and have only that one loss in conference to the champion. Same goes for Murray.

TTU needs to win one of its FBS games and beat G-W.

SeMo needs to win all of its OOC.

AP needs to beat G-W and either GSU or NDSU with a respectable loss in the other.
----------------------

You may think this is unreasonable but I don't think the OVC league play can hold up an at-large on its own. The OVC shouldn't be treated any differently from the NEC or PFL. They have shown time and time again in the playoffs that this is true as well.

Final OVC GPI (League rank: 12)

20. E Kentucky (20.38)
42. E Illinois (35.13)
65. Jacksonville St (50.38)
75. Austin Peay (57.50)
78T. Tennessee St (58.88)
80. TN Martin (59.13)
93T. Samford (67.75)
96. Tennessee Tech (70.25)
105. SE Missouri St (75.13)
108. Murray St (76.50)

[Biff]

FBS? What's that?xlolx xlolx

I think FBS stands for ****ing Bu11 $h!t.

[AppAlum2003]

1) Pioneer
2) SoCon
3) CAA
4) Gateway
5) Big Sky
6) Great West
7) Southland
8) Big South
9) OVC
10) Patriot
11) MEAC
12) IVY
13) NEC
14) SWAC

Just a slight adjustment taking academics as a added criteria.xlolx xpeacex


That's right, I forgot that these supposed "battles" at the line of scrimmage are won by the individual that can recite pi to the most digits.

[CopperCat]

That's right, I forgot that these supposed "battles" at the line of scrimmage are won by the individual that can recite pi to the most digits.

How metaphorical. You must have been/are an english major in school.xchinscratchx

[udchuck]

That's right, I forgot that these supposed "battles" at the line of scrimmage are won by the individual that can recite pi to the most digits.

After 4-5 years of these supposed "Battles" at the line of scrimmage.You better know how to recite pi to the most digits,or get lost in this cruel world.xthumbsupx Just like "some" of the Pros that can't speak so you can understand them,also can't add 2+2 and get 4.xreadx ;)

[jaxstatealum]

IMO, for the OVC to warrant an at-large the second place team must have only one league loss, to the league champion (who went undefeated in league play and had good OOC) and must also win the following OOC corresponding to team:

EKU - Cincy or WKU, Morehead
JSU - Georgia Tech (or close game), AAMU, Chattanooga
EIU - Central Michigan or Illinois (or close games), Indiana State, Illinois State
UTM - South Florida or Auburn, Baker
TSU - AAMU, Southern, Jackson State, FAMU
Murray - Indiana or WKU, Illinois State, Lambuth
TTU - Louisville or Western Michigan, Gardner-Webb
SEMo - Missouri, Missouri State, Indiana State, Southwest Baptist
AP - NDSU or Georgia Southern (with respectable showing in the loss), Gardner-Webb


I think you'll end up with JSU losing to GTech, but running through the OVC with a close game at EKU.

If that is true, and EKU loses to both Cincy and WKU, I don't think EKU deserves an at-large. Morehead as a sole OOC win is not good enough for me.

EIU needs to win one of its FBS games to warrant consideration.

UTM has to win one of its FBS games.

TSU needs to win all of its OOC games and have only that one loss in conference to the champion. Same goes for Murray.

TTU needs to win one of its FBS games and beat G-W.

SeMo needs to win all of its OOC.

AP needs to beat G-W and either GSU or NDSU with a respectable loss in the other.
----------------------

You may think this is unreasonable but I don't think the OVC league play can hold up an at-large on its own. The OVC shouldn't be treated any differently from the NEC or PFL. They have shown time and time again in the playoffs that this is true as well.

Final OVC GPI (League rank: 12)

20. E Kentucky (20.38)
42. E Illinois (35.13)
65. Jacksonville St (50.38)
75. Austin Peay (57.50)
78T. Tennessee St (58.88)
80. TN Martin (59.13)
93T. Samford (67.75)
96. Tennessee Tech (70.25)
105. SE Missouri St (75.13)
108. Murray St (76.50)

I think you are correct about the OVC. It's my own conference, but until one of the teams that we put in the playoffs actually wins a game xrolleyesx then we should not have an at large bid - even thought I like seeing the Cocks have a shot at it.

Bottom line - we are a weak conference with the exception of JSU, EKU and EIU.

[AppAlum2003]

How metaphorical. You must have been/are an english major in school.xchinscratchx

I'm still trying to figure out if that was a stab at me. Oh well...

[ODUfootballfan]

I think FBS stands for ****ing Bu11 $h!t.

Biff, thank you for your very helpful input. You are obviously our mental superior, thus we should simply follow your lead by behaving like absolute idiots before the world.

Just one question for all but Biff, Didn't the CAA fill nearly half of the playoff draw last season?

[93henfan]

Didn't the CAA fill nearly half of the playoff draw last season?

Rd 1 - 5 of 16
Quarters - 3 of 8
Semis - 2 of 4
Finals - 1 of 2

[Biff]

Biff, thank you for your very helpful input. You are obviously our mental superior, thus we should simply follow your lead by behaving like absolute idiots before the world.

Just one question for all but Biff, Didn't the CAA fill nearly half of the playoff draw last season?

I'm just saying I don't like the format of the FBS, and how the big conferences are moving to divisional seperation (Unfortunately I can see the SoCon pushing to go to a mega conference with multiple divisions) I wasn't trying to be metally superior and I apologize if I made you feel that way. Looking back at the post, it was made quickly and added nothing. To all I apologize, but to ODUfootballfan, sorry you got your panties in a wad over my post. I think the rest of the forum chose to ignore as I am somewhat still new to the forum and have been, like other people, known to make a bad post here and there.

[danefan]

I'm just saying I don't like the format of the FBS, and how the big conferences are moving to divisional seperation (Unfortunately I can see the SoCon pushing to go to a mega conference with multiple divisions) I wasn't trying to be metally superior and I apologize if I made you feel that way. Looking back at the post, it was made quickly and added nothing. To all I apologize, but to ODUfootballfan, sorry you got your panties in a wad over my post. I think the rest of the forum chose to ignore as I am somewhat still new to the forum and have been, like other people, known to make a bad post here and there.

Hey man, feel free to call FBS whatever you want, even if it doesn't add anything to the conversation.

I don't really think you needed to apologize to anyone.xpeacex

[mmiller_34]

Biff, thank you for your very helpful input. You are obviously our mental superior, thus we should simply follow your lead by behaving like absolute idiots before the world.

Just one question for all but Biff, Didn't the CAA fill nearly half of the playoff draw last season?

actually got a nice chuckle out of biff's post.. BUT on the topic of the CAA's playoff teams..

New Hampshire
Delaware
James Madison
Richmond
UMass

[mmiller_34]

Rd 1 - 5 of 16
Quarters - 3 of 8
Semis - 2 of 4
Finals - 1 of 2

I just absolutely missed henfan's post.. 'eh what can i do xoopsx

[jmu_duke07]

Not exactly unique. They have in state competition...

http://www.grizzoulian.com/EWU.jpg http://www.coughockey.com/Site/images/wsu.jpg

I'm not a fan of EWU's logo. However, I think JMU's could be better as well. But JMU is going on a "Madison" Crusade... Which I like Madison better than JMU.

[katstrapper]

looks good to me. xthumbsupx Southland's about right--no way they are top 5 IMO.


I wouldnt put Great West in top 5 either.xtwocentsx

[AppStFan76]

1) SoCon
2) CAA
3) Gateway
4) Big Sky
5) Great West
6) Southland
7) Big South
8) OVC
9) Patriot
10) MEAC
11) IVY
12) NEC
13) Pioneer
14) SWAC


Agreed!

SoCon will be the toughest conference in 08'xnodx

[stevdock]

When was the last time the CAA/A-10 was not the top rated conference in FCS?? Not trying to start anything, I just don't know the answer. My guess for this year is CAA 1st, then SoCon and Gateway about even. Everyone else fills in behind.

[RabidRabbit]

When was the last time the CAA/A-10 was not the top rated conference in FCS?? Not trying to start anything, I just don't know the answer. My guess for this year is CAA 1st, then SoCon and Gateway about even. Everyone else fills in behind.

Unless I misremember, 2006, GWFC was the top rated conference.

[RabidRabbit]

When was the last time the CAA/A-10 was not the top rated conference in FCS?? Not trying to start anything, I just don't know the answer. My guess for this year is CAA 1st, then SoCon and Gateway about even. Everyone else fills in behind.

Unless I misremember, 2006, GWFC was the top rated conference.

[skinny_uncle]

How do you think the conferences will end up ranked in the GPI in 2008?? Who's the best conference?? I think it'll be the Gateway, but the SoCon and CAA both will try to challenge that spot this year.

I also want to send out my 2008 predictions:

I'm personally looking for the Southland to start making a comeback this season. McNeese is tough as ever, and Sam Houston I believe will make a lot of noise, along with Central Arkansas. The Gateway I believe will be a log jam at the top between NDSU, UNI, SIU and Youngstown, and I see the CAA South with a lot of dominant teams, probably most of that division will be tight to the end. The CAA North will see New Hampshire top that end.

App and Georgia Southern will battle for the top of the SoCon, and the Griz will dominate the Big Sky like always. I also predict Cal-Poly to win the GWFC with Davis and UND close behind. I'm picking Jacksonville State to win the OVC and Lafayette to win the Patriot. I think Coastal will take another Big South title. I see Hampton at the top of the MEAC, Yale to win the Ivy, Albany to win the NEC, Southern to win the SWAC, and the Pioneer?? WHO CARES!! They don't even give scholarships!!!xlolx xlolx xlolx (Just kidding, Dayton will win that)

Here's my list for 2008:

1) Gateway
2) CAA
3) SoCon
4) Southland
5) Big Sky
6) Great West
7) OVC
8) MEAC
9) Big South
10) Patriot
11) NEC
12) Ivy
13) SWAC
14) Pioneer

What do you think??
I think it needs an update.


1) Missouri Valley Football Conference
2) CAA
3) SoCon
4) Southland
5) Big Sky
6) Great West
7) OVC
8) MEAC
9) Big South
10) Patriot
11) NEC
12) Ivy
13) SWAC
14) Pioneer

[ericsaid]

SoCon shouldn't be third, we will find out this year with all of the SoCon and CAA match ups.

Have a feelings Elon will beat UR, and UD will beat FU, and App may once again edge JMU but that game has turned into a rivalry between two powerhouse FCS schools and is becoming unpredictable.

[Longhorn]

SoCon shouldn't be third, we will find out this year with all of the SoCon and CAA match ups.

Have a feelings Elon will beat UR, and UD will beat FU, and App may once again edge JMU but that game has turned into a rivalry between two powerhouse FCS schools and is becoming unpredictable.


Anythings possible, but your predictions are back asswards IMO. UR over Elon, FU over UD and JMU over ASU is how the odds makers will line up. Of course, just for the record, I wouldn't mind if the CAA just swept all OOC games. xsmiley_wix

On topic, I think 89Hen has the conference alignments right...except for the needed change of name of the Gateway to the MVC!

[crusader11]

1) Colonial
2) MVFC
3) Southern Conference
4) Southland
5) Great West
6) Big Sky
7) Patriot
8) OVC
9) MEAC
10) Ivy
11) NEC
12) Big South
13) SWAC
14) Pioneer

[DFW HOYA]

At this point, the Ivy is ahead of the PL.

1) Colonial
2) SoCon
3) Missouri Valley
4) Southland
5) OVC
6) Big Sky
7) Great West
9) MEAC
10) SWAC
11) Ivy
12) Big South
13) Patriot
14) NEC
15) Pioneer

[crusader11]

The Patriot League and Ivy League were 9-9 against each other last year. The PL as a whole would have actually had a much better record against the Ivy League if Bucknell and Georgetown did not go winless. Explain why you think the Ivy is ahead...

[JBB]

I would put the great west down in the 11 spot moving all the others up 1.

Lost a couple of good teams, UND is questionable and USD didnt look good in big games last year. UCD was fading a bit too.

[Keeper]

Based on my pre-season power ratings:

_COLONIAL __________ 60.53
_SOUTHERN___________ 60.06
_BIG SKY____________ 57.41
_MISSOURI VALLEY____ 56.70
_SOUTHLAND__________ 56.20
_GREAT WEST_________ 55.59
_BIG SOUTH__________ 52.54
_PATRIOT____________ 50.59
_IVY LEAGUE_________ 50.46
_OHIO VALLEY________ 48.38
_SWAC_______________ 47.70
_MID-EASTERN________ 45.51
_NORTHEAST__________ 43.53
_PIONEER____________ 36.40

[PW Bison]

Big Sky above the Missouri Valley?.?.?.....Keep sippin' that koolaid.:)

[DFW HOYA]

Explain why you think the Ivy is ahead...

Bucknell and Georgetown.

[appfan2008]

i think we can all agree on one thing... the socon, caa, and gateway will be the three top as they have the last few years...

each of these three are very very deep...

[CID1990]

Why is it that:

1. ASU has won three NCs in a row.

2. In two of those NC years, ASU did not go undefeated in the SoCon.

3. In the year they WERE undefeated in the SoCon, none of the playoff teams they played gave them as close a game as either Wofford or GSU did.

... and people still place the SoCon in either 2nd or 3rd place in conference rankings?

Given the fact that for three years in a row, ASU's competition has been tougher in their own conference than in the playoffs (where the best of the country supposedly plays) I will not take seriously any conference ranking that does not place the SoCon at the top.

[Saint3333]

Why is it that:

1. ASU has won three NCs in a row.

2. In two of those NC years, ASU did not go undefeated in the SoCon.

3. In the year they WERE undefeated in the SoCon, none of the playoff teams they played gave them as close a game as either Wofford or GSU did.

... and people still place the SoCon in either 2nd or 3rd place in conference rankings?

Given the fact that for three years in a row, ASU's competition has been tougher in their own conference than in the playoffs (where the best of the country supposedly plays) I will not take seriously any conference ranking that does not place the SoCon at the top.

When it matters the SoCon is the best, look at the playoff success. 5 of the last ten 1-AA/FCS champions are from one conference.

Watch out for the Gateway conference they have a lot of teams that could be solid programs consistently. It will be interesting to see how those programs develop the next few years.

[seantaylor]

Why is it that:

1. ASU has won three NCs in a row.

2. In two of those NC years, ASU did not go undefeated in the SoCon.

3. In the year they WERE undefeated in the SoCon, none of the playoff teams they played gave them as close a game as either Wofford or GSU did.

... and people still place the SoCon in either 2nd or 3rd place in conference rankings?

Given the fact that for three years in a row, ASU's competition has been tougher in their own conference than in the playoffs (where the best of the country supposedly plays) I will not take seriously any conference ranking that does not place the SoCon at the top.

Same with GSU during our championship runs from 98-00. We just destroyed everyone in the playoffs, with the exception of Montana in the 2000 title game. The game would not have been that close except for the monsoon.

[ngineer]

1. CAA
2. Gateway
3. Southern
4. Big Sky
5. Great West
6. Southland
7. Patriot
8. Ivy
9. OVC
10. Big South
11. MEAC
12. NEC
13. SWAC
14. PFL

[bleedblue]

Why is it that:

1. ASU has won three NCs in a row.

2. In two of those NC years, ASU did not go undefeated in the SoCon.

3. In the year they WERE undefeated in the SoCon, none of the playoff teams they played gave them as close a game as either Wofford or GSU did.

... and people still place the SoCon in either 2nd or 3rd place in conference rankings?

Given the fact that for three years in a row, ASU's competition has been tougher in their own conference than in the playoffs (where the best of the country supposedly plays) I will not take seriously any conference ranking that does not place the SoCon at the top.

I love my Hens but I have to agree with you. I feel the NC team lends more weight to who is the better conference especially when the CAA and SoCon are so close. Edge to the NC teams conference. I should say I feel this way only when 2 conferences are close and 1 of the 2 has the NC team.

[R.A.]

The MEAC beat the Ivy League on the field last season, Hampton beat Princeton at Princeton... and the SWAC is not the last place conference in the FCS.

And the OVC, Patriot League, Big South, and Ivy League are all overrated :laugh:

[DetroitFlyer]

And the OVC, Patriot League, Big South, and Ivy League are all overrated :laugh:[/QUOTE]


I could not possibly agree more!

[89Hen]

Why is it that:

1. ASU has won three NCs in a row.

2. In two of those NC years, ASU did not go undefeated in the SoCon.

3. In the year they WERE undefeated in the SoCon, none of the playoff teams they played gave them as close a game as either Wofford or GSU did.

... and people still place the SoCon in either 2nd or 3rd place in conference rankings?

Given the fact that for three years in a row, ASU's competition has been tougher in their own conference than in the playoffs (where the best of the country supposedly plays) I will not take seriously any conference ranking that does not place the SoCon at the top.
I will not take seriously anyone who doesn't do his homework...

2007 - AppSt: lost 2 SoCon games
2006 - AppSt: undefeated in SoCon
2005 - AppSt: lost 1 SoCon game
2004 - JMU: lost 1 A10 game
2003 - Delaware: lost 1 A10 game
2002 - WKU: lost 1 Gateway game
2001 - Montana: undefeated in BSC
2000 - GSU: lost 1 SoCon game
1999 - GSU: lost 1 SoCon game
1998 - UMass: lost 3 A10 games
1997 - YSU: lost 2 Gateway games
1996 - Marshall: undefeated in SoCon
1995 - Montana: lost 1 BSC game

IOW, it's rare that a National Champion goes undefeated in conference play. xsmiley_wix

[AppAlum2003]

I will not take seriously anyone who doesn't do his homework...

2007 - AppSt: lost 2 SoCon games
2006 - AppSt: undefeated in SoCon
2005 - AppSt: lost 1 SoCon game
2004 - JMU: lost 1 A10 game
2003 - Delaware: lost 1 A10 game
2002 - WKU: lost 1 Gateway game
2001 - Montana: undefeated in BSC
2000 - GSU: lost 1 SoCon game
1999 - GSU: lost 1 SoCon game
1998 - UMass: lost 3 A10 games
1997 - YSU: lost 2 Gateway games
1996 - Marshall: undefeated in SoCon
1995 - Montana: lost 1 BSC game

IOW, it's rare that a National Champion goes undefeated in conference play. xsmiley_wix

What's your point? According to your figures, all 3 of his points are correct. BTW, GSU and Wofford did give ASU their toughest games all season in 2006, including the playoffs.

[jaxstatealum]

And the OVC, Patriot League, Big South, and Ivy League are all overrated :laugh:


I could not possibly agree more![/QUOTE]

xrolleyesx The conference as a whole perhaps; individual teams - I disagree

[89Hen]

What's your point? According to your figures, all 3 of his points are correct. BTW, GSU and Wofford did give ASU their toughest games all season in 2006, including the playoffs.
Point is that it's generally tougher to go undefeated in conference play in any conference than win a National Championship according to the numbers. So to say that because AppSt won the NC without going undefeated in the SoCon twice doesn't mean much. They actually were one of only three teams since 1995 to go undefeated and win the NC and one of the others was also a SoCon team. xeyebrowx

[danefan]

xrolleyesx The conference as a whole perhaps; individual teams - I disagree


See thread title: "Rank the Conferences (2008)!!!"


xeyebrowx

[jaxstatealum]

See thread title: "Rank the Conferences (2008)!!!"


xeyebrowx

:D

[AppAlum2003]

Point is that it's generally tougher to go undefeated in conference play in any conference than win a National Championship according to the numbers. So to say that because AppSt won the NC without going undefeated in the SoCon twice doesn't mean much. They actually were one of only three teams since 1995 to go undefeated and win the NC and one of the others was also a SoCon team. xeyebrowx

OK, point taken. What were the OOC records of those teams? I think what the OP was trying to say was that the toughest games for App these past 3 years have all been SoCon games, undefeated in conference or not. I could be wrong though. It has happened once or twice before.

[89Hen]

OK, point taken. What were the OOC records of those teams? I think what the OP was trying to say was that the toughest games for App these past 3 years have all been SoCon games, undefeated in conference or not. I could be wrong though. It has happened once or twice before.
Again, I think that's the case of most of these teams. Off the top of my head from the CAA: Delaware's only loss in 2003 was in conference, JMU only lost to a I-A and in conference, and UMass lost three in conference and to nobody else.

[AppAlum2003]

Again, I think that's the case of most of these teams. Off the top of my head from the CAA: Delaware's only loss in 2003 was in conference, JMU only lost to a I-A and in conference, and UMass lost three in conference and to nobody else.


So what, you think the CAA is good or something?!? xlolx

It just goes to show you that rivalry and familiarity can sometimes be as much as factor as talent-level, etc.

[Green26]

Part of this statement is not accurate:

" think we can all agree on one thing... the socon, caa, and gateway will be the three top as they have the last few years..."

The Big Sky has been one of the top conferences in recent years and in the past 10 years, except in '07. In fact, the Big Sky was ranked above the SoCon every year from 1998 - 2006, according to Sagarin.

The top 3 conferences over the past 5 years have been the Colonial, Gateway and Big Sky, again according to Sagarin.

Some of you seem to have short memories, focusing largely on '07.

The Big Sky will be much stronger this year than last year.

[Scooter]

1. SoCon
2. Gateway (can't get used to the new name yet)
3. CAA
4. Big Sky
5. Southland
6. Great West (just lost top 40% of teams)
7. Patriot
8. Ivy
9. OVC
10. Big South
11. MEAC
12. NEC
13. SWAC
14. PFL[/QUOTE]

[89Hen]

It just goes to show you that rivalry and familiarity can sometimes be as much as factor as talent-level, etc.
No doubt. xnodx xnodx

[89Hen]

Part of this statement is not accurate:

" think we can all agree on one thing... the socon, caa, and gateway will be the three top as they have the last few years..."

The Big Sky has been one of the top conferences in recent years and in the past 10 years, except in '07. In fact, the Big Sky was ranked above the SoCon every year from 1998 - 2006, according to Sagarin.

The top 3 conferences over the past 5 years have been the Colonial, Gateway and Big Sky, again according to Sagarin.

Some of you seem to have short memories, focusing largely on '07.

The Big Sky will be much stronger this year than last year.
Sagarin is easily the most inaccurate indicator of I-AA strength. As for this year, we shall see. Who do you think will be much stronger in the BSC?

[89Hen]

As for this year, we shall see. Who do you think will be much stronger in the BSC?
Biggest problem is that we'll never really know. Here is the full list of OOC games vs I-AA's...

Montana - CalPoly, UC Davis and SUU
UNC - Texas State and UC Davis
NAU - SUU (who is their 11th game?)
PSU - UC Davis
SacSt - UC Davis
ISU - CalPoly
MSU - NONE (South Dakota still not I-AA)
EWU - NONE
Weber - NONE

So that's 2 vs. CalPoly, 4 vs. UC Davis, 2 vs. SUU and 1 vs. Texas State. 9 total OOC games against I-AA's. If I had to guess right now, I'd say Montana goes 3-0, NAU 1-0, UNC 0-2, SacSt 0-1, ISU 0-1 and PSU/UCD is a toss-up. So probably 5-4 or 4-5 vs basically the same three teams. How exactly are we to know if the Big Sky is any better this year? xconfusedx

[technocat]

NAU, WEBER, PSU, EWU, UM, and Montana State will all be contenders this year. Because of scheduling I believe we will only have a max of 2 teams in the playoffs(unless weber, psu, or msu pull off some 1-A upsets). But all in all a much improved conference.

[FCS Go!]

Biggest problem is that we'll never really know. Here is the full list of OOC games vs I-AA's...

Montana - CalPoly, UC Davis and SUU
UNC - Texas State and UC Davis
NAU - SUU (who is their 11th game?)
PSU - UC Davis
SacSt - UC Davis
ISU - CalPoly
MSU - NONE (South Dakota still not I-AA)
EWU - NONE
Weber - NONE

So that's 2 vs. CalPoly, 4 vs. UC Davis, 2 vs. SUU and 1 vs. Texas State. 9 total OOC games against I-AA's. If I had to guess right now, I'd say Montana goes 3-0, NAU 1-0, UNC 0-2, SacSt 0-1, ISU 0-1 and PSU/UCD is a toss-up. So probably 5-4 or 4-5 vs basically the same three teams. How exactly are we to know if the Big Sky is any better this year? xconfusedx

Good analysis of the problem of limited scheduling options.

The bottom and middle of the conference will have to win their OOC games & the playoff bound teams will have to play well in the playoffs for the BSC to get more respect. CalPoly & UCDavis having great seasons would be a big help too.

The lack of common opponents with East Coast powers makes it difficult to argue either way in respect to the BSC strength vs CAA & SoCon. I think most BSC-types would say that the usual bottom feeders in the conference are playing much better over the last few years with the playoff bound teams having some success as well. To us BSC-types this looks like a stronger conference overall.

[89Hen]

I think most BSC-types would say that the usual bottom feeders in the conference are playing much better over the last few years
Last year SacSt, ISU and UNC were a combined 1-8 OOC with the only win being a DII. In fairness there were some I-A losses in there, but also a DII loss. How the hell did MSU lose to UNC last year?? xeyebrowx xsmiley_wix

[89Hen]

For full disclosure, here are the CAA's I-AA OOC opponents. A lot of lower ranked teams, but certainly some that should be valuable in trying to evaluate different conferences...

Delaware - Furman and Albany
JMU - AppSt and NCCU
Richmond - Elon, VMI and Georgetown
Villanova - Lehigh and Penn
Towson - Morgan State, Coastal and Columbia
W&M - VMI and Norfolk State
Northeastern - Georgia Southern and UC Davis
Hofstra - Albany, Stony Brook and Bucknell
UNH - Albany and Dartmouth
UMass - Albany and Holy Cross
Maine - Monmouth, Stony Brook and Iona
URI - Monmouth, Fordham and Brown

[Green26]

I'll take the Sagarin ratings over the opinions of most fans on a message board.

The Big Sky should be considerably better, because it's clear to those who follow the teams that certain teams will improve, or improve considerably, from last year. This is based on how they played as the season went on, and who their returners are.

UNC and ISU were terrible last year. SS had a very good defense, but not much offense.

At the top of the conferences, one comparison is that the Big Sky champion lost to the SoCon champion by 1 point, and the Big Sky runner up lost to the SoCon runner up and eventual nat'l champion by 3. The Big Sky champ beat the runner up by 1 point in the regular season. The SoCon champ beat the runnerup in the regular season. Based on those games, it seems those teams were pretty close to each other last year, and that any of those games (or at least 3 of them) could have gone the other way.

[AppAlum2003]

I'll take the Sagarin ratings over the opinions of most fans on a message board.

The Big Sky should be considerably better, because it's clear to those who follow the teams that certain teams will improve, or improve considerably, from last year. This is based on how they played as the season went on, and who their returners are.

UNC and ISU were terrible last year. SS had a very good defense, but not much offense.

At the top of the conferences, one comparison is that the Big Sky champion lost to the SoCon champion by 1 point, and the Big Sky runner up lost to the SoCon runner up and eventual nat'l champion by 3. The Big Sky champ beat the runner up by 1 point in the regular season. The SoCon champ beat the runnerup in the regular season. Based on those games, it seems those teams were pretty close to each other last year, and that any of those games (or at least 3 of them) could have gone the other way.

I'm tired of people saying the EWU playoff game vs. App "could have gone either way." I was sitting in section 3A for the entire game and I can tell you that although EWU put up a good fight, they were not going to win. Jerry put in his second teams in the 4th quarter and were it not for complete mental lapses on special teams to help EWU with two late scores, it would have been a laugher.

All that being said, EWU looks like they'll be more than good this year. I expect them to win the BSC. Hopefully the coaching change doesn't hurt.

[Green26]

You've missed an important point.

If EWU doesn't fumble near the goal line late in the first half, with the score 7-14, then it might have been a different game. I believe the fumble was on first down, but don't recall for sure. The rb wasn't even hit; he just dropped the ball, is my recollection. It is highly likely EWU would have scored on that drive, but for the fumble. Momentum in the game was changing toward EWU, prior to the fumble.

Instead, EWU doesn't get a score, EWU is demoralized and AS is fired up, AS marches down the field for a TD in a minute or so (scoring with seconds left in the half), the momentum completely swings back to AS, and the teams come out after halftime at 7-21, instead of 14-14.

[AppAlum2003]

You've missed an important point.

If EWU doesn't fumble near the goal line late in the first half, with the score 7-14, then it might have been a different game. I believe the fumble was on first down, but don't recall for sure. The rb wasn't even hit; he just dropped the ball, is my recollection. It is highly likely EWU would have scored on that drive, but for the fumble. Momentum in the game was changing toward EWU, prior to the fumble.

Instead, EWU doesn't get a score, EWU is demoralized and AS is fired up, AS marches down the field for a TD in a minute or so (scoring with seconds left in the half), the momentum completely swings back to AS, and the teams come out after halftime at 7-21, instead of 14-14.

Sure, IIRC, Kevin Richardson fumbled early in that game, too. You can't say that the entire game was dictated by a first half fumble. Maybe EWU was just inexperience and folded while on the road in a hostile environment. If anything, they'll learn from that and be better for it this year.

[Green26]

AppAlum03, I can say what I want, and I just did. That EWU fumble changed the complexion of the game. Richardson's fumble did not. Also, it is total BS for you to indicate that AS may have had its backups in the game when EWU was driving for a TD to make the game a 3-pt game. If that was true, and I know it's not, your coach should be fired. No coach in any game, let alone a playoff game, leaves in his backups when the other team is moving to make the game a 3-pt game.

You are such a homer that you can't even analyze the game in an objective way. To use your phrase, I am sick of fans like you who can't look at a game objectively.

[technocat]

Yeah I wonder what this conversation would have been like if MSU hadn't tried that ill conceived trick play at the beginning of the 4th quarter in Boone(2006). Not saying we would have scored for certain but we had all the momentum and were only down a touchdown at that point. Jefferson throws the pick and ASU quickly scores and just like that we are pretty much out of the game.

Not meaning to bash ASU, I just think that some fans forget how without one or two plays (or three if you count JMU) there could be no three time national champions right now....

[nevadagriz]

For full disclosure, here are the CAA's I-AA OOC opponents. A lot of lower ranked teams, but certainly some that should be valuable in trying to evaluate different conferences...

Delaware - Furman and Albany
JMU - AppSt and NCCU
Richmond - Elon, VMI and Georgetown
Villanova - Lehigh and Penn
Towson - Morgan State, Coastal and Columbia
W&M - VMI and Norfolk State
Northeastern - Georgia Southern and UC Davis
Hofstra - Albany, Stony Brook and Bucknell
UNH - Albany and Dartmouth
UMass - Albany and Holy Cross
Maine - Monmouth, Stony Brook and Iona
URI - Monmouth, Fordham and Brown

No offense But i see no eye poppers on those schedules either except, GSU and Appy!

[FCS Go!]

No offense But i see no eye poppers on those schedules either except, GSU and Appy!

Few & none common opponents with Big Sky teams either. The more I look at all this the more I become a UCDavis & Cal Poly fan.

[AppAlum2003]

AppAlum03, I can say what I want, and I just did. That EWU fumble changed the complexion of the game. Richardson's fumble did not. Also, it is total BS for you to indicate that AS may have had its backups in the game when EWU was driving for a TD to make the game a 3-pt game. If that was true, and I know it's not, your coach should be fired. No coach in any game, let alone a playoff game, leaves in his backups when the other team is moving to make the game a 3-pt game.

You are such a homer that you can't even analyze the game in an objective way. To use your phrase, I am sick of fans like you who can't look at a game objectively.

ASU was up by 17 points with 6:07 to go in regulation and you're calling me a homer for thinking they won easily that day???? Seriously???? Keep name calling, it's really proving your point.

Also, fans that were actually there that day can back me up in saying that the second team was in there for most of the fourth quarter. The starters may have come back in when it got to 3 pts, but the second team still let EWU back into the game.

Again, all the credit in the world to EWU. They fought with everything they had that day. However, no one was stopping ASU after the JMU miracle.

[R.A.]

I could not possibly agree more!

xrolleyesx The conference as a whole perhaps; individual teams - I disagree[/QUOTE]

Was it the SWAC's Alabama State the defeated the OVC's Jacksonville State last season?

[jaxstatealum]

xrolleyesx The conference as a whole perhaps; individual teams - I disagree

Was it the SWAC's Alabama State the defeated the OVC's Jacksonville State last season?[/QUOTE]

Yup. Your point xconfusedx

[R.A.]

Was it the SWAC's Alabama State the defeated the OVC's Jacksonville State last season?

Yup. Your point xconfusedx[/QUOTE]


That the OVC's overrated and the SWAC's underrated.

[Green26]

Again AppAlum, you miss the point. I can see that it's hopeless to try to have a discussion with you, because you keep talking about the end of the game--which was a 3 point game by any measurement--and I'm talking about the whole game and a key play at the end of the half which I believe changed the complexion of the game.

I wonder what would have happened if the game had gone another 10 minutes. The momentum had swung to EWU. They might have kept it and scored again. EWU certainly rolled over your starters at the end of the game.

As for name-calling, let's see you quote where I name-called you. I trust that you you're not going to try to tell us that calling you a homer, which you clearly are, is name-calling.

[Mr. Tiger]

There is no way the SWAC should be last and the OVC should be that high. The SWAC had winning records over the MEAC and OVC last season.
I believe 93henfan's rankings are pretty accurate. I'm not sure if the Big South should be over the SWAC but I could live with that. But any ranking that has the SWAC last is bogus.

[Green26]

AppAlum03, you are completely full of it. I just checked the game stats from the game (EWU website).

EWU's first half fumble came on 1st and goal from the 2.

Richardson did not fumble in the game. In fact, AS had no fumbles (and not turnovers). Did you make this up, or just lie?

EWU's last two drives were both 66 yards in 11 plays.

Every single tackle made by AS in the last two drives was by a starter (according to the list of AS starters in the EWU website stats). Again, all by starters--not one single one by a second teamer. Obviously, the first team was in the game for those two drives. Again, were you just making this up or lying?

On the 2nd to last drive, the tackles were made by Banks/Howard, B, Smith, Woazeah, Gilbert, Lynch, W and Smith.

On the last drive, the tackles were made by Johnson, Woazeah, W, W/Tharrington, W, Banks and Finnerty (this may have been a knocked down pass).

I just skimmed the rest of the EWU drives in the second half. I saw 1.5 tackles made by AS non-starters in the entire second half. It looks to me that AS played its starters the whole second half, and EWU made its comeback against the starters.

Here's the link to the stats and drive charts: http://goeags.cstv.com/sports/m-footbl/stats/2007-2008/12-01-07.html

[Cap'n Cat]

Jesus, are you guys FCS geeks.

xrolleyesx xrolleyesx xrolleyesx xrolleyesx xrolleyesx