ASU's Playoff Show

[Saint3333]

Just heard the UMass AD on the show. It sounds like they went strictly by records and really don't look at the strength of schedule as much as many would like.

He specifically mentioned looking at who would be sent to Montana. It came down to EKU or Wofford. Note either would be a bus trip to Richmond. EKU at 9-2 was seen as a stronger team than an 8-3 Wofford team. You'd think the AQ from the SoCon would be considered better than the AQ from the OVC.

Yep, you got it Woofed...

[ncman071]

yea the SOCON got screwed. the best conference in FCS nation gets 2 teams in neither of which gets a seed (and yes i know wofford has 3 losses and would be hard to be seeded) but ASU should have gotten at least a bottom seed. anyway, i like their chances in their bracket.

How in the crap does a 7-4 New Hampshire team get in over a better/stronger 7-4 Citadel team???

[Grizalltheway]

What exactly makes the SoCon better than the CAA? The fact that App State beat Michigan? Honest question here.

[UDBlueLotFan]

Rumor has it that the UMass AD has a beef with Citidogxnonono2x Say it ain't soxsmhx

[Appattk]

UMASS AD put a definite CAA bias into the field...

The conference deserves credit for being tough, but geez... 5 bids.. Too much!

[hapapp]

I don't necessarily think the SoCon is better than the CAA (in fact, I don't). It may turn out that all five of the CAA teams win first round games. However, it would suggest that by putting 5 CAA teams in the field of 16, that none of the other conferences got much respect from the committee. I don't believe that the CAA warranted getting twice as many teams in as any other conference.

[Eyes of Old Main]

He specifically mentioned looking at who would be sent to Montana. It came down to EKU or Wofford. Note either would be a bus trip to Richmond. EKU at 9-2 was seen as a stronger team than an 8-3 Wofford team. You'd think the AQ from the SoCon would be considered better than the AQ from the OVC.

Yep, you got it Woofed...

Then again, you'd think the money conscious NCAA would do whatever it could to avoid Richmond hosting a game. I realize Wofford's attendence isn't huge, but based off the averages I've seen attributed to Richmond posted on this site, all I can say is that I'm shocked.

[CID1990]

yea the SOCON got screwed. the best conference in FCS nation gets 2 teams in neither of which gets a seed (and yes i know wofford has 3 losses and would be hard to be seeded) but ASU should have gotten at least a bottom seed. anyway, i like their chances in their bracket.

How in the crap does a 7-4 New Hampshire team get in over a better/stronger 7-4 Citadel team???

Thanks for the props, but having followed these selections for many years, I can say that The Citadel can only get in as an at-large if they have 9 wins. Plus, if you don't take strength of schedule into account, a balanced SoCon will get screwed every time.

[CID1990]

Ultimately, the way to shove this in the face of the selection committee is for Wofford and ASU to whip ass.

[Black and Gold Express]

Ultimately, the way to shove this in the face of the selection committee is for Wofford and ASU to whip ass.

We'll certainly do our part... er, I mean our best. xsmiley_wix

[Appaholic]

I don't necessarily think the SoCon is better than the CAA (in fact, I don't). It may turn out that all five of the CAA teams win first round games. However, it would suggest that by putting 5 CAA teams in the field of 16, that none of the other conferences got much respect from the committee. I don't believe that the CAA warranted getting twice as many teams in as any other conference.

I agree.....don't think the Socon is better than CAA, but 5 bids is a bit much considering the strength of teams nationwide...

[mrklean]

I really hate being left out!!!!!!!

I know i sound like a bsd looser, but this really hurts!!!!

We had it in our hands and blew it!!!!!!!!!!!!

[appfan2008]

Ultimately, the way to shove this in the face of the selection committee is for Wofford and ASU to whip ass.

we will do our best to hold up our end of that

[ASUdrummer]

yea the SOCON got screwed. the best conference in FCS nation gets 2 teams in neither of which gets a seed (and yes i know wofford has 3 losses and would be hard to be seeded) but ASU should have gotten at least a bottom seed. anyway, i like their chances in their bracket.

How in the crap does a 7-4 New Hampshire team get in over a better/stronger 7-4 Citadel team???

Citadel only had 6 Div I wins...they blew away Webber College for one of those 7. But there are other teams that deserved it over UNH...

[TheValleyRaider]

Then again, you'd think the money conscious NCAA would do whatever it could to avoid Richmond hosting a game. I realize Wofford's attendence isn't huge, but based off the averages I've seen attributed to Richmond posted on this site, all I can say is that I'm shocked.

Richmond put up the $$$$$$

The bid is totally guaranteed, and since they have deep pockets and a large stadium, they can submit a large bid. The NCAA gets paid whether there are people there or not.

[JMU2K_DukeDawg]

Just wanted to echo TheValleyRaider's sentiment. Curious as to what our bid was (JMU). One person not from JMU on the boards mentioned it was 2nd highest behind App St.'s bid and that should JMU and EWU win, we would finally have a home game. If that was accurate, and Mickey Matthews knew it to be so, then that would explain why he was so ticked off about us playing at App St. in the 1st round - we would have hosted Wofford, EKU, or Del St. (all the other regional schools). He also mentioned that it was a tough draw saying we have the toughest 1st round matchup of any of the CAA schools. (maybe he forgot UNI - I think I know one coach who votes for Montana as #1 in their poll! ;) ) At least we JMU fans know he understands the tough task at hand in winning at the Rock. I'd rather play App St. in R1 than R2 or the semi's with a packed house.

[PaladinFan]

App fans, don't finger point too much. Roach Laney was a big mover and shaker when ASU got seeded over a Furman team with a better record who had beaten you already that season.

[ERASU2113]

At least we JMU fans know he understands the tough task at hand in winning at the Rock. I'd rather play App St. in R1 than R2 or the semi's with a packed house.

Granted the crowd will be small....it will be decent size compared to 2 years ago. Last year it was around 17-18k I think. This year I don't expect less....could be around 18k again. Maybe more.

Heck, Chatty we drew 23k in a game that really didn't have much interest. Majority of students are coming back, season ticket holders are going to get their. So really have no clue how big, other than around 18k. Just depends how dedicated fans are.

If it was friday, the place would next to empty

[Eyes of Old Main]

Ultimately, the way to shove this in the face of the selection committee is for Wofford and ASU to whip ass.

Wofford will do their best to oblige you on that.

Remember, Grizzly Bears have big ankles and the Terriers are extra hungry after taking last week off.

[ASU]

App fans, don't finger point too much. Roach Laney was a big mover and shaker when ASU got seeded over a Furman team with a better record who had beaten you already that season.

You talking about the Roach Laney that ASU fired. Might have had a negative impact? Also, are you talking about the year that App State beat
FU in the semi finals?

[Grabholdofyosef]

You talking about the Roach Laney that ASU fired. Might have had a negative impact? Also, are you talking about the year that App State beat
FU in the semi finals?
He is talking about the ASU team that won the SoCon outright (6-1) that year and two of the 3 losses were to BCS teams (kansas and LSU) and played decent against LSU. He is also talking about the Furman team that lost to Western Carolina that year and didnt play any BCS teams and finished 5-2 in conference.

[santosballnewhampshire]

How in the crap does a 7-4 New Hampshire team get in over a better/stronger 7-4 Citadel team???

No way are they better then ricky santos and crew you would much rather watch uni play unh over the citadel its not even close

[CID1990]

How in the crap does a 7-4 New Hampshire team get in over a better/stronger 7-4 Citadel team???

No way are they better then ricky santos and crew you would much rather watch uni play unh over the citadel its not even close

That makes no sense since you know nothing about The Citadel, only UNH. The point is moot since your season will be over this weekend.

[NYJMUSupporter]

Remember that the CAA is a 12 team league. Considering the number of quality teams that are in the CAA, 5 teams is not that outrageous. With that being said, NH did not deserve a bid. I would have given Villanova the spot.

EXPAND THE FIELD!!!

[BDKJMU]

UMASS AD put a definite CAA bias into the field...

The conference deserves credit for being tough, but geez... 5 bids.. Too much!

5 out of 12 teams is about 42% of the conference. If the Gateway had gotten 3 (of 7) which is what would have happened if the Gateway had gotten YSU in that would have been about 43%. If the So-Con ad gotten 3 (of 8) that would have been about 37%. A few weeks ago people were talking about the So-Con getting 4, which would have been half the conference, and hasn't that happened before with the So-Con? 5 out of 12 isn't out of line percentage wise. The So-Con and Gateway only having 2 teams 8-3 or better and a lack of 8-3 (with halfway decent resumes) from the non power conferences meant an 7-4 from a power conference was going to have a shot. Was really 6 of those. UNH and Nova from the CAA were the strongest candidates based on quality wins AND a I-A AND having NO D-2. YSU, GSU, Elon and Citadel were out there, but didn't they all have D-2s on the schedule, thereby only 6 Div 1 wins?

[BDKJMU]

I don't necessarily think the SoCon is better than the CAA (in fact, I don't). It may turn out that all five of the CAA teams win first round games. However, it would suggest that by putting 5 CAA teams in the field of 16, that none of the other conferences got much respect from the committee. I don't believe that the CAA warranted getting twice as many teams in as any other conference.

You can't compare a conference that has 12 teams with conferences that have 7-8 teams and treat an equal # of playoff teams in the field as being equal. For example, say 4 from a 12 team conference would be the same as 3 from a 9 team conference= 33%. 3 from a 12 team conference would be the same as 2 from an 8 team conference= 25%. 5 from 12 team conference would be about the same as 3 from a 7 team conference about 42% vs 43%.

If thats the case, when ODU joins the CAA, the CAA should add a 14th team, split into 2 7 team conferences the CAA North and CAA South as opposed to 2 divisions, get up to 3 teams in from each conference, up to 6 teams total, and no one would complain like they are now, even though it would be about the same percentage wise, 6 of 14 vs 5 of 12.

[NYJMUSupporter]

I could not agree more. The committee was justifed in picking 5 CAA teams!

[eaglesrthe1]

If you play a strong enough schedule, and do well enough against it, then you should be in the playoffs. The number of other playoff teams from that same conference shouldn't have anything to do with it, other than show how strong your schedule was to begin with.

Babbling about how many teams are from one conference is something that people do when they are grasping at straws, and that's the best straw they see. It's hogwash.xcoffeex

[gophoenix]

Here's a solution.

Make the entire playoffs be the CAA. That way they can figure out who their winner is. Goodness knows they don't do it in conference play.

The only schools to play nearly all of their good teams were the ones that weren't close to the playoffs.

And no, they weren't justified by putting in 5 CAA teams. As I keep saying, Colgate, Holy Cross, Lafayette, SC State or Norfolk State would have been good choices instead of a 5th.

And comparing a 12 team conference to the rest of us is crap anyway. The conference padded the schedule of the contenders.

[gsugt1]

Or why not put in Nova ? They had the same record and a better conference record.

[lizrdgizrd]

I've gotta agree with gophoenix. The problem with the CAA is that not all the top teams play each other every season. The rest of us have to play every team in our conference and the playoff contenders have to beat each other thereby reducing the chance of them making the playoffs.

[PurpleandGold]

padded the schedule of the contenders????

UNH had to play JMU, UD, UR, UMASS, and Hofstra.
JMU played UNH, UD, UR, and Villanova.
UD played JMU, UR, Villanova, and UNH.
UR played JMU, UD, Villanova, and UNH.
UMASS played UNH, Hofstra, and Villanova.

Arguably only UMASS's schedule was even remotely padded by not having to play JMU, UD, and UR. The rest had to play 4 top 25(GPI) squads, 3 of which playoff bound, and all played I-A's. Padding? I think not.

[lizrdgizrd]

padded the schedule of the contenders????

UNH had to play JMU, UD, UR, UMASS, and Hofstra.
JMU played UNH, UD, UR, and Villanova.
UD played JMU, UR, Villanova, and UNH.
UR played JMU, UD, Villanova, and UNH.
UMASS played UNH, Hofstra, and Villanova.

Arguably only UMASS's schedule was even remotely padded by not having to play JMU, UD, and UR. The rest had to play 4 top 25(GPI) squads, 3 of which playoff bound, and all played I-A's. Padding? I think not.
Note that UNH was the team on the bubble out of those 5. What would those other teams' records look like if they had all played at least 5 of the others? xeyebrowx

[PurpleandGold]

and what would App's record like if they played Montana and S. Illinois? SOS is based on who you play, not who you don't, and CAA squads have good SOS even though they don't play the whole conference. Some have better than others due to that fact, but all still have a good SOS.

UMASS lucking out by not playing UR is no different then App lucking out by not playing SIU.

It could be argued that App gets it easy because they can't get out of playing UTC and WCU, both with lower GPI than our cellar dwellers URI and Towson. When your entire conference is in the top half of FCS, something only the CAA can claim, there are no easy games and there are no weak schedules even if you play the weaker half of the other division.

[PurpleandGold]

Sorry for the rant, and I don't mean to target App, but really, the argument that CAA teams get it easy by not playing the whole conference is just plain silly. Granted, it's more difficult to compare the CAA to the SOCON or BSC because of that, but you can't discount the success of CAA teams. Their SOS is competitive with anybody in the nation (except maybe SUU), no matter who they don't have to play in a given year, and SOS is where you evaluate teams, not on how they achieve that SOS.

[lizrdgizrd]

and what would App's record like if they played Montana and S. Illinois? SOS is based on who you play, not who you don't, and CAA squads have good SOS even though they don't play the whole conference. Some have better than others due to that fact, but all still have a good SOS.

UMASS lucking out by not playing UR is no different then App lucking out by not playing SIU.

It could be argued that App gets it easy because they can't get out of playing UTC and WCU, both with lower GPI than our cellar dwellers URI and Towson. When your entire conference is in the top half of FCS, something only the CAA can claim, there are no easy games and there are no weak schedules even if you play the weaker half of the other division.

It's actually very different. SIU and App aren't in the same conference. All the other conferences play all the teams in their conference (except the SWAC I think). Tell me your top 6 would have the same records if they all had to play each other this year. xeyebrowx

I'm not saying your conference is weak, but the fact is that not all the top teams have to play each other every year. If they did their records would be quite different (except maybe UNH who did manage to play most of the top teams).

[PurpleandGold]

You're absolutely right, JMU's record would likely be different if we played UMASS, Hofstra, and Maine instead of UNC, Coastal, and VMI, but that means nothing. App's recored might be different if they played those three instead of Lenoir Rhyne, Michigan, and Gardner Webb. There's no difference as far as comparing JMU to ASU. JMU fared the way the did against the SOS they were dealt, so did ASU. Speculating what records would be like if they had played different schools is pointless. JMU's record would also have been different if they played a full ACC slate too instead of just UNC, but nobody's speculating about that.

[lizrdgizrd]

You're absolutely right, JMU's record would likely be different if we played UMASS, Hofstra, and Maine instead of UNC, Coastal, and VMI, but that means nothing. App's recored might be different if they played those three instead of Lenoir Rhyne, Michigan, and Gardner Webb. There's no difference as far as comparing JMU to ASU. JMU fared the way the did against the SOS they were dealt, so did ASU. Speculating what records would be like if they had played different schools is pointless. JMU's record would also have been different if they played a full ACC slate too instead of just UNC, but nobody's speculating about that.
You keep bringing up OOC games, but we're talking about in-conference games. You should be playing every team in your conference - good and bad. That you can avoid some of the best teams in the conference is a benefit to your records. The rest of us don't have that luxury. xrolleyesx

[PurpleandGold]

You keep bringing up conference games like there's something magical about a game being in conference versus out. If we play a good UD team in conference and win and you play the same good UD team and win, do we get more credit for it because its in conference? So we didn't play UMASS this year, is that really any different than ASU not playing UMASS? You can't play everyone in FCS and we can't play everyone in the CAA every year. We get crap because we're the only conference this large, but it really doesn't matter, all that matter's is SOS. Asking what JMU's record would be if they played UMASS is as pointless as asking what would ASU's be if they played them, or asking what would the world be like if the sky were purple, not blue?

[PurpleandGold]

Also for the record, I enjoy the spirited debate, no matter how much I disagree.

[lizrdgizrd]

You keep bringing up conference games like there's something magical about a game being in conference versus out. If we play a good UD team in conference and win and you play the same good UD team and win, do we get more credit for it because its in conference? So we didn't play UMASS this year, is that really any different than ASU not playing UMASS? You can't play everyone in FCS and we can't play everyone in the CAA every year. We get crap because we're the only conference this large, but it really doesn't matter, all that matter's is SOS. Asking what JMU's record would be if they played UMASS is as pointless as asking what would ASU's be if they played them, or asking what would the world be like if the sky were purple, not blue?
I'm saying that some of your teams got the benefit of scheduling less of your good teams. Plain and simple. The rest of us have to play all our playoff contending teams. xpeacex

[lizrdgizrd]

Also for the record, I enjoy the spirited debate, no matter how much I disagree.
Enjoy your return trip to Boone. I hope the outcome is the same as last year. xsmiley_wix

[PurpleandGold]

P.S. Where are our conference mates backing us up?