GPI Through 10/22/07, Northern Iowa No. 1 <---CSN

[CSN-info]

Gridiron Power Index (GPI) Through 10/22/07, Northern Iowa No. 1
College Sporting News

The Gridiron Power Index (GPI), the hybrid ranking for FCS and top index indicator of at-large playoff selection has the University of Northern Iowa in the top spot for the fourth straight week. The FCS's largest league, the Colonial Athletic Association is the top ranked conference. The CAA has seven of their teams in the top 25; the Southern Conference placed five; the Gateway Football Conference placed four; the Big Sky and Great West Football Conference placed two each; the Ivy League, Ohio Valley Conference, Patriot League, Southland and Southwestern Athletic Conference placed one each. (Games through 10/22/07)

10/23/2007 GPI

Top 25
Rank-Team-Total
1. Northern Iowa (1.13)
2. N Dakota St (2.25)
3. Massachusetts (3.00)
4. McNeese St (5.00)
5. James Madison (6.00)
6. S Illinois (6.75)
7. New Hampshire (8.38)
8. Appalachian St (9.00)
9. Delaware (9.25)
10. Yale (9.75)
11. Wofford (10.38)
12. Montana (10.63)
13. Richmond (13.13)
14. Elon (13.63)
15. Hofstra (15.75)
16. E Kentucky (18.50)
17. Grambling (19.75)
18. Youngstown St (19.88)
19. Holy Cross (20.38)
20. Villanova (20.63)
21. Ga Southern (21.50)
22. The Citadel (22.00)
23. W Illinois (23.75)
24. S Dakota St (24.75)
25. E Washington (25.50)

Conference Rank
Rank, Conference (Average Rating)
1. Colonial Athletic Association (24.58)
2. Southern Conference (24.97)
3. Gateway Football Conference (27.77)
4. Great West Football Conference (31.35)
5. Southland Conference (40.88)
6. Big Sky Conference (43.02)
7. Ivy League (47.96)
8. Patriot League (48.13)
9. Southwestern Athletic Conference (51.90)
10. Mid-Eastern Athletic Conference (54.10)
11. Ohio Valley Conference (55.20)
12. Big South Conference (57.88)
13. Pioneer Football League (65.99)
14. Independents (66.91)
15. Northeast Conference (68.29)
16. Metro Atlantic Athletic Conference (77.00)

Conference Detail
Rank, Team (Average Rating)
1. Colonial Athletic Association (24.58)
3. Massachusetts (3.00)
5. James Madison (6.00)
7. New Hampshire (8.38)
9. Delaware (9.25)
13. Richmond (13.13)
15. Hofstra (15.75)
20. Villanova (20.63)
31T. William & Mary (29.38)
46. Towson (38.38)
55. Northeastern (43.75)
61. Rhode Island (49.00)
79. Maine (58.25)

2. Southern Conference (24.97)
8. Appalachian St (9.00)
11. Wofford (10.38)
14. Elon (13.63)
21. Ga Southern (21.50)
22. The Citadel (22.00)
36. Furman (31.63)
51T. Chattanooga (41.88)
64. W Carolina (49.75)

3. Gateway Football Conference (27.77)
1. Northern Iowa (1.13)
6. S Illinois (6.75)
18. Youngstown St (19.88)
23. W Illinois (23.75)
31T. Illinois St (29.38)
38. Missouri St (33.38)
113. Indiana St (80.13)

4. Great West Football Conference (31.35)
2. N Dakota St (2.25)
24. S Dakota St (24.75)
37. Cal Poly (31.75)
49. UC Davis (39.88)
78. Southern Utah (58.13)

5. Southland Conference (40.88)
4. McNeese St (5.00)
34. Cent Arkansas (30.50)
35. Nicholls St (30.75)
43. Sam Houston St (36.75)
65. Texas St (51.25)
66T. Northwestern St (51.38)
66T. SE Louisiana (51.38)
97. SF Austin (70.00)

6. Big Sky Conference (43.02)
12. Montana (10.63)
25. E Washington (25.50)
26. Montana St (25.88)
39. N Arizona (34.88)
59. Portland St (47.75)
69. Weber St (52.38)
73T. Idaho St (55.13)
73T. Sacramento St (55.13)
112. N Colorado (79.88)

7. Ivy League (47.96)
10. Yale (9.75)
29. Harvard (28.25)
47. Cornell (38.63)
70. Penn (53.75)
71. Dartmouth (53.88)
75. Brown (56.00)
88. Princeton (64.75)
110. Columbia (78.63)

8. Patriot League (48.13)
19. Holy Cross (20.38)
41T. Fordham (36.38)
48. Colgate (39.13)
51T. Lehigh (41.88)
68. Lafayette (52.13)
99. Bucknell (71.63)
106. Georgetown (75.38)

9. Southwestern Athletic Conference (51.90)
17. Grambling (19.75)
28. Alabama A&M (27.88)
45. Southern Univ (37.50)
53. Jackson St (42.25)
58. Prairie View (45.63)
76. Alabama St (56.38)
86. Ark Pine Bluff (64.00)
98. MS Valley St (71.00)
103. Alcorn St (74.13)
114. TX Southern (80.50)

10. Mid-Eastern Athletic Conference (54.10)
27. Delaware St (26.88)
30. Norfolk St (29.00)
33. S Carolina St (30.38)
57. Hampton (45.25)
81. W Salem St (60.13)
82. Morgan St (61.13)
87. Florida A&M (64.38)
94. Howard (69.00)
100. Bethune-Cookman (72.63)
116. NC A&T (82.25)

11. Ohio Valley Conference (55.20)
16. E Kentucky (18.50)
44. Jacksonville St (37.00)
50. E Illinois (41.25)
72. Tennessee St (54.25)
77. Austin Peay (57.00)
89. Samford (65.75)
90T. TN Martin (66.25)
92. Tennessee Tech (66.50)
95T. Murray St (69.50)
108. SE Missouri St (76.00)

12. Big South Conference (57.88)
40. Liberty (35.50)
60. Gardner Webb (48.13)
83. Coastal Carolina (61.38)
95T. Charleston So (69.50)
105. VMI (74.88)

13. Pioneer Football League (65.99)
41T. San Diego (36.38)
56. Dayton (44.00)
84. Drake (61.88)
93. Morehead St (68.13)
102. Davidson (73.38)
111. Jacksonville (78.88)
115. Butler (81.75)
118. Valparaiso (83.50)

14. Independents (66.91)
62. Stony Brook (49.13)
80. Presbyterian (60.00)
101. NC Central (73.25)
121. Savannah St (85.25)

15. Northeast Conference (68.29)
54. Albany (43.13)
63. Central Conn (49.25)
90T. Wagner (66.25)
107. Monmouth (75.88)
109. Robert Morris (77.13)
117. Sacred Ht (82.38)
119. St Francis (84.00)

16. Metro Atlantic Athletic Conference (77.00)
85. Iona (63.13)
104. Duquesne (74.50)
120. Marist (84.38)
122. La Salle (86.00)

[danefan]

I'm waiting DetriotFlyerxsmiley_wix xthumbsupx

[TypicalTribe]

Gridiron Power Index (GPI) Through 10/22/07, Northern Iowa No. 1

10/23/2007 GPI

Top 25
1. Northern Iowa (1.13)
2. N Dakota St (2.25)
3. Massachusetts (3.00)
4. McNeese St (5.00)
5. James Madison (6.00)
6. S Illinois (6.75)
7. New Hampshire (8.38)
8. Appalachian St (9.00)
9. Delaware (9.25)
10. Yale (9.75)
11. Wofford (10.38)
12. Montana (10.63)
13. Richmond (13.13)
14. Elon (13.63)
15. Hofstra (15.75)
16. E Kentucky (18.50)
17. Grambling (19.75)
18. Youngstown St (19.88)
19. Holy Cross (20.38)
20. Villanova (20.63)
21. Ga Southern (21.50)
22. The Citadel (22.00)
23. W Illinois (23.75)
24. S Dakota St (24.75)
25. E Washington (25.50)

Conference Rank
Rank, Conference (Average Rating)
1. Colonial Athletic Association (24.58)
2. Southern Conference (24.97)
3. Gateway Football Conference (27.77)
4. Great West Football Conference (31.35)
5. Southland Conference (40.88)
6. Big Sky Conference (43.02)
7. Ivy League (47.96)
8. Patriot League (48.13)
9. Southwestern Athletic Conference (51.90)
10. Ohio Valley Conference (55.20)
11. Big South Conference (57.88)
12. Mid-Eastern Athletic Conference (60.11)
13. Pioneer Football League (65.99)


Couldn't agree more with most of the rankings. Nice to see a little credit going to Holy Cross and Elon. Amazing the difference between Montana's human and computer ratings.

[AZGrizFan]

Couldn't agree more with most of the rankings. Nice to see a little credit going to Holy Cross and Elon. Amazing the difference between Montana's human and computer ratings.

It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that the top ranked teams (according to the flawed GPI model) get that way by playing I-A schools. This year, Montana chose NOT to play a I-A school (first time in several years), thus, their SOS suffers. It also suffers by being forced to play UNC. Computers can't seem to figure that out. Humans can. Thus the reason we rule the world. :) :) :)

[DetroitFlyer]

OK, here is a "bone" for my NEC friends:

54. Albany (43.13)

56. Dayton (44.00)

The Danes are ruling my Flyers according to the GPS....xbawlingx

Dayton and Albany would be a great game this year! If we can somehow knock off San Diego, maybe we can play in that Gridiron Classic thing in December....

[T-Dog]

Can't wait for the SoCon to jump the CAA in the standings. It's inevitable.

[RE/MAXGriz]

Couldn't agree more with most of the rankings. Nice to see a little credit going to Holy Cross and Elon. Amazing the difference between Montana's human and computer ratings.

Yeah, but even if Montana started the season at, lets say 15th in the nation, due to teams losing games (App, Wofford, UMass, JMU, Deleware, etc) They'd still probably be sitting between 3rd - 6th.

Sometimes it just comes down to winning games, and 7-0 in the polls is a lot better than 5-2.

[JayJ79]

Can the Gateway disown Indiana State?
kidding, kidding.

I wish them the best in getting their program back together somehow.

[danefan]

OK, here is a "bone" for my NEC friends:

54. Albany (43.13)

56. Dayton (44.00)

The Danes are ruling my Flyers according to the GPS....xbawlingx

Dayton and Albany would be a great game this year! If we can somehow knock off San Diego, maybe we can play in that Gridiron Classic thing in December....


haha....nice
Not what I expected though. Lets just say that our wins over Fordham and Fordham's relative success have kept us in the top half of the GPI. There's no telling what will happen if Fordham loses.

[TypicalTribe]

It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that the top ranked teams (according to the flawed GPI model) get that way by playing I-A schools. This year, Montana chose NOT to play a I-A school (first time in several years), thus, their SOS suffers. It also suffers by being forced to play UNC. Computers can't seem to figure that out. Humans can. Thus the reason we rule the world. :) :) :)

I think it's more likely that the Griz have struggled at home against teams that aren't very good.

[appfan2008]

It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that the top ranked teams (according to the flawed GPI model) get that way by playing I-A schools. This year, Montana chose NOT to play a I-A school (first time in several years), thus, their SOS suffers. It also suffers by being forced to play UNC. Computers can't seem to figure that out. Humans can. Thus the reason we rule the world. :) :) :)

its amazing how when your team gets screwed over you complain about the system... while if it had montana first you would be praising it!

[USDFAN_55]

Quick question..... why did San Diego get so high in the GPI last year with just a win over Yale? They are doing the same as last year with dominating victories over the same teams (some would say a Drake team is comparable to the Yale team), yet they are so low? Does beating the Ivy Champ really help in the GPI that much?

[uofmman1122]

its amazing how when your team gets screwed over you complain about the system... while if it had montana first you would be praising it!If it had Montana at #1 right now, I don't think we'd ever see the GPI again. xlolx

[skinny_uncle]

That concept is beyond the grasp of Bill & Hillary fans... xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx
We can get in enough arguments just about football without dragging politics into it.
xwhistlex

[Syntax Error]

If it had Montana at #1 right now, I don't think we'd ever see the GPI again. xlolxxconfusedx Maybe because it would be so unrealistic? ;) :p

Since 2001 with Montana #1:
10/18/06 http://www.i-aa.org/article.asp?articleid=81579
11/14/05 http://www.i-aa.org/article.asp?articleid=74210
10/11/05 http://www.i-aa.org/article.asp?articleid=73178
11/19/03 http://www.i-aa.org/article.asp?articleid=50708
11/21/01 http://www.i-aa.org/article.asp?articleid=30250
11/14/01 http://www.i-aa.org/article.asp?articleid=30249
10/31/01 http://www.i-aa.org/article.asp?articleid=30247

[uofmman1122]

xconfusedx Maybe because it would be so unrealistic? ;) :pMy, you're a sharp one. xsmhx



:p :p :p :p

[Syntax Error]

My, you're a sharp one. xsmhx
:p :p :p :pHappy to see you know when you're being poked. xlolx xrolleyesx xlolx :p :p :p :p :p :p :p

You're welcome for the links.

[Cincy App]

Quick question..... why did San Diego get so high in the GPI last year with just a win over Yale? They are doing the same as last year with dominating victories over the same teams (some would say a Drake team is comparable to the Yale team), yet they are so low? Does beating the Ivy Champ really help in the GPI that much?

There is a huge difference in a good team like Yale versus a horrible scholarship team like Northern Colorado. Drake is no comparison to Yale. Also, San Diego's wins have not been quite as dominating this year. A 10 point win against D2 Azusa Pacific, 21 point win against an awful Marist team, and a 14 point win against Valpo really are nothing to brag about. San Diego has been impressive in its last 2 wins but still will not impress many people until they decide to play a more competitive non-conference schedule.

[USDFAN_55]

There is a huge difference in a good team like Yale versus a horrible scholarship team like Northern Colorado. Drake is no comparison to Yale. Also, San Diego's wins have not been quite as dominating this year. A 10 point win against D2 Azusa Pacific, 21 point win against an awful Marist team, and a 14 point win against Valpo really are nothing to brag about. San Diego has been impressive in its last 2 wins but still will not impress many people until they decide to play a more competitive non-conference schedule.

Last year we got ragged on for running the score up, and now that we don't do that we get ridiculed for not playing as well. Sounds like a lose lose situation.xnodx

[AZGrizFan]

I think it's more likely that the Griz have struggled at home against teams that aren't very good.

Define: Struggle.

SUU - 37-17
Fort Lewis - 49-0
Albany - 35-14
Weber - 18-10
EWU - 24-23
Sac State - 17-3
UNC - 52-7

Average margin of home victories: 22.67 points
Average margin of home I-AA victories: 17.4 points
Average margin of road victory: 14 points


I'm just spitballin' here, but I'd venture a guess our skill position first stringers have played less this year than just about any other team in the top 15. We have 11 different running backs with carries this year. We've had 15 different receivers catch at least one pass. 3 different QB's have seen action, and I don't believe it's ever been because one of them got banged up.

So, I'll take that struggling all day long. Building depth (at the expense of blowing people out) may not look as great on the scoreboard to those of you who apparently place supreme importance on point differential, but it sure helps in the long run.... xnodx xnodx xnodx

[USDTorero]

If Nicholls St. can beat 0-7 Sam Houston St. by 1 pt and beat the previously mentioned Azusa in a far less convincing fashion than USD did, I am not sure how they can be considered superior to USD. There are bound to be some inconsistencies within the rankings and one can only hope that at the end of the year, USD is undefeated and rewarded with an opportunity in the playoffs to show everyone what all of the hype is about.

[FargoBison]

If Nicholls St. can beat 0-7 Sam Houston St. by 1 pt and beat the previously mentioned Azusa in a far less convincing fashion than USD did, I am not sure how they can be considered superior to USD. There are bound to be some inconsistencies within the rankings and one can only hope that at the end of the year, USD is undefeated and rewarded with an opportunity in the playoffs to show everyone what all of the hype is about.

Nicholls State also plays in a quality conference and had 2 IA games, while USD dumbed down their schedule from last year. Why they should be rewarded for that is beyond me. I'll take a 7-4 team from the Gateway, CAA, Southland, Big Sky, or Socon over an 11-0 USD team any day.

[Cincy App]

Last year we got ragged on for running the score up, and now that we don't do that we get ridiculed for not playing as well. Sounds like a lose lose situation.xnodx

No one said that San Diego had to run up the score. The difference seems to be San Diego has had a tougher time separating themselves from a couple of the weaklings on its schedule this year. Once a team is beat, 42-7 or 35-0 says enough. No need to run up 50 or 60 points.

San Diego does not deserve to be in the playoffs. They had the opportunity to schedule a quality out-of-conference slate and they chose not to. Blame your AD - not the Playoff Selection Committee.

[RabidRabbit]

Nicholls State also plays in a quality conference and had 2 IA games, while USD dumbed down their schedule from last year. Why they should be rewarded for that is beyond me. I'll take a 7-4 team from the Gateway, CAA, Southland, Big Sky, or Socon over an 11-0 USD team any day.

Given this year's USD opponents, I'd agree. Even the UC-Davis team is suspect this year. (Although, with my luck, I'm cursing my Bunnies with this post :p )

However, if in future years, their OOC's are 3 WINNING records, full schollie FCS teams, then, could see an invite. Still would love to have U San Diego jump up to join the "other USD" in the GWFC. xthumbsupx

[DetroitFlyer]

San Diego, if they finish 11-0, has "EVERY RIGHT" to be in the playoffs.... There will be multiple autobid conference teams in the playoffs this year that cannot hold a candle to San Diego!

The reason that USD is not ranked higher this year has everything to do with the Old Guard faction of FCS not wanting to come up with more lame excuses for keeping USD out.... Harbaugh's lobbying last year made it very difficult for the Old Guard to ignore USD.... It is easy to rank a slightly above average Yale team high, there is no playoff controversy.... And, most Old Guarders would jump for joy if the Ivy League decided to grace their precious playoffs by participating. For some reason, they believe that Ivy participation increases credibility somehow.... Ivy League SOS.... Please....

SOS is simply a lame argument period. Unless all autobids are eliminated, do not even try to make an argument using SOS! The fact that 4-0 (PL), Fordham has lost to Dayton and Albany is lost on the Old Guard.... Fordham has a great shot at the PL AQ, while USD, Dayton and Albany have slim chances at best.... But it is all about SOS.... Yeah right!xrolleyesx

[McNeese72]

If Nicholls St. can beat 0-7 Sam Houston St. by 1 pt and beat the previously mentioned Azusa in a far less convincing fashion than USD did, I am not sure how they can be considered superior to USD. There are bound to be some inconsistencies within the rankings and one can only hope that at the end of the year, USD is undefeated and rewarded with an opportunity in the playoffs to show everyone what all of the hype is about.


Huh? Nicholls hasn't played Sam Houston St. yet. One thing you skipped over is that Nicholls opened the season by beating FBS Rice.

Doc

[Houndawg]

Define: Struggle.

SUU - 37-17
Fort Lewis - 49-0
Albany - 35-14
Weber - 18-10
EWU - 24-23
Sac State - 17-3
UNC - 52-7

Average margin of home victories: 22.67 points
Average margin of home I-AA victories: 17.4 points
Average margin of road victory: 14 points


I'm just spitballin' here, but I'd venture a guess our skill position first stringers have played less this year than just about any other team in the top 15. We have 11 different running backs with carries this year. We've had 15 different receivers catch at least one pass. 3 different QB's have seen action, and I don't believe it's ever been because one of them got banged up.

So, I'll take that struggling all day long. Building depth (at the expense of blowing people out) may not look as great on the scoreboard to those of you who apparently place supreme importance on point differential, but it sure helps in the long run.... xnodx xnodx xnodx

Averages. If you stick your head in the oven and your feet in the freezer, on average you'll be the right temperature.

[danefan]

San Diego, if they finish 11-0, has "EVERY RIGHT" to be in the playoffs.... There will be multiple autobid conference teams in the playoffs this year that cannot hold a candle to San Diego!

The reason that USD is not ranked higher this year has everything to do with the Old Guard faction of FCS not wanting to come up with more lame excuses for keeping USD out.... Harbaugh's lobbying last year made it very difficult for the Old Guard to ignore USD.... It is easy to rank a slightly above average Yale team high, there is no playoff controversy.... And, most Old Guarders would jump for joy if the Ivy League decided to grace their precious playoffs by participating. For some reason, they believe that Ivy participation increases credibility somehow.... Ivy League SOS.... Please....

SOS is simply a lame argument period. Unless all autobids are eliminated, do not even try to make an argument using SOS! The fact that 4-0 (PL), Fordham has lost to Dayton and Albany is lost on the Old Guard.... Fordham has a great shot at the PL AQ, while USD, Dayton and Albany have slim chances at best.... But it is all about SOS.... Yeah right!xrolleyesx

But you're arguing two different points here. One for at-large and one for auto-bid. Its two different things.

SOS is a huge factor in at-large determinations. But its not a factor at all for auto-bids, you don't even need 7 DI wins if you win the championship in an AQ conference.

I don't think USD should get an at-large because they haven't provided a strong enough resume. I do think all eligible leagues should get an AQ and that includes the PFL.

[DetroitFlyer]

Different, yet the same.... Those who try to use SOS as an argument for keeping a USD out of the playoffs, have no concern about AQ's SOS.... If half the field can get in without having to worry about SOS, how is it right that the other half has to walk on water relative to SOS to get in? What does this say about our vaunted "crown the champion on the field" mantra? As I've said, do away with all autobids and then you can talk SOS! Until that time, however, using the SOS argument for keeping an 11-0 USD out of the playoffs just does not hold water.

[GannonFan]

Different, yet the same.... Those who try to use SOS as an argument for keeping a USD out of the playoffs, have no concern about AQ's SOS.... If half the field can get in without having to worry about SOS, how is it right that the other half has to walk on water relative to SOS to get in? What does this say about our vaunted "crown the champion on the field" mantra? As I've said, do away with all autobids and then you can talk SOS! Until that time, however, using the SOS argument for keeping an 11-0 USD out of the playoffs just does not hold water.

Oh stop it - tell USD's AD to put together a real schedule (Cal Poly for instance) and we wouldn't even be having this discussion. You can't change the autobids right now so it's pointless to be arguing over it. Heck, I advocate scrapping the auto bids altogether but you have to deal with the situation that you have. San Diego, this year, is playing nobody, again. Northern Colorado is terrible (and everyone knew they would be), UC Davis will be lucky to win more than 4 games this year (in USD's defense, who knew that Davis wouldn't be any good this year), Azuza is a DII school they don't need to play when the conference schedule already offers so many patsies, and the same goes for Marist. That's not a very well put together OOC schedule and that's why USD is staying home yet again come playoff time. Forget about the autobids, you can't fix that this year. But when considering the at larges, SOS is absolutely important, no matter how much you try to avoid it, and USD, by their own actions, hemmed themselves in with that one. xrulesx

[Purple For Life]

Averages. If you stick your head in the oven and your feet in the freezer, on average you'll be the right temperature.

I laughed a lot at this...
xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xthumbsupx xthumbsupx xthumbsupx xthumbsupx xthumbsupx

[USDTorero]

Huh? Nicholls hasn't played Sam Houston St. yet. One thing you skipped over is that Nicholls opened the season by beating FBS Rice.

Doc

Stephen F. Austin, sorry for the mistake. Rice is mediocre at best. Despite our AD being a complete pansy, I'm hoping that there is enough intrigue for people to want to see USD, a team that can score with the best of 'em, in the playoffs.

[ysubigred]

Since USD and MU has to defend their strenght of schedule so much I thought I would look it up myself to give you guys the benifit of the doubt this is what I found;

According to Sagarin rank of schedule out of 242 Div 1 teams.

Montana 212xeekx

San Diego 239 xnonono2x

You both might want to pick it up on the strenght of scheduleing next year if your sick of hearing the truth xrolleyesx

[DetroitFlyer]

And yet, most at AGS would not flinch for a moment if Montana receives a bid to the playoffs.... In fact, there are those that think Montana should be ranked #1 in all of FCS.... Yet, USD is struggling to crack the top 25. As I've been saying for years, the SOS argument is just an excuse for keeping a USD out of the playoffs. Montana's SOS should clearly demonstrate this to even the most stubborn AGS Old Guard member. xnodx

[GannonFan]

And yet, most at AGS would not flinch for a moment if Montana receives a bid to the playoffs.... In fact, there are those that think Montana should be ranked #1 in all of FCS.... Yet, USD is struggling to crack the top 25. As I've been saying for years, the SOS argument is just an excuse for keeping a USD out of the playoffs. Montana's SOS should clearly demonstrate this to even the most stubborn AGS Old Guard member. xnodx

And what happens to the SOS numbers as over the next 4 weeks USD plays Dayton, Davidson, Morehead St, and UC Davis while Montana plays N. Arizona, Portland St, Idaho St, and Montana St? I'm guessing the numbers will continue to diverge greatly as Montana's SOS improves greatly while USD's could actually decline.

And heck, I'm probably one of the more vocal detractors of the Big Sky on these boards, but NAU, PSU, and Montana St, if they were on USD's schedule, would be USD's 3 hardest games all year. Heck, imagine if even one was on USD's schedule, then we could actually start talking about getting USD into the playoffs rather than stuck where we are right now, lamenting the fact that USD has wasted a great team and great players by never putting together a playoff-worthy schedule.

[R.A.]

So the Big South and the OVC are better than the MEAC... really...

[NDB]

It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that the top ranked teams (according to the flawed GPI model) get that way by playing I-A schools. This year, Montana chose NOT to play a I-A school (first time in several years), thus, their SOS suffers. It also suffers by being forced to play UNC. Computers can't seem to figure that out. Humans can. Thus the reason we rule the world. :) :) :)

so what's the excuse for Montana's crappy OOC schedule?

[FargoBison]

And yet, most at AGS would not flinch for a moment if Montana receives a bid to the playoffs.... In fact, there are those that think Montana should be ranked #1 in all of FCS.... Yet, USD is struggling to crack the top 25. As I've been saying for years, the SOS argument is just an excuse for keeping a USD out of the playoffs. Montana's SOS should clearly demonstrate this to even the most stubborn AGS Old Guard member. xnodx

You can go on and on about the "Old Gaurd" this or whatever else but USD's AD knew what it would take to qualify for the playoffs and decided to schedule in the opposite direction. For missing the playoffs all the PFL fans and USD players/coaches have only one person to point the finger to and that is USD's AD. I know its not as fun as whining about the "Old Gaurd" but everyone on this board could have told USD how to make the playoffs before the season started. If USD would have done so none of us in the "Old Gaurd" would have a problem with the USD playoff talk.

Until USD schedules up this is all your amazing record will get from me....

http://www.martinawards.com/Merchant2/graphics/00000001/RIB22_large.jpg

Thanks for playing and have a nice offseason after November 17th.

[DetroitFlyer]

Yep, keep making excuses to support your own personal bias!xnonox

[McNeese75]

Yep, keep making excuses to support your own personal bias!xnonox

And you keep trying to sell snake oil xcoffeex

[FargoBison]

Yep, keep making excuses to support your own personal bias!xnonox

USD's schedule isn't an excuse, it is a fact.

[USDFAN_55]

How is the SOS determined? Is every team evaluated and then given a strength value? I guess my point would be how accurate is this SOS number? It doesn't seem like it can truly evaluate just how tough a teams schedule is. There are way too many factors that go into each game to determine whether or not a schedule is strong or weak.

[Syntax Error]

And yet, most at AGS would not flinch for a moment if Montana receives a bid to the playoffs.... In fact, there are those that think Montana should be ranked #1 in all of FCS.... Yet, USD is struggling to crack the top 25. As I've been saying for years, the SOS argument is just an excuse for keeping a USD out of the playoffs. Montana's SOS should clearly demonstrate this to even the most stubborn AGS Old Guard member. xnodxMontana:
78 Southern Utah
458* Fort Lewis
54 Albany
69 Weber State
25 Eastern Wash
73 at Sacramento St
112 Northern Colorado
39 at Northern Ariz
59 Portland State
73 at Idaho State
26 at Montana State

San Diego:
334* at Azusa Pacific
120 Marist
112 Northern Colorado
115 at Butler
118 at Valparaiso
84 Drake
111 Jacksonville
56 at Dayton
102 Davidson
93 at Morehead State
49 at UC Davis

GPI rank, *Massey rank.


At least USD can say their worst opponent is better than Montana's worst. Montana's schedule towers over USD's and that is not realistically arguable.

[USDFAN_55]

Montana:
78 Southern Utah
458* Fort Lewis
54 Albany
69 Weber State
25 Eastern Wash
73 at Sacramento St
112 Northern Colorado
39 at Northern Ariz
59 Portland State
73 at Idaho State
26 at Montana State

San Diego:
334* at Azusa Pacific
120 Marist
112 Northern Colorado
115 at Butler
118 at Valparaiso
84 Drake
111 Jacksonville
56 at Dayton
102 Davidson
93 at Morehead State
49 at UC Davis

GPI rank, *Massey rank.


At least USD can say their worst opponent is better than Montana's worst. Montana's schedule towers over USD's and that is not realistically arguable.

But where do these numbers come from? How are they derived?

[eaglesrthe1]

The next ten old geezers that I see on oxygen is going to get their cans handed to them by yours truly. Then after I get out of the slammer, I'm going to insist on a heavywheight title shot. Screw the rankings... I'll be undefeated. What excuse could those clowns have to deny me?

All hail USD xbowx xbowx

[Syntax Error]

But where do these numbers come from? How are they derived?http://www.collegesportingnews.com/section_front.asp?arttypeid=983
http://www.masseyratings.com/cf/compare1aa.htm

These are not a secret and have been discussed on AGS for eons. It is also no secret that USD is a very good team trapped in a not very good schedule.

[USDFAN_55]

http://www.collegesportingnews.com/section_front.asp?arttypeid=983
http://www.masseyratings.com/cf/compare1aa.htm

These are not a secret and have been discussed on AGS for eons. It is also no secret that USD is a very good team trapped in a not very good schedule.

So the numbers are based off of polls that are voted on by people that have not seen every team play? And off of computer ratings that can't take into account a lot of various factors. What I'm trying to get at is SOS is an objective number. There really is now way to accurately quantify a SOS. There's no way you can have an unbiased SOS when human voting is involved, but there is no way you can be completely accurate if it is just a computer involved. To go off of SOS alone is rediculous. It is just another statistic that people can use to argue their point, but when someone points out the inaccuracies of their statistics they get all defensive.

[Syntax Error]

So the numbers are based off of polls that are voted on by people that have not seen every team play? And off of computer ratings that can't take into account a lot of various factors. What I'm trying to get at is SOS is an objective number. There really is now way to accurately quantify a SOS. There's no way you can have an unbiased SOS when human voting is involved, but there is no way you can be completely accurate if it is just a computer involved. To go off of SOS alone is rediculous. It is just another statistic that people can use to argue their point, but when someone points out the inaccuracies of their statistics they get all defensive.What inaccuracies? You make a lot of assumptions, care to back them up?
"the numbers are based off of polls that are voted on by people that have not seen every team play"
"computer ratings that can't take into account a lot of various factors"
"SOS is an objective number. There really is now way to accurately quantify a SOS"

[GannonFan]

So the numbers are based off of polls that are voted on by people that have not seen every team play? And off of computer ratings that can't take into account a lot of various factors. What I'm trying to get at is SOS is an objective number. There really is now way to accurately quantify a SOS. There's no way you can have an unbiased SOS when human voting is involved, but there is no way you can be completely accurate if it is just a computer involved. To go off of SOS alone is rediculous. It is just another statistic that people can use to argue their point, but when someone points out the inaccuracies of their statistics they get all defensive.

And if the PFL, especially USD, would play schedules that challenge them and allow those humans and computers to see how the PFL stacks up against the rest of the FCS then the subjective measures would be more accurate. However, the PFL, and especially USD, continue to sit on the outside and rail about how unfair the system is while they can easily make the system work for them by scheduling better. USD could've played people this year - Cal Poly was there for the asking, Northern Arizona needed another game, even Appalachian State was begging for another game for months. And instead USD found Azuza and Marist and Northern Colorado. Nothing Old Guard about that, no matter how much DetroitFlyer wants it to be that way - USD had the options and choose not to take them and they will again be on the outside looking in come playoff time. As a fan of the FCS level, I'm disappointed that USD has wasted a good team and a great QB - the blame lies there.

[USDFAN_55]

What inaccuracies? You make a lot of assumptions, care to back them up?
"the numbers are based off of polls that are voted on by people that have not seen every team play"
"computer ratings that can't take into account a lot of various factors"
"SOS is an objective number. There really is now way to accurately quantify a SOS"

You stated the inaccuracies for me

"the numbers are based off of polls that are voted on by people that have not seen every team play"

Coaches, for the most part, only see teams that they play against and teams their opponents have played. Reporters/fans, for the most part, see teams from their region only.

"computer ratings that can't take into account a lot of various factors"

Injuries, weather, style of play, playing surfaces

"SOS is an objective number. There really is now way to accurately quantify a SOS"

this is true because of what I stated above.

[Petrie Dish]

It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that the top ranked teams (according to the flawed GPI model) get that way by playing I-A schools. This year, Montana chose NOT to play a I-A school (first time in several years), thus, their SOS suffers. It also suffers by being forced to play UNC. Computers can't seem to figure that out. Humans can. Thus the reason we rule the world. :) :) :)

Sagarin Rankings:

Southern Illinois 73
Western Illinois 124
Iowa State 126
SDSU 127
Illinois St. 139
Drake 191

It's a good thing playing Iowa St. helped our SOS so much. xrolleyesx

[USDFAN_55]

And if the PFL, especially USD, would play schedules that challenge them and allow those humans and computers to see how the PFL stacks up against the rest of the FCS then the subjective measures would be more accurate. However, the PFL, and especially USD, continue to sit on the outside and rail about how unfair the system is while they can easily make the system work for them by scheduling better. USD could've played people this year - Cal Poly was there for the asking, Northern Arizona needed another game, even Appalachian State was begging for another game for months. And instead USD found Azuza and Marist and Northern Colorado. Nothing Old Guard about that, no matter how much DetroitFlyer wants it to be that way - USD had the options and choose not to take them and they will again be on the outside looking in come playoff time. As a fan of the FCS level, I'm disappointed that USD has wasted a good team and a great QB - the blame lies there.

Your SOS is a completely objective number with numerous inaccuracies. You guys like to use this number as if it is 100% accurate and final say so in every arguement regarding a teams worthiness. I am saying what are your other arguments besides the objective SOS? Have you seen all the teams play? Have you weighed in all the various factors that go into the difficulty of a game? Until there is a way to have a completely unbiased and non-objective SOS the arguement can be made that it is just another number/statistic. Take it for what it is. I'm sure a lot of people in here have taken a sociology statistics class in one form or another, and can realize the inaccuracies of the SOS.

[eaglesrthe1]

I want the top 16 teams in the country to be in the playoffs. Is USD one of them? Who the hell knows.

But let's face it. You have to make an argument to be included, instead of trying to argue that no one can prove that you don't.

SOS is very relevant, even if it's not ironclad. I haven't seen where anyone claimed that it was foolproof. However, it is a universally accepted method of garnering relative strength. Nobody has ever directly measured the temperature of the suns surface, and yet I am reasonably sure that it's quite warm.

[GannonFan]

Your SOS is a completely objective number with numerous inaccuracies. You guys like to use this number as if it is 100% accurate and final say so in every arguement regarding a teams worthiness. I am saying what are your other arguments besides the objective SOS? Have you seen all the teams play? Have you weighed in all the various factors that go into the difficulty of a game? Until there is a way to have a completely unbiased and non-objective SOS the arguement can be made that it is just another number/statistic. Take it for what it is. I'm sure a lot of people in here have taken a sociology statistics class in one form or another, and can realize the inaccuracies of the SOS.

I think you mean subjective and not objective.

But regardless, the way to make it more relevant is to have more games played against the rest of the FCS world - you want to prove your team is good, then play someone else who is considered good. It's not a strange concept, the Patriot League got their initial respect by doing this. The NEC has put together schedules that if they did well versus they would be in the playoffs. Numerous schools who didn't play in an autobid conference were nonetheless able to play quality schedules that garnered them inclusion in the playoffs (Delaware, Georgia Southern, Youngstown, Hofstra, and more recently Cal Poly and Coastal Carolina).

It's so simple it's amazing that people still try to argue about some grand conspiracy and throw out trite names. Here it is again - play a good schedule against tough teams, win most of those games, and you're in the playoffs. Very simple. xthumbsupx

[james_lawfirm]

I think you mean subjective and not objective.

But regardless, the way to make it more relevant is to have more games played against the rest of the FCS world - you want to prove your team is good, then play someone else who is considered good. It's not a strange concept, the Patriot League got their initial respect by doing this. The NEC has put together schedules that if they did well versus they would be in the playoffs. Numerous schools who didn't play in an autobid conference were nonetheless able to play quality schedules that garnered them inclusion in the playoffs (Delaware, Georgia Southern, Youngstown, Hofstra, and more recently Cal Poly and Coastal Carolina).

It's so simple it's amazing that people still try to argue about some grand conspiracy and throw out trite names. Here it is again - play a good schedule against tough teams, win most of those games, and you're in the playoffs. Very simple. xthumbsupx


What he said!! xnodx xnodx xnodx

[Syntax Error]

Sagarin Rankings:

Southern Illinois 73
Western Illinois 124
Iowa State 126
SDSU 127
Illinois St. 139
Drake 191

It's a good thing playing Iowa St. helped our SOS so much. xrolleyesxIf you are not going to use the GPI (which Sagarin is included) then at least use Massey who ranks all teams. That will give you this:
http://www.masseyratings.com/team.php?tm=347339
2007 Northern Iowa Panthers (7-0)
Cedar Falls, IA
PF-PA: 236-91
Per Game: 33.7-13.0

137 at W Illinois
81 S Illinois
175 at Illinois St
268 at Drake
142 at S Dakota St
149 at Iowa St
193 MN Mankato
144 Youngstown St
179 at Missouri St
398 Indiana St
256 Southern Utah

[Syntax Error]

Your SOS is a completely objective [sic] number with numerous inaccuracies.Still waiting to hear about the supposed inaccuracies. Besides, I listed a total ranking, not SOS. Montana plays waaaaaaaaaaaaay better teams than USD. You know it but are trying to be a pain. You've succeeded.xoopsx

[USDFAN_55]

Still waiting to hear about the supposed inaccuracies. Besides, I listed a total ranking, not SOS. Montana plays waaaaaaaaaaaaay better teams than USD. You know it but are trying to be a pain. You've succeeded.xoopsx

See my previous post for the inaccuracies. The SOS is a number that is used by all in here to illustrate a teams worthiness, and I am just showing a different view. Take your blinders off and see what I am trying to say. I am not saying USD is a top 5 team, there really is now way of telling that unless they go to the play-offs. Otherwise their ranking is based on voters who for the most part have not seen them play.

[USDFAN_55]

I want the top 16 teams in the country to be in the playoffs. Is USD one of them? Who the hell knows.

But let's face it. You have to make an argument to be included, instead of trying to argue that no one can prove that you don't.

SOS is very relevant, even if it's not ironclad. I haven't seen where anyone claimed that it was foolproof. However, it is a universally accepted method of garnering relative strength. Nobody has ever directly measured the temperature of the suns surface, and yet I am reasonably sure that it's quite warm.

Oh, well if it is universally accepted it must be rightxsmiley_wix

[Syntax Error]

See my previous post for the inaccuracies. The SOS is a number that is used by all in here to illustrate a teams worthiness, and I am just showing a different view. Take your blinders off and see what I am trying to say. I am not saying USD is a top 5 team, there really is now way of telling that unless they go to the play-offs. Otherwise their ranking is based on voters who for the most part have not seen them play.Computer rankings are not based on voters and you have no proof on who has seen whom play (and your inaccuracies are wrongly termed). You're just out of line and.....

xhomerx

[Petrie Dish]

If you are not going to use the GPI (which Sagarin is included) then at least use Massey who ranks all teams. That will give you this:
http://www.masseyratings.com/team.php?tm=347339
2007 Northern Iowa Panthers (7-0)
Cedar Falls, IA
PF-PA: 236-91
Per Game: 33.7-13.0

137 at W Illinois
81 S Illinois
175 at Illinois St
268 at Drake
142 at S Dakota St
149 at Iowa St
193 MN Mankato
144 Youngstown St
179 at Missouri St
398 Indiana St
256 Southern Utah

1. Iowa St. is not included in the GPI
2. What's the difference if they are both (Sagarin and Massey) included?

[Syntax Error]

1. Iowa St. is not included in the GPI
2. What's the difference if they are both (Sagarin and Massey) included?Yeah, I use the rankings of Massey for non-FCS teams because he ranks all the NCAA.

[USDFAN_55]

Computer rankings are not based on voters and you have no proof on who has seen whom play (and your inaccuracies are wrongly termed). You're just out of line and.....

xhomerx

Pointing out the flaws in a statistic makes me a Homer? xlolx

[Syntax Error]

Pointing out the flaws in a statistic makes me a Homer? xlolxPlease, you continue to miss the point. You have not pointed out any flaws. In fact you have avoided direct questions. The responses you gave are not answers. xoopsx

[USDFAN_55]

Please, you continue to miss the point. You have not pointed out any flaws. In fact you have avoided direct questions. The responses you gave are not answers. xoopsx

What doesn't this answer?

"the numbers are based off of polls that are voted on by people that have not seen every team play"

Coaches, for the most part, only see teams that they play against and teams their opponents have played. Reporters/fans, for the most part, see teams from their region only.

"computer ratings that can't take into account a lot of various factors"

Injuries, weather, style of play, playing surfaces,

"SOS is an objective number. There really is now way to accurately quantify a SOS"

this is true because of what I stated above.

[USDFAN_55]

Please, you continue to miss the point. You have not pointed out any flaws. In fact you have avoided direct questions. The responses you gave are not answers. xoopsx

How do you defend the SOS rankings? And you can't just give an answer of it being universally accepted. That doesn't make it accurate.

[bigchocolate]

I laughed a lot at this...
xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xthumbsupx xthumbsupx xthumbsupx xthumbsupx xthumbsupx

I laughed also until I put the numbers in a spreadsheet and those for other conferences were correct but those for the MEAC were not....!!!!xnonox No wonder this conference cannot get two teams in. How can one truly believe in this system.

[Syntax Error]

I laughed also until I put the numbers in a spreadsheet and those for other conferences were correct but those for the MEAC were not....!!!!xnonox No wonder this conference cannot get two teams in. How can one truly believe in this system.What system?

[bigchocolate]

GPI ...#'s generated via Computer which ranked conferences and teams

[Houndawg]

"SOS is an objective number. There really is now way to accurately quantify a SOS"


Which one is it, dude? Can't be both.

[USDFAN_55]

Which one is it, dude? Can't be both.

sorry.... subjective number. The whole thing is that it has inaccuracies.

[Houndawg]

sorry.... subjective number. The whole thing is that it has inaccuracies.

True, there are inaccuracies. You still gotta upgrade your schedule. If your AD won't do it you need to get one that will.

[USDFAN_55]

True, there are inaccuracies. You still gotta upgrade your schedule. If your AD won't do it you need to get one that will.

Well if you look at our schedules since he has arrived the schedule has gotten betterxeekx I know..... hard to believexrotatehx

[GannonFan]

Well if you look at our schedules since he has arrived the schedule has gotten betterxeekx I know..... hard to believexrotatehx

Glaciers move too - doesn't mean they get very far over a period of time. xcoffeex

[appfan2008]

Well if you look at our schedules since he has arrived the schedule has gotten betterxeekx I know..... hard to believexrotatehx

how so? what games are your good games now? that are better than before

[USDFAN_55]

how so? what games are your good games now? that are better than before

We used to have teams such as Laverne, Chapman, and Menlo College on our schedule. Anything is a step up from those games.xnodx

[bigchocolate]

I laughed also until I put the numbers in a spreadsheet and those for other conferences were correct but those for the MEAC were not....!!!!xnonox No wonder this conference cannot get two teams in. How can one truly believe in this system.

Gentlemen!!!!....I am confused here.....the statement above is a very major issue if I understand how conference ratings are derived in the GPI. Please correct me if I am wrong, the multiple weights associated with SOS, quality of win, etc are applied when deriving the value for the team gpi and the conference rank or gpi ratings is an average of the team values. If this is correct the ranking for the MEAC is too low. Their rating should be above two other conferences. Help me to understand this please!!!!!xpeacex xbowx

[bigchocolate]

Gentlemen!!!!....I am confused here.....the statement above is a very major issue if I understand how conference ratings are derived in the GPI. Please correct me if I am wrong, the multiple weights associated with SOS, quality of win, etc are applied when deriving the value for the team gpi and the conference rank or gpi ratings is an average of the team values. If this is correct the ranking for the MEAC is too low. Their rating should be above two other conferences. Help me to understand this please!!!!!xpeacex xbowx

Thanks for making a change to your original post and not acknowledging the change was made...... I wondered why this obvious informed group were not responding to this reporting error. This represents one of the original post. xmadx

Originally Posted by CSN-info
Gridiron Power Index (GPI) Through 10/22/07, Northern Iowa No. 1

10/23/2007 GPI

Top 25
1. Northern Iowa (1.13)
2. N Dakota St (2.25)
3. Massachusetts (3.00)
4. McNeese St (5.00)
5. James Madison (6.00)
6. S Illinois (6.75)
7. New Hampshire (8.38)
8. Appalachian St (9.00)
9. Delaware (9.25)
10. Yale (9.75)
11. Wofford (10.38)
12. Montana (10.63)
13. Richmond (13.13)
14. Elon (13.63)
15. Hofstra (15.75)
16. E Kentucky (18.50)
17. Grambling (19.75)
18. Youngstown St (19.88)
19. Holy Cross (20.38)
20. Villanova (20.63)
21. Ga Southern (21.50)
22. The Citadel (22.00)
23. W Illinois (23.75)
24. S Dakota St (24.75)
25. E Washington (25.50)

Conference Rank
Rank, Conference (Average Rating)
1. Colonial Athletic Association (24.58)
2. Southern Conference (24.97)
3. Gateway Football Conference (27.77)
4. Great West Football Conference (31.35)
5. Southland Conference (40.88)
6. Big Sky Conference (43.02)
7. Ivy League (47.96)
8. Patriot League (48.13)
9. Southwestern Athletic Conference (51.90)
10. Ohio Valley Conference (55.20)
11. Big South Conference (57.88)
12. Mid-Eastern Athletic Conference (60.11)
13. Pioneer Football League (65.99)