AGS Poll Results - Week 7 - 2021

[AGSPoll]

10/18/2021



Rank
Team:
Total Points
First Place Votes


1
Sam Houston Bearkats
1326
40


2
North Dakota State Bison
1271
4


3
Eastern Washington Eagles
1270
10


4
Southern Illinois Salukis
1191



5
South Dakota State Jackrabbits
1126



6
Villanova Wildcats
1052



7
Montana State Bobcats
1019



8
James Madison Dukes
994



9
Southeastern Louisiana Lions
913



10
South Dakota Coyotes
775



11
UC Davis Aggies
769



12
Montana Grizzlies
675



13
Incarnate Word Cardinals
660



14
Missouri State Bears
590



15
East Tennessee State Buccaneers
569



16
Tennessee-Martin Skyhawks
489



17
Kennesaw State Owls
471



18
Princeton Tigers
329



19
Virginia Military Institute Keydets
310



20
Rhode Island Rams
308



21
Northern Iowa Panthers
258



22
Sac State Hornets
229



23
Harvard Crimson
220



24
Dartmouth Big Green
214



25
Duquesne Dukes
90
















ORV:




26
Jackson State Tigers
83



27
Eastern Kentucky Colonels
78



28
Weber State Wildcats
57



29
Chattanooga Mocs
51



30
North Dakota Fighting Hawks
37



31
Delaware Fightin' Blue Hens
31



32
Mercer Bears
20



33T
Northern Arizona Lumberjacks
18



33T
Monmouth Hawks
18



35
Furman Paladins
15



36
William & Mary Tribe
6



37
Central Arkansas Bears
5


































Most Significant Win:
Sac State Hornets






Most Significant Loss:
Montana Grizzlies

[Daytripper]

1: Sam Houston Bearkats
2: Eastern Washington Eagles
3: Southern Illinois Salukis
4: North Dakota State Bison
5: South Dakota State Jackrabbits
6: James Madison Dukes
7: Villanova Wildcats
8: Southeastern Louisiana Lions
9: UC Davis Aggies
10: Montana State Bobcats
11: South Dakota Coyotes
12: Missouri State Bears
13: Incarnate Word Cardinals
14: Montana Grizzlies
15: Rhode Island Rams
16: East Tennessee State Buccaneers
17: Dartmouth Big Green
18: Princeton Tigers
19: Tennessee-Martin Skyhawks
20: Kennesaw State Owls
21: Northern Iowa Panthers
22: Virginia Military Institute Keydets
23: Chattanooga Mocs
24: Sac State Hornets
25: Harvard Crimson

[Professor Chaos]

Article for this week: http://thefcswedge.com/ags-poll/ags-poll-week-7-top-25-results-3/

Some big streaks were ended this week. Weber St snapped a 62 poll streak in the top 25 (began Week 12 of 2016), UND snapped a 23 poll streak (began Week 8 of 2019), and Delaware snapped a 15 poll streak (began Week 4 this past spring). Duquesne made only their 2nd appearance ever in the top 25 (the first was the Final poll in 2018).

[Schism55]

Looks darn good to my eyes, well done fellas xthumbsupx

[GoBlueHens83]

Who is still voting for Delaware at this point, and why?

[Professor Chaos]

This is what I had:

1: Sam Houston Bearkats
2: Eastern Washington Eagles
3: North Dakota State Bison
4: Southern Illinois Salukis
5: South Dakota State Jackrabbits
6: Villanova Wildcats
7: James Madison Dukes
8: Montana State Bobcats
9: Southeastern Louisiana Lions
10: South Dakota Coyotes
11: Montana Grizzlies
12: UC Davis Aggies
13: Incarnate Word Cardinals
14: Missouri State Bears
15: Kennesaw State Owls
16: Tennessee-Martin Skyhawks
17: East Tennessee State Buccaneers
18: Northern Iowa Panthers
19: Sac State Hornets
20: Harvard Crimson
21: Virginia Military Institute Keydets
22: Duquesne Dukes
23: Princeton Tigers
24: Rhode Island Rams
25: Jackson State Tigers

[POD Knows]

1: Eastern Washington Eagles
2: Sam Houston Bearkats
3: Southern Illinois Salukis
4: South Dakota State Jackrabbits
5: North Dakota State Bison
6: Montana State Bobcats
7: Villanova Wildcats
8: James Madison Dukes
9: Southeastern Louisiana Lions
10: South Dakota Coyotes
11: Kennesaw State Owls
12: UC Davis Aggies
13: Princeton Tigers
14: Tennessee-Martin Skyhawks
15: Sac State Hornets
16: Montana Grizzlies
17: Missouri State Bears
18: East Tennessee State Buccaneers
19: Incarnate Word Cardinals
20: Virginia Military Institute Keydets
21: Jackson State Tigers
22: Duquesne Dukes
23: Harvard Crimson
24: Dartmouth Big Green
25: Eastern Kentucky Colonels

POD Knows

The Most Significant Win: Sac State Hornets
The Most Significant Loss: East Tennessee State Buccaneers
Which Conference Does Your Team Play in?: Missouri Valley Football Conference

[Professor Chaos]

The Princeton/Harvard game this Saturday should be telling. I've been higher on Harvard than on Princeton all season so far and looks like I'm in the minority there. Their best win (Holy Cross) is more impressive than Princeton's is (Monmouth) and Harvard handled their one common opponent to this point (Brown) more easily than Princeton did.

[MSUBobcat]

Article for this week: http://thefcswedge.com/ags-poll/ags-poll-week-7-top-25-results-3/

Some big streaks were ended this week. Weber St snapped a 62 poll streak in the top 25 (began Week 12 of 2016), UND snapped a 23 poll streak (began Week 8 of 2019), and Delaware snapped a 15 poll streak (began Week 4 this past spring). Duquesne made only their 2nd appearance ever in the top 25 (the first was the Final poll in 2018).

As the resident archivist for the Poll, do you know if this is UIW's highest ever ranking? I don't recall them ever cracking the top 15, but... that doesn't necessarily mean anything.

[Professor Chaos]

As the resident archivist for the Poll, do you know if this is UIW's highest ever ranking? I don't recall them ever cracking the top 15, but... that doesn't necessarily mean anything.
They did get up to #12 this past spring (Week 6). That is the only other poll until this week that they've cracked the top 15 in.

[MSUBobcat]

They did get up to #12 this past spring (Week 6). That is the only other poll until this week that they've cracked the top 15 in.

xthumbsupx Very cool. Congrats to the Cardinals!

[Go Green]

The Princeton/Harvard game this Saturday should be telling. I've been higher on Harvard than on Princeton all season so far and looks like I'm in the minority there. Their best win (Holy Cross) is more impressive than Princeton's is (Monmouth) and Harvard handled their one common opponent to this point (Brown) more easily than Princeton did.

Hopefully you'll be impressed with Dartmouth soon. :)

[dbackjon]

There is no logical reason voting Montana so high. The team is a mess, and a shell of the team that beat Washington.


Sac State is WAY too low - voters still stick with the refusal to do big movements as warranted especially early in the season and cling to pre-season biases.

[MR. CHICKEN]

I thought they may make the top 25 also, but they do have shame in their loss 1st loss, which was to Austin Peay, not App St. APSU is.... not good. Their only other win was over Morehead State


.....YEAH....MIS-READ SKED......CAUGHT MAH MISTAKE BUT....YOU ANSWERED JES' B/4 MAH POST DELETE.................AUSTIN PEAY...WAS #23 IN PRESEASON POLL........AWK!

[Professor Chaos]

There is no logical reason voting Montana so high. The team is a mess, and a shell of the team that beat Washington.


Sac State is WAY too low - voters still stick with the refusal to do big movements as warranted especially early in the season and cling to pre-season biases.
I feel like these are contradictory criticisms. If Montana isn't that good why should we be so impressed with Sac St? Other than their Montana win Sac St has done nothing to warrant consideration in the top 25 so far this fall.

[MSUBobcat]

There is no logical reason voting Montana so high. The team is a mess, and a shell of the team that beat Washington.


Sac State is WAY too low - voters still stick with the refusal to do big movements as warranted especially early in the season and cling to pre-season biases.

Perhaps, but the Hornets got beat at home to the now #21 UNI also. They have wins over winless, transitional Dixie St., 1 win ISU-o (shocked Davis), 1 win SUU (over transitioning Tarleton) and the team you call "a mess" in UM.

[MSUBobcat]

.....YEAH....MIS-READ SKED.......AUSTIN PEAY...WAS #23 IN PRESEASON POLL........AWK!

No worries. You deleted it before I even posted, so deleted my response also. xthumbsupx


I feel like these are contradictory criticisms. If Montana isn't that good why should we be so impressed with Sac St? Other than their Montana win Sac St has done nothing to warrant consideration in the top 25 so far this fall.

Beat me to it, Professor.

[dbackjon]

I feel like these are contradictory criticisms. If Montana isn't that good why should we be so impressed with Sac St? Other than their Montana win Sac St has done nothing to warrant consideration in the top 25 so far this fall.

Somewhat. More pointing out that the large gap between Montana and Sac State doesn't make sense based on recent outcomes.

I can live with Sac State being 18-22 range. But Montana should be down there as well.

[dbackjon]

I feel like these are contradictory criticisms. If Montana isn't that good why should we be so impressed with Sac St? Other than their Montana win Sac St has done nothing to warrant consideration in the top 25 so far this fall.


Of course the poll voters are treating it as a good win, but rating Sac State low - so that is contradictory as well. :)

[MSUBobcat]

Of course the poll voters are treating it as a good win, but rating Sac State low - so that is contradictory as well. :)

Not really. They went from not even ORV (top 40) to #22, a jump of AT LEAST 19 spots. From winning ONE GAME. Over a team you called a mess.

Edit: I DO agree that with the way they are playing lately, the Griz should be around that 18-22 range also.

[atthewbon]

Here is mine: Overall I feel pretty good about the top 8 but after that it got really difficult. Looking back I think I should have dropped Montana more. I was also low on UIW compared to many voters (IDK how good they are).

1: Sam Houston Bearkats
2: North Dakota State Bison
3: Eastern Washington Eagles
4: Southern Illinois Salukis
5: South Dakota State Jackrabbits
6: Villanova Wildcats
7: Montana State Bobcats
8: James Madison Dukes
9: Southeastern Louisiana Lions
10: South Dakota Coyotes
11: Montana Grizzlies
12: Kennesaw State Owls
13: Missouri State Bears
14: Tennessee-Martin Skyhawks
15: UC Davis Aggies
16: Rhode Island Rams
17: East Tennessee State Buccaneers
18: Northern Iowa Panthers
19: Incarnate Word Cardinals
20: Sac State Hornets
21: Virginia Military Institute Keydets
22: Harvard Crimson
23: Jackson State Tigers
24: Duquesne Dukes
25: Dartmouth Big Green

[Professor Chaos]

Of course the poll voters are treating it as a good win, but rating Sac State low - so that is contradictory as well. :)
You could say the same about UNI only being one spot above Sac St despite beating them easily on the road earlier this fall. I try to avoid recency bias in my poll ballot so UNI's win at Sac St was significant as well. It was probably the path of least resistance for me, given UNI's recent losses and Montana's strong performance thus far this fall, to treat the Sac St win over Montana as flukish and using that to justify ranking Montana above UNI and UNI above Sac St but that's what I went with.

IMO the further into the season we get the less weight should be put on head-to-head matchups since we've get more and more data outside of head-to-head to consider.

[uofmman1122]

Not really. They went from not even ORV (top 40) to #22, a jump of AT LEAST 19 spots. From winning ONE GAME. Over a team you called a mess.

Edit: I DO agree that with the way they are playing lately, the Griz should be around that 18-22 range also.Still too high, IMO.

I don't think people that didn't watch the game realize how bad our depleted offense is right now.

We would struggle to beat most teams in the top 25 at home.

It will be a chore to beat Idaho this weekend.

[uofmman1122]

Stealing a post from eGriz just to really hammer this home, but this is just pathetic and illustrates just how inept the Montana offense has been all year (and it's gotten significantly worse since Humphrey was injured)
Montana is +4 in turnover margin. Here's what they've done with those 15 turnovers, working backwards from the Sac State game...

Fumble - Interception 1-0
Fumble - Punt 3-9
Interception - Punt 3-8
Fumble - Fumble 5-13
Interception - Punt 3-4
Interception - Missed FG 3-4
Interception - End of Half 1- -2
Interception - Punt 5-51
Interception - Returned for TD
Fumble - TD 4-6
Interception - Interception 4-17
Fumble - Interception 3-1
Interception - End of Game 1- -1
Interception - TD 10-69
Interception - Punt 3- -4


So, outside of Belknap's INT returned for a TD, we have had exactly ONE sustained drive that resulted in points, and that was in the first game against UW. 15 turnovers, only 21 total points (and 6 of those were scored by the D). Two INT's were at the end of the half (or game, in UW's case). Seven 3-outs (or worse). Only once did the offense move the ball further than 17 yards.


That doesn't sound like Griz football.

[MSUWineGuy]

Missouri State beat South Dakota. ;-)

Damnit that Youngstown State nightmare.

[MTfan4life]

You could say the same about UNI only being one spot above Sac St despite beating them easily on the road earlier this fall. I try to avoid recency bias in my poll ballot so UNI's win at Sac St was significant as well. It was probably the path of least resistance for me, given UNI's recent losses and Montana's strong performance thus far this fall, to treat the Sac St win over Montana as flukish and using that to justify ranking Montana above UNI and UNI above Sac St but that's what I went with.

IMO the further into the season we get the less weight should be put on head-to-head matchups since we've get more and more data outside of head-to-head to consider.

I'd say Sac State's multi score loss to UNI was the flukish result. The Hornets outgained uni by 100 yards, but they had 6 turnovers, including 4 in the second half.

[MSUDuo]

I guess USD is getting the benefit of the better loss? *shrugs*

We will have our chances

[dbackjon]

You could say the same about UNI only being one spot above Sac St despite beating them easily on the road earlier this fall. I try to avoid recency bias in my poll ballot so UNI's win at Sac St was significant as well. It was probably the path of least resistance for me, given UNI's recent losses and Montana's strong performance thus far this fall, to treat the Sac St win over Montana as flukish and using that to justify ranking Montana above UNI and UNI above Sac St but that's what I went with.

IMO the further into the season we get the less weight should be put on head-to-head matchups since we've get more and more data outside of head-to-head to consider.

Montana had one strong game, the first.

Since then:
Beat a one-win Western Illinois
Beat a one-win Cal Poly
Lost to EWU
Beat a zero-win FCS transitional Dixie State
Lost to Sac State

[ursus arctos horribilis]

Stealing a post from eGriz just to really hammer this home, but this is just pathetic and illustrates just how inept the Montana offense has been all year (and it's gotten significantly worse since Humphrey was injured)

xlolx that is another point I made in the poll forum. I said unless the D actually does the scoring, or the ST does it, it is not gonna happen because we can't/don't do jack **** with the gifts from either of the other two facets of the team.

[MSUBobcat]

Still too high, IMO.

I don't think people that didn't watch the game realize how bad our depleted offense is right now.

We would struggle to beat most teams in the top 25 at home.

It will be a chore to beat Idaho this weekend.

FINE! The Griz are terrible and shouldn't be ranked! You don't have to twist my arm too hard to say THAT! xlolx

Should mean a 5th straight Brawl for the Good Guys then. Only 11 more to go...........xdrunkyx

[Professor Chaos]

I'd say Sac State's multi score loss to UNI was the flukish result. The Hornets outgained uni by 100 yards, but they had 6 turnovers, including 4 in the second half.
Possibly. Sac St pumped out a lot of garbage time yards in that one after UNI had already gone up 34-9 but you have a point on the turnovers. I'm just not buying Sac St as a bona fide playoff caliber team yet. Montana, despite all their recent issues, still has the best win in the subdivision and a very tight loss to a top 3 team on the road that shows their quality IMO. I'm giving them the benefit of the doubt for now but if they struggle with Idaho this weekend, as it appears most Griz fans expect them to, that will most likely run out.

[crusader11]

The Princeton/Harvard game this Saturday should be telling. I've been higher on Harvard than on Princeton all season so far and looks like I'm in the minority there. Their best win (Holy Cross) is more impressive than Princeton's is (Monmouth) and Harvard handled their one common opponent to this point (Brown) more easily than Princeton did.

Agree with you. Harvard is just rock solid across the board. Big offensive line that wears you down, stout defense, solid run game (as they always seem to have), a QB who uses the play-action really well and is mobile -- this is Murphy's best team since 2015.

[Preferred Walk-On]

Hello Preferred Walk-On,

We have received your AGS Top 25 vote on 10/16/2021 23:06:44

Your vote is listed below.

1: Sam Houston Bearkats
2: North Dakota State Bison
3: Eastern Washington Eagles
4: Southern Illinois Salukis
5: South Dakota State Jackrabbits
6: Montana State Bobcats
7: Southeastern Louisiana Lions
8: Villanova Wildcats
9: James Madison Dukes
10: South Dakota Coyotes
11: Montana Grizzlies
12: Kennesaw State Owls
13: Missouri State Bears
14: Virginia Military Institute Keydets
15: East Tennessee State Buccaneers
16: Incarnate Word Cardinals
17: Tennessee-Martin Skyhawks
18: UC Davis Aggies
19: Sac State Hornets
20: Chattanooga Mocs
21: Princeton Tigers
22: Harvard Crimson
23: Dartmouth Big Green
24: Duquesne Dukes
25: North Dakota Fighting Hawks

Preferred Walk-On

The Most Significant Win: Virginia Military Institute Keydets
The Most Significant Loss: Rhode Island Rams
Which Conference Does Your Team Play in?: Missouri Valley Football Conference

[JSUSoutherner]

Jax State not even receiving votes.

As it should be.




This must be how Thanos felt after he won.

[smilo]

My ranking process is a bit less intensive and exhaustive than it was a few years back, so have at it. To address some concerns others have pointed out, I strongly agree Sac State feels too low (maybe I overreacted and Montana has gotten that bad?) and that Harvard should definitely be ahead of Princeton going into this weekend.

Weber and UND are competitive in tough games! Keeping them in. Better than the dregs of the CAA and SoCon and OVC struggling against mediocre teams.

1: Sam Houston Bearkats
2: South Dakota State Jackrabbits
3: Southern Illinois Salukis
4: Eastern Washington Eagles
5: North Dakota State Bison
6: Villanova Wildcats
7: James Madison Dukes
8: Southeastern Louisiana Lions
9: Montana State Bobcats
10: Missouri State Bears
11: South Dakota Coyotes
12: Northern Iowa Panthers
13: Sac State Hornets
14: Montana Grizzlies
15: UC Davis Aggies
16: Harvard Crimson
17: East Tennessee State Buccaneers
18: Incarnate Word Cardinals
19: North Dakota Fighting Hawks
20: Princeton Tigers
21: Weber State Wildcats
22: Dartmouth Big Green
23: Virginia Military Institute Keydets
24: Rhode Island Rams
25: Tennessee-Martin Skyhawks

I really like Chattanooga going forward but couldn't rationalize putting them in just yet.

[McCowboys]

Your vote is listed below.


1: Sam Houston Bearkats
2: Eastern Washington Eagles
3: North Dakota State Bison
4: Southern Illinois Salukis
5: South Dakota State Jackrabbits
6: Villanova Wildcats
7: Montana State Bobcats
8: James Madison Dukes
9: Southeastern Louisiana Lions
10: UC Davis Aggies
11: South Dakota Coyotes
12: Montana Grizzlies
13: Incarnate Word Cardinals
14: Missouri State Bears
15: Tennessee-Martin Skyhawks
16: East Tennessee State Buccaneers
17: Kennesaw State Owls
18: Rhode Island Rams
19: Princeton Tigers
20: Harvard Crimson
21: Virginia Military Institute Keydets
22: Dartmouth Big Green
23: Jackson State Tigers
24: Northern Iowa Panthers
25: Sac State Hornets

McCowboys

The Most Significant Win: Sac State Hornets
The Most Significant Loss: Weber State Wildcats
Which Conference Does Your Team Play in?: Southland Conference

I knew that E. Kentucky had beaten UCA on the Stripes, but I didn't see the replay until after I had voted. That second half by E. KY was unbelievable.

[ursus arctos horribilis]

FINE! The Griz are terrible and shouldn't be ranked! You don't have to twist my arm too hard to say THAT! xlolx

Should mean a 5th straight Brawl for the Good Guys then. Only 11 more to go...........xdrunkyx

You're trying to match our 2nd longest win streak I guess. You'll be 1/2 way to our 3rd longest though.:D

[POD Knows]

Your vote is listed below.


1: Sam Houston Bearkats
2: Eastern Washington Eagles
3: North Dakota State Bison
4: Southern Illinois Salukis
5: South Dakota State Jackrabbits
6: Villanova Wildcats
7: Montana State Bobcats
8: James Madison Dukes
9: Southeastern Louisiana Lions
10: UC Davis Aggies
11: South Dakota Coyotes
12: Montana Grizzlies
13: Incarnate Word Cardinals
14: Missouri State Bears
15: Tennessee-Martin Skyhawks
16: East Tennessee State Buccaneers
17: Kennesaw State Owls
18: Rhode Island Rams
19: Princeton Tigers
20: Harvard Crimson
21: Virginia Military Institute Keydets
22: Dartmouth Big Green
23: Jackson State Tigers
24: Northern Iowa Panthers
25: Sac State Hornets

McCowboys

The Most Significant Win: Sac State Hornets
The Most Significant Loss: Weber State Wildcats
Which Conference Does Your Team Play in?: Southland Conference

I knew that E. Kentucky had beaten UCA on the Stripes, but I didn't see the replay until after I had voted. That second half by E. KY was unbelievable.
I have EKU in my poll. Their resume is as good as anyone else in at 15-25 tier.

[Go Lehigh TU Owl]

1: Sam Houston Bearkats
2: North Dakota State Bison
3: Eastern Washington Eagles
4: Villanova Wildcats
5: Southern Illinois Salukis
6: James Madison Dukes
7: South Dakota State Jackrabbits
8: Montana State Bobcats
9: South Dakota Coyotes
10: Southeastern Louisiana Lions
11: Incarnate Word Cardinals
12: Montana Grizzlies
13: Dartmouth Big Green
14: East Tennessee State Buccaneers
15: UC Davis Aggies
16: Princeton Tigers
17: Tennessee-Martin Skyhawks
18: Kennesaw State Owls
19: Harvard Crimson
20: Missouri State Bears
21: Rhode Island Rams
22: Virginia Military Institute Keydets
23: Jackson State Tigers
24: Northern Iowa Panthers
25: Sac State Hornets

The Most Significant Win: Dartmouth Big Green
The Most Significant Loss: North Dakota Fighting Hawks
Which Conference Does Your Team Play in?: Patriot League

[MSUBobcat]

You're trying to match our 2nd longest win streak I guess. You'll be 1/2 way to our 3rd longest though.:D

xconfusedx I'm assuming you're referring to an unbeaten streak, while I am referring to winning streaks.

[HootyHoo]

There is no logical reason voting Montana so high. The team is a mess, and a shell of the team that beat Washington.


Sac State is WAY too low - voters still stick with the refusal to do big movements as warranted especially early in the season and cling to pre-season biases.


My ranking process is a bit less intensive and exhaustive than it was a few years back, so have at it. To address some concerns others have pointed out, I strongly agree Sac State feels too low (maybe I overreacted and Montana has gotten that bad?) and that Harvard should definitely be ahead of Princeton going into this weekend.

Weber and UND are competitive in tough games! Keeping them in. Better than the dregs of the CAA and SoCon and OVC struggling against mediocre teams.

1: Sam Houston Bearkats
2: South Dakota State Jackrabbits
3: Southern Illinois Salukis
4: Eastern Washington Eagles
5: North Dakota State Bison
6: Villanova Wildcats
7: James Madison Dukes
8: Southeastern Louisiana Lions
9: Montana State Bobcats
10: Missouri State Bears
11: South Dakota Coyotes
12: Northern Iowa Panthers
13: Sac State Hornets
14: Montana Grizzlies
15: UC Davis Aggies
16: Harvard Crimson
17: East Tennessee State Buccaneers
18: Incarnate Word Cardinals
19: North Dakota Fighting Hawks
20: Princeton Tigers
21: Weber State Wildcats
22: Dartmouth Big Green
23: Virginia Military Institute Keydets
24: Rhode Island Rams
25: Tennessee-Martin Skyhawks

I really like Chattanooga going forward but couldn't rationalize putting them in just yet.

Could you explain your reasoning on why KSU is not ranked?

[KPSUL]

Hopefully you'll be impressed with Dartmouth soon. :)

I was last Saturday! Dartmouth played almost a perfect game vs UNH, except for losing track of Dylan Laube a couple times. I had the three leading Ivy team in the Top 25, although Dartmouth the highest ranked of the three..

[PantherRob82]

1: North Dakota State Bison
2: Eastern Washington Eagles
3: Sam Houston Bearkats
4: Southern Illinois Salukis
5: South Dakota State Jackrabbits
6: Montana State Bobcats
7: Villanova Wildcats
8: James Madison Dukes
9: Montana Grizzlies
10: Southeastern Louisiana Lions
11: Weber State Wildcats
12: South Dakota Coyotes
13: Incarnate Word Cardinals
14: UC Davis Aggies
15: Northern Iowa Panthers
16: North Dakota Fighting Hawks
17: East Tennessee State Buccaneers
18: Kennesaw State Owls
19: Missouri State Bears
20: Tennessee-Martin Skyhawks
21: Rhode Island Rams
22: Delaware Fightin' Blue Hens
23: Virginia Military Institute Keydets
24: Sac State Hornets
25: Princeton Tigers

PantherRob82

The Most Significant Win: Sac State Hornets
The Most Significant Loss: Central Arkansas Bears

[KPSUL]

1: Sam Houston Bearkats
2: North Dakota State Bison
3: Eastern Washington Eagles
4: Southern Illinois Salukis
5: South Dakota State Jackrabbits
6: Villanova Wildcats
7: Montana State Bobcats
8: James Madison Dukes
9: Southeastern Louisiana Lions
10: East Tennessee State Buccaneers
11: Montana Grizzlies
12: Missouri State Bears
13: Dartmouth Big Green
14: UC Davis Aggies
15: Incarnate Word Cardinals
16: Kennesaw State Owls
17: Princeton Tigers
18: Virginia Military Institute Keydets
19: Northern Iowa Panthers
20: Rhode Island Rams
21: South Dakota Coyotes
22: Harvard Crimson
23: Duquesne Dukes
24: Tennessee-Martin Skyhawks
25: Holy Cross Crusaders

[mvemjsunpx]

Previous week in parentheses…


1. Sam Houston St. (1)
2. Eastern Washington (2)
3. North Dakota St. (3)
4. Southern Illinois (4)
5. South Dakota St. (5)
6. Villanova (6)
7. James Madison (7)
8. Montana St. (9)
9. UC Davis (10)
10. Southeastern Louisiana (12)
11. East Tennessee St. (8)
12. Missouri St. (14)
13. South Dakota (15)
14. Harvard (16)
15. Dartmouth (25)
16. Incarnate Word (23)
17. Princeton (17)
18. Northern Iowa (13)
19. Sacramento St. (NR)
20. Tennessee-Martin (18)
21. Duquesne (20)
22. Kennesaw St. (24)
23. Montana (11)
24. VMI (NR)
25. Mercer (19)

Dropped - Rhode Island (21), Weber St. (22)


W - Sacramento St.
L - Montana

[Professor Chaos]

I have EKU in my poll. Their resume is as good as anyone else in at 15-25 tier.
Idk... that home loss to Indiana State looks A-W-F-U-L right now.

[POD Knows]

Idk... that home loss to Indiana State looks A-W-F-U-L right now.
So does Rhody’s loss and MSU had a bad loss. EKU is 5-1 in FCS. Are they good, don’t really know but the pile of teams I had at the back of the pack, UNI, UND, NAU, MERCER, RHODY and EKU are pretty much a coin flip.

[smilo]

Could you explain your reasoning on why KSU is not ranked?

There is virtually no differentiation between KSU and Furman resumes. Looking to Massey for objective results-based metrics places them #38 even though the composite is more generous. Looking to SP+ for predictive-based has them 21st, well behind other teams like Princeton and Dartmouth who have limited (but no longer bare) resumes.

There's a case for them to get a slot, but between 23 and 30 I may as well throw darts. I was mighty impressed with VMI last two weeks even though the analytics hate them so they got the spot especially over a resume of someone that looks like the 3rd best team's in their conference.

Wish Kennesaw would play somebody so we could justify any ranking they've ever had!

[GoBlueHens83]

Could you explain your reasoning on why KSU is not ranked?

Must not have been impressed with the 10 point win over Reinhardt.

[ursus arctos horribilis]

xconfusedx I'm assuming you're referring to an unbeaten streak, while I am referring to winning streaks.

Yes. I'd appreciate it if you would just go along with it as well.

[Chalupa Batman]

I'd say Sac State's multi score loss to UNI was the flukish result. The Hornets outgained uni by 100 yards, but they had 6 turnovers, including 4 in the second half.

Another thing to think about is how would've the Hornets defended UNI if they actually prepared for Theo Day? They were winning before he came in, and you can tell they weren't prepared for him.

[Chalupa Batman]

Have at it.

1: Eastern Washington Eagles
2: Sam Houston Bearkats
3: Southern Illinois Salukis
4: North Dakota State Bison
5: South Dakota State Jackrabbits
6: Villanova Wildcats
7: Southeastern Louisiana Lions
8: James Madison Dukes
9: Montana State Bobcats
10: Incarnate Word Cardinals
11: South Dakota Coyotes
12: Princeton Tigers
13: East Tennessee State Buccaneers
14: UC Davis Aggies
15: Kennesaw State Owls
16: Virginia Military Institute Keydets
17: Missouri State Bears
18: Sac State Hornets
19: Harvard Crimson
20: Chattanooga Mocs
21: Montana Grizzlies
22: Tennessee-Martin Skyhawks
23: Jackson State Tigers
24: Dartmouth Big Green
25: Duquesne Dukes

The Most Significant Win: Virginia Military Institute Keydets
The Most Significant Loss: Rhode Island Rams
Which Conference Does Your Team Play in?: Missouri Valley Football Conference

[grizband]

My week 7 poll:

1: Eastern Washington Eagles
2: Sam Houston Bearkats
3: North Dakota State Bison
4: Southern Illinois Salukis
5: South Dakota State Jackrabbits
6: Montana State Bobcats
7: Villanova Wildcats
8: James Madison Dukes
9: Southeastern Louisiana Lions
10: UC Davis Aggies
11: Missouri State Bears
12: South Dakota Coyotes
13: East Tennessee State Buccaneers
14: Incarnate Word Cardinals
15: Sac State Hornets
16: Montana Grizzlies
17: Kennesaw State Owls
18: Tennessee-Martin Skyhawks
19: Rhode Island Rams
20: Dartmouth Big Green
21: Eastern Kentucky Colonels
22: Virginia Military Institute Keydets
23: Jackson State Tigers
24: Princeton Tigers
25: Northern Iowa PanthersThe Most Significant Win: Sac State Hornets
The Most Significant Loss: Montana Grizzlies
Which Conference Does Your Team Play in?: Big Sky Conference

[caribbeanhen]

1: Sam Houston Bearkats
2: Eastern Washington Eagles
3: Southern Illinois Salukis
4: North Dakota State Bison
5: South Dakota State Jackrabbits
6: James Madison Dukes
7: Villanova Wildcats
8: Southeastern Louisiana Lions
9: UC Davis Aggies
10: Montana State Bobcats
11: South Dakota Coyotes
12: Missouri State Bears
13: Incarnate Word Cardinals
14: Montana Grizzlies
15: Rhode Island Rams
16: East Tennessee State Buccaneers
17: Dartmouth Big Green
18: Princeton Tigers
19: Tennessee-Martin Skyhawks
20: Kennesaw State Owls
21: Northern Iowa Panthers
22: Virginia Military Institute Keydets
23: Chattanooga Mocs
24: Sac State Hornets
25: Harvard Crimson

Delaware out?

next up Rhode Island, they just ain’t that good

[caribbeanhen]

1: Sam Houston Bearkats
2: Eastern Washington Eagles
3: North Dakota State Bison
4: Southern Illinois Salukis
5: South Dakota State Jackrabbits
6: Montana State Bobcats
7: Villanova Wildcats
8: James Madison Dukes
9: Southeastern Louisiana Lions
10: Incarnate Word Cardinals
11: South Dakota Coyotes
12: UC Davis Aggies
13: Missouri State Bears
14: Sac State Hornets
15: Montana Grizzlies
16: Harvard Crimson
17: Dartmouth Big Green
18: East Tennessee State Buccaneers
19: Princeton Tigers
20: Northern Iowa Panthers
21: Tennessee-Martin Skyhawks
22: Kennesaw State Owls
23: Virginia Military Institute Keydets
24: Duquesne Dukes
25: Eastern Kentucky Colonels

[GoBlueHens83]

1: Eastern Washington Eagles
2: North Dakota State Bison
3: Sam Houston Bearkats
4: Villanova Wildcats
5: Southern Illinois Salukis
6: South Dakota State Jackrabbits
7: James Madison Dukes
8: Montana State Bobcats
9: UC Davis Aggies
10: Southeastern Louisiana Lions
11: Tennessee-Martin Skyhawks
12: South Dakota Coyotes
13: Harvard Crimson
14: East Tennessee State Buccaneers
15: Missouri State Bears
16: Incarnate Word Cardinals
17: Montana Grizzlies
18: Princeton Tigers
19: Dartmouth Big Green
20: Eastern Kentucky Colonels
21: Virginia Military Institute Keydets
22: Northern Iowa Panthers
23: Sac State Hornets
24: Kennesaw State Owls
25: Furman Paladins

[MSUBobcat]

Yes. I'd appreciate it if you would just go along with it as well.

Haha. Well, now we have the OT rules demanding an outcome so ties are no longer possible. So when we get to 16 straight wins, and especially 17, be damn certain I'll be bringing it up!

[paward]

Who is still voting for Delaware at this point, and why?
I voted them most significant Loss

[Mike296]

Enjoy,



Hello Mike296 ,

We have received your AGS Top 25 vote on 10/17/2021 3:19:45

Your vote is listed below.


1: Sam Houston Bearkats
2: Eastern Washington Eagles
3: North Dakota State Bison
4: Southern Illinois Salukis
5: South Dakota State Jackrabbits
6: Villanova Wildcats
7: James Madison Dukes
8: Montana State Bobcats
9: Southeastern Louisiana Lions
10: UC Davis Aggies
11: Montana Grizzlies
12: East Tennessee State Buccaneers
13: South Dakota Coyotes
14: Incarnate Word Cardinals
15: Northern Iowa Panthers
16: Rhode Island Rams
17: Missouri State Bears
18: Tennessee-Martin Skyhawks
19: Kennesaw State Owls
20: Princeton Tigers
21: Jackson State Tigers
22: Virginia Military Institute Keydets
23: Harvard Crimson
24: Eastern Kentucky Colonels
25: Dartmouth Big Green

Mike296

The Most Significant Win: Sac State Hornets
The Most Significant Loss: Weber State Wildcats
Which Conference Does Your Team Play in?: Ohio Valley Conference


I’m going to admit that even though I dropped Montana like 7 spots in my poll I realistically should have put them around 15-25. This was my first poll in two weeks due to me catching Covid.

Jackson State is actually a decent squad. I was flipping through ESPN+ games Saturday and saw that one in the second half.

It’s a rough year to be an APSU fan that’s for sure especially when we’re due for a conference move at the end of the year.

[MTfan4life]

I take kind of a different approach each given week. This week, I moved into a "What have you done for me lately?" approach.

1: Eastern Washington Eagles
2: North Dakota State Bison
3: Southern Illinois Salukis
4: Villanova Wildcats
5: Sam Houston Bearkats
6: South Dakota State Jackrabbits
7: Montana State Bobcats
8: Southeastern Louisiana Lions
9: James Madison Dukes
10: Missouri State Bears
11: South Dakota Coyotes
12: Kennesaw State Owls
13: UC Davis Aggies
14: Tennessee-Martin Skyhawks
15: Incarnate Word Cardinals
16: East Tennessee State Buccaneers
17: Sac State Hornets
18: Jackson State Tigers
19: Virginia Military Institute Keydets
20: Harvard Crimson
21: Montana Grizzlies
22: Eastern Kentucky Colonels
23: Duquesne Dukes
24: Dartmouth Big Green
25: Rhode Island Rams

I personally think UC Davis is too high, but it's hard to go against a 6-1 team with an FBS win. Northern Iowa maybe could be ranked, but I think I just watched too much of their last two games. Sure they were playing good competition, but they looked rather pitiful in both of them. North Dakota put up a MUCH better fight against both teams and I didn't rank them. If you know Coach Farley, though, you know UNI will win handily in Brookings this weekend. It's just what they do. haha

I don't like ranking non-participants, so it's rare to get three of them in there with two Ivies and a SWAC rep. Jackson State has a dreadful remaining schedule, so I'll probably just reserve that 18th spot for them for the remainder of the season. Those Tigers sure can play defense, though!

The SoCon is looking to have a very wild conference race. With them continuing to beat each other up, it might end up being the case where no one seems rank worthy. VMI has recovered nicely, though. That's all for now.

[Gil Dobie]

You could say the same about UNI only being one spot above Sac St despite beating them easily on the road earlier this fall. I try to avoid recency bias in my poll ballot so UNI's win at Sac St was significant as well. It was probably the path of least resistance for me, given UNI's recent losses and Montana's strong performance thus far this fall, to treat the Sac St win over Montana as flukish and using that to justify ranking Montana above UNI and UNI above Sac St but that's what I went with.

IMO the further into the season we get the less weight should be put on head-to-head matchups since we've get more and more data outside of head-to-head to consider.

Montana hasn't been good since their QB was injured. Sac is 4-2, 3-0 in conference play, UNI is 3-3, 1-2 in conference play.

[Professor Chaos]

Montana hasn't been good since their QB was injured. Sac is 4-2, 3-0 in conference play, UNI is 3-3, 1-2 in conference play.
Similar to dbackjon's statement if Montana is no good why should we even consider Sac St in the top 25? Outside of that they have a nail biting win over 1 win Idaho St, an easy win over 1 win SUU, and gave 0 win Dixie St their most closest loss so far this season. How do you think UNI would do against those teams?

[ElCid]

The SoCon is looking to have a very wild conference race. With them continuing to beat each other up, it might end up being the case where no one seems rank worthy. VMI has recovered nicely, though. That's all for now.

I can't think of another conf as closely competitive. Blowout games are not common as compared to some conferences. In regard to VMI, they didn't look good for the first few games, but they got Ws except for the Kent debacle, but lots of teams, even good teams let FBS games get away from them sometimes. The Citadel/VMI game shouldn't be too much of a black mark considering the intense rivalry, it was in Charleston, and the coveted Silver Shako was on the line. We have a few Dr Jekyll and Mr Hyde performances as well, especially from UTC, Samford, and now Mercer as well. UTC is especially hard to figure out. They blew it against the Peay, but took Kentucky to the last minute. Crazy year.

[Ivytalk]

I was last Saturday! Dartmouth played almost a perfect game vs UNH, except for losing track of Dylan Laube a couple times. I had the three leading Ivy team in the Top 25, although Dartmouth the highest ranked of the three..
When was the last year that three Ivy schools made the AGS Top 25? I think it’s happened before, but it’s been a heckuva long time.

[caribbeanhen]

When was the last year that three Ivy schools made the AGS Top 25? I think it’s happened before, but it’s been a heckuva long time.

The jury is still out if this years Big 3 Ivies are better than the 2018/2019 Princeton Dartmouth teams

I had em both near top 10, Yale top 25

[ElCid]

The jury is still out if this years Big 3 Ivies are better than the 2018/2019 Princeton Dartmouth teams

I had em both near top 10, Yale top 25

The Yale that couldn't beat UCONN? The UCONN that HC beat by 10? Just asking. Not sure Yale is necessarily worthy...but then again, are any of the current 18-25 slot teams worthy. Hard to say this year.

[caribbeanhen]

The Yale that couldn't beat UCONN? The UCONN that HC beat by 10? Just asking. Not sure Yale is necessarily worthy...but then again, are any of the current 18-25 slot teams worthy. Hard to say this year.

No

my Yale reference was referring to Yale from a few years ago, not this year.

Remember when Maine made that Semi final run back in 2018? Well Yale curbstomped Maine at the Yale Bowl earlier that year.

[ElCid]

No

my Yale reference was referring to Yale from a few years ago, not this year.

Remember when Maine made that Semi final run back in 2018? Well Yale curbstomped Maine at the Yale Bowl earlier that year.

Oops. My bad. It was 2018.

[Gil Dobie]

Similar to dbackjon's statement if Montana is no good why should we even consider Sac St in the top 25? Outside of that they have a nail biting win over 1 win Idaho St, an easy win over 1 win SUU, and gave 0 win Dixie St their most closest loss so far this season. How do you think UNI would do against those teams?

How would UNI do against Sac St, with Sac St knowing which QB was going to finish the game. Sac St was winning, Day came in to start the 2nd half, and the game was over. 6 Turnovers for Sac St and 1 UNI had a huge impact too. Sac St had more total yards and TOP. Montana would lose to UNI if they played today. Sac St has a good chance of beating UNI if the game was played today.

[Rjones61]

SE LA is the most interesting in the poll, I think. Don't know what to make of them. Reminds me of a lot of EWU teams in the past where their offense can carry them to playoffs, but they will be immediately bumped for having nothing on defense.


I also think Incarnate Word will climb to the top 10.

[Professor Chaos]

How would UNI do against Sac St, with Sac St knowing which QB was going to finish the game. Sac St was winning, Day came in to start the 2nd half, and the game was over. 6 Turnovers for Sac St and 1 UNI had a huge impact too. Sac St had more total yards and TOP. Montana would lose to UNI if they played today. Sac St has a good chance of beating UNI if the game was played today.
I'd disagree, I think the result would be similar with Day as the known starter since he's just a much better QB than McElvain is. After UNI went up 34-9 Sac St put up 192 yards of offense compared to UNI's 14 so them winning the total yardage battle is pretty insignificant IMO.

Turnovers are a huge factor but they're part of the game. Do you give UNI a pass for their loss against USD since they had 2 turnovers and a blocked punt in the first half to give USD the ball inside the UNI redzone 3 times (which led to 17 points)? I don't. UNI also outgained USD in that game. There seems to be a lot of mental gymnastics being done to explain away a 3 score head-to-head win for UNI at Sac St when the simplest explanation of UNI is just better than Sac St could turn out be the right one. We'll see.

[caribbeanhen]

SE LA is the most interesting in the poll, I think. Don't know what to make of them. Reminds me of a lot of EWU teams in the past where their offense can carry them to playoffs, but they will be immediately bumped for having nothing on defense.


I also think Incarnate Word will climb to the top 10.

SLA beat Nova in first round in 2019 in a great game but D fell apart up in Montana

[MR. CHICKEN]

I can't think of another conf as closely competitive. Blowout games are not common as compared to some conferences. In regard to VMI, they didn't look good for the first few games, but they got Ws except for the Kent debacle, but lots of teams, even good teams let FBS games get away from them sometimes. The Citadel/VMI game shouldn't be too much of a black mark considering the intense rivalry, it was in Charleston, and the coveted Silver Shako was on the line. We have a few Dr Jekyll and Mr Hyde performances as well, especially from UTC, Samford, and now Mercer as well. UTC is especially hard to figure out. They blew it against the Peay, but took Kentucky to the last minute. Crazy year.


32207

.....AH CAN......11 OF 21 CAA CONFERENCE GAMES.....PLAYED TA DATE........HAVE BEEN DECIDED........BAH....UH TOUCHDOWN O' LESS..............BRAQUE!!

[Preferred Walk-On]

I'd disagree, I think the result would be similar with Day as the known starter since he's just a much better QB than McElvain is. After UNI went up 34-9 Sac St put up 192 yards of offense compared to UNI's 14 so them winning the total yardage battle is pretty insignificant IMO.

Turnovers are a huge factor but they're part of the game. Do you give UNI a pass for their loss against USD since they had 2 turnovers and a blocked punt in the first half to give USD the ball inside the UNI redzone 3 times (which led to 17 points)? I don't. UNI also outgained USD in that game. There seems to be a lot of mental gymnastics being done to explain away a 3 score head-to-head win for UNI at Sac St when the simplest explanation of UNI is just better than Sac St could turn out be the right one. We'll see.

Occam's razor, indeed.

[Professor Chaos]

In the end the how good UNI is/isn't debate will be settled pretty quickly. They play at SDSU this Saturday and are home to SIU the Saturday after that so if they win those they'll be easily in the top 10, if they split they're probably still solidly in the top 25, and if they lose both they'll be dropped out with a 3-5 record.

[MSUBobcat]

Occam's razor, indeed.

Haha. I just said the same in my rep comment to PC. xnodx Big fan of Occam's Razor.

[Gil Dobie]

I'd disagree, I think the result would be similar with Day as the known starter since he's just a much better QB than McElvain is. After UNI went up 34-9 Sac St put up 192 yards of offense compared to UNI's 14 so them winning the total yardage battle is pretty insignificant IMO.

Turnovers are a huge factor but they're part of the game. Do you give UNI a pass for their loss against USD since they had 2 turnovers and a blocked punt in the first half to give USD the ball inside the UNI redzone 3 times (which led to 17 points)? I don't. UNI also outgained USD in that game. There seems to be a lot of mental gymnastics being done to explain away a 3 score head-to-head win for UNI at Sac St when the simplest explanation of UNI is just better than Sac St could turn out be the right one. We'll see.

6 turnovers is huge. UNI had 7 yards passing in the first half, and was presenting a running offense. In the 3rd Quarter, 3 of UNI's TD's were 23, 27 and 24 yard drives after turnovers, and in the 4th, a 70 yard drive ended in a INT. I remember Indiana St getting a couple picks and beating the Bison. How many times out of 10, would the Bison have won against Indiana St that year.

[Professor Chaos]

6 turnovers is huge. UNI had 7 yards passing in the first half, and was presenting a running offense. In the 3rd Quarter, 3 of UNI's TD's were 23, 27 and 24 yard drives after turnovers, and in the 4th, a 70 yard drive ended in a INT. I remember Indiana St getting a couple picks and beating the Bison. How many times out of 10, would the Bison have won against Indiana St that year.
And USD had first half TD drives of 13, 20, and 42 yards (and a FG drive of -1 yards) last Saturday against UNI. Is anyone arguing that USD's win over UNI was a fluke? Good teams take care of the football. Good defenses take the football away from the opposing offense. I don't know if either UNI or Sac St is that good but I'd take UNI in a rematch easily.

[Gil Dobie]

And USD had first half TD drives of 13, 20, and 42 yards (and a FG drive of -1 yards) last Saturday against UNI. Is anyone arguing that USD's win over UNI was a fluke? Good teams take care of the football. Good defenses take the football away from the opposing offense. I don't know if either UNI or Sac St is that good but I'd take UNI in a rematch easily.

USD, UNI and Sac St are all good teams, with South Dakota being the better at this time of the season. Good teams also have bad games, where nothing goes right. We will find out by season's end, but at this point of the season, I would take Sac St. I also remember Montana beating NDSU the first game of a season, and meeting again in the playoffs, a situation that has happened often in FCS, where teams split, or the winner of an early games doesn't make the playoffs and the loser does. Who do you have as 3rd best team in the Big Sky. I have a close one between NAU and Sac St, Montana after them, and maybe after UCD right now.

[kdinva]

1: Sam Houston Bearkats
2: North Dakota State Bison
3: Eastern Washington Eagles
4: Southern Illinois Salukis
5: South Dakota State Jackrabbits
6: Montana State Bobcats
7: Southeastern Louisiana Lions
8: Villanova Wildcats
9: James Madison Dukes
10: South Dakota Coyotes
11: UC Davis Aggies
12: East Tennessee State Buccaneers
13: Missouri State Bears
14: Montana Grizzlies
15: Rhode Island Rams
16: Kennesaw State Owls
17: Virginia Military Institute Keydets
18: Incarnate Word Cardinals
19: Princeton Tigers
20: Tennessee-Martin Skyhawks
21: Dartmouth Big Green
22: Jackson State Tigers
23: Chattanooga Mocs
24: Northern Iowa Panthers
25: Harvard Crimson


The Most Significant Win: Virginia Military Institute Keydets
The Most Significant Loss: Delaware Fightin' Blue Hens

[lionsrking2]

SLA beat Nova in first round in 2019 in a great game but D fell apart up in Montana

We played both of those games with wounded secondary, and neither corner would have played in any other circumstance — and we were already thin at LB. We are in far better shape with depth and talent right now than we were in the playoffs in 2019 or at any point last spring. And we have some young guys who are getting better and better each week. I like where we are right now.

[lionsrking2]

SE LA is the most interesting in the poll, I think. Don't know what to make of them. Reminds me of a lot of EWU teams in the past where their offense can carry them to playoffs, but they will be immediately bumped for having nothing on defense.


I also think Incarnate Word will climb to the top 10.

We have plenty on defense — we're a lot better than you think.

[BEAR]

So when does the Crapsville Bar open??? xdrunkyxxlolx

[MSUBobcat]

USD, UNI and Sac St are all good teams, with South Dakota being the better at this time of the season. Good teams also have bad games, where nothing goes right. We will find out by season's end, but at this point of the season, I would take Sac St. I also remember Montana beating NDSU the first game of a season, and meeting again in the playoffs, a situation that has happened often in FCS, where teams split, or the winner of an early games doesn't make the playoffs and the loser does. Who do you have as 3rd best team in the Big Sky. I have a close one between NAU and Sac St, Montana after them, and maybe after UCD right now.

If you're giving a pass for good teams having bad games, Davis should be ahead of NAU. Davis lost a shocker to ISU-o but trounced NoCo, while NAU lost a shocker to NoCo but trounced ISU-o (wash). Even though Arizona is a P5, I think Davis's 2 pt win over Tulsa is a better win than NAU's 2 pt win over Arizona. And Davis's win @Weber has to be better than getting whipped by both Sam Houston and SoDak. Not saying Weber is equal to either, but winning on the road against a decent team is better than getting destroyed by really good teams. Davis vs Sac State is a narrower margin, IMO. Sac lost to a UNI team that may not be as good as we thought, but beat a Griz team that may not be as good as we thought. They also gave Cal their only win (even Washington, who the Griz beat, was able to beat Cal in OT). If Sac beats NAU, I'd give them the edge ahead of Davis, who plays Cal Poly. If NAU beats Sac, Davis would be my #3. NAU is getting a lot of love for beating a BAD Arizona team. They have ample opportunities to prove to be a top 3-4 Big Sky team, however, with Cal Poly being the only "cupcake" left, though the game at Idaho isn't upper echelon either.

[Rjones61]

We have plenty on defense — we're a lot better than you think.

If you say so. I haven't watched one of your games, but 36 points per game allowed doesn't exactly scream "plenty of defense".

Especially when your opponents average points per game is 29.

Especially when each opponent (minus the Central Connecticut) has had their highest score total, or about near their highest score total of the season when playing SELA.

[Gil Dobie]

If you're giving a pass for good teams having bad games, Davis should be ahead of NAU. Davis lost a shocker to ISU-o but trounced NoCo, while NAU lost a shocker to NoCo but trounced ISU-o (wash). Even though Arizona is a P5, I think Davis's 2 pt win over Tulsa is a better win than NAU's 2 pt win over Arizona. And Davis's win @Weber has to be better than getting whipped by both Sam Houston and SoDak. Not saying Weber is equal to either, but winning on the road against a decent team is better than getting destroyed by really good teams. Davis vs Sac State is a narrower margin, IMO. Sac lost to a UNI team that may not be as good as we thought, but beat a Griz team that may not be as good as we thought. They also gave Cal their only win (even Washington, who the Griz beat, was able to beat Cal in OT). If Sac beats NAU, I'd give them the edge ahead of Davis, who plays Cal Poly. If NAU beats Sac, Davis would be my #3. NAU is getting a lot of love for beating a BAD Arizona team. They have ample opportunities to prove to be a top 3-4 Big Sky team, however, with Cal Poly being the only "cupcake" left, though the game at Idaho isn't upper echelon either.

Fair assessment, lots of games left to play.

[ursus arctos horribilis]

Haha. Well, now we have the OT rules demanding an outcome so ties are no longer possible. So when we get to 16 straight wins, and especially 17, be damn certain I'll be bringing it up!

As well you should brother. May we both live long enough to never see it happen though.xthumbsupx

[ursus arctos horribilis]

Montana hasn't been good since their QB was injured. Sac is 4-2, 3-0 in conference play, UNI is 3-3, 1-2 in conference play.

It is not the QB.

[Professor Chaos]

USD, UNI and Sac St are all good teams, with South Dakota being the better at this time of the season. Good teams also have bad games, where nothing goes right. We will find out by season's end, but at this point of the season, I would take Sac St. I also remember Montana beating NDSU the first game of a season, and meeting again in the playoffs, a situation that has happened often in FCS, where teams split, or the winner of an early games doesn't make the playoffs and the loser does. Who do you have as 3rd best team in the Big Sky. I have a close one between NAU and Sac St, Montana after them, and maybe after UCD right now.
I think UCD is a good team... still perplexed how they gave Idaho St their only win of the season to this point but that seems like a really "weird" place to play (kinda like WIU in the MVFC) and seems like teams tend to sleepwalk there. UCD has a pretty decent stretch at the end of the season starting at NAU (another tough place to play regardless of how good NAU is) and then home vs EWU and Sac St. I expect them to beat both NAU and Sac St. Regardless, that should help the Big Sky sort itself out.

[ursus arctos horribilis]

I think UCD is a good team... still perplexed how they gave Idaho St their only win of the season to this point but that seems like a really "weird" place to play (kinda like WIU in the MVFC) and seems like teams tend to sleepwalk there. UCD has a pretty decent stretch at the end of the season starting at NAU (another tough place to play regardless of how good NAU is) and then home vs EWU and Sac St. I expect them to beat both NAU and Sac St. Regardless, that should help the Big Sky sort itself out.

Right now, Sacramento has a couple of very good and well rounded teams that much like Montana in 2019 can come out and just lay an egg every here and there.

[MSUBobcat]

As well you should brother. May we both live long enough to never see it happen though.xthumbsupx

You don't want to live another 11 years and 1 month??? C'mon, Big Bear! You got more life left than that!

[MSUBobcat]

I think UCD is a good team... still perplexed how they gave Idaho St their only win of the season to this point but that seems like a really "weird" place to play (kinda like WIU in the MVFC) and seems like teams tend to sleepwalk there. UCD has a pretty decent stretch at the end of the season starting at NAU (another tough place to play regardless of how good NAU is) and then home vs EWU and Sac St. I expect them to beat both NAU and Sac St. Regardless, that should help the Big Sky sort itself out.

^^This here. Sac State was trailing at half, trailing entering the 4th quarter, kicked a FG early in the 4th and held on to a 2 point win. (Somehow UND, who often is not good on the road, went there and smacked 'em up though). In 2019, the team that finished 3-9 THUMPED UND, who was #27 in that week's AGS poll from wins over SHSU and UC-Davis. In 2018 (6-5), they beat playoff-bound MSU. They went 6-0 at home in 2014, with wins over Cal Poly and Sac St, who both finished 7-5. Something about that place where even as the favorite, you don't feel real certain of a victory.

[uofmman1122]

^^This here. Sac State was trailing at half, trailing entering the 4th quarter, kicked a FG early in the 4th and held on to a 2 point win. (Somehow UND, who often is not good on the road, went there and smacked 'em up though). In 2019, the team that finished 3-9 THUMPED UND, who was #27 in that week's AGS poll from wins over SHSU and UC-Davis. In 2018 (6-5), they beat playoff-bound MSU. They went 6-0 at home in 2014, with wins over Cal Poly and Sac St, who both finished 7-5. Something about that place where even as the favorite, you don't feel real certain of a victory.
That place is cursed, or something. Do I need to mention our 2009 game there? xlolx

[lionsrking2]

If you say so. I haven't watched one of your games, but 36 points per game allowed doesn't exactly scream "plenty of defense".

Especially when your opponents average points per game is 29.

Especially when each opponent (minus the Central Connecticut) has had their highest score total, or about near their highest score total of the season when playing SELA.

Like you said, you haven't watched.

[MSUBobcat]

That place is cursed, or something. Do I need to mention our 2009 game there? xlolx

Apparently yes, yes you do. But now that you did.... damn! A GW FG as time expires to beat a hapless Bengal team that went 1-10?? By a Griz team that went to the FINAL and lost by 2 to Nova?!?! (that was the Szczur year, right?) I'd say that pretty much exemplifies what I was trying to say. I'm glad they're coming to us, instead of us going there for a trap game after the Weber win.

[MSUBobcat]

Like you said, you haven't watched.

I also haven't really watched much of the Lions, but how do you refute what he stated?
Gave up 28 to 1-6 UNA, who only topped that with 31 vs Campbell and RMU and 34 to NC A&T.
Gave up the most points 2-4 La. Tech has scored all year, by 8 points.
1-5 CCSU only scored 10 but they're atrocious, with a D-II loss.
2-4 McNeese scored 35, with only D-II West Florida (36) allowing more and equaling what they scored on Northwestern State (not the measuring stick most programs aspire to be compared to this year).
Gave up a whopping 48 to 2-4 Nicholls, a total only matched when they played Houston Baptist, which is straight trash.
And gave up 24 to trashy, winless HBU who has only scored more against PVAMU (27).

It sure seems like they give up a lot of points to... not the most difficult of opponents. What about that is saying the defense is any kind of good? Are we chalking it up to having 5 straight away games to start the year (seriously... who does that?)? What are your eyeballs telling you that makes you say to not judge them by points against? xdontknowx

[ursus arctos horribilis]

You don't want to live another 11 years and 1 month??? C'mon, Big Bear! You got more life left than that!

No, I said may we both live long enough to see it not happen. I'll save the date though JIC.

[dbackjon]

If you're giving a pass for good teams having bad games, Davis should be ahead of NAU. Davis lost a shocker to ISU-o but trounced NoCo, while NAU lost a shocker to NoCo but trounced ISU-o (wash). Even though Arizona is a P5, I think Davis's 2 pt win over Tulsa is a better win than NAU's 2 pt win over Arizona. And Davis's win @Weber has to be better than getting whipped by both Sam Houston and SoDak. Not saying Weber is equal to either, but winning on the road against a decent team is better than getting destroyed by really good teams. Davis vs Sac State is a narrower margin, IMO. Sac lost to a UNI team that may not be as good as we thought, but beat a Griz team that may not be as good as we thought. They also gave Cal their only win (even Washington, who the Griz beat, was able to beat Cal in OT). If Sac beats NAU, I'd give them the edge ahead of Davis, who plays Cal Poly. If NAU beats Sac, Davis would be my #3. NAU is getting a lot of love for beating a BAD Arizona team. They have ample opportunities to prove to be a top 3-4 Big Sky team, however, with Cal Poly being the only "cupcake" left, though the game at Idaho isn't upper echelon either.

I would put us below Sac and Davis now for sure.

Yes, Arizona is bad, but still a P5 we hadn't beaten in 90 years.

But, as stated, we get to settle it on the field - Saturday in Hornetville, in a couple weeks in Flag.

Realistically, NAU needs to run the table to get into the playoffs. 7-4 will get consideration, but will take help from other bubble teams losing.

The UNC game was a killer.

[lionsrking2]

I also haven't really watched much of the Lions, but how do you refute what he stated?
Gave up 28 to 1-6 UNA, who only topped that with 31 vs Campbell and RMU and 34 to NC A&T.
Gave up the most points 2-4 La. Tech has scored all year, by 8 points.
1-5 CCSU only scored 10 but they're atrocious, with a D-II loss.
2-4 McNeese scored 35, with only D-II West Florida (36) allowing more and equaling what they scored on Northwestern State (not the measuring stick most programs aspire to be compared to this year).
Gave up a whopping 48 to 2-4 Nicholls, a total only matched when they played Houston Baptist, which is straight trash.
And gave up 24 to trashy, winless HBU who has only scored more against PVAMU (27).

It sure seems like they give up a lot of points to... not the most difficult of opponents. What about that is saying the defense is any kind of good? Are we chalking it up to having 5 straight away games to start the year (seriously... who does that?)? What are your eyeballs telling you that makes you say to not judge them by points against? xdontknowx

For starters, I'm not claiming we're the '85 Bears. I'm merely stating we're not as bad as the numbers appear, and we're much better than we were in the spring and the final three games of 2019.

As far as UNA, we were running from Hurricane Ida and only practiced once outside in 10 days, which was essentially a walk-thru the Thursday before the game, in Florence, Alabama. They started a transfer QB we had no tape on and we had zero idea what they were going to do offensively. We lined up in base and adjusted as we went. They hit us with a trick play for one score and essentially three big plays for the other scores. But it was a yawner and there was zero emotion or energy — we had kids who lost their homes and still had family members displaced. We took our 49-28 win and moved on. Well, actually we stayed in Florence, AL for the next six days after that before heading to Ruston, La to play La Tech.

Louisiana Tech is pretty good offensively, especially for a G5, and we gave up 35 defensive points, which isn't too bad. They had a pick 6 for one score and a FG set up by an INT. Tech scored 34 against Miss State the week before in a one-point loss, 37 against undefeated SMU, in a game they lost on a Hail Mary at the end the game. And they were a Hail Mary away from tying/beating a ranked NC State the week after that. No shame in dropping that one, especially considering we scored 42 points and had the ball with a chance to win on the last possession of the game.

All 10 of CCSU's points were set up at point blank range off turnovers. It was literally like practice.

21 of McNeese's 35 points were set up off turnovers or special teams. They ran a punt back inside our 5 and we muffed a punt inside our 10. The first score was setup by a turnover. They had three good drives the entire game — scored on two and missed a FG.

Nicholls is really good on offense and have a great QB, OL and WR. They had a pick six and another score setup by a turnover. They scored 48, our defense is responsible for 35. I'll take that against them.

HBU went three and out, faked a punt for 37 yards that set them up inside our 15. We got a roughing the passer call to set them up inside the 5 and they punched one in. Another three points was set up by a fumble around midfield and they kicked a 59 yard field goal. They had two good drives, both of which involved big plays. Other than that, they did nothing.

[Preferred Walk-On]

For starters, I'm not claiming we're the '85 Bears. I'm merely stating we're not as bad as the numbers appear, and we're much better than we were in the spring and the final three games of 2019.

As far as UNA, we were running from Hurricane Ida and only practiced once outside in 10 days, which was essentially a walk-thru the Thursday before the game, in Florence, Alabama. They started a transfer QB we had no tape on and we had zero idea what they were going to do offensively. We lined up in base and adjusted as we went. They hit us with a trick play for one score and essentially three big plays for the other scores. But it was a yawner and there was zero emotion or energy — we had kids who lost their homes and still had family members displaced. We took our 49-28 win and moved on. Well, actually we stayed in Florence, AL for the next six days after that before heading to Ruston, La to play La Tech.

Louisiana Tech is pretty good offensively, especially for a G5, and we gave up 35 defensive points, which isn't too bad. They had a pick 6 for one score and a FG set up by an INT. Tech scored 34 against Miss State the week before in a one-point loss, 37 against undefeated SMU, in a game they lost on a Hail Mary at the end the game. And they were a Hail Mary away from tying/beating a ranked NC State the week after that. No shame in dropping that one, especially considering we scored 42 points and had the ball with a chance to win on the last possession of the game.

All 10 of CCSU's points were set up at point blank range off turnovers. It was literally like practice.

21 of McNeese's 35 points were set up off turnovers or special teams. They ran a punt back inside our 5 and we muffed a punt inside our 10. The first score was setup by a turnover. They had three good drives the entire game — scored on two and missed a FG.

Nicholls is really good on offense and have a great QB, OL and WR. They had a pick six and another score setup by a turnover. They scored 48, our defense is responsible for 35. I'll take that against them.

HBU went three and out, faked a punt for 37 yards that set them up inside our 15. We got a roughing the passer call to set them up inside the 5 and they punched one in. Another three points was set up by a fumble around midfield and they kicked a 59 yard field goal. They had two good drives, both of which involved big plays. Other than that, they did nothing.

So you are saying their defense is not that bad...they just cannot hang on the ball and are undisciplined. That does not bode well either.

It is my opinion that SLU's offense is really good at scoring, but not as good at keeping the opposing offense on the sideline (i.e., they do not help their defense much). In the Southland, that works. In the playoffs, it becomes more difficult to outscore every team in shootouts. This is why it took Sam Houston figuring out how to control some clock and help their defense become the best they could be (which was pretty-darned good) before they were able to win a title.

I believe SLU has been underrated for the better part of two years now; however, I am under no illusion that they can outscore everybody for a title.

[lionsrking2]

So you are saying their defense is not that bad...they just cannot hang on the ball and are undisciplined. That does not bode well either.

It is my opinion that SLU's offense is really good at scoring, but not as good at keeping the opposing offense on the sideline (i.e., they do not help their defense much). In the Southland, that works. In the playoffs, it becomes more difficult to outscore every team in shootouts. This is why it took Sam Houston figuring out how to control some clock and help their defense become the best they could be (which was pretty-darned good) before they were able to win a title.

I believe SLU has been underrated for the better part of two years now; however, I am under no illusion that they can outscore everybody for a title.

We're actually quite good at keeping opponents offense off the field -- maybe as good as anybody in the country. We lead FCS in average first downs per game at 31.3, we are in the top two or three in time of possession at over 34 minutes per game and we've punted only 8 times all year. We do fumble way too much.

[Preferred Walk-On]

You are correct, TOP is great (#5). And as you indicated, turnovers are a bit of an issue (turnover margin = 0;#58T), but not a negative margin.

However, total defense is not as great (384 YPG; #63). Top team defenses are in the low/mid 200's. SLU is smack in the middle of the FCS for team defense. Even if the touchdowns you point out were scored were off turnovers (i.e., short field), this really does not account much for the high YPG allowed (or plays allowed). There is definitely a bit of a disconnect here between YPG and good defense. I could get on board with average defense, but am hesitant to board the good defense train. If it is not due to the offense not "protecting" the defense, then is there something else we are missing regarding SLU's defense?

[lionsrking2]

You are correct, TOP is great (#5). And as you indicated, turnovers are a bit of an issue (turnover margin = 0;#58T), but not a negative margin.

However, total defense is not as great (384 YPG; #63). Top team defenses are in the low/mid 200's. SLU is smack in the middle of the FCS for team defense. Even if the touchdowns you point out were scored were off turnovers (i.e., short field), this really does not account much for the high YPG allowed (or plays allowed). There is definitely a bit of a disconnect here between YPG and good defense. I could get on board with average defense, but am hesitant to board the good defense train. If it is not due to the offense not "protecting" the defense, then is there something else we are missing regarding SLU's defense?

Again, not claiming that we have a "top defense" but yards allowed is relative to the style of play you see on a regular basis. We play in a fast tempo league in a part of the country that likes to go fast and throws the ball A LOT — games regularly average 130+ combined plays, upwards of 150-160, or more, on occasion. The "top defenses" you're referring to are usually from slower tempo, heavy run leagues that average less than 130 plays per game, and sometimes considerably less. Doesn't mean they aren't great defenses, but it's a lot easier to play statistically good defense when the ball isn't being snapped within 10-15 seconds every time the ball is spotted. Good defense is relative to who you're playing and what you have to do to win a football game.

My point is that we're much improved from where were in the spring when we lost a 43-38 game on the road at Sam Houston, and a 55-48 game at Southern Illinois. We were playing with walk-ons and converted backup OL on the defensive line because we were decimated by injury before the season started, and lost more guys as the season went. If we're capable of hanging in there against two top 5 teams on the road with what we were running out there on defense then, we sure as hell can compete with them now. And we're better on offense too.

Because of the situation the Southland is currently in, we have zero margin for error and could very well miss the playoffs if we slip up. But I'm confident if we make it, we'll represent ourselves well and there's no team in the country I would fear playing with this team. We may not win, but we'll be in every game.

[Preferred Walk-On]

Again, not claiming that we have a "top defense" but yards allowed is relative to the style of play you see on a regular basis. We play in a fast tempo league in a part of the country that likes to go fast and throws the ball A LOT — games regularly average 130+ combined plays, upwards of 150-160, or more, on occasion. The "top defenses" you're referring to are usually from slower tempo, heavy run leagues that average less than 130 plays per game, and sometimes considerably less. Doesn't mean they aren't great defenses, but it's a lot easier to play statistically good defense when the ball isn't being snapped within 10-15 seconds every time the ball is spotted. Good defense is relative to who you're playing and what you have to do to win a football game.

My point is that we're much improved from where were in the spring when we lost a 43-38 game on the road at Sam Houston, and a 55-48 game at Southern Illinois. We were playing with walk-ons and converted backup OL on the defensive line because we were decimated by injury before the season started, and lost more guys as the season went. If we're capable of hanging in there against two top 5 teams on the road with what we were running out there on defense then, we sure as hell can compete with them now. And we're better on offense too.

Because of the situation the Southland is currently in, we have zero margin for error and could very well miss the playoffs if we slip up. But I'm confident if we make it, we'll represent ourselves well and there's no team in the country I would fear playing with this team. We may not win, but we'll be in every game.

I can get on board with all that you say, and I would even say that you can compete with anyone.

I am just saying that defense travels, and that I don't think the stats support SLU having said defense. If it did, then especially with that TOP, the number of plays and YPG would be down. What it indicates to me is that SLU does not force many three and outs, providing teams with the opportunity for more plays and more yards. If the SLU defense were "shut-down", those stats would be lower, again, especially with 34 min TOP per game.

I am pulling for SLU to make the playoffs, and I definitely think SLU is the team to beat in the Southland. I just think it is harder to consistently win shootouts. EWU vs. NDSU is a prime example of that last spring. By all accounts, NDSU's offense was less-than-optimal last spring, and EWU jumped out to an early lead. Despite this, I think most Bison fans knew that as soon as EWU stopped scoring, the game would turn, because their defense was not going to stop even NDSU's subpar offense. I shudder to think what EWU would be with a better defense (this year?), and I think SLU might be in that same boat. I know this is not necessarily an apples vs. apples comparison for varying reasons, but this is what SLU reminds me of right now. However, I will admit that unlike spring 2021 and fall 2019, where I watched a fair share of SLU games, I have only been able to observe through stats and highlights this fall.

[Daytripper]

Again, not claiming that we have a "top defense" but yards allowed is relative to the style of play you see on a regular basis. We play in a fast tempo league in a part of the country that likes to go fast and throws the ball A LOT — games regularly average 130+ combined plays, upwards of 150-160, or more, on occasion. The "top defenses" you're referring to are usually from slower tempo, heavy run leagues that average less than 130 plays per game, and sometimes considerably less. Doesn't mean they aren't great defenses, but it's a lot easier to play statistically good defense when the ball isn't being snapped within 10-15 seconds every time the ball is spotted. Good defense is relative to who you're playing and what you have to do to win a football game.

My point is that we're much improved from where were in the spring when we lost a 43-38 game on the road at Sam Houston, and a 55-48 game at Southern Illinois. We were playing with walk-ons and converted backup OL on the defensive line because we were decimated by injury before the season started, and lost more guys as the season went. If we're capable of hanging in there against two top 5 teams on the road with what we were running out there on defense then, we sure as hell can compete with them now. And we're better on offense too.

Because of the situation the Southland is currently in, we have zero margin for error and could very well miss the playoffs if we slip up. But I'm confident if we make it, we'll represent ourselves well and there's no team in the country I would fear playing with this team. We may not win, but we'll be in every game.

I've said all year that I think you guys are a dark horse to win it all. Like PWO said though, at some point you are going to have to make a few big defensive stops because the defenses that you face in the latter part of the playoffs will make some stops on your offense.

[lionsrking2]

I can get on board with all that you say, and I would even say that you can compete with anyone.

I am just saying that defense travels, and that I don't think the stats support SLU having said defense. If it did, then especially with that TOP, the number of plays and YPG would be down. What it indicates to me is that SLU does not force many three and outs, providing teams with the opportunity for more plays and more yards. If the SLU defense were "shut-down", those stats would be lower, again, especially with 34 min TOP per game.

I am pulling for SLU to make the playoffs, and I definitely think SLU is the team to beat in the Southland. I just think it is harder to consistently win shootouts. EWU vs. NDSU is a prime example of that last spring. By all accounts, NDSU's offense was less-than-optimal last spring, and EWU jumped out to an early lead. Despite this, I think most Bison fans knew that as soon as EWU stopped scoring, the game would turn, because their defense was not going to stop even NDSU's subpar offense. I shudder to think what EWU would be with a better defense (this year?), and I think SLU might be in that same boat. I know this is not necessarily an apples vs. apples comparison for varying reasons, but this is what SLU reminds me of right now. However, I will admit that unlike spring 2021 and fall 2019, where I watched a fair share of SLU games, I have only been able to observe through stats and highlights this fall.

We don't need "said defense," we just need to be good enough to complement our offense, and I think we are at least that. It would be a bonus to have shutdown defensive unit, but as long as we score more than we give up, all is good. We can score on anybody.

[MSUBobcat]

I meant no disrespect and was honestly curious, Lions. I wasn't aware of all the TOs putting them in bad spots. If I were to do a poll, I'd probably have you above the Bobcats, with how vanilla our offensive playcalling has been. Pretty sure your defense could stop "run it straight up the middle" more times than our defense would stop your potent offense.

I also agree with PWO that TOs dont explain the YPG if they have short fields. And more often than not, the high flying O meets a solid D and their championship hope's come to an end. (See the Rob Ash years for the Bobcats)

[Preferred Walk-On]

We don't need "said defense," we just need to be good enough to complement our offense, and I think we are at least that. It would be a bonus to have shutdown defensive unit, but as long as we score more than we give up, all is good. We can score on anybody.

But can anybody can score on you? SLU's season has ended the past two years on the wrong end of shootouts, so... xchinscratchx

[lionsrking2]

I meant no disrespect and was honestly curious, Lions. I wasn't aware of all the TOs putting them in bad spots. If I were to do a poll, I'd probably have you above the Bobcats, with how vanilla our offensive playcalling has been. Pretty sure your defense could stop "run it straight up the middle" more times than our defense would stop your potent offense.

I also agree with PWO that TOs dont explain the YPG if they have short fields. And more often than not, the high flying O meets a solid D and their championship hope's come to an end. (See the Rob Ash years for the Bobcats)

No disrespect taken. I realize a lot of folks haven't seen us play or seen much video. Like I said, we're not great on defense — we're just not nearly as bad as folks assume, especially if they haven't seen us play and only go by the box scores — or if going off last spring or the playoffs in 2019. And we're not you're typical, "high flying O" either.

[lionsrking2]

But can anybody can score on you? SLU's season has ended the past two years on the wrong end of shootouts, so... xchinscratchx

Of course they can. All I'm saying is we're much better equipped personnel-wise to be on the other end of those shootouts. We blew one at Louisiana Tech in our loss because we turned the ball over and had twice as many penalties. But we outplayed them otherwise. We just gotta value the ball more or it could bite us again.

[andy7171]

Like you didn't. :)

[dudeitsaid]

lionsrking2, I was thinking about your perspective on your defense, and am quite familiar with being a fan of a team with a defense that is not highly regarded. And it seems a lot of people agree that style of play has a big impact on the stats, as noted in comparing MVFC teams that like to run clock and slow down the game, versus quick strike offenses that tend to increase the numbers of possessions both teams have in a game and corresponding stats such as yardage, first downs, 3rd down conversions percentage are all impacted. I'm always interested in trying to see patterns in stats just for fun, and I know stats are usually missing some degree of context (like the QB's that have no run game and have inflated passing numbers as a result), but it's intriguing none-the-less.

I've been looking at the AGS top 25, and looking at their comparative ranking based on where they stand in scoring O, scoring D, MOV, etc. Obviously, these don't tell the whole story because each game has been played between different teams with different styles in different circumstances (such as the hurricane, covid impact, injuries, etc), but the best teams still tend to show up on the top of the leaderboards in different areas regardless.

Maybe one of the most interesting ones is Margin of Victory. If the teams were ranked by best MOV, it would look like this. I also scored every team buy adding their current ranking in scoring offense and defense cumulatively, and it's cool to see that sorted as well. I've done the same with total offense and defense on a different speadsheet I didn't post, but in the end, it's really about points that are scored, so I just shared this one. Anyways, just something interesting to look at. It really is crazy to think that SDSU's average MOV is a good field goal ahead of the next team...even with losing a game!





AGS Ranking
Team
Scoring Offense
Scoring Defense
Cumulative standing
Points scored
Points allowed
Games
AVG MOV


5
South Dakota State Jackrabbits
3
9
12
275
96
6
29.8


3
Eastern Washington Eagles
1
61
62
378
190
7
26.9


23
Harvard Crimson
11
2
13
185
52
5
26.6


18
Princeton Tigers
5
7
12
206
77
5
25.8


2
North Dakota State Bison
24
1
25
197
43
6
25.7


7
Montana State Bobcats
17
3
20
241
74
7
23.9


8
James Madison Dukes
9
8
17
229
93
6
22.7


1
Sam Houston Bearkats
6
19
25
201
92
5
21.8


9
Southeastern Louisiana Lions
2
85
87
304
190
6
19.0


15
East Tennessee State Buccaneers
14
22
36
252
134
7
16.9


13
Incarnate Word Cardinals
8
33
41
230
135
6
15.8


11
UC Davis Aggies
28
14
42
225
115
7
15.7


6
Villanova Wildcats
23
17
40
198
108
6
15.0


10
South Dakota Coyotes
35
10
45
211
113
7
14.0


4
Southern Illinois Salukis
10
43
53
264
171
7
13.3


12
Montana Grizzlies
37
11
48
174
97
6
12.8


24
Dartmouth Big Green
26
5
31
162
85
6
12.8


17
Kennesaw State Owls
50
16
66
162
101
6
10.2


14
Missouri State Bears
21
45
66
201
148
6
8.8


21
Northern Iowa Panthers
48
18
66
163
110
6
8.8


25
Duquesne Dukes
25
49
74
163
126
5
7.4


20
Rhode Island Rams
51
26
77
162
122
6
6.7


16
Tennessee-Martin Skyhawks
22
67
89
199
168
6
5.2


19
Virginia Military Institute Keydets
29
70
99
223
204
7
2.7


22
Sac State Hornets
56
42
98
157
154
6
0.5

[dewey]

lionsrking2, I was thinking about your perspective on your defense, and am quite familiar with being a fan of a team with a defense that is not highly regarded. And it seems a lot of people agree that style of play has a big impact on the stats, as noted in comparing MVFC teams that like to run clock and slow down the game, versus quick strike offenses that tend to increase the numbers of possessions both teams have in a game and corresponding stats such as yardage, first downs, 3rd down conversions percentage are all impacted. I'm always interested in trying to see patterns in stats just for fun, and I know stats are usually missing some degree of context (like the QB's that have no run game and have inflated passing numbers as a result), but it's intriguing none-the-less.

I've been looking at the AGS top 25, and looking at their comparative ranking based on where they stand in scoring O, scoring D, MOV, etc. Obviously, these don't tell the whole story because each game has been played between different teams with different styles in different circumstances (such as the hurricane, covid impact, injuries, etc), but the best teams still tend to show up on the top of the leaderboards in different areas regardless.

Maybe one of the most interesting ones is Margin of Victory. If the teams were ranked by best MOV, it would look like this. I also scored every team buy adding their current ranking in scoring offense and defense cumulatively, and it's cool to see that sorted as well. I've done the same with total offense and defense on a different speadsheet I didn't post, but in the end, it's really about points that are scored, so I just shared this one. Anyways, just something interesting to look at. It really is crazy to think that SDSU's average MOV is a good field goal ahead of the next team...even with losing a game!





AGS Ranking
Team
Scoring Offense
Scoring Defense
Cumulative standing
Points scored
Points allowed
Games
AVG MOV


5
South Dakota State Jackrabbits
3
9
12
275
96
6
29.8


3
Eastern Washington Eagles
1
61
62
378
190
7
26.9


23
Harvard Crimson
11
2
13
185
52
5
26.6


18
Princeton Tigers
5
7
12
206
77
5
25.8


2
North Dakota State Bison
24
1
25
197
43
6
25.7


7
Montana State Bobcats
17
3
20
241
74
7
23.9


8
James Madison Dukes
9
8
17
229
93
6
22.7


1
Sam Houston Bearkats
6
19
25
201
92
5
21.8


9
Southeastern Louisiana Lions
2
85
87
304
190
6
19.0


15
East Tennessee State Buccaneers
14
22
36
252
134
7
16.9


13
Incarnate Word Cardinals
8
33
41
230
135
6
15.8


11
UC Davis Aggies
28
14
42
225
115
7
15.7


6
Villanova Wildcats
23
17
40
198
108
6
15.0


10
South Dakota Coyotes
35
10
45
211
113
7
14.0


4
Southern Illinois Salukis
10
43
53
264
171
7
13.3


12
Montana Grizzlies
37
11
48
174
97
6
12.8


24
Dartmouth Big Green
26
5
31
162
85
6
12.8


17
Kennesaw State Owls
50
16
66
162
101
6
10.2


14
Missouri State Bears
21
45
66
201
148
6
8.8


21
Northern Iowa Panthers
48
18
66
163
110
6
8.8


25
Duquesne Dukes
25
49
74
163
126
5
7.4


20
Rhode Island Rams
51
26
77
162
122
6
6.7


16
Tennessee-Martin Skyhawks
22
67
89
199
168
6
5.2


19
Virginia Military Institute Keydets
29
70
99
223
204
7
2.7


22
Sac State Hornets
56
42
98
157
154
6
0.5






I think using MOV of victory is heavily skewed on teams that have numerous cupcakes (NDSU vs Valparaiso, etc.). If you could figure out how to add in a strength of schedule maybe that would help.

Dewey

[dudeitsaid]

I think using MOV of victory is heavily skewed on teams that have numerous cupcakes (NDSU vs Valparaiso, etc.). If you could figure out how to add in a strength of schedule maybe that would help.

Dewey

I completely agree...that would be an great way to filter this. EWU and NDSU both have strong Margin of Victories, but Hero Sports had an article about how EWU really hasn't faced an elite defense yet, and NDSU an elite offense...but both will face multiple tests in those regards in the rest of the regular season.

But I do think to lionrking2's point, if the offense is elite, and the defense isn't horrible, you should get a decent mov. A game won 19-3 and a game won 45 - 26 are both handily won. If the they can keep that up, they should be able to make some noise in the playoffs.

[caribbeanhen]

1: Sam Houston Bearkats
2: Eastern Washington Eagles
3: Southern Illinois Salukis
4: North Dakota State Bison
5: South Dakota State Jackrabbits
6: James Madison Dukes
7: Villanova Wildcats
8: Southeastern Louisiana Lions
9: UC Davis Aggies
10: Montana State Bobcats
11: South Dakota Coyotes
12: Missouri State Bears
13: Incarnate Word Cardinals
14: Montana Grizzlies
15: Rhode Island Rams
16: East Tennessee State Buccaneers
17: Dartmouth Big Green
18: Princeton Tigers
19: Tennessee-Martin Skyhawks
20: Kennesaw State Owls
21: Northern Iowa Panthers
22: Virginia Military Institute Keydets
23: Chattanooga Mocs
24: Sac State Hornets
25: Harvard Crimson

That should do it for Rhode Island

[Chalupa Batman]

Dammit, now I gotta rank Weber and UNI again!

[MTfan4life]

If you know Coach Farley, though, you know UNI will win handily in Brookings this weekend. It's just what they do. haha


:D