PFL & NEC, Welcome to the FCS Playoffs!!!!!

[DetroitFlyer]

http://www1.ncaa.org/membership/governance/division_I/champ_cabinet/2007/September_2007/Supp_25_FCS.htm

This is getting serious! 24 teams, PFL and NEC included! Wow!!!!!

[appfan2008]

AWESOME!
I would love to see playin games during thanksgiving weekend!
I think this would benefit everyone... though it may in the short term include too many 7-4 teams!

[Seahawks Fan]

Great news. Glad the NCAA did the right thing.

[Appstate29]

This is not good in my opinion, too many teams playing.

[BlueHen86]

http://www1.ncaa.org/membership/governance/division_I/champ_cabinet/2007/September_2007/Supp_25_FCS.htm

This is getting serious! 24 teams, PFL and NEC included! Wow!!!!!
Glad to see that. I hope they go with the 24 team bracket option, but even the play-in games option is an improvement over the current 16 team format.
I like the brackets provided, using last years records and seedings.

[rmutv]

This doesn't look like it is an official done deal. This just looks like the proposal. Am I missing something?

[TexasTerror]

AWESOME!
I would love to see playin games during thanksgiving weekend!
I think this would benefit everyone... though it may in the short term include too many 7-4 teams!

May not have play-in games during Thanksgiving weekend. Seems that they may start the FCS season earlier, which could in fact lead to more FCS vs FCS games unless schools want to give up their byes...

Anything that means more FCS vs FCS games is a good thing...xnodx

[89Hen]

This doesn't look like it is an official done deal. This just looks like the proposal. Am I missing something?
You're only missing the part that this will be defeated....

A 6-5 Maine in the playoff field? xlolx They COMPLETELY blew their own arguement out of the water. xnutsx

[DetroitFlyer]

This does not appear to be a done deal yet. There are some significant issues to be worked out relative to timing.... But, this is the first ever document from the NCAA that indicates that the PFL and NEC Champions will receive an AUTOMATIC bid to the FCS playoffs! Believe me, for us PFL and NEC fans, this is huge news! I sure hope the details can be worked out and we can look forward to a 24 team playoff next season!!!!!

[rmutv]

This does not appear to be a done deal yet. There are some significant issues to be worked out relative to timing.... But, this is the first ever document from the NCAA that indicates that the PFL and NEC Champions will receive an AUTOMATIC bid to the FCS playoffs! Believe me, for us PFL and NEC fans, this is huge news! I sure hope the details can be worked out and we can look forward to a 24 team playoff next season!!!!!

It doesn't indicate anything other than that there is a proposal being floated. It's news that it is being discussed, but the likelihood of a playoff expansion being approved would not be a good bet in Vegas.

[UAalum72]

This is the report of the Football Championship Committee. I suppose it still has to go thru the legislative process, and I don't know if it still would be impacted by the OVC's proposal for scholarship minimums to define 'eligible conferences'.

But it's OK by me, and so much for the arguments that 'playoffs can't be expanded' due to time constraints.

[aceinthehole]

FANTASTIC! xthumbsupx

This propsal is great, we just have to hope it gets final approval. xpeacex

Not only does this allow NEC and PLF immediate access to the playoffs under the new format, but it also assures Big South access once they are eligible.

Will the SWAC or Ivy now apply for a AQ under this new proposal?

[brownbear]

FANTASTIC! xthumbsupx

Will the SWAC or Ivy now apply for a AQ under this new proposal?

I think the issue there is that the schools in the Ivy League and SWAC don't want to be in the playoff. Personally, I would love to see the Ivy League champion going on to the playoffs for the chance to win a national title. In 2005, I think Brown's team would have had a good chance of winning perhaps a game or two in the playoffs, but they never had the opportunity.

[citdog]

I think the issue there is that the schools in the Ivy League and SWAC don't want to be in the playoff. Personally, I would love to see the Ivy League champion going on to the playoffs for the chance to win a national title. In 2005, I think Brown's team would have had a good chance of winning perhaps a game or two in the playoffs, but they never had the opportunity.

don't want to be exposed as not matching up with the elite conferences in the FCS, but continue to be ranked highly in the FCS Polls.

[HensRock]

This doesn't look like it is an official done deal. This just looks like the proposal. Am I missing something?

That's what it looks like to me too.

[FCSFAN]

This doesn't look like it is an official done deal. This just looks like the proposal. Am I missing something?No it is not a done deal. It was announced three months ago that they were developing a plan. More will be known after they meet on 9/19.

[citdog]

No it is not a done deal. It was announced three months ago that they were developing a plan. More will be known after they meet on 9/19.

so 24 teams THIS year?

[henfan]

...so much for the arguments that 'playoffs can't be expanded' due to time constraints.

UAalum, I think you've missed the point that time constraints remain a significant deterrant to this whole proposal gaining wholesale approval. Hence the following language in the Other Issues section of the proposal:

"To accommodate the added round of competition, the championship would have to be extended on the back end (conflicting with the Christmas holiday or moved to a near-New Year’s date); the football season would have to start a week earlier (budget impact for all FCS institutions) or; teams would have to give up their bye weeks during the season, creating the possibility of up to 16 straight weeks of competition for a team participating in every round of the championship. The committee also recognizes that there may be other issues inherent to this option that it has not yet had time to fully vet in this short timeframe."

Assuming past history is any indicator, the option of moving up the date of the FCS Championship Game is not likely to happen if FBS schools have any input in the decision whatsoever. Their deals ESPN media deals with holiday season bowls would likely precluded our making any moves in that direction. If they don't object though, this is the best option on the table.

Giving up bye weeks is going to be a very hard sell, especially among schools who play difficult conference schedules. And moving up seasons to timeframes that would prohibit student attendance at opening games is going to be a non-starter, I'd imagine.

There may be a solution in there somewhere. One thing's for sure: playoff expansion isn't close to being a done deal precisely because of the limited time constraints. While this is encouraging news, the proposal still has a long, long way to go.

[aceinthehole]

Yes, this is just a PROPOSAL, but it provides specific and tangible expansion options for the NCAA to consider.

Does anyone know the timeline for consideration of this proposal? What committe/groups needs to approve it? What is required by the NCAA to adopt this proposal?

If approved, this could go into effect as early as next season (2008).

[89Hen]

Does anyone know the timeline for consideration of this proposal? What committe/groups needs to approve it? What is required by the NCAA to adopt this proposal?


More will be known after they meet on 9/19.
xthumbsupx

[89Hen]

BTW, when this gets rejected, some of you can save all the "Old Guard" and 'trying to keep the NEC and PLF down' crap to yourselves. Extending the season, skipping mid-season byes, having teams like 6-5 Maine in the field, etc... will be the reason.

[FCSFAN]

I thought we talked about this already:
http://www.anygivensaturday.com/forum/showthread.php?t=27110

Yearbook page 14:
http://www.collegesportingnews.com/article.asp?articleid=86744

[DetroitFlyer]

Not with anything in writing from the NCAA.... I just looked over the play in game sample bracket again.... Under this option, only 18 teams are involved.... No timing issues.... The concern with this option is that it would only be a short term solution. Once the Big South becomes eligible, it would not work....

But, the fact that there are short term and long term options on the table makes me think that the chances of one option making it through are not too bad!!!!

The "Old Guard" just might have to welcome some new members to the table as early as next year!

[blukeys]

BTW, when this gets rejected, some of you can save all the "Old Guard" and 'trying to keep the NEC and PLF down' crap to yourselves. Extending the season, skipping mid-season byes, having teams like 6-5 Maine in the field, etc... will be the reason.

Should this proposal pass (and we go to 5 yeeks of playoffs) we really only need to extend the playoffs 2 more weeks and then everyone in FCS can be in the playoffs. All of the Pioneer teams would get auto bids!!!!! xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx

[FCSFAN]

Who would want 75% of eligible teams in the playoffs? Those who didn't make it, that's who. 50% made it in last year.

[downbythebeach]

YAAAY!!!
sounds good to me........not a done deal, but it's coming along
xthumbsupx xrulesx xpeacex xbowx :)

[henfan]

Does anyone know the timeline for consideration of this proposal? What committe/groups needs to approve it? What is required by the NCAA to adopt this proposal?

If approved, this could go into effect as early as next season (2008).

A recommendation with a budget impact is supposed to be submitted to the cabinet for review at the cabinet’s September meeting (7-10 pm on 9/19.) It's unlikely there would be any sort of vote without careful examination of the proposal. Perhaps the earliest you'd see a vote would be at the Feb. 08 meeting or possibly the Junes '08 meeting. It's going to take time for supporters to build a concensus for what has proven to be an unpopular proposal. We'll see.

[GannonFan]

As 89 detailed above, this ain't gonna happen in it's current form - no way do they push the championship back around Christmas - that could actually kill the championship game attendance-wise/tv-wise. But it will happen eventually and they will have to do something on the order of not having byes during the year or starting the season a week earlier. They can get around the week earlier just on the notion that most teams don't draw in large numbers anyway so having the students on campus or not means little - and heck, most schools start late in August anyway so it wouldn't be that bad. Taking all the byes out probably won't work, though, since teams use them to handle big payday games and in some cases, to coordinate with exams. The number of teams, though, is encouraging - I don't want to see 24, that's too many, but 20 would be the right number, IMO - get all the conference champs in and then worthy at-larges (no 6-5 Maines for instance).

[henfan]

The one measure that failed overwhelmingly last June was pairing back the number of at-large teams to 7 and offering 9 auto-bids. I think that's off the table.

[89Hen]

The one measure that failed overwhelmingly last June was pairing back the number of at-large teams to 7 and offering 9 auto-bids. I think that's off the table.
I think that would have taken major bylaw changes to accomplish.

[Seawolf97]

This is good discussion out in the open-but it aint a done deal yetxsmhx

[aceinthehole]

Personally, I'm cautiously optomistic, but there are still things to settle regarding byes, first week, last week, etc. There is a lot of work to be done for proponents. Some very big hurdles still must be addressed. This is nowhere near close to being a done deal!

That being said, this is a detailed and formal proposal issued by the NCAA on expansion - it is big news in that sense and is the product of the previously mentionded task force.

IMO - the momentum is shifting and expansion is more likely now than it ever. This is more than just messageboard banter, it is NCAA officials exaiming options for playoff expansion. Some people can keep their head in the sand, but it appears some form of expansion may very well happen in the near future. Its an idea some people, flat out denied was possible just a year ago xnodx

[henfan]

I think that would have taken major bylaw changes to accomplish.

You'd think so, though a bylaw change is exactly what was voted on. If passed, it would have had to go further up the D-I ladder for approval, I believe.

[FCSFAN]

Personally, I'm cautiously optomistic, but there are still things to settle regarding byes, first week, last week, etc. There is a lot of work to be done for proponents. Some very big hurdles still must be addressed. This is nowhere near close to being a done deal!

That being said, this is a detailed and formal proposal issued by the NCAA on expansion - it is big news in that sense and is the product of the previously mentionded task force.

IMO - the momentum is shifting and expansion is more likely now than it ever. This is more than just messageboard banter, it is NCAA officials exaiming options for playoff expansion. Some people can keep their head in the sand, but it appears some form of expansion may very well happen in the near future. Its an idea some people, flat out denied was possible just a year ago xnodxSqueaky wheel gets the grease you mean? xlolx

[Seawolf97]

;)
Personally, I'm cautiously optomistic, but there are still things to settle regarding byes, first week, last week, etc. There is a lot of work to be done for proponents. Some very big hurdles still must be addressed. This is nowhere near close to being a done deal!

That being said, this is a detailed and formal proposal issued by the NCAA on expansion - it is big news in that sense and is the product of the previously mentionded task force.

IMO - the momentum is shifting and expansion is more likely now than it ever. This is more than just messageboard banter, it is NCAA officials exaiming options for playoff expansion. Some people can keep their head in the sand, but it appears some form of expansion may very well happen in the near future. Its an idea some people, flat out denied was possible just a year ago xnodx


All kidding aside - this is good news ;)

[TheValleyRaider]

As 89 detailed above, this ain't gonna happen in it's current form - no way do they push the championship back around Christmas - that could actually kill the championship game attendance-wise/tv-wise. But it will happen eventually and they will have to do something on the order of not having byes during the year or starting the season a week earlier. They can get around the week earlier just on the notion that most teams don't draw in large numbers anyway so having the students on campus or not means little - and heck, most schools start late in August anyway so it wouldn't be that bad. Taking all the byes out probably won't work, though, since teams use them to handle big payday games and in some cases, to coordinate with exams. The number of teams, though, is encouraging - I don't want to see 24, that's too many, but 20 would be the right number, IMO - get all the conference champs in and then worthy at-larges (no 6-5 Maines for instance).

I'm on-board with a 20 team playoff, and would consider it the ideal scenario. I would be surprised, unfortunately, if the NCAA chose to expand and did not go all the way to 24.

I think pushing the season opener back a week is also the most likely scneario as well. GF outlines it pretty well above, plus it's worthwhile to remember that D-II starts that weekend as well. Not saying we should look at D-II for our answers (regionalization=bad), but it certainly can be done.

[FCSFAN]

;)
All kidding aside - this is good news ;)old news, wait another week for current news.

[aust42]

It will never happen. Besides 16 teams in plenty enough.

[appfan2008]

as far as i can see the only down side is letting in teams that are 6-5 and not good enough

[FCSFAN]

as far as i can see the only down side is letting in teams that are 6-5 and not good enoughYou still have to have seven D-I wins to qualify, only 32 teams did last year. Or win one of the eight autobids.

[Franks Tanks]

Who would want 75% of eligible teams in the playoffs? Those who didn't make it, that's who. 50% made it in last year.

Not sure what your getting at here. You said 50% of "eligible" (whatever that means) teams made the playoffs last year, how are only 32 teams eligible?

[appfan2008]

well couldnt it happen that with more games against fbs and d2s that there might not be enough teams that qualify if then need 7 d1 wins?

[89Hen]

expansion is more likely now than it ever.
I won't disagree with that statement. xnodx

[89Hen]

I'm on-board with a 20 team playoff, and would consider it the ideal scenario.
You change the schedules of 120+ teams to accomodate 4?

[appfan2008]

if we expand then we should bypass 20 and go right for 24

[89Hen]

if we expand then we should bypass 20 and go right for 24
May as well, because that's where it'd end up within a couple years. xnodx

[TheValleyRaider]

I don't think there's anything in this proposal that says the "7 D-I wins" requirement would be removed. Just from last year, you could add in San Diego, Monmouth (PFL/NEC Champs), Portland St., UNI, Wofford, Towson (all 7-4), and a choice of 7-4 Holy Cross or 8-3 Delaware State. All meeting the minimum requirements. Now, again, I'd only take 20, meaning I'd go with Portland and UNI from last season along with USD/Monmouth, but it can be done without a 6-5 side in the bunch

[ccd494]

You're only missing the part that this will be defeated....

A 6-5 Maine in the playoff field? xlolx They COMPLETELY blew their own arguement out of the water. xnutsx

$100 says Maine would have blown out Tennessee Martin at the end of last year, too.

[appfan2008]

sure last year yes... but i could see a scenario in which not enough teams had that many wins and...

did all those teams you mention, psu, uni, wofford, towson, etc. all have 7 d1 wins or just 7 wins?

[bluehenbillk]

Not a fan of 24 & not a fan of 7-4 teams making the field.

Did anyone catch the last line of the whole thing: "Impact on Student Athlete: NONE". Can someone show this to the presidents that have issues with having a 1-A playoff instead of the BCS crap.

[TheValleyRaider]

You change the schedules of 120+ teams to accomodate 4?

I think Playoff expansion is more than likely, and don't see the need to go the full 24. Only my opinion of course, which has little weight with the committee (surprisingly enough xrolleyesx ;) ). If the playoffs do expand, schedules are going to have to be altered in some way or another, all of it an accomodation for 4-8 teams. I also happen to think an eligible conference should have an autobid, there should be something at stake for winning your conference beyond a nice trophy. You're not getting all 10 conferences in unless you expand, so there you have it. Of course, if changes in the number of eligible and willing conferences appear, I'm willing to change my mind on 20.

[TheValleyRaider]

sure last year yes... but i could see a scenario in which not enough teams had that many wins and...

did all those teams you mention, psu, uni, wofford, towson, etc. all have 7 d1 wins or just 7 wins?

7 DIs. I'm nearly 100% on that, although it's possible I missed a few, I looked kinda quickly. I definately left out some teams that I knew had 7 wins, but not DI wins.

[kardplayer]

Honestly, I don't see how playing the Championship on December 21 this year would have had any negative impact on attendance - if anything it could improve it as most people will be off from work on the Monday after...

[appfan2008]

7 DIs. I'm nearly 100% on that, although it's possible I missed a few, I looked kinda quickly. I definately left out some teams that I knew had 7 wins, but not DI wins.

thanks i was just curious

[TheValleyRaider]

thanks i was just curious

Hey, I'm not adverse to someone checking my facts :)

It certainly is close, and I had to dig a bit to find those 7 possible at-large teams that didn't have the full 7 wins. I think, and this would take more research than I really have the time to do (since I should be researching other things, like my schoolwork), that 2006 was actually the anomoly in terms of 7-4 teams. If I remember correctly, I-AA and FCS are usually blessed with a few more 8-3 sides, with 7-4 being typically on the outside looking in. I have to think we could find more than 7 in most years. xreadx

[FCSFAN]

Not sure what your getting at here. You said 50% of "eligible" (whatever that means) teams made the playoffs last year, how are only 32 teams eligible?
I thought we talked about this already:
http://www.anygivensaturday.com/forum/showthread.php?t=27110
Yearbook page 14:
http://www.collegesportingnews.com/article.asp?articleid=86744
7 DIs. I'm nearly 100% on that, although it's possible I missed a few, I looked kinda quickly. I definately left out some teams that I knew had 7 wins, but not DI wins.
I thought we talked about this already:
http://www.anygivensaturday.com/forum/showthread.php?t=27110
Yearbook page 14:
http://www.collegesportingnews.com/article.asp?articleid=86744The list from last year from the yearbook:

"*72 eligible teams at playoff selection time in 2006 did not have 7 wins of any kind including Lafayette (6-5) who won their conference AQ.

32 teams had at least 7 wins:
7 won their conference AQ
Appalachian State (10-1)
Hampton (10-1)
Massachusetts (10-1)
Montana (10-1)
Tennessee-Martin (9-2)
Youngstown State (9-2)
McNeese State (7-4) (only 6 D-I wins)

8 had at least 7 D-I wins and were selected for the playoffs
Coastal Carolina (9-2)
James Madison (9-2)
Furman (8-3)
Illinois State (8-3)
New Hampshire (8-3)
Southern Illinois (8-3)
Eastern Illinois (8-4)
Montana State (7-4)

11 had at least 7 D-I wins but were not selected for the playoffs
San Diego (10-0)
Monmouth (10-1)
Central Connecticut State (8-3)
Delaware State (8-3)
Duquesne (7-3)
Albany (7-4)
Holy Cross (7-4)
Northern Iowa (7-4)
Portland State (7-4)
Towson (7-4)
Wofford (7-4)

6 did not qualify for the playoffs with at least 7 D-I wins
Charleston Southern (9-2)
Drake (9-2)
Cal Poly (7-4)
Florida A&M (7-4)
Robert Morris (7-4)
South Carolina State (7-4)"

[howvan]

ysuwin posted the report of the Div. I FCS subcommitte meeting on 6/26-27 to GuinZone, and I thought that I would share it here:
http://www1.ncaa.org/membership/governance/division_I/champ_cabinet/2007/September_2007/Supp_25_FCS.htm.

It appears that we might see a 24-team bracket or opening round "play-in" games next year. What I think is interesting is how the 2006 brackets would have looked if there were 24 teams or these play-in games. Click on the link in the report to the PDF.

What does everyone think?

[danefan]

see http://www.anygivensaturday.com/forum/showthread.php?t=29252&highlight=autobid

[Go...gate]

I think it is interesting. I like the idea that every conference champion gets in.

[howvan]

I guess that answers that. My bad.

[TheValleyRaider]

Close. Maine and Cal Poly did not have the required 7 D-I wins. Lafayette didn't either, but they were an auto-bid, so it didn't matter. Holy Cross and a couple of other teams had the 7 wins, they're listed for certain in the thread that's been up about this.

Interesting to see, certainly xthumbsupx

[danefan]

damn those post combining elves work fast.

[blur2005]

Yeah, screw a 24-team bracket until there are more teams that are legitimately competitive. And until after the moratorium is up:D.

[CopperCat]

AWESOME!
I would love to see playin games during thanksgiving weekend!
I think this would benefit everyone... though it may in the short term include too many 7-4 teams!

I daresay that is a good thing, because some of those 7-4 teams play WAY harder schedules than other FCS teams do.