Griz Coach explains schedule.

[Ronbo]

In the first ten minutes. Go ahead and critique his thoughts. He also talks about James Madison, Georgia Southern, App. State, and Northern Iowa. Says watch out for James Madison you CAA folks. xnodx

Bobby Hauck Show (http://streamingmedia.montanagrizzlies.com/umgriz/2007_2008/Football/Multimedia/Bye_week___S/radio_091007.mp3)

[AZGrizFan]

I say he's spot on. I've said all along, I don't mind SUU and Albany, but Fort Lewis has GOT to go. We got just as much playing time and experience for the 2nd/3rd stringers against SUU, without the game being an embarrasment. I'd rather plug in SDSU, Cal Poly, or UC Davis, or NDSU. Then you've got a tough (but winnable) game, a medium difficulty game, and a fairly easy game....just right for an OOC schedule.

[89Hen]

Then you've got a tough (but winnable) game, a medium difficulty game, and a fairly easy game....just right for an OOC schedule.
That's the formula I like. xthumbsupx

[patssle]

You should do another home and home with SHSU...come back to Huntsville boys :D

[FCS_pwns_FBS]

You guys are letting the Big Sky haters get to you xlolx, thinking you somehow need to bolser your schedule strength. I agree with Hauck. There is nothing wrong with scheduling a DII or a weak FCS on a yearly basis, and it's good if you can schedule one close to get a lot of attendance. I would like to see a regular season game with Montana or have at least one good FCS OOC, but there is no need to go nuts and try to bring in top 25 teams for every OOC date.

And he's dead wrong about Georgia Southern not being able to compete right now :D

[putter]

You guys are letting the Big Sky haters get to you xlolx, thinking you somehow need to bolser your schedule strength. I agree with Hauck. There is nothing wrong with scheduling a DII or a weak FCS on a yearly basis, and it's good if you can schedule one close to get a lot of attendance. I would like to see a regular season game with Montana or have at least one good FCS OOC, but there is no need to go nuts and try to bring in top 25 teams for every OOC date.

And he's dead wrong about Georgia Southern not being able to compete right now :D

do you think they could compete with FBS teams now like you did in the past?

[yorkcountyUNHfan]

[QUOTE=Ronbo;645150]In the first ten minutes. Go ahead and critique his thoughts. He also talks about James Madison, Georgia Southern, App. State, and Northern Iowa. Says watch out for James Madison you CAA folks. xnodx

Ya, thanks...a little late.xbangx xbangx

[89Hen]

there is no need to go nuts and try to bring in top 25 teams for every OOC date.
xconfusedx Has anyone ever said anything close to that??

[appfan2008]

it would be stupid to bring in top 25 ooc games every week because no one else is doing it

[Grizzaholic]

it would be stupid to bring in top 25 ooc games every week because no one else is doing it

And if they were all home and homes and they were away the first year would all of the haters quit dissin' Montana about playing in the friendly confines of Wa-Griz and scheduling a tough OOC?



My guess is no.

[Jerbearasu]

And if they were all home and homes and they were away the first year would all of the haters quit dissin' Montana about playing in the friendly confines of Wa-Griz and scheduling a tough OOC?



My guess is no.

I would totally quit dissing their schedule. I don't mind what year they go on the home/home as long as they do go for the away game instead of buying their way out. I don't even think it has to be a Top 25 team but a team that is pretty respectable. I loved our series we had with EKU even though they were only in the Top 25 one year (I believe) it was still a decent game with a team that isn't a pushover... That is all I look for. Especially if you schedule the games far out, you can't predict if they will be in the Top 25 or not but if you get a program with a decent reputation then I would think alot higher of the Griz's schedule.

[Casey_Orourke]

And if they were all home and homes and they were away the first year would all of the haters quit dissin' Montana about playing in the friendly confines of Wa-Griz and scheduling a tough OOC?



My guess is no.

I would not dis Montana as much as I do now if they had some home and home agreements with some of the better teams for their OOC schedules. It would shut up many of your critics and dispell the smack that Montana is afraid to play outside of their home stadium.

My own personal opinion is that Montana could win anywhere,,,and really nothing is sweeter then beating a team on its home turf....look at the push Appy has been getting since Michigan

[Green26]

The Montana schedule, since the $1 million budget deficit came to light about 3 or so years ago, has been influenced primarily by financial concerns. The VP-Finance of the university, as well as the president, has been active in the financial affairs of the athletic department since that time.

It's been important for Montana to have 7 home games, or 6 home game and a huge money game like Oregon/Iowa. The best available info is that Montana nets about $400,000 on home games. Thus, playing a home and home "costs" UM $400,000 over a two-year period.

Montana's scheduling had been complicated by now having 8 teams in the conference, instead of just 7.

While Montana, of course, looks at the strength of its schedule (both ways), Montana isn't afraid to play on the road. Some of you can say what you want about that, but you don't know what you're talking about and it isn't accurate.

Here was UM's non-conference schedule in past years:

'06 - Iowa, Cal Poly and So. Dak. St.
'05 - Oregon, Cal Poly, SDS and Fort Lewis
'04 - Maine, Hofstra, Sam Houston (and No. Colo. before it was in the conference).

With the deficit being paid off as of June 30, 2007, and a 12th permitted in '08 for I-AA, I think Montana will have a more exciting schedule in '08 and will start to schedule home and homes again. Montana is currently working on an exciting game for next fall, and has several irons in the fire.

[Ronbo]

So far we have Davis, SUU, and Western Colorado State lined up for home games, and there are rumors of a game in Las Vegas.

[Ronbo]

Two schools are said to be in touch with us for Aug 30, 2008. A game with Grambling in Las Vegas. Or a game in Hawaii. We need to work out details but the 1st OOC game next season will be one of those. Hawaii is said to be offering $175,000 plus covering all expenses. The Las Vegas Classic is paying $175,000, no expenses.

[blukeys]

Hauck says his league is the best in the country. Now that is a real HOOT. xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx

I'm glad Hauck is pleased to schedule Fort Lewis so his backups can get experience. That is fine. It still does not entitle them to a ranking above Northern Iowa who beat a FBS team or JMU who beat a top 10 FCS team.

No one begrudges Montana's scheduling but Montana fans need to accept the consequences of scheduling a patsy instead of a difficult team the way UNI did.

[GRZZ]

What do you want the coach to say? Our league is terrible? That is the dumbest thing in the world and you know it. Of course the coach is going to be a strong supporter of the league publicly.

[McNeese75]

xconfusedx Has anyone ever said anything close to that??

xrolleyesx SUU??? :D

[Ronbo]

He was making a joke about our League office, not the Conference strength. As far as the OOC games this year I was told they were lined up three years ago when we were embroiled in a defecit brought on by away games in Maine, New York, and Texas and the loss of revenue caused by adding N. Colorado to the Conference. Most people don't know that Montana has really high Charter costs to travel. We bring a plane in from Washington because we have no charter jets here in Missoula. Must be nice to be able to bus to 30 OOC schools in your neighborhood. I heard Maine cost over 200K.

[blukeys]

He was making a joke about our League office, not the Conference strength. As far as the OOC games this year I was told they were lined up three years ago when we were embroiled in a defecit brought on by away games in Maine, New York, and Texas and the loss of revenue caused by adding N. Colorado to the Conference. Most people don't know that Montana has really high Charter costs to travel. We bring a plane in from Washington because we have no charter jets here in Missoula. Must be nice to be able to bus to 30 OOC schools in your neighborhood. I heard Maine cost over 200K.


And whose dumb decision was that!!!! Quit your whining and accept the consequences of the stupiditity of your own AD. Why everyone must pay for the dumb decisions made by Montana administrators is beyond me.

Montana has earned the reputation for jerking around OOC opponents and rightfully so. If you are in a financial hole then be a mensch and say we screwed up and are sorry instead of trying to make it sound as if you guys are the victims. In the end you screwed the other schools not the other way around.

[blukeys]

What do you want the coach to say? Our league is terrible? That is the dumbest thing in the world and you know it. Of course the coach is going to be a strong supporter of the league publicly.

Can't wait to hear a MEAC coach or Patriot League coach or OVC coach make the same claim. Let me know when it happens and I will jump on them as well but I don't think any of them will be that stupid or that big a homer.

[Ronbo]

It's pretty simple buddy boy. It costs us 200K to travel. Pay up or shut up. No more home and homes with 9 Conference members. N. Colorado has taken away the one game every other year for a home and home. I feel we are heading out as soon as the 4 year thing is up. We can't afford to play I-AA schools any longer. They can't pay us.

[JackJD]

The Montana schedule, since the $1 million budget deficit came to light about 3 or so years ago, has been influenced primarily by financial concerns. The VP-Finance of the university, as well as the president, has been active in the financial affairs of the athletic department since that time.

It's been important for Montana to have 7 home games, or 6 home game and a huge money game like Oregon/Iowa. The best available info is that Montana nets about $400,000 on home games. Thus, playing a home and home "costs" UM $400,000 over a two-year period.

Montana's scheduling had been complicated by now having 8 teams in the conference, instead of just 7.

While Montana, of course, looks at the strength of its schedule (both ways), Montana isn't afraid to play on the road. Some of you can say what you want about that, but you don't know what you're talking about and it isn't accurate.

Here was UM's non-conference schedule in past years:

'06 - Iowa, Cal Poly and So. Dak. St.
'05 - Oregon, Cal Poly, SDS and Fort Lewis
'04 - Maine, Hofstra, Sam Houston (and No. Colo. before it was in the conference).

With the deficit being paid off as of June 30, 2007, and a 12th permitted in '08 for I-AA, I think Montana will have a more exciting schedule in '08 and will start to schedule home and homes again. Montana is currently working on an exciting game for next fall, and has several irons in the fire.

Please list the home and away games that Montana has cancelled in the past six years and please state how much, if anything, Montana paid to get out of those games.

And while you're at it, please list the same information for your buddies, Montana State.

[FargoBison]

It's pretty simple buddy boy. It costs us 200K to travel. Pay up or shut up. No more home and homes with 9 Conference members. N. Colorado has taken away the one game every other year for a home and home. I feel we are heading out as soon as the 4 year thing is up. We can't afford to play I-AA schools any longer. They can't pay us.

SDSU figured out how to travel to Missoula twice and not end up in financial ruins. In my view that makes a program like Montana look really cheap when they buy out that one return game. I don't see how Montana is in a position to go IA when your penny pinching right now.

[catbob]

He was making a joke about our League office, not the Conference strength. As far as the OOC games this year I was told they were lined up three years ago when we were embroiled in a defecit brought on by away games in Maine, New York, and Texas and the loss of revenue caused by adding N. Colorado to the Conference. Most people don't know that Montana has really high Charter costs to travel. We bring a plane in from Washington because we have no charter jets here in Missoula. Must be nice to be able to bus to 30 OOC schools in your neighborhood. I heard Maine cost over 200K.

Or that whole incident involving improper uses of the budget that lead to the firing of someone high up. I can't remember the details very well.

[ursus arctos horribilis]

Please list the home and away games that Montana has cancelled in the past six years and please state how much, if anything, Montana paid to get out of those games.

And while you're at it, please list the same information for your buddies, Montana State.

Cal Poly and SDSU and I believe the price was $50,000 on each of them. Doing the simple math I believe that is about $350,000 made on each game that helped service the debt. Not a popular choice with everybody as to be expected, but faced with that same choice only the intellectual midget would have gone the other way.

[JackJD]

Just asking.

The 'intellectual midget' comment suggests this continues to be a sore spot with some. xlolx

[ursus arctos horribilis]

Just asking.

The 'intellectual midget' comment suggests this continues to be a sore spot with some. xlolx

Really?

OK, I see where you're going with this. You mean fans other than the Griz fans. It doesn't bother me too much that we had another home game.

[ucdtim17]

You've paid the debt off now - I look forward to seeing you in Davis in '09

[ursus arctos horribilis]

You've paid the debt off now - I look forward to seeing you in Davis in '09

Maybe you're smacking here but I seriously don't know. Do we have a home and home with you with you upcoming?

[Ronbo]

Or that whole incident involving improper uses of the budget that lead to the firing of someone high up. I can't remember the details very well.

Yep, the AD scheduled us into a $1,000,000 deficit over a three year period (2002-2004) in Football and Men's and Women's Basketball and paid with his job.

[ucdtim17]

Maybe you're smacking here but I seriously don't know. Do we have a home and home with you with you upcoming?

I know we're up there next year and heard several years ago that it was a home and home, but I haven't heard anything since then

[ursus arctos horribilis]

I know we're up there next year and heard several years ago that it was a home and home, but I haven't heard anything since then

Look forward to seeing you guys. I hope your administration had the good sense to negotiate a big buyout for yourselves.

[Ronbo]

We won't back out again any time soon. But with our Conference schedule of 4 away games every year and only an 11 game schedule it's tough to get these home and homes scheduled. Maybe one a year from now on and nothing to the East Coast, travel costs (fuel) have doubled in the last 4 years. I can see ND, NDSU, Cal Poly, Davis, SD and SDSU as the only teams we'd schedule a home and home with. You never know though. Maybe UNI. The Regents have put a short leash on Montana for travel unless it's a big payday game.

[Polywog]

It's pretty simple buddy boy. It costs us 200K to travel. Pay up or shut up. No more home and homes with 9 Conference members. N. Colorado has taken away the one game every other year for a home and home. I feel we are heading out as soon as the 4 year thing is up. We can't afford to play I-AA schools any longer. They can't pay us.

WOW. So I guess we'll be seeing Montana in the PAC-10 pretty soon, eh? xeyebrowx

[Ronbo]

I'm just going on what the Missoulian printed that the trip to Maine cost. I would guess any trip to the East Coast out of Missoula might be close. We have to fly in a Jet from Washington, it's very expensive. Most schools don't have to do that. Bet Poly has a Charter close by. Does it cost more or less for a Pac 10 school to travel than Montana? Isn't it about the same per head for Air, Hotel, Food, etc. no matter what division? Or do FCS teams get a discount? No, not Pac 10, maybe the WAC. All schools in a similar distance as Big Sky schools, but it opens up lot's of OOC games in our area too. The MWC and Pac 10, and the Big Sky. That would be 28-30 FBS and FCS schools to have OOC games with in our area where we only have about 3 FCS schools now. SUU, Cal Poly, and Davis. Let's face it, FCS football is an Eastern Division. That's why so many Southland and Big Sky schools have bailed.

[Old Montana State Grad]

There are two airports in Montana with direct flights to the outer world; Glacier Park International between Kalispell and Columbia Falls and Gallatin Field between Belgrade and Bozo; quit playing politics and demanding the same service--get on a shuttle to the Flathead and you won't pay the dang fees.

Give it up and let the Flathead, and Gallatin grow.

[mlbowl]

Montana fans need to accept the consequences of scheduling a patsy instead of a difficult team

Gotcha.....Maybe we should work on getting powerful West Chester at home every yearxrolleyesx

[Proud Griz Man]

You've paid the debt off now - I look forward to seeing you in Davis in '09

Just guessing, the game at Davis might be slated for 2010 instead of 2009. The Griz football team plays at Sacramento State this fall/odd-numbered years and I can't see UM scheduling two California road games in the same year. I have no idea about the buyout clause, and won't speculate. xcoffeex

I find it amusing that the teflon-coated Athletic Directors at SDSU and Cal Poly negotiated contracts with low buyout clauses, and are not subject to any second guessing. xrulesx xbawlingx xbawlingx xbawlingx xbawlingx

[HIU 93]

Then you've got a tough (but winnable) game, a medium difficulty game, and a fairly easy game....just right for an OOC schedule.

Very interesting. When we do that, you say our schedule is weak, but it's okay when you do that. I smell a homer double standard!

[FCS Go!]

Very interesting. When we do that, you say our schedule is weak, but it's okay when you do that. I smell a homer double standard!

No. It's just that the MEAC is one of the few conferences considered weaker than the Big Sky by east coast posters.

[Ronbo]

Very interesting. When we do that, you say our schedule is weak, but it's okay when you do that. I smell a homer double standard!

The Big Sky goes to the playoffs and gets some wins, the MEAC doesn't. 11-0 Hampton is one and out. It does say something about SOS of the Conference. EWU over #1 SIU, NAU over #1 McNeese, MSU over Furman. These are all recent BSC wins. The only time Montana has been one and out is during rebuilding years like our 8-4 2005 team that team was 70% sophmores and freshman. In 2003 our starting QB was injured and we still took a very good WIU team to 3 OT's with our backup QB.

[THE HERD]

We won't back out again any time soon. But with our Conference schedule of 4 away games every year and only an 11 game schedule it's tough to get these home and homes scheduled. Maybe one a year from now on and nothing to the East Coast, travel costs (fuel) have doubled in the last 4 years. I can see ND, NDSU, Cal Poly, Davis, SD and SDSU as the only teams we'd schedule a home and home with. You never know though. Maybe UNI. The Regents have put a short leash on Montana for travel unless it's a big payday game.

I would love to see a home and home with NDSU and Montana.......I really think that it could become one of the best rivarlies in the FCS. There are still rumors of Mont. St. still coming to Fargo in the next year or two for the game we played out there a few years ago.

[HIU 93]

The Big Sky goes to the playoffs and gets some wins, the MEAC doesn't. 11-0 Hampton is one and out. It does say something about SOS of the Conference. EWU over #1 SIU, NAU over #1 McNeese, MSU over Furman. These are all recent BSC wins. The only time Montana has been one and out is during rebuilding years like our 8-4 2005 team that team was 70% sophmores and freshman. In 2003 our starting QB was injured and we still took a very good WIU team to 3 OT's with our backup QB.

In 2004, we beat WIU 40-20. I think you Montana guys are just a little sensitive about your current creampuff schedule. I also think there is a double standard. If we do as AZ said, schedule a tough team that is winnable (like WIU in '04), a medium difficulty team (ex. Grambling in '05), and an easy game (say, SSU in '04), the entire AGS nation goes on a 750 gajillion page bender about the lack of SOS at Hampton, the lack of coaching, the lack of whatever else you feel like criticizing us for. Maybe y'all aren't happy unless you have SOMETHING to criticize others about.:p

[putter]

In 2004, we beat WIU 40-20. I think you Montana guys are just a little sensitive about your current creampuff schedule. I also think there is a double standard. If we do as AZ said, schedule a tough team that is winnable (like WIU in '04), a medium difficulty team (ex. Grambling in '05), and an easy game (say, SSU in '04), the entire AGS nation goes on a 750 gajillion page bender about the lack of SOS at Hampton, the lack of coaching, the lack of whatever else you feel like criticizing us for. Maybe y'all aren't happy unless you have SOMETHING to criticize others about.:p

HIU, after reading the threads bashing Montana you should know by now that the only thing most posters care about is playoff success. They use SOS as a barometer of playoff success and if you have not been successful in the playoffs then your OOC schedule immediately comes into question. Heck, Montana has played in 5 NC games and people still question the teams we play.

[flexbone]

[QUOTE=Ronbo;645150]In the first ten minutes. Go ahead and critique his thoughts. He also talks about James Madison, Georgia Southern, App. State, and Northern Iowa. Says watch out for James Madison you CAA folks. xnodx

Ya, thanks...a little late.xbangx xbangx

LOL

[HIU 93]

HIU, after reading the threads bashing Montana you should know by now that the only thing most posters care about is playoff success. They use SOS as a barometer of playoff success and if you have not been successful in the playoffs then your OOC schedule immediately comes into question. Heck, Montana has played in 5 NC games and people still question the teams we play.

Notice the smiley- tounge in cheek, friendly bashing of a very successful team- you guys have 5 National Championships. That's all you need to say. You don't have to be all sensitive about a schedule, nor do you need to bash anyone else for their schedule or anything they do. All you need to do is say-

FIVE NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIPS

Until and unless folks reach that level, they really have nothing to say to you.

Y'all some sensitive bamas!:p

...AND YOU STILL HAVE A CREAMPUFF SCHEDULE!:p xlolx :p

[mlbowl]

All you need to do is say-

FIVE NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIPS



I wish...It's actually 5 appearances with 2 championships

[Ronbo]

Notice the smiley- tounge in cheek, friendly bashing of a very successful team- you guys have 5 National Championships. That's all you need to say. You don't have to be all sensitive about a schedule, nor do you need to bash anyone else for their schedule or anything they do. All you need to do is say-

FIVE NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIPS

Until and unless folks reach that level, they really have nothing to say to you.

Y'all some sensitive bamas!:p

...AND YOU STILL HAVE A CREAMPUFF SCHEDULE!:p xlolx :p


Thanks for the kudos buddy. It's only two. We've been to the final game 5 times. At least we're not 0-fer like the Bills and Viks are in the Super Bowls. xlolx

[putter]

Notice the smiley- tounge in cheek, friendly bashing of a very successful team- you guys have 5 National Championships. That's all you need to say. You don't have to be all sensitive about a schedule, nor do you need to bash anyone else for their schedule or anything they do. All you need to do is say-

FIVE NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIPS

Until and unless folks reach that level, they really have nothing to say to you.

Y'all some sensitive bamas!:p

...AND YOU STILL HAVE A CREAMPUFF SCHEDULE!:p xlolx :p

Not as creamy as some think as I still think playing 2 of3 FCS teams is legit but it is fun to smack back and forth:D xlolx !!

[Casey_Orourke]

It's pretty simple buddy boy. It costs us 200K to travel. Pay up or shut up. No more home and homes with 9 Conference members. N. Colorado has taken away the one game every other year for a home and home. I feel we are heading out as soon as the 4 year thing is up. We can't afford to play I-AA schools any longer. They can't pay us.

By the same token it probably would cost some schools the same amount to travel to play you. Some of the better schools that you may want to play may be of the opinion that "If you aren't willing to play the cost to come play us, why should we shell out the same amount to come play you?"

Your Board of Regents need to remember there s a world on the other side of the Mississippi with teams that would jump at the chance to play the Great Montana, but would also like the chance to play you guys in front of their home fans as much as you like to play in front of yours. so.....are a couple of home/homes against a top team a large price to pay, especially if you could get a schedule get a schedule with one travel game and a home game and the next the visitor hosts you and you host the team you traveled to the previous season.

It might lessen some of your bashing, but then being on top always attracts some attention.... as I said before, Montana....the team you hate to love, but love to hate. xthumbsupx xpeacex

[putter]

By the same token it probably would cost some schools the same amount to travel to play you. Some of the better schools that you may want to play may be of the opinion that "If you aren't willing to play the cost to come play us, why should we shell out the same amount to come play you?"

Your Board of Regents need to remember there s a world on the other side of the Mississippi with teams that would jump at the chance to play the Great Montana, but would also like the chance to play you guys in front of their home fans as much as you like to play in front of yours. so.....are a couple of home/homes against a top team a large price to pay, especially if you could get a schedule get a schedule with one travel game and a home game and the next the visitor hosts you and you host the team you traveled to the previous season.

It might lessen some of your bashing, but then being on top always attracts some attention.... as I said before, Montana....the team you hate to love, but love to hate. xthumbsupx xpeacex


Makes sense although flying out of Montana is expensive. My family had to fly to Houston and from Great Falls to Houston roundtrip came to $480/ticket. If we were flying from Houston to Great Falls the cost was $305/ticket...go figure.

[AZGrizFan]

So far we have Davis, SUU, and Western Colorado State lined up for home games, and there are rumors of a game in Las Vegas.


Is this the same Western Colorado State that has lost its two games this year by a combined 56 points, has scored a grand total of 6 points in its two games, and got beat in it's opener 55-3 by Fort Hays State? xeekx xeekx xeekx xeekx

So, we beat a 7-4 Fort Lewis team by 49 points THIS year, and go and schedule the f-ing cellar dwelling Western State team (3-8 in the vaunted Rocky Mountain Athletic Conference) for next year??? What, was Fort Lewis too tough? Jesus. I'm not sure how many more of these I can stand....

[ucdtim17]

Just guessing, the game at Davis might be slated for 2010 instead of 2009. The Griz football team plays at Sacramento State this fall/odd-numbered years and I can't see UM scheduling two California road games in the same year. I have no idea about the buyout clause, and won't speculate. xcoffeex


I saw the same thing - that would make more sense

[Ronbo]

Is this the same Western Colorado State that has lost its two games this year by a combined 56 points, has scored a grand total of 6 points in its two games, and got beat in it's opener 55-3 by Fort Hays State? xeekx xeekx xeekx xeekx

So, we beat a 7-4 Fort Lewis team by 49 points THIS year, and go and schedule the f-ing cellar dwelling Western State team (3-8 in the vaunted Rocky Mountain Athletic Conference) for next year??? What, was Fort Lewis too tough? Jesus. I'm not sure how many more of these I can stand....


Thank Don Read, he scheduled this game 3 years ago. He was also responsible for the Fort Lewis games and the SUU games. All set up right after the deficit cost his predecessor his job.

[Peems]

By the same token it probably would cost some schools the same amount to travel to play you. Some of the better schools that you may want to play may be of the opinion that "If you aren't willing to play the cost to come play us, why should we shell out the same amount to come play you?"

Your Board of Regents need to remember there s a world on the other side of the Mississippi with teams that would jump at the chance to play the Great Montana, but would also like the chance to play you guys in front of their home fans as much as you like to play in front of yours. so.....are a couple of home/homes against a top team a large price to pay, especially if you could get a schedule get a schedule with one travel game and a home game and the next the visitor hosts you and you host the team you traveled to the previous season.


It might lessen some of your bashing, but then being on top always attracts some attention.... as I said before, Montana....the team you hate to love, but love to hate. xthumbsupx xpeacex


The only problem with everything is, why should the AD, Coach care what people think? All the tickets were bought up, every game made max profit. What is the benefit of going out and playing a Delaware at UD? None(in the eyes of the powers that be). The Griz have established themselves as a perennial power and if they win the conference and get playoff home games, no one complains(inside of Montana that is). Now before everyone comes after me, remember that this is what the higher ups think about. The Griz will travel outside of Missoula for an OOC game sometime in the next 50 years...I guarantee it:D

[McNeese75]

The Griz will travel outside of Missoula for an OOC game sometime in the next 50 years...I guarantee it:D

xrolleyesx We will believe it when we see it :D

[JALMOND]

Before the season began, I caught Colin Cowherd's radio show and he was addressing this topic of teams upset at not getting a home and home against the bigger named programs thus refusing to schedule the heavies. He was talking about FBS but I could see the parallels to FCS. Basically, his topic was the issue of earning the right to play the heavies on your own field. Issues like would a team like Florida Atlantic be right in refusing to play Georgia because the Bulldogs would not do a home and home. Sounds crazy? Isn't that what we are talking about here? Why would Montana have to schedule a home and home just to get a game against, say, Wofford? Why would Appalachian State have to schedule home and home to play Portland State? Would you say that Wofford and Portland State have earned the right for these big name FCS teams to play at their house?

[Casey_Orourke]

The only problem with everything is, why should the AD, Coach care what people think? All the tickets were bought up, every game made max profit. What is the benefit of going out and playing a Delaware at UD? None(in the eyes of the powers that be). The Griz have established themselves as a perennial power and if they win the conference and get playoff home games, no one complains(inside of Montana that is). Now before everyone comes after me, remember that this is what the higher ups think about. The Griz will travel outside of Missoula for an OOC game sometime in the next 50 years...I guarantee it:D

My point is that Montana's OOC schedule will consist of teams like Ft. Lewis, Southern Utah and teams few know about or are not all that good. The teams that count and would give Montana an actual challenge may say that unless you are willing to sign a home&home...forget it.

Recently we got a new employee whose son plays college ball here in Texas. when I mentioned a possible game against a school like Montana, her exact words describing Montata were ...Pompous, arrogant, to good to come here, to scared to leave home and other things like that.

It surprised me that even here in Texas, Montana is so despised and loathed here in a place that worships college football as if it were a religion.

[CopperCat]

Before the season began, I caught Colin Cowherd's radio show and he was addressing this topic of teams upset at not getting a home and home against the bigger named programs thus refusing to schedule the heavies. He was talking about FBS but I could see the parallels to FCS. Basically, his topic was the issue of earning the right to play the heavies on your own field. Issues like would a team like Florida Atlantic be right in refusing to play Georgia because the Bulldogs would not do a home and home. Sounds crazy? Isn't that what we are talking about here? Why would Montana have to schedule a home and home just to get a game against, say, Wofford? Why would Appalachian State have to schedule home and home to play Portland State? Would you say that Wofford and Portland State have earned the right for these big name FCS teams to play at their house?

For the record, Colin Cowherd is a loudmouth. But on occassion he does say SOME things that make sense.

Concerning the above post, there's a middle ground, and that is why there is a home and home deal out there. "You scratch our back, we'll scratch yours" kind of deal. One team doesn't want to give it up, but the other one doesn't either. In the end, there is either NO game, or there is a deal that centers around this middle ground (in the ideal world). But then you add in buyouts and the whole thing is just a mess.xrolleyesx

[Casey_Orourke]

Before the season began, I caught Colin Cowherd's radio show and he was addressing this topic of teams upset at not getting a home and home against the bigger named programs thus refusing to schedule the heavies. He was talking about FBS but I could see the parallels to FCS. Basically, his topic was the issue of earning the right to play the heavies on your own field. Issues like would a team like Florida Atlantic be right in refusing to play Georgia because the Bulldogs would not do a home and home. Sounds crazy? Isn't that what we are talking about here? Why would Montana have to schedule a home and home just to get a game against, say, Wofford? Why would Appalachian State have to schedule home and home to play Portland State? Would you say that Wofford and Portland State have earned the right for these big name FCS teams to play at their house?

The question is if a top program like App St or a program with history behind like an Ivy leage offered Montana a home & home......would they agree?

[ucdtim17]

Before the season began, I caught Colin Cowherd's radio show and he was addressing this topic of teams upset at not getting a home and home against the bigger named programs thus refusing to schedule the heavies. He was talking about FBS but I could see the parallels to FCS. Basically, his topic was the issue of earning the right to play the heavies on your own field. Issues like would a team like Florida Atlantic be right in refusing to play Georgia because the Bulldogs would not do a home and home. Sounds crazy? Isn't that what we are talking about here? Why would Montana have to schedule a home and home just to get a game against, say, Wofford? Why would Appalachian State have to schedule home and home to play Portland State? Would you say that Wofford and Portland State have earned the right for these big name FCS teams to play at their house?

No one is saying Auburn owes Florida Atlantic a home and home. But when a program gets to the point of selling out every game no matter the opponent, certain schools in recent years have made a habit of scheduling every OOC game at home (UM is the only real culprit in FCS - there are more in FBS). No one can force them to play away once in a while, but their consciences and sense of fair sport should (not to mention their FANBASES). Football teams do not exist solely to provide revenue for the university.

[AlphaSigMD]

The question is if a top program like App St or a program with history behind like an Ivy leage offered Montana a home & home......would they agree?

Montana will Never, and let me repeat that, NEVER come to Boone to play ASU unless forced to do so via a kooky playoff circumstance. Lets just say that the very essence of Kidd Brewer Stadium is not condusive to the collective well being of those calling Montana home. Just ask Montana State.


Now, they might say they will in order to get a front loaded "home and wuss out" deal (i'm still looking at you too, Northwestern State) but hopefully Cobb would see that one coming.

Personally, I'd love to see the game, (i still remember watching the OT thrilla at Wa-Griz in Newland Residence Hall) in Montana, Chatty or even somewhere in between.

[Casey_Orourke]

Montana will Never, and let me repeat that, NEVER come to Boone to play ASU unless forced to do so via a kooky playoff circumstance. Lets just say that the very essence of Kidd Brewer Stadium is not condusive to the collective well being of those calling Montana home. Just ask Montana State.


Now, they might say they will in order to get a front loaded "home and wuss out" deal (i'm still looking at you too, Northwestern State) but hopefully Cobb would see that one coming.

Personally, I'd love to see the game, (i still remember watching the OT thrilla at Wa-Griz in Newland Residence Hall) in Montana, Chatty or even somewhere in between.


That is the sad thing about the whole situation....Montana has a good team, but few beyond the the BSC have seen them play in person. So to them Montana is this team that is always highly rated but only seems to appear duringf the playoffs then disappears.

[Stang Fever]

I say he's spot on. I've said all along, I don't mind SUU and Albany, but Fort Lewis has GOT to go. We got just as much playing time and experience for the 2nd/3rd stringers against SUU, without the game being an embarrasment. I'd rather plug in SDSU, Cal Poly, or UC Davis, or NDSU. Then you've got a tough (but winnable) game, a medium difficulty game, and a fairly easy game....just right for an OOC schedule.

The Griz are just getting what the deserve. They stiff everyone in I-AA who signs a home and away contract with them. Only to buyout of the away game. Teams are tired of it. OUR Fans want to see elite teams come to our stadium and play. Why should CAL POLY, NDSU, etc...come to Montana when you know that the home date you signed for your fans isnt even worth the paper it is signed on.


ATTENTION FCS!!! DO NOT SIGN a HOME and HOME(away) with MONTANA only if and that is a big if Montana is willing to go to you first.

[AZGrizFan]

The Griz are just getting what the deserve. They stiff everyone in I-AA who signs a home and away contract with them. Only to buyout of the away game. Teams are tired of it. OUR Fans want to see elite teams come to our stadium and play. Why should CAL POLY, NDSU, etc...come to Montana when you know that the home date you signed for your fans isnt even worth the paper it is signed on.


ATTENTION FCS!!! DO NOT SIGN a HOME and HOME(away) with MONTANA only if and that is a big if Montana is willing to go to you first.


xbawlingx xbawlingx xbawlingx xbawlingx xbawlingx xbawlingx

Aren't you the frickin' genius. xrolleyesx xrolleyesx xrolleyesx xrolleyesx xrolleyesx

Montana is the DEVIL! Run!

ATTENTION FCS: Do not sign a home and home with Montana that contains a buyout clause that will in all probability be exercised unless you're prepared to have it exercised. If you do, and blame it on Montana you need to check the mirror. Fire your ******** AD, I don't care. But the fact they sign a ****ty contract ain't my fault. Go cry in your beer. xthumbsupx xcoffeex

[ursus arctos horribilis]

The Griz are just getting what the deserve. They stiff everyone in I-AA who signs a home and away contract with them. Only to buyout of the away game. Teams are tired of it. OUR Fans want to see elite teams come to our stadium and play. Why should CAL POLY, NDSU, etc...come to Montana when you know that the home date you signed for your fans isnt even worth the paper it is signed on.


ATTENTION FCS!!! DO NOT SIGN a HOME and HOME(away) with MONTANA only if and that is a big if Montana is willing to go to you first.

You are correct we are getting what we deserve. Sold out games at home. Also why are you crying about us coming out there? By us not coming there we have given you a chance to get a victory by scheduling an Idaho or some other patsy.....ooops., never mind. When we were there in 99 & 01 we beat you by 14 each visit. You should be thanking us for giving you an extra chance to get a win so you can get in the playoffs once in a while. Once you got into the playoffs and came here you finally got a win against us. Now instead of of 0-10 you are 1-10 against us and have something to feel good about. A simple thank you would be nice.

[Ronbo]

You are correct we are getting what we deserve. Sold out games at home. Also why are you crying about us coming out there? By us not coming there we have given you a chance to get a victory by scheduling an Idaho or some other patsy.....ooops., never mind. When we were there in 99 & 01 we beat you by 14 each visit. You should be thanking us for giving you an extra chance to get a win so you can get in the playoffs once in a while. Once you got into the playoffs and came here you finally got a win against us. Now instead of of 0-10 you are 1-10 against us and have something to feel good about. A simple thank you would be nice.

1-11

[mlbowl]

The Griz are just getting what the deserve. They stiff everyone in I-AA who signs a home and away contract with them. Only to buyout of the away game. Teams are tired of it. OUR Fans want to see elite teams come to our stadium and play. Why should CAL POLY, NDSU, etc...come to Montana when you know that the home date you signed for your fans isnt even worth the paper it is signed on.


ATTENTION FCS!!! DO NOT SIGN a HOME and HOME(away) with MONTANA only if and that is a big if Montana is willing to go to you first.


Are you F'N retarded???....seriously, are you?

2004 @ Sam Houston State
2003 @ Maine
2002 @ Hofstra
2001 @ Cal Poly

[Casey_Orourke]

Are you F'N retarded???....seriously, are you?

2004 @ Sam Houston State
2003 @ Maine
2002 @ Hofstra
2001 @ Cal Poly

The most recent is three years ago. What have you done lately? What OOC away games beyond the few big money games has Montana done lately?

[Casey_Orourke]

You are correct we are getting what we deserve. Sold out games at home. Also why are you crying about us coming out there? By us not coming there we have given you a chance to get a victory by scheduling an Idaho or some other patsy.....ooops., never mind. When we were there in 99 & 01 we beat you by 14 each visit. You should be thanking us for giving you an extra chance to get a win so you can get in the playoffs once in a while. Once you got into the playoffs and came here you finally got a win against us. Now instead of of 0-10 you are 1-10 against us and have something to feel good about. A simple thank you would be nice.

OK, rest on your laurels, Montana deserves all its accomplishments, but past accomplishments are in the past, and now it is time to look to the future.

Have you considered that schools may want to play the best teams in the FCS division, but would like to play in front of their fans instead of being REQUIRED to play in front of your's as a contract stipulation?

There may come a time someday soon that Montana will have open home games and there will be no takers from anyone. Given the current feelings I am reading, it may not be far off

[Green26]

The fact that Montana has bought out several teams during the period of repayment of its budget deficit has had only a very small impact on scheduling. Several other factors have been much more important in scheduling. Some of you who are spouting off about this don't know what you're talking about.

[AZGrizFan]

Are you F'N retarded???....seriously, are you?

2004 @ Sam Houston State
2003 @ Maine
2002 @ Hofstra
2001 @ Cal Poly


The most recent is three years ago. What have you done lately? What OOC away games beyond the few big money games has Montana done lately?

Casey---while I appreciate the need/desire to pile on, you might want to check facts before you start spouting off. Portland State ain't exactly Dudley Doright here...

Do you know how many OOC away games beyond the few big money games PORTLAND STATE has played since 2004 (before the debacle in Louisana two weeks ago)?

I'll tell you: ONE - UC Davis, and that was 9/10/05.

Every other OOC away game since 2004 has been a payday: Boise State, Fresno State, New Mexico, California, Oregon State.

But hey, don't let facts get in the way of a good argument.

[Casey_Orourke]

Casey---while I appreciate the need/desire to pile on, you might want to check facts before you start spouting off. Portland State ain't exactly Dudley Doright here...

Do you know how many OOC away games beyond the few big money games PORTLAND STATE has played since 2004 (before the debacle in Louisana two weeks ago)?

I'll tell you: ONE - UC Davis, and that was 9/10/05.

Every other OOC away game since 2004 has been a payday: Boise State, Fresno State, New Mexico, California, Oregon State.

But hey, don't let facts get in the way of a good argument.

I know how many OOC Portland State has.......xmadx I also know our record is less than spectacular, but that is not the subject of this thread...

I was not asking to be an a@@, but because I honestly didn't know (I don't follow Montana football as closely as others). Also, it is tough to get any hard information from you guys without you getting defensive, because you automaticaly believe it is another attempt to slam your team.

But you have to admit that while we all do admit Montana has a great football program, past history has not endeared Montana to many folks here. Even here in Texas, as I mentioned before, the people I have talked to who know FCS football, despise Montana, for what they percieve, as a total disrespect for their programs when Montana according to their perceptions, blatently refuses to come to their field to play their teams.

Personally I have no feelings on this either way, Montana can do what Montana wants, but I think that in the big picture is not just one or two top teams in the FCS, but a large group teams that range from outstanding to downright horrible, but we all still have pride in our schools.

Perception is everything, and right now the perception of Montana (outside of the BSC) is not very good. You Montana backers need to try to change that.

[already123]

Blah Blah Blah!!! I just wanna see Montana have at least a challenging schedule next season...

[putter]

Blah Blah Blah!!! I just wanna see Montana have at least a challenging schedule next season...

Funny how most of you slam other FCS competition. Southern Utah is FCS, Albany is FCS so we are playing out division in OOC.

P.S. --> Casey, we were in Texas to play Sam Houston in 2004. How many trips to Texas are we supposed to make? Other than the playoffs when have Texas teams come up to Missoula? (Sam did it in 2003..)

[Casey_Orourke]

Funny how most of you slam other FCS competition. Southern Utah is FCS, Albany is FCS so we are playing out division in OOC.

P.S. --> Casey, we were in Texas to play Sam Houston in 2004. How many trips to Texas are we supposed to make? Other than the playoffs when have Texas teams come up to Missoula? (Sam did it in 2003..)
Evidently not enough in their eyes. They only want to see their teams play the best in front of their homefield fans on a regular basis.

[lizrdgizrd]

Funny how most of you slam other FCS competition. Southern Utah is FCS, Albany is FCS so we are playing out division in OOC.

P.S. --> Casey, we were in Texas to play Sam Houston in 2004. How many trips to Texas are we supposed to make? Other than the playoffs when have Texas teams come up to Missoula? (Sam did it in 2003..)
Are you really trying to claim SUU is a tough team to beat? Would you say the same for UTC? xrolleyesx

[putter]

Are you really trying to claim SUU is a tough team to beat? Would you say the same for UTC? xrolleyesx


No, it is obvious that SUU is not a stellar team but even LSU will play Louisiana-Monroe etc. Personally I would like to see a Maine, Sam Houston, Hofstra on the OOC schedule like we had in 2003 & 2004 but the almighty dollar is seemingly playing a larger and larger role in scheduling thus Montana seems to want to play west teams. I hope that the UC Davis game is a home and home starting next year.

[Uncle Buck]

No, it is obvious that SUU is not a stellar team but even LSU will play Louisiana-Monroe etc. Personally I would like to see a Maine, Sam Houston, Hofstra on the OOC schedule like we had in 2003 & 2004 but the almighty dollar is seemingly playing a larger and larger role in scheduling thus Montana seems to want to play west teams. I hope that the UC Davis game is a home and home starting next year.

Not trying to fuel the fire, but i love playing Montana as well. While they did come to us in '02 as follow up to our game in '00, I think they bought out their trip to us in '05 after we went there in '04. But i will say that it is fun to play them.

[patssle]

Casey, we were in Texas to play Sam Houston in 2004. How many trips to Texas are we supposed to make? Other than the playoffs when have Texas teams come up to Missoula? (Sam did it in 2003..)

Texas teams comes to Montana almost every year because of the bull#$% playoff comittee who thinks sending the SLC to Montana is a great idea year in and year out.

That said...if we know we are coming there in the playoffs...why would we want to come during the season.

[putter]

Not trying to fuel the fire, but i love playing Montana as well. While they did come to us in '02 as follow up to our game in '00, I think they bought out their trip to us in '05 after we went there in '04. But i will say that it is fun to play them.

You are correct Buck. Montana did buy out the game saying the deficit was the reason. I hope that we can get new home-and-home series scheduled. xthumbsupx

[putter]

Texas teams comes to Montana almost every year because of the bull#$% playoff comittee who thinks sending the SLC to Montana is a great idea year in and year out.

That said...if we know we are coming there in the playoffs...why would we want to come during the season.

I agree with you there. the NCAA needs to start seeding more teams so that the Big Sky vs. SLC every year does not happen in the first round.

[Uncle Buck]

You are correct Buck. Montana did buy out the game saying the deficit was the reason. I hope that we can get new home-and-home series scheduled. xthumbsupx

So when can we expect you to come out? :)

Just kidding man, there are too many bigger things in life to worry about...like beating Albany and equaling last year's win totalxnodx

[ursus arctos horribilis]

It is funny how all these teams like Cal Poly and the 'Texas schools" keep bitchin' about Montana and that we won't come play them at their house when we have very recently, excluding deficit years. You all are like a bunch of jilted girlfriends that know a stud when they have one and then when it's taken away you go and cry to all of your friends how he wronged you. When Montana makes that drunken 2AM booty call you will all welcome us in by whining a little bit at first about how we didn't call you and then service our needs anyway. If you don't someone else will answer the 2:30 AM booty call. Why don't your AD's get some home and homes with some other studs out of the SoCon, Gateway, and the CAA? And last but not least, Casey why do you keep up with this? You keep up the same arguments and keep getting the same retorts. Seriously man we have beaten you down time and time again on the board and the football field. If your IQ ever gets to 50, I would sell immediately.

[GannonFan]

I agree with you there. the NCAA needs to start seeding more teams so that the Big Sky vs. SLC every year does not happen in the first round.

Well, in the past 9 years, an SLC team only went to Montana in 4 of those years. The other 5 years had 1 OVC team, 3 Gateway teams, and 1 Great West team. Interesting too, Montana was 0-4 in those games against the Gateway and Great West in that time period, while sweeping the SLC and the OVC entrants. Maybe we should make sure a non-SLC is sent!!!:p

[DuckDuckGriz]

Well, in the past 9 years, an SLC team only went to Montana in 4 of those years. The other 5 years had 1 OVC team, 3 Gateway teams, and 1 Great West team. Interesting too, Montana was 0-4 in those games against the Gateway and Great West in that time period, while sweeping the SLC and the OVC entrants. Maybe we should make sure a non-SLC is sent!!!:p

Montana is 6-1 against the Great West in Missoula in that time period.
2-2 against the Gateway.
1-0 vs the Ohio Valley.

xeyebrowx

I'd say your stats are a "tad" off.

[mlbowl]

What have you done lately?

Eliminated a million dollar deficitxnodx


xdeadhorsex

[elkmcc]

Well, in the past 9 years, an SLC team only went to Montana in 4 of those years. The other 5 years had 1 OVC team, 3 Gateway teams, and 1 Great West team. Interesting too, Montana was 0-4 in those games against the Gateway and Great West in that time period, while sweeping the SLC and the OVC entrants. Maybe we should make sure a non-SLC is sent!!!:p


I only remember losses to 2 Gateway teams since 1998. WIU(2)once in '98 opening round at WIU and one in '03 opening round at Wa/Griz. The Griz lost to YSU in the opening round of 1999 in Wa/Griz. The Griz lost once (2005) to CP (but also beat them earlier the same year) and in the same time period beat CP 7 times.

You are forgetting either the drubbing SIU took last year in the quarterfinals or the shutout that the Griz put on UNI in the 2001 semi's.

[DuckDuckGriz]

I only remember losses to 2 Gateway teams since 1998. WIU(2)once in '98 opening round at WIU and one in '03 opening round at Wa/Griz. The Griz lost to YSU in the opening round of 1999 in Wa/Griz. The Griz lost once (2005) to CP (but also beat them earlier the same year) and in the same time period beat CP 7 times.

You are forgetting either the drubbing SIU took last year in the quarterfinals or the shutout that the Griz put on UNI in the 2001 semi's.

See my post above.

[Casey_Orourke]

Casey why do you keep up with this? You keep up the same arguments and keep getting the same retorts. Seriously man we have beaten you down time and time again on the board and the football field. If your IQ ever gets to 50, I would sell immediately.

Why? I just want an honest debate between adults without the insults, name calling or bashing (as seen above), that seems to bea part of many of these posts.

In many of the posts in this thread I have stated Montana is one of the best programs in the FCS, but in recent years few outside of Montana and the Big Sky have seen it perform. So to them Montana is this team they know little about (unless they frequent boards like this) that always appears in the playoffs.

Those of us who appreciate the passion our teams put out on the field and the intensity all of our teams play with, not for the financial rewards our big brothers in the FBS, but the sheer love of the game and the pride of representing our schools, just want the chance to see the best the FCS has to offer.

Many of us are just asking the question......

Why has Montana hidden themselves away from us here in the rest of the country?

When will Montana resume its rightful spot as one of the most sought after teams to have come your stadium and show everybody what a championship caliber team looks like?


All we want are simple and honest answers. Is that to much to ask?

[DuckDuckGriz]

Why? I just want an honest debate between adults without the insults, name calling or bashing (as seen above), that seems to bea part of many of these posts.

In many of the posts in this thread I have stated Montana is one of the best programs in the FCS, but in recent years few outside of Montana and the Big Sky have seen it perform. So to them Montana is this team they know little about (unless they frequent boards like this) that always appears in the playoffs.

Those of us who appreciate the passion our teams put out on the field and the intensity all of our teams play with, not for the financial rewards our big brothers in the FBS, but the sheer love of the game and the pride of representing our schools, just want the chance to see the best the FCS has to offer. In the last five years we have traveled further east of the Mississippi than any other BSC team (Maine, Hofstra).

Many of us are just asking the question......

Why has Montana hidden themselves away from us here in the rest of the country?

When will Montana resume its rightful spot as one of the most sought after teams to have come your stadium and show everybody what a championship caliber team looks like?


All we want are simple and honest answers. Is that to much to ask?

Here's the flaw in your argument. Montana has played an OOC on the road every year except this year, infact multiple in one season. Yet if we play a BCS opponent you call it a "big money" game and don't count it. So......you are dissapointed because in (only) 2 years we haven't played a standard FCS opponent OOC on the road? Iowa and Oregon don't count with you because they are "too good" basically. By the way, the loss to Sam Houston State in 2004 is the only FCS OOC road loss in over a decade.

[Casey_Orourke]

Here's the flaw in your argument. Montana has played an OOC on the road every year except this year, infact multiple in one season. Yet if we play a BCS opponent you call it a "big money" game and don't count it. So......you are dissapointed because in (only) 2 years we haven't played a standard FCS opponent OOC on the road? Iowa and Oregon don't count with you because they are "too good" basically. By the way, the loss to Sam Houston State in 2004 is the only FCS OOC road loss in over a decade.

Why are you reacting as if I am attacking you? I'm not!!

Montana's past record speaks for itself.....It is one of the elite programs in the FCS today. I am asking about the future. What will we see from Montana in the future?

With the recent Appy/Michigan game people are beginning to notice the FCS. Now suddenly teams that were quietly successful are suddenly under scrutiny and people want to see them in action. This includes Montana, so I am simply asking again....What will we see from Montana in the future?

[Tailbone]

Casey,

It's not too much to ask for "simple and honest answers".
The issue however, is an apparent inability or unwillingness to accept those "simple and honest answers".

It has been stated (repeatedly) that a 1Million dollar deficit (contributed to in large part by cross country trips) necessitated a different scheduling model in the recent past to recover from the deficit.

Historically, the university of Montana has scheduled in the manner you would like (as has also been stated many times). Why don't we get credit for that?
As has been pointed out, PSU has made NO trips to venues not offering the large pay-out, in the same time period. But I don't blame PSU because a statistic that gets lost in this debate is cost/trip.

A single trip to NAU (required by conference participation) costs in excess of 26,000 dollars (and conference play dictates 4-5 such road trips each year). This one expense, alone, is probably greater than the whole travel budget for most eastern teams. Did you know that a whole half of the population of the US is within 500 miles of App State? OOC games require nothing more than a bus ride. The situation is the same for most other eastern teams.

I understand your desire to see the Griz (or any top team) in person but football is a business, not a charity. Instead of whining, ADs need to find creative ways to make these marquee games attractive to everybody.
The recent rumor re: Grambling/UM is a good example of how that might be done.

C'mon Casey, You asked for fair answers, I'm asking for similar fair-mindedness from you.

[ursus arctos horribilis]

Why? I just want an honest debate between adults without the insults, name calling or bashing (as seen above), that seems to bea part of many of these posts.

In many of the posts in this thread I have stated Montana is one of the best programs in the FCS, but in recent years few outside of Montana and the Big Sky have seen it perform. So to them Montana is this team they know little about (unless they frequent boards like this) that always appears in the playoffs.

Those of us who appreciate the passion our teams put out on the field and the intensity all of our teams play with, not for the financial rewards our big brothers in the FBS, but the sheer love of the game and the pride of representing our schools, just want the chance to see the best the FCS has to offer.

Many of us are just asking the question......

Why has Montana hidden themselves away from us here in the rest of the country?

When will Montana resume its rightful spot as one of the most sought after teams to have come your stadium and show everybody what a championship caliber team looks like?


All we want are simple and honest answers. Is that to much to ask?

What are you talking about in case you forgot PSU is in the Big Sky and we play you every year. Therefore, once a year you see what a championship caliber team looks like. How many times do you need to look at the recipe to bake this cake? All we have given you is simple and honest answers to the questions and yet you still do not understand. Whatever it is at now I would sell, things are not getting better.

[ursus arctos horribilis]

Wow Tailbone that was some parallel thinking on the posts. Glad my landed on the board at the same time otherwise Casey would have said I was buying my way out of a game or something along those lines.

[Casey_Orourke]

Why? I just want an honest debate between adults without the insults, name calling or bashing (as seen above), that seems to bea part of many of these posts.

In many of the posts in this thread I have stated Montana is one of the best programs in the FCS, but in recent years few outside of Montana and the Big Sky have seen it perform. So to them Montana is this team they know little about (unless they frequent boards like this) that always appears in the playoffs.

Those of us who appreciate the passion our teams put out on the field and the intensity all of our teams play with, not for the financial rewards our big brothers in the FBS, but the sheer love of the game and the pride of representing our schools, just want the chance to see the best the FCS has to offer.

Many of us are just asking the question......

Why has Montana hidden themselves away from us here in the rest of the country?

When will Montana resume its rightful spot as one of the most sought after teams to have come your stadium and show everybody what a championship caliber team looks like?


All we want are simple and honest answers. Is that to much to ask?

What are you talking about in case you forgot PSU is in the Big Sky and we play you every year. Therefore, once a year you see what a championship caliber team looks like. How many times do you need to look at the recipe to bake this cake? All we have given you is simple and honest answers to the questions and yet you still do not understand. Whatever it is at now I would sell, things are not getting better.


GEEZ!!!! Why are you still getting defensive?

I'm not in Oregon any more. I now live in Texas, so I don't have the chance to see Montana play every year. The perception here in TEXAS is that Montana hides itself away in the mountains and seldom leaves to play outside of its home. In that reguard Montana has to do some damage control, just to show everybody that they deserve their rep as one of the toughest teams around.

TEXANS love college football, thus they want to see the best and would warmly welcome the best teams in the FCS to come down here and play any of their teams, even if the home team loses, just to see it.

I admit I do rag on you guys on occasion, but the truth be known, I miss Big Sky football. I wanted to go to watch MSU play Texas A&M, but College Station is to far for a daytrip.

So chill.....I am not trying to get into a pi@@ing contest, just trying to have a serious discussion.

[DavisAggie]

Are you F'N retarded???....seriously, are you?

Since you added the, "seriously, are you", question, you need to understand that your college is a Tier 3 University, so, maybe you should be asking yourself, "am I f’n retarded".

Sorry everybody, but that kind of disrespect just annoys me.

[Tailbone]

“Orourke, come to my office please”.

“Yessir, Mr Dennison, I’ll be right there”

“Orourke, I’ve been going over your expense report and see that you are 1 million dollars over budget, what gives?

“Well, Mr Dennison, In response to demands by other soft drink manufacturers, I am attempting to ‘grow the business’, we will all benefit from this and by default, our own sales should grow.”

Dennison frowned. “let me see if I understand this. You feel that by rewarding those who drink Coke, RC cola, Fanta, and Sam’s club colas, you will be increasing the sales of Pepsi?” “and to this end you have been advertising other brands?”

“yessir, Mr Dennison. I know it seems crazy but we’re being criticized by the other manufacturers for not doing our part to ‘grow the soft drink market’. This should quiet our critics”

Dennison frowned again. “Uh, Orourke, did you notice whose name is at the bottom of your checks”?

“Yessir, it’s your name.”

“That’s right Orourke, it’s my name. I don’t pay you to ‘grow the market, I pay you to grow the Pepsi brand, to make money for Pepsi” “Do you watch the Apprentice Orourke?”

“Yessir, I do.” “I just love Trump.”

“Good” Dennison said as he combed his hair over his receding hairline. “Orourke, you’re fired!”


The point is, C_O, that despite the fact that Texans (and others) would love to see the Griz, their desire is not sufficient justification to be fiscally irresponsible. If Texans are sufficiently intrigued to make it financially justifiable, I’m sure O’Day would be more than accommodating.

Have your people call our people. Let’s see what we can work out.

[AZGrizFan]

Since you added the, "seriously, are you", question, you need to understand that your college is a Tier 3 University, so, maybe you should be asking yourself, "am I f’n retarded".

Sorry everybody, but that kind of disrespect just annoys me.

As opposed to some "other" kind of disrespect, of which you have no problem? xconfusedx

[DavisAggie]

As opposed to some "other" kind of disrespect, of which you have no problem? xconfusedx

Like when you ask a stupid question, you get a stupid answer.

(that should explain myself, try not to make it into a complicated riddle)

[citdog]

coach: ok i got this list of times and places where we're gonna play football. it's called a schedule.



what more to explain?xnodx

[AZGrizFan]

Like when you ask a stupid question, you get a stupid answer.

(that should explain myself, try not to make it into a complicated riddle)


Just watch your sentence structure, bub, if you're gonna venture out of the kiddie pool. xnodx xnodx xnodx

[blukeys]

Gotcha.....Maybe we should work on getting powerful West Chester at home every yearxrolleyesx

Yes WCUPA is our Fort Lewis although West Chester was ranked 15th in the nation in D-2 and Fort Lewis is ranked where???????xoopsx xoopsx xoopsx xoopsx xoopsx xoopsx xoopsx

In fact whereas West Chester has a record of success in the D-2 playoffs, one can't find Fort Lewis anywhere. xrolleyesx xrolleyesx xrolleyesx When one compares Fort Lewis as competition one would have to consider Wesley College a D-3 team as a better opponent than the Fort Lewis crew.

We play in the toughest conference in FCS. One creampuff OOC game is OK in that event. We don't have the equivalent of Sacramento State or Weber State in our conference but YOU DO !!!!!!xnodx xnodx xnodx

At any rate we have Navy this year as an OOC, and Maryland and Furman next year. Enjoy Fort Lewis again and get your reserves ready for your conference schedule. I'll be willing to hear how Hauck tells us again how the Big Fluffy Sky is the best conference in the nation. I gotta give the guy points for hutzpah.

When was the last time a team from the Big Fluffy Sky Conference had a playoff win from a team without Montana in their name?????

[Casey_Orourke]

Casey,

It's not too much to ask for "simple and honest answers".
The issue however, is an apparent inability or unwillingness to accept those "simple and honest answers".

It has been stated (repeatedly) that a 1Million dollar deficit (contributed to in large part by cross country trips) necessitated a different scheduling model in the recent past to recover from the deficit.

Historically, the university of Montana has scheduled in the manner you would like (as has also been stated many times). Why don't we get credit for that?
As has been pointed out, PSU has made NO trips to venues not offering the large pay-out, in the same time period. But I don't blame PSU because a statistic that gets lost in this debate is cost/trip.

A single trip to NAU (required by conference participation) costs in excess of 26,000 dollars (and conference play dictates 4-5 such road trips each year). This one expense, alone, is probably greater than the whole travel budget for most eastern teams. Did you know that a whole half of the population of the US is within 500 miles of App State? OOC games require nothing more than a bus ride. The situation is the same for most other eastern teams.

I understand your desire to see the Griz (or any top team) in person but football is a business, not a charity. Instead of whining, ADs need to find creative ways to make these marquee games attractive to everybody.
The recent rumor re: Grambling/UM is a good example of how that might be done.

C'mon Casey, You asked for fair answers, I'm asking for similar fair-mindedness from you.

This answers a lot of questions because until recent posts I and probably many more did not know that Montana had this million dollar deficit (you guys have kept that tidbit pretty quiet). The resulting schedules now make sense when taken in context.

I also said that Montana's past accomplishments speaks for itself. But now that you have this reputation as a national bada@@ team, you need find ways to keep it. PSU has had its problems in the past and needs to re-establish its own credibility in the FCS.

On travel, I lived in that part of the country and I know the travel problems and how they differ from the east, but that means that all the schools (not only Montana) west of the Mississippi need to be creative in creating opprtunities to play where the maxumum people can see them.

On the final point I do understand that football isw a business, but even businesses need to understand it is what the customer wants, so there is a need to find a way to provide it.

[Tailbone]

......

On the final point I do understand that football is a business, but even businesses need to understand it is what the customer wants, so there is a need to find a way to provide it.

UM is apparently satisfying its customer base: 18K season tickets sold and a full stadium every weekend (regardless of foe). We as fans say one thing with our tongues (we want better competition!) and something else with our wallets.
UM has identified their customer base and it consists of little more than Griz fans. Right now, we willingly pay for what we are getting.

[AZGrizFan]

Yes WCUPA is our Fort Lewis although West Chester was ranked 15th in the nation in D-2 and Fort Lewis is ranked where???????xoopsx xoopsx xoopsx xoopsx xoopsx xoopsx xoopsx

In fact whereas West Chester has a record of success in the D-2 playoffs, one can't find Fort Lewis anywhere. xrolleyesx xrolleyesx xrolleyesx When one compares Fort Lewis as competition one would have to consider Wesley College a D-3 team as a better opponent than the Fort Lewis crew.

We play in the toughest conference in FCS. One creampuff OOC game is OK in that event. We don't have the equivalent of Sacramento State or Weber State in our conference but YOU DO !!!!!!xnodx xnodx xnodx

At any rate we have Navy this year as an OOC, and Maryland and Furman next year. Enjoy Fort Lewis again and get your reserves ready for your conference schedule. I'll be willing to hear how Hauck tells us again how the Big Fluffy Sky is the best conference in the nation. I gotta give the guy points for hutzpah.

When was the last time a team from the Big Fluffy Sky Conference had a playoff win from a team without Montana in their name?????

Is there a class at UD where they teach this *****?

No, really....I mean there are what, 12 freakin' teams in the CAA, and yet it seems like it's only the Delaware fans who keep beatin' this dead horse....Now we're gonna start comparing how our D-2 opponents are ranked? Give me an f-in' break. And if you can throw out "Navy" and "Maryland" (2 BARELY FBS teams), why can't we throw out Iowa and Oregon? THis is the first year in a long time we haven't had one of those types of teams on our schedule.

And now we can't include Montana STATE's playoff victories? This just keeps gettin' better and better....you guys are too funny.

It all comes down to Griz envy. Pure and simple. xwhistlex xwhistlex xwhistlex xwhistlex xwhistlex xwhistlex xwhistlex xwhistlex Every one of you poor saps would trade places with Griz fans in a New York minute, given the opportunity. xnodx xnodx xnodx xnodx xnodx xnodx xnodx xnodx

[patssle]

Every one of you poor saps would trade places with Griz fans in a New York minute, given the opportunity

No way, its way too damn cold in Montana. xlolx xnodx

[AZGrizFan]

No way, its way too damn cold in Montana. xlolx xnodx

I ain't talkin about the weather, junior. xcoolx xcoolx xcoolx xcoolx xcoolx


;) ;)

I'm talkin' about the 14 straight playoff trips, 9 straight conference titles, 5 NC appearances and 2 NC's! xnodx xnodx xnodx xnodx xnodx

[Casey_Orourke]

UM is apparently satisfying its customer base: 18K season tickets sold and a full stadium every weekend (regardless of foe). We as fans say one thing with our tongues (we want better competition!) and something else with our wallets.
UM has identified their customer base and it consists of little more than Griz fans. Right now, we willingly pay for what we are getting.

Point well taken, but Griz football could be so much more. With todays mobile society many schools end up with fans and alumni in all parts of the country which leads less of a regional fan base to a possible national fan base and very possibly big money doners from outside your traditional borders, because everybody likes a winner.

[Tailbone]

........
We play in the toughest conference in FCS. One creampuff OOC game is OK in that event. We don't have the equivalent of Sacramento State or Weber State in our conference but YOU DO !!!!!!xnodx xnodx xnodx

That's your opinion....and it's wrong.

......


When was the last time a team from the Big Fluffy Sky Conference had a playoff win from a team without Montana in their name?????

Nice try.
Montana and Montana State are different schools, and to answer your question....Eastern Washington beat top ranked SIU in 2004. NAU beat top ranked McNeese in 2003. Both on the road.

...but you knew that.

[BlueHen86]

Point well taken, but Griz football could be so much more. With todays mobile society many schools end up with fans and alumni in all parts of the country which leads less of a regional fan base to a possible national fan base and very possibly big money doners from outside your traditional borders, because everybody likes a winner.
There is no reason for Montana to change a thing. Every school would love to schedule all home games if they could, but they can't. Montana is lucky that it can schedule 7 home games.
Montana's formula has worked for years, why change? They have 5 finals appearances, 2 titles and I can't remember the last time they missed the playoffs. Playoff home games (which Montana has a lot of)= more revenue.

What you are asking makes no sense. Montana would lose money because of the travel, and fewer home games. Also, if they lost some of these games you want to see they might not get playoff home games, which would cost them even more money.

I'd love to see Delaware play Montana in a home and home, but it doesn't work financially. Delaware would make more money playing West Chester at home than they would traveling to Montana.

[blukeys]

That's your opinion....and it's wrong.

......



Nice try.
Montana and Montana State are different schools, and to answer your question....Eastern Washington beat top ranked SIU in 2004. NAU beat top ranked McNeese in 2003. Both on the road.

...but you knew that.

SIU 2004 was the most overrated #1 seed of all time. I believed that at the time and was proven correct. I saw them in 2003 and they were fat and slow.

In 2003 NAU got beat by FLA ATL who was beat by Colgate. Colgate was waxed in the finals as you know.

The reality is once you get past Montana and Montana State the Big Fluffy Sky Conference is lame. I saw first hand Portland State in 2000 and they were unbelievably weak.

[DuckDuckGriz]

SIU 2004 was the most overrated #1 seed of all time. I believed that at the time and was proven correct. I saw them in 2003 and they were fat and slow.

In 2003 NAU got beat by FLA ATL who was beat by Colgate. Colgate was waxed in the finals as you know.

The reality is once you get past Montana and Montana State the Big Fluffy Sky Conference is lame. I saw first hand Portland State in 2000 and they were unbelievably weak.

Wow Grade A copout.

You get presented with facts that straight up deflect your argument that no other teams in the BSC win in the playoffs, but now your defense is that one of those teams was "fat and slow." Nevermind that SIU dominated the Gateway that year. Nevermind that NAU beat #1 McNeese 35-3 in the biggest loss for a #1 seed ever in the playoffs.

Let the backpedaling continue I guess. But try taking off your little Delaware blinders.

[ursus arctos horribilis]

SIU 2004 was the most overrated #1 seed of all time. I believed that at the time and was proven correct. I saw them in 2003 and they were fat and slow.

In 2003 NAU got beat by FLA ATL who was beat by Colgate. Colgate was waxed in the finals as you know.

The reality is once you get past Montana and Montana State the Big Fluffy Sky Conference is lame. I saw first hand Portland State in 2000 and they were unbelievably weak.

Hang on a minute folks as it shouldn't take blukeys long to open his mouth remove one foot and insert the other.

[blukeys]

There is no reason for Montana to change a thing. Every school would love to schedule all home games if they could, but they can't. Montana is lucky that it can schedule 7 home games.
Montana's formula has worked for years, why change? They have 5 finals appearances, 2 titles and I can't remember the last time they missed the playoffs. Playoff home games (which Montana has a lot of)= more revenue.

What you are asking makes no sense. Montana would lose money because of the travel, and fewer home games. Also, if they lost some of these games you want to see they might not get playoff home games, which would cost them even more money.

I'd love to see Delaware play Montana in a home and home, but it doesn't work financially. Delaware would make more money playing West Chester at home than they would traveling to Montana.


No one begrudges Montana making money. The problem is that Montana embarked on a program of bad faith negotiating with FCS teams such as NDSU, SDSU, Cal POLY, etc. etc. etc. They signed contracts for home and home series with these teams. These teams were counting on these games when they created their schedules and then the Griz yanked their games when they found they could make more $$$$$$$$$ on home games with other opponents. This totally screwed the other schools as they now had to scramble to find new opponents in a shortened scheduling environment.

This type of selfishness is not worthy of a fine University but some on this board will justify it because Montana hired a dumbass for AD some 6 years ago. Montana's poor hiring decisions should not be paid for by OOC foes who entered into home and home contracts in good faith. xnodx xnodx

The Griz are a great program. But I would not want to see a Delaware - Montana Home and Home arrangement without the first game in Newark. Montana's track record speaks for itself. They will enter into contracts with the first home game in Montana. They will then shop the return date with OOC teams and do the Math. They will then buy out the OOC opponent on short notice so that that team has to scramble to fill out the schedule.

If Montana had said from the beginning that the contract was a one game only event as Delaware said to Lehigh in 2005 , then no one would have a right to complain. Lehigh negotiated a guarantee based on a no return date at Lehigh. They got their money based on that agreement. I'm sure Lehigh would have asked for less $$$$$$ for a home and home, as Did the schools Montana screwed. Lehigh would have then made more on a return engagement by the Hens subsequently. But Delaware said it was a one game only arrangement unlike the sneaky Griz who led a bunch of other schools on.

I hope when the Griz pay of their debts they will get back to dealing honestly with other schools. The schools out west deserve better than what the Griz have dealt out.

[ursus arctos horribilis]

Told ya.

[Casey_Orourke]

There is no reason for Montana to change a thing. Every school would love to schedule all home games if they could, but they can't. Montana is lucky that it can schedule 7 home games.
Montana's formula has worked for years, why change? They have 5 finals appearances, 2 titles and I can't remember the last time they missed the playoffs. Playoff home games (which Montana has a lot of)= more revenue.

What you are asking makes no sense. Montana would lose money because of the travel, and fewer home games. Also, if they lost some of these games you want to see they might not get playoff home games, which would cost them even more money.

I'd love to see Delaware play Montana in a home and home, but it doesn't work financially. Delaware would make more money playing West Chester at home than they would traveling to Montana.

Keep your hopes up, things could radicaly change in a few years where everybody gets what they want

[blukeys]

Hang on a minute folks as it shouldn't take blukeys long to open his mouth remove one foot and insert the other.

I just proved my point. Interesting you have nothing to add. But you have had nothing to add for a long time.

[Ronbo]

When we played NDSU it was a money game for them. One and done. When is everyone going to stop saying we backed out on them? They were DII, we don't do home and home with DII.

[DuckDuckGriz]

I just proved my point. Interesting you have nothing to add. But you have had nothing to add for a long time.

You actually didn't. You attempted 2 points and when one was shot down, you attempted another.

Tell us again about why those BSC playoff wins aren't legit?

xrolleyesx

[blukeys]

When we played NDSU it was a money game for them. One and done. When is everyone going to stop saying we backed out on them? They were DII, we don't do home and home with DII.

Just for clarification, Are you saying the contract was for one game only?
Can you provide a link?
My understanding was that it was a home and home arrangement.

If your version is so then I stand corrected on the NDSU situation as I believed that there was in fact a home and home contract.

Of course this does not negate the other home and home contracts the Griz have avoided to fulfill in order to cover hiring an incompetent AD who spent them into oblivion and have inconvienced other FCS schools in the meantime.

[ursus arctos horribilis]

I just proved my point. Interesting you have nothing to add. But you have had nothing to add for a long time.

Good one. You really got me there.

[ursus arctos horribilis]

Just for clarification, Are you saying the contract was for one game only?
Can you provide a link?
My understanding was that it was a home and home arrangement.

If your version is so then I stand corrected on the NDSU situation as I believed that there was in fact a home and home contract.

Of course this does not negate the other home and home contracts the Griz have avoided to fulfill in order to cover hiring an incompetent AD who spent them into oblivion and have inconvienced other FCS schools in the meantime.

You do stand corrected. It is so nice to see someone like yourself sticking up for the little people. Rage on you valiant, glorious bastard.

[blukeys]

You actually didn't. You attempted 2 points and when one was shot down, you attempted another.

Tell us again about why those BSC playoff wins aren't legit?

xrolleyesx

Sorry DDGriz you quoted a response I made to someone else and I don't understand your response. I don't recall going for 2 points. When I quote someone in a response I try to respond to their post and not someone else because I can get lost. xoopsx xoopsx xoopsx

Would you PM me and spell out to me your requirements. I am drinking some very fine bourbon tonight and don't want to quit. So far this argument has been fun. And Yes I already knew who the BSC playoff winners were in 2003 -2004. Just wanted to keep the discussion going!!!!xsmiley_wix xsmiley_wix xsmiley_wix xsmiley_wix

[BlueHen86]

No one begrudges Montana making money. The problem is that Montana embarked on a program of bad faith negotiating with FCS teams such as NDSU, SDSU, Cal POLY, etc. etc. etc. They signed contracts for home and home series with these teams. These teams were counting on these games when they created their schedules and then the Griz yanked their games when they found they could make more $$$$$$$$$ on home games with other opponents. This totally screwed the other schools as they now had to scramble to find new opponents in a shortened scheduling environment.

This type of selfishness is not worthy of a fine University but some on this board will justify it because Montana hired a dumbass for AD some 6 years ago. Montana's poor hiring decisions should not be paid for by OOC foes who entered into home and home contracts in good faith. xnodx xnodx

The Griz are a great program. But I would not want to see a Delaware - Montana Home and Home arrangement without the first game in Newark. Montana's track record speaks for itself. They will enter into contracts with the first home game in Montana. They will then shop the return date with OOC teams and do the Math. They will then buy out the OOC opponent on short notice so that that team has to scramble to fill out the schedule.

If Montana had said from the beginning that the contract was a one game only event as Delaware said to Lehigh in 2005 , then no one would have a right to complain. Lehigh negotiated a guarantee based on a no return date at Lehigh. They got their money based on that agreement. I'm sure Lehigh would have asked for less $$$$$$ for a home and home, as Did the schools Montana screwed. Lehigh would have then made more on a return engagement by the Hens subsequently. But Delaware said it was a one game only arrangement unlike the sneaky Griz who led a bunch of other schools on.

I hope when the Griz pay of their debts they will get back to dealing honestly with other schools. The schools out west deserve better than what the Griz have dealt out.
I don't know the whole history of Montana scheduling but it seems to me that if there is a buyout clause in the contract then Montana is within it's rights to take advantage of it.

If the other schools don't like it they can: not schedule Montana anymore, they can insist on the first game being at home or they can up the buyout amount.

[blukeys]

You do stand corrected. It is so nice to see someone like yourself sticking up for the little people. Rage on you valiant, glorious bastard.

My parents were married for many years before I was conceived so I am not a bastard by any definition. I do appreciate the other adjectives you have provided. xsmiley_wix xsmiley_wix

Would you please provide a link?

It seems UM walked out on quite a few deals other than NDSU.

As I said earlier, if NDSU was a one and done deal they have no gripe. I thought they had a home and home deal and I stand corrected should that be the case.

In that event my gripe is with those NDSU fans who have b*tched about Montana backing out of contracts.xnodx xnodx

[blukeys]

I don't know the whole history of Montana scheduling but it seems to me that if there is a buyout clause in the contract then Montana is within it's rights to take advantage of it.

If the other schools don't like it they can: not schedule Montana anymore, they can insist on the first game being at home or they can up the buyout amount.

Agreed! and with Montana's History that is what I recommend for the Hens. xthumbsupx

[Peems]

No one begrudges Montana making money. The problem is that Montana embarked on a program of bad faith negotiating with FCS teams such as NDSU, SDSU, Cal POLY, etc. etc. etc. They signed contracts for home and home series with these teams. These teams were counting on these games when they created their schedules and then the Griz yanked their games when they found they could make more $$$$$$$$$ on home games with other opponents. This totally screwed the other schools as they now had to scramble to find new opponents in a shortened scheduling environment.

This type of selfishness is not worthy of a fine University but some on this board will justify it because Montana hired a dumbass for AD some 6 years ago. Montana's poor hiring decisions should not be paid for by OOC foes who entered into home and home contracts in good faith. xnodx xnodx

The Griz are a great program. But I would not want to see a Delaware - Montana Home and Home arrangement without the first game in Newark. Montana's track record speaks for itself. They will enter into contracts with the first home game in Montana. They will then shop the return date with OOC teams and do the Math. They will then buy out the OOC opponent on short notice so that that team has to scramble to fill out the schedule.

If Montana had said from the beginning that the contract was a one game only event as Delaware said to Lehigh in 2005 , then no one would have a right to complain. Lehigh negotiated a guarantee based on a no return date at Lehigh. They got their money based on that agreement. I'm sure Lehigh would have asked for less $$$$$$ for a home and home, as Did the schools Montana screwed. Lehigh would have then made more on a return engagement by the Hens subsequently. But Delaware said it was a one game only arrangement unlike the sneaky Griz who led a bunch of other schools on.

I hope when the Griz pay of their debts they will get back to dealing honestly with other schools. The schools out west deserve better than what the Griz have dealt out.

First off you know nothing of our old AD, so I would not spout off about him. He was a great AD who did great things not only for Montana but for the entire Big Sky. He made some mistakes and paid with his job. But understand he did more good that "evil." Which leads me to my next point, the way you type about the Griz you would think our plan is to destroy all the other institutions within the FCS. The fact is plain and simple: "The Griz never violated any contracts."

Finally, the Griz aren't going to change anything because some fans are pissed they didn't get to see the Griz in their house. Just remember that maybe someday, you too can see the Griz:Dxthumbsupx

[AZGrizFan]

No one begrudges Montana making money. The problem is that Montana embarked on a program of bad faith negotiating with FCS teams such as NDSU, SDSU, Cal POLY, etc. etc. etc. They signed contracts for home and home series with these teams. These teams were counting on these games when they created their schedules and then the Griz yanked their games when they found they could make more $$$$$$$$$ on home games with other opponents. This totally screwed the other schools as they now had to scramble to find new opponents in a shortened scheduling environment.

If Montana had said from the beginning that the contract was a one game only event as Delaware said to Lehigh in 2005 , then no one would have a right to complain. Lehigh negotiated a guarantee based on a no return date at Lehigh. They got their money based on that agreement. I'm sure Lehigh would have asked for less $$$$$$ for a home and home, as Did the schools Montana screwed. Lehigh would have then made more on a return engagement by the Hens subsequently. But Delaware said it was a one game only arrangement unlike the sneaky Griz who led a bunch of other schools on.



(1) Montana did not "embark on a program of bad faith negotiating." You make it sound like they knew when they signed the contracts (years before the deficit was discovered) that they never intended to fulfill the agreements. If you've got proof of that, I'd love to see it. Otherwise, that lame-ass logic and conspiracy theorist crap has got to go.

(2) The contracts were signed by BOTH PARTIES. Why is that so hard for everyone to understand? Why do the AD's of THESE jilted universities get a free pass for signing a bad contract? There isn't a single AD with a brainstem out there that, when faced with the same situation the Montana AD was faced with, wouldn't do the math and come up with the exact same conclusion: As ugly as it was, he was left with no choice but to back out of these deals until the finances were straightened out. This "conspiracy theory" crap is laughable.

(3) And as far as the "money" games and no one having the right to complain....boy, that sure hasn't stopped them, has it? We can't win for losing. First we're a-holes and dickheads for conspiratorially backing out of the back end of home-home deals, and now we're cherry picking weak-ass west coast teams to pad our schedules by buying games with the sorry sacks of *****. Guess that makes Cal-Davis the designated "sorry sack of *****" next year, huh? How's that make you feel, Aggie fans?

(4) And finally, the Griz have not "led a bunch of other schools on". Christ, it sounds like jilted lovers here. The number is TWO. TWO, people. Cal- Poly and SDSU. The logic for the actions has been explained ad-nauseum. You won't find a Griz fan anywhere who likes the situation, and you'll have to look far and wide to find a Griz fan who likes to see the likes of Fort Lewis on our schedule, but it gets damned old constantly listening to the exaggerations spouted on this board about the University of Montana Devils and how they've *****ed over half the FCS.


I shall now step down from my soap box. You all may continue your ridiculous argument.

xpeacex

[AZGrizFan]

I don't know the whole history of Montana scheduling but it seems to me that if there is a buyout clause in the contract then Montana is within it's rights to take advantage of it.

If the other schools don't like it they can: not schedule Montana anymore, they can insist on the first game being at home or they can up the buyout amount.


You've got to stop talkin' sense here, Hen fan, or you'll kill this damned thread quicker than a bullet through the head.

You seem to be applying common sense to this argument....you SURE you're a Hen fan? xeyebrowx xeyebrowx xeyebrowx xconfusedx ;)

[blukeys]

First off you know nothing of our old AD, so I would not spout off about him. He was a great AD who did great things not only for Montana but for the entire Big Sky. He made some mistakes and paid with his job. But understand he did more good that "evil." Which leads me to my next point, the way you type about the Griz you would think our plan is to destroy all the other institutions within the FCS. The fact is plain and simple: "The Griz never violated any contracts."

Finally, the Griz aren't going to change anything because some fans are pissed they didn't get to see the Griz in their house. Just remember that maybe someday, you too can see the Griz:Dxthumbsupx

Sorry but it is the Griz faithful who are dumping on your prior AD and not me. Every decision that UM makes that screws other schools is justified under the banner of "Well we have to make money because our prior AD spent too much money traveling to Maine!!!xrolleyesx xrolleyesx xrolleyesx "

You are quite correct. I have no first hand knowledge of the UM finances. I only have the facts as presented to me by the Griz Nation and they have universally dumped on the prior AD. If you have facts to the contrary then you need to post them here as the Griz Faithful blame all financial shortfalls on your prior AD.

I find it amazing that you blame me for the negative views of your prior AD. The Griz nation has been airing this particular bit of dirty laundry for years.

If you want folks to not criticize your prior AD then shut up the Griz posters on this and other boards because they are the ones giving the rest of us the ammunition to load our guns. xnodx

[grizbeer]

Just for clarification, Are you saying the contract was for one game only?
Can you provide a link?
My understanding was that it was a home and home arrangement.

If your version is so then I stand corrected on the NDSU situation as I believed that there was in fact a home and home contract.

Of course this does not negate the other home and home contracts the Griz have avoided to fulfill in order to cover hiring an incompetent AD who spent them into oblivion and have inconvienced other FCS schools in the meantime.


I understand why you believe UM backed out of a game with NDSU, since NDSU fans have been calling for a return trip by the Griz, but it was never part of the agreement - personally i would like to see it as well, but it was never a home and home:



Taylor said he's trying in line up games for next season. Taylor said he's talked to UC Davis, which NDSU will play next week, Georgia Southern, Montana State and Saint Mary's, as well as a few Division II schools. Montana and North Dakota State will not play next season, although Taylor said he's hopeful the two teams will play again, possibly in the 19,000-seat Fargodome in Fargo, N.D.

http://www.missoulian.com/articles/2003/09/05/sports/sports02.txt

i guess you owe me a shot of that fine bourbon you are drinking xprost2x

[ursus arctos horribilis]

My parents were married for many years before I was conceived so I am not a bastard by any definition. I do appreciate the other adjectives you have provided. xsmiley_wix xsmiley_wix

Would you please provide a link?

It seems UM walked out on quite a few deals other than NDSU.

As I said earlier, if NDSU was a one and done deal they have no gripe. I thought they had a home and home deal and I stand corrected should that be the case.

In that event my gripe is with those NDSU fans who have b*tched about Montana backing out of contracts.xnodx xnodx

Well then I need you to post a link showing that your mom and dad were married for several years before you were born.

But seriously as was posted earlier NDSU was a D2. We never had a H&H with them and those that thought that are simply incorrect. we bought out of SDSU and Cal Poly in the deficit years. Would Delaware schedule a H&H with any D2's they schedule? If this is how things are done then I think we got screwed by K State, Fresno State, Oregon, Oregon State, & Iowa if that's the line of logic we're dealing with.

[Tailbone]

SIU 2004 was the most overrated #1 seed of all time. I believed that at the time and was proven correct. I saw them in 2003 and they were fat and slow.

In 2003 NAU got beat by FLA ATL who was beat by Colgate. Colgate was waxed in the finals as you know.

The reality is once you get past Montana and Montana State the Big Fluffy Sky Conference is lame. I saw first hand Portland State in 2000 and they were unbelievably weak.

C'mon Blukeys, set aside your (demonstrated) bias and look at a few facts about playoff competition.

70-80 % home teams win - doesn't matter how good you are, or where you are from.
In addition to the games already mentioned, ask UNI about the quality of the EWU team they beat 38-41 in the dome a few years back.
Last year the "Big Fluffy Sky" runner up beat the SoCon runner-up.
The point is "any given saturday" can yield any result. Many factors conspire to result in one team's win over another, and it's not always the best team that wins.

You can suggest that the BSC is "lame" but the evidence (when viewed objectively) suggests otherwise.
You arrogantly dis the BSC, but you really have no idea as to the quality of play in the BSC and refuse to give credit where due. You arrogantly dis the Gateway by stating that their 2004 champion was "fat and slow". I suppose you have a reason for stating that the CAA is best despite the fact that the last 2 NC winners have come from the SoCon. what's wrong with the Great West?

The fact that the A-10 is the largest conference, and likely to produce more playoff participants (and home games) as a consequence might give the APPEARANCE that the A-10 is a superior conference.......but only if you are unwilling to look beyond your prejudice to look at other possibilities.

As for PSU - The 2000 team may have been weak but the 2006 team would have beaten half the playoff participants.

[Tailbone]

Sorry but it is the Griz faithful who are dumping on your prior AD and not me. Every decision that UM makes that screws other schools is justified under the banner of "Well we have to make money because our prior AD spent too much money traveling to Maine!!!xrolleyesx xrolleyesx xrolleyesx "

Whether or not anybody got "screwed" is between the ADs of the respective schools. It's certainly not for YOU to decide.


You are quite correct. I have no first hand knowledge of the UM finances. I only have the facts as presented to me by the Griz Nation and they have universally dumped on the prior AD.......

No, you are correct in admitting to no "first hand knowledge" of UM finances. Perhaps you should avoid speculation as it only makes you look foolish. The "facts" presented to you by Griz fans are in no way complete, and are based as much on opinion as anything else. Without knowledge of back office machinations your OPINION is without merit.


I find it amazing that you blame me for the negative views of your prior AD. The Griz nation has been airing this particular bit of dirty laundry for years.

You are responsible for your own views, particularly if based on nothing more than hearsay. I find it amazing that you feel we should blame someone else for YOUR opinion.


If you want folks to not criticize your prior AD then shut up the Griz posters on this and other boards because they are the ones giving the rest of us the ammunition to load our guns. xnodx

Sorry, we as Griz fans have the right to praise or criticize our AD as we see fit. If you wish to weigh in with your opinion, you might at least obligate yourself to understanding the issues and facts rather than superficially forming an opinion based on hearsay and a predisposed bias against the U of M.

Incidentally, While Montana did unilaterally (though within the terms of the contract) buy out SDSU, there is some debate about whether the Cal Poly buy out was similarly executed. I recall that at the time of the buy out, Cal Poly may have had scheduling conflicts as a result of the formation of the new GWFC and pre-existing agreements. Conflicts that were resolved by the buy out. It was also rumored that the buy out was mutually agreed upon (despite Ellerson's posturing).


From an AGS article regarding the formation of the GWFC in 2004.


Scheduling is a concern with the 2004 season as some schools have more than the desired home or away games. The desired schedule, since seven schools are in the conference, is to have three home and three away games. Some schools this season will have four home games and two road games and visa versa.

The 2005 schedule will be just the reverse, according to UC Davis' Warzecka. By the 2006 season a balanced schedule could be attained and is currently being worked on by the conference. Most likely, the schedule would be set up to set aside the last seven weeks of the season as the conference schedule according to Warzecka and one open date within that seven week period would be given to each school. This will leave the first four weeks open for non-conference schools and would also leave one open date during the conference schedule to be used as either a non-conference game or just as an open date.

[DavisAggie]

Just watch your sentence structure, bub, if you're gonna venture out of the kiddie pool. xnodx xnodx xnodx

Sentence structure, bub, and kiddle pool. xthumbsupx

[FargoBison]

My parents were married for many years before I was conceived so I am not a bastard by any definition. I do appreciate the other adjectives you have provided. xsmiley_wix xsmiley_wix

Would you please provide a link?

It seems UM walked out on quite a few deals other than NDSU.

As I said earlier, if NDSU was a one and done deal they have no gripe. I thought they had a home and home deal and I stand corrected should that be the case.

In that event my gripe is with those NDSU fans who have b*tched about Montana backing out of contracts.xnodx xnodx

Actually it was Montana State who backed out on us but with that said Cal Poly and SDSU are both in our conference and we don't like seeing those two fine schools being treated like Montana treated them. SDSU gave them two f'n games, they had their deficit paid and still couldn't afford to make the return trip this year. That kind of scheduling just rubs me the wrong way, if you don't want to travel pay teams to play at your stadium at full price and don't jerk them around with the carrot of getting a return trip.

[AZGrizFan]

Actually it was Montana State who backed out on us but with that said Cal Poly and SDSU are both in our conference and we don't like seeing those two fine schools being treated like Montana treated them. SDSU gave them two f'n games, they had their deficit paid and still couldn't afford to make the return trip this year. That kind of scheduling just rubs me the wrong way, if you don't want to travel pay teams to play at your stadium at full price and don't jerk them around with the carrot of getting a return trip.-

xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xrolleyesx xrolleyesx

14 pages into it? You're a little late to this party, aintcha? xcoffeex xcoffeex xcoffeex xcoffeex

[ursus arctos horribilis]

Actually it was Montana State who backed out on us but with that said Cal Poly and SDSU are both in our conference and we don't like seeing those two fine schools being treated like Montana treated them. SDSU gave them two f'n games, they had their deficit paid and still couldn't afford to make the return trip this year. That kind of scheduling just rubs me the wrong way, if you don't want to travel pay teams to play at your stadium at full price and don't jerk them around with the carrot of getting a return trip.

I believe the deficit was paid off in June of this year. Kinda late to be rearranging the schedule for both schools don't you think?

[FargoBison]

I believe the deficit was paid off in June of this year. Kinda late to be rearranging the schedule for both schools don't you think?

Pretty sure I heard about the deficit being pretty much repaid on egriz well before June. I could look it up if you want but I'd guess it was before either school had their schedules set.

[AZGrizFan]

Pretty sure I heard about the deficit being pretty much repaid on egriz well before June. I could look it up if you want but I'd guess it was before either school had their schedules set.

well, we couldn't back out of the Fort Lewis game, because you know, one is a dot, two is a line, three is a trend. xeyebrowx xeyebrowx xeyebrowx We're all about honoring our commitments. xthumbsupx

[FargoBison]

-

xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xrolleyesx xrolleyesx

14 pages into it? You're a little late to this party, aintcha? xcoffeex xcoffeex xcoffeex xcoffeex

Just filling Bluekeys in on some stuff that he was positng about a whole page ago. Bison fans know the Griz never owed us a game, We have no gripe there.

[ursus arctos horribilis]

Pretty sure I heard about the deficit being pretty much repaid on egriz well before June. I could look it up if you want but I'd guess it was before either school had their schedules set.

I'm not positive but it is what I read and I can't remember where but if you have a different date and can prove me wrong I'd be glad to take a look.

[AZGrizFan]

Pretty sure I heard about the deficit being pretty much repaid on egriz well before June. I could look it up if you want but I'd guess it was before either school had their schedules set.


I'm not positive but it is what I read and I can't remember where but if you have a different date and can prove me wrong I'd be glad to take a look.

Yeah, well, whatever you do FargoBison, do NOT piss ursus off!!! If you need further info, go to the "Worst Physical Pain" thread and read his post there.... xeekx xeekx xeekx xeekx

Ursus has "issues". As in, anger management.

[FargoBison]

I'm not positive but it is what I read and I can't remember where but if you have a different date and can prove me wrong I'd be glad to take a look.

http://www.egriz.com/GrizBoard/topic22969.php

[ursus arctos horribilis]

http://www.egriz.com/GrizBoard/topic22969.php

Thanks for the link. I was off by a couple of months but do you think that was enough time to reset the table in march of this year?

[FargoBison]

Thanks for the link. I was off by a couple of months but do you think that was enough time to reset the table in march of this year?

I don't know, its hard to say. SDSU had their schedule finalized in January but since Montana bought them out in October there was no point in them waiting around til March.

[mlbowl]

Since you added the, "seriously, are you", question, you need to understand that your college is a Tier 3 University, so, maybe you should be asking yourself, "am I f’n retarded".




Okay, I asked myself. I'm fine.;)