FCS Playoffs Selection is Extremely Flawed

[flyenhigh]

Who really got woofed? The entire FCS community for not giving us a true FCS National Champion. Leaving out any 1AA conf. champs is pathetic.

The number (1) one (1) reason that no team from the mid major will ever get in is bc the committee will not allow a so-called upset or upsets to happen over a full blown FCS team. How would you like it if a team with 0 scholarships came in a smashed up a team with the full allotment. I would bet my home that the coaches/AD's lobbied to never allow a mid major team in.

Complete BS is the entire system. Needs to be changed for the better. FCS is living in the past and they need to grow up and move forward. Expansion is needed. There is no true champ in my book; there is no true champ to the general community (due to the mid major championship game)

Bunch of freaking cowards.

[catbob]

Pony up and get some scholarships.

[Tim James]

Who really got woofed? The entire FCS community for not giving us a true FCS National Champion. Leaving out any 1AA conf. champs is pathetic.

The number (1) one (1) reason that no team from the mid major will ever get in is bc the committee will not allow a so-called upset or upsets to happen over a full blown FCS team. How would you like it if a team with 0 scholarships came in a smashed up a team with the full allotment. I would bet my home that the coaches/AD's lobbied to never allow a mid major team in.

Complete BS is the entire system. Needs to be changed for the better. FCS is living in the past and they need to grow up and move forward. Expansion is needed. There is no true champ in my book; there is no true champ to the general community (due to the mid major championship game)

Bunch of freaking cowards.

Spend some more money instead of being cheap and add more schollys. Get everyone in your conference to do it and have everyone be on the same page. If that happens then your league will get an auto bid and then their wont be a problem.

[bcrawf]

OK, let Dayton in and then don't be all pissed off when they go to Montana or Appy or UNI and that team runs it up on them.

Dayton would not hold any of those three teams under 50. San Diego has lost to a mediocre at best UC Davis team each of the last two years...

UNI/Appy/Montana 56
Dayton 3

This is not flawed. Period.

[BearsCountry]

I feel bad for Liberty.

[Seawolf97]

Who really got woofed? The entire FCS community for not giving us a true FCS National Champion. Leaving out any 1AA conf. champs is pathetic.

The number (1) one (1) reason that no team from the mid major will ever get in is bc the committee will not allow a so-called upset or upsets to happen over a full blown FCS team. How would you like it if a team with 0 scholarships came in a smashed up a team with the full allotment. I would bet my home that the coaches/AD's lobbied to never allow a mid major team in.

Complete BS is the entire system. Needs to be changed for the better. FCS is living in the past and they need to grow up and move forward. Expansion is needed. There is no true champ in my book; there is no true champ to the general community (due to the mid major championship game)

Bunch of freaking cowards.

Outside of Fordham I cant see Dayton being a match for any of todays picksxwhistlex

[BlueHen86]

Who really got woofed? The entire FCS community for not giving us a true FCS National Champion. Leaving out any 1AA conf. champs is pathetic.

The number (1) one (1) reason that no team from the mid major will ever get in is bc the committee will not allow a so-called upset or upsets to happen over a full blown FCS team. How would you like it if a team with 0 scholarships came in a smashed up a team with the full allotment. I would bet my home that the coaches/AD's lobbied to never allow a mid major team in.

Complete BS is the entire system. Needs to be changed for the better. FCS is living in the past and they need to grow up and move forward. Expansion is needed. There is no true champ in my book; there is no true champ to the general community (due to the mid major championship game)

Bunch of freaking cowards.

You guys didn't get woofed by the playoff selection committee, you got woofed by your schedule. Play some tough OOC games (like Albany did), if you win those games you might get a bid.

[th0m]

So we should give the conf champs of the Big South and the MAAC an AQ as well then?

[Ud1Hens]

Who really got woofed? The entire FCS community for not giving us a true FCS National Champion. Leaving out any 1AA conf. champs is pathetic.

The number (1) one (1) reason that no team from the mid major will ever get in is bc the committee will not allow a so-called upset or upsets to happen over a full blown FCS team. How would you like it if a team with 0 scholarships came in a smashed up a team with the full allotment. I would bet my home that the coaches/AD's lobbied to never allow a mid major team in.

Complete BS is the entire system. Needs to be changed for the better. FCS is living in the past and they need to grow up and move forward. Expansion is needed. There is no true champ in my book; there is no true champ to the general community (due to the mid major championship game)

Bunch of freaking cowards.

I understand your frustration but if a Mid-Major wants to get in the tourney, play and BEAT a playoff team. Going 10-1 every year against weak teams is not going to get you in. Look at what Albany is doing...scheduling big programs...if they upset a team like that when that specific team is playoff bound it will do wonders for them. I know you beat Fordham and they are in the playoffs but you can't lose to Morehead St. and get in with that schedule. You need to go 11-0 and hope to have beaten a good team on your schedule or have your one loss be to a Montana, SIU, UNI, App St., UD...you get the idea.

[th0m]

Well in all honesty Ud1Hens, they did beat a playoff team in Fordham. But just a win over Fordham just doesn't make you a playoff team. Really, with a Pioneer slate, it's hard to create a decent schedule to become a playoff team. It's not Dayton's fault that the teams in their conference aren't as good as some teams from other conferences - generating a more challenging schedule - just don't come whining when you're not invited to come play with the big boys.

[JMUSaxMRD]

If you guys want a playoff birth, play an all scholarship team schedule, and then maybe your no scholarship team will have the same credentials and get in the playoffs. That is if you can pull off a good enough record. Not our fault your SOS is poor.

[APPSTER]

Who really got woofed? The entire FCS community for not giving us a true FCS National Champion. Leaving out any 1AA conf. champs is pathetic.

The number (1) one (1) reason that no team from the mid major will ever get in is bc the committee will not allow a so-called upset or upsets to happen over a full blown FCS team. How would you like it if a team with 0 scholarships came in a smashed up a team with the full allotment. I would bet my home that the coaches/AD's lobbied to never allow a mid major team in.

Complete BS is the entire system. Needs to be changed for the better. FCS is living in the past and they need to grow up and move forward. Expansion is needed. There is no true champ in my book; there is no true champ to the general community (due to the mid major championship game)

Bunch of freaking cowards.

You guys having that Gridiron Football Classic is what's killing you. It screams "We're not worthy!"

You need to junk the GFC and then swap out Urbana for Youngstown or EKU, etc. and win. You can't go 10-1 beating up on the sisters of the poor and expect to make the playoffs. Your "exclusion" from the playoffs is your AD's fault, not the committee's.

[mvemjsunpx]

The concept of this whole thread is essentially worthless now.

With the NEC's auto-bid next year, there likely won't be a mid-major designation anymore.

[danefan]

OK folks. Let lay it out there.

Stop complaining about not getting in if you have ANY sub DI games on your schedule.

I'm sorry. If Albany can go out and get a full nonconference schedule of playoff contenders, everyone else who wants to can too.

I'm disappointed that Albany didn't make the playoffs, but its our own fault. Had we taken care of business and beat Colgate or Hofstra we would have been in. No question about it.

[UMass922]

Stop complaining about not getting in if you have ANY sub DI games on your schedule.

Agreed. A sub-FCS game can be enough to keep you out even if you play a SoCon schedule, much less a PFL schedule: just look at Georgia Southern. If their win over West Georgia was instead a win over Savannah State, the Eagles would be in the playoffs right now.

[danefan]

You guys having that Gridiron Football Classic is what's killing you. It screams "We're not worthy!"


I agree with you 100000%. I said it when the NEC signed the contract. Its a cop-out and excuse to not schedule for an at-large. Like or not, the current system is what it is. You either step up and take the challenge or you don't. Albany took the challenge and came up a little short. Oh well, move on.

Our schedule next year is even harder. xthumbsupx

[JTCowboy]

Who really got woofed? The entire FCS community for not giving us a true FCS National Champion. Leaving out any 1AA conf. champs is pathetic.

The number (1) one (1) reason that no team from the mid major will ever get in is bc the committee will not allow a so-called upset or upsets to happen over a full blown FCS team. How would you like it if a team with 0 scholarships came in a smashed up a team with the full allotment. I would bet my home that the coaches/AD's lobbied to never allow a mid major team in.

Complete BS is the entire system. Needs to be changed for the better. FCS is living in the past and they need to grow up and move forward. Expansion is needed. There is no true champ in my book; there is no true champ to the general community (due to the mid major championship game)

Bunch of freaking cowards.

This is a real easy problem to solve hot shot. Try having your Ad schedule some of these schools during the season and prove you belong in the big dance.xbawlingx

[JohnStOnge]

In my opinion, every FCS conference champion should get an automatic bid. Establish the criteria for what it takes to be a FCS conference. Then, if a conference meets those criteria, the champ gets an automatic bid. The only exception should be a "minimum number of teams" requirement. At the extreme, you obviously can't have a two team conference with its champ getting an automatic bid.

I do think it's wrong to say a league like the Pioneer is a FCS conference then say their champ isn't in. If there's a problem with the scholarship thing, tell them they have to meet a minimum scholarship requirement to be FCS. Tell that to the Ivy and Patriot too (I know the Ivy doesn't participate in the playoffs...but if being FCS requires certain minimum scholarships that's the rule).

To me, they should establish a situation where every FCS team that's a conference member controls its own destiny and doesn't have to rely on opinions and computer rankings (unless you're a chicken conference like the Ivy that'll participate in every NCAA championship tournament except football). Every FCS conference member should know, at the beginning of the season, that if they win their league they're in.

[BobbyMo]

I agree with you 100000%. I said it when the NEC signed the contract. Its a cop-out and excuse to not schedule for an at-large. Like or not, the current system is what it is. You either step up and take the challenge or you don't.

I was thinking the same thing this morning.

Also, let me say that I have seen Albany and Dayton both in person as they both played (and beat) Robert Morris.

I personally think Albany is the better team, and will show it in GIC. But that is yet to be determined.

Albany had a better chance from the start of the season when they stepped up with their OOC games. I think Dayton has a couple local games with lower division teams, and that is fine, but I dont think they should be able to complain when they do not make the playoffs.

Albany knows what it takes to get into the playoffs, and played teams that would help them reach it. They were probably one win away from making the playoffs. Albany was also head and shoulders above the rest of their conference, where as Dayton lost to Morehead.

End of rant.

EDIT: I also think every conference champion should be allowed into the playoffs.

[danefan]

In my opinion, every FCS conference champion should get an automatic bid. Establish the criteria for what it takes to be a FCS conference. Then, if a conference meets those criteria, the champ gets an automatic bid. The only exception should be a "minimum number of teams" requirement. At the extreme, you obviously can't have a two team conference with its champ getting an automatic bid.

I do think it's wrong to say a league like the Pioneer is a FCS conference then say their champ isn't in. If there's a problem with the scholarship thing, tell them they have to meet a minimum scholarship requirement to be FCS. Tell that to the Ivy and Patriot too (I know the Ivy doesn't participate in the playoffs...but if being FCS requires certain minimum scholarships that's the rule).

To me, they should establish a situation where every FCS team that's a conference member controls its own destiny and doesn't have to rely on opinions and computer rankings (unless you're a chicken conference like the Ivy that'll participate in every NCAA championship tournament except football). Every FCS conference member should know, at the beginning of the season, that if they win their league they're in.

I agree with you. And I hope it happens sooner rather than later (which I think it will). But that's not the current system. For some people to sit here and complain about a system which they knew how to beat ahead of time is just a whiner.

[danefan]

In my opinion, every FCS conference champion should get an automatic bid. Establish the criteria for what it takes to be a FCS conference. Then, if a conference meets those criteria, the champ gets an automatic bid. The only exception should be a "minimum number of teams" requirement. At the extreme, you obviously can't have a two team conference with its champ getting an automatic bid.

I do think it's wrong to say a league like the Pioneer is a FCS conference then say their champ isn't in. If there's a problem with the scholarship thing, tell them they have to meet a minimum scholarship requirement to be FCS. Tell that to the Ivy and Patriot too (I know the Ivy doesn't participate in the playoffs...but if being FCS requires certain minimum scholarships that's the rule).

To me, they should establish a situation where every FCS team that's a conference member controls its own destiny and doesn't have to rely on opinions and computer rankings (unless you're a chicken conference like the Ivy that'll participate in every NCAA championship tournament except football). Every FCS conference member should know, at the beginning of the season, that if they win their league they're in.

I agree with you. And I hope it happens sooner rather than later (which I think it will). But that's not the current system. For some people to sit here and complain about a system which they knew how to beat ahead of time is just whining.

[eaglesrthe1]

Who really got woofed? The entire FCS community for not giving us a true FCS National Champion. Leaving out any 1AA conf. champs is pathetic.

The number (1) one (1) reason that no team from the mid major will ever get in is bc the committee will not allow a so-called upset or upsets to happen over a full blown FCS team. How would you like it if a team with 0 scholarships came in a smashed up a team with the full allotment. I would bet my home that the coaches/AD's lobbied to never allow a mid major team in.

Complete BS is the entire system. Needs to be changed for the better. FCS is living in the past and they need to grow up and move forward. Expansion is needed. There is no true champ in my book; there is no true champ to the general community (due to the mid major championship game)

Bunch of freaking cowards.

I think that they should do away with AQs, and just take the best 16. Of course, that still wouldn't do the Flyers any good.xrolleyesx

[89Hen]

I feel bad for Liberty.
xconfusedx How so? They made their schedule.

[nwFL Griz]

In my opinion, every FCS conference champion should get an automatic bid. Establish the criteria for what it takes to be a FCS conference. Then, if a conference meets those criteria, the champ gets an automatic bid. The only exception should be a "minimum number of teams" requirement. At the extreme, you obviously can't have a two team conference with its champ getting an automatic bid.

I do think it's wrong to say a league like the Pioneer is a FCS conference then say their champ isn't in. If there's a problem with the scholarship thing, tell them they have to meet a minimum scholarship requirement to be FCS. Tell that to the Ivy and Patriot too (I know the Ivy doesn't participate in the playoffs...but if being FCS requires certain minimum scholarships that's the rule).

To me, they should establish a situation where every FCS team that's a conference member controls its own destiny and doesn't have to rely on opinions and computer rankings (unless you're a chicken conference like the Ivy that'll participate in every NCAA championship tournament except football). Every FCS conference member should know, at the beginning of the season, that if they win their league they're in.

Can you be serious about that? Every conference champ an AQ?

So if you take all the conference champs (we'll say 13...excluding Ivy and MAAC, for obvious reasons), that would leave you with 3 at-large berths. Meaning, this year, there would be no UNH, UD, EIU, EWU, JMU.....but we would get Liberty, Cal-Poly, Albany, Dayton and Grambling instead?

No thanks....I like it the way it is.

[SuperJon]

I feel bad for Liberty.


xconfusedx How so? They made their schedule.

Don't feel bad for us. We did our best, played great the last few weeks, and came up short. That's life. We're starting to prove to people that we're not the 1-10 team with the horrible facilities so hopefully people will start scheduling us. We still have the problem with a lot of schools that don't want to schedule "Jerry Falwell's school." It happens. There were multiple reasons why our schedule was what it was this year. We accomplished all of our goals for this season, and the playoffs would've just been the icing on the cake. The cake still tastes pretty frickin good though.

[bjtheflamesfan]

Reallly I like having 16 because it gives a significance to making it into the field. If they gave all the conference champions a berth they would have to proportionally increase the size of the playoff field to accomodate.

[flyenhigh]

I agree with you. And I hope it happens sooner rather than later (which I think it will). But that's not the current system. For some people to sit here and complain about a system which they knew how to beat ahead of time is just a whiner.

Dane please re read my original post and stop being so hard headed xbangx . The point I was trying to make was that EVERY FCS Conf. champ should get a shot in the playoffs.

[appfan2008]

adding a couple or even 4 extra spots would not hurt anything and could provide some additional aqs to shut people up!

[danefan]

Dane please re read my original post and stop being so hard headed xbangx . The point I was trying to make was that EVERY FCS Conf. champ should get a shot in the playoffs.

I agree every conference should have an AQ. If that was your point, I missed it and I apologize.

Your original post comes across as claiming that the Committee did something unjust this year. I don't think they did. xpeacex

[flyenhigh]

What is it with everyone disagreeing with me in giving every Conf. champion a slot in the playoffs? I just do not get it. IF YOU ARE A 1AA TEAM IN A 1AA CONF THE WINNER OF THE CONF DESERVES A BID. Period.

If I were Dayton, Albany, USD, Monmouth etc etc I would lobby to be D3 again or else give a freaking playoff spot. How is this so hard to grasp. Someone please explain to me why a FCS conf. champ should not be in the playoffs? Do not use the strength of schedule as a reason.

[flyenhigh]

I agree every conference should have an AQ. If that was your point, I missed it and I apologize.

Your original post comes across as claiming that the Committee did something unjust this year. I don't think they did. xpeacex

No prob.

[SuperJon]

What is it with everyone disagreeing with me in giving every Conf. champion a slot in the playoffs? I just do not get it. IF YOU ARE A 1AA TEAM IN A 1AA CONF THE WINNER OF THE CONF DESERVES A BID. Period.


Are you saying the MAAC deserves a bid? No, they don't.

Every conference doesn't deserve one. You don't see Liberty fans whining that we don't have an auto-bid and we won our conference games by an average of 30 points.

Schedule some decent teams, make an impression by beating said decent teams, then complain if you don't get in.

Amazing how there wasn't a single Dayton fan on here until a couple weeks ago.

[Appstate29]

What is it with everyone disagreeing with me in giving every Conf. champion a slot in the playoffs? I just do not get it. IF YOU ARE A 1AA TEAM IN A 1AA CONF THE WINNER OF THE CONF DESERVES A BID. Period.

If I were Dayton, Albany, USD, Monmouth etc etc I would lobby to be D3 again or else give a freaking playoff spot. How is this so hard to grasp. Someone please explain to me why a FCS conf. champ should not be in the playoffs? Do not use the strength of schedule as a reason.

Go back to being D3 and shut up.

[BearsCountry]

xconfusedx How so? They made their schedule.

It was scarsam.

[SuperJon]

Liberty's not whining. We know what happened and know how to fix it.

[flyenhigh]

Go back to being D3 and shut up.

What makes you so special? APP state?? Wow, good for you, no one in the world heard of your team until this year. Makes you feel special to crap on the likes of Dayton? Go back to being FCS xlolx xlolx xlolx

[UAalum72]

Are you saying the MAAC deserves a bid? No, they don't.
The MAAC hasn't been eligible for two years, and won't even exist as a football league next year so it doesn't matter


Every conference doesn't deserve one. You don't see Liberty fans whining that we don't have an auto-bid and we won our conference games by an average of 30 points.

That's because the Big South isn't eligible to receive a bid according to the NCAA rules. See what you think when Stony Brook joins and you're eligible to receive an auto-bid, but won't get one if the playoffs don't expand


Amazing how there wasn't a single Dayton fan on here until a couple weeks ago.

I guess you haven't been paying attention the last two years

[gophoenix]

I sort of agree with these guys. All conferences who want to be in the playoffs should get a bid. Whether that means a week of extra round games for lower seeds, so be it.

I am sort of having a problem with a team playing for a championship that couldn't win their own championship for their conference. Where's the logic in that?

[Appstate29]

What makes you so special? APP state?? Wow, good for you, no one in the world heard of your team until this year. Makes you feel special to crap on the likes of Dayton? Go back to being FCS xlolx xlolx xlolx

I couldn't care less how many people have heard of my team. I have, which is enough for me. MY TEAM puts out the full compliment of scholarships, and schedules decent (some of the selections I haven't been happy about) OOC opponents, not to mention plays in one of the (if not THE) most respected FCS conference. Sorry to hit you with a little truth in your dreamworld, but its team like YOURS that create the image FCS has. If there was scholarship reqs, attendance reqs, ect ect. Then it wouldn't take someone beating the #5 team in the nation to get our sub-division a little attention. Dayton playing Mary's School of the Blind in front of a raucous crowd of 26 is what keeps us down.

[SuperJon]

If the Big South is eligible for an auto-bid, you won't hear me complaining unless we're one of the top 8 conferences.

[gophoenix]

If the Big South is eligible for an auto-bid, you won't hear me complaining unless we're one of the top 8 conferences.

It will be interesting to see how that pans out when you guys have enough and the NEC gets better. Will they snub the OVC, Patriot or MEAC one year if times warrant it?

That is going to cause a major stink when it happens.

[McTailGator]

Who really got woofed? The entire FCS community for not giving us a true FCS National Champion. Leaving out any 1AA conf. champs is pathetic.

The number (1) one (1) reason that no team from the mid major will ever get in is bc the committee will not allow a so-called upset or upsets to happen over a full blown FCS team. How would you like it if a team with 0 scholarships came in a smashed up a team with the full allotment. I would bet my home that the coaches/AD's lobbied to never allow a mid major team in.

Complete BS is the entire system. Needs to be changed for the better. FCS is living in the past and they need to grow up and move forward. Expansion is needed. There is no true champ in my book; there is no true champ to the general community (due to the mid major championship game)

Bunch of freaking cowards.

xgiveadamnx

Is it flawed,

Yea, so what.

Do you perfer what the FBS has?

News flash...

IMO, YOUR TEAM DOESN'T PLAY IN A REAL CONFERENCE AGAINST REAL COMPETITION, IT's JUST A HOBBY FOR YOUR PLAYERS.

WANT INCLUSION, PLAY THE BIG BOY'S AND BEAT THEM REGULARLY.

[McTailGator]

xthumbsupx
Go back to being D3 and shut up.

[flyenhigh]

[QUOTE=Appstate29;749862]I couldn't care less how many people have heard of my team. I have, which is enough for me. MY TEAM puts out the full compliment of scholarships, and schedules decent (some of the selections I haven't been happy about) OOC opponents, not to mention plays in one of the (if not THE) most respected FCS conference. Sorry to hit you with a little truth in your dreamworld, but its team like YOURS that create the image FCS has. If there was scholarship reqs, attendance reqs, ect ect. Then it wouldn't take someone beating the #5 team in the nation to get our sub-division a little attention. Dayton playing Mary's School of the Blind in front of a raucous crowd of 26 is what keeps us down.[/QUOTE

Are you being serious?? You cant be serious LOL.xlolx

Are you a little man living in a big mans world too??? You act as if you are FBS. That image is FCS. You talk about attendance requirements, well, only 26 teams support an avg attendance over 12k. Dayton is towards the middle back half. See for yourself http://web1.ncaa.org/d1mfb/2007/Internet/attendance/IAA_AVGATTENDANCE.pdf

How about you stop living in a dream world. YOU ARE NOT FBS.

[flyenhigh]

xthumbsupx


Who is Mcsneeze State?? xlolx xlolx xlolx

[Appstate29]

[QUOTE=Appstate29;749862]I couldn't care less how many people have heard of my team. I have, which is enough for me. MY TEAM puts out the full compliment of scholarships, and schedules decent (some of the selections I haven't been happy about) OOC opponents, not to mention plays in one of the (if not THE) most respected FCS conference. Sorry to hit you with a little truth in your dreamworld, but its team like YOURS that create the image FCS has. If there was scholarship reqs, attendance reqs, ect ect. Then it wouldn't take someone beating the #5 team in the nation to get our sub-division a little attention. Dayton playing Mary's School of the Blind in front of a raucous crowd of 26 is what keeps us down.[/QUOTE

Are you being serious?? You cant be serious LOL.xlolx

Are you a little man living in a big mans world too??? You act as if you are FBS. That image is FCS. You talk about attendance requirements, well, only 26 teams support an avg attendance over 12k. Dayton is towards the middle back half. See for yourself http://web1.ncaa.org/d1mfb/2007/Internet/attendance/IAA_AVGATTENDANCE.pdf

How about you stop living in a dream world. YOU ARE NOT FBS.

Nor do I want to to be FBS, I like the playoffs. However, I want to see the FCS as a whole act more like their own sub-division, with rules and reqs, not just "Hey I want to play division I basketball and still have football, but I'll be damned if i'm going to spend money on it..."

[FCS_Advocacy5]

I couldn't care less how many people have heard of my team. I have, which is enough for me. MY TEAM puts out the full compliment of scholarships, and schedules decent (some of the selections I haven't been happy about) OOC opponents, not to mention plays in one of the (if not THE) most respected FCS conference. Sorry to hit you with a little truth in your dreamworld, but its team like YOURS that create the image FCS has. If there was scholarship reqs, attendance reqs, ect ect. Then it wouldn't take someone beating the #5 team in the nation to get our sub-division a little attention. Dayton playing Mary's School of the Blind in front of a raucous crowd of 26 is what keeps us down.


I would not be so quick to knock Dayton's attendance this year. They did have around 5500 people on average for their home games with their largest crowd being 8,000 against San Diego. Their stadium holds over 11,000 and will more than likely sell out for the Gridiron Classic on Dec. 1 against Albany.

If my memory serves me correctly I think Delaware State holds 6500 xwhistlex

Not too bad for playing teams which have to be led to the field by canes and seeing eye dogs. :D

[McTailGator]

Who is Mcsneeze State?? xlolx xlolx xlolx

a REAL TEAM

No 2 seed in a playoff system your team will NEVER participate in.

[flyenhigh]

Never heard of you. You guys from Canada?

[flyenhigh]

[QUOTE=flyenhigh;749952]

Nor do I want to to be FBS, I like the playoffs. However, I want to see the FCS as a whole act more like their own sub-division, with rules and reqs, not just "Hey I want to play division I basketball and still have football, but I'll be damned if i'm going to spend money on it..."

Do some homework, please! Dayton was forced in to the 1AA. xnonox

[BigApp]

Sorry to hit you with a little truth in your dreamworld, but its team like YOURS that create the image FCS has. If there was scholarship reqs, attendance reqs, ect ect. Then it wouldn't take someone beating the #5 team in the nation to get our sub-division a little attention. Dayton playing Mary's School of the Blind in front of a raucous crowd of 26 is what keeps us down.

xhurrayx xhurrayx xhurrayx HALLELUJAH!xhurrayx xhurrayx xhurrayx

http://www.thruthebible.org/atf/cf/%7BFEA5B386-48F1-4797-9023-5F77EED319B7%7D/McGee%20preaching.jpg

[Appstate29]

[QUOTE=Appstate29;749969]

Do some homework, please! Dayton was forced in to the 1AA. xnonox

Ohh i'm well aware of the situation, and would love to have it back to the way it was.

[BigApp]

IMO, YOUR TEAM DOESN'T PLAY IN A REAL CONFERENCE AGAINST REAL COMPETITION, IT's JUST A HOBBY.



I think I've just found my new signature! Do you mind?? :D

[Appstate29]

I think I've just found my new signature! Do you mind?? :D

go play intramurals, brother!

[McTailGator]

I think I've just found my new signature! Do you mind?? :D

OK, but I want a percentage if it makes you rich, xsmiley_wix

[siugrad99]

Quit your cryin, you want to play with the big boys you can't just schedule 1 FCS team and think that is good enough. Plenty of FCS teams beat BCS teams this year and you don't hear us crying to be included in the bowl games. Get over and play your Gridiron Classic and like it.

[downbythebeach]

While I do think that every conference that meets the NCAA's written requirements for autobid should get one...........keep this thread going the way it is cause some of these one liners are pretty funny....atleast to me

[BigApp]

OK, but I want a percentage if it makes you rich, xsmiley_wix

And if it sends me to the poorhouse? xeyebrowx xlolx

I dolled it up a little...hope you don't mind xthumbsupx

[texcap]

What is it with everyone disagreeing with me in giving every Conf. champion a slot in the playoffs? I just do not get it. IF YOU ARE A 1AA TEAM IN A 1AA CONF THE WINNER OF THE CONF DESERVES A BID. Period.

If I were Dayton, Albany, USD, Monmouth etc etc I would lobby to be D3 again or else give a freaking playoff spot. How is this so hard to grasp. Someone please explain to me why a FCS conf. champ should not be in the playoffs? Do not use the strength of schedule as a reason.

I agree with you. However, I do not think several of the conferences that are now DI should be DI conferences. There are several schools that are DI for one reason only: Basketball. They are allowed to play non-scholly football at the DI level so that there basketball teams can be DI. I think that the NCAA needs to allow an exception for DI in basketball like they do for hockey and require scholarships for all DI football members. If they do not offer scholarships in football, then they should be DIII like therest of the schools that are non-scholarship.

[TheValleyRaider]

In my opinion, every FCS conference champion should get an automatic bid. Establish the criteria for what it takes to be a FCS conference. Then, if a conference meets those criteria, the champ gets an automatic bid. The only exception should be a "minimum number of teams" requirement. At the extreme, you obviously can't have a two team conference with its champ getting an automatic bid.

I do think it's wrong to say a league like the Pioneer is a FCS conference then say their champ isn't in. If there's a problem with the scholarship thing, tell them they have to meet a minimum scholarship requirement to be FCS. Tell that to the Ivy and Patriot too (I know the Ivy doesn't participate in the playoffs...but if being FCS requires certain minimum scholarships that's the rule).

To me, they should establish a situation where every FCS team that's a conference member controls its own destiny and doesn't have to rely on opinions and computer rankings (unless you're a chicken conference like the Ivy that'll participate in every NCAA championship tournament except football). Every FCS conference member should know, at the beginning of the season, that if they win their league they're in.

I agree, except that the requirements for an autobid are actually pretty-well spelled-out (at least, they are now)

Because there are 16 teams in the playoffs, you can only have 8 autobids (at least half the field has to be at-larges). To qualify for an autobid conference you need:
-at least 6 members
-at least 6 who have been together for a minimum amount of time (I think it's 3 years?)
-to submit an application

There are 12 conferences that currently meet these requirements. Of those 12, 8 have autos (Big Sky, CAA, Gateway, MEAC, OVC, Patriot, Southern, Southland), 3 choose not to apply (Ivy, SWAC and Pioneer), and 1 has yet to be awarded a bid (NEC). The Great West doesn't qualify, and unfortunately for them, with the XDSUs leaving, it doesn't look like they will anytime soon. The Big South will get over the hump with Presby and Stony Brook, and while they have to wait, dollars to donughts bets that they apply when they have eligibility.

Playoff expansion, for now, only rewards the NEC, unless the Pioneer, SWAC or Ivies decided to join up as well.

[APPSTER]

All FCS conferences get an autobid? Why should conferences that do not fully support football scholarships be rewarded with a playoff spot? 1st round games with scores of 56-10 are a waste of time. Your teams will not be able to compete for a championship until they commit to football.

I'd rather see I-AAA football with the NEC, PFL, Big South, etc and let them play for their own championship.

[D1B]

In my opinion, every FCS conference champion should get an automatic bid. Establish the criteria for what it takes to be a FCS conference. Then, if a conference meets those criteria, the champ gets an automatic bid. The only exception should be a "minimum number of teams" requirement. At the extreme, you obviously can't have a two team conference with its champ getting an automatic bid.

I do think it's wrong to say a league like the Pioneer is a FCS conference then say their champ isn't in. If there's a problem with the scholarship thing, tell them they have to meet a minimum scholarship requirement to be FCS. Tell that to the Ivy and Patriot too (I know the Ivy doesn't participate in the playoffs...but if being FCS requires certain minimum scholarships that's the rule).

To me, they should establish a situation where every FCS team that's a conference member controls its own destiny and doesn't have to rely on opinions and computer rankings (unless you're a chicken conference like the Ivy that'll participate in every NCAA championship tournament except football). Every FCS conference member should know, at the beginning of the season, that if they win their league they're in.

Not in football. I'd be pissed beyond belief if Dayton got in and a third or 4th place Gateway, socon, CAA, BSC was left out. If your going to do something like this, it should be based on high national ranking or have a play in game between those weak ass conferences.

[blukeys]

Any selection process that keeps the weak kneed, tutu wearing, members of the PFL out of the FCS playoffs is great in my book.

The PFL (otherwise known as the Pathetic Football League) is a group of posers pretending to be real FCS teams. They typically schedule D-3 and D-2 teams to inflate their records and then try to make hay off of one decent showing against FCS teams. In short they are fakers and posers who do not deserve the time of day of any FCS adherent. Dayton, USD etc. would never come close to a winning record against real FCS competition such as the CAA, Gateway, or the SoCon.

This is why they duck scheduling these 3 conferences despite proximity to all. There is a wealth of OOC opportunities for the Pathetic Football League but they ignore them for the Ivies and the Northern Colorados of the world.

In the past the selection committee has said emphatically that strength of schedule is important. They have confirmed this with their picks. Why are the denizens of Dayton so dense????????

This was told told to USD just last year and yet the Dayton PFL folks are whining and crying like babies. xbabycryx xbabycryx
Wake up, smell the coffee, and change your business plan. Albany and Stony Brook got the message.

Why are the members of the Pathetic Football league so dumb about what they need to do??????????????

[UMass922]

Can you be serious about that? Every conference champ an AQ?

So if you take all the conference champs (we'll say 13...excluding Ivy and MAAC, for obvious reasons), that would leave you with 3 at-large berths. Meaning, this year, there would be no UNH, UD, EIU, EWU, JMU.....but we would get Liberty, Cal-Poly, Albany, Dayton and Grambling instead?

No thanks....I like it the way it is.

I believe the NCAA mandates there be at least as many at-large berths as automatic bids. That's why the playoffs are expanding by two teams next season even though just one more auto-bid (for the NEC) is being added. So if there were 13 auto-bids, there would have to be at least 13 at-large teams.

[UNCBears2010]

To all the SoCon, CAA, etc. fans on here saying that not every conference deserves, I pose a question:

How would you like it if your basketball team won the conference title and DIDN'T go to the Big Dance?

I say expand to 24 teams, let all the conference champs in, and let the mid-major champs get pummeled in the first round like in basketball. It's a great experience for the players to play in the playoffs and great exposure for the schools, conferences, and FCS football.

[Tribe4SF]

To all the SoCon, CAA, etc. fans on here saying that not every conference deserves, I pose a question:

How would you like it if your basketball team won the conference title and DIDN'T go to the Big Dance?

I say expand to 24 teams, let all the conference champs in, and let the mid-major champs get pummeled in the first round like in basketball. It's a great experience for the players to play in the playoffs and great exposure for the schools, conferences, and FCS football.

For those of us in the CAA, there's no concern about basketball. We've become a multi-bid conference in that sport.:D

Part of the reason we are is that CAA teams play tough OOC schedules in basketball. Tribe has already played Georgetown, and NC State. This ain't rocket science, boys and girls.

[Grabholdofyosef]

Not in football. I'd be pissed beyond belief if Dayton got in and a third or 4th place Gateway, socon, CAA, BSC was left out. If your going to do something like this, it should be based on high national ranking or have a play in game between those weak ass conferences.
I have an idea. The NCAA could throw the lesser conferences a bone and have the lowest ranked two teams that auto qualify play in a play-in with the winner getting to play the #1 seed the next week. It could be played in Dayton every year. Wait...this sounds oddly familiar : )

[AppMan]

APP state?? Wow, good for you, no one in the world heard of your team until this year.

In other words, nobody gives a rats a$$ about FCS football. Interesting.

[lucchesicourt]

If USD, arguably the best non schollie team the last two years, cannot beat an average UCD team at best (presently), how do you guys think you could compete with the top teams in the FCS. I am sorry, but I have seen USD twice and have been unimpressed by their team. And, I bet you have been unimpressed with our UCD team (me too). But, the fact is the top teams of FCS would easily handle USD and Dayton and us too. In the past two years, Josh Johnson has completed around 50% of his passes against a weak UCD secondary for FCS standards, and yet has completed 70% of his passes against the rest of his competition, Does anyone think he his NFL caliber? I don't after seeing him play twice against UCD. He is a good QB, but not an elite IMHO. Our QB against a weak USD secondary, has faired much better than USD Qb's in both games.

[AppMan]

[QUOTE=Appstate29;749969]

Do some homework, please! Dayton was forced in to the 1AA. xnonox

Dayton was one of those schools trying to have their cake and eat it too by playing D-III football and D-I basketball. The only mistake the NCAA made was not mandating schools like Dayton pony up and fund a minimum number of scholarships to play football or drop your basketball program to D-III as well.

[AppMan]

I say expand to 24 teams, let all the conference champs in, and let the mid-major champs get pummeled in the first round like in basketball. It's a great experience for the players to play in the playoffs and great exposure for the schools, conferences, and FCS football.

It will never happen, but I say divide the playoffs into two divisions of 8 teams and let the non/low scholarship guys have their own party. If you want to play with the big boys your conference programs must fund 90% of the allowed scholarships over a two year period. IMO, it would be better to see fewer, but larger conferences with two divisions and conference championship games that essentially serve as the 1st round of the playoffs. Then take those 8 conference champions and let them play it off.

[Dane96]

For those of us in the CAA, there's no concern about basketball. We've become a multi-bid conference in that sport.:D

Part of the reason we are is that CAA teams play tough OOC schedules in basketball. Tribe has already played Georgetown, and NC State. This ain't rocket science, boys and girls.

Not to get into a different argument, but don't expect MULTI-BIDS every year. The CAA is a fantastic conference, however with super league like the SEC, ACC, and Big East-- More bids will be going there way than EVER...especially for fear of the NCAA losing teams from Super Conferences that would normally go to the NIT to this NEW THIRD TOURNAMENT.

This year, only ONE MAG picked the CAA for multi-bids.

[DetroitFlyer]

If USD, arguably the best non schollie team the last two years, cannot beat an average UCD team at best (presently), how do you guys think you could compete with the top teams in the FCS. I am sorry, but I have seen USD twice and have been unimpressed by their team. And, I bet you have been unimpressed with our UCD team (me too). But, the fact is the top teams of FCS would easily handle USD and Dayton and us too. In the past two years, Josh Johnson has completed around 50% of his passes against a weak UCD secondary for FCS standards, and yet has completed 70% of his passes against the rest of his competition, Does anyone think he his NFL caliber? I don't after seeing him play twice against UCD. He is a good QB, but not an elite IMHO. Our QB against a weak USD secondary, has faired much better than USD Qb's in both games.

Duh.... DAYTON DEFEATED PLAYOFF TEAM FORDHAM, AT FORDHAM. How is it somehow OK for Fordham to get a bid, but not Dayton? This process is nothing but good old boys stroking each other and awarding bids to their buddies! I suffered through the Waves broadcast yesterday and that dude that was on trying to explain this corrupt process would have made any politician proud. To Ralph's credit, he did try to pin him down, and that dude squirmed out of an honest answer in every regard. The bottom line is that the committee picked whoever the he__ they felt like picking, period. It has little to do with picking the "best" 8 at large teams. Two teams from the weak OVC CLEARLY show how corrupt this process has become. The OVC is on a par with the PFL this year. The OVC gets two teams in, the PFL none. Frankly, you are all simply afraid of getting your butts kicked by a PFL team in the playoffs! ( By the way, DAYTON won the PFL this year, not San Diego ). xmadx

[lucchesicourt]

Yes. I know Dayton won the PFL this year. I said over the past two years. Everyone who has been raving about USD needs to realize USD is just an AVERAGE FCS team and NOT a power. Dayton probably falls in the same category, but I have not seen them play. I can only base my opinion on what I have seen. Do I think Dayton could beat UCD? NO!!! Again, we are currently a mediocre FCS team, IMHO.

[DetroitFlyer]

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/sagarin/fbc07.htm

What would Sagarin have to say?

Albany - 150

Dayton - 154

FORDHAM - 157

San Diego - 166

EASTERN ILLINOIS - 170

Norfolk State - 176

Alabama A&M - 178

OVC - 36.28
PFL - 33.46

Last week, the PFL was ranked above the OVC.

Let's face it, the fact that the OVC got two teams in, from one of the weakest conferences in FCS, and the PFL got ZERO teams in from a conference ranked about the same as the OVC, tells me this process 100%corrupt and is the ultimate in a good ole boys network! Both Albany and Dayton deserved to go over Eastern Illinois, and both deserved to go over the teams the talking heads had in the mix. Corrupt, corrupt, corrupt.... Frankly, anyone on this committee should be embarrassed to show his/her face in public!xmadx

[downbythebeach]

For those of us in the CAA, there's no concern about basketball. We've become a multi-bid conference in that sport.

LOL since when????????????????????/xlolx xlolx

[DetroitFlyer]

OK folks. Let lay it out there.

Stop complaining about not getting in if you have ANY sub DI games on your schedule.

I'm sorry. If Albany can go out and get a full nonconference schedule of playoff contenders, everyone else who wants to can too.

I'm disappointed that Albany didn't make the playoffs, but its our own fault. Had we taken care of business and beat Colgate or Hofstra we would have been in. No question about it.


Frankly, I find it amusing to read the fantasy of Albany fans. A few short years ago, they were all generally, firmly in step with posters like me, ( whether they admit it or not ). Since that did not work, most started to adopt a "if we can't beat em, join em" type of attitude. While it has garnered increased support on this board, the playoff committee does not give a darn! What Albany fans have not seemed to grasp is that the only way a NEC or PFL team ever gets a bid is to essentially walk on freaking water. As for as I know, that has only happened once by the way....

A NEC or PFL team has to go out and schedule 4, top level, FCS teams. Mind you a Northern Colorado will simply not do.... Then, you have to go out and win at least two of those four games, AND THEN GO UNDEFEATED IN YOUR CONFERENCE. Upon doing that, you just might, maybe, sort of, possibly, might be in contention for the 16th and final spot with power teams like Norfolk State, Alabama A&M, and who would have thunk, Eastern illinios....

This process is largely corrupt and obviously rewards the OVC rule, even though it has never been passed or "officially" adopted by the NCAA.

Keep drinking the koolaid Albany fans. Maybe you will move into a full scholly league sometime in the future or maybe the NEC will gain an AQ. Otherwise, prepare for more years of frustration and enjoy watching Eastern Illinois on TV in the playoffs or some other "deserving" team like them.

I think I am going to puke!!!!!xmadx

[DFW HOYA]

Dayton was one of those schools trying to have their cake and eat it too by playing D-III football and D-I basketball. The only mistake the NCAA made was not mandating schools like Dayton pony up and fund a minimum number of scholarships to play football or drop your basketball program to D-III as well.

That was no mistake. There is no miniumum scholarship requirement in any NCAA Division I sport outside I-A football--not basketball, not baseball, much less tennis or golf.

[APPSTER]

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/sagarin/fbc07.htm

What would Sagarin have to say?

Albany - 150

Dayton - 154

FORDHAM - 157

San Diego - 166

EASTERN ILLINOIS - 170

Norfolk State - 176

Alabama A&M - 178

OVC - 36.28
PFL - 33.46

Last week, the PFL was ranked above the OVC.

Let's face it, the fact that the OVC got two teams in, from one of the weakest conferences in FCS, and the PFL got ZERO teams in from a conference ranked about the same as the OVC, tells me this process 100%corrupt and is the ultimate in a good ole boys network! Both Albany and Dayton deserved to go over Eastern Illinois, and both deserved to go over the teams the talking heads had in the mix. Corrupt, corrupt, corrupt.... Frankly, anyone on this committee should be embarrassed to show his/her face in public!xmadx

The AD's of the PFL and the NEC have given the committee an "out" by scheduling the GFC on Dec 1st. A win over Fordham isn't going to overcome your weak schedule. Instead of comparing your league to the OVC on paper, how about playing those teams on the field?

You have a right to be mad, but you should be mad at your AD and the adminstration. No playoffs until you: a) schedule and b) beat good FCS teams. Albany is on the right track and they will "earn" their autobid next year because their AD is scheduling a good OOC slate.

[FCS Preview]

For those of us in the CAA, there's no concern about basketball. We've become a multi-bid conference in that sport.:D



LOL since when????????????????????/xlolx xlolx

Since 2006.

2006: UNC-Wilmington, George Mason
2007: Old Dominion, Virginia Commonwealth.

:D

[Dane96]

Frankly, I find it amusing to read the fantasy of Albany fans. A few short years ago, they were all generally, firmly in step with posters like me, ( whether they admit it or not ). Since that did not work, most started to adopt a "if we can't beat em, join em" type of attitude. While it has garnered increased support on this board, the playoff committee does not give a darn! What Albany fans have not seemed to grasp is that the only way a NEC or PFL team ever gets a bid is to essentially walk on freaking water. As for as I know, that has only happened once by the way....

A NEC or PFL team has to go out and schedule 4, top level, FCS teams. Mind you a Northern Colorado will simply not do.... Then, you have to go out and win at least two of those four games, AND THEN GO UNDEFEATED IN YOUR CONFERENCE. Upon doing that, you just might, maybe, sort of, possibly, might be in contention for the 16th and final spot with power teams like Norfolk State, Alabama A&M, and who would have thunk, Eastern illinios....

This process is largely corrupt and obviously rewards the OVC rule, even though it has never been passed or "officially" adopted by the NCAA.

Keep drinking the koolaid Albany fans. Maybe you will move into a full scholly league sometime in the future or maybe the NEC will gain an AQ. Otherwise, prepare for more years of frustration and enjoy watching Eastern Illinois on TV in the playoffs or some other "deserving" team like them.

I think I am going to puke!!!!!xmadx

Ummmm...NO. The only thing we agreed with you on is that ALL conferences should have autobids. Other than that, we have ragged on your schedule since we moved to DI.

[eaglesrthe1]

What is it with everyone disagreeing with me in giving every Conf. champion a slot in the playoffs? I just do not get it. IF YOU ARE A 1AA TEAM IN A 1AA CONF THE WINNER OF THE CONF DESERVES A BID. Period.

If I were Dayton, Albany, USD, Monmouth etc etc I would lobby to be D3 again or else give a freaking playoff spot. How is this so hard to grasp. Someone please explain to me why a FCS conf. champ should not be in the playoffs? Do not use the strength of schedule as a reason.

That's like someone saying why am I a fatass? Do not use my gluttony as a reason.

Why am I a drunk? Do not use the fact that I drink like a fish as a reason.

Why do I have emphysema? Don't use my 3 pack a day habit as a reason.xbawlingx xbawlingx

[Dane96]

Since 2006.

2006: UNC-Wilmington, George Mason
2007: Old Dominion, Virginia Commonwealth.

:D

And Hofstra SHOULD have been a third. That being said, this will NOT be a regular thing IMHO.

[AppMan]

That was no mistake. There is no miniumum scholarship requirement in any NCAA Division I sport outside I-A football--not basketball, not baseball, much less tennis or golf.

I know that! My point is.... The NCAA mandates a program must fund 90% of the allowable 85 scholarships over a two year period in order to compete at the 1-A/FBS level. The mistake made by the NCAA, imo, was not having a similar requirement to play at the 1-aa/FCS level.

[UAalum72]

You have a right to be mad, but you should be mad at your AD and the adminstration. No playoffs until you: a) schedule and b) beat good FCS teams. Albany is on the right track and they will "earn" their autobid next year because their AD is scheduling a good OOC slate.
And Eastern Illinois got, not an auto-bid, but an at-large, on the strength of its 46-point loss to an FBS, a loss to 4-7 Illinois State, and its lone out of conference win over ... INDIANA STATE?

[SuperJon]

I'd rather see I-AAA football with the NEC, PFL, Big South, etc and let them play for their own championship.

Whoa whoa whoa, we're a full scholarship league. Don't throw us in with them.

[SuperJon]

What Albany fans have not seemed to grasp is that the only way a NEC or PFL team ever gets a bid is to essentially walk on freaking water. As for as I know, that has only happened once by the way....


It actually happened twice, but who needs details...

[McNeese_beat]

Not in football. I'd be pissed beyond belief if Dayton got in and a third or 4th place Gateway, socon, CAA, BSC was left out. If your going to do something like this, it should be based on high national ranking or have a play in game between those weak ass conferences.

I wouldn't go changing the current system. I've made this point before and I'll make it again. If you tell a lot of the limited-scholarship/no scholarship programs that they have to either fully fund the sport (however you define that) or not be allowed in the FCS, that will force the hand of many of them to just drop football. I think for many of the limited scholarship schools, being in Division I and having access to NCAA basketball tournament revenue is more important than having football.

So such a move would be bad for the sport because you would cut down the number of opportunities for young men to play the game at the college level.

EDIT: I do think I responded to the wrong post. John St.Onge made a point about allowing all conferences in the playoffs, but forcing them to fully fund the sport...it was in reply to that.

[downbythebeach]

Since 2006.

2006: UNC-Wilmington, George Mason
2007: Old Dominion, Virginia Commonwealth.

:D

I go to Mason and have followed their team and CAA basketball for years....

LOL I was hoping someone was going to say thatxlolx

[URMite]

[QUOTE=Appstate29;749969]

Do some homework, please! Dayton was forced in to the 1AA. xnonox

Whoa! When did the NCAA start mandating that colleges have to offer football? Is that going to happen to everyone?xeekx :p xsmiley_wix

I can see all conference that meet minimum requirement receiving an AQ but there does need to be a requirement beyond just having 6 teams. Instead of trying to force scholarships, how about requiring scheduling? To have an AQ no conference team can play 3 or more Non_DI teams, and no more than 2 can play 2 non-DI teams.

That would create a better basis for requiring a miniumum performance on the field. Instead of just having the potential to perform on the field in post season.

[APPSTER]

Whoa whoa whoa, we're a full scholarship league. Don't throw us in with them.

Sorry.....my bad.

[DetroitFlyer]

[QUOTE=flyenhigh;750021]

Whoa! When did the NCAA start mandating that colleges have to offer football? Is that going to happen to everyone?xeekx :p xsmiley_wix

I can see all conference that meet minimum requirement receiving an AQ but there does need to be a requirement beyond just having 6 teams. Instead of trying to force scholarships, how about requiring scheduling? To have an AQ no conference team can play 3 or more Non_DI teams, and no more than 2 can play 2 non-DI teams.

That would create a better basis for requiring a miniumum performance on the field. Instead of just having the potential to perform on the field in post season.


At first glance this sounds reasonable. In principle, I agree. But.... I look at Butler and Valparaiso as the poster children here.... This past year, both scheduled all of their OOC games against sub-FCS teams. Butler went 4-0, while Valpo went 3-1. Let's remember that is has been a while since either program enjoyed much success.... In conference play, Butler lost every game while Valpo defeated only Butler. So Butler finishes 4-7 on the season, while Valpo finishes 5-6. Not great by most standards, but far better than 0-11 or 1-10.... Odds are the supporters are not clammoring to kill the program with a 4-7 or 5-6 record, but put together a 0-11 season or a 1-10 season and see what happens.... ( La Salle )?

As a league this season, the PFL went 16-2 against sub-FCS teams. I hate these games, but at least we won most of them. I understand why Butler and Valpo scheduled the way they did. My expectation would be that they slowly improve their schedules as their programs get back on their feet. Mandating that they schedule all FCS teams might just kill both programs.... Maybe that is what many here at AGS want, but the bottom line is that forcing programs into the graveyard is not a good thing.

Dayton defeating Fordham, at Fordham, is evidence enough that the PFL champion can be competitive in the playoffs if nothing changed today except for the PFL champion receiving a bid.

I swear that everything bad about FBS has infiltrated FCS in a manner that it is becomming just as corrupt! FCS exists 100% for cost containment. Now, we want to define just enough cost containment but not too much cost containment.... Dayton and Albany were both left out of the playoffs because of the "OVC Rule" and even the teams that go in were shafted by travel plans designed to maximize revenue.... Follow the money to FBS corruption. Franky, it makes me want to puke!!!!

[flyenhigh]

There are a lot of comments on here that make my head spin. It is very interesting that so many people hate the PFL so much.

Let me make myself clear: THE FCS IS NOT THE FBS

Let me make myself clear: NOT ONE FCS TEAM MAKES MONEY FOR THEIR SCHOOL

Let me make myself clear: NOT EVEN APP STATE IS FBS

Let me make myself clear: FCS is corrupt


Many of you talk as if 1AA football is the king of kings, the NFL of football. Head check, every team in the FCS is sub par to 99% of the FBS teams. That being said 1AA in comprised of many walks of life and that is what makes it fun and exciting. It is ashame that so many of you want to see Dayton and the PFL for that matter the Ivy move to another division. Fact: the IVY and PFL teams have lots of national exposure that CAN help FCS gain attention.

FRANKLY I AM DISGUSTED WITH MANY OF YOU.

[BlueHen86]

There are a lot of comments on here that make my head spin. It is very interesting that so many people hate the PFL so much.

Let me make myself clear: THE FCS IS NOT THE FBS

Let me make myself clear: NOT ONE FCS TEAM MAKES MONEY FOR THEIR SCHOOL

Let me make myself clear: NOT EVEN APP STATE IS FBS

Let me make myself clear: FCS is corrupt


Many of you talk as if 1AA football is the king of kings, the NFL of football. Head check, every team in the FCS is sub par to 99% of the FBS teams. That being said 1AA in comprised of many walks of life and that is what makes it fun and exciting. It is ashame that so many of you want to see Dayton and the PFL for that matter the Ivy move to another division. Fact: the IVY and PFL teams have lots of national exposure that CAN help FCS gain attention.

FRANKLY I AM DISGUSTED WITH MANY OF YOU.

I'm disgusted with the PFL people who continuously cry about missing the playoffs, but won't admit that their school doesn't do what is required to get in.

The committee has repeatedly rewarded strength of schedule.
The PFL teams (except for Drake) repeatly schedule weak OOC teams.

Schedule like Albany, win 2 or 3 OOC games and then you have an argument.

Until then stop crying when the committee overlooks you because you schedule two non-Div I teams every year.

BTW - I don't hate your league, just your schedule.

[UDChE89]

There are a lot of comments on here that make my head spin. It is very interesting that so many people hate the PFL so much.

Let me make myself clear: THE FCS IS NOT THE FBS

Let me make myself clear: NOT ONE FCS TEAM MAKES MONEY FOR THEIR SCHOOL
Let me make myself clear: NOT EVEN APP STATE IS FBS

Let me make myself clear: FCS is corrupt


Many of you talk as if 1AA football is the king of kings, the NFL of football. Head check, every team in the FCS is sub par to 99% of the FBS teams. That being said 1AA in comprised of many walks of life and that is what makes it fun and exciting. It is ashame that so many of you want to see Dayton and the PFL for that matter the Ivy move to another division. Fact: the IVY and PFL teams have lots of national exposure that CAN help FCS gain attention.

FRANKLY I AM DISGUSTED WITH MANY OF YOU.


Fine, be disgusted with us but it's hard to take anything you say without a grain of salt when you're clearly wrong. Just from a quick glance of the Office of Postsecondary Education website http://ope.ed.gov/athletics/main.asp, you can see in that the year ending 6/30/07 that the following was true...

Delaware $5.53M Revenue $4.02M Expenses $1.51M Profit
Montana $7.47M Revenue $4.80M Expenses $2.67M Profit
App. St. $4.55M Revenue $1.97M Expenses $2.58M Profit

[flyenhigh]

Fine, be disgusted with us but it's hard to take anything you say without a grain of salt when you're clearly wrong. Just from a quick glance of the Office of Postsecondary Education website http://ope.ed.gov/athletics/main.asp, you can see in that the year ending 6/30/07 that the following was true...

Delaware $5.53M Revenue $4.02M Expenses $1.51M Profit
Montana $7.47M Revenue $4.80M Expenses $2.67M Profit
App. St. $4.55M Revenue $1.97M Expenses $2.58M Profit

I do not have time to dissect that web site. So I will take your word for it although I am very skeptical. And if in fact this info is correct, I would bet everything that the only reason they were in the green was from some money games. Anyway, three teams out of 1AA making money is a bust therefore your side of the argument is flawed. 1AA will never be profitable on paper.

That being said with a grain of salt my points have some merit whether you care to agree or not.

FCS football needs to redirect and be managed much better. Regroup please because as it stands now IMO it is a mess.

[flyenhigh]

I'm disgusted with the PFL people who continuously cry about missing the playoffs, but won't admit that their school doesn't do what is required to get in.

The committee has repeatedly rewarded strength of schedule.
The PFL teams (except for Drake) repeatly schedule weak OOC teams.

Schedule like Albany, win 2 or 3 OOC games and then you have an argument.

Until then stop crying when the committee overlooks you because you schedule two non-Div I teams every year.

BTW - I don't hate your league, just your schedule.


My argument is that each 1AA conf champ should be in the playoffs. Yes, every one. If they cannot grant that wish if I was Dayton/PFL/NEC etc etc I would look for other ways to play football. What a shame.

[AppMan]

..... if I was Dayton/PFL/NEC etc etc I would look for other ways to play football.

Now you're talking!

[BlueHen86]

My argument is that each 1AA conf champ should be in the playoffs. Yes, every one. If they cannot grant that wish if I was Dayton/PFL/NEC etc etc I would look for other ways to play football. What a shame.


You mean like Arena Football? Theres an idea for you.xthumbsupx

I can see it now: 2008 Bradley-Terry FCS Arena Football Rankings. xlolx

[saluki_in_ohio]

Never heard of you. You guys from Canada?

Dayton football?

Heck, Even people living in Montgomery County, OH don't even know Dayton plays football....

[OhioHen]

I have an idea. The NCAA could throw the lesser conferences a bone and have the lowest ranked two teams that auto qualify play in a play-in with the winner getting to play the #1 seed the next week. It could be played in Dayton every year. Wait...this sounds oddly familiar : )

I would probably attend the play-in game if my schedule allowed it. Wellcome Stadium in Dayton is less than 45 minutes from my house.

[OhioHen]

I do not have time to dissect that web site. So I will take your word for it although I am very skeptical. And if in fact this info is correct, I would bet everything that the only reason they were in the green was from some money games.

Those "money games" would be every home game at The Tub, Wa-Griz, and Kidd-Brewer!!! xnodx xnodx xnodx

[Cranium716]

Dayton's OOC Schedule since 2000:

2000: Tiffin (D-II), Ohio Northern (D-III), Yale, Robert Morris, Saint Joseph's (D-II) - 2 D-II & 1 D-III
2001: Saint Francis, Robert Morris, Duquesne, Canisius, Saint Mary's
2002: Saint Francis, Robert Morris, Duquesne, Tiffin (D-II), Canisius - 1 D-II
2003: Saint Joseph's (D-II), Ohio Northern (D-III), Saint Peter's (discontinued, not sure of division), Tiffin (D-II) - at least 2 D-II & 1 D-III
2004: Tiffin (D-II), Yale, Robert Morris - 1 D-II
2005: Tiffin (D-II), Wittenberg (D-III) - 1 D-II & 1 D-III
2006: Robert Morris, Wittenberg (D-III) - 1 D-III
2007: Robert Morris, Urbana (NAIA), Central State (D-II)- 1 D-II & 1 NAIA

Take a look at this schedule and tell me that you think that this is a schedule worthy of contention into the playoffs. Dayton's OOC includes since 2000 includes 8 D-II opponents, 4 D-III opponents, and 1 NAIA opponent. If you can tell me with a straight face and tell me that this is a challenging schedule then you're smoking something. Either convince your school to fire your AD or stop whining! If you want to play with the best for the NC, then play the best during the regular season!

[lizrdgizrd]

Who really got woofed? The entire FCS community for not giving us a true FCS National Champion. Leaving out any 1AA conf. champs is pathetic.

The number (1) one (1) reason that no team from the mid major will ever get in is bc the committee will not allow a so-called upset or upsets to happen over a full blown FCS team. How would you like it if a team with 0 scholarships came in a smashed up a team with the full allotment. I would bet my home that the coaches/AD's lobbied to never allow a mid major team in.

Complete BS is the entire system. Needs to be changed for the better. FCS is living in the past and they need to grow up and move forward. Expansion is needed. There is no true champ in my book; there is no true champ to the general community (due to the mid major championship game)

Bunch of freaking cowards.
xnonox xbawlingx

[flyenhigh]

Dayton football?

Heck, Even people living in Montgomery County, OH don't even know Dayton plays football....

Considering the fact NCAA made a rule simply due to the success of Dayton Football "The Dayton Rule" your comment makes no sense.

Once again, the idea of FCS not allowing the conf champ to go to the playoffs is not in any FCS member’s best interest. For one it creates confusion for many in the general public. It also separates 1AA in a way that causes even more confusion. That said NCAA needs to change for the better.

In regards to Dayton’s non-conf schedule, I am well aware that UD does not typically have a very difficult schedule. If I were the AD at Dayton I would do everything in my power to change that. But, neither I nor any of the fans on this site are.

In one way, I want UD to go back to the Div. 3 level so that we would have a chance to have a post season. But that simply won’t happen.

I would be happy with a bowl game between the winner of the PFL and the IVY. Make it a tradition. ;)

[FCS Preview]

2003: Saint Joseph's (D-II), Ohio Northern (D-III), Saint Peter's (discontinued, not sure of division), Tiffin (D-II) - at least 2 D-II & 1 D-III

St. Peter's was in the MAAC.

[saluki_in_ohio]

Once again, the idea of FCS not allowing the conf champ to go to the playoffs is not in any FCS member’s best interest. For one it creates confusion for many in the general public. It also separates 1AA in a way that causes even more confusion. That said NCAA needs to change for the better.

To fix this perception problem, all Division I FCS non-scholarship programs need to pony up the scholarships. Or perhaps you can start playing some Division I FCS teams that have scholarships instead of the local DII, DIII, and NAIA teams like Wittenberg, Urbana, and Central State?

Beat a few high profile scholarship FCS schools such as members of the Gateway, SoCon, and CAA, then let's talk playoffs.