Why 5?

[Rekdiver]

I'm still irked that you could have 31% (5 out of 16) of the playoff teams from one conference and the seeding almost guaranteed that conference a final shot at the Championship....4 were at large......The CAA is a fine, strong conference but there were some more deserving teams.

How does the selection committee com up with and how do they defend their selections?

Also who got left out and how do we communicate displeasure to the selection group (assuming you were displeased)?

[mcveyrl]

I'm still irked that you could have 31% (5 out of 16) of the playoff teams from one conference and the seeding almost guaranteed that conference a final shot at the Championship....4 were at large......The CAA is a fine, strong conference but there were some more deserving teams.

How does the selection committee com up with and how do they defend their selections?

Also who got left out and how do we communicate displeasure to the selection group (assuming you were displeased)?

First of all, I think if you're going to voice your displeasure, then please list the teams you would've had in, who you would've left out, etc.

Second, how do you figure that the seeding "guaranteed that conference a final shot at the Championship"? How many teams were seeded??? Didn't the seeding dictate that those teams would at least have to go on the road for the quarter-finals?

Also, of the five teams, two were on the road in the opening round (both lost) - and the other three had the potential of facing seeded teams in the next round. Two teams did (one lost, one won) and the other had to face the SoCon champion (and won on the road) - all of those games were on the road.

The last home game for any team from "that conference "was the first round.

[mcveyrl]

Also, don't say that the way the bracket was divided up dictated the "championship shot" because you can't face conference opponents in the first round so they had to split them up.

Also the relative geographic diversity of the CAA makes spreading them out through regionalization more feasible than spreading out most other conferences.

[Touchdown Yosef]

wow are we back to this again? Looking back I really didn't see any problem with 5, although i think the Socon gave the CAA five by beating each other up, IE G. South and Elon (gsu did not have 7 D-1 wins) either one of those teams would have been in if they had not lost close games down the stretch but they lost. I was against UNH getting in but they did take UNI to the limit just as JMU took us to the limit. Now I will inevitably wait for this to turn into a Socon CAA battle thread and we will all get to hear why Dayton should have been included in the playoffs, even though the correct decission was made to leave them out.

[mcveyrl]

wow are we back to this again? Looking back I really didn't see any problem with 5, although i think the Socon gave the CAA five by beating each other up, IE G. South and Elon (gsu did not have 7 D-1 wins) either one of those teams would have been in if they had not lost close games down the stretch but they lost. I was against UNH getting in but they did take UNI to the limit just as JMU took us to the limit. Now I will inevitably wait for this to turn into a Socon CAA battle thread and we will all get to hear why Dayton should have been included in the playoffs, even though the correct decission was made to leave them out.

I want to point out that I didn't start this. I also want to point out that, to me, it's not a CAA v. SoCon issue (the only reason I pointed out the SoCon champ above was to show that Richmond had to play either UM in Missoula or the SoCon Champ). I just want those that have a problem with the selection to list the teams that SHOULD'VE been in.

I really think any team that thinks they got shafted should look at E. Illinois, not necessarily the CAA.

[Touchdown Yosef]

I want to point out that I didn't start this. I also want to point out that, to me, it's not a CAA v. SoCon issue (the only reason I pointed out the SoCon champ above was to show that Richmond had to play either UM in Missoula or the SoCon Champ). I just want those that have a problem with the selection to list the teams that SHOULD'VE been in.

I really think any team that thinks they got shafted should look at E. Illinois, not necessarily the CAA.

Yes I realize that, I was just making a bold prediction as to the path this thread was going to take. I really don't care we don't have much else to discuss at this point in the year anyway, so lets do it.

[mcveyrl]

Yes I realize that, I was just making a bold prediction as to the path this thread was going to take. I really don't care we don't have much else to discuss at this point in the year anyway, so lets do it.

I agree with your prediction. Just needed to get on the record early!!

[89Hen]

I'm still irked that you could have 31% (5 out of 16) of the playoff teams from one conference and the seeding almost guaranteed that conference a final shot at the Championship....4 were at large......The CAA is a fine, strong conference but there were some more deserving teams.

How does the selection committee com up with and how do they defend their selections?

Also who got left out and how do we communicate displeasure to the selection group (assuming you were displeased)?
xeyebrowx The CAA was actually underrepresented compared to the 50% of the Gateway that made it before. xsmiley_wix

In all seriousness though, not sure how you can say they were almost guaranteed a final slot. The CAA did beat the Gateway, Southern, Patriot, MEAC and OVC champs during the playoffs and there were no CAA vs CAA match-ups that would guarantee a CAA team in the next round. xpeacex

[FCS Preview]

I'm still irked that you could have 31% (5 out of 16) of the playoff teams from one conference and the seeding almost guaranteed that conference a final shot at the Championship....4 were at large......The CAA is a fine, strong conference but there were some more deserving teams.

How does the selection committee com up with and how do they defend their selections?

Also who got left out and how do we communicate displeasure to the selection group (assuming you were displeased)?

Delaware had to beat two of the top seeds, on the road, to make it to the finals. In no way were the guaranteed a spot there...

Teams that got left out include 7-win clubs Hofstra and Villanova. Oops they are also CAA. xlolx

[lizrdgizrd]

xeyebrowx The CAA was actually underrepresented compared to the 50% of the Gateway that made it before. xsmiley_wix

In all seriousness though, not sure how you can say they were almost guaranteed a final slot. The CAA did beat the Gateway, Southern, Patriot, MEAC and OVC champs during the playoffs and there were no CAA vs CAA match-ups that would guarantee a CAA team in the next round. xpeacex
Technically, the CAA only beat one of the Southern Conference champs. xpeacex

[yorkcountyUNHfan]

I'm still irked that you could have 31% (5 out of 16) of the playoff teams from one conference and the seeding almost guaranteed that conference a final shot at the Championship....4 were at large......The CAA is a fine, strong conference but there were some more deserving teams.
How does the selection committee com up with and how do they defend their selections?

Also who got left out and how do we communicate displeasure to the selection group (assuming you were displeased)?

Name them

[Jerbearasu]

My beef isn't with the CAA getting 5 teams in. If you remember, there was a thread in the middle of the year that was predicting the CAA and SoCon possibly garnering 7 of the 8 at-large berths (it was a bunch of chest thumping from both my SoCon bretheren and the CAA folks alike). Right now the SoCon fans are upset and dumbfounded that we ended up on the short end of the stick while the CAA took care of their business by getting the 7 D1 wins. Here is where the problem lies IMO... I think the 7 D1 wins is a bad measuring tool. You can't tell me that a non-scholly FCS team is better than a good D2 school. Ga Southern played a tough West Georgia team and won the game but were punished because it was not a D1 school. UNH's victory over Iona was not much more impressive than GSU's win. I don't blame UNH or the CAA for this but think it was bad on the part of the committee. I also agree that EIU was the worst at-large that was awarded a bid and would have left them out before UNH...

[Appinator]

This is dumb, the teams that got in deserved it. Someone always gets left out, that's what comes along with participating in one of the most statistically exclusive playoffs in NCAA competition. Want more SoCon teams in? Win your OOC games.

[proasu89]

Technically, the CAA only beat one of the Southern Conference champs. xpeacex

You would have made one hell of a goalie. Nothing get's passed youxlolx

[unicat87]

Talk about beating a dead horse.... -unicat87

[UNHWildCats]

every team knows what they need to get in at seasons end... If you play in a tough conference where wins maybe tough to comeby, dont waste a spot on your schedule with a game that wont matter.

[JMU-MRD-DAD]

........Maybe next year we will go for 6 teams!!!!!!!!!


I'm tired of hearing about 5.....

[ChickenMan]

The CAA is a fine, strong conference but there were some more deserving teams.




Like who???

[ERASU2113]

Talk about beating a dead horse.... -unicat87

Seriously guys....I know it's the off-season and there really isn't much to talk about but come on.

The season ended Dec. 14...do we really need to keep arguing about who got in/didn't?

[appstate38]

The best 16 teams got in, IMO. It was a great post season and I think the CAA teams acquitted themselves quite well.

[Monarch History]

The best 16 teams got in, IMO. It was a great post season and I think the CAA teams acquitted themselves quite well.

I agree with appstate38, I believe that the best 16 teams were chosen and made for a great post season.

Let's move on!

[Rekdiver]

Well........I missed all the earlier banter so I apologize. BUT if you read my post there were two themes with the major one being in a 16 team playoff, unless there is a clear reason by strength of schedule or beating DI schools that 5 schools from a conference should get in. There were several years when the 3 and 4 teams from other conferences didn't get in and this same argument was used. Why the change? Is there a change in thinking or a bias. I don't know but it needs to be vetted and we need to understand the selection criteria and I didn't see who the voters were and what conferences were represented?

[henfan]

I don't know but it needs to be vetted and we need to understand the selection criteria and I didn't see who the voters were and what conferences were represented?

Sounds like many already understand the process and agree with the selections. OTOH, you might need to do some homework. I'd recommend starting with the Division I Football Championship Manual. It's a good read on a long winter's day.;)

[WrenFGun]

Rekdiver,

Look through the archives and read what was said about this very subject. I was a strong proponent of UNH for the six days before they announced the playoff seedings, so you'll see me arguing with anyone and everyone who would listen.

With that said, the committee made very clear that they dismissed all FCS schools with less than 7 DI wins, because none of the teams had the quality of wins below 7 to justify inclusion. If you think Norfolk State or Alabama A&M, with GPI's in the 40's, warranted inclusion over UNH, I'm not sure you're really thinking straight. The only justifiable choice over UNH was Villanova, as they deserved it more than Eastern Illinois, who had an embarrassing showing.

[lizrdgizrd]

The best 16 teams got in, IMO. It was a great post season and I think the CAA teams acquitted themselves quite well.
I don't think we ever really get the best 16 teams. Autobids from weak conferences tend to give a top 30-20 team a spot that should be for the top 16. Note: I'm not saying that the autobid teams are crappy, just that they are rarely all in top 16. xpeacex

[Eyes of Old Main]

I think the committee did an OK job, but not outstanding. Under the circumstances, the CAA probably warranted the 5 teams. But, I also understand that there have been years when smaller conferences had 3 deserving teams and only got 2 bids when others got 4. Perhaps they could put some caps into place to keep this from happening again, but that's just going to shift the argument around. The only solution I see is playoff expansion.

UNH was clearly the last team to get in and yet they gave the #1 team in the country ALL they wanted and the #2 and #3 seeds were eliminated at home in the first round so it makes ense that lower rated teams can wreak plenty of havoc. I realize expansion sacrifices some of the aura and appeal of makingthe playoffs, but if 24 got in, would there really be these kinds of debates about what 6-5 team got left out?

[D1scout]

I agree with appstate38, I believe that the best 16 teams were chosen and made for a great post season.

Let's move on!

Monarch, I, too, thought that the FCS Playoffs were exciting this year but don't necessarily accept that the best 16 got in. I watched Villinova play twice last season and UNH as well. In my mind, Villi was a better team. But, nevertheless, this whole issue could really be solved by expanding the number of teams selected for the competition. Simple include the top 20 teams and have a first round elimination bracket for the teams 17 though 20. Also, eliminate the Bye Week in the regular season schedule to shorten the season by a week to accommodate the elimination bracket.xthumbsupx

[FCS Preview]

You can't tell me that a non-scholly FCS team is better than a good D2 school. Ga Southern played a tough West Georgia team and won the game but were punished because it was not a D1 school...

And if they had managed a 'gimme' FG at the end of the Furman game...or managed to beat a lousy (2-9) Chattanooga team...GSU would have made the playoffs.

Complain all you want but dems the facts.

[TheValleyRaider]

Ga Southern played a tough West Georgia team and won the game but were punished because it was not a D1 school.

That "tough" West Georgia team was 2-9 this year xeyebrowx

If you're going to make the argument for a "tough" D-II, where does one draw the line? Beating a D-II with a winning record? A playoff birth?

It's the Division I Championship, so wins against Division I teams should count, regardless of how they decide to run their programs xtwocentsx

[UNH_Alum_In_CT]

No NCAA Tournament is the best whatever the number is teams in the country. Why do people view the FCS Playoffs differently? Look at basketball, there are many teams from power conferences in the NIT that are better than autobid conference reps. That's reality every year. The at large bids are the ones that are designated for the best remaining teams.

I didn't look at UNH as the last team in. To me, that team was Eastern Illinois. Can you imagine the outcry if the committee selected UNH and Villanova and left EIU home? If you're picking the best teams with seven D-I wins, that is what should have happened. IMO if we had true seeding, UNH wouldn't have been sent to Northern Iowa.

The issue isn't whether a D-II team is better team than a non scholly FCS team. The committee has clearly make seven D-I wins a threshold and that makes a win over a FCS non scholly more important than a win over a D-II or D-III. They have selected based on that for multiple years now. JMU got the message clearly a couple of years ago. YSU understood that was why they didn't make the playoffs a couple of years ago. Every week on this forum there is a thread about playoff projections and the seven D-I wins is always used as a determining factor. As results fell into place that last Saturday, posters who understood the selection criteria were predicting that UNH or Villanova would be selected.

[89Hen]

But, nevertheless, this whole issue could really be solved by expanding the number of teams selected for the competition. Simple include the top 20 teams and have a first round elimination bracket for the teams 17 though 20.
xsmhx What does that solve? All that does is push back the complaining from the 9th at large (first left out) to the 13th at large. Your scenario actually CREATES more problems... scheduling, no rest, etc...

[WrenFGun]

If you were actually going to rank the 16 teams in the playoffs..it should've looked like this:

1. UNI
2. Mcneese State
3. Montana
4. Southern Illinois
5. Appalachian State
6. Richmond
7. Wofford
8. UMass
9. Delaware
10. E. Washington
11. James Madison
12. EKU
13. UNH
14. Delaware State
15. Fordham
16. EIU

[WrenFGun]

(I should note, Fordham gave a better effort than Delaware State, but I'm just talking about how teams were viewed previous to the start of the playoffs)

[Eight Legger]

Personally, I was pretty surprised that UNH made the playoffs. That said, I was not surprised at how well they played once there. Had Elon or Ga. Southern won the games they should have, that spot would have gone to one of them and we might not be having this discussion. But they didn't, so the CAA got the spot. End of story.

[FCS Preview]

Simple include the top 20 teams and have a first round elimination bracket for the teams 17 though 20. Also, eliminate the Bye Week in the regular season schedule to shorten the season by a week to accommodate the elimination bracket.xthumbsupx


This would leave you with 18 teams. If you expand to 20, then the Top 12 get a bye, 13-20 play each other, 4 advance, creating a round of 16.

[AshevilleApp2]

Monarch, I, too, thought that the FCS Playoffs were exciting this year but don't necessarily accept that the best 16 got in. I watched Villinova play twice last season and UNH as well. In my mind, Villi was a better team. But, nevertheless, this whole issue could really be solved by expanding the number of teams selected for the competition. Simple include the top 20 teams and have a first round elimination bracket for the teams 17 though 20. Also, eliminate the Bye Week in the regular season schedule to shorten the season by a week to accommodate the elimination bracket.xthumbsupx

In this scenario would you still play 12 regular season games? Then you'd run the risk of a low seed making a run in the playoffs and playing a 17 game season. That seems to be too much.

[JMU-MRD-DAD]

And if they had managed a 'gimme' FG at the end of the Furman game...or managed to beat a lousy (2-9) Chattanooga team...GSU would have made the playoffs.

Complain all you want but dems the facts.

.....xnodx xnodx xnodx xnodx xnodx xnodx xnodx xnodx xnodx xnodx xnodx

[D1scout]

This would leave you with 18 teams. If you expand to 20, then the Top 12 get a bye, 13-20 play each other, 4 advance, creating a round of 16.

FCS Preview, you came with a better idea! So, how do we get the NC$$ to approve it.xlolx

[D1scout]

In this scenario would you still play 12 regular season games? Then you'd run the risk of a low seed making a run in the playoffs and playing a 17 game season. That seems to be too much.

Ash, I would eliminate the Bye Week and shorten the schedule to 11 regular season games if necessary. Of course, this would mean less revenue for most of the FCS teams. Possibly, the teams representing conferences at the playoff could share some of their revenue from the play-off games. Or, we could just have one beer less and donate that money to a fund for all the FCS participatents.xsmiley_wix Gee, I bet with that kind of funding most school could build a new stadium!xlolx

[AshevilleApp2]

Ash, I would eliminate the Bye Week and shorten the schedule to 11 regular season games if necessary. Of course, this would mean less revenue for most of the FCS teams. Possibly, the teams representing conferences at the playoff could share some of their revenue from the play-off games. Or, we could just have one beer less and donate that money to a fund for all the FCS participatents.xsmiley_wix Gee, I bet with that kind of funding most school could build a new stadium!xlolx

How about you donate two beers and let me keep all mine?xsmiley_wix

[D1scout]

How about you donate two beers and let me keep all mine?xsmiley_wix

Ash, it's you supply that would turn the talbles.xsmiley_wix If I gave both of my beers away I wouldn't have any for two days!:(

[Henny]

If anyone has questions just look at the first round game with UNH (7-4) taking #1 UNI to the wire. NO ONE should question the CAA getting 5 teams in. All bids well deserved. As noted, the next teams chosen could have been CAA members Nova and Hofstra Yes CAA teams!!!

[mvemjsunpx]

If anyone has questions just look at the first round game with UNH (7-4) taking #1 UNI to the wire. NO ONE should question the CAA getting 5 teams in. All bids well deserved. As noted, the next teams chosen could have been CAA members Nova and Hofstra Yes CAA teams!!!

No, Hofstra shouldn't have made it (lost 4 of their last 5), but Villanova should have replaced Eastern Illinois. They beat Delaware & had better credentials than UNH, so I was surprised that UNH made it without Villanova (they both should have been selected). I don't think anyone got "woofed", though, as there were more playoff-caliber at-large candidates than there were slots available.

[cougarpines]

Who played this broken record again?

[JohnStOnge]

If you take the "average" final rankings at http://www.mratings.com/cf/compare1aa.htm, the eight highest rated eligible teams that did not get automatic bids are:

Applachian State
Richmond
Delaware
Southern Illinois
James Madison
Villanova
Eastern Washington
New Hampshire

The only inconsistency between that and the actual selections is Eastern Illinois being included while Villanova was left out. Had Villanova been in instead of Eastern Illinois, that would've been six CAA teams.

I know many will disagree but I personally consider the referenced average rankings to be as credible as anything out there. I consider it more credible than the GPI because the influence of human polls is very small due to large number of systems used as compared to the small number such polls.

For sure, I don't think five teams from the CAA was unreasonable if the idea is to get the best 8 teams available for at large berths.

[SuperEagle]

Personally, I was pretty surprised that UNH made the playoffs. That said, I was not surprised at how well they played once there. Had Elon or Ga. Southern won the games they should have, that spot would have gone to one of them and we might not be having this discussion. But they didn't, so the CAA got the spot. End of story.
**
Had UNH not been routed by a pitiful NorthEastern squad, they would have never came up in any discussions as a team that didn't deserve to get in. But I think Nova deserved it more IMO.
The reality on this whole mess is this (and we in Statesboro now know it), schedule as many cream puff FCS schools as possible. It's just the way it is now unfortunately. The committee wants it so we are now going to pacify them. We were in talks w/national champion Valdosta State about playing a game. Now, we're trying to get Savannah State on a consistant basis per our AD. The committee has proven they cannot be subjective.
They can't see past a number. It's sad but true. So matchups involving great DII's are probably going to be eliminated.
We are kind of dumping on our DII brothers. Seems kind of arrogant to me.
It would serve us right IMO if our FBS friends did the same thing to us.

[TheValleyRaider]

**
Had UNH not been routed by a pitiful NorthEastern squad, they would have never came up in any discussions as a team that didn't deserve to get in. But I think Nova deserved it more IMO.
The reality on this whole mess is this (and we in Statesboro now know it), schedule as many cream puff FCS schools as possible. It's just the way it is now unfortunately. The committee wants it so we are now going to pacify them. We were in talks w/national champion Valdosta State about playing a game. Now, we're trying to get Savannah State on a consistant basis per our AD. The committee has proven they cannot be subjective.
They can't see past a number. It's sad but true. So matchups involving great DII's are probably going to be eliminated.
We are kind of dumping on our DII brothers. Seems kind of arrogant to me.
It would serve us right IMO if our FBS friends did the same thing to us.

Well, I suppose anything to stop the "FBS schools are afraid to play us" nonsense can't be a terrible thing...

First of all, let's stop pretending GSU did some difficult thing by beating up D-II West Georgia. The Wolves went 2-9, which fits no ones definition of good or challenging. If we're going to talk about allowing D-II schools as a good thing for playoff qualification, do we really include them all? Or should there be some sort of cutoff, and if there is, what should that be? I asked these questions earlier, and no one has even tried to give an answer.

Matchups with D-IIs won't be eliminated. They have never been looked upon well by the Committee, and trying to make Georgia Southern as some sort of "victim" of a crime that's never occurred before is ludicrous. Schedule D-IIs at your own risk. That's the message, that's always been the message.

Remember that this is the NCAA's ruling on the issue. Is it "dumping" on D-II? Well, maybe a little. But we're D-I for a reason, and we're playing for the "Division I Championship"

[ASU88]

Let it go already.

[YoUDeeMan]

Ash, I would eliminate the Bye Week and shorten the schedule to 11 regular season games if necessary. Of course, this would mean less revenue for most of the FCS teams. Possibly, the teams representing conferences at the playoff could share some of their revenue from the play-off games.

xconfusedx xconfusedx xconfusedx xconfusedx xconfusedx xconfusedx

The money pot after expenses for the FCS playoffs is small to non-existant for a lot of teams. xnodx

This isn't the FBS. xreadx

[GannonFan]

Well, I suppose anything to stop the "FBS schools are afraid to play us" nonsense can't be a terrible thing...

First of all, let's stop pretending GSU did some difficult thing by beating up D-II West Georgia. The Wolves went 2-9, which fits no ones definition of good or challenging. If we're going to talk about allowing D-II schools as a good thing for playoff qualification, do we really include them all? Or should there be some sort of cutoff, and if there is, what should that be? I asked these questions earlier, and no one has even tried to give an answer.

Matchups with D-IIs won't be eliminated. They have never been looked upon well by the Committee, and trying to make Georgia Southern as some sort of "victim" of a crime that's never occurred before is ludicrous. Schedule D-IIs at your own risk. That's the message, that's always been the message.

Remember that this is the NCAA's ruling on the issue. Is it "dumping" on D-II? Well, maybe a little. But we're D-I for a reason, and we're playing for the "Division I Championship"

Agreed, stop the trumpeting of West Georgia as some wonderful team - they stunk this year. xthumbsupx