Where does the 7 Div I wins requirement come from?

[SuperJon]

Everyone always mentions this, and I thought it to be true, until I read this:


"The won-lost record of a team will be scrutinized to determine a team’s strength of schedule; however, less than seven Division I wins may place a team in jeopardy of not being selected;"

http://www.ncaa.org/library/handbooks/football/2007/2007_d1_football_handbook.pdf

That's straight from the NCAA website.

Is the seven wins thing something we just made up?

I know we have no chance of getting in, but I was just wondering where the myth of seven wins came from.

[UCAMonkey]

They probably use it when they have several teams with the same records.

[JayJ79]

No, there is nothing FORBIDDING a team without 7 Div. I wins from getting an at-large bid. It's just probably not gonna happen.

[HiHiYikas]

It's in the Bible - Book of Revelation, I believe...

And in the midst of the seven candlesticks one like unto the Son of man, clothed with a garment down to the foot, and girt about the paps with a golden girdle. His head and his hairs were white like wool, as white as snow; and his eyes were as a flame of fire; And his feet like unto fine brass, as if they burned in a furnace; and his voice as the sound of many waters. And he had in his right hand seven stars: and out of his mouth went a sharp twoedged sword: and his countenance was as the sun shineth in his strength. And when I saw him, I fell at his feet as dead. And he laid his right hand upon me, saying unto me...Write the things which thou hast seen, and the things which are, and the things which shall be hereafter; The mystery of the seven stars which thou sawest in my right hand, and the seven golden candlesticks...The seven stars are victories against adversaries of the first division: and the seven candlesticks which thou sawest are the victories required of thee to demonstrate thy playoff worthiness in the eyes of the national principalities of collegiate athletics.

[SuperJon]

We always talk about it like it was a steadfast rule. I understand that it's very unlikely for it ever to happen, but I just didn't know if the committee had said that before, etc.

[james_lawfirm]

It's in the Bible - Book of Revelation, I believe...

And in the midst of the seven candlesticks one like unto the Son of man, clothed with a garment down to the foot, and girt about the paps with a golden girdle. His head and his hairs were white like wool, as white as snow; and his eyes were as a flame of fire; And his feet like unto fine brass, as if they burned in a furnace; and his voice as the sound of many waters. And he had in his right hand seven stars: and out of his mouth went a sharp twoedged sword: and his countenance was as the sun shineth in his strength. And when I saw him, I fell at his feet as dead. And he laid his right hand upon me, saying unto me...Write the things which thou hast seen, and the things which are, and the things which shall be hereafter; The mystery of the seven stars which thou sawest in my right hand, and the seven golden candlesticks...The seven stars are victories against adversaries of the first division: and the seven candlesticks which thou sawest are the victories required of thee to demonstrate thy playoff worthiness in the eyes of the national principalities of collegiate athletics.


xrotatehx xlolx xnodx
Yep, that's what I thought. You got too much time on your hands.

[HensRock]

SJ,
You answered your own question. The NCAA Handbook passage you quoted is exactly where the 7 DI win "rule" comes from. It has been misquoted often and mis-applied here even more. It is not a "rule" so much as a guideline for the playoff selection committee.

Once again, it is a necessary, but not SUFFICIENT condition for playoff selection. If you don't know the difference, you might be in for a suprise on selection Sunday.

[JayJ79]

It's not like the FBS, with their 6 game "bowl eligible" rule, where team can have a .500 season and still get picked for a bowl simply because they think they can sell lots of tickets or get higher media ratings for it with their fans.

[SuperJon]

It came up in a discussion on our board about the playoffs. Most of us know we've got no shot (technically there is a shot, but I've got a better shot at winning this week's lottery) and I mentioned we weren't even eligible and someone brought that to my attention.

[URMite]

I think many have interpreted the handbook passage to mean:

You are still eligible with <7 DI wins, but we will never select a teams with <7 DI wins if one with 7 or more is available.

It may not be an accurate interpretation but I think it is a widely accepted one.

[URMite]

I think there was a similar passage about >3 losses in the past. Therefore many prognosticators eliminate anyone with either 4 losses or 6 or less DI wins and start from there.

[GreatAppSt]

It is a NCAA FCS selection guideline. If I remember the actual guideline correctly it states "a team with less than 7 D I wins places it's selection consideration in jeopardy", or somthing close to that. If it were a steadfast rule and a given year develped less than 16 teams with 7 D I wins wht would they do?xthumbsupx .

[Cincy App]

Of course, Montana State was an at-large selection to the playoff field last year with a 7-4 regular season record.

[URMite]

It is a NCAA FCS selection guideline. If I remember the actual guideline correctly it states "a team with less than 7 D I wins places it's selection consideration in jeopardy", or somthing close to that. If it were a steadfast rule and a given year develped less than 16 teams with 7 D I wins wht would they do?xthumbsupx .

Exactly! That's what I was attempting to infer, that they have to ensure there are 16 eligible teams.

BTW is it possible that there could be a year without enough .500+ teams to fill the bowls? Now that would be funny, if they had to cancel one because no eligible teams were available.

[URMite]

Of course, Montana State was an at-large selection to the playoff field last year with a 7-4 regular season record.

But did they have 7 DI wins?

[HensRock]

But did they have 7 DI wins?

Yes, they did. Including a win over I-A Colorado.

The interesting thing is that one of the 4 losses was to a Div-II team.

[SuperJon]

We were so close this year, that's what bugs me. A pass not getting dropped, a penalty not being called, or a bad spot and we're looking at a possible 9-2 or 10-1 at the end of the year.

I'll always wonder if we would've gotten in if we would've won one of those two close games (W&M, FBS Toledo) and were 9-2.

[UMass922]

I think many have interpreted the handbook passage to mean:

You are still eligible with <7 DI wins, but we will never select a teams with <7 DI wins if one with 7 or more is available.

It may not be an accurate interpretation but I think it is a widely accepted one.

That's what I take it to mean too. They will not dip into the six-win pool unless absolutely necessary. Perhaps the only reason it's not a hard-and-fast rule is to allow for the possibility of a freak season of rampant parity in which there aren't enough seven-win teams to fill out the bracket.

[URMite]

Yes, they did. Including a win over I-A Colorado.

The interesting thing is that one of the 4 losses was to a Div-II team.

I should have remembered that. But that fact is why I don't think MSU last year, is relevant to the discussion of having < 7 DI wins.

[already123]

So your sayin theres a chance....

[McNeese_beat]

The guideline is probably worded like it is to give the committee an out of there aren't enough teams from full-scholarship conferences with 7 D-I wins to fill the field but there are some mid-majors sitting there with 7-8 *D-I wins.

*- Most or all wins over teams from conferences that don't play 63 scholarship football.

[terrierbob]

It's in the Bible - Book of Revelation, I believe...

And in the midst of the seven candlesticks one like unto the Son of man, clothed with a garment down to the foot, and girt about the paps with a golden girdle. His head and his hairs were white like wool, as white as snow; and his eyes were as a flame of fire; And his feet like unto fine brass, as if they burned in a furnace; and his voice as the sound of many waters. And he had in his right hand seven stars: and out of his mouth went a sharp twoedged sword: and his countenance was as the sun shineth in his strength. And when I saw him, I fell at his feet as dead. And he laid his right hand upon me, saying unto me...Write the things which thou hast seen, and the things which are, and the things which shall be hereafter; The mystery of the seven stars which thou sawest in my right hand, and the seven golden candlesticks...The seven stars are victories against adversaries of the first division: and the seven candlesticks which thou sawest are the victories required of thee to demonstrate thy playoff worthiness in the eyes of the national principalities of collegiate athletics.


Thus sayeth the Yikas. xbowx

[walliver]

It's in the Bible - Book of Revelation, I believe...

And in the midst of the seven candlesticks one like unto the Son of man, clothed with a garment down to the foot, and girt about the paps with a golden girdle. His head and his hairs were white like wool, as white as snow; and his eyes were as a flame of fire; And his feet like unto fine brass, as if they burned in a furnace; and his voice as the sound of many waters. And he had in his right hand seven stars: and out of his mouth went a sharp twoedged sword: and his countenance was as the sun shineth in his strength. And when I saw him, I fell at his feet as dead. And he laid his right hand upon me, saying unto me...Write the things which thou hast seen, and the things which are, and the things which shall be hereafter; The mystery of the seven stars which thou sawest in my right hand, and the seven golden candlesticks...The seven stars are victories against adversaries of the first division: and the seven candlesticks which thou sawest are the victories required of thee to demonstrate thy playoff worthiness in the eyes of the national principalities of collegiate athletics.

I believe the "principalities" serve the Evil One.xnodx At least that it my interpretation and I'm sticking to it.:D

[appfan2008]

I think we all figured it out now... basically you better have 7 d1 wins or pray that there arent enough teams to fill out the bracket

[walliver]

I think we all figured it out now... basically you better have 7 d1 wins or pray that there arent enough teams to fill out the bracket

This is actually the "Montana Rule". The Griz have a constitutional right to a play-off spot, and the "may disqualify rule" is the NCAA's implementation of the rule to maintain Montana's constitutional right.:D Of course the Griz do their part by not playing any schedule capable of producing less than 7 D1 wins.:D

[AlphaSigMD]

I believe the "principalities" serve the Evil One.xnodx At least that it my interpretation and I'm sticking to it.:D

Miles Brand is the evil one. He fired The General Robert Montgomery Knight.

[skinny_uncle]

I don't recall there ever being a problem filling a field because of a lack of teams with 7 wins. The only way you should get in with less would be by getting an autobid. There are usually several teams with 7 wins sitting at home after the field is filled. The requirement that they be D1 wins is to keep teams from loading up on wins from lower division teams.