The CAA Today: Week Twelve & Playoff Preview – We Did It! Five Get In! <---CSN

[CSN-info]

The CAA Today: Week Twelve & Playoff Preview – We Did It! Five Get In!
Bruce Dowd, CSN columnist

There will be many people in the country that feel that the Selection Committee should never have put five teams from the same conference in the tournament. And while they may think that they have legitimate reasons for their opinion, they would be wrong. The biggest controversy centers around the pick of 7-4 New Hampshire, so we will assume that most people are in agreement with four from the CAA and focus on the UNH pick.

First of all, there is this nagging problem of rules. The committee has firm rules that they are mandated to follow. Let me just repeat what I posted several weeks ago, which are the first three rules that they are FORCED to follow in order to award at-large bids;

1. The committee shall select the best teams available on a national at-large basis to complete the bracket. (All polls, and computer indexes, etc. justify the UNH pick, so get over it folks. As a matter of fact, be thankful that Villanova didn’t get in as well because the GPI had them as one of the best 16 teams, which would have put six CAA teams in.)

2. There is no limit to the number of teams the committee may select from one conference. (Should end any argument that five from one conference being unfair. The rules state that if they deserve to be in, there is NO LIMIT from any single conference. Plain as day folks. If you don’t like it, then you need to get the rule changed.)

3. The won-lost record of a team will be scrutinized to determine a team’s strength of schedule. (They beat FBS Marshall. UNH played Delaware, Richmond and James Madison, all playoff bound teams. As an example, UMass didn’t play any of those teams. UNH also had to play UMass and Hofstra. UNH was the only team of the five playoff teams from the CAA that played all the other playoff teams and three of those four games were on the road. Forget about your fringe 8-3 teams, none had a tougher schedule than UNH. Only serious argument might come from 7-4 Villanova. In the end though, the Marshall win probably put UNH over the hump.)

Many people are saying that the presence of Ricky Santos might have had something to do with the pick, but I doubt that, although if it did, then okay by me. However, the New Hampshire pick stands on its own merits without the Santos factor.

Some people have complained that because the CAA has twelve teams, it is too hard for them to play each other, so it is unfair to the other leagues that do have everybody play each other. Maybe so, but you can’t penalize the teams themselves because of that. It is my belief that if the CAA was two conferences, North and South, six teams each, that the same number of teams would have gotten in and maybe even more as they would probably be playing less CAA teams and instead playing FCS teams from other conferences, which they dominated this year.

What some of the complainers have to also consider is that this was a very unusual year when most of the other conferences only had one or two dominate teams, so the options for the committee were not that great. Not if they are mandated by rule number one.

Many people who were upset said they would have liked to see other teams get a shot, like 8-3 Albany, or even a 10-1 Dayton. I agree that that would be nice and be a special treat for teams in those divisions that are not quite as competitive as the CAA. More like the March Madness in basketball, but remember, that tournament has 64 teams and most of those long shots are conference winners with automatic bids. But I’ll say it again; putting those kinds of teams in the tournament violates the current rules and penalizes the teams that play a more difficult schedule. This situation is a very good argument for expanding the playoffs which is something I completely support. But for now, we are stuck with just 16 teams and therefore Dayton and Albany do not deserve a slot ahead of New Hampshire.

I know I had a lot of fun teasing the committee this year with the recent weekly cartoons, but in the end, they got it exactly right. They picked the eight best teams available for the at-large bids. Actually, I applaud them for having the guts to pull the trigger. They took a hit on both fronts, not only the five CAA teams, but also a 7-4 team which opened up all the other 7-4 teams with a legitimate shot to contest the decision. They could have easily copped out and taken an 8-3 team and very few people would have complained.

So, for all you complainers out there, get over it! The CAA deserves the five teams. The committee strictly followed the rules and did exactly what it was supposed to do.

READ MORE... http://www.collegesportingnews.com/article.asp?articleid=89201

[WrenFGun]

Ahem. How's this for ya, Mr. Coulson?

[Syntax Error]

Solid! xthumbsupx

[UNHWildCats]

Dowd > Coulson

[GreatAppSt]

3. The won-lost record of a team will be scrutinized to determine a team’s strength of schedule. (They beat FBS Marshall. UNH played Delaware, Richmond and LOST James Madison, and LOST all playoff bound teams. As an example, UMass didn’t play any of those teams. UNH also had to play UMass and LOST Hofstra. UNH was the only team of the five playoff teams from the CAA that played all the other playoff teams and three of those four games were on the road. Forget about your fringe 8-3 teams, none had a tougher schedule than UNH. Only serious argument might come from 7-4 Villanova. In the end though, the Marshall win probably put UNH over the hump.)


How can you use SOS to hype this team Bruce? they LOST to 75% of the teams that made it a good SOS and one scrub to boot. Do you get more credit for losing to a good team than winning in the CAA? Sorry buddy but you have given way to much room for people to have dowd's about your arguements.xnodx laughablexlolx

[Syntax Error]

How can you use SOS to hype this team Bruce?UNH won seven D-I games and beat an FBS and beat a playoff team. No other team can say that and were left out of the tournament. End of argument.

[GreatAppSt]

UNH won seven D-I games ONE of those seven included an FBS and beat a playoff team. No other team can say that and were left out of the tournament. End of argument.

FIxed it.:)

End of argument. Not even close, though I do admire the ability of the CAA to close ranks with themselves against the entire FCS Division.

[Cleets]

And when they lose by 45... and GSU or SD would have played a real game...? (oh well)

[Syntax Error]

And when they lose by 45... and GSU or SD would have played a real game...? (oh well)SD? xconfusedx

[umassfan]

And when they lose by 45... and GSU or SD would have played a real game...? (oh well)

Come on buddy... GSU didnt even win 7 DI games with a weaker schedule. They both played equal FBS teams and UNH won theirs. SD plays no one. Hell they got beat by Dayton.

[WrenFGun]

If UNH pulls the upset, or is even close, this is going to be unbearable for the non CAA fans. I can't wait.

[Ud1Hens]

Being that the 5th best team in a conference sticks around with the #1 team on the road would be impressive. Go CAA!

[Wildcat757]

I think that if anyone has a chance against UNI, its New Hampshire. especially after what happened two years ago. So happy the game will be televised up here xrotatehx .

[citdog]

i hope all you damn yankee oppressors are defeated and your Virginia Scalawag teams as well.xrulesx

[Monarch History]

Being that the 5th best team in a conference sticks around with the #1 team on the road would be impressive. Go CAA!

I second that emotion. xrotatehx xrotatehx

[CharlestonAppFan]

Welcome to the NCAA FCS Football Championship xthumbsupx

[Houndawg]

If UNH pulls the upset, or is even close, this is going to be unbearable for the non CAA fans. I can't wait.

If a frog had wings he wouldn't whomp his ass hopping. This game will be about a close as UNH/UMass.

[terrierbob]

Like I said- ALL CAA ALL THE TIME

[Pantherpower]

Welcome to the NCAA FCS Football Championship xthumbsupx

Hilarious! Loved Houndawg's frog line as well!!

[TokyoGriz]

Yep according to the system as it is now you got 5 in fair and square.

What if we just use the criteria that got all 5 of those teams in for everyone? Strength of schedule etc could be used for all 16 teams period. That way teams for weak conferences wouldnt sully our nice playoffs.

Obviously the problems in the system are obvious with conferences that are weak according to the litmus test you use getting automatic playoff berths and even high seeds. Teams from conferences that are not as competitive according to your number crunching get the shaft because of it.

Teams dont really control how strong or weak their conference is. Only OOC games can be potentially controlled to allow high caliber competition, and even thats a crap shoot.

The solution seems simple enough. Lets use the same criteria for all 16 teams period.

[gophoenix]

I guess the playoffs are the only way for the CAA to know who their true champion is.

But anyway, there is a flaw in this article. The CAA may indeed be two conferences of 6 teams. I can buy that argument. But the two conferences play each other for OOC basically and very little of anyone else. So it becomes even more difficult to litmus test it against the rest of the division.

So ultimately, name is running you guys in the polls especially with most of the media votes coming from the Northeast. Again, nothing wrong with that.

Close games with some I-A teams runs you will and beefs up the entire league.

But my serious question is, how does the CAA get 7 teams at the top. I am not discounting that they are good. I guess what I am asking is, the SoCon and CAA had what looked like the same competitive level. The SoCon played some descent OOC opponents, typically on the level of the CAA. The SoCon played higher rated I-A teams closer than the CAA, though the CAA came away with more wins. But in the scheme of computer polls, that is a wash as it is more about margins and predicted spreads. And yes, I know the D-II thing, but most polls don't factor those in.

So, where I am going with this is (and this is serious) how did the CAA maintain the rankings, even with the number of upsets, while other conferences with over half the conference being good teams not maintain it?

Delaware - W Monmouth, W Navy
Hofstra - W Furman, W Albany, W Stony Brook
JMU - W Coastal, W VMI, L North Carolina
Maine - L UConn, W Monmouth, L Strony Brook
UMass - L BC, W Colgate, W Holy Cross
UNH - W Marshall, W Iona, W Dartmouth
Northeastern - L Northwestern, W Northwestern St, L UC Davis
URI - L Army, L Fordham, W Brown
Richmond - W Stony Brook, W Bucknell, L Vandy
Towson - W CCSU, W Morgan St, L Colgate
Villanova - L Maryland, W Lehigh, W Penn
W&M - W Liberty, W VMI, L Virginia Tech

App - W Michigan, W Northern Arizona, W Lenoir-Rhyne, W Gardner-Webb
UTC - L Arkansas, L Carson-Newman, L - Jax St, L WKU
Cit - W VMI, W Chas South, L Wisconsin, W Webber
Elon - L South Florida, W WVW, W Liberty, W Stony Brook
Furman - L Hofstra, W Presby, L Clemson, W Coastal
GSU - L Colorado St, W West Georgia, W Coastal, W South Dakota St
WCU - L Alabama, L EKU, L Georgia, W Presbyterian
Wof - W Georgetown Ky, W Chas South, L NC State, W Gardner-Webb

What's the difference between the two? The SoCon has a non D-I in many of the extra game slots that the CAA plays in conference. So that might have an affect. But those don't count for most computer polls. So, the Litmus test between the SoCon and CAA is that same sample set.

The SoCon played better competition and lost a bit more. While the CAA played some weaker competition and won. Does that play up in computer polls? There was some overlap in competition of SoCon and CAA opponents.

Stony Brook, VMI, Liberty come to mind. Overall the SoCon did better.

I guess what I am ultimately asking is, how does the CAA maintain top ranking with only I-A and NS games mainly OOC while others play Big South and others do not. With Monmouth, Iona and some of the Patriots being so weak. I am not saying the CAA doesn't deserve, I have just been watching this for a few years and I have trouble seeing how the Patriot and CAA stay so high playing some types of teams while the Gateway, SoCon and Southland stay lower playing what is ultimately tougher competition for many games.....

Like I said, not smack, I really want to know.

[th0m]

Sounds like a fair question gophoenix, and as a CAA fan I have no clear answer, so am eager to see replies from other CAA fans that do have one ;)

[FCS Preview]

SoCon: 6 games against D-II schools. A 1-7 record against FBS schools
CAA: 1 D-II school? 2-8 against FBS schools

And yet the SoCon played better schools?

[citdog]

SoCon: 6 games against D-II schools. A 1-7 record against FBS schools
CAA: 1 D-II school? 2-8 against FBS schools

And yet the SoCon played better schools?


there is a big difference between playing Navy and Marshall and Wisconsin, Michigan, Alabama, Florida, et al





you should know that

[UNHWildCats]

there is a big difference between playing Navy and Marshall and Wisconsin, Michigan, Alabama, Florida, et al





you should know that
good keep playing them and then every year when you fall short of 7 Div I wins you can bitch and moan more about it :D xcoolx

[citdog]

good keep playing them and then every year when you fall short of 7 Div I wins you can bitch and moan more about it :D xcoolx


Navy will NEVER play us again. Same for Hudson High. Marshall knows they made a mistake leaving and don't want to get beat by their former SoCon mates. UNH doesn't deserve to be there and the BOTH COUNTRIES, the USA and the CSA, KNOW IT!

[WrenFGun]

I think Gophoenix makes a solid point which will be resolved by Samford's entrance into the SoCon. Since they only have seven conference games, they have to play at least 4 OOC games, which means its one more game that they have to find a FCS/FBS team to play. Of course, next year there are 12 games, so they'll stiill need another OOC, but at least they'll be on the level of everyone else.

It is, admittedly, a bit unfair to the SoCon that they had to find 4 OOC, but there must have been something they could do to avoid that D II school.

[blueballs]

SoCon: 6 games against D-II schools. A 1-7 record against FBS schools
CAA: 1 D-II school? 2-8 against FBS schools

And yet the SoCon played better schools?

How many of those D-1 OOC games that the CAA played were against non- scholarship teams and how many of the D-2 teams that the soCon played offer the full boat of scholarships?

35 scholarships > 0 scholarships, regardless of nomenclature.

[th0m]

there is a big difference between playing Navy and Marshall and Wisconsin, Michigan, Alabama, Florida, et al





you should know that

While it is true the Socon plays very tough FBS games - in addition to your list teams like Clemson and Arkansas as well - the CAA also played teams such as Virginia Tech, Vanderbilt, UConn and Boston College.

[FCS Preview]

How many of those D-1 OOC games that the CAA played were against non- scholarship teams and how many of the D-2 teams that the soCon played offer the full boat of scholarships?

35 scholarships > 0 scholarships, regardless of nomenclature.

West Georgia went (2-9) this year.
Lenoir-Rhyne went (2-9) this year.
Webber went (3-6).


And of course, Indiana State went (0-11) showing that scholarships don't mean all that much. :D

[gophoenix]

SoCon: 6 games against D-II schools. A 1-7 record against FBS schools
CAA: 1 D-II school? 2-8 against FBS schools

And yet the SoCon played better schools?

If you want me to say it again. The D-II games don't count for most computer polls, so just throw that out right now.

The SoCon played 0 non-scholarship schools. Those types of schools are typically bottom level of the computer polls. Beating Navy and Marshall were basically like beating another CAA team in the whole scheme of the computer polls.

CAA:
12 Va Tech (-47)
15 Boston College (-10)
21 UConn (-38)
52 Vanderbilt (-24)
54 Mrayland (-17)
70 North Carolina (-23)
78 Navy (+7)
83 Northwestern (-27)
121 Furman (+15)
127 Marshall (+13)
128 Army (-7)
132 Liberty (+7)
138 Holy Cross (+10)
146 UC Davis (-18)
150 Albany (+15)
157 Fordham (-10)
159 Colgate x2 (+18 -10)
163 Stony Brook x3 (+5 -7 +42)
172 Lehigh (+10)
180 Brown (+7)
182 Northwestern State (+28)
184 Coastal Carolina (+35)
185 Penn (+20)
196 Dartmouth (+21)
205 Morgan State (+7)
210 Monmouth x2 (+35 +7)
212 CCSU (+10)
215 Bucknell (+31)
221 Iona (+28)
228 VMI x2 (+47 +28)

Average Rank: 140

SoCon
12 Georgia (-29)
13 South Florida (-15)
17 Clemson (-18)
25 Michigan (+2)
31 Wisconsin (-14)
34 Arkansas (-19)
42 Alabama (-46)
59 NC State (-21)
92 South Dakota State (+3)
101 Western Kentucky (-7)
103 Colorado State (-8)
117 Hostra (-15)
132 Liberty (+28)
135 Eastern Kentucky (-24)
152 Northern Arizona (+13)
163 Stony Brook (+15)
184 Coastal Carolina x2 (+10 +8)
187 Jacksonville St (-14)
191 Gardner-Webb x2 (+38 +35)
208 Presbyterian x2 (+13 +24)
209 Charleston Southern x2 (+28 +25)
228 VMI (+42)

Average Rank: 116

Food for thought.

[Syntax Error]

If you want me to say it again. The D-II games don't count for most computer polls, so just throw that out right now. Food for thought.D-II games count for all computer ratings but just 1 that I can think of, Sagarin. Sag is just too FBS-centric to change his ways.

Food for thought.

[gophoenix]

D-II games count for all computer ratings but just 1 that I can think of, Sagarin. Sag is just too FBS-centric to change his ways.

Food for thought.

That's why I listed the above for Sagarin. It is easier to show just all D-I games with for this.

But my question still stands. The SoCOn played a better schedule. Performed better against the top 60. Performed worse in the middle but also played more of the middle OOC. And both were hit or miss against the bottom 50.

This is why I asked the question. How does the CAA sustain itself in the rankings while the SoCon does not in computer polls?

[FCS Preview]

If you want me to say it again. The D-II games don't count for most computer polls, so just throw that out right now.

But you can't compare SOS if you're not including the 6 games against D-II competition...and some of those were LOUSY schools, probably worse than the non-schollys that the CAA played.

If you look at the Massey ratings, which are the only ones I know of that rank every team in every division, you would see, for example that:

Lenoir-Rhyne #454
Carson-Newman #168
Webber #579 (NAIA School)
WV Weslyan #505
West Georgia #341
Georgetown Ky #461

and for kicks add in to the CAA, West Chester #266

How would that affect the SOS ratings?

Looks like the CAA slips to 143...the SoCon to 198 (using the numbers you had, plus the ones I found)

http://www.masseyratings.com/rate.php?lg=cf

[Syntax Error]

That's why I listed the above for Sagarin. It is easier to show just all D-I games with for this.
But my question still stands. The SoCOn played a better schedule. Performed better against the top 60. Performed worse in the middle but also played more of the middle OOC. And both were hit or miss against the bottom 50.
This is why I asked the question. How does the CAA sustain itself in the rankings while the SoCon does not in computer polls?What????
SoCon played a bunch of non-D-I games so Sag matters little. That's why there is a GPI.

Which FBS teams did the SoCon beat except for UM? How many SoCon teams finished with 7 D-I wins?

I don't understand what you are trying to prove.

[gophoenix]

But you can't compare SOS if you're not including the 6 games against D-II competition...and some of those were LOUSY schools, probably worse than the non-schollys that the CAA played.

If you look at the Massey ratings, which are the only ones I know of that rank every team in every division, you would see, for example that:

Lenoir-Rhyne #454
Carson-Newman #168
Webber #579 (NAIA School)
WV Weslyan #505
West Georgia #341
Georgetown Ky #461

and for kicks add in to the CAA, West Chester #266

How would that affect the SOS ratings?

Looks like the CAA slips to 143...the SoCon to 198 (using the numbers you had, plus the ones I found)

http://www.masseyratings.com/rate.php?lg=cf

Would you guys just look at this. I used Sagarin because it is the easiest example and you keep dodging the question with the example I gave.

With the Sagarin, how does the CAA sustain their rankings with a weaker schedule. Like I said, this isn't a CAA knock, I am trying to understand the method behind the computer rankings.

When you take the above OOC schedule into comparison. Furman lost big to Hofstra. Furman beat GSU and Elon. So that has to help the CAA overall when lined up head to head against the SoCon. But otherwise, the CAA as a whole an overall SoS that was a big difference than the SoCon. But the SoCon hurt with in conference wins and losses where the CAA didn't as much.

So, given that the example is the Sagarin, does anyone have any suggestions as to why that is?

And if you are going to do the but but but D-II this or massey that, then don't bother answering. That is not what I am asking. When the Sagarin only takes D-I teams into consideration, then that is as good a measuring stick as any because it leaves West Chester and the other garbage teams out. And it ultimately leaves 3 D-I games per team in each conference to compare each other with.

I am not trying to prove anything, I am trying to understand the math behind the computer ratings systems. Some put their formula up, some don't. The Sagarin is one of the more widely used methods, so it is as good as any.

[Syntax Error]

... the Massey ratings, which are the only ones I know of that rank every team in every division...All ratings apply their computer for all teams except Sag, I think.

[Syntax Error]

Would you guys just look at this. I used Sagarin because it is the easiest example...and the most flawed

You are really trying to skewer your take with spoiled vittles

[gophoenix]

and the most flawed

That is a matter of opinion. Why is it the most flawed? Because it only counts D-I games?

My example I only listed D-I games.

What are you trying to prove?

It's only spoiled because some of you guys keep with the same thing over and over. And I asking a valid question here, and all you have in return is opinion, accusations and nothing else..... xcoffeex

[FCS Preview]

Would you guys just look at this. I used Sagarin because it is the easiest example and you keep dodging the question with the example I gave.

With the Sagarin, how does the CAA sustain their rankings with a weaker schedule. Like I said, this isn't a CAA knock, I am trying to understand the method behind the computer rankings.

When you take the above OOC schedule into comparison. Furman lost big to Hofstra. Furman beat GSU and Elon. So that has to help the CAA overall when lined up head to head against the SoCon. But otherwise, the CAA as a whole an overall SoS that was a big difference than the SoCon. But the SoCon hurt with in conference wins and losses where the CAA didn't as much.

So, given that the example is the Sagarin, does anyone have any suggestions as to why that is?

And if you are going to do the but but but D-II this or massey that, then don't bother answering. That is not what I am asking. When the Sagarin only takes D-I teams into consideration, then that is as good a measuring stick as any because it leaves West Chester and the other garbage teams out. And it ultimately leaves 3 D-I games per team in each conference to compare each other with.

I am not trying to prove anything, I am trying to understand the math behind the computer ratings systems. Some put their formula up, some don't. The Sagarin is one of the more widely used methods, so it is as good as any.

The only thing your numbers prove is that the SoCon played better Division I OOC teams. So what. When you add in the D-II and NAIA (!) schools that the SoCon played, it swings in the other direction. Just because Sagarin doesn't take those games into account doesn't mean that the pollsters and the selection committee doesn't know that Webber and Georgetown (KY) are lousy.

[Wmbgskip]

Does Sagarin truly ignore all non-DI teams, or does he use a bandit rating (like, 0 or 1) to represent all such teams?

For whatever reason, the last time I read through his explanations I understood him to be using the latter. Which would account for the lower schedule rating for SoCon teams when their D-I schedule was "so much more impressive" than the CAAs.

Just a thought.

--Skip

[FCS Preview]

Does Sagarin truly ignore all non-DI teams, or does he use a bandit rating (like, 0 or 1) to represent all such teams?

For whatever reason, the last time I read through his explanations I understood him to be using the latter. Which would account for the lower schedule rating for SoCon teams when their D-I schedule was "so much more impressive" than the CAAs.

Just a thought.

--Skip


In COLLEGE FOOTBALL the W-L records include ALL games, but ONLY games between the 242 TEAMS RATED here are used for RATING and SCHEDULE STRENGTH computations

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/sagarin/fbt07.htm

[Syntax Error]

what he said

[gophoenix]

The only thing your numbers prove is that the SoCon played better Division I OOC teams. So what. When you add in the D-II and NAIA (!) schools that the SoCon played, it swings in the other direction. Just because Sagarin doesn't take those games into account doesn't mean that the pollsters and the selection committee doesn't know that Webber and Georgetown (KY) aren't lousy.

This isn't about the playoffs or if the CAA gets 12 teams in to the SoCon 0. I don't care about that for this question.

I am asking how the CAA maintains their conference rating with an average of 3 OOC games and the SoCon does not maintain the same thing with an average of 3 OCC games. Both in the sagarin here. Both showing only D-I competition. Both discounting non D-I games or making all sub-D-I games as playing #242, whatever. That is what I am asking.

I am not saying the SoCon should be higher or the CAA should be higher. I am trying to figure out with both conferences beating each other. Both conferences having teams upset by lower conference members. With all being said, the CAA has a better sagarin showing than the SoCon. All I am asking is why.

And all a lot of your are saying is, but D-II games count for the committee. So you're dodging the question. If you don't know, say you don't know. It doesn't make the CAA any less better or worse or the SoCon and less better or worse to say so. I am just wondering why the CAA maintains higher teams is all.

It happens every year with one conference. This year it was the CAA. it has been the SoCon before. Big Sky before. It always happens and I always wonder.

Geez some of you guys need to get a grip.

[FCS Preview]

Well, in the OOC games you listed, the CAA was (23-12), all against D-I competition. (You left out UD over WCU) The SoCon was (19-13), and (14-12) against D-I competiton.

So how does the CAA maintain their ranking? Just like the old Raiders slogan..."JUST WIN, BABY!"

[gophoenix]

Well, in the OOC games you listed, the CAA was (23-12), all against D-I competition. (You left out UD over WCU) The SoCon was (19-13), and (14-12) against D-I competiton.

So how does the CAA maintain their ranking? Just like the old Raiders slogan..."JUST WIN, BABY!"

Fair enough. But it doesn't fully explain everything.

[FCS Preview]

"I could explain it better, but I'd need charts, and graphs, and an easel."

[FUspirit]

This year The Southern Conference is like the Southeastern Conference... A bunch of heavyweights beating each other out of the playoffs or bowls.
While the Colonial is more like the Big East (or Big Ten or ACC, pick one) were you have about 4 good teams beating up the rest of the conference thus boosting there rankings. At least one of the bad teams gets lucky and beats a good team thus making the conference look better than it actualy is. I would put the top 5 SoCon teams against the top 5 CAA teams anytime and be a winner everytime... My prediction, only two CAA teams make it to the 2nd round Mass and of course Del.

[Ud1Hens]

This year The Southern Conference is like the Southeastern Conference... A bunch of heavyweights beating each other out of the playoffs or bowls.
While the Colonial is more like the Big East (or Big Ten or ACC, pick one) were you have about 4 good teams beating up the rest of the conference thus boosting there rankings. At least one of the bad teams gets lucky and beats a good team thus making the conference look better than it actualy is. I would put the top 5 SoCon teams against the top 5 CAA teams anytime and be a winner everytime... My prediction, only two CAA teams make it to the 2nd round Mass and of course Del.

Richmond beats Delaware, James Madison and New Hampshire; Delaware beats James Madison; James Madison beats New Hampshire; New Hampshire beats Delaware; UMass beats New Hampshire...I'd say that they did a pretty good job beating up on each other this year.

[ChickenMan]

I would put the top 5 SoCon teams against the top 5 CAA teams anytime and be a winner everytime...

Well.. that bogus opinion has already been proven WRONG..

Furman was tied for 3rd in the SonCon with a 4-3 conference record

Hofstra was tied for 6th in the CAA with a 4-4 conference record

September 8th.. 2007... Hofstra 32 Furman 17

xnonox

[Uncle Buck]

Well.. that bogus opinion has already been proven WRONG..

Furman was tied for 3rd in the SonCon with a 4-3 conference record

Hofstra was tied for 6th in the CAA with a 4-4 conference record

September 8th.. 2007... Hofstra 32 Furman 17

xnonox


Sept. 8th was a very good day xthumbsupx

[gophoenix]

Well.. that bogus opinion has already been proven WRONG..

Furman was tied for 3rd in the SonCon with a 4-3 conference record

Hofstra was tied for 6th in the CAA with a 4-4 conference record

September 8th.. 2007... Hofstra 32 Furman 17

xnonox

I love how you guys break out the 6th place thing when you are proving a point against other conferences then pull out the 3rd place in their division thing when making the case for playoffs xrolleyesx

We truly beat up on each other because we all played each other. Not the case in the CAA. If everyone played everybody else (or at least all of the "good" teams played each other, you would have seen the same thing that happened in the SoCon and Gateway).

Let me fix it for you.
Hofstra was tied for 2nd out of 6 teams (or 6 out of 12 which is a crock because you get measure than way against each other). Furman was tied for 3rd out of 8 teams.

But if you really really want to look at it like that. #7 CAA team beat #6 SoCon when you factor in tie breakers. Then it really isn't quite as impressive as your spin makes it out to be.

Factoring in tiebreakers
#1 Wofford
#2 App (tie breaker over wofford)
#3 GSU (2-0 against the tie for #1 teams)
#4 Elon (1-1 against the tie for #1 teams)
#5 The Citadel (0-2 against #1 beat Furman)
#6 Furman (0-2 against #1 teams, lost to The Citadel)
#7 UTC
#8 Western Carolina

[UNHWildCats]

I love how you guys break out the 6th place thing when you are proving a point against other conferences then pull out the 3rd place in their division thing when making the case for playoffs xrolleyesx

We truly beat up on each other because we all played each other. Not the case in the CAA. If everyone played everybody else (or at least all of the "good" teams played each other, you would have seen the same thing that happened in the SoCon and Gateway).

Let me fix it for you.
Hofstra was tied for 2nd out of 6 teams (or 6 out of 12 which is a crock because you get measure than way against each other). Furman was tied for 3rd out of 8 teams.

someone said you would take the top 5 in the SoCon against the top 5 in the CAA any day, ChickenMan just showed that the #6 overall in the CAA beat the #3 in the SoCon this season.

Then you attack his valid point in response, boy I think its time you retire from this thread.

[gophoenix]

someone said you would take the top 5 in the SoCon against the top 5 in the CAA any day, ChickenMan just showed that the #6 overall in the CAA beat the #3 in the SoCon this season.

Then you attack his valid point in response, boy I think its time you retire from this thread.

Someone said it, not me. I am just saying, if you are going to smack someone around, at least do it with the right facts.

I would put the top 6 SoCon against any of the the top 7 CAA any day and see a good game I think, regardless of the outcome. You'd win some, we'd win some. And if the same game is played a different week, we'd see different winners every time.

Both leagues have many good teams.

[CSN-info]

The CAA Today: Week Twelve & Playoff Preview – We Did It! Five Get In!
Bruce Dowd, CSN columnist

So, for all you complainers out there, get over it! The CAA deserves the five teams. The committee strictly followed the rules and did exactly what it was supposed to do.

READ MORE... http://www.collegesportingnews.com/article.asp?articleid=89201No one can dispute it, all five CAA teams showed they deserved it. xthumbsupx

[BigApp]

Richmond beats Delaware, James Madison and New Hampshire; Delaware beats James Madison; James Madison beats New Hampshire; New Hampshire beats Delaware; UMass beats New Hampshire...I'd say that they did a pretty good job beating up on each other this year.

how did UMass do against Delaware, JMU and Richmond??

And bruce, you're doing a fanciful job of dancing around the non-scholly question...

[BigApp]

Well.. that bogus opinion has already been proven WRONG..

Furman was tied for 3rd in the SonCon with a 4-3 conference record

Hofstra was tied for 6th in the CAA with a 4-4 conference record

September 8th.. 2007... Hofstra 32 Furman 17

xnonox

but gosh, if the SoCon played by your conference's rules, they might not have played Appalachian and Wofford.

Furman University 4-1 Southern Conference Champs!

[Syntax Error]

but gosh, if the SoCon played by your conference's rules, they might not have played Appalachian and Wofford.
Furman University 4-1 Southern Conference Champs!All the SoCon seven D-I win teams made the playoffs unlike the CAA. xcoffeex

[BigApp]

All the SoCon seven D-I win teams made the playoffs unlike the CAA. xcoffeex

xrolleyesx 4-1 would've been good enough for the autobid right?xrolleyesx

but we can go your route:

then Furman could've played Iona and Davidson instead of App and Wofford. Everything would be kosher, right?

[FCS Preview]

xrolleyesx 4-1 would've been good enough for the autobid right?xrolleyesx

but we can go your route:

then Furman could've played Iona and Davidson instead of App and Wofford. Everything would be kosher, right?

They could have played Iona instead of Hofstra and gotten to 7. But they figured a Hofstra team that has struggled of late would be a good D-I win... :D

[youwouldno]

someone said you would take the top 5 in the SoCon against the top 5 in the CAA any day, ChickenMan just showed that the #6 overall in the CAA beat the #3 in the SoCon this season.

Then you attack his valid point in response, boy I think its time you retire from this thread.

Those conference rankings are misleading and inaccurate. Hofstra wasn't 6th in the CAA because of the division system... Hofstra was 2nd in the CAA North. Furman was tied with 3 other teams in conference record, and those other 3 finished 7-4 whereas Furman was 6-5. So to say Furman finished "3rd" is technically true but makes no sense in that context.

Chew on this: 7 of 12 CAA teams were in the GPI top 25- good for an impressive 58%. The SoCon had 5 of 8 for 62.5%, and Furman was 27th, while the next CAA team was tied for 33rd.

[VT Wildcat Fan53]

If UNH pulls the upset, or is even close, this is going to be unbearable for the non CAA fans. I can't wait.
Nice crystal ball you were using! xthumbsupx

[citdog]

UNH-L
JMU-L



Woffy-W
App- W


all that matters

[WildcatFan]

UNH-L
JMU-L
Woffy-W
App- W
all that matters

Yup, they were blow-outs, not sure why we even bothered playing the gamexsmiley_wix

[yorkcountyUNHfan]

UNH-L
JMU-L



Woffy-W
App- W


all that matters


Using that logic:

North- W


All that matters.xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx

[UNHWILDCATS05]

Using that logic:

North- W


All that matters.xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx

xlolx xlolx xlolx