GSU Announces Plans for FBS Feasibility Study

[Soar7]

Guys, why are you so worried as to whether or nor GSU moves to the FBS. If moving up is what GSU plans to do then wish them well. If Appy, Furman, and the others feel so strong about their programs then why worry about what GSU plans to do. Just take care of your own business and everything else will take care of itself.
Soar7

[gophoenix]

Guys, why are you so worried as to whether or nor GSU moves to the FBS. If moving up is what GSU plans to do then wish them well. If Appy, Furman, and the others feel so strong about their programs then why worry about what GSU plans to do. Just take care of your own business and everything else will take care of itself.
Soar7

Because it is the exclusionary attitude. It is the same thing everyone complains about with the BCS and I-A schools. Everyone else stabs each other in the back try and get that extra scrap left on the floor from the top conference's table.

And what happens when Furman, Liberty, Elon, Lehigh or these other private schools go to I-A because they can afford it too?

[pete4256]

Should the Big South hold a grudge? Yes. And they do to a point as Big South football was created for us and Liberty more than anything and we left anyway. And then we left them high and dry regardless.

There is a major difference in the way things are structured here. When Elon left the NAIA, D-II and Big South; we as fans didn't go blaming Carson-Newman, Wingate, Liberty, Coastal or High Point (or the others). Many of guys are constantly laying out the reasons and it always involved those darn private schools as why. Only App and GSU do this. When UConn moved up, you didn't hear their fans blaming Northeastern or Hofstra. But you people are always doing that. How can your fans be excited over Elon. Elon this, Wofford, that, we're a different schools. Etc etc etc. It's like comparing Florida State to Wake Forest. Or Virginia Tech to Duke. But for some reason you are constantly laying the blame on a handful on a handful of other schools.

That is where the problem is. Want to move up to create a scenario for better competition or better exposure, that's fine. But to constantly lay the blame of "we don't belong with these guys" wreaks of MAJOR elitism.

When did I blame Elon for the desire to move up? I blame the university's goals of achieving major regional status. It has NOTHING TO DO WITH YOU.

Period.

[pete4256]

Because it is the exclusionary attitude. It is the same thing everyone complains about with the BCS and I-A schools. Everyone else stabs each other in the back try and get that extra scrap left on the floor from the top conference's table.

And what happens when Furman, Liberty, Elon, Lehigh or these other private schools go to I-A because they can afford it too?

Everything you say smacks of neurosis.

[youwouldno]

I love the people that think the FBS playoffs will be good for non-BCS programs. LOL. So naive. It actually will just mark a further separation between the big boys and the cannon fodder that fills out that subdivision. Of course, the best non-BCS team in the entire country would get a spot, like they do in the current system.

It doesn't take a lot of math to realize how hard it is to be the single best non-BCS team in the country. And the South really isn't fertile ground for it-- the mid-major FBS programs out West operate in an environment with less big-time competition (just Pac-10). That's why Boise St and Hawaii have been successful, along with great coaching.

In the southeast, the SEC and ACC gobble up tons of players, not to mention the fact that the Big East, Big 10, and Big 12 recruit players in southeastern hot-spots as well. There is no opening for a top drawer, non-BCS team in the region. Marshall started hot because they had such a tremendous program when they moved up. Interesting trend though:

1996: I-AA champs- move to I-A
1997: 10-3; Motor City Bowl
1998: 12-1; Motor City Bowl
1999: 13-0; Motor City Bowl
2000: 8-5; Motor City Bowl
2001: 11-2; GMAC Bowl
2002: 11-2; GMAC Bowl
2003: 8-4; did they go to a bowl game?
2004: 6-6; Ft. Worth Bowl
2005: 4-7
2006: 5-7
2007: 3-9

Even with all that early success, there was no next step. Just an inevitable Motor City Bowl. What a great reward for a terrific season. So much better than playing for a title. Now the program is in reverse.

Troy is doing OK, I guess. But the same problem applies- they aren't going to play in a meaningful bowl game. Even if they went undefeated it wouldn't matter-- the Sun Belt is so weak that a BCS bowl bid is mathematically impossible.

I think the difference can be summed up pretty easily; would you rather go 12-0 in the regular season and play some MAC team in the Motor City Bowl, or go 15-0 and win the FCS championship. Many fans prefer the former, apparently. I like football, so I would prefer the latter.

[mathman]

Everything that mathman says about the relationship between the Georgia BoR and GSU is true. I wish we had the kind of support tha ASU gets from its system and its chancellor. Our chancellor probably wouldn't want to be caught dead on our campus, much less be seen on national TV trying to get the crowd riled up at one of our playoff games.

Sometimes I think GSU should secede from the University System of Georgia.

A lot of the Georgia Legislature are UGA and UGA law school grads so that helps UGA. Having a law school might bode well in the long run for Georgia State as well. But there is a reason that UGA is frequently referred to as the "flagship" university of the state so everyone has to fall behind UGA. Except maybe Georgia Tech whose presence is 'tolerated'.

Leaving the University System would be hard to do. Georgia Tech has frequently talked of buying its way out and becoming private but from my inside contacts, it is highly unlikely to happen. Being part of the university system has its advantages with a guaranteed cash flow of support for operations and money for new buildings coming from the state. One problem though is having to get in line for projects with all the other schools. Right now, the bulk of money for projects has been going to Kennesaw State (high growth) and Georgia Gwinnett (new school).

But Georgia Tech has the money to buy itself out if it wanted to but I doubt Georgia Southern could.

[FCS_pwns_FBS]

A lot of the Georgia Legislature are UGA and UGA law school grads so that helps UGA. Having a law school might bode well in the long run for Georgia State as well. But there is a reason that UGA is frequently referred to as the "flagship" university of the state so everyone has to fall behind UGA. Except maybe Georgia Tech whose presence is 'tolerated'.

Leaving the University System would be hard to do. Georgia Tech has frequently talked of buying its way out and becoming private but from my inside contacts, it is highly unlikely to happen. Being part of the university system has its advantages with a guaranteed cash flow of support for operations and money for new buildings coming from the state. One problem though is having to get in line for projects with all the other schools. Right now, the bulk of money for projects has been going to Kennesaw State (high growth) and Georgia Gwinnett (new school).

But Georgia Tech has the money to buy itself out if it wanted to but I doubt Georgia Southern could.

I was just joking about becoming a private school...the "secession" thing is sort of an inside joke on this board. I know that there is no way we can get close to 17,000 undergraduates to pay the tuition that we would need to charge for not getting state money, especially when so many students can get the HOPE scholarship.

I think as long as we continue have an admin who is willing to nag and b^tch and moan constantly to the BoR then we will continue to grow. Of course, it does hurt that Sonny Purdue fired Tom Meredith, who I believe is friends with Grube.

[BigApp]

lose in the playoffs this year and see how many of these fans show up next year when the bloom will be off the Michigan win

we broke attendance records coming off a 6-5 season and no playoffs. What are you talkin' about?

[gophoenix]

Everything you say smacks of neurosis.

Real mature there. I guess that's what happens when someone makes a valid counter-claim that you don't like. But hey, you're the one with both a superiority and inferiority complex depending on which post you read.

Your original post makes the claim with Elon mentioned in it. So as long as your are making your claim and it involved my school, you're darn right it is about my school.

Very sad.

[ButlerGSU]

Actually yes, with final exams next week. Other than that we'll be beating you guys again this year but this time in basketball on Saturday at 3.

Then we'll probably shop for companies to study our potential move to I-A xsmiley_wix

It's true, GSU rolls in impressive fashion 85-72...moving to 6-1 on the season.

Congrats on another playoff win today.

[BearsCountry]

Troy is doing OK, I guess. But the same problem applies- they aren't going to play in a meaningful bowl game. Even if they went undefeated it wouldn't matter-- the Sun Belt is so weak that a BCS bowl bid is mathematically impossible.

I think the difference can be summed up pretty easily; would you rather go 12-0 in the regular season and play some MAC team in the Motor City Bowl, or go 15-0 and win the FCS championship. Many fans prefer the former, apparently. I like football, so I would prefer the latter.

You undefeated any conference you will play in a BCS bowl is how the rules are basically set up now. Besides Sun Belts schools normally play a stupid OOC schedule, they normally play 1/4 of the SEC anyways.

[Death Dealer]

Hmmm . . . let's see. There's more to a university than football, but as your chancellor put it, football is the university's front porch. GSU recently was classified as a research university, or doctoral institution. When the state board of regents also applies that term, GSU will have reached the goal of its recent academic overhaul.

Given that status and everything else we know about the university, let me ask you, what are GSU's peer institutions?

Are we more like Southern Miss, East Carolina, and Marshall?

Or are we more like Wofford, Furman, Elon, Samford, et al.?

That is not smack. It simply points out the kind of school we are and want to be in the near future.

Unfortunately, as far as athletics go, this probably means giving up our national prominence in football. I don't like that aspect of it, but it certainly makes sense.

And it shouldn't make the haters come out and start deriding GSU.Since 98% of your student body couldn't get into Furman or Wofford, much less afford it, I'd say you are nothing like us. And thank God for that!xlolx xnodx xlolx xnodx

[ButlerGSU]

Since 98% of your student body couldn't get into Furman or Wofford, much less afford it, I'd say you are nothing like us. And thank God for that!xlolx xnodx xlolx xnodx

Keep thinking that, but I do agree with you on one thing...thank God we are not Furman.

[gophoenix]

Since 98% of your student body couldn't get into Furman or Wofford, much less afford it, I'd say you are nothing like us. And thank God for that!xlolx xnodx xlolx xnodx

Public schools are nothing but people who expect everyone to subsidize their education :)

Private schools are filled with people willing to take fiscal responsibility for their education.

[Saint3333]

Public schools are nothing but people who expect everyone to subsidize their education :)

Private schools are filled with people willing to take fiscal responsibility for their education.

You can't be serious...xcoffeex

[gophoenix]

You can't be serious...xcoffeex

No, it was completely tongue in cheek.

But to an extent, it is sorta true too. Speaking from a complete libertarian perspective (rhetorical question); if you can afford private school via loans or sheer money power, why should you expect the people to fund universities so you can go to school cheaper????

[Baldy]

Public schools are nothing but people who expect everyone to subsidize their education :)

Private schools are filled with people willing to take fiscal responsibility for their education.
...but the people making the most stupid remarks are a Fermin and a Fee Nix. xlolx

[Saint3333]

No, it was completely tongue in cheek.

But to an extent, it is sorta true too. Speaking from a complete libertarian perspective (rhetorical question); if you can afford private school via loans or sheer money power, why should you expect the people to fund universities so you can go to school cheaper????

Good, I thought you'd lost it.xlolx

If an individual can purchase a similar product for 1/4 of the price they usually choose the less expensive option, I do. xpeacex

[gophoenix]

Good, I thought you'd lost it.xlolx

If an individual can purchase a similar product for 1/4 of the price they usually choose the less expensive option, I do. xpeacex

And my choice came down to a flip of the coin. Heads App and tails Elon. Both would have been good choices.

And I understand taking the cheap option. But really, in this day of people who can afford private school but choose against it, even in the great wealth of the US, why do we still have the public subsidize people's education like this? It is a completely valid rhetorical question.

[FCS_pwns_FBS]

Since 98% of your student body couldn't get into Furman or Wofford, much less afford it, I'd say you are nothing like us. And thank God for that!xlolx xnodx xlolx xnodx

Give me a breakxrolleyesx ...i'll try and find recent stats on our freshman profiles, but I'll bet you at least a quarter of our students beat your average SAT of admitted freshman...

[mrklean]

Public schools are nothing but people who expect everyone to subsidize their education :)

Private schools are filled with people willing to take fiscal responsibility for their education.

Why should I pay 30k a year when I can go to a school for 15k a year. My tax dollars help pay for my college.

I know too many students who graduated from a Private school and started out in the working world with 50k in student loans.

Now who got pimped??

[Baldy]

That is where the problem is. Want to move up to create a scenario for better competition or better exposure, that's fine. But to constantly lay the blame of "we don't belong with these guys" wreaks of MAJOR elitism.
And to actually believe that the reason of a possible move is because of Elon, Furman, etc, wreaks of insanity.
Yeah, we're thinking about moving because of the private schools.... xnutsx

[gophoenix]

Why should I pay 30k a year when I can go to a school for 15k a year. My tax dollars help pay for my college.

I know too many students who graduated from a Private school and started out in the working world with 50k in student loans.

Now who got pimped??

You're missing the point of my question. The loans suck, I can vouch for that and I had a load of scholarships. But why should everyone pay taxes into a system that they may or may not use? And this goes for taxes into a ton of different things whether it be subsidies, bailouts, colleges loads of crap.

I am not questioning the choice of how things stand now. There are pros and cons to both types of schools. But, why should all taxpayers be forced to pay the taxes so that a certain percentage of residents can get a university system education cheaper. And then you can take it a step further when you look at NC giving some of the out of state tuition for students and ask why taxpayers of one state are paying to subsidize the education of people who not only don't pay taxes in that state but may not even live her after graduation, etc.

[Baldy]

Give me a breakxrolleyesx ...i'll try and find recent stats on our freshman profiles, but I'll bet you at least a quarter of our students beat your average SAT of admitted freshman...
As I've told these Furmans before, I'd put our top 2800 students up against their entire student body anytime. xnodx

[DFW HOYA]

The only reaslistic conference for this study is the Sun Belt. To even offer the Big East as an option is beyond reason. Georgetown will play Big East football before Georgia Southern does.

A major college conference is going to be looking for a lot more than I-AA/FCS playoff appearances to judge a candidate. Here are three:

1. Is Paulson Stadium meeting minimum conference stadium standards? The Sun Belt gladly accepts "erector set" stadia that meet the I-A minimim, the Big East does not.

2. What is the TV market that the school brings? Statesboro is not Atlanta.

3. What does the school bring to the table in terms of basketball and other sports? The GSU fieldhouse does not even meet the 6,000 seat Big East minimum.

4. Can the school receive a 75% vote from the existing membership? Assuming GSU would have the undivided support of the football schools (unlikely, but let's agree for the sake of argument), where are the four votes from Notre Dame, Georgetown, Villanova, St. John's, Providence, Seton Hall, Marquette, and DePaul?

GSU is a Sun Belt candidate and probably a good one. But not beyond that.

[mrklean]

The only reaslistic conference for this study is the Sun Belt. To even offer the Big East as an option is beyond reason. Georgetown will play Big East football before Georgia Southern does.

A major college conference is going to be looking for a lot more than I-AA/FCS playoff appearances to judge a candidate. Here are three:

1. Is Paulson Stadium meeting minimum conference stadium standards? The Sun Belt gladly accepts "erector set" stadia that meet the I-A minimim, the Big East does not.

2. What is the TV market that the school brings? Statesboro is not Atlanta. Over 60% of our alumni live in Atlanta!!!

3. What does the school bring to the table in terms of basketball and other sports? The GSU fieldhouse does not even meet the 6,000 seat Big East minimum. Baseball we would win it out right!!

4. Can the school receive a 75% vote from the existing membership? Assuming GSU would have the undivided support of the football schools (unlikely, but let's agree for the sake of argument), where are the four votes from Notre Dame, Georgetown, Villanova, St. John's, Providence, Seton Hall, Marquette, and DePaul?

GSU is a Sun Belt candidate and probably a good one. But not beyond that.

That is all!!!!

[gophoenix]

And to actually believe that the reason of a possible move is because of Elon, Furman, etc, wreaks of insanity.
Yeah, we're thinking about moving because of the private schools.... xnutsx

It was the example given, and it is the subject of many aspects of the argument on the GSU message board. xrulesx

Maybe it should have read.... Do we have more in common with The Citadel, Elon, Furman, Wofford, Western Carolina and UTC.....

Or the later group.

But the argument listed only private schools. So, crazy, I am not. I am just stating and arguing against the reason in that first post.

[mrklean]

You're missing the point of my question. The loans suck, I can vouch for that and I had a load of scholarships. But why should everyone pay taxes into a system that they may or may not use? And this goes for taxes into a ton of different things whether it be subsidies, bailouts, colleges loads of crap.

I am not questioning the choice of how things stand now. There are pros and cons to both types of schools. But, why should all taxpayers be forced to pay the taxes so that a certain percentage of residents can get a university system education cheaper. And then you can take it a step further when you look at NC giving some of the out of state tuition for students and ask why taxpayers of one state are paying to subsidize the education of people who not only don't pay taxes in that state but may not even live her after graduation, etc.

There are alot of things that my tax dollar pays for and I dont agree with it. EDUCATION is one bill I dont mind paying for!!!!!!

[soweagle]

Hey GoPhoenix, why was it not considered elitists when Elon moved from div. II to I-AA? Double standard?

[gophoenix]

Hey GoPhoenix, why was it not considered elitists when Elon moved from div. II to I-AA? Double standard?

No, it wasn't. Like I said before, none of our fans were out there saying we don't belong with all those schools like we're seeing here. Try reading my posts. No Elon fans stated we didn't belong with Carson-Newman, Wingate or Lenoir-Rhyne. And none stated that we didn't belong with Liberty, Gardner-Webb (though I did say it with Charleston Southern).

It is one thing to want to move up for better competition, exposure and those types of reasons. It's different when you run around saying it is because of Wofford, Elon and Furman like many are doing in this case.

Again, try reading the posts. xcoffeex

[ButlerGSU]

No, it wasn't. Like I said before, none of our fans were out there saying we don't belong with all those schools like we're seeing here. Try reading my posts. No Elon fans stated we didn't belong with Carson-Newman, Wingate or Lenoir-Rhyne. And none stated that we didn't belong with Liberty, Gardner-Webb (though I did say it with Charleston Southern).

It is one thing to want to move up for better competition, exposure and those types of reasons. It's different when you run around saying it is because of Wofford, Elon and Furman like many are doing in this case.

Again, try reading the posts. xcoffeex

Why does our reason matter? We would rather be with public schools closer to our profile. Is that wrong? Tough.

[FCS_pwns_FBS]

The only reaslistic conference for this study is the Sun Belt. To even offer the Big East as an option is beyond reason. Georgetown will play Big East football before Georgia Southern does.

A major college conference is going to be looking for a lot more than I-AA/FCS playoff appearances to judge a candidate. Here are three:

1. Is Paulson Stadium meeting minimum conference stadium standards? The Sun Belt gladly accepts "erector set" stadia that meet the I-A minimim, the Big East does not.

2. What is the TV market that the school brings? Statesboro is not Atlanta.

3. What does the school bring to the table in terms of basketball and other sports? The GSU fieldhouse does not even meet the 6,000 seat Big East minimum.

4. Can the school receive a 75% vote from the existing membership? Assuming GSU would have the undivided support of the football schools (unlikely, but let's agree for the sake of argument), where are the four votes from Notre Dame, Georgetown, Villanova, St. John's, Providence, Seton Hall, Marquette, and DePaul?

GSU is a Sun Belt candidate and probably a good one. But not beyond that.


That is all!!!!


We don't have an "erector set" stadium. You cannot go under the bleachers. And if I'm not mistaken, we are expanding the stadium soon. I'd be willing to bet that our homegame attendance is comparable to quite a few big east schools.

We are also making improvements to non-football facilities.

[gophoenix]

Why does our reason matter? We would rather be with public schools closer to our profile. Is that wrong? Tough.

No, just elitist. If that's the reason, then fine. But don't get cranky when someone calls it what it is.

[DFW HOYA]

We don't have an "erector set" stadium. You cannot go under the bleachers. And if I'm not mistaken, we are expanding the stadium soon.

An "erector set" stadium is one where bleachers are hastily created to meet the 30K minimum, above or around the seating area, such as open end zones. (See UNT's Fouts Field as as an example.)


I'd be willing to bet that our homegame attendance is comparable to quite a few big east schools. We are also making improvements to non-football facilities.

GSU home attendance (18,925) is not at Big East levels, but it's not realistic to expect that in I-AA/FCS, either.

West Virginia: 60,460
South Florida: 53,170
Rutgers: 43,863
Louisville: 39,935
Connecticut: 38,205
Syracuse: 35,009
Pittsburgh: 33,315
Cincinnati: 30,246

[ButlerGSU]

No, just elitist. If that's the reason, then fine. But don't get cranky when someone calls it what it is.

Elitist??? What do you call your rant about private education????

[gophoenix]

Elitist??? What do you call your rant about private education????

A tongue in cheek, rhetorical argument, just like I posted that it was the begin with.

Next?

[pete4256]

No, it wasn't. Like I said before, none of our fans were out there saying we don't belong with all those schools like we're seeing here. Try reading my posts. No Elon fans stated we didn't belong with Carson-Newman, Wingate or Lenoir-Rhyne. And none stated that we didn't belong with Liberty, Gardner-Webb (though I did say it with Charleston Southern).

It is one thing to want to move up for better competition, exposure and those types of reasons. It's different when you run around saying it is because of Wofford, Elon and Furman like many are doing in this case.

Again, try reading the posts. xcoffeex

Why did Elon change its mascot away from "Fighting Christians"?

Whatever your answer is, I think it wreaks of elitism.

[pete4256]

A tongue in cheek, rhetorical argument, just like I posted that it was the begin with.

Next?

Right . . . your powers of logic truly boggle the mind. xwhistlex

[gophoenix]

Why did Elon change its mascot away from "Fighting Christians"?

Whatever your answer is, I think it wreaks of elitism.

I have no answer or argument against that. I disliked the name change.

[soweagle]

No, it wasn't. Like I said before, none of our fans were out there saying we don't belong with all those schools like we're seeing here. Try reading my posts. No Elon fans stated we didn't belong with Carson-Newman, Wingate or Lenoir-Rhyne. And none stated that we didn't belong with Liberty, Gardner-Webb (though I did say it with Charleston Southern).

It is one thing to want to move up for better competition, exposure and those types of reasons. It's different when you run around saying it is because of Wofford, Elon and Furman like many are doing in this case.

Again, try reading the posts. xcoffeex

Claiming "better competition" is the same as saying you don't belong with a certain group.

Of course I don't think Elon was taking an elitists attitude towards moving up but if you are going to use that lame of an argument against GSU then you need a dose of your own medicine. You are reading between the lines and taking the martyr, "woe is me attitude" that is frankly not there. No one at GSU is interested in moving to D-IA b/c of Elon. You give your school and program too much credit and that is an elitists attitude.

[gophoenix]

Claiming "better competition" is the same as saying you don't belong with a certain group.

Of course I don't think Elon was taking an elitists attitude towards moving up but if you are going to use that lame of an argument against GSU then you need a dose of your own medicine. You are reading between the lines and taking the martyr, "woe is me attitude" that is frankly not there. No one at GSU is interested in moving to D-IA b/c of Elon. You give your school and program too much credit and that is an elitists attitude.

Go read your board. I am playing elitist. If anything, I am playing the victim of the constant GSU and App campaign and conspiracy against the private schools of the south.

Boy talk about trying to turn around and really try to stretch it to apply the other day. :D Really gave me a good laugh to read that one.

xpeacex

[ButlerGSU]

Go read your board. I am playing elitist. If anything, I am playing the victim of the constant GSU and App campaign and conspiracy against the private schools of the south.

Boy talk about trying to turn around and really try to stretch it to apply the other day. :D Really gave me a good laugh to read that one.

xpeacex

Exactly. App and GSU boards. Why are you going out of your way to read them? Worry more about Elon and less about us.

[soweagle]

Go read your board. I am playing elitist. If anything, I am playing the victim of the constant GSU and App campaign and conspiracy against the private schools of the south.

Boy talk about trying to turn around and really try to stretch it to apply the other day. :D Really gave me a good laugh to read that one.

xpeacex

Quit flattering yourself into thinking it is about you. It s about better competition, exposure and those types of reasons. Sound familiar.

Heck, Go Phoenix, the truth is I don't know why we are doing this. I think each individual has their own reason for wanting something to change. I'm for it, I guess. Part of me thinks GSU should get out there and not be afraid to take the chance. We have won 6 titles and it is time to move on. However, part of me thinks we should stay put before we destroy a good program. I'm just glad it will not adversely change my life either way.

[gophoenix]

Exactly. App and GSU boards. Why are you going out of your way to read them? Worry more about Elon and less about us.

So, reading posts concerning elon is not worrying about elon?

Maybe GSU started the study when the SoCon became more competitive? You are running from the challenge of Wofford, Elon, The Citadel, Furman and App. Too much to risk losing, so you have to go to the Sun Belt to have an easier time. Makes sense to me. :D

[soweagle]

So, reading posts concerning elon is not worrying about elon?

Maybe GSU started the study when the SoCon became more competitive? You are running from the challenge of Wofford, Elon, The Citadel, Furman and App. Too much to risk losing, so you have to go to the Sun Belt to have an easier time. Makes sense to me. :D

Don't forget UTC, we lost to them this year.xrolleyesx

[Death Dealer]

Give me a breakxrolleyesx ...i'll try and find recent stats on our freshman profiles, but I'll bet you at least a quarter of our students beat your average SAT of admitted freshman...
I wouldn't be suprised if it's more than that, I was just breaking Petey's balls over his smart @$$ comment about how you guys are more like Sou. Miss and Marshall than the small privates. Hell, I went to Furman on a scholarship. If not for that, it'd have been a coin toss between Clemson, The Citadel, or Appy (that's where my sister was at the time).

As I have already stated, I hope GSU does what's best for GSU. And whatever they do, I'll pull for them to do well. But my personal preference would be for ya'll to stay put, so we can continue to whittle down that win/loss ratio.

[FCS_pwns_FBS]

I wouldn't be suprised if it's more than that, I was just breaking Petey's balls over his smart @$$ comment about how you guys are more like Sou. Miss and Marshall than the small privates. Hell, I went to Furman on a scholarship. If not for that, it'd have been a coin toss between Clemson, The Citadel, or Appy (that's where my sister was at the time).

As I have already stated, I hope GSU does what's best for GSU. And whatever they do, I'll pull for them to do well. But my personal preference would be for ya'll to stay put, so we can continue to whittle down that win/loss ratio.

I do think that we are more like Marshall and Southern Miss than the small private schools in some ways. But I don't think that we are "too good" for the SoCon (what kind of a moron would think that?). Heck, I would put the SoCon up against the Sun Belt most years (this year I'd put us ahead of them, in football at least).

I want what is best for GSU, and I am sort of an FCS homer, but I don't think moving into the Sun Belt is going to help us grow our program and our school any faster. (GSU broke it's average homegame attendance record for this year, and that includes years that followed two straight national championship wins, so I think we are on the right track). I don't see how more people are going to want to watch us play teams like Middle Tennesee State and Troy State more than they want to watch us play teams like App. and you guys. The quality of the competition is the same in the regular season, and the quality of competition would usually be the same in a home playoff game as it would be in a weekday afternoon bowl game that will probably be 1000 miles from where most of the fan base lives.

[OL FU]

Personally, I think this study was just a ploy to keep up the chatter about GSU on AGSxnodx xrotatehx xsmiley_wix

[soweagle]

Personally, I think this study was just a ploy to keep up the chatter about GSU on AGSxnodx xrotatehx xsmiley_wix

We just want to be loved and not forgotten.:D

[lizrdgizrd]

We just want to be loved and not forgotten.:D
Will you settle for hated but not forgotten? xlolx

[Death Dealer]

Will you settle for hated but not forgotten? xlolxBut we do LOVE to hate them! xsmiley_wix I wouldn't have it any other way! xnodx xpeacex

[pete4256]

I wouldn't be suprised if it's more than that, I was just breaking Petey's balls over his smart @$$ comment about how you guys are more like Sou. Miss and Marshall than the small privates. Hell, I went to Furman on a scholarship. If not for that, it'd have been a coin toss between Clemson, The Citadel, or Appy (that's where my sister was at the time).

As I have already stated, I hope GSU does what's best for GSU. And whatever they do, I'll pull for them to do well. But my personal preference would be for ya'll to stay put, so we can continue to whittle down that win/loss ratio.

Many have tried and many have failed . . . my balls are still intact.

I'd just as soon stay in FCS, if only to have continued opportunities to pay Furman back for 2001.

I love playing in FCS and in the Socon.

BTW, if your sister went to App and you were forced to go there too, does that mean . . . forget it.

[walliver]

Consultants usually recommend what they are paid to recommend. Therefore, I suspect that the decision has already been made by the upper levels of GSU management.

I have suspected that ASU and GSU will both make a move. I believe that App probably has a timetable set, and that GSU will be "forced" to follow (Visit tscports.com the day App announces a movexnodx )

I wish them the best of luck. I believe that any school should be allowed to play at any level they choose. There is a bias on this board about national championships, but, the real purpose of football is to play the next game on your schedule. FBS fans enjoy their games just as much as FCS fans do. FBS teams can't go to the play-offs, but they can go to bowl games in exotic locations (and have enough advance notice to take time off work and make travel plans).

Unfortunately, right now I don't see a good home for ASU or GSU. The Sunbelt is aboiut full as it is, and is not really attractive to either school. The MAC is full (and non-football travel expenses would be excessive if they could join). Neither school would bring a lot to C-USA. The Savannah/Stateboro market isn't that big, and, even though "60% of GSU alumni live in Atlanta", Georgia Southern would at best be the fourth most popular team in Atlanta (after UGA, GT, and probably Auburn). The Boone market doesn't bring a whole lot either. Neither school has the basketball program/facilities for the Big East.

The "best option" for both schools would be a new conference - possibly with Jacksonville State, Texas State-San Marcos, UTSA?, Coastal? and a CAA school or two. I don't believe ECU, or Marshall would want to "move down" to such a league, but, possibly a few Sunbelt teams would move (FAU?).

As long as much of the "general public" believes that "I-A schools" are somehow better schools than the others, there will continue to be a great drive for schools like ASU and GSU to "move up". The NCAA moratorium will end in 2011, probably with little change in current rules, and there will be widespread movement. When that happens, I hope the SoCon can persuade the Virginia CAA schools to return to the South.

[CID1990]

I like pie.

[citdog]

I like pie.


me too.

[lizrdgizrd]

I like pie.


me too.

Agreed! xnodx

[rfeng]

A 30K-seat Stadium and Field House are two big ticket items.

Some schools have already begun studies or put financial packages together to build/upgrade their stadiums. That is an indication that joining the FBS is an objective.

The Sun Belt is a viable option for GSU.
The BE is not a viable option for schools who don't have facilities in place. It is much easier for the BE to invite existing FBS schools (CUSA or MAC) to join. I think that Temple will eventually get invited back once they establish a strong football program. They already have the NFL stadium (Philadelphia Eagles) for their home games, are in a large population center, and have the Eagles helping them sell tickets.

[appfan2008]

Unfortunately the improvements that are occuring at kidd brewer and paulson are pointing to both of us moving up in the next 5-10 years... i dont want to see it but i think the inevitable is just that

[WCU_FL_Alum]

I guess I might be bias because my school isn't moving anywhere. Hell, many question if the university provides enough support for the FCS. Anyway, I don't think it is the best move for these schools (GSU/ APP St). As many people have stated, they will end up in a lower tier conference and fight every year to go to what...the New Orleans Bowl?

I live in South Florida and have watched as FAU (Florida Atlantic) has built their program. Soon after they started their program, the had success in FCS and went to the quarterfinal of the playoffs. This level of success wasn't enough and they soon moved on to FBS where they are members of the Sun Belt. Granted, it is a new program and it is located in fickle South Florida (where everyone seems to be band wagon fans and dont even support a BB team who has won two World Series) and they dont have their own stadium (play in Ft. Lauderdale's Lockhart Stadium).

Every year they play 4 or 5 major FBS BCS schools who drill them. Howard Schnellenberger calls these games "advanced training". Then they limp back to play their conference games. Unfortunately, just like many FCS schools, these lower level FBS schools NEED these games to finance their programs.

I just don't see what the advantage is to making the move. People who point to Univ. of South Florida, need to realize that everything lined up perfectly for them due to the Big East teams that fled to the ACC. Just happened to work out for them but, dont think the same scenerio will happen anytime soon. Hell UCF has a much older program than USF but missed the boat (invite to the Big East) and were happy to move from the MAC to CUSA. At least they have done well this year (CUSA Champs and a new on campus stadium)

[BluehenJK]

You GSU fans who think that you will ever get close to a FBS playoff are just misinformed. First of all you are assuming the PAC-10 and Big 10 will be forward thinking. Not happening anytime soon. Jim Delaney is a powerful man and he proved that by keeping Georgia out of the Rose Bowl. He was able to shoot down all those TV execs and got a 3 loss Illinois in the Rose Bowl. The Big 10 still stops games before Th'giving. So GSU enjoy the Sunbelt and that big game against North Texas before 6k people on a Tues on ESPN. Idiots.........xsmhx

[JDC325]

I wish I had the ability to look into the future like you Nostradumass (SP)
GSU has a good chance of exceeding the hater expectations!!
xcoffeex

[CID1990]

I have two words for you:

MAR. SHALL.

Once a FCS powerhouse, now a FBS nobody.

[pete4256]

I have two words for you:

MAR. SHALL.

Once a FCS powerhouse, now a FBS nobody.

Can The Citadel really talk smack on Marshall?

[08Dawg]

Let's think...are GSU and App hurting for money that much, to sell their souls out to an FBS nobody conference and get shat on at every turn? Plus, as long as GSU can't outright beat everybody in the SoCon (we beat them last year on the road) what hope of any kind of success can they have against a schedule that will likely feature big-hitting FBS teams? Same argument goes for App. Plus, I'd much rather see a strong SoCon with App and GSU still in it than see them go to the Sun Belch or C-USA.

[pete4256]

You GSU fans who think that you will ever get close to a FBS playoff are just misinformed. First of all you are assuming the PAC-10 and Big 10 will be forward thinking. Not happening anytime soon. Jim Delaney is a powerful man and he proved that by keeping Georgia out of the Rose Bowl. He was able to shoot down all those TV execs and got a 3 loss Illinois in the Rose Bowl. The Big 10 still stops games before Th'giving. So GSU enjoy the Sunbelt and that big game against North Texas before 6k people on a Tues on ESPN. Idiots.........xsmhx

Irrational hatred.

[08Dawg]

Can The Citadel really talk smack on Marshall?


Yes we can, and we do xlolx

[pete4256]

Yes we can, and we do xlolx

To each his own. If I were a fan of The Citadel, I'd be careful not to throw stones at other programs.

[UDChE89]

A 30K-seat Stadium and Field House are two big ticket items.

Some schools have already begun studies or put financial packages together to build/upgrade their stadiums. That is an indication that joining the FBS is an objective.

The Sun Belt is a viable option for GSU.
The BE is not a viable option for schools who don't have facilities in place. It is much easier for the BE to invite existing FBS schools (CUSA or MAC) to join. I think that Temple will eventually get invited back once they establish a strong football program. They already have the NFL stadium (Philadelphia Eagles) for their home games, are in a large population center, and have the Eagles helping them sell tickets.

That's a big assumption there cowboy. I don't think there's a chance in HELL of Temple ever building a strong football program. They're likely to fail in the MAC as they did in the Big East. Throw out the huge crowd they had for Penn State and their average was about 20K or less than UD. They only filled the Linc to 42% of capacity including the Penn State game.

[BigApp]

wow. this thread is still going? I'll guess and say at least 15 pages of it is smack about 'crappy bowls' (which still outdraw and out rate anything on this level)...

But, the real issue, and what the haters are conveniently leaving out, is that FBS is NOT about the bowls, IT'S ABOUT THE REGULAR SEASON!

[appfan2008]

That's a big assumption there cowboy. I don't think there's a chance in HELL of Temple ever building a strong football program. They're likely to fail in the MAC as they did in the Big East. Throw out the huge crowd they had for Penn State and their average was about 20K or less than UD. They only filled the Linc to 42% of capacity including the Penn State game.

Temple really is a long way from being asked to join the big east... they are just not that big of football program and wont be anytime soon

[Seven Would Be Nice]

I have two words for you:

MAR. SHALL.

Once a FCS powerhouse, now a FBS nobody.

In the grand scheme of things, everyone in the FCS is a nobody.

App state won TWO national championships in a ROW, like GSU has done three times.

App beats Michigan and gets more media coverage than all 8 of those National Titles combined.

[asu70]

In the grand scheme of things, everyone in the FCS is a nobody.

App state won TWO national championships in a ROW, like GSU has done three times.

App beats Michigan and gets more media coverage than all 8 of those National Titles combined.

Pathetic but true!

[bandit]

I think we'll be seeing several other schools working to make a move to FBS in the near future. Right now, with a few exceptions, all you have to do to get to a bowl game is finish with a winning record (look at 7-5 Ball State in the International Bowl).

FCS fans may laugh at those bowl games, but even the smallest one gets more viewers, more TV $$$$, and more fans in the stands than the FCS title game.

There will be opportunity on the horizon, especially in the SE.

I think we'll see a major shakeup among NON-BCS leagues in the next 5 to 7 years. BYU, Utah, Air Force and others are increasingly unhappy with the MWC and its terrible TV situation. There has been discussion about going independant, and setting up a scheduling alliance of sorts with the likes of Notre Dame, Army and Navy, and setting up individual bowl and TV deals. I recall reading about a study done in BYU's case that indicated they are losing millions in potential revenue by staying with the MWC.

The Western half of CUSA is in an uneasy relationship with the Eastern half. ECU's AD has made public comments about how problematic the travel situation is in the league, and rivalries have been slow to develop. If there is an implosion in the MWC - and maybe even if there isn't - look for the Western half of CUSA to try and bring in TCU, and perhaps a couple more like UNLV, New Mexico and La Tech, for a possible ressurection of the SWC conference.

You could have Memphis as a football-only member in the BE, leaving 5 eastern CUSA schools essentially without a league: ECU, UAB, USM, Marshall and UCF.

Ga Southern, App State, JMU, ODU and Delaware should all put themselves in position to step in and benefit, and I think most if not all of these schools will do so.

Even if none of these things come to pass, GSU's move to FBS would make sense. The Sun Belt is improving every year, and will likely have a 2nd bowl game soon. CUSA will eventually have an opening. And aren't Georgia State and Kennessaw State both seriously looking to football, and ultimately to FBS? Ga Southern can't sit back and allow those schools to surpass them. They need to act first.

I don't understand the attitude that any FCS moving to FBS is doomed to failure. Is an 8-4 season and a televised bowl game a failure? Is winning a national title the only way to gauge a successful season and a successful program? If so, there are alot of failures out there.

Just my 2 cents, anyways :)

[ButlerGSU]

Even if none of these things come to pass, GSU's move to FBS would make sense. The Sun Belt is improving every year, and will likely have a 2nd bowl game soon. CUSA will eventually have an opening. And aren't Georgia State and Kennessaw State both seriously looking to football, and ultimately to FBS? Ga Southern can't sit back and allow those schools to surpass them. They need to act first.


B-I-N-G-O

xnodx xnodx xnodx xnodx xnodx

[appfan2008]

I think we'll be seeing several other schools working to make a move to FBS in the near future. Right now, with a few exceptions, all you have to do to get to a bowl game is finish with a winning record (look at 7-5 Ball State in the International Bowl).

FCS fans may laugh at those bowl games, but even the smallest one gets more viewers, more TV $$$$, and more fans in the stands than the FCS title game.

There will be opportunity on the horizon, especially in the SE.

I think we'll see a major shakeup among NON-BCS leagues in the next 5 to 7 years. BYU, Utah, Air Force and others are increasingly unhappy with the MWC and its terrible TV situation. There has been discussion about going independant, and setting up a scheduling alliance of sorts with the likes of Notre Dame, Army and Navy, and setting up individual bowl and TV deals. I recall reading about a study done in BYU's case that indicated they are losing millions in potential revenue by staying with the MWC.

The Western half of CUSA is in an uneasy relationship with the Eastern half. ECU's AD has made public comments about how problematic the travel situation is in the league, and rivalries have been slow to develop. If there is an implosion in the MWC - and maybe even if there isn't - look for the Western half of CUSA to try and bring in TCU, and perhaps a couple more like UNLV, New Mexico and La Tech, for a possible ressurection of the SWC conference.

You could have Memphis as a football-only member in the BE, leaving 5 eastern CUSA schools essentially without a league: ECU, UAB, USM, Marshall and UCF.

Ga Southern, App State, JMU, ODU and Delaware should all put themselves in position to step in and benefit, and I think most if not all of these schools will do so.

Even if none of these things come to pass, GSU's move to FBS would make sense. The Sun Belt is improving every year, and will likely have a 2nd bowl game soon. CUSA will eventually have an opening. And aren't Georgia State and Kennessaw State both seriously looking to football, and ultimately to FBS? Ga Southern can't sit back and allow those schools to surpass them. They need to act first.

I don't understand the attitude that any FCS moving to FBS is doomed to failure. Is an 8-4 season and a televised bowl game a failure? Is winning a national title the only way to gauge a successful season and a successful program? If so, there are alot of failures out there.

Just my 2 cents, anyways :)

great stuff... hadnt really thought about a break up of the cusa but it really does seem plausible due the awful travel schedules for those schools... that would be an interesting conference with uab ecu marshall smu and gsu jmu asu and others... that might be fun...

[asu7]

I think we'll be seeing several other schools working to make a move to FBS in the near future. Right now, with a few exceptions, all you have to do to get to a bowl game is finish with a winning record (look at 7-5 Ball State in the International Bowl).

FCS fans may laugh at those bowl games, but even the smallest one gets more viewers, more TV $$$$, and more fans in the stands than the FCS title game.

There will be opportunity on the horizon, especially in the SE.

I think we'll see a major shakeup among NON-BCS leagues in the next 5 to 7 years. BYU, Utah, Air Force and others are increasingly unhappy with the MWC and its terrible TV situation. There has been discussion about going independant, and setting up a scheduling alliance of sorts with the likes of Notre Dame, Army and Navy, and setting up individual bowl and TV deals. I recall reading about a study done in BYU's case that indicated they are losing millions in potential revenue by staying with the MWC.

The Western half of CUSA is in an uneasy relationship with the Eastern half. ECU's AD has made public comments about how problematic the travel situation is in the league, and rivalries have been slow to develop. If there is an implosion in the MWC - and maybe even if there isn't - look for the Western half of CUSA to try and bring in TCU, and perhaps a couple more like UNLV, New Mexico and La Tech, for a possible ressurection of the SWC conference.

You could have Memphis as a football-only member in the BE, leaving 5 eastern CUSA schools essentially without a league: ECU, UAB, USM, Marshall and UCF.

Ga Southern, App State, JMU, ODU and Delaware should all put themselves in position to step in and benefit, and I think most if not all of these schools will do so.

Even if none of these things come to pass, GSU's move to FBS would make sense. The Sun Belt is improving every year, and will likely have a 2nd bowl game soon. CUSA will eventually have an opening. And aren't Georgia State and Kennessaw State both seriously looking to football, and ultimately to FBS? Ga Southern can't sit back and allow those schools to surpass them. They need to act first.

I don't understand the attitude that any FCS moving to FBS is doomed to failure. Is an 8-4 season and a televised bowl game a failure? Is winning a national title the only way to gauge a successful season and a successful program? If so, there are alot of failures out there.

Just my 2 cents, anyways :)

Excellent post ...

GaSo ... Good luck fellow SOCON brothers ...

I hope you do it and I hope we follow.

Everyone who hates the move and anyone who thinks of a move just does not want to face the impact of you leaving their conference. If GaSo moves and APP does not we might as well hang it up. We will be stuck playing teams like Presby and Samford.

FU and Woff I do enjoy playing you guys. The future additions to the SOCON does not look promising.

Some of you say why move to a level that you can't win at. Since it is hard to win on this level lets just all move to D2 and kick ass cause chances are most in 1AA will not win a championship. So since we all can't win in basketball and football lets just go to some place where we can beat the **** out of everyone in every sport. Is that what you are saying folks? We should stay where we can win all the time? If that were the case lets go D2 and win all the time.

Agreed that when these D2 schools move up it is a great thing as people do say on here ... why is it such a pain in one's ass when we move to the FBS.

App will probably never win a basketball championship guess we better go D2 so we can win. Since the only thing that judges a good season is a championship.

I want to play Marshall and ECU on a regular basis so hate me ... I hear APPMAN and everyone else talking about that rivalry that I missed out on ...

anyways I am done I remove myself from the box lol

I love yall!!! xnodx

[FCS Preview]

Excellent post ...

GaSo ... Good luck fellow SOCON brothers ...

I hope you do it and I hope we follow.

Everyone who hates the move and anyone who thinks of a move just does not want to face the impact of you leaving their conference. If GaSo moves and APP does not we might as well hang it up. We will be stuck playing teams like Presby and Samford.

FU and Woff I do enjoy playing you guys. The future additions to the SOCON does not look promising.

Some of you say why move to a level that you can't win at. Since it is hard to win on this level lets just all move to D2 and kick ass cause chances are most in 1AA will not win a championship. So since we all can't win in basketball and football lets just go to some place where we can beat the **** out of everyone in every sport. Is that what you are saying folks? We should stay where we can win all the time? If that were the case lets go D2 and win all the time.

Agreed that when these D2 schools move up it is a great thing as people do say on here ... why is it such a pain in one's ass when we move to the FBS.

App will probably never win a basketball championship guess we better go D2 so we can win. Since the only thing that judges a good season is a championship.

I want to play Marshall and ECU on a regular basis so hate me ... I hear APPMAN and everyone else talking about that rivalry that I missed out on ...

anyways I am done I remove myself from the box lol

I love yall!!! xnodx

Different sports have different goals
Different schools have different goals in sports.

In FCS football, for schools in the major conferences, the goal should be to win the NC. For schools in the non-AQ leagues, the goal is to make the playoffs. This is no different than in FBS football, where the "BCS" conference teams have the goal of winning the MNC. In the other conferences, the goal is a bowl invite, since they have no chance of the MNC.

In basketball, same thing. Mid-major conferences, the goal is to make the Dance, and win a game or two. For the major conferences, the goal is to win the NC.

If you would be happy going from a school with a chance every year to win a title, to becoming one whose goal is to get an invite to Detroit in December, go ahead. I hear downtown Detroit is lovely at Christmas. xrolleyesx

[bandit]

Different sports have different goals
Different schools have different goals in sports.

In FCS football, for schools in the major conferences, the goal should be to win the NC. For schools in the non-AQ leagues, the goal is to make the playoffs. This is no different than in FBS football, where the "BCS" conference teams have the goal of winning the MNC. In the other conferences, the goal is a bowl invite, since they have no chance of the MNC.

In basketball, same thing. Mid-major conferences, the goal is to make the Dance, and win a game or two. For the major conferences, the goal is to win the NC.

If you would be happy going from a school with a chance every year to win a title, to becoming one whose goal is to get an invite to Detroit in December, go ahead. I hear downtown Detroit is lovely at Christmas. xrolleyesx


Not sure why you’re picking on the Motor City Bowl – it has largely been very successful. The Akron/Memphis and MTSU/CMU games the last couple years had outstanding crowds.

Defining a goal is only one aspect of a move to FBS. There is also increased stature and visibility.

Tell me: why was it seen as such a monumental upset – one for the ages – when App. State beat Michigan. Would it have been the same if East Carolina beat them? Nah, the Pirates have beaten Miami and other big-time programs in the past. What about Northern Illinois? Nah, they’ve beaten Alabama and other major BCS teams and ESPN didn’t have a field day over it. The reason App. State’s victory was so huge is the perception of FCS and the difference in stature between the 2 divisions.

Those who know football realize that App. State could compete with and beat ECU and/or N. Illinois most years. But because they are in FCS, they are viewed in an entirely different way from programs that should be their peers.

There are increasing opportunities every year in FBS. More TV slots from the multiple ESPN networks. More bowl games. More $$$$. I live near Washington, DC and this year I watched New Mexico State vs. Nevada on national TV. North Texas vs. ULL. MTSU vs. Louisville. I even saw Florida International slug it out with Miami. I saw FAU on national TV in their home stadium – small as it is – hosting USF. Why should FAU be hosting games on ESPN while the only chance App State, Delaware and Ga Southern have to be on TV is the playoffs?

Things change rapidly in the college football landscape. If you had told me 10 years ago that UCONN would be co-champs of a BCS league, I’d have asked what you were smoking. If you had told me USF would be #2 in the country, would have a sold out Raymond James stadium for a huge national TV game, and would be facing Oregon in the Sun Bowl, I’d have asked you to have your head examined. Why shouldn’t Ga Southern or any other school set the bar high and see what happens? ECU is a perfect template for what Ga Southern could achieve at FCS. 45k per game, multiple national TV appearances, regular bowl games, increased visibility, etc.

If they have the ability to do it, I say go for it! Why not aim high?

[FCS Preview]

Not sure why you’re picking on the Motor City Bowl – it has largely been very successful. The Akron/Memphis and MTSU/CMU games the last couple years had outstanding crowds.

Defining a goal is only one aspect of a move to FBS. There is also increased stature and visibility.

Tell me: why was it seen as such a monumental upset – one for the ages – when App. State beat Michigan. Would it have been the same if East Carolina beat them? Nah, the Pirates have beaten Miami and other big-time programs in the past. What about Northern Illinois? Nah, they’ve beaten Alabama and other major BCS teams and ESPN didn’t have a field day over it. The reason App. State’s victory was so huge is the perception of FCS and the difference in stature between the 2 divisions.

Those who know football realize that App. State could compete with and beat ECU and/or N. Illinois most years. But because they are in FCS, they are viewed in an entirely different way from programs that should be their peers.

There are increasing opportunities every year in FBS. More TV slots from the multiple ESPN networks. More bowl games. More $$$$. I live near Washington, DC and this year I watched New Mexico State vs. Nevada on national TV. North Texas vs. ULL. MTSU vs. Louisville. I even saw Florida International slug it out with Miami. I saw FAU on national TV in their home stadium – small as it is – hosting USF. Why should FAU be hosting games on ESPN while the only chance App State, Delaware and Ga Southern have to be on TV is the playoffs?

Things change rapidly in the college football landscape. If you had told me 10 years ago that UCONN would be co-champs of a BCS league, I’d have asked what you were smoking. If you had told me USF would be #2 in the country, would have a sold out Raymond James stadium for a huge national TV game, and would be facing Oregon in the Sun Bowl, I’d have asked you to have your head examined. Why shouldn’t Ga Southern or any other school set the bar high and see what happens? ECU is a perfect template for what Ga Southern could achieve at FCS. 45k per game, multiple national TV appearances, regular bowl games, increased visibility, etc.

If they have the ability to do it, I say go for it! Why not aim high?

And like I said, if you want to change the focus of your program from one of winning championships to one of playing in meaningless bowl games, go ahead. I don't think the average major-college football fan could tell you who won the Liberty Bowl last year. Or the Holiday Bowl.

And if FBS ever gets off their asses and puts in a playoff system, you can be damn sure teams like GSU would never get a chance, unless like Hawai'i, they went undefeated.

[bandit]

And like I said, if you want to change the focus of your program from one of winning championships to one of playing in meaningless bowl games, go ahead. I don't think the average major-college football fan could tell you who won the Liberty Bowl last year. Or the Holiday Bowl.


I guess "meaningless" is in the eye of the beholder. I would imagine that most of the players and fans who have teams heading to bowl games in the coming weeks would dispute the notion that they are all meaningless, and only the LSU/Ohio State game really matters. If that's the case, why play them? It's all such meaningless rubbish, after all. Someone really must have fooled those TV suits and advertising execs that are pouring millions of $$$$ into these meaningless games.

And you think the average college football fans knows (or cares) who won the FCS, D-II, or D-III National Title?

[Tim James]

I dont know about the MWC imploding. I doubt TCU wants to go back to CUSA. I have no doubts BYU is unhappy but if the PAC 10 wont take them then they are screwed. Air Force could always go independent. I would love to see the Pac 10 take BYU and Utah but their commish said they wont expand.

As for CUSA its a complete cluster**** to me. I have no idea whats gonna happen there. The southwest conference reforming ? Nah I cant see that happening.

[citdog]

Air Force?xlolx xlolx xlolx


you think they want anything to do with you South Ga Clayeaters?xlolx


Think the Falcons are going to come to Pigs Ass, GA to play you?xlolx


y'all make me laugh!

[Cocky]

http://www.usajaguars.com/ViewArticle.dbml?DB_OEM_ID=8300&ATCLID=1349218

With USA announcing the move to football, the story told to JSU officials by the SunBelt are coming true. The likelyhood of expansion would increase if USA added football. A 10 team league is more of a scheduling nightmare than a 12 team league. USA annoucement will make a need for 2 teams. I know the SunBelt came out stating that no expansion was forthcoming but there were talks with JSU officials. Anyway today announcement will make a change in the landscape come 2013.

[pete4256]

And like I said, if you want to change the focus of your program from one of winning championships to one of playing in meaningless bowl games, go ahead. I don't think the average major-college football fan could tell you who won the Liberty Bowl last year. Or the Holiday Bowl.

And if FBS ever gets off their asses and puts in a playoff system, you can be damn sure teams like GSU would never get a chance, unless like Hawai'i, they went undefeated.

Well, since Hawaii, Utah, and Boise State have all gotten BCS bids in the last few years, I say that, yeah, non-"power six" conferences will have representation in a playoff, provided the field is large enough.

I also don't think they would have kept out undefeated teams of the past, such as Marshall, who finished in the so-called "top ten" at least once.

[pete4256]

Air Force?xlolx xlolx xlolx


you think they want anything to do with you South Ga Clayeaters?xlolx


Think the Falcons are going to come to Pigs Ass, GA to play you?xlolx


y'all make me laugh!

Who said anything about that?

[eaglesrthe1]

Pathetic but true!

Apples and Oranges. Titles are won every year and coverage gets made, however it's not every year that a FCS team beats a top 5 BCS team. Sort of an unique experience that certainly should receive an appropriate amount of coverage.

[appfan2008]

It is amazing to me how this thread has turned into the future of fbs conferences...

[AppMan]

Excellent post ...

GaSo ... Good luck fellow SOCON brothers ...

I hope you do it and I hope we follow.

Everyone who hates the move and anyone who thinks of a move just does not want to face the impact of you leaving their conference. If GaSo moves and APP does not we might as well hang it up. We will be stuck playing teams like Presby and Samford.

FU and Woff I do enjoy playing you guys. The future additions to the SOCON does not look promising.

Some of you say why move to a level that you can't win at. Since it is hard to win on this level lets just all move to D2 and kick ass cause chances are most in 1AA will not win a championship. So since we all can't win in basketball and football lets just go to some place where we can beat the **** out of everyone in every sport. Is that what you are saying folks? We should stay where we can win all the time? If that were the case lets go D2 and win all the time.

Agreed that when these D2 schools move up it is a great thing as people do say on here ... why is it such a pain in one's ass when we move to the FBS.

App will probably never win a basketball championship guess we better go D2 so we can win. Since the only thing that judges a good season is a championship.

I want to play Marshall and ECU on a regular basis so hate me ... I hear APPMAN and everyone else talking about that rivalry that I missed out on ..

I hear ya!

[ERASU2113]

I honestly see ASU looking into it once KBS and the majority of Athletics Enhancement Project is completed.

Especially if Ga. Southern moves up. I think a lot of members of the Yosef Club and Board of Trustees would push for it.

Already wanting to expand KBS more. Only time will tell though.

[dbackjon]

http://www.usajaguars.com/ViewArticle.dbml?DB_OEM_ID=8300&ATCLID=1349218

With USA announcing the move to football, the story told to JSU officials by the SunBelt are coming true. The likelyhood of expansion would increase if USA added football. A 10 team league is more of a scheduling nightmare than a 12 team league. USA annoucement will make a need for 2 teams. I know the SunBelt came out stating that no expansion was forthcoming but there were talks with JSU officials. Anyway today announcement will make a change in the landscape come 2013.

I was wondering if this would open a door for JSU...

[Cocky]

I was wondering if this would open a door for JSU...


I really believe it will open up the door for two teams at least. The SunBelt is about the only option for us or Georgia Southern to start out in FBS. CUSA isn't going to take a FCS team unless their basketball is very strong. The Big East would only take Villanova.

[dbackjon]

I really believe it will open up the door for two teams at least. The SunBelt is about the only option for us or Georgia Southern to start out in FBS. CUSA isn't going to take a FCS team unless their basketball is very strong. The Big East would only take Villanova.


Perusing the Troy board after the USA announcement, they seemed to think the same thing - and seemed to want to renew the JSU/Troy rivalry.

[Fresno St. Alum]

So UMass, Texas St., Ga. Southern, & Jacksonville St. are all looking at FBS. If the Belt took Jax St. & Ga. So. as football only members would the OVC & SoCon keep them for all other sports. Texas St. would be screwed? UMass MAC for football A-10 for all other sports like Temple?

How many of these will actually move to the FBS? thoughts?

[ERASU2113]

How many of these will actually move to the FBS? thoughts?

Not many, at least not all at once. I think the NCAA wants to limit or atleast slow down the movement of teams to a higher division.

I think they'll all move one day, but it'll gradually happen.

[Fresno St. Alum]

yeah there's a moratorium until 2011 how many of the 4 will move to the FBS soon after the moratorium is up?

[bandit]

I think several schools are going to use the moratorium as a period to adequately build and prepare for a move to 1-A. It's an opportunity to take it slowly and do it right. It seems like there is a mini-rush of schools either thinking about it or actively planning it - including a few who currently do not even have a team. It wouldn't surprise me to see a major shift towards 1-A by 2013-2015.

Every 1-AA team that makes the move will encourage another 1-AA to do the same, because they will likely be 1) losing a rival and 2) further devaluing the conference and 1-AA as a whole. The more top 1-AA programs make the jump, the more others are going to be afraid of being left behind.

[great2bmtneer]

I have the ability to see the future...its 2021 and here's how it goes...
ESPN (backpage)
The Buck Miller Sausage Bowl announced today that Georgia Southern from the Sunbelt Conference will play East Willingham School for the Arts on December 9th at 11am on CMT following Hee Haw, thus fullfilling GSU's dream of playing in a bowl game on the IA level.

[FCS Preview]

Well, since Hawaii, Utah, and Boise State have all gotten BCS bids in the last few years, I say that, yeah, non-"power six" conferences will have representation in a playoff, provided the field is large enough..

And I believe they were all undefeated, which is what I said in my post.

[ButlerGSU]

I have the ability to see the future...its 2021 and here's how it goes...
ESPN (backpage)
The Buck Miller Sausage Bowl announced today that Georgia Southern from the Sunbelt Conference will play East Willingham School for the Arts on December 9th at 11am on CMT following Hee Haw, thus fullfilling GSU's dream of playing in a bowl game on the IA level.

That's probably true, we'll be the story right above the FCS Championship article xsmiley_wix

[pete4256]

And I believe they were all undefeated, which is what I said in my post.

But you implied two things: 1) That going undefeated is a fluke. Not true. Almost every year a non power-six team goes undefeated. 2) That a non power-sic team with losses should have equal access. Why should they have equal access? Is the NCAA basketball tournament unfair because mid-majors don't get top seeds very often?

You tried to make it sound as though including undefeated non power-six teams is unfair somehow. I don't see your logic.

[pete4256]

Not many, at least not all at once. I think the NCAA wants to limit or atleast slow down the movement of teams to a higher division.

I think they'll all move one day, but it'll gradually happen.


If the NCAA really feels that way, then why don't they abolish the subdivisions and let conferences/teams decide how many scholarships they'd like to award and which postseason criteria they'd like to foot the bill for. It's so simple . . .

[OL FU]

xeyebrowx xeyebrowx You guys still in FCSxconfusedx xconfusedx


xwhistlex xwhistlex xwhistlex xsmiley_wix

[pete4256]

xeyebrowx xeyebrowx You guys still in FCSxconfusedx xconfusedx


xwhistlex xwhistlex xwhistlex xsmiley_wix

Not for the last couple of years. You haven't noticed?

[OL FU]

Not for the last couple of years. You haven't noticed?


I was thinking with the length of this thread, you should have moved on by nowxsmiley_wix

[pete4256]

I was thinking with the length of this thread, you should have moved on by nowxsmiley_wix

Let's see how long this thread is four years from now. :D

Personally, I'm not sure if we will move up, and from a football competition pov, I'm not sure I even want to.

[08Dawg]

You'll go from competitive to a non-issue. Plus, FBS is all about the money, FCS is for the love of the game!

[FCS Preview]

But you implied two things: 1) That going undefeated is a fluke. Not true. Almost every year a non power-six team goes undefeated. 2) That a non power-sic team with losses should have equal access. Why should they have equal access? Is the NCAA basketball tournament unfair because mid-majors don't get top seeds very often?

You tried to make it sound as though including undefeated non power-six teams is unfair somehow. I don't see your logic.

I didn't imply anything. I said, straight out...
And if FBS ever gets off their asses and puts in a playoff system, you can be damn sure teams like GSU would never get a chance, unless like Hawai'i, they went undefeated.if FBS ever institutes a playoff system, the non-BCS conferences will not get a bid, unless, like Hawai'i, they went undefeated. Do you think Hawai'i would have gotten a BCS bowl bid if they lost a single game this year? No freaking way.

[mtnman]

dont do it gsu will be like marshall maybe a good year or two but,will be at the bottom of bcs.go to some small bowl game at best,plus you have gt and uga to go up against bad move gsu

[pete4256]

I didn't imply anything. I said, straight out...if FBS ever institutes a playoff system, the non-BCS conferences will not get a bid, unless, like Hawai'i, they went undefeated. Do you think Hawai'i would have gotten a BCS bowl bid if they lost a single game this year? No freaking way.

Would Hawaii have deserved a BCS bid had they lost a game this year? I say probably not. You imply that this proves how flawed a possible playoff system would be. I say it doesn't.

But I'm not defending the BCS. It's a crock, and I'm frankly surprised that they let Hawaii, Boise, and Utah in at all. The system certainly screwed Tulane, Marshall, and others a decade ago.

[appfan2008]

You'll go from competitive to a non-issue. Plus, FBS is all about the money, FCS is for the love of the game!

and for winning!

[BearsCountry]

I'm frankly surprised that they let Hawaii, Boise, and Utah in at all. The system certainly screwed Tulane, Marshall, and others a decade ago.

Its bc Tulane and BYU went to Congress and threatened legally against it. And if a playoff situation would come along they would do the same thing to get included.

[catdaddy2402]

if FBS ever institutes a playoff system, the non-BCS conferences will not get a bid, unless, like Hawai'i, they went undefeated. Do you think Hawai'i would have gotten a BCS bowl bid if they lost a single game this year? No freaking way.
I doubt they would have this year because they would have fallen out of the criteria for qualifying.
However, they (or BYU for that matter) still could have secured a BCS at-large bid had UCLA beat USC and Arizona beat Arizona State, because that would have given UCLA te PAC10 championship and the BCS bid. Either the Warriers or Cougars would have then finished higher in the BCS rankings than the Bruins, and would have gotten an at-large bid.

[OL FU]

GSU should study staying put


The feasibility study results won't say that exactly, but that's what six months' research and several hundred single-spaced pages will amount to.

The study will lay out budgetary projections, taking into account scholarship increases, program additions and how much cash the Southern Boosters can expect to raise.

The report will recommend facility improvements to help meet the higher costs, and the wisdom of investing in a stadium expansion or field-house renovation.

It will include conference options, and the travel-cost projections for each prospective league.

And the dreamers among the Georgia Southern fan base won't like the results.

http://savannahnow.com/node/412443

[ButlerGSU]

http://savannahnow.com/node/412443

Although I believe anyone with any knowledge of I-A/I-AA will find plenty of holes in the article you posted I'll post GATA's response from TSCsports.com:

Adam Van Brimmer's two recent stories on GSU looking into FBS membership are both so full of mistakes and misinformation that they do not hold a shred of legitimacy. For a member of the media to intentionally pass on and fabricate misleading information is an example of what "bad journalism" can do to hinder growth and falsely steer the public's perception. Mr. Van Brimmer should be ashamed of his efforts.

In his story titled "Is GSU Ready for the Next Big Step", Mr. Van Brimmer makes an attempt at explaining why Title IX will be a deterrent for GSU moving up into FBS. His "gender equity requirements" calculation of 13.5-to-13.5 (men's to women's additional scholarships) is a stab-in-the-dark by someone who apparently doesn't have an idea of how Title IX requirements are calculated and established. He later changes his estimates to 22-to-22. I think Mr. Van Brimmer should spend time to learn more about Title IX and its ramifications if he's going to talk about them in a public forum.

Mr. Van Brimmer also expresses concern of whether GSU would be able to put together an FBS (I-A) schedule, including home games against FBS competition. He needs to look at all other programs that have moved from I-AA to I-A and realize that putting together a home schedule isn't that tough, as long as GSU has competent athletic administrators that know how to schedule games and that we move up in conjunction with joining a FBS conference. This is a non-issue should GSU decide to move up.

As far as increased travel expenses, Mr. Van Brimmer's assertion that travel in the Sunbelt or CUSA would be more expensive than the SoCon is correct. But he should look back twenty years to a conference GSU was a member of; the Trans America Athletic Conference (TAAC). Today, the TAAC is known as the Atlantic Sun. GSU sent teams to compete against TAAC members in Texas (San Antonio, Houston & Abilene), Louisiana (Monroe, Natchitoches & Hammond), Arkansas (Little Rock), Florida (DeLand & Orlando) and the closer sites of Birmingham, Atlanta and Macon. All this travel was done on budgets MUCH SMALLER than what GSU is operating on today. We had a lower per-student athletic fee for the 6,500 GSC students than the current fee assessed to our 17,000 students today. Travel is expensive, but it has always been costly. It is expensive for every collegiate athletic program, not just for GSU. Mr. Van Brimmer can't simply single out "travel expense" as a cause not to move our program from FCS to FBS because someone on campus throws that faux-excuse on the table. As a member of the press, he should explore what the costs are and how they compare to other universities as well as how they compare to GSU's own expenses from years past.

Mr. Van Brimmer's reference to Middle Tennessee State University was legitimate, but his referring to them as the "Blue Tide" instead of the correct name of "Blue Raiders" is inexcusable. Either Mr. Van Brimmer is a little sloppy in his fact gathering, or he doesn't care to proof his stories. Regardless of which it is, his mistakes tend to make his stories a little less weighty on the subjects he is addressing.


In Mr. Van Brimmer's second article, titled "GSU Should Study Staying Put", he says our athletic budget would have to "double or triple" in moving from FCS to FBS. It is apparent that Adam is simply relaying misinformation generated by individuals on our campus rather than facts. As a member of the press, Mr. Van Brimmer should do a little research and find out what our peer universities have for athletic budgets. Mind you, I'm not saying we compare ourselves to UGA, USC, GT, or other BCS schools, but rather schools in the Sunbelt and Mid America conferences. They are perceived as the "lower end" of FBS schools, and regardless of what you and I may think, this is the level GSU will initially have to start before moving higher up the FBS food chain. I think Mr. Van Brimmer will see that "double or triple" our current budget is a fairy tail dreamed up to discourage GSU from taking the step of moving up into FBS.

Ticket prices rising is a given. But so are income taxes, the sun rising every morning, and politicians telling lies. We all know ticket prices will rise, and most of us are willing to pay more to help our university achieve her goals.

Seat licenses? I don't know where this one came from. With the exception of the top twenty collegiate programs in the country, I don't know of any school that has initiated personal seat licenses (PSLs). I may be wrong, but I cannot fathom PSL's ever being used for assigning seats at Paulson Stadium . . . unless someone without ANY sense of reality decides to tackle moving up into the FBS without increasing student athletic fees. But, we don't have anyone that clueless or anti-growth on staff at GSU, do we?

I've never met Mr. Van Brimmer, but I'm sure he is a good person. I just think he decided to listen to one side of the argument and take the easy way out by not researching information readily available to him.

The entire study of GSU moving to FBS will be very political, and a lot of fans will not believe the results regardless of what the study's final report says. But, we all need to go into this level headed and not be swayed by misinformation, false reporting, and without intentional roadblocks (i.e. "no student fee increases allowed") being thrown into the mix throughout the process. We would all benefit from members of the press being objective and not becoming talking heads for either side during the process.

[OL FU]

Although I believe anyone with any knowledge of I-A/I-AA will find plenty of holes in the article you posted I'll post GATA's response from TSCsports.com:

Adam Van Brimmer's two recent stories on GSU looking into FBS membership are both so full of mistakes and misinformation that they do not hold a shred of legitimacy. For a member of the media to intentionally pass on and fabricate misleading information is an example of what "bad journalism" can do to hinder growth and falsely steer the public's perception. Mr. Van Brimmer should be ashamed of his efforts.

In his story titled "Is GSU Ready for the Next Big Step", Mr. Van Brimmer makes an attempt at explaining why Title IX will be a deterrent for GSU moving up into FBS. His "gender equity requirements" calculation of 13.5-to-13.5 (men's to women's additional scholarships) is a stab-in-the-dark by someone who apparently doesn't have an idea of how Title IX requirements are calculated and established. He later changes his estimates to 22-to-22. I think Mr. Van Brimmer should spend time to learn more about Title IX and its ramifications if he's going to talk about them in a public forum.

Mr. Van Brimmer also expresses concern of whether GSU would be able to put together an FBS (I-A) schedule, including home games against FBS competition. He needs to look at all other programs that have moved from I-AA to I-A and realize that putting together a home schedule isn't that tough, as long as GSU has competent athletic administrators that know how to schedule games and that we move up in conjunction with joining a FBS conference. This is a non-issue should GSU decide to move up.

As far as increased travel expenses, Mr. Van Brimmer's assertion that travel in the Sunbelt or CUSA would be more expensive than the SoCon is correct. But he should look back twenty years to a conference GSU was a member of; the Trans America Athletic Conference (TAAC). Today, the TAAC is known as the Atlantic Sun. GSU sent teams to compete against TAAC members in Texas (San Antonio, Houston & Abilene), Louisiana (Monroe, Natchitoches & Hammond), Arkansas (Little Rock), Florida (DeLand & Orlando) and the closer sites of Birmingham, Atlanta and Macon. All this travel was done on budgets MUCH SMALLER than what GSU is operating on today. We had a lower per-student athletic fee for the 6,500 GSC students than the current fee assessed to our 17,000 students today. Travel is expensive, but it has always been costly. It is expensive for every collegiate athletic program, not just for GSU. Mr. Van Brimmer can't simply single out "travel expense" as a cause not to move our program from FCS to FBS because someone on campus throws that faux-excuse on the table. As a member of the press, he should explore what the costs are and how they compare to other universities as well as how they compare to GSU's own expenses from years past.

Mr. Van Brimmer's reference to Middle Tennessee State University was legitimate, but his referring to them as the "Blue Tide" instead of the correct name of "Blue Raiders" is inexcusable. Either Mr. Van Brimmer is a little sloppy in his fact gathering, or he doesn't care to proof his stories. Regardless of which it is, his mistakes tend to make his stories a little less weighty on the subjects he is addressing.


In Mr. Van Brimmer's second article, titled "GSU Should Study Staying Put", he says our athletic budget would have to "double or triple" in moving from FCS to FBS. It is apparent that Adam is simply relaying misinformation generated by individuals on our campus rather than facts. As a member of the press, Mr. Van Brimmer should do a little research and find out what our peer universities have for athletic budgets. Mind you, I'm not saying we compare ourselves to UGA, USC, GT, or other BCS schools, but rather schools in the Sunbelt and Mid America conferences. They are perceived as the "lower end" of FBS schools, and regardless of what you and I may think, this is the level GSU will initially have to start before moving higher up the FBS food chain. I think Mr. Van Brimmer will see that "double or triple" our current budget is a fairy tail dreamed up to discourage GSU from taking the step of moving up into FBS.

Ticket prices rising is a given. But so are income taxes, the sun rising every morning, and politicians telling lies. We all know ticket prices will rise, and most of us are willing to pay more to help our university achieve her goals.

Seat licenses? I don't know where this one came from. With the exception of the top twenty collegiate programs in the country, I don't know of any school that has initiated personal seat licenses (PSLs). I may be wrong, but I cannot fathom PSL's ever being used for assigning seats at Paulson Stadium . . . unless someone without ANY sense of reality decides to tackle moving up into the FBS without increasing student athletic fees. But, we don't have anyone that clueless or anti-growth on staff at GSU, do we?

I've never met Mr. Van Brimmer, but I'm sure he is a good person. I just think he decided to listen to one side of the argument and take the easy way out by not researching information readily available to him.

The entire study of GSU moving to FBS will be very political, and a lot of fans will not believe the results regardless of what the study's final report says. But, we all need to go into this level headed and not be swayed by misinformation, false reporting, and without intentional roadblocks (i.e. "no student fee increases allowed") being thrown into the mix throughout the process. We would all benefit from members of the press being objective and not becoming talking heads for either side during the process.


I think I have made it clear before, I don't have a position on a possible move by GSU to FBS. I think it is up to each individual school and best of luck in their decision. Each school must decide their appropriate place in collegiate athletics.

I posted for discussion purposes onlyxnodx

[WUTNDITWAA]

I think I have made it clear before, I don't have a position on a possible move by GSU to FBS. I think it is up to each individual school and best of luck in their decision. Each school must decide their appropriate place in collegiate athletics.

I posted for discussion purposes onlyxnodx

Hmmm. If I were a Georgia Southern fan I woud no longer pay any attention to anyone with "Van" in his last name. xreadx

[ButlerGSU]

Hmmm. If I were a Georgia Southern fan I woud no longer pay any attention to anyone with "Van" in his last name. xreadx

No kidding!

The article did bring out several good points from Troy though...

The similarities go deeper. Troy played in a cozy, 17,500-seat facility similar to Paulson Stadium. Williams lacked deep-pocketed donors. Almost every Trojan fan was either an Alabama, Auburn or Florida State fan first.

Troy went undefeated its first season of I-AA competition and finished the regular season ranked No. 1. The Trojans made the playoffs six of the next seven years.

And in 1998, the school launched its own feasibility study.

"The recommendation was[B] not to go," Williams said. "But the (Board of Regents) went in and said, 'No, we're going to make this move.'"

Fortunately for Williams, the glamour of Division I-A appealed to sponsors and alumni. Money poured in. The school renovated the stadium, bumping it up to 30,000 seats and adding luxury boxes.

Williams found that he could expand Troy's marketing reach from a 25-mile radius as a I-AA school to 100 miles at the I-A level.

"You looked at the raw data, and there was not enough there to do what we needed to do. It was scary," Williams said. "But our support doubled from people we never targeted before."

Troy attracted attention with its schedule, playing Miami, Nebraska and Mississippi State in its first season as a I-A school and more heavyweights - Kansas State, Missouri, Arkansas, Minnesota, Virginia, Louisiana State, South Carolina, Florida State, Georgia Tech, Georgia - in the years to come.

This fall, Troy defeated Oklahoma State on its home field in an ESPN Thursday night game.

Troy's fans still might root for Alabama, Auburn and FSU, but now they're Trojans fans first.

"I-A is a pretty good deal ... if you get there," Williams said. "But the numbers can be daunting."

[BigApp]

reading through some older posts....man, there are some geographically challenged individuals on here.

Dallas, TX=Southwest
Dallas, NC=Southeast (as well as Dallas, GA)

[walliver]

http://savannahnow.com/node/412443


The people doing the study will tell GSU administration exactly what they want to here. The results will be spun by all involved to support their viewpoints, and the school administration will do whatever it is they have already decided to do.

If ASU announces a move, GSU will be forced to follow. I expect ASU to move, and I suspect that GSU is laying plans to move when that happens (otherwise marauding Eagle fans will begin lynching athletic officials until the school commits to move, and then they would be forced to rush a move without enough planning).

[Baldy]

No kidding!

The article did bring out several good points from Troy though...

The similarities go deeper. Troy played in a cozy, 17,500-seat facility similar to Paulson Stadium. Williams lacked deep-pocketed donors. Almost every Trojan fan was either an Alabama, Auburn or Florida State fan first.

Troy went undefeated its first season of I-AA competition and finished the regular season ranked No. 1. The Trojans made the playoffs six of the next seven years.

And in 1998, the school launched its own feasibility study.

"The recommendation was[B] not to go," Williams said. "But the (Board of Regents) went in and said, 'No, we're going to make this move.'"

Fortunately for Williams, the glamour of Division I-A appealed to sponsors and alumni. Money poured in. The school renovated the stadium, bumping it up to 30,000 seats and adding luxury boxes.

Williams found that he could expand Troy's marketing reach from a 25-mile radius as a I-AA school to 100 miles at the I-A level.

"You looked at the raw data, and there was not enough there to do what we needed to do. It was scary," Williams said. "But our support doubled from people we never targeted before."

Troy attracted attention with its schedule, playing Miami, Nebraska and Mississippi State in its first season as a I-A school and more heavyweights - Kansas State, Missouri, Arkansas, Minnesota, Virginia, Louisiana State, South Carolina, Florida State, Georgia Tech, Georgia - in the years to come.

This fall, Troy defeated Oklahoma State on its home field in an ESPN Thursday night game.

Troy's fans still might root for Alabama, Auburn and FSU, but now they're Trojans fans first.

"I-A is a pretty good deal ... if you get there," Williams said. "But the numbers can be daunting."

Just to add some facts that the Troy AD has failed to give:

1. There wasn't money "pouring in" from alumni. The overwhelming majority of the money to finance the move for them came from one person, Richard Scrushy, of HealthSouth fame. He is now in federal prison serving time for bribery and fraud. He told the officials at Troy that if they didn't move to I-A, he would take his money elsewhere. BTW, he isn't a grad of Troy, he went to UAB.

2. Troy's stadium is not theirs. It is owned by the city of Troy and was financed almost entirely by the sale of the local hospital. On top of that, they have to share it with the local high school team.

[Cocky]

Just to add some facts that the Troy AD has failed to give:

1. There wasn't money "pouring in" from alumni. The overwhelming majority of the money to finance the move for them came from one person, Richard Scrushy, of HealthSouth fame. He is now in federal prison serving time for bribery and fraud. He told the officials at Troy that if they didn't move to I-A, he would take his money elsewhere. BTW, he isn't a grad of Troy, he went to UAB.

2. Troy's stadium is not theirs. It is owned by the city of Troy and was financed almost entirely by the sale of the local hospital. On top of that, they have to share it with the local high school team.

Scrushy's wife was the Troy grad. Scrushy was on the BOT but left to join the University of Alabama System's BOT. This includes the Birmingham, Huntsville, and Tuscaloosa campuses.

[JDC325]

We are not the ones talking about going up.

You should look into moving down, if you ever want a NC flag much less 6 waving over your stadium.

[JDC325]

You should research before you post. Georgia Southern has higher average freshmen SAT scores than a number of Big East schools including #1 West Virginia, as far as market we are 40 minutes from Savannah and slightly over an hour from Augusta which is the second and third largest cities in Georgia respectively.


You really expect the zealots, haters, and sour grapes morons on here to actually research rather than spouting hate and ignorance. xeyebrowx You have posted long enough on here to know better.

[mrklean]

I love the GSU HATE!!!!!!!!!!!!

Keep it comming!!!!!

[FCS Preview]

I love the GSU HATE!!!!!!!!!!!!

Keep it comming!!!!!

So people who point out the negatives -- such as never winning another NC, struggling to have winning seasons, having the post-season consist of the Holiday Bowl or the Liberty Bowl instead of the playoffs, are GSU haters???? Or just realists?

[Lehigh Football Nation]

Mr. Van Brimmer also expresses concern of whether GSU would be able to put together an FBS (I-A) schedule, including home games against FBS competition. He needs to look at all other programs that have moved from I-AA to I-A and realize that putting together a home schedule isn't that tough, as long as GSU has competent athletic administrators that know how to schedule games and that we move up in conjunction with joining a FBS conference. This is a non-issue should GSU decide to move up.

All these things described here are HARDLY givens. C-USA or the Sun Belch hasnt' said they would take GSU.

And look around: finding home games are not always easy. Look how long Arkansas State has been FBS, and last year they had OOC home games against such "luminaries" as SMU and Memphis.


As far as increased travel expenses, Mr. Van Brimmer's assertion that travel in the Sunbelt or CUSA would be more expensive than the SoCon is correct. But he should look back twenty years to a conference GSU was a member of; the Trans America Athletic Conference (TAAC). Today, the TAAC is known as the Atlantic Sun.... All this travel was done on budgets MUCH SMALLER than what GSU is operating on today... As a member of the press, he should explore what the costs are and how they compare to other universities as well as how they compare to GSU's own expenses from years past.

Of course, you're ignoring that football was a I-AA independent at that time and the TAAC was a much different league then, with schools like Oklahoma City University (now in NAIA) and Hardin-Simmons (now D-III). I'm also banking that there are a lot fewer sports to consider back then in comparison to now in terms of Title IX. Taking figures from twenty years ago simply are impossible to do in context here.


In Mr. Van Brimmer's second article, titled "GSU Should Study Staying Put", he says our athletic budget would have to "double or triple" in moving from FCS to FBS. It is apparent that Adam is simply relaying misinformation generated by individuals on our campus rather than facts. As a member of the press, Mr. Van Brimmer should do a little research and find out what our peer universities have for athletic budgets. Mind you, I'm not saying we compare ourselves to UGA, USC, GT, or other BCS schools, but rather schools in the Sunbelt and Mid America conferences... I think Mr. Van Brimmer will see that "double or triple" our current budget is a fairy tail dreamed up to discourage GSU from taking the step of moving up into FBS.

Lucky for you, I did just this.

Troy Athletics Expenses: $13,089,969
Marshall Athletics Expenses: $18,965,635

GSU Athletics Expenses: $6,415,730

This ain't no "fairy tale", Virginia.


I've never met Mr. Van Brimmer, but I'm sure he is a good person. I just think he decided to listen to one side of the argument and take the easy way out by not researching information readily available to him.

The entire study of GSU moving to FBS will be very political, and a lot of fans will not believe the results regardless of what the study's final report says. But, we all need to go into this level headed and not be swayed by misinformation, false reporting, and without intentional roadblocks (i.e. "no student fee increases allowed") being thrown into the mix throughout the process. We would all benefit from members of the press being objective and not becoming talking heads for either side during the process.

Let's recap: he said that:
* scheduling could be difficult. This has been borne out by Arkansas State this year and in years past.
* increased travel expenses. You admit this is correct.
* budgets could double (vis-a-vis Troy) or triple (vis-a-vis Marshall). This is true based on the EADA report numbers.

So your claim that he has been spouting "misinformation and false reporting" is completely and utterly baseless.

[Baltimore Hen]

It is important to note this is only a study, it present goals for our program and outline a plan to move forward in the future. It is not an automatic assumption that we will move up. However, it is a real possibility depending on a conference fit.

You would be Sunbelt. No room in the ACC, No room in the SEC. Maybe Conference USA, but any way you slice it, it is a bad move.

[yosef1969]

You would be Sunbelt. No room in the ACC, No room in the SEC. Maybe Conference USA, but any way you slice it, it is a bad move.
True, that is if you are looking at the current alignment. Moratorium in place for 4 years and IMHO changes are afoot.

[mathman]

You should research before you post. Georgia Southern has higher average freshmen SAT scores than a number of Big East schools including #1 West Virginia, as far as market we are 40 minutes from Savannah and slightly over an hour from Augusta which is the second and third largest cities in Georgia respectively.


You really expect the zealots, haters, and sour grapes morons on here to actually research rather than spouting hate and ignorance. xeyebrowx You have posted long enough on here to know better.
But do you seriously think the Big East will snap up Georgia Southern? Georgia Southern doesn't match with Big East schools in terms of level and amount of research. University presidents want conference members to be peer institutions. How much research does Georgia Southern do annually? As far as I know, Georgia Southern doesn't have an endowment even close to the other Big East schools.

And the Augusta and Savannah metros combined is around 700,000 and both are a fair drive. About 80 and 50 miles respectively. And some of those metro areas extend into SC. Statesboro is not a big market. I agree that Georgia Southern's situation is more akin to Troy U. I think the Sun Belt is more likely and the schools there are similar. If schools like Memphis and UCF (and even FAU and FIU assuming FIU can improve its football as well) can improve their academics, they'd be fine for the Big East

[soweagle]

This is a study, nothing more and nothing less. GSU has not annouced we are changing divisions. All we are doing is studying the options. I know many of you find it insane that a school might actually want to investigate the possiblilites of other options and for that we apologize for being so proactive. I completely understand how our admin. should take advice from rival schools on how we should plan for the future of GSU.

[OL FU]

I completely understand how our admin. should take advice from rival schools on how we should plan for the future of GSU.


My advice - extend the summer break until Decemberxnodx







xsmiley_wix xsmiley_wix xsmiley_wix

[mrklean]

But do you seriously think the Big East will snap up Georgia Southern? Georgia Southern doesn't match with Big East schools in terms of level and amount of research. University presidents want conference members to be peer institutions. How much research does Georgia Southern do annually? As far as I know, Georgia Southern doesn't have an endowment even close to the other Big East schools.

And the Augusta and Savannah metros combined is around 700,000 and both are a fair drive. About 80 and 50 miles respectively. And some of those metro areas extend into SC. Statesboro is not a big market. I agree that Georgia Southern's situation is more akin to Troy U. I think the Sun Belt is more likely and the schools there are similar. If schools like Memphis and UCF (and even FAU and FIU assuming FIU can improve its football as well) can improve their academics, they'd be fine for the Big East

NOt so fast. 60% of GSU alumni reside in the Atlanta area.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

NOt so fast. 60% of GSU alumni reside in the Atlanta area.

The Big East will take UMass before GSU. Bank on it.

[flyenhigh]

***THIS JUST IN****

I think that it's a great move. Most others are just jealous. Who is to say that they will be mediocre??? I can come up with many examples that would defeat that claim. But even if they are mediocre in most ways, it is better than being the best in FCS. There is so much more potential in the big boy's league. I think it is ashame so many on this board are knocking a great thing. Just proves how hard headed and brainwashed many of you are.

Congrats!!

[flyenhigh]

You would be Sunbelt. No room in the ACC, No room in the SEC. Maybe Conference USA, but any way you slice it, it is a bad move.

JUST A LITTLE HEADS UP FOR EVERYONE. FBS IS TEN TIMES BETTER THAN THE FCS.

WHY ALL THE HATE??? IT IS DRIVING ME INSANE!!!!!!!!! THIS IS A GRRREAT MOVE ANY WAY YOU SLICE IT.

NOBODY GIVES TWO SHI*** ABOUT FCS EXCEPT A SMALL GROUP OF US.

xnonox xnonox xnonox xnonox xnonox xconfusedx xconfusedx xconfusedx xconfusedx xoopsx xoopsx xoopsx xoopsx xoopsx

[MarkCCU]

JUST A LITTLE HEADS UP FOR EVERYONE. FBS IS TEN TIMES BETTER THAN THE FCS.

WHY ALL THE HATE??? IT IS DRIVING ME INSANE!!!!!!!!! THIS IS A GRRREAT MOVE ANY WAY YOU SLICE IT.

NOBODY GIVES TWO SHI*** ABOUT FCS EXCEPT A SMALL GROUP OF US.

xnonox xnonox xnonox xnonox xnonox xconfusedx xconfusedx xconfusedx xconfusedx xoopsx xoopsx xoopsx xoopsx xoopsx


xconfusedx xconfusedx xconfusedx xconfusedx xconfusedx xconfusedx xconfusedx

[FCS Preview]

***THIS JUST IN****

I think that it's a great move. Most others are just jealous. Who is to say that they will be mediocre??? I can come up with many examples that would defeat that claim. But even if they are mediocre in most ways, it is better than being the best in FCS. There is so much more potential in the big boy's league. I think it is ashame so many on this board are knocking a great thing. Just proves how hard headed and brainwashed many of you are.

Congrats!!

Jealous? I don't think so.

I have no desire to see my alma mater in the Liberty Bowl or Holiday Bowl. I want to see them make the playoffs and have a reasonable chance to win a national title, not a zero chance.

If GSU is playing in the Holiday bowl, and Southern Illinois is winning the FCS National Championship, do you think SIU fans will be thinking..."Damn, this is nice, but I so wish we could be like Georgia Southern and playing in the Holiday Bowl..."?

Seriously doubt it.

[citdog]

JUST A LITTLE HEADS UP FOR EVERYONE. FBS IS TEN TIMES BETTER THAN THE FCS.

WHY ALL THE HATE??? IT IS DRIVING ME INSANE!!!!!!!!! THIS IS A GRRREAT MOVE ANY WAY YOU SLICE IT.

NOBODY GIVES TWO SHI*** ABOUT FCS EXCEPT A SMALL GROUP OF US.

xnonox xnonox xnonox xnonox xnonox xconfusedx xconfusedx xconfusedx xconfusedx xoopsx xoopsx xoopsx xoopsx xoopsx

and "raymond shaw is the, bravest, kindest, gentlest, most caring human being you have met in your entire life."


right?

[soweagle]

The Big East will take UMass before GSU. Bank on it.

I agree. If Umass chooses to move they will have an easier time than most schools not b/c of football but b/c of other sports and location. IMHO, the Sumbelt is the only choice for GSU. The goal should be to eventually move out of the Sunbelt to a better conference. However, we have no idea what the landscape will be in several years. GSU might fall on its face and stay in the Sunbelt for 30 years or the Sunbelt might become a good confernce in that time frame. It is certainly a gamble if GSU decides to change divisions but I'm glad they are studying the possibility.

[phillyAPP]

I agree. If Umass chooses to move they will have an easier time than most schools not b/c of football but b/c of other sports and location. IMHO, the Sumbelt is the only choice for GSU. The goal should be to eventually move out of the Sunbelt to a better conference. However, we have no idea what the landscape will be in several years. GSU might fall on its face and stay in the Sunbelt for 30 years or the Sunbelt might become a good confernce in that time frame. It is certainly a gamble if GSU decides to change divisions but I'm glad they are studying the possibility.


This is a FEASIBILITY STUDY, there maybe alot going on in the next 4 years. Maybe the NCAA put the moritorium on because they plan on something changing? MAYBE GSU wants to be ready?

Many other schools will be doing STUDIES in the next few years. That does not mean the school is BAD or WRONG.

LIVE and LET LIVE.

[citdog]

That does not mean the school is BAD or WRONG.



GSU is BAD! AND WRONG TOO!xnodx

[phillyAPP]

GSU is BAD! AND WRONG TOO!xnodx

OK--- For you, they can be BAD and WRONG and probibly more :D

[FCS_pwns_FBS]

Wow...when Western Kentucky, FIU, and FAU just up and left the division for the FBS there was barely any discussion on AGS about it. Then GSU begins a feasibility study (and at that one that was started by an indifferent administration only after tireless begging by boosters and fans) and you have a 40-something page thread.

xlolx

[OL FU]

Wow...when Western Kentucky, FIU, and FAU just up and left the division for the FBS there was barely any discussion on AGS about it. Then GSU begins a feasibility study (and at that one that was started by an indifferent administration only after tireless begging by boosters and fans) and you have a 40-something page thread.

xlolx

You guys sure like to talk about yourself:p xrotatehx xsmiley_wix

[WMTribe90]

I'll offer my two scents based on the recent history of IAA schools that have made the jump in the last decade or so. It appears to be me that there are two primary factors that will determine the success of a move from IAA to IA.

1) Would the IAA school be the first public (non-religious) IA school in its home state?

and/or

2) Would the IAA school immediately ascend to a spot in a BCS conference?

In recent years, I think all the schools that have achieved long-term success as IAs, after jumpting from IAA, have met one or both of these criteria.

A few examples...

BSU vs IU- Idaho bleeds orange and blue. BSU is the state's flagship program and receives great support because of it. The Vandals represent the flip side in my argument. Idaho made the move in an effort to keep pace with their in-state rivalry. Ego's got the better of their judgement and Idaho is a joke in IA that is barely a blip on the radar. They are neither in a BCS conference or the state's flagship program.

Marshall vs UConn - UConn was an average program at the IAA level, but has made a successful transition because they were guaranteed a sopt in the BCS (Big East). This gave them instant creditabilty and assured them of marqee opponents at home. Marshall was wildly successful in IAA, but has fallen on hard times after some initial IA success. Marshall has no natural rivals and a bloated travel budget in CUSA and will never surpass WVU as the flagship program in the state. Marshall's attedace has dipped below its IAA levels, IA affilaition is no substitute for winning when it comes to fan support.

There are a handful of IAA programs that could successfully make the jump, if they were commited to it:

UD - Would be the state'sfagship program. Has a large enrollment and would be a decent candidate for eventual Big East expansion.

Montana - Would become the state's IA flagship program and increase tis already impressive attendance regardless of conference affiliation.

UMass - Good candidate for BE expansion and would be the IA (public)
flagship program in Mass. BC as a Catholic school has more of niche following that does not equate to widespread support or envoke state-pride.

Villanova - Like UConn would have a ready made home in the Big East.

So, based on the two criteria above, I would guess the chances of GSU achieving long term success as a IA are very low. They would be third in line in-state behind GT and UG for fan support and are not a likely candidate for a BCS spot. In addition, they would lose traditional rivalries and bring in teams from a larger geographical footprint that will not bring large numbers of visiting fans. Games with marqee opponents will most likely be on the road. I don't care too much either way, but it looks like a bad move to me. No hate, just an objective view from an outside party.

Qualifiers:

Criteria #1 does not apply to states that had more than one IA program in existence prior to roughly 1990 (i.e., UVA and VT, Penn State and Pitt). These schools and rivalries were established before the BCS hierachy came into being and before IA football reached market saturation.

A possible exception to this rule could be IAA programs making the move in football rich states like FL or TX. IMO it hasn't happened yet, but it will be interesting to see if a FAU or FIU can achieve prolonged success by capturing in-state talent that would otherwise escape to BCS teams in other states. My guess is still no.

IMO, a successful jump entails no financail hardship (i.e., no hemoragging cash) as well as winning football games.

[mrklean]

I wonder if USF, Bosie St. and Uconn regret moving up???

[JDC325]

Umm....Georgia is a football rich state. Do some research homeboy, it is usually in the top five in recruits and even ESPN ranked GA, which is dwarfed in population by many states, as a top five football state. Look at the rosters of border FBS and FCS programs. BTW GSU has never had a problem pulling Florida talent either. I guess GSU has just been lucky to be most sucessfull FCS program all time and not be in a football rich state.

[WMTribe90]

I wonder if USF, Bosie St. and Uconn regret moving up???

Read my above post. There are reasons these schools succeeded where the majority fail:

BSU: State flagship program located in large city.

USF: BCS mebership in a state that was exporting alot of DIA talent.

UConn: BCS membership and the state flagship program.

GSU: No BCS membership, not going to be the state falgship, and not located in a large city.

[FCS Preview]

Umm....Georgia is a football rich state. Do some research homeboy, it is usually in the top five in recruits and even ESPN ranked GA, which is dwarfed in population by many states, as a top five football state. Look at the rosters of border FBS and FCS programs. BTW GSU has never had a problem pulling Florida talent either.

His point was not talent, but whether a state already split by Georgia Tech and UGa would have room for GSU? Would people stop being a fan of one of the other schools to root for the Eagles? Especially if they are in a minor conference or an independent.

[JDC325]

Boise a large city? OK....xlolx I know Statesboro is much smaller but I bet there are more people with in hour of Statesboro than within one hour of Boise.

[JDC325]

His point was not talent, but whether a state already split by Georgia Tech and UGa would have room for GSU? Would people stop being a fan of one of the other schools to root for the Eagles? Especially if they are in a minor conference or an independent.

Dooooooom and Gloooooooom. How in the world did USF or UCF ever get any fans. I mean with UF, FSU and UM their was nobody left to cheer for yet another program. xcoffeex

[WMTribe90]

Umm....Georgia is a football rich state. Do some research homeboy, it is usually in the top five in recruits and even ESPN ranked GA, which is dwarfed in population by many states, as a top five football state. Look at the rosters of border FBS and FCS programs. BTW GSU has never had a problem pulling Florida talent either.

Never said Georgia wasn't a football rich state "homeboy". Doesn't change the fact the GSU would neither be a BCS conference member or the state's flagship program. Name a program that has moved up from IAA to IA within the last decade that has achieved prolonged success that fails to meet either criteria and get back to me.

PS Georgia is talent rich, but how much of that talent do you figure GSU will land after GT, UG, and the rest of the ACC/BE teams take their cut?

[FCS Preview]

Boise a large city? OK....xlolx I know Statesboro is much smaller but I bet there are more people with in hour of Statesboro than within one hour of Boise.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boise_metropolitan_area


The metro area is currently the fourth largest in the Pacific Northwest (after Seattle, Portland and Vancouver)


and from the census: http://www.census.gov/population/cen2000/phc-t29/tab01a.pdf

The Boise area ranks 97th in the USA; Statesboro, 543rd.

[JDC325]

Never said Georgia wasn't a football rich state "homeboy". Doesn't change the fact the GSU would neither be a BCS conference member or the state's flagship program. Name a program that has moved up from IAA to IA within the last decade that has achieved prolonged success that fails to meet either criteria and get back to me.

PS Georgia is talent rich, but how much of that talent do you figure GSU will land after GT, UG, and the rest of the ACC/BE teams take their cut?


Not much at first but that would change over time with sucess and building. I think it goes without saying that most kids will give any instate program the edge over an out of state program. You guys act like Boise, USF, did not have to struggle. Boise relies on California kids which GSU would not even have to leave the state to field a good team and USF did not start in the Big East. Point being we have a bunch of nastradumasses spouting biased sour grapes opinions without any research. GSU is not Boise nor is it UL Lafayette. It is GSU period. NOBODY on here can predict the success level GSU will reach or how long it will take. However to say that the state of GA does not have room for another successful FBS team is just asinine and ignorant of the facts.

[JDC325]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boise_metropolitan_area



and from the census: http://www.census.gov/population/cen2000/phc-t29/tab01a.pdf

The Boise area ranks 97th in the USA; Statesboro, 543rd.

I guess reading and comprehension is not your strong point. xlolx I said within ONE hour which would include both Savannah and Augusta not to mention all the smaller town in between.

[FCS Preview]

NOBODY on here can predict the success level GSU will reach or how long it will take. However to say that the state of GA does not have room for another successful FBS team is just asinine and ignorant of the facts.

OK, but from your point of view, what would you consider 'success' for a school like GSU at the FBS level, assuming they are not invited to join a BCS league?

[WMTribe90]

Boise a large city? OK.... I know Statesboro is much smaller but I bet there are more people with in hour of Statesboro than within one hour of Boise.

I lived in Boise for a year. The city itself is much larger than Statesboro and the western suburbs a exploding and expansive. Boise metro area population is over one-half million and all living within 35 to 45 minutes of the stadium.


His point was not talent, but whether a state already split by Georgia Tech and UGa would have room for GSU? Would people stop being a fan of one of the other schools to root for the Eagles? Especially if they are in a minor conference or an independent.

Correct. Will the casual college football fan living in Atlanta choose to drive to Statesboro to watch GSU play North Texas or stay close to home and attend GT versus (insert ACC foe here)?

[FCS Preview]

I guess reading and comprehension is not your strong point. xlolx I said within ONE hour which would include both Savannah and Augusta not to mention all the smaller town in between.

You said you didn't consider them a large city -- they are the 4th largest metro area in the Pacific Northwest.

They may not be Chicago, Boston or NY, but large enough for that part of the country...

and the largest city within an hour of Statesboro is Savannah, I think...which even combined with Statesboro is not as large as the Boise metro area...Augusta, according to Yahoo maps is 80 miles, approximately 90 mins, from Statesboro.

http://maps.yahoo.com/#mvt=m&lat=32.96399&lon=-81.922315&mag=9&q1=statesboro%2C%20ga&q2=augusta%2C%20ga

[mathman]

NOt so fast. 60% of GSU alumni reside in the Atlanta area.
60% of what? How many is that? And Atlanta is over 200 miles from Statesboro. I live in Atlanta and there is barely any mention about Georgia Southern in the press. There was a lot of talk and news coverage when Erk Russell was there but that was due to the newness of the program and UGA had just come off a national championship where Russell was the defensive coordinator. Russell's success there also firgured in but it was more about Russell than Georgia Southern. Since then it had died down...a lot. The Georgia Southern alumni base in Atlanta is not generating a big demand for the media to cover Georgia Southern sports.

If Georgia Southern goes FBS, I'll guess that it will generate renewed interest by Atlanta sports news because it will be something new but will gradually be drowned out by UGA and Tech. Winning will obviously help but I think Georgia Tech and especially UGA supporters won't like any attention diverted from them. I doubt Georgia Southern will ever have a significant part of the Atlanta market. The local media have little air time for sports and even Clarke Atlanta and Morehouse don't get much coverage. And if Georgia State and Kennesaw State start football (the former more likely), there will be even less room for Georgia Southern.

[WMTribe90]

Not much at first but that would change over time with sucess and building. I think it goes without saying that most kids will give any instate program the edge over an out of state program. You guys act like Boise, USF, did not have to struggle. Boise relies on California kids which GSU would not even have to leave the state to field a good team and USF did not start in the Big East. Point being we have a bunch of nastradumasses spouting biased sour grapes opinions without any research. GSU is not Boise nor is it UL Lafayette. It is GSU period. NOBODY on here can predict the success level GSU will reach or how long it will take. However to say that the state of GA does not have room for another successful FBS team is just asinine and ignorant of the facts.

Hey, all I did was take an objective look at recent history of other IAA programs that have tried to make the jump. Some succeeded and other didn't. I found what I considered to be two successfull criteria for a successful jump and none of the subsequent posters have discredited my hypothesis. I never said GSU was doomed to fail in this endeavor. All I said was that based on an objective view of history and the facts surrounding it, GSU would appear to have a low probability of success. I would argue your empassioned response is the one void of facts and objectivity, which is uderstandable given your point of view as a GSU fan.

If success for you is defined as middle of the pack IA with occassional trips to second and third tier bowl games than God's speed and best of luck. I just hope GSU approaches this endeavor with realistic expectations.

[JDC325]

You said you didn't consider them a large city -- they are the 4th largest metro area in the Pacific Northwest.

They may not be Chicago, Boston or NY, but large enough for that part of the country...

and the largest city within an hour of Statesboro is Savannah, I think...which even combined with Statesboro is not as large as the Boise metro area...Augusta, according to Yahoo maps is 80 miles, approximately 90 mins, from Statesboro.

http://maps.yahoo.com/#mvt=m&lat=32.96399&lon=-81.922315&mag=9&q1=statesboro%2C%20ga&q2=augusta%2C%20ga

First of all it is quite apparent you know nothing of football in the South and anything about GT. Second less than 500K, are you kidding there are more people in my county than all of the Boise metro area. Point is Boise is SMALL and NOT BIG. Yeah and yahoo maps thinks folks actually do the speed limit. My TomTom has it taking 4+ hours for me to make it to Statesboro but I usually make it right at 3 hours.

[mathman]

Dooooooom and Gloooooooom. How in the world did USF or UCF ever get any fans. I mean with UF, FSU and UM their was nobody left to cheer for yet another program. xcoffeex

USF is in Tampa, about 2.7 million people and has 45,000 students. UCF is in Orlando, with about 2.6 million people, and has almost 50,000 students.

Georgia Southern's situation is more like that of Troy's. It's doable at the FBS level but long term prospects for a national championship is poor unless the BCS system is changed.

[JDC325]

Hey, all I did was take an objective look at recent history of other IAA programs that have tried to make the jump. Some succeeded and other didn't. I found what I considered to be two successfull criteria for a successful jump and none of the subsequent posters have discredited my hypothesis. I never said GSU was doomed to fail in this endeavor. All I said was that based on an objective view of history and the facts surrounding it, GSU would appear to have a low probability of success. I would argue your empassioned response is the one void of facts and objectivity, which is uderstandable given your point of view as a GSU fan.

If success for you is defined as middle of the pack IA with occassional trips to second and third tier bowl games than God's speed and best of luck. I just hope GSU approaches this endeavor with realistic expectations.


Sorry for jumping down your throat but all the naysayers, FCS zealots, and lets be honest the SOUR GRAPES jealous A-HOLES are getting on my nerves. BTW being a middle of the pack FBS team is light years ahead of anything in the FCS can offer a school like GSU. Look up average FBS numbers and it ain't even close to what ANY FCS team could ever hope for. Whether the kool aid drinkers on here want to admit it or not there is a limit to how much you can grow in the FCS and to anyone outside of the FCS world there is DIV I and everything else is DIV II and schools especially in the South suffer because of it. At some point it is just time to move on whether that is five years away or 10 GSU will move and rightly so. I do not expect folks that did not attend GSU to know just how much that school has grown in all aspects in the last 25 years and how bright the future looks, just like I do not expect 99% of the rest of the football world to give to sheatts about FCS football or people on this board to be realistic about the relavance of FCS football to the average alumni or student.

[FCS Preview]

First of all it is quite apparent you know nothing of football in the South and anything about GT. Second less than 500K, are you kidding there are more people in my county than all of the Boise metro area. Point is Boise is SMALL and NOT BIG. Yeah and yahoo maps thinks folks actually do the speed limit. My TomTom has it taking 4+ hours for me to make it to Statesboro but I usually make it right at 3 hours.

And my county has a higher population than 11 states. But you don't count, because you're more than an hour from Statesboro. :D

[JDC325]

USF is in Tampa, about 2.7 million people and has 45,000 students. UCF is in Orlando, with about 2.6 million people, and has almost 50,000 students.

Georgia Southern's situation is more like that of Troy's. It's doable at the FBS level but long term prospects for a national championship is poor unless the BCS system is changed.


The point you made was that those fans had to stop cheering for an established DOMINANT FLA team but yet they did. I guess you going to tell me next they are all new football fans. xlolx ATL metro area is huge but most could care less about GT. The size of your city does NOT directly correlate to the level of support.

[FCS Preview]

Sorry for jumping down your throat but all the naysayers, FCS zealots, and lets be honest the SOUR GRAPES jealous A-HOLES are getting on my nerves. BTW being a middle of the pack FBS team is light years ahead of anything in the FCS can offer a school like GSU. Look up average FBS numbers and it ain't even close to what ANY FCS team could ever hope for. Whether the kool aid drinkers on here want to admit it or not there is a limit to how much you can grow in the FCS and to anyone outside of the FCS world there is DIV I and everything else is DIV II and schools especially in the South suffer because of it. At some point it is just time to move on whether that is five years away or 10 GSU will move and rightly so. I do not expect folks that did not attend GSU to know just how much that school has grown in all aspects in the last 25 years and how bright the future looks, just like I do not expect 99% of the rest of the football world to give to sheatts about FCS football or people on this board to be realistic about the relavance of FCS football to the average alumni or student.

if you think people would be jealous of Georgia Southern making a minor bowl game once in a while, versus having a chance to win a NC -- yes, even at the FCS level -- then you're deluded. As I said earlier, I don't think an SIU fan would be in the midst of celebrating an FCS championship but be thinking, "Damn...I wish we could be in the Holiday Bowl instead..."

[JDC325]

And my county has a higher population than 11 states. But you don't count, because you're more than an hour from Statesboro. :D

But yet I still attend... I guess that sorta debunks the importance of having to live close to support a team...xsmiley_wix

[JDC325]

if you think people would be jealous of Georgia Southern making a minor bowl game once in a while, versus having a chance to win a NC -- yes, even at the FCS level -- then you're deluded. As I said earlier, I don't think an SIU fan would be in the midst of celebrating an FCS championship but be thinking, "Damn...I wish we could be in the Holiday Bowl instead..."


OK......then please explain to me how the RL carriers New Orleans bowl out drew the NC game....and do NOT tell me there was not enough tickets because there were a TON being scalped in the parking lot.

[Eaglesrus]

I have said that I'm not sold on the idea of GSU moving to the FBS. However, in response to the last 10 plus posts I will say that to be successful fan support-wise GSU would not need the Atlanta market. Both Atlanta and Athens are 200 miles from Statesboro, meaning that GSU would be the only FBS school in the southern 2/3rds of the state. Yes, the Atlanta metro area encompasses millions in population, but there's also a pretty good number of folks who live in south Georgia. It would be Georgia State and Kennesaw that would have to crack the Atlanta market, not Georgia Southern.

[FCS Preview]

The point you made was that those fans had to stop cheering for an established DOMINANT FLA team but yet they did. I guess you going to tell me next they are all new football fans. xlolx

I would say most are bandwagon.

In 2006, USF's average attendance was 30,222; USF averaged 53,170 fans in its six home games this season.

[JDC325]

I would say most are bandwagon.

In 2006, USF's average attendance was 30,222; USF averaged 53,170 fans in its six home games this season.

POINT BEING, it would be nowhere near that if they were still in the FCS coming off a threepete national championship run. I seriously doubt that many folks we not fans of another FBS team in the state before USF they just did not care about FCS football. BTW I am not downing the FCS I am proud of all of GSU NC's but the FBS is just a higher level period even with its crooked system and it is obvious that there is a limit for some schools of how much you can grow in the FCS. I think GSU has reached that point and now it is time to START looking to move up nothing more nothing less. I also do not think success will be INSTANT, it took Boise 11 years to be relevant and I do not expect GSU to do it any sooner. I will point out that FAU was the laughing stock of ALL of the FBS along with FIU but now FAU is officially the youngest school in the ENTIRE history of the FBS to ever reach a bowl game much less win in a blow out. Like I have said before each school IS DIFFERENT and its success can NOT be predicted by the success or lack there of the schools that went before them. For every negative you can bring up I can give an example of a school overcoming it. The most important factors are leadership, support and luck all the rest a just unreliable indicators at best.

[Saint3333]

The reason for all these posts is that if schools like GSU (ASU, Montana, etc.) leave for the FBS the FCS will look more like D2 of the 1980's.

The FCS continues to lose some of the stronger member of this division (top 30 teams) and this trend is going to continue once 2011 arrives.

[JDC325]

The reason for all these posts is that if schools like GSU (ASU, Montana, etc.) leave for the FBS the FCS will look more like D2 of the 1980's.

The FCS continues to lose some of the stronger member of this division (top 30 teams) and this trend is going to continue once 2011 arrives.

I agree somewhat but there are a good amount of NDSU's lurking in DIV II to take our spots. It will eventually reach a point where it is mainly comprised of schools that would never have a shot at moving up though if the trend continues.

[FCS Preview]

The reason for all these posts is that if schools like GSU (ASU, Montana, etc.) leave for the FBS the FCS will look more like D2 of the 1980's.

The FCS continues to lose some of the stronger member of this division (top 30 teams) and this trend is going to continue once 2011 arrives.
It depends who leaves, and how many schools leave. Even if Montana, GSU and App State left, you'd still have 14 of the 16 playoff teams from this season. Plus NDSU, which would have been a playoff team had they been eligible.

[citdog]

I agree somewhat but there are a good amount of NDSU's lurking in DIV II to take our spots. It will eventually reach a point where it is mainly comprised of schools that would never have a shot at moving up though if the trend continues.


ah dude some of us played at the level which you wish to play at for HALF A CENTURY OR MORE! YOU KNOW... WHEN YOU DIDN'T EVEN PLAY FOOTBALL!

[JDC325]

It depends who leaves, and how many schools leave. Even if Montana, GSU and App State left, you'd still have 14 of the 16 playoff teams from this season. Plus NDSU, which would have been a playoff team had they been eligible.

However if you took all the teams that have moved up the playoff bracket would look nothing like the way it does today.

[ButlerGSU]

ah dude some of us played at the level which you wish to play at for HALF A CENTURY OR MORE! YOU KNOW... WHEN YOU DIDN'T EVEN PLAY FOOTBALL!

Over half a century of work and nothing to show for it...sad ain't it? xsmiley_wix

[JDC325]

ah dude some of us played at the level which you wish to play at for HALF A CENTURY OR MORE! YOU KNOW... WHEN YOU DIDN'T EVEN PLAY FOOTBALL!

and there is a reason your not there now! Point being?

[FCS Preview]

However if you took all the teams that have moved up the playoff bracket would look nothing like the way it does today.

"nothing"? I doubt it. Marshall and Boise would be in the playoffs. Connecticut? They'd be a 6th CAA team. xlolx

Really though, Marshall would have knocked out UNH. Boise could have knocked out EWU. Akron? Buffalo? Idaho? probably not...

[citdog]

and there is a reason your not there now! Point being?

THE REASON? THE CONFERENCE WE WERE IN AT THE TIME I-AA WAS FORMED, THE SOUTHERN CONFERENCE YOU MAY HAVE HEARD OF IT, WANTED TO MOVE. WE ARE ALWAYS GOING TO HAVE OUR CROWD AT THE GAME REGARDLESS OF WHOM WE PLAY. WE WOULD DRAW BETTER PLAYING AT THE FBS LEVEL AND PLAYING ARMY, NAVY, AIR FORCE, DUKE, WAKE FOREST, VANDY, FURMAN, VMI, ETC ETC.

WE ARE HAPPY WHERE WE ARE.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

The reason for all these posts is that if schools like GSU (ASU, Montana, etc.) leave for the FBS the FCS will look more like D2 of the 1980's.

The FCS continues to lose some of the stronger member of this division (top 30 teams) and this trend is going to continue once 2011 arrives.

xconfusedx

Only Marshall, Louisiana-Monroe, Boise State and Western Kentucky could have been considered top teams, i.e. ones that won at least one national championship during their stay.

Louisiana-Monroe: won in 1987, left in 1994
Boise State: won in 1980, left in 1996
Marshall: won in 1992 and 1996, left in 1997
Western Kentucky: won in 2002, left in 2006

Of these four teams, only Boise State and Marshall could boast good home attendances. WKU *never* drew well at home, neither did Monroe. All four teams had playoff attendances below Delaware, Montana, and Appalachian State.

Unless you consider the loss of Western Kentucky in 2006 as the loss of a "stronger member of the division" (I don't), that means that no team of consequence has been lost to FBS in the last ten years. UConn, Buffalo, FAU, FIU, Troy... none of these programs were even close to Delaware, Appalachian State, Georgia Southern and Montana in terms of home support and team quality.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

"nothing"? I doubt it. Marshall and Boise would be in the playoffs. Connecticut? They'd be a 6th CAA team. xlolx

Really though, Marshall would have knocked out UNH. Boise could have knocked out EWU. Akron? Buffalo? Idaho? probably not...

I don't think so... Marshall proved they didn't belong when they got throttled by UNH 48-35 this year, remember? xlolx xlolx xlolx

[FCS Preview]

I don't think so... Marshall proved they didn't belong when they got throttled by UNH 48-35 this year, remember? xlolx xlolx xlolx


You're right, my bad. Neg rep for me! xlolx xlolx xlolx

So we have Boise State...

[Saint3333]

It depends who leaves, and how many schools leave. Even if Montana, GSU and App State left, you'd still have 14 of the 16 playoff teams from this season. Plus NDSU, which would have been a playoff team had they been eligible.

The teams that have left for the FBS make up just over 20% of the all-time playoff participants (games appeared in). If the FCS lost ASU, GSU, and Montana that number would be close to 35%.

If all the teams from 1978 or 1981 (for other teams) stayed in the FCS the playoffs would look a lot different today and IMO the overall play would be better. The more teams in the FBS obviously dilutes the caliber of the average player at the FCS level. Better players/recruits would have fallen to FCS programs thus raising the play on the field.

[WMTribe90]

For every negative you can bring up I can give an example of a school overcoming it.


I'll offer my two scents based on the recent history of IAA schools that have made the jump in the last decade or so. It appears to be me that there are two primary factors that will determine the success of a move from IAA to IA.

1) Would the IAA school be the first public (non-religious) IA school in its home state?

and/or

2) Would the IAA school immediately ascend to a spot in a BCS conference?

In recent years, I think all the schools that have achieved long-term success as IAs, after jumpting from IAA, have met one or both of these criteria.

Okay, so name a IAA school that doesn't meet either of the above criteria that has overcome it to achieve prolonged success at the IA level?

Again, I'm not saying GSU absolutely won't achieve success in IA. However, I would argue there is much more working against GSU than for GSU in this regard and that the history of schools in similar situations (i.e. Marshall) are not very encouraging.

Pro's

GSU has enjoyed remarkable success and fan support by IAA standards and as a rich football tradition.

GSU is located in the south, which enjoys good HS football talent and support for college football.

Con's

GSU would not enter directly into a BCS conference. The lack of premier hoops, academics, or a large untapped media market would indicate a low probability that GSU would even eventually be picke up by a BCS conference.

GSU is not and would not become the flagship program for the state of Georgia and would not out-compete UG or GT for the support of casual football fans.

GSU is not located in a major city of metropolitan area and would receive limted press coverage in Atlanta.

GSU would lose ties with traditional SoCon rivals and join a geographically dispersed conference (Asun or CUSA) with no natural or in-state rivals that will bring visiting fans to Statesboro in large numbers.

The overall atheltic budget will increase by 2X to 3X due to increased scholarships (mens and womens), travel costs for all sports, facility upgrades, etc.

Its unlikely that any increase in football revenues will cover the costs of moving the entire athletic department to CUSA or the ASun.


That's a lot to overcome. I don't think I would play this hand with cards GSU is currently holding.

[Saint3333]

xconfusedx

Only Marshall, Louisiana-Monroe, Boise State and Western Kentucky could have been considered top teams, i.e. ones that won at least one national championship during their stay.

Louisiana-Monroe: won in 1987, left in 1994
Boise State: won in 1980, left in 1996
Marshall: won in 1992 and 1996, left in 1997
Western Kentucky: won in 2002, left in 2006

Of these four teams, only Boise State and Marshall could boast good home attendances. WKU *never* drew well at home, neither did Monroe. All four teams had playoff attendances below Delaware, Montana, and Appalachian State.


Unless you consider the loss of Western Kentucky in 2006 as the loss of a "stronger member of the division" (I don't), that means that no team of consequence has been lost to FBS in the last ten years. UConn, Buffalo, FAU, FIU, Troy... none of these programs were even close to Delaware, Appalachian State, Georgia Southern and Montana in terms of home support and team quality.

Not true at the time of their departure MTSU, Nevada, Arkansas St., La Tech, Troy and yes even Idaho were in the TOP 30 of 1-AA. You don't have to win the national championship to be considered in the top 1/3 of the division.xreadx If you don't like the FCS would be better with Troy, UConn, etc. then we will agree to disagree.

[WMTribe90]

If all the teams from 1978 or 1981 (for other teams) stayed in the FCS the playoffs would look a lot different today and IMO the overall play would be better. The more teams in the FBS obviously dilutes the caliber of the average player at the FCS level. Better players/recruits would have fallen to FCS programs thus raising the play on the field.

Yes and No. Your theory would have to assume no growth in the talent level or population of HS football players. Both have increased.

I would also argue that the gap between the top third of FCS and bottom half of the BCS is narrowing. And as a result more kids are passing on offers from ASun, CUSA and MAC schools to attend top-level FCS schools, especially when the FCS school often offers better academics. I think the talent level in the FCS is currently as good as it has ever been.

I don't think we could withstand mass defections, but losing a WKU, Marshall or even GSU every four or five years isn't the end of the world as long as they are replaced by Cal Polys and NDSU, etc.

[Saint3333]

I understand your point. However no matter what the talent level is the "better" recruits are going to the FBS programs and thus the programs that have moved up are more "talented". Yes I know UNH beat Marshall, etc., but consistently the FBS programs are better.

If you don't think kids aren't choosing the FBS programs (even the lower level ones) check the recruiting sites and see the percentage of recruits FCS programs sign away from the FBS and vice versa.

[soweagle]

Okay, so name a IAA school that doesn't meet either of the above criteria that has overcome it be achieve prolonged success at the IA level?

Again, I'm not saying GSU absolutely won't achieve success in IA. However, I would argue there is much more working against GSU than for GSU in this regard and that the history of schools in similar situations (i.e. Marshall) are not very encouraging.

Pro's

GSU has enjoyed remarkable success and fan support by IAA standards and as a rich football tradition.

GSU is located in the south, which enjoys good HS football talent and support for college football.

Con's

GSU would not enter directly into a BCS conference. The lack of premier hoops, academics, or a large untapped media market would indicate a low probability that GSU would even eventually be picke up by a BCS conference.

GSU is not and would not become the flagship program for the state of Georgia and would not out-compete UG or GT for the support of casual football fans.

GSU is not located in a major city of metropolitan area and would receive limted press coverage in Atlanta.

GSU would lose ties with traditional SoCon rivals and join a geographically dispersed conference (Asun or CUSA) with no natural or in-state rivals that will bring visiting fans to Statesboro in large numbers.

The overall atheltic budget will increase by 2X to 3X due to increased scholarships (mens and womens), travel costs for all sports, facility upgrades, etc.

Its unlikely that any increase in football revenues will cover the costs of moving the entire athletic department to CUSA or the ASun.


That's a lot to overcome. I don't think I would play this hand with cards GSU is currently holding.

Your Con regardng overtaking GT and UGA is kind of mixed. While UGA will always be the main show in the state, GT can be knocked down to third by a good program. I would almost bet that in the late 80's GSU was closing in on GT. What does scare me about GSU moving up is in all the years that GT has been playing football they still can not come close to matching the fan base of UGA. GT has a rich history with former coaching greats as Bobby Dodd and John Heisman and yet they still are no where near UGA when it comes to fan base.

[WMTribe90]

I never argued that FCS teams were better than FBS teams. My point is that an increasing number are choosing top level FCS programs over bottom tier FBS teams. This is born out by the recruiting services also. In the 1990's the average CAA team might get one or two kids with any IA offers per recruiting class. In the past couple seasons the average CAA team is landing two to two or three of these kids per class. Two of WM's verbal commits to date had IA offers. MAC teams are now reluctant to play FCS squads because the talent gap has narrowed between the top of FCS and the bottom of FBS. The line is blurring and the results on the recruiting front support that.

[soweagle]

I understand your point. However no matter what the talent level is the "better" recruits are going to the FBS programs and thus the programs that have moved up are more "talented". Yes I know UNH beat Marshall, etc., but consistently the FBS programs are better.

If you don't think kids aren't choosing the FBS programs (even the lower level ones) check the recruiting sites and see the percentage of recruits FCS programs sign away from the FBS and vice versa.

Don't you love how a kid can have a couple of stars and once he commits to a FCS school he drops in stars. I watched it happen to a recruit out of Florida a couple of years ago. He was around 2 or 3 stars and he committed to GSU and dropped to one star. On siging day he signed with Boston College and the week after signing day he suddenly went back to 2 or 3 stars. That should tell you how much respect FCS gets. I'm not saying it is right but it is reality.

[WMTribe90]

WM got a verbal from a two star QB in PA with serious interest from Penn State among other IAs and he immediately dropped to zero stars. I guess signing with an FCS is an automatic two-star deduction...xsmhx

[mathman]

Pro's

GSU has enjoyed remarkable success and fan support by IAA standards and as a rich football tradition.
True, their present support is enough for FBS but to be somewhat average to marginal, they'd have to at least double their attendance to around 30,000. Their present attendance is good enough for the Sun Belt but would probably have to increase a few thousand for CUSA.


Con's

GSU would not enter directly into a BCS conference. The lack of premier hoops, academics, or a large untapped media market would indicate a low probability that GSU would even eventually be picke up by a BCS conference.
They definitely lag in academic credentials and the immediate Statesboro market is around 22,500 in the city and 63,000 for the county. They'd have to rely on Savannah and Augusta which are small metro areas.


GSU is not and would not become the flagship program for the state of Georgia and would not out-compete UG or GT for the support of casual football fans.
No way any Georgia school can overcome UGA. I don't think the BOR or Georgia legislature would even allow Georgia Southern to become a research university. And GT can't even compete with UGA for the hearts of fans in Georgia. Not sure how south Georgians feel about Georgia Southern.


GSU is not located in a major city of metropolitan area and would receive limted press coverage in Atlanta.
Atlanta is saturated as it is. That will make it even tough for Georgia State and Kennesaw State with their possible programs. Georgia Southern is fortunate to be somewhat distant from UGA, but Statesboro is not a big media market. The name Georgia Southern has regional appeal but not likely to win many fans in nearby SC. Georgia State has the better statewide name but I think that program will have huge fan-base problems.


GSU would lose ties with traditional SoCon rivals and join a geographically dispersed conference (Asun or CUSA) with no natural or in-state rivals that will bring visiting fans to Statesboro in large numbers.
I think you meant Sun Belt. ASun would be big step backward for Georgia Southern. They might keep their old rivals through OOC games.


The overall atheltic budget will increase by 2X to 3X due to increased scholarships (mens and womens), travel costs for all sports, facility upgrades, etc.

Its unlikely that any increase in football revenues will cover the costs of moving the entire athletic department to CUSA or the ASun.
They could squeeze that out of the students by increasing an already high athletic fee. I think their football program as is comes close to breaking even, but FBS should be budget buster.

[WUTNDITWAA]

WM got a verbal from a two star QB in PA with serious interest from Penn State among other IAs and he immediately dropped to zero stars. I guess signing with an FCS is an automatic two-star deduction...xsmhx

It's actually a three star deduction, but it's impossible to rate someone -1 stars.

[mathman]

The point you made was that those fans had to stop cheering for an established DOMINANT FLA team but yet they did. I guess you going to tell me next they are all new football fans. xlolx ATL metro area is huge but most could care less about GT. The size of your city does NOT directly correlate to the level of support.
True, but being in the vicinity of large populations helps. Both USF and UCF have very large student populations located in large cities with no resident established football university to compete with. Their potentials are very good. Georgia Southern likewise has to deal with UGA's popularity but it doesn't enjoy the strategic position that UCF and USF have. Georgia Southern's market success is much more doubtful.

[soweagle]

Wins are the only thing that matters with fan support. It does not matter where you are located. You can lose in downtown Atlanta and no one will be there but win in Stillmore, GA and they will come. I will not see in my lifetime where GSU will have a larger crowd than UGA but we do not need that amount of support to be considered a success in I-A.

[mathman]

Wins are the only thing that matters with fan support. It does not matter where you are located. You can lose in downtown Atlanta and no one will be there but win in Stillmore, GA and they will come. I will not see in my lifetime where GSU will have a larger crowd than UGA but we do not need that amount of support to be considered a success in I-A.
Sure, we see that with Troy. But the point has been raised, how successful? Georgia Southern is used to contending for and winning national championships. It is very likely that at the FBS level, Georgia Southern will never see another national championship. If you are not BCS, the chances are almost nil and it doesn't look good for Georgia Southern to enter a BCS conference. Chances for Sun Belt are good and CUSA is a long shot.

[WMTribe90]

I think what Troy has accomplished since moving to IA represents a best case scenario for GSU if they make the move. If the majority of GSU fans would be satisfied with Troy level success in a non-BCS conference than that is great.

[FCS Preview]

I think what Troy has accomplished since moving to IA represents a best case scenario for GSU if they make the move. If the majority of GSU fans would be satisfied with Troy level success in a non-BCS conference than that is great.

Even if they have Boise-level success, it means in their best season, going undefeated, they might make a BCS bowl game and finish in the Top 10.

[asu7]

Does it really matter what they do as long as this is what they want ... I mean geez

They may never win a game ... they may win 500 games who knows ...

Let em be happy with whatever they choose ...

I personally think GSU would struggle at first but then they would get some footing ...

but the main thing is ... is this what they want ... if it is I wish them the best of luck!

[yosef1969]

Even if they have Boise-level success, it means in their best season, going undefeated, they might make a BCS bowl game and finish in the Top 10.

...and depending on the fan's expectations and goals, even if they fall far short of Boise-level "success" the move wouldn't necessarily be a failure.

You are projecting your goals and perception of success onto an entire program and fanbase.

Playoffs and NC are the best part of FCS no doubt about it. The bowl system is asinine and the playoffs are a far superior method in determining a National Champion.

However if the quality of the subdivision continues to be diminished due to non-participation and the steady decline in the level of competition (The level of competition is being diluted because with no minimum requirements it is financially too compelling for a D-II school to jump up and claim dollars from the other sports while maintaining current football funding)

Then under these circumstances, even the lure of the NC is not reason enough to stay.

[FCS Preview]

However if the quality of the subdivision continues to be diminished due to non-participation and the steady decline in the level of competition (The level of competition is being diluted because with no minimum requirements it is financially too compelling for a D-II school to jump up and claim dollars from the other sports while maintaining current football funding)

Then under these circumstances, even the lure of the NC is not reason enough to stay.

The quality of the subdivision is declining and the level of competition is being diluted? 9 teams beat FBS schools this year, including, as you may have heard, Michigan and Navy. (Actually 8 teams won 9 games)

[yosef1969]

The quality of the subdivision is declining and the level of competition is being diluted? 9 teams beat FBS schools this year, including, as you may have heard, Michigan and Navy. (Actually 8 teams won 9 games)
The subdivision as whole is not getting stronger, only the top 15-25. Same with FBS, it's being diluted by former I-AA making the jump. Does the Sunbelt make FBS stonger? Same applies to FCS. It is being diluted on the back end by the influx of former D-II and lower programs. xnodx Consequence of no minimums.

[FCS Preview]

The subdivision as whole is not getting stronger, only the top 15-25. Same with FBS, it's being diluted by former I-AA making the jump. Does the Sunbelt make FBS stonger? Same applies to FCS. It is being diluted on the back end by the influx of former D-II and lower programs. xnodx Consequence of no minimums.

Yup, NDSU, SDSU and Cal Poly are really weakening the subdivision. xlolx

[yosef1969]

Yup, NDSU, SDSU and Cal Poly are really weakening the subdivision. xlolx

For every 3 that have a postive impact there are 5 that are dragging it down. You can point out exceptions all day.

BTW, odd that the three you mention all happen to be fully funded.xnodx

[UAalum72]

The subdivision as whole is not getting stronger, only the top 15-25. Same with FBS, it's being diluted by former I-AA making the jump. Does the Sunbelt make FBS stonger? Same applies to FCS. It is being diluted on the back end by the influx of former D-II and lower programs. xnodx Consequence of no minimums.
But FBS does have minimums and yet you say it's still being diluted. And assuming the top 15-25 of the FCS subdivision (don't refer to FCS as 'THE subdivision, FBS is also 'a' subdivision) were already fully funded, how are they 'getting stronger'? I guess it depends on who you think you are. If Ap moves to FBS, don't you think most of the BCS conferences will think you're 'diluting' their domain?

[walliver]

There is a bias on this board toward national championships. Sometimes we forget that the playoffs are icing, but the real cake is the regular season. The most important football game for any team or fan is the next game on the schedule. There are successful FBS programs drawing 50,000 to 100,000 per game, with rabid fan bases, who have not competed for a national championship ever (or at least not in a long while). These programs are not failures, and their fans are not clamoring to move to FCS level. Their fans all dream of a BCS championship, but they enjoy the excitement of Saturday Fall Afternoons. Even at FCS level, The Citadel has very good alumni/fan support despite no recent play-off visits.

The real question for Georgia Southern (or ASU or any other team seeking to move up) is ... will fans support the program through their attendance and gifts through 6-6, 5-7, 4-8 seasons year after year with an occasional breakthrough 8-4 year with a bowl bid to a lesser bowl? If the answer is "yes" and they can find the money, there is no reason the Eagles shouldn't move.

[yosef1969]

But FBS does have minimums and yet you say it's still being diluted. And assuming the top 15-25 of the FCS subdivision (don't refer to FCS as 'THE subdivision, FBS is also 'a' subdivision) were already fully funded, how are they 'getting stronger'? I guess it depends on who you think you are. If Ap moves to FBS, don't you think most of the BCS conferences will think you're 'diluting' their domain?

The top programs appear to be getting stronger because both the lower levels of FCS and FBS are being diluted.

Sorry but I referred to as FCS as the subdivision because it was the subdivision we were discussing. I do understand what the "S" stands for in both subdivisions and meant no disrespect at all. We can play gotcha on semantics all day but that's not really the point.

Sure the top programs in FBS would probably see GSU and ASU as watering down their division but they have felt that way about every program that has made the jump.

The point is at least in FBS the NCAA has taken steps to protect that division by requiring programs to meet minimums. I think the moratorium will result in more stringent minimums to prevent further real or perceived damage to FBS. I'd just like to see the same steps taken to protect FCS.

[hapapp]

Some have, in fact, suggested that the moratorium was as much in reaction to the diminishing number of DII programs. As more make the move to DI, that level is suffering. Is it possible that there will be stricter requirements for teams leaving DII for DI? Perhaps, there should be an effort to allow DI basketball schools to play something less than DI football.

[yosef1969]

But FBS does have minimums and yet you say it's still being diluted. And assuming the top 15-25 of the FCS subdivision (don't refer to FCS as 'THE subdivision, FBS is also 'a' subdivision) were already fully funded, how are they 'getting stronger'? I guess it depends on who you think you are. If Ap moves to FBS, don't you think most of the BCS conferences will think you're 'diluting' their domain?

The top programs appear to be getting stronger because both the lower levels of FCS and FBS are being diluted.

Sorry but I referred to as FCS as the subdivision because it was the subdivision we were discussing. I do understand what the "S" stands for in both subdivisions and meant no disrespect at all. We can play gotcha on semantics all day but that's not really the point.

Sure the top programs in FBS would probably see GSU and ASU as watering down their division but they have felt that way about every program that has made the jump.

The point is at least in FBS the NCAA has taken steps to protect that division by requiring programs to meet minimums. I think the moratorium will result in more stringent minimums to prevent further real or perceived damage to FBS. I'd just like to see the same steps taken to protect FCS.

[dbackjon]

For every 3 that have a postive impact there are 5 that are dragging it down. You can point out exceptions all day.

BTW, odd that the three you mention all happen to be fully funded.xnodx


Who is dragging FCS down? There will always be two levels of FCS play, as long as the current structure exists - fully funded, and the limited/no-schollie group.

For purposes of FCS strength, the discussion is really limited to the fully-funded programs. Of the fully funded programs that have made the leap in the past 10 years, which are dragging the FCS down?

[yosef1969]

Some have, in fact, suggested that the moratorium was as much in reaction to the diminishing number of DII programs. As more make the move to DI, that level is suffering. Is it possible that there will be stricter requirements for teams leaving DII for DI? Perhaps, there should be an effort to allow DI basketball schools to play something less than DI football.

That's what I'm hoping for, minimums and required participation in the championship process.

I think allowing non-scholarship football programs to participate in a lower division would be a good compromise. Much like Davidson and Georgetown used to do.

[hapapp]

I suspect, none. I think the concern expressed by some is that the requirements to be in this subdivision are too broad. Some DII programs offer more scholarships than some in this subdivision. However, a win over a DII program gets you penalized for playoff consideration while a win against a non-scholarship FCS team counts toward such.

[yosef1969]

Who is dragging FCS down? There will always be two levels of FCS play, as long as the current structure exists - fully funded, and the limited/no-schollie group.

For purposes of FCS strength, the discussion is really limited to the fully-funded programs. Of the fully funded programs that have made the leap in the past 10 years, which are dragging the FCS down?

But IMHO it is primarily the non funded and non playoff participating programs that dilute FCS. If there are two divisions within this subdivision why not structure it that way. What is wrong with requiring that minimums be met. I do think there are other issues such as seating capacity and staffing minimums that should be set as well but those obstacles are more easily overcome than scholarships.

[yosef1969]

I want to make it clear that I am not saying a move to FBS is a cure all for programs like GSU and ASU or that it is absolutely the right thing for any program. I do however understand the concerns of most that approve of making the move to FBS. I simply am offering some suggestions for how some of those concerns might be addressed. I ultimately want ASU to be where the fanbase and adminstration feels that it best fits. If that's FCS I will still be there every Saturday just as I have for the past 20+ years.

[UNH_Alum_In_CT]

There is a bias on this board toward national championships. Sometimes we forget that the playoffs are icing, but the real cake is the regular season. The most important football game for any team or fan is the next game on the schedule. There are successful FBS programs drawing 50,000 to 100,000 per game, with rabid fan bases, who have not competed for a national championship ever (or at least not in a long while). These programs are not failures, and their fans are not clamoring to move to FCS level. Their fans all dream of a BCS championship, but they enjoy the excitement of Saturday Fall Afternoons. Even at FCS level, The Citadel has very good alumni/fan support despite no recent play-off visits.

The real question for Georgia Southern (or ASU or any other team seeking to move up) is ... will fans support the program through their attendance and gifts through 6-6, 5-7, 4-8 seasons year after year with an occasional breakthrough 8-4 year with a bowl bid to a lesser bowl? If the answer is "yes" and they can find the money, there is no reason the Eagles shouldn't move.

I've been thinking about a similar train of thought as Walliver in that the regular season is paramount and the playoffs are gravy. It's a quality schedule and competitive play that gets me to support the program and travel to watch them play. If you make the playoffs then you get an incredible bonus. Yes, it is the one that makes FCS so special, but you've got to have the foundation of a quality regular season.

Putting myself into the shoes of App State and GA Southern, well the best I can do based on reading this forum, I do see alternatives that would be excellent reasons to upgrade their programs. There does seem to be disconnect in the SoCon between the public and private schools. And there does seem to be an option that would provide App and GA Southern with more regular season games with more like minded institutions without too great an impact geographically. Many old rivalries would be renewed from what I understand.

Down the road I could see a new FBS league forming (or revamped existing league) with 10-12 (probably others I didn't think about) of the following schools:

GA Southern
App State
East Carolina
Marshall
Middle Tenn
Charlotte
James Madison
Old Dominion
Youngstown State (aren't they really a MAC school? xconfusedx xconfusedx )
Troy
GA State
Western KY
Eastern KY
Coastal Carolina

I can easily see how that would be a preferable association compared to today's SoCon. They're all mid-sized or larger publics, mostly in the Southeast. I don't see the problem with that group as a lower level FBS league? I'm probably in the minority, but I think the MAC is a good league. It's made up of like minded schools and makes sense geographically. I look at this new association as a Southeast version of the MAC.

In this set up, I don't think you'd see any Mars Hill, Lenoir whoever that was, West Georgia, etc. on either schedule. And if I'm reading the App and GSU folks, they'd prefer to see Marshall, Middle Tenn, Troy, JMU, East Carolina, etc. rather than the small privates. They're the ones buying the season tickets and traveling to games. If you take bowl games versus playoffs out of the mix and use the basis of regular season games, then there are valid reasons to upgrade. JMHO xpeacex xpeacex xpeacex xpeacex

[FCS Preview]

Down the road I could see a new FBS league forming (or revamped existing league) with 10-12 (probably others I didn't think about) of the following schools:

GA Southern
App State
East Carolina
Marshall
Middle Tenn
Charlotte
James Madison
Old Dominion
Youngstown State (aren't they really a MAC school? xconfusedx xconfusedx )
Troy
GA State
Western KY
Eastern KY
Coastal Carolina

I don't see any schools currently in a conference leaving their conferences. Why would Marshall, East Carolina et al leave their current conferences which have a MBB AQ for a new league which would have to wait a long time for an AQ? And if you're envisioning a FB-only deal, I don't forsee any teams leaving their current FBS leagues unless they're also FB-only members. What's their upside?

[yosef1969]

I don't see any schools currently in a conference leaving their conferences. Why would Marshall, East Carolina et al leave their current conferences which have a MBB AQ for a new league which would have to wait a long time for an AQ? And if you're envisioning a FB-only deal, I don't forsee any teams leaving their current FBS leagues unless they're also FB-only members. What's their upside?

C-USA will not survive in its current form indefinately, ECU AD Terry Holland has stated publicly that ECU would welcome a split into East/West. Travel cost are too high. Just saying it's not as crazy as it first sounds!xpeacex

[UNH_Alum_In_CT]

I don't see any schools currently in a conference leaving their conferences. Why would Marshall, East Carolina et al leave their current conferences which have a MBB AQ for a new league which would have to wait a long time for an AQ? And if you're envisioning a FB-only deal, I don't forsee any teams leaving their current FBS leagues unless they're also FB-only members. What's their upside?

I did give a "revamped existing league" as an option. ;)

Nope, not envisioning a football only league. IMHO, Marshall and East Carolina would also view such an alignment as better than their current leagues because of more like minded schools and better geography.

[appfan2008]

C-USA will not survive in its current form indefinately, ECU AD Terry Holland has stated publicly that ECU would welcome a split into East/West. Travel cost are too high. Just saying it's not as crazy as it first sounds!xpeacex

it does sound crazy but when you think it about the cusa is set up to fail... the schools are so spread out it makes no sense whatsoever.... ecu may split off and then be looking at the possibility of joining teams like asu who they used to be in the same conference with and pretty good rivals...

[BigApp]

I've been thinking about a similar train of thought as Walliver...It's a quality schedule and competitive play that gets me to support the program and travel to watch them play. If you make the playoffs then you get an incredible bonus. Yes, it is the one that makes FCS so special, but you've got to have the foundation of a quality regular season.



my vote for Post of the Year! Bravo!!

http://www.planetsmilies.com/smilies/character/character0286.gif

[mathman]

Does it really matter what they do as long as this is what they want ... I mean geez

They may never win a game ... they may win 500 games who knows ...

Let em be happy with whatever they choose ...

I personally think GSU would struggle at first but then they would get some footing ...

but the main thing is ... is this what they want ... if it is I wish them the best of luck!
I think most of us take this position. But some of the more enthusiastic Georgia Southern supporters think that shortly after going FBS they'll be joining a BCS conference thus putting themselves in a good position to go for a NC or at least finish with a top 25 ranking. I and some others are just offering a reality check. South Florida was a special case and not the norm. USF is strong academically with a good market and recruiting grounds. I don't think Georgia Southern matches these qualities plus Georgia Southern would need to raise a lot of money on its own and with the state of Georgia already supporting 4 research institutions, I don't think it will want to add Georgia Southern. If the Georgia Southern fan base is content with being like Troy U then more power to them.

[mathman]

There is a bias on this board toward national championships. Sometimes we forget that the playoffs are icing, but the real cake is the regular season. The most important football game for any team or fan is the next game on the schedule. There are successful FBS programs drawing 50,000 to 100,000 per game, with rabid fan bases, who have not competed for a national championship ever (or at least not in a long while). These programs are not failures, and their fans are not clamoring to move to FCS level. Their fans all dream of a BCS championship, but they enjoy the excitement of Saturday Fall Afternoons. Even at FCS level, The Citadel has very good alumni/fan support despite no recent play-off visits.
This might be the strength of the bowl system. The Dance has been a huge success but it sort of diminishes the regular season. The regular season matters but even then it just seeds the conference championship but once you're at the Dance, no one cares about what games were won or lost. With the FBS system, the regular season sort of decides who are the last two standing (granted that now they have conference championship games in some conferences as well but even that is between just 2 teams). Though I still prefer the playoff system.


The real question for Georgia Southern (or ASU or any other team seeking to move up) is ... will fans support the program through their attendance and gifts through 6-6, 5-7, 4-8 seasons year after year with an occasional breakthrough 8-4 year with a bowl bid to a lesser bowl? If the answer is "yes" and they can find the money, there is no reason the Eagles shouldn't move.
Sure, just as long as they understand this. With the present BCS system, Georgia Southern will probably be shutout from even the big bowl games for a long time. Guess we'll see if Hawaii's season was a fluke or not.

[FCS Preview]

This might be the strength of the bowl system. The Dance has been a huge success but it sort of diminishes the regular season. The regular season matters but even then it just seeds the conference championship but once you're at the Dance, no one cares about what games were won or lost. With the FBS system, the regular season sort of decides who are the last two standing (granted that now they have conference championship games in some conferences as well but even that is between just 2 teams). Though I still prefer the playoff system.

Except that teams that go undefeated (Boise State and Hawai'i come to mind) still don't get to go to the title game. And that's the big weakness of the bowl system...

[Baldy]

I think most of us take this position. But some of the more enthusiastic Georgia Southern supporters think that shortly after going FBS they'll be joining a BCS conference thus putting themselves in a good position to go for a NC or at least finish with a top 25 ranking. I and some others are just offering a reality check. South Florida was a special case and not the norm. USF is strong academically with a good market and recruiting grounds. I don't think Georgia Southern matches these qualities plus Georgia Southern would need to raise a lot of money on its own and with the state of Georgia already supporting 4 research institutions, I don't think it will want to add Georgia Southern. If the Georgia Southern fan base is content with being like Troy U then more power to them.
Idiotic statement.

I have yet to see any GSU fan state that they thought GSU would move into a BCS conference shortly after moving to FBS, and putting ourselves in a position to win or even play for a NC. Most have said that they think GSU could move to a C-USA type conference within a few years of moving up....and that goal is very attainable.

As far as recruiting is concerned, GSU is in a great position. A much better position than say...ECU, Troy, UAB, any of the other Sunbelt schools, Marshall, Boise State, etc.
For example, Georgia has 3X+ the population of Alabama and only 2 FBS schools (compared to Alabama's 4, and North Carolina's 5), on top of that GA Tech recruits heavily outside of the state of GA considering they have 45 non-Georgians on their roster.

[seantaylor]

GSU has to be one of the biggest schools in 1AA, and for sure the biggest in the Socon by far with over 17,000 students. We are located in south Georgia. We recruit Georgia and Florida. 2 of the best 4 states in recruiting. We have an absolute ridiculous history. We would be the model to moving to 1A shortly after we make the move. Boise State was undefeated last year. They are in IDAHO. Never won an national championship, and have nowhere near the fanbase that we do. The Furman homer is an idiotic poster. Nothing he has said has made any sense.

[FCS Preview]

GSU has to be one of the biggest schools in 1AA, and for sure the biggest in the Socon by far with over 17,000 students. We are located in south Georgia. We recruit Georgia and Florida. 2 of the best 4 states in recruiting. We have an absolute ridiculous history. We would be the model to moving to 1A shortly after we make the move. Boise State was undefeated last year. They are in IDAHO. Never won an national championship, and have nowhere near the fanbase that we do. The Furman homer is an idiotic poster. Nothing he has said has made any sense.

Boise State won the 1980 I-AA National Championship.

[citdog]

GSU has to be one of the biggest schools in 1AA, and for sure the biggest in the Socon by far with over 17,000 students. We are located in south Georgia. We recruit Georgia and Florida. 2 of the best 4 states in recruiting. We have an absolute ridiculous history. We would be the model to moving to 1A shortly after we make the move. Boise State was undefeated last year. They are in IDAHO. Never won an national championship, and have nowhere near the fanbase that we do. The Furman homer is an idiotic poster. Nothing he has said has made any sense.


taylor you have to be the dumbest sob alive! Boise State sells out just about EVERY GAME. GSU doesn't even sell out for its homecoming, i know because i was there, your program is a thing of the past. now that foster is gone..... back to 3-8!

[soweagle]

Why do people think that Boise and Troy are as high as they can reach? I see two programs that are moving along nicely.

[soweagle]

taylor you have to be the dumbest sob alive! Boise State sells out just about EVERY GAME. GSU doesn't even sell out for its homecoming, i know because i was there, your program is a thing of the past. now that foster is gone..... back to 3-8!

Citdel Vs. GSU attendance- 18,506

Stadium seats- 18,000.

[citdog]

Citdel Vs. GSU attendance- 18,506

Stadium seats- 18,000.




IT'S THE CITADEL YOU PIRCK!


LOTS OF FOLKS DISGUISED AS EMPTY SEATS THAT DAY!

MUST BE SOME OF THAT WOFFORD ATTENDANCE MATH!xnodx

[soweagle]

Lots and lots of folks sitting on the grass and not in their seats. Only sections that was empty by any large portion was reserved for THE VMI-South fans.

[citdog]

Lots and lots of folks sitting on the grass and not in their seats. Only sections that was empty by any large portion was reserved for THE VMI-South fans.

sure they were, and i'm yankee. you can't even win the SoCon why would you try and move up when you can't even get in the playoffs? that last title was a WHILE AGO. BACK to 3-8 for the boys from Pigs Ass, GA! Can't wait!

[soweagle]

sure they were, and i'm yankee. you can't even win the SoCon why would you try and move up when you can't even get in the playoffs? that last title was a WHILE AGO. BACK to 3-8 for the boys from Pigs Ass, GA! Can't wait!

Sorry VMIsouthdog but the truth is the truth and we have never needed to inflate our numbers. Tickets sold are tickets sold. People sitting on the grass in the four corners are still paying customers, whether you saw them or not (not quite sure how you missed them, I hope you weren't a sharp shooter for our military). Who said we were moving anywhere? If you would use your VMI-Lite education for a minute you would read that we are only studying the option. I for one don't think we will go anywhere but rather a ploy by the admin. to act as if they tried.

We might be 3-8 next year with wins over Samford, VMI Jr. College, and some other patsy on the schedule.xlolx

[citdog]

Sorry VMIsouthdog but the truth is the truth and we have never needed to inflate our numbers. Tickets sold are tickets sold. People sitting on the grass in the four corners are still paying customers, whether you saw them or not (not quite sure how you missed them, I hope you weren't a sharp shooter for our military). Who said we were moving anywhere? If you would use your VMI-Lite education for a minute you would read that we are only studying the option. I for one don't think we will go anywhere but rather a ploy by the admin. to act as if they tried.

We might be 3-8 next year with wins over Samford, VMI Jr. College, and some other patsy on the schedule.xlolx

there are a lot of people "on grass" at GSU alright. and VMI-Lite? i am not familiar with that term.

[walliver]

there are a lot of people "on grass" at GSU alright. and VMI-Lite? i am not familiar with that term.


Should it be "The VMI-lite"? :D

[soweagle]

there are a lot of people "on grass" at GSU alright. and VMI-Lite? i am not familiar with that term.

xlolx xlolx Good one!!!

I tired to give you rep points for that but it won't let me.

[ButlerGSU]

sure they were, and i'm yankee. you can't even win the SoCon why would you try and move up when you can't even get in the playoffs? that last title was a WHILE AGO. BACK to 3-8 for the boys from Pigs Ass, GA! Can't wait!

Ha, always good to hear a Citadel fan talking smack about titles...how long ago was that last one for Citadel? xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx

[CID1990]

Ha, always good to hear a Citadel fan talking smack about titles...how long ago was that last one for Citadel? xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx

You guys talking about your titles is like Army talking about theirs.

[soweagle]

You guys talking about your titles is like Army talking about theirs.

At least we can talk about titles.

[mrklean]

You guys talking about your titles is like Army talking about theirs.

At least we were alive to see out last title!!!!!!

GATA

[WUTNDITWAA]

At least we were alive to see out last title!!!!!!

GATA

They say things are getting worse, but I beg to diffeer. My daughter, who is in first grade, lives in a world where the New York Yankees have never won a World Series, the Dallas Cowboys have never won a Super Bowl and Georgia Southern has never won a National Championship. xsmiley_wix

[KJ Eagle]

Ha, always good to hear a Citadel fan talking smack about titles...how long ago was that last one for Citadel? xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx

Cue citpuppy's response of..."we were in the SoCon before you were even a twinkle in your momma's eye, boy."

You know they don't know nothing about no titles in chuck-town. Or is that THE chuck-town?xwhistlex

[citdog]

Cue citpuppy's response of..."we were in the SoCon before you were even a twinkle in your momma's eye, boy."

You know they don't know nothing about no titles in chuck-town. Or is that THE chuck-town?xwhistlex


yeah well We were in the SoCon..





OH ****! xlolx xlolx xlolx

[seantaylor]

Citadel is not even a blip on GSU's radar.

[citdog]

THE Citadel is not even a blip on GSU's radar.


xmadx xmadx xmadx xmadx


I'LL REMEMBER YOU SAID THAT WHEN YOU GO 3-8 THIS YEAR AND LAUNCH FEASIBILITY STUDIES ABOUT MOVING TO DIV II! YOU'RE A THING OF THE PAST.

[ButlerGSU]

xmadx xmadx xmadx xmadx


I'LL REMEMBER YOU SAID THAT WHEN YOU GO 3-8 THIS YEAR AND LAUNCH FEASIBILITY STUDIES ABOUT MOVING TO DIV II! YOU'RE A THING OF THE PAST.

I guess Citadel fans are still waiting on their time huh? xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx

[citdog]

I guess THE Citadel fans are still waiting on their time huh? xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx

NOT WE HAD OURS. 1860-1865, 1898, 1917, 1941-1945, 1952, 1965-1972, 1991, 2001-PRESENT DAY

[CID1990]

Citadel is not even a blip on GSU's radar.

In the last five years, GSU has lost twice to The Citadel. Since you are one Jayson Foster scamper away from being less than .500 against us, perhaps you should PUT us on your radar.

On second thought, nevermind.

[fjblair]

Citadel is not even a blip on GSU's radar.




Might want to recalibrate the old radar. SoCon, you know.