First things first for Georgia Southern football

[ButlerGSU]

The next big step: Atlanta firm hopes to conduct feasibility study to determine whether program should move to Division 1-A

Georgia Southern's administration and fans want to know the possibilities of moving the football program to the highest collegiate level of play.

Rosser International, Inc., which submitted a bid of $169,500, may be able to provide those answers.

The parties are close to getting together.

Very close.

The state's Department of Administrative Services on behalf of the Board of Regents of the University System of Georgia has publicly issued a notice of intent to award Rosser International with processing GSU's athletic feasibility study.

The study would determine whether the school, the town, students, alumni and supporters will back a move that would increase the football program from 63 scholarships to the maximum of 85 offered by schools competing in the Football Bowl Subdivision (formerly Division I-A).

The Department of Administrative Services' Josh Borden said several formalities still need to be ironed out before the Atlanta-based architectural and engineering corporation would be given the go-ahead, potentially as soon as May 25.

"We have not met with any of the companies, so I can't comment on one or another, but I'm ready for (the process) to be final," GSU athletics director Sam Baker said. "It's like a lot of things in life. Nothing is final until you have that contract in your hands."

Rosser has more than 40 years of experience working with universities' athletic needs. It recently conducted a study for Georgia State when the Panthers were contemplating starting a football program.

Should Rosser get the contract, marketing manager Fran Rothbard said the company would work with Convention, Sports and Leisure International (CSL) and ex-collegiate ADs Andy Geiger and Mike McGee to investigate if GSU football can ascend to the levels of Georgia and Georgia Tech as the state's only Football Bowl Subdivision members.

http://savannahnow.com/node/502257

[Syntax Error]

back in November...
http://www.anygivensaturday.com/forum/showthread.php?t=33850

Is this another study? How many are there?

[brad_gsu2011]

since Rosser worked on
places like turner field

do you think GSU is
looking into upgrading
paulson stadium too?

it would be nice.

[ButlerGSU]

since Rosser worked on
places like turner field

do you think GSU is
looking into upgrading
paulson stadium too?

it would be nice.

Have you not noticed something new has been built/renovated at Paulson each of the last three seasons?

[brad_gsu2011]

Have you not noticed something new has been built/renovated at Paulson each of the last three seasons?

yea but im talking about seating

i know they just got done with the new
concessions and bathrooms
and they are working on the field itself now.

just thinking that since rosser has worked on
major sports venues that GSU was thinking
ahead to adding more seats to Paulson Stadium
because after all, it will have to be done before
we make the move to I-A

[ButlerGSU]

yea but im talking about seating

i know they just got done with the new
concessions and bathrooms
and they are working on the field itself now.

just thinking that since rosser has worked on
major sports venues that GSU was thinking
ahead to adding more seats to Paulson Stadium
because after all, it will have to be done before
we make the move to I-A

I wouldn't expect more seats till the press box is replaced which I know is on the agenda now because of the waiting list for sky boxes and the age of the current one...

[bench]

As of right now, any FCS school moving up to the bowl series would be absolutely retarded. Especially east of the Mississippi, since the only place you could go would be somewhere you don't really want to be.

Someone pass my recommendation along to GSU's Board of Regents, and see if they'll give me a little of the $169,500 I just saved them.

[AppMan]

Only took 7 posts for a doom & gloom prediction to show up.

[Retro]

Has any school every had one of these studie's and they come back saying they don't recommend a move? xrolleyesx

[MaximumBobcat]

Has any school every had one of these studie's and they come back saying they don't recommend a move? xrolleyesx

Probably not, because even if they fail they can always go back to FCS.

Only now, they'll have a bigger stadium and better facilities probably.

[Syntax Error]

Has any school every had one of these studie's and they come back saying they don't recommend a move? xrolleyesxI think Georgia Southern and App State both had studies recommending against it. Hence the AppMan distain etc.

[CID1990]

back in November...
http://www.anygivensaturday.com/forum/showthread.php?t=33850

Is this another study? How many are there?

There is more studying going on off the GSU campus than there is going on ON the GSU campus.

[citdog]

all i have to say is....








BYE!

[JBB]

I read today the GSU is scheduled to play in Fargo in 2011. Do you think they would still play that game if they moved up?

[ButlerGSU]

There is more studying going on off the GSU campus than there is going on ON the GSU campus.

We can't all be sodomizing and assaulting our students while playing army on campus...


xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx

The blind jealousy and hatred will be missed if we do end up making the move. Everyone here seems to not understand what a study is however...

[Cap'n Cat]

We can't all be sodomizing and assaulting our students while playing army on campus...


xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx

The blind jealousy and hatred will be missed if we do end up making the move. Everyone here seems to not understand what a study is however...


Oh, come on, B.


xsmhx xsmhx xsmhx xsmhx xsmhx xsmhx

[ButlerGSU]

Oh, come on, B.


xsmhx xsmhx xsmhx xsmhx xsmhx xsmhx


All the xlolx meant to indicate 'tongue in cheek' Cat...

Seriously though, the study is just that - a study. The results will be used to guide the growth of the program which may or may NOT lead to an eventual move out of FCS... but those decisions are a long way away.

[citdog]

We can't all be sodomizing and assaulting our students while playing army on campus...


xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx

The blind jealousy and hatred will be missed if we do end up making the move. Everyone here seems to not understand what a study is however...

say that when you come to Charleston and you'll be buried there. being dead in Charleston is a whole lot better than being ALIVE in statesboro.

[IndianaAppMan]

If Ga. Southern leaves for the FBS, for their sake, I hope they get in C-USA or, better yet, the Big East, rather than the Sun Belt. That conference gets ONE bowl bid to the New Orleans Bowl.

Let's not kid ourselves: the SoCon would not be as strong without Ga. Southern.

[Tilldog40]

Umass has been doing a study to upgrade that seems to have been going on for years now. I haven't heard anything on their status.

[mathman]

If Ga. Southern leaves for the FBS, for their sake, I hope they get in C-USA or, better yet, the Big East, rather than the Sun Belt. That conference gets ONE bowl bid to the New Orleans Bowl.

Let's not kid ourselves: the SoCon would not be as strong without Ga. Southern.
We had a thread about this before.

No way would the Big East want Georgia Southern. Ga Southern's market is too small and its academics don't measure up. Memphis would have a better shot.

A long shot would be C-USA but Ga Southern is unproven at the FBS level. And I think there are more attractive teams in the Sunbelt in terms of market and academics than Ga Southern.

So that leaves the Sunbelt which I think is a good fit them. It depends on what Ga Southern wants to achieve. Even Ga Tech can't reach the level of UGA :D . Ga Southern's attendance is already good enough for FBS and probably would increase but I think they'll be a perennial bottom feeder in the FBS. No way does Ga Southern rise to the level of Ga Tech and UGA. Ga Southern is cash poor and the power conferences still have their exclusive club.

[dbackjon]

I read today the GSU is scheduled to play in Fargo in 2011. Do you think they would still play that game if they moved up?

They couldn't move up until 2012 at the earliest.

[parr90]

We had a thread about this before.

No way would the Big East want Georgia Southern. Ga Southern's market is too small and its academics don't measure up. Memphis would have a better shot.

A long shot would be C-USA but Ga Southern is unproven at the FBS level. And I think there are more attractive teams in the Sunbelt in terms of market and academics than Ga Southern.

So that leaves the Sunbelt which I think is a good fit them. It depends on what Ga Southern wants to achieve. Even Ga Tech can't reach the level of UGA :D . Ga Southern's attendance is already good enough for FBS and probably would increase but I think they'll be a perennial bottom feeder in the FBS. No way does Ga Southern rise to the level of Ga Tech and UGA. Ga Southern is cash poor and the power conferences still have their exclusive club.


Academics are much much different at GSU now than 10 years ago. Matter of fact it is harder to get into GSU right now than Furman if you are an athlete. The attendance would explode and the money would come over time. Recruiting would be much better for us than the other sunbelt schools because of the attraction of the school and its location.
I think Troy has come a long way in 3 or 4 years and dont think them a bottom feeder. They are on the rise and I think GSU would do better than Troy has done. I say we would easily compete in the big east or conf usa if they would have us. Maybe they will who knows.

[Hoseinexile07]

If Ga. Southern leaves for the FBS, for their sake, I hope they get in C-USA or, better yet, the Big East, rather than the Sun Belt. That conference gets ONE bowl bid to the New Orleans Bowl.

Let's not kid ourselves: the SoCon would not be as strong without Ga. Southern.

I don't know why GA Southern would even consider such a move. They've been a perennial power in the Southern Conference. Part of me says, "If it ain't broke, don't fix it." In addition, I feel the Eagles have a better chance at a post-season and championship in I-AA. In I-A football you always have to contend with a glass ceiling because there's no way a team from a non-BCS conference [Sun Belt, CUSA, or Big East] will play for the national title. Ever. Now, it's possible that joining one of these conferences will be a spring board into a BCS conference a LONG way down the road, but that opportunity might not necessarily be there.

BUT, if Southern decides to split in 5-10 years, everyone in Clinton will support it and wish it luck...especially if it provides a chance for us to join the SoCon...

[UNH_Alum_In_CT]

I don't know why GA Southern would even consider such a move. They've been a perennial power in the Southern Conference. Part of me says, "If it ain't broke, don't fix it." In addition, I feel the Eagles have a better chance at a post-season and championship in I-AA. In I-A football you always have to contend with a glass ceiling because there's no way a team from a non-BCS conference [Sun Belt, CUSA, or Big East] will play for the national title. Ever. Now, it's possible that joining one of these conferences will be a spring board into a BCS conference a LONG way down the road, but that opportunity might not necessarily be there.


The Big East IS a BCS Conference and West Virginia, had they not been upset by Pitt, might have played in the game to crown the mythical national championship. Have to say that the BE has been as good or better than the ACC the past couple of seasons.

[IndianaAppMan]

Have to say that the BE has been as good or better than the ACC the past couple of seasons.

Can't disagree with you there.

I've found it very interesting how the majority of the multi-title-winning 1-AA schools have remained where they are rather than make the switch. Marshall moved up, but Ga. Southern, Youngstown State, App State & Montana are still 1-AA. It's been other programs that moved, with mixed results at best.

Youngstown State is particularly interesting. They're not just in Big Ten country; they're also in MAC country. They probably see how much MAC schools in Ohio get mired in mediocrity, with the highest hopes being a Motor City Bowl and typical years drawing crowds no larger than the upper crest of 1-AA. Youngstown's leadership, I imagine, has likely figured, "Why even bother? We don't need to be like _______ University. We'd rather compete for championships!"

It'll be a tough call for Ga. Southern. The SoCon would lose one of its most consistent playoff teams, the kind of team that makes rival fans rip down their goal posts after a victory.

Considering GSU's winning tradition, if I made the decision, I wouldn't want to make the move unless it was straight to C-USA. The Sun Belt would be too depressing for their fans.

[Saint3333]

I don't know why GA Southern would even consider such a move.

Why did PC move up?

[Hoseinexile07]

Why did PC move up?

Good point. But GA Southern has a reputation as a powerhouse in I-AA football. They're good at what they do.

[Just to answer your question, we made the jump because we were tired of competing with Wofford and Furman for athletes as a D-II school. PC has much higher academic standards than the SAC schools, so while Wofford and Furman got the good, smart athletes, teams like Pooberry got the good, dumb ones as well as the wash outs from I-A programs.]

[seantaylor]

It is a natural progression for GSU to move up. GSU is the biggest school in the Socon by a good bit in enrollment. 17K+ now with plans to be over 20 in 3 years. We have only been playing football for 25 years, so we're not entrenched in FCS like most programs are. The Socon has become a tiny private school league, and that is definitely not GSU's mantra.

[Death Dealer]

The Big East IS a BCS Conference and West Virginia, had they not been upset by Pitt, might have played in the game to crown the mythical national championship. Have to say that the BE has been as good or better than the ACC the past couple of seasons.

That is all true, but no way in hell GSU gets into the BE.

[Death Dealer]

Matter of fact it is harder to get into GSU right now than Furman if you are an athlete.

Show me the numbers and I'll believe it. Otherwise, GTFO!

[Death Dealer]

The next big step: Atlanta firm hopes to conduct feasibility study to determine whether program should move to Division 1-A

Georgia Southern's administration and fans want to know the possibilities of moving the football program to the highest collegiate level of play.

Rosser International, Inc., which submitted a bid of $169,500, may be able to provide those answers.

The parties are close to getting together.

Very close.

The state's Department of Administrative Services on behalf of the Board of Regents of the University System of Georgia has publicly issued a notice of intent to award Rosser International with processing GSU's athletic feasibility study.

The study would determine whether the school, the town, students, alumni and supporters will back a move that would increase the football program from 63 scholarships to the maximum of 85 offered by schools competing in the Football Bowl Subdivision (formerly Division I-A).

The Department of Administrative Services' Josh Borden said several formalities still need to be ironed out before the Atlanta-based architectural and engineering corporation would be given the go-ahead, potentially as soon as May 25.

"We have not met with any of the companies, so I can't comment on one or another, but I'm ready for (the process) to be final," GSU athletics director Sam Baker said. "It's like a lot of things in life. Nothing is final until you have that contract in your hands."

Rosser has more than 40 years of experience working with universities' athletic needs. It recently conducted a study for Georgia State when the Panthers were contemplating starting a football program.

Should Rosser get the contract, marketing manager Fran Rothbard said the company would work with Convention, Sports and Leisure International (CSL) and ex-collegiate ADs Andy Geiger and Mike McGee to investigate if GSU football can ascend to the levels of Georgia and Georgia Tech as the state's only Football Bowl Subdivision members.

http://savannahnow.com/node/502257
xcoffeex xcoffeex xcoffeex xcoffeex xcoffeex xcoffeex SOSDD. xrolleyesx Go already, and good luck, really.xnodx

[FCS_pwns_FBS]

I read today the GSU is scheduled to play in Fargo in 2011. Do you think they would still play that game if they moved up?

The earliest anyone can move to the FBS is 2013, as of right now.


We had a thread about this before.

No way would the Big East want Georgia Southern. Ga Southern's market is too small and its academics don't measure up. Memphis would have a better shot.

A long shot would be C-USA but Ga Southern is unproven at the FBS level. And I think there are more attractive teams in the Sunbelt in terms of market and academics than Ga Southern.

So that leaves the Sunbelt which I think is a good fit them. It depends on what Ga Southern wants to achieve. Even Ga Tech can't reach the level of UGA :D . Ga Southern's attendance is already good enough for FBS and probably would increase but I think they'll be a perennial bottom feeder in the FBS. No way does Ga Southern rise to the level of Ga Tech and UGA. Ga Southern is cash poor and the power conferences still have their exclusive club.

GSU's academics do measure up to those of The Big East. We discussed this in the last thread on the subject. But we certainly don't match up with our athletics budget, coach salaries, homegame attendance, and things like that.

By the way, how is it that GSU fans get more cold water thrown on them from the people on this board than the Texas State people do? They are even more unrealistic and delusional about moving to the FBS than even our fans are. Jealousy much? At least our homerish fans know this place exists.

[JohnStOnge]

If the people who commissoned the study want it to say they should move to FBS, it'll say they should move to FBS.

[JohnStOnge]

I think Troy has come a long way in 3 or 4 years and dont think them a bottom feeder. .

Then, in my opinion, you are not thinking correctly.

[Sir William]

Matter of fact it is harder to get into GSU right now than Furman if you are an athlete.

Bull****.

Someone took a leak in Eagle Creek, and it appears that you've been drinking it.

[Saint3333]

GSU's academics do measure up to those of The Big East. We discussed this in the last thread on the subject. But we certainly don't match up with our athletics budget, coach salaries, homegame attendance, and things like that.



I'd like to see the average SAT and GPA for incoming freshman, GSU vs. Big East schools to believe that.

[FCS_pwns_FBS]

I'd like to see the average SAT and GPA for incoming freshman, GSU vs. Big East schools to believe that.

Someone posted it in the first thread about the study, but I don't feel like digging it up.

[ButlerGSU]

I'd like to see the average SAT and GPA for incoming freshman, GSU vs. Big East schools to believe that.

Avg for Georgia Southern is around 1200 now for the past years freshman class...

[Franks Tanks]

Avg for Georgia Southern is around 1200 now for the past years freshman class...

I am assuming that is on the new SAT scale, while places a 1200 at pretty crappy.

Of all the crazy things I have heard on the board GSU to the Big East is about the biggest pipe dream ever. First and formost the Big East is a B-Ball league 1st and adding conf members would have to agree with the B-Ball machine first. You are terrible is B-Ball so their is really no shot there. I agree 100% with the poster who said that the Big East would go for Memphis in a second if the wanted to expand. Bigger market, awesome B-Ball team, and an established FB team

[FCS_pwns_FBS]

I am assuming that is on the new SAT scale, while places a 1200 at pretty crappy.

Of all the crazy things I have heard on the board GSU to the Big East is about the biggest pipe dream ever. First and formost the Big East is a B-Ball league 1st and adding conf members would have to agree with the B-Ball machine first. You are terrible is B-Ball so their is really no shot there. I agree 100% with the poster who said that the Big East would go for Memphis in a second if the wanted to expand. Bigger market, awesome B-Ball team, and an established FB team

Why would you assume that that number it is on the new scale? A 1200 on the 2400 scale is like getting an 800 on the 1600 scale. I don't think there is a four-year institution the entire country with freshman SATs that low. The real number is about 1120 on the 1600 scale, which is 1680 on the new scale.

[Franks Tanks]

Why would you assume that that number it is on the new scale? A 1200 on the 2400 scale is like getting an 800 on the 1600 scale. I don't think there is a four-year institution the entire country with freshman SATs that low. The real number is about 1120 on the 1600 scale, which is 1680 on the new scale.

Many of the SWAC schools have scores like that. Alcorn, Alabama A&M etc.

[mathman]

Avg for Georgia Southern is around 1200 now for the past years freshman class...
Uh...what is your source? If Ga Southern's entering freshmen average around 1200, that would be close to UGA's average. Ga Southern is more like 1100.

Georgia Southern does less than $2 million in research each year. A school like Pitt does around $600 million.

How does Ga Southern's endowment measure up against other BE schools? West Virginia is about $500 million. Pitt and Cincinnati are in the billions of dollars.

How are Ga Southern's programs ranked? Even Georgia State manages to have a few programs ranked in the top 10 in the nation.

I really doubt the BE schools consider Ga Southern as a peer institution.

[parr90]

Bull****.

Someone took a leak in Eagle Creek, and it appears that you've been drinking it.

You take ncaa standards for admitting athletes dont you? At GSU the standard is higher as of now. We have a couple of guys right now that qualify to Georgia or any other sec school but cant get in to GSU. Our president raised the standards above the ncaa requirments. Do a little research and see for yourself sir william my boy.

[Death Dealer]

You take ncaa standards for admitting athletes dont you? At GSU the standard is higher as of now. We have a couple of guys right now that qualify to Georgia or any other sec school but cant get in to GSU. Our president raised the standards above the ncaa requirments. Do a little research and see for yourself sir william my boy.

You can do all the research you want, but I can guarantee you there is no way in hell that anyone could get into Furman and not into GSU, athlete or not. GMAFB.xrolleyesx xlolx

[Dinman31]

You take ncaa standards for admitting athletes dont you? At GSU the standard is higher as of now. We have a couple of guys right now that qualify to Georgia or any other sec school but cant get in to GSU. Our president raised the standards above the ncaa requirments. Do a little research and see for yourself sir william my boy.

Furman's admission standards for athletes is WELL ABOVE anything the NCAA has set. In fact, its well above any other football playing school in the league.

[The Moody1]

We have only been playing football for 25 years, so we're not entrenched in FCS like most programs are.



FCS has only been around for a little over 25 years so your are as entrenched as anyone else.

[Franks Tanks]

Furman's admission standards for athletes is WELL ABOVE anything the NCAA has set. In fact, its well above any other football playing school in the league.


I dont deny your statement, but I was wondering however how many liberties Furman does take with admissions. There has been a lot of talk lately about Scholly's in the PL. Furman is really the most similar FCS school to many of the PL schools and is really the only one in that category that offers Schollys. So a little information to compare would be helpful.

[JDC325]

Only took 7 posts for a doom & gloom prediction to show up.

Usually folks around here are a lot quicker than that....xlolx

[JDC325]

Has any school every had one of these studie's and they come back saying they don't recommend a move? xrolleyesx

Yes UMASS.

[JDC325]

I think Georgia Southern and App State both had studies recommending against it. Hence the AppMan distain etc.

Internal I believe not a outside fullblown one.

[mathman]

FCS has only been around for a little over 25 years so your are as entrenched as anyone else.
According to Wikipedia, the split of D1 to D1-A and D1-AA was in 1978. So that is 30 years ago. So clearly that extra 5 years other schools have endured at the D1-AA/FCS level would make it a great deal harder for them to move up than Georgia Southern. xlolx

[JDC325]

I am assuming that is on the new SAT scale, while places a 1200 at pretty crappy.

Of all the crazy things I have heard on the board GSU to the Big East is about the biggest pipe dream ever. First and formost the Big East is a B-Ball league 1st and adding conf members would have to agree with the B-Ball machine first. You are terrible is B-Ball so their is really no shot there. I agree 100% with the poster who said that the Big East would go for Memphis in a second if the wanted to expand. Bigger market, awesome B-Ball team, and an established FB team


Your ASSuming wrong look it up.

[mathman]

Your ASSuming wrong look it up.
I've looked it up and I can't find anything that says the freshman class at Georgia Southern has an average SAT of 1200 (verbal plus math).

And as a side note, use the contraction you're not the possessive your.

[JDC325]

According to Wikipedia, the split of D1 to D1-A and D1-AA was in 1978. So that is 30 years ago. So clearly that extra 5 years other schools have endured at the D1-AA/FCS level would make it a great deal harder for them to move up than Georgia Southern. xlolx


Well considering we were starting a football team from SCRATCH it is a little bit of a difference. I Assume since you seem to know everything already you knew that as well...right? We were not playing bottom level DIV I football since WWII like some of you were which was nothing more basically than what the FCS is today. Outside of Furman and for some App we do not have any real long term "rivals" or significant long term history with a conference so therefore we are not as tied to this level of football as some other teams are. As a matter of fact for some older fans a lot of our first "rivals" are in the FBS allready.

[blueballs]

JDC is correct... GSU, or GSC as it was known then, joined the division in time for the 1984 season. Since then the enrolment has tripled to over 16,000, facilities have been built then upgraded, and the school achieved university and then research university status. The institution is clearly in a growth cycle and this study makes all the sense in the world, regardless of how the results turn out.

[JDC325]

I've looked it up and I can't find anything that says the freshman class at Georgia Southern has an average SAT of 1200 (verbal plus math).

And as a side note, use the contraction you're not the possessive your.

I was referring to the 1200 being tied to the new system not the the specific score itself. Average SAT Score was 1104 (FALL 2006), the highest in the University’s history. This compares to a State average of 990 and a National Average of 1021.Yearly deviations are less important than the FACT that GSU as whole has been improving in all areas exponentially since we became a University in the 90's, including test scores and GPA. Kudos for catching the you're I posted in haste and usually catch grammar. However, folks that call out others for grammar on a message boards are usually ones that get their lunch ate in most debates. Oh also, kudos for actually attempting to look something up before spewing ASSumptions. I took me about two seconds to find the information by the way so work on sharpening your research skills. Most schools have a yearly fact book.

http://services.georgiasouthern.edu/osra/fb0607.pdf

Please try to find something in there academically that GSU has not gotten better at year to year because I could not. xthumbsupx

[parr90]

[QUOTE=Death Dealer;959822]You can do all the research you want, but I can guarantee you there is no way in hell that anyone could get into Furman and not into GSU, athlete or not. GMAFB.xrolleyesx xlolx[/QUOTE


Thats probably because they dont recruit players that are borderline to begin with but as far a qualifying for a scholarship for football it is by NCAA standards. I could be wrong but I am going by what some GSU coaches are telling me because we are having a hard time getting some guys in that are qualified at most other schools but cant get in GSU. Our president isnt a football guy and he has raised the standards substantially over the last two years. Im not a great internet person so I cant dig up stuff to show you. I dont doubt Furmans greatness as a school compared to GSU but I do think GSU has come a long way and can not be looked upon as they once were.

[McTailGator]

The next big step: Atlanta firm hopes to conduct feasibility study to determine whether program should move to Division 1-A

Georgia Southern's administration and fans want to know the possibilities of moving the football program to the highest collegiate level of play.



First...

THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS I-A...


2nd,

Georgia Southern already plays in "THE HIGHEST LEVEL OF COMPETITION" the NCAA has to offer.

Your school is already DIVISION I...

In fact, you play in NCAA's Division I - Football Championship Subdivision, which is the highest level of NCAA sanctioned Football Championship.

The other Division I SUB-DIVISION, The Football Bowl Subdivision, does not have a NCAA recognized champion.

[McTailGator]

I read today the GSU is scheduled to play in Fargo in 2011. Do you think they would still play that game if they moved up?


They already are Division I...

They Can NOT move UP...

Unless they move DOWN to Division II, the only other direction they could move is OVER to the D-I Football Bowl SUBDIVISION, which is a lateral move.

But as I said, they already play in the NCAA's HIGHEST LEVEL OF COMPETITION for Football Championships....

The NCAA's Division I, Football Championship Subdivision.

[Franks Tanks]

Your ASSuming wrong look it up.

I spent quite a bit of time looking for it with no avail--it wasnt highly publicized.

[Death Dealer]

Thats probably because they dont recruit players that are borderline to begin with but as far a qualifying for a scholarship for football it is by NCAA standards. I could be wrong but I am going by what some GSU coaches are telling me because we are having a hard time getting some guys in that are qualified at most other schools but cant get in GSU. Our president isnt a football guy and he has raised the standards substantially over the last two years. Im not a great internet person so I cant dig up stuff to show you. I dont doubt Furmans greatness as a school compared to GSU but I do think GSU has come a long way and can not be looked upon as they once were.
I'm glad to hear that you guys have raised your standards. But the reality is that Furman's admission standards have been way above the NCAA standards for a long time. In fact, I'd hazard to guess that the guy with the lowest GPA and admission test scores on campus would blow away the standards set by the NCAA. Therefore, any kid who even gets accepted to Furman (and yes, athletes at Furman have to meet the same standards for admission as any other kid applying) will fly over the minimums without even trying hard.

[terrierbob]

My old HS test scores would be comparable to WC and FU average, but I sure as hell wouldn't get in now with my *****y HS GPA. Did well at WC, though. Average freshman GPA now at WC is 4.0. I know there has been grade inflation since '72, but 4.0 is 4.0.

[mathman]

My old HS test scores would be comparable to WC and FU average, but I sure as hell wouldn't get in now with my *****y HS GPA. Did well at WC, though. Average freshman GPA now at WC is 4.0. I know there has been grade inflation since '72, but 4.0 is 4.0.
I think the SAT is a better measure although even the SAT has changed over time. I've heard that its score has been inflated by about 100. I don't know a lot about the ACT.

The quality of the GPA depends on the school. But how can the average GPA be 4.0? That would suggest that every freshman had straight A's. Are there A+'s so as to skew the scores higher than 4.0?

[Franks Tanks]

I think the SAT is a better measure although even the SAT has changed over time. I've heard that its score has been inflated by about 100. I don't know a lot about the ACT.

The quality of the GPA depends on the school. But how can the average GPA be 4.0? That would suggest that every freshman had straight A's. Are there A+'s so as to skew the scores higher than 4.0?

I always laugh when someone says I got a 4.5 on a 4.0 scale. (all these high schools give extra points somehow for AP classes so many kids get over a 4.0) Im always like you ****ing idiot it is no longer a 4.0 scale if you recieved a score over a 4.0. It is theoretically impossible to get a score that is higher then the scale that rates the scores, therefore it is no longer a 4.0 scale xoopsx. Its like when people say I will give 110%, that is impossible, you cannot give more effort then the maxium possble output that can be achieved. If greater output is achieved then a new standard for 100% is automatically set

[bobbythekidd]

I always laugh when someone says I got a 4.5 on a 4.0 scale. (all these high schools give extra points somehow for AP classes so many kids get over a 4.0) Im always like you ****ing idiot it is no longer a 4.0 scale if you recieved a score over a 4.0. It is theoretically impossible to get a score that is higher then the scale that rates the scores, therefore it is no longer a 4.0 scale xoopsx. Its like when people say I will give 110%, that is impossible, you cannot give more effort then the maxium possble output that can be achieved. If greater output is achieved then a new standard for 100% is automatically set
Frank... This is AGS. There is no room here for facts and logic. Take that trash somewhere else.;)

[terrierbob]

I think the SAT is a better measure although even the SAT has changed over time. I've heard that its score has been inflated by about 100. I don't know a lot about the ACT.

The quality of the GPA depends on the school. But how can the average GPA be 4.0? That would suggest that every freshman had straight A's. Are there A+'s so as to skew the scores higher than 4.0?

Beats me. Got it off Peterson's site referred by Yahoo education. Seems odd.

[terrierbob]

http://education.yahoo.com/college/facts/9759.html

[IndianaAppMan]

People, let's stay on topic in this thread...

The issues are whether it's wise on GSU's part to invest in a study about switching to FBS, whether such a move would be good or bad for GSU football & athletics overall, how that would affect the SoCon, and what conference might be best.

Everyone is well aware that Ga. Southern is already in Division 1, as is every other program in the FCS. Everyone is well aware that FCS was 1-AA. It makes no difference if we call it FCS or 1-AA; they're the same thing, and let's not waste our time debating that nomenclature because that belongs in another thread. Everyone knows that the FCS is the highest level of championship football and that the BCS is not NCAA-sanctioned. We're not stupid. No one has to remind us of that.

Still, there are undeniable benefits to moving to FBS football IF the university can do so successfully financially and athletically. If that's not true, why aren't successful FBS programs like USC, LSU, Ohio State, etc., clamoring for studies on a move to the FCS? Let me clarify: I'm not suggesting that leaving FCS is always best. Just ask Idaho. Shoot, it would be extra hard for Georgia Southern because it would shift from being a premier program to a very modest one at best.

Here's a notion worth considering: Ga. Southern (or any other school, for that matter) could become an associate football member of a conference like the Big East. Temple and Virginia Tech were football-only for years. Notre Dame is everything but football. Davidson chooses not to participate in SoCon football, opting instead for the Pioneer League with other non-scholly FCS schools. Is GSU to the Big East a long shot? Abso-stinkin-lutely! But is that notion preposterous? No more than it was for Virginia Tech. Prior to Frank Beamer, they were completely off the national radar, and as far as TV markets go, I don't think Blacksburg/Roanoke is that much better than Statesboro/Savannah. South Florida football didn't even exist a dozen years ago, and now they're Big East.

[Franks Tanks]

People, let's stay on topic in this thread...

The issues are whether it's wise on GSU's part to invest in a study about switching to FBS, whether such a move would be good or bad for GSU football & athletics overall, how that would affect the SoCon, and what conference might be best.

Everyone is well aware that Ga. Southern is already in Division 1, as is every other program in the FCS. Everyone is well aware that FCS was 1-AA. It makes no difference if we call it FCS or 1-AA; they're the same thing, and let's not waste our time debating that nomenclature because that belongs in another thread. Everyone knows that the FCS is the highest level of championship football and that the BCS is not NCAA-sanctioned. We're not stupid. No one has to remind us of that.

Still, there are undeniable benefits to moving to FBS football IF the university can do so successfully financially and athletically. If that's not true, why aren't successful FBS programs like USC, LSU, Ohio State, etc., clamoring for studies on a move to the FCS? Let me clarify: I'm not suggesting that leaving FCS is always best. Just ask Idaho. Shoot, it would be extra hard for Georgia Southern because it would shift from being a premier program to a very modest one at best.

Here's a notion worth considering: Ga. Southern (or any other school, for that matter) could become an associate football member of a conference like the Big East. Temple and Virginia Tech were football-only for years. Notre Dame is everything but football. Davidson chooses not to participate in SoCon football, opting instead for the Pioneer League with other non-scholly FCS schools. Is GSU to the Big East a long shot? Abso-stinkin-lutely! But is that notion preposterous? No more than it was for Virginia Tech. Prior to Frank Beamer, they were completely off the national radar, and as far as TV markets go, I don't think Blacksburg/Roanoke is that much better than Statesboro/Savannah. South Florida football didn't even exist a dozen years ago, and now they're Big East.


Memphis, Central Florida, ECU, and maybe even Marshall are just a few canidates who would be asked to join the Big East way before Georgia Southern. Realistically C-USA would be the best GSU could hope for barring a dramatic conference re-alingment in tne next few decades.

[Laserlips]

I always laugh when someone says I got a 4.5 on a 4.0 scale. (all these high schools give extra points somehow for AP classes so many kids get over a 4.0) Im always like you ****ing idiot it is no longer a 4.0 scale if you recieved a score over a 4.0. It is theoretically impossible to get a score that is higher then the scale that rates the scores, therefore it is no longer a 4.0 scale xoopsx. Its like when people say I will give 110%, that is impossible, you cannot give more effort then the maxium possble output that can be achieved. If greater output is achieved then a new standard for 100% is automatically set


FT:

My favorite one is when a person refers to "making a 360" in a conversation intending to indicate a a reversal of course.... xbeerchugx

Best Wishes,

Jesse

[mathman]

I was referring to the 1200 being tied to the new system not the the specific score itself. Average SAT Score was 1104 (FALL 2006), the highest in the University’s history. This compares to a State average of 990 and a National Average of 1021.Yearly deviations are less important than the FACT that GSU as whole has been improving in all areas exponentially since we became a University in the 90's, including test scores and GPA. Most schools have a yearly fact book.

http://services.georgiasouthern.edu/osra/fb0607.pdf

Please try to find something in there academically that GSU has not gotten better at year to year because I could not. xthumbsupx

The rise of Georgia Southern’s average freshman SAT score is noteworthy. This last year Georgia Southern’s score inched higher to 1108. But it looks as if the rate of rise has slowed a great deal and Southern might be hitting a glass ceiling of about 1110. Guess we’ll have to see how the trend goes this fall. UGA seems to be stuck around 1230 and Tech around 1330. It gets increasingly harder to push average SAT scores ever higher. Georgia College and State University had a similar rise to Southern’s as they are now at 1127. Southern Poly is at 1106 and Georgia State is 1084. I’m doubting Southern’s SATs will continue to rise because UGA and Tech usually nab the lion’s share of students with the higher scores. And the graph of Georgia Southern’s SAT score rise looks more linear than exponential. I'll take your claim of Georgia Southern's academic exponential rise as hyperbole.

Georgia Southern’s vision statement dated Fall of 2004 is

“Vision - Georgia Southern University will be recognized as one of the best public
comprehensive universities in the country within the next ten years.”

That is some statement! So they got 6 years to go. But I’m unsure how they will assess whether nor not they are among the best comprehensive universities. What schools do you consider to be Georgia Southern’s peer institutions? That is, what schools are somewhat like Ga. Southern academically?

Other areas I look at for academic quality are the ranking of programs (are any nationally recognized to be among the best in some areas), level of research (Georgia Southern does less than $2 million a year which is very small. Even Kennesaw State does around $1 million), and endowment. I see conflicting claims as to what Georgia Southern’s endowment is but in all cases, it is pretty small for a school aspiring to be among the best in the country. I think Georgia Southern would have to add at least $300 million to be considered even modestly good academically. The rate of increase of Georgia Southern’s endowment is not on pace for that.

So I see somewhat linear rise in Ga. Southern's SAT but possibly asymptomatically approaching some value around 1110. Research seems flat, I don't know if any of Southern's programs are among the best in the country, and the school's endowment isn't on pace to take the school to be among the elite.


Kudos for catching the you're I posted in haste and usually catch grammar. However, folks that call out others for grammar on a message boards are usually ones that get their lunch ate in most debates. Oh also, kudos for actually attempting to look something up before spewing ASSumptions. I took me about two seconds to find the information by the way so work on sharpening your research skills.
Forgive me, most of us don't have the benefit of having had a Georgia Southern education. :D

[SoCon48]

Yes UMASS.

Interesting.

[JohnStOnge]

When people start talking about these studies, I think it means that they've already decided they want to go the FBS and they're looking for a justification for doing it. The Consultant is going to be aksed to come up with an analysis indicating that they should do it. I don't think it's an objective process.

[eaglesrthe1]

When people start talking about these studies, I think it means that they've already decided they want to go the FBS and they're looking for a justification for doing it. The Consultant is going to be aksed to come up with an analysis indicating that they should do it. I don't think it's an objective process.

That may be the opposite at GSU. Many seem to think that the AD and pres. are against the move, yet are giving the go ahead to do the study to quiet the masses. Many think that the fix is in and the study will automatically nix the idea for a move up.

[AppMan]

That may be the opposite at GSU. Many seem to think that the AD and pres. are against the move, yet are giving the go ahead to do the study to quiet the masses. Many think that the fix is in and the study will automatically nix the idea for a move up.

As we found out at ASU, the consultant will come up with whatever conclusion the Chancellor and AD desire. The people who do these studies get their business from referrals. If they come up with somethig other than what the PTB want, do you actually think they will get good references?

[SoCon48]

"However, folks that call out others for grammar on a message boards are usually ones that get their lunch ate in most debates."

Keep trying.

Some lose the debates and have their grammar dissed.

[SoCon48]

As we found out at ASU, the consultant will come up with whatever conclusion the Chancellor and AD desire. The people who do these studies get their business from referrals. If they come up with somethig other than what the PTB want, do you actually think they will get good references?\

Here's a novel idea. Sometimes, even at ASU, they come up with the conclusion their expertise and data led them toward even though it is contrary to popular opinion as well as the opinions of certain self proclaimed experts. xcoffeex

[eaglesrthe1]

As we found out at ASU, the consultant will come up with whatever conclusion the Chancellor and AD desire. The people who do these studies get their business from referrals. If they come up with somethig other than what the PTB want, do you actually think they will get good references?


So, if the PTB wanted to make the move and the consultant tailored it that way "just because", what would happen if the movement fell on it's face. A glowing review?

I agree that you can make facts and figures say just about anything, but one thing you can't do is make those doctored reports work in the real world if it isn't in the cards. It would seem short sighted on the consultants part to just spit out rubbish.

[AppStFan76]

So, if the PTB wanted to make the move and the consultant tailored it that way "just because", what would happen if the movement fell on it's face. A glowing review?

I agree that you can make facts and figures say just about anything, but one thing you can't do is make those doctored reports work in the real world if it isn't in the cards. It would seem short sighted on the consultants part to just spit out rubbish.

Makes you wonder if this isn't the case with some schools who have made the move ....unsuccesfully

[ericsaid]

Maybe someone around GSU athletics had an epiphany and said, "Hey, lets do a feasability study to see if we can move up or to see how far off we are from being able to do so." Since when has curiosity been so scrutinized?

[Syntax Error]

Since when has curiosity been so scrutinized?Ask Cobb and Peacock. Or Roachel Laney.

[ASU]

Glad to see that the Georgia Prison System has upgraded their libraries. That must be the reason that your SAT's are better.

[AppMan]

\

Here's a novel idea. Sometimes, even at ASU, they come up with the conclusion their expertise and data led them toward even though it is contrary to popular opinion as well as the opinions of certain self proclaimed experts. xcoffeex

I don't know about the self-proclaimed experts you speak of, but I was on the I-A Study Committee and saw all the research data. There were numerous manipulations and exaggerations of the "facts" used by the consultant to support his conclusion. What a lot of people seem to forget is this was a feasibility study. Personally, I was looking for the study to tell me what ASU needed to do in order to make the move, not whether we should or should not do it. IMO, that was not for him to decide. I simply wanted them to gather the facts and figures and let ASU decide. Everyone knew going in there were areas of improvement before it could be considerd. However, the consultant's conclusion to remain in I-AA was based on several key highly attainable factors. All things considered, the study did exactly what many of us hoped it would. It clearly indicated a glaring lack of support and vision for athletics by the administration and leadership with in the department of athletics. However, all that is a moot point today as requirments have changed and there has certainly been a change in leadership and support from the university.

[SoCon48]

Many of the requirements have been lessened and ill-enforced since that time.
Lack of vision is sometimes a tired old term for reality of where one truly stands at the moment.
We have only recently come close to getting the financial support needed for the program and still havn't shown the ability to raise capital for facility enhancements from the fans. The taxpayer bore the burden for the basketball facility and the students and parents are paying for the bulk of the football facility improvements.
the first time we had the chance to stay in with the larger programs of Division I as the SoCon elcted to allow its demotions, no facts or figurres needed manipulation. We just flat came up short in several key areas especially in competing in awarding scholarships necessary.
Prospects of satisfying attendance requirements looked really tough even with the extensions allowed. Of course no one knew at that time that the NCAA would relax those later, make exceptions, and completly fail to enforce the ones they had.
At the time, the decision was the wise.
If the time has now come, this admin can make that decision soon, especially with the moratorium in place while we get things in order without worrying about some others getting the jump on us.
Maybe things will shake out, too, so that we don't have to grab on to the very bottom rung in terms of conference peers.

And geez, I've heard so many different versions of the study's saga, it isn't funny.