AGS Top 25 - How They Fared - Week 7, Fall 2021

[Preferred Walk-On]

Without further ado, I present to you this week's "How They Fared". Teams in the top 10, with a couple of exceptions, fared well. Overall, the top 25 was 15-9, with a few eye opening losses for a few teams and a few losses that have potentially sealed the playoff fate for others. In addition to denoting some teams that either cannot reach 7 DI wins or have to win out to achieve 7 DI wins, I have also highlighted sub-.500 records at this point in the season. Any mistakes, please let me know, and happy polling!

CLICK HERE TO SEE “HOW THEY FARED”. (https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1XdxLtUmY9Sz_AhooIs9OumHAJLyfajFCg3UFniSI0as/edit?usp=sharing)

[Tribe4SF]

I won't be voting for any teams with 4 losses. Tough enough to decipher numbers 15 - 25 so I need some ground rules.

[kdinva]

thanks for the sheet.

[KPSUL]

Dartmouth is a very solid team, after watching them yesterday, I think they could play with anyone at the FCS level. They are a complete team with really no weaknesses. I've only watched Harvard once this season, Princeton not at all. But if those teams are as good as Dartmouth, three ranked Ivy teams is certainly reasonable.

[semobison]

Dartmouth is a very solid team, after watching them yesterday, I think they could play with anyone at the FCS level. They are a complete team with really no weaknesses. I've only watched Harvard once this season, Princeton not at all. But if those teams are as good as Dartmouth, three ranked Ivy teams is certainly reasonable.

Hmm,
Dartmouth beat Valpo 28-18. NAIA Indiana Wesleyan beat Valpo 28-10 and NDSU beat Valpo 64-0. After losing to Dartmouth yesterday one might also think UNH is down this year!
Never been a fan of ranking Ivy’s, even if they deserve it!

[caribbeanhen]

Dartmouth is a very solid team, after watching them yesterday, I think they could play with anyone at the FCS level. They are a complete team with really no weaknesses. I've only watched Harvard once this season, Princeton not at all. But if those teams are as good as Dartmouth, three ranked Ivy teams is certainly reasonable.

Already did that and have been plugging how good the good Ivies are for a few years around here

[NY Crusader 2010]

Hmm,
Dartmouth beat Valpo 28-18. NAIA Indiana Wesleyan beat Valpo 28-10 and NDSU beat Valpo 64-0. After losing to Dartmouth yesterday one might also think UNH is down this year!
Never been a fan of ranking Ivy’s, even if they deserve it!

I made the mistake of calling Dartmouth "overrated" the other day. Reason being the close game against God-awful Valpo to start the season. You'd think I would've learned after I picked SHU to beat them a few weeks ago and the Big Green ended up taking that one 34-7. I guess at this point I'd chalk it up to the fact that weird things tend to happen Week 1 and that Dartmouth hadn't played in 2 years. Looks like they're a well-oiled machine now.

As we all know, comparing scores of different games isn't always the perfect crystal ball. UNH lost to JMU by 2. Doesn't mean Dartmouth would beat JMU by double digits. Just like they probably also wouldn't lose to Indiana Wesleyan.

[caribbeanhen]

I made the mistake of calling Dartmouth "overrated" the other day. Reason being the close game against God-awful Valpo to start the season. You'd think I would've learned after I picked SHU to beat them a few weeks ago and the Big Green ended up taking that one 34-7. I guess at this point I'd chalk it up to the fact that weird things tend to happen Week 1 and that Dartmouth hadn't played in 2 years. Looks like they're a well-oiled machine now.

As we all know, comparing scores of different games isn't always the perfect crystal ball. UNH lost to JMU by 2. Doesn't mean Dartmouth would beat JMU by double digits. Just like they probably also wouldn't lose to Indiana Wesleyan.

lot’s of wisdom here

[KPSUL]

Hmm,
Dartmouth beat Valpo 28-18. NAIA Indiana Wesleyan beat Valpo 28-10 and NDSU beat Valpo 64-0. After losing to Dartmouth yesterday one might also think UNH is down this year!
Never been a fan of ranking Ivy’s, even if they deserve it!

UNH has been "down" since 2017, when we last made the playoffs. If what you want to conclude is that Dartmouth hasn't yet beaten a solid Top25 team yet I'd agree with you. However, the Ivy league has been getting progressively better for the last 5-6 years. Prior to then, we could get away with Voting Harvard #20something and write off the other seven teams. IMO that is no longer the case.

[semobison]

UNH has been "down" since 2017, when we last made the playoffs. If what you want to conclude is that Dartmouth hasn't yet beaten a solid Top25 team yet I'd agree with you. However, the Ivy league has been getting progressively better for the last 5-6 years. Prior to then, we could get away with Voting Harvard #20something and write off the other seven teams. IMO that is no longer the case.

How do we know the Ivy’s are getting better the last few years? They play a rather limited schedule. Because Dartmouth beat UNH? The CAA and UNH sure aren’t what they used to be.
I would love to see the Ivy’s in the playoffs.It would be good for FCS football but until they do, we really don’t know how good they are and claiming that Dartmouth can play with the top FCS teams is skeptical.

[WestCoastAggie]

Call me crazy but perhaps Kennesaw State isn’t truly overrated at all. Their defense at least is very good. If they run the table, a top-10 ranking shouldn’t be out of the question.

[caribbeanhen]

How do we know the Ivy’s are getting better the last few years? They play a rather limited schedule. Because Dartmouth beat UNH? The CAA and UNH sure aren’t what they used to be.
I would love to see the Ivy’s in the playoffs.It would be good for FCS football but until they do, we really don’t know how good they are and claiming that Dartmouth can play with the top FCS teams is skeptical.

I thought Princeton and Dartmouth were top 10 a few years ago, Would be hard to prove that though when you don’t participate in the playoffs

[Daytripper]

Incarnate Word is slowly putting together a pretty good resume. Since losing their opening game 41-44 on the road to Youngstown St., they have ticked off five wins in a row including a FBS scalp in Texas State. They have yet to score less than 31 points in a game. A November 6th matchup in San Antonio with Southeastern Louisiana could determine a playoff seed for the Southland.

[HootyHoo]

Call me crazy but perhaps Kennesaw State isn’t truly overrated at all. Their defense at least is very good. If they run the table, a top-10 ranking shouldn’t be out of the question.

Hooty is wise and full of knowledge. KSU is legit. However, if they continue to turn the ball over like they have, KS?U won't make a deep playoff run. Gotta clean it up.

[NY Crusader 2010]

How do we know the Ivy’s are getting better the last few years? They play a rather limited schedule. Because Dartmouth beat UNH? The CAA and UNH sure aren’t what they used to be.
I would love to see the Ivy’s in the playoffs. It would be good for FCS football but until they do, we really don’t know how good they are and claiming that Dartmouth can play with the top FCS teams is skeptical.

When I was in college, the Ivy league was basically this:

Penn and Harvard were very good. Yale was somewhere between good and very good. Brown had a good offense. Everyone else was basically the equivalent of Bucknell.

These days, the league is stronger through and through. One metric you could look at would be the Ivy's record against the Patriot. Stark difference between 2009 and today. And we've gone full scholarship since then (not that it's helped our overall ranking in FCS).

The Ivy has definitely gotten stronger the last 10 years. One thing we'll never know without playoff participation is exactly how good the top teams in the Ivy are. Could Harvard be a Top 10- caliber team? Or do they belong at the tail end of the Top 25? We'll never know. Ivy's getting love in the Top 25: "We know you're good but we'll never know exactly how good" tip of the cap.

[Daytripper]

Hooty is wise and full of knowledge. KSU is legit. However, if they continue to turn the ball over like they have, KS?U won't make a deep playoff run. Gotta clean it up.

Good win for KSU. They will be making an appearance in my poll.

[semobison]

When I was in college, the Ivy league was basically this:

Penn and Harvard were very good. Yale was somewhere between good and very good. Brown had a good offense. Everyone else was basically the equivalent of Bucknell.

These days, the league is stronger through and through. One metric you could look at would be the Ivy's record against the Patriot. Stark difference between 2009 and today. And we've gone full scholarship since then (not that it's helped our overall ranking in FCS).

The Ivy has definitely gotten stronger the last 10 years. One thing we'll never know without playoff participation is exactly how good the top teams in the Ivy are. Could Harvard be a Top 10- caliber team? Or do they belong at the tail end of the Top 25? We'll never know. Ivy's getting love in the Top 25: "We know you're good but we'll never know exactly how good" tip of the cap.

The Patriot League sadly is a shell of what it was used to be. Beating up on today’s PL teams doesn’t say much!

[NY Crusader 2010]

I thought Princeton and Dartmouth were top 10 a few years ago, Would be hard to prove that though when you don’t participate in the playoffs

I forget the exact year but I believe the Top 2 in the Ivy finished #5 and #6 in FCS in Sagarin sometime in the 2015-2017 range. IIRC it was Harvard and Dartmouth that year though.

2018 was the year Colgate won the Lambert Cup and went to the FCS quarters against NDSU, after beating JMU in Round of 16. Princeton went 10-0 that year in what was a strong season for the Ivy. 4th place Yale beat natty semifinalist Maine during the season. Princeton was arguably a Top 10 FCS team that year. I think that's the season they beat Monmouth by 6 TDs.

I went to the 2019 Dartmouth-Princeton game at Yankee Stadium where Dartmouth won in what was the de facto Ivy Championship Game. IMO, based on the "eye test" both teams were lower-level Top 25 material, not sure where they finished in the polls or computers that year.

The highest an Ivy team has been ranked in Sagarin at end of season was when Ryan Fitzpatrick led Harvard to a 10-0 season in 2004. JMU was #1 with Harvard #2 in final computer ranking.

[POD Knows]

Call me crazy but perhaps Kennesaw State isn’t truly overrated at all. Their defense at least is very good. If they run the table, a top-10 ranking shouldn’t be out of the question.
I thought their D looked very good as well. Fast and physical. I won’t have them in the top 10 but close.

[caribbeanhen]

Incarnate Word is slowly putting together a pretty good resume. Since losing their opening game 41-44 on the road to Youngstown St., they have ticked off five wins in a row including a FBS scalp in Texas State. They have yet to score less than 31 points in a game. A November 6th matchup in San Antonio with Southeastern Louisiana could determine a playoff seed for the Southland.

I call them Incarnate Ward

[lionsrking2]

I call them Incarnate Ward

Good one.

[caribbeanhen]

Call me crazy but perhaps Kennesaw State isn’t truly overrated at all. Their defense at least is very good. If they run the table, a top-10 ranking shouldn’t be out of the question.

Kenny will be cracking my poll, I admit I was slow on the uptake on the lil darlins

[HootyHoo]

Kenny will be cracking my poll, I admit I was slow on the uptake on the lil darlins

Your ignorance is forgiven young grasshopper. Although merely being in the Tp 25 seems trite. Hooty requires a top 10 ranking. Just give Montana State the boot.

[POD Knows]

Your ignorance is forgiven young grasshopper. Although merely being in the Tp 25 seems trite. Hooty requires a top 10 ranking. Just give Montana State the boot.
You got the wrong “Montana” there swami.

[Daytripper]

You got the wrong “Montana” there swami.

^^^This^^^

[caribbeanhen]

Your ignorance is forgiven young grasshopper. Although merely being in the Tp 25 seems trite. Hooty requires a top 10 ranking. Just give Montana State the boot.

make the playoffs and beat them and you got it

[HootyHoo]

make the playoffs and beat them and you got it

See that's the issue. KSU wants to host the bobcats in the quarters. Not travel to Bozeman in December. The last time the Owls went there it snowed more than I have ever seen in my life. A freaking Blizzard. No thank you.

And on the Montanas. It is my opinion that both of them are unworthy of a seed. I feel for the Griz, they have been felled by injuries. MSU is just incompetent. I came away from the Weber game unimpressed with both teams.

[WestCoastAggie]

See that's the issue. KSU wants to host the bobcats in the quarters. Not travel to Bozeman in December. The last time the Owls went there it snowed more than I have ever seen in my life. A freaking Blizzard. No thank you.

And on the Montanas. It is my opinion that both of them are unworthy of a seed. I feel for the Griz, they have been felled by injuries. MSU is just incompetent. I came away from the Weber game unimpressed with both teams.

You would think a triple option offense would work in cold weather, huh? However, those pitches are almost like passes. But that defense will travel.

- - - Updated - - -


See that's the issue. KSU wants to host the bobcats in the quarters. Not travel to Bozeman in December. The last time the Owls went there it snowed more than I have ever seen in my life. A freaking Blizzard. No thank you.

And on the Montanas. It is my opinion that both of them are unworthy of a seed. I feel for the Griz, they have been felled by injuries. MSU is just incompetent. I came away from the Weber game unimpressed with both teams.

Odds are the ASun will allow for that.

[HootyHoo]

You would think a triple option offense would work in cold weather, huh? However, those pitches are almost like passes. But that defense will travel.

- - - Updated - - -



Odds are the ASun will allow for that.

Oh we won that game in Bozeman. A fact our Big Sky brethren conveniently forget. IMO the Triple Option has a chance to come back in fashion. The advent of the RPO spread option and Air Raid has moved defenses away from the once traditional 4-3 base designed by Jimmy Johnson specifically to stop the Triple option. As DEs and LBs get smaller and faster to better adapt to high powered passing attacks, they become more vulnerable to the Option. Not saying everyone is going start running Triple, but it is effective against modern defenses. A&T would be a perfect program for the option.

[caribbeanhen]

Oh we won that game in Bozeman. A fact our Big Sky brethren conveniently forget. IMO the Triple Option has a chance to come back in fashion. The advent of the RPO spread option and Air Raid has moved defenses away from the once traditional 4-3 base designed by Jimmy Johnson specifically to stop the Triple option. As DEs and LBs get smaller and faster to better adapt to high powered passing attacks, they become more vulnerable to the Option. Not saying everyone is going start running Triple, but it is effective against modern defenses. A&T would be a perfect program for the option.

I thought the trend was everybody was moving away from TO

[HootyHoo]

I thought the trend was everybody was moving away from TO

Exactly, you gotta Zag when everybody else Zigs.

[Mocs123]

Generally I think of teams running the triple option as using it as an equalizer to bridge a talent gap, usually because of some sort of recruiting hurdles (such as higher academic admission standards, service academy's etc), KSU has no recruiting hurdles however and I wouldn't be surprised to see them move to another offensive scheme at some point.

A well executed triple option is a thing of beauty however and I'm sure it gives DC's nightmares

[MR. CHICKEN]

....ARMY BAFFLED WISCONSIN FO' 3 3/4 QUARTERS YESTERDAY...AN' AIR FORCE IS 6-1 BEAT BOISE.......NAVY.....ISN'T SO SHIP SHAPE DIS YEAR......AWQUE!

[Houndawg]

I forget the exact year but I believe the Top 2 in the Ivy finished #5 and #6 in FCS in Sagarin sometime in the 2015-2017 range. IIRC it was Harvard and Dartmouth that year though.

2018 was the year Colgate won the Lambert Cup and went to the FCS quarters against NDSU, after beating JMU in Round of 16. Princeton went 10-0 that year in what was a strong season for the Ivy. 4th place Yale beat natty semifinalist Maine during the season. Princeton was arguably a Top 10 FCS team that year. I think that's the season they beat Monmouth by 6 TDs.

I went to the 2019 Dartmouth-Princeton game at Yankee Stadium where Dartmouth won in what was the de facto Ivy Championship Game. IMO, based on the "eye test" both teams were lower-level Top 25 material, not sure where they finished in the polls or computers that year.

The highest an Ivy team has been ranked in Sagarin at end of season was when Ryan Fitzpatrick led Harvard to a 10-0 season in 2004. JMU was #1 with Harvard #2 in final computer ranking.

The Ivy league belongs in D2

[caribbeanhen]

The Ivy league belongs in D2

along with the rest of FCS when playing the MVFC

[ursus arctos horribilis]

Call me crazy but perhaps Kennesaw State isn’t truly overrated at all. Their defense at least is very good. If they run the table, a top-10 ranking shouldn’t be out of the question.

The guys have been making that statement on the podcast for several weeks now.

[uofmman1122]

See that's the issue. KSU wants to host the bobcats in the quarters. Not travel to Bozeman in December. The last time the Owls went there it snowed more than I have ever seen in my life. A freaking Blizzard. No thank you.

And on the Montanas. It is my opinion that both of them are unworthy of a seed. I feel for the Griz, they have been felled by injuries. MSU is just incompetent. I came away from the Weber game unimpressed with both teams.
Yeah, it sucks, but it's going to be like this probably for the rest of the year.

Our guys who got hurt and have been able to come back just keep reaggravating their injuries, and the guys who were sick are just shells of the players they were at the beginning of the season, but you can't get that lost mass back during the season.

We also just aren't going to suddenly get a competent QB, even if Cam comes back (although he's light years ahead of Brown).

It really sucks. We seem like a completely different team than the one that beat UW. The most crushing thing is that I really felt like this was finally the year we turned it all around.

[WestCoastAggie]

The guys have been making that statement on the podcast for several weeks now.
Their only issue is turnovers. Their defense won’t be able to bail them out as they were yesterday in the post season. A -3 turnover day is a recipe for disaster. However, that’s very fixable.

[ursus arctos horribilis]

Yeah, it sucks, but it's going to be like this probably for the rest of the year.

Our guys who got hurt and have been able to come back just keep reaggravating their injuries, and the guys who were sick are just shells of the players they were at the beginning of the season, but you can't get that lost mass back during the season.

We also just aren't going to suddenly get a competent QB, even if Cam comes back (although he's light years ahead of Brown).

It really sucks. We seem like a completely different team than the one that beat UW. The most crushing thing is that I really felt like this was finally the year we turned it all around.

I know you can not see it as you are not a voter but I made a post in that forum that was dead on with this one. Cam vs. Brown is zero difference to me. We have more upside now than we did before and we are 3 and out way too much with both of these guys right now and I can't even say that it is either one of their faults for that fact.

Good eye on everything yoou said though. We might scrap and scrape by but we are fairly screwed with this convergence of events lately and I don't see any brightness coming from it. We will sustain more injuries since our D seems to be playing too much compared to what the offense it playing. That is a tough way to try and heal up.

[uofmman1122]

I know you can not see it as you are not a voter but I made a post in that forum that was dead on with this one. Cam vs. Brown is zero difference to me. We have more upside now than we did before and we are 3 and out way too much with both of these guys right now and I can't even say that it is either one of their faults for that fact.

Good eye on everything yoou said though. We might scrap and scrape by but we are fairly screwed with this convergence of events lately and I don't see any brightness coming from it. We will sustain more injuries since our D seems to be playing too much compared to what the offense it playing. That is a tough way to try and heal up.
I honestly think the only thing that can save this season and this offense is Marcus Knight miraculously getting healthy enough to play and somehow not missing a beat.

I have no doubt that even with the QB struggles, if we had #21 this season, we'd likely be 6-0 right now. He is/was the stick the stirs the offensive drink on our team.

But like I said, that's not a very likely scenario, so I'm just hoping and praying we can somehow make the playoffs and beat state. Another 6-5 season isn't out of the realm of possibilities, either.

[Bobcat99]

I honestly think the only thing that can save this season and this offense is Marcus Knight miraculously getting healthy enough to play and somehow not missing a beat.

I have no doubt that even with the QB struggles, if we had #21 this season, we'd likely be 6-0 right now. He is/was the stick the stirs the offensive drink on our team.

But like I said, that's not a very likely scenario, so I'm just hoping and praying we can somehow make the playoffs and beat state. Another 6-5 season isn't out of the realm of possibilities, either.

A good RB wouldn’t fix the problem that is your OL.

Furthermore, Knight is a good back, but he isn’t elite. He got a lot of TD’s because of goal line volume, but shoot, he only averaged 4.5 yards per carry for the season. He’s solid, but he’s not as good as you Griz think he is. Ifanse in Bozeman is easily the superior RB.

But anyways, y’all got a crappy OL, and a defense that relies on a lot of trickery to succeed. That’ll work for the first few games before a lot of tape is out, but as we’re seeing, it doesn’t last all season long. You’re headed toward a few more losses this season yet. Maybe even enough to get Bobby fired.

[Go Lehigh TU Owl]

Few Thoughts...
- I didn't kill ETSU for what I consider a tough road loss to a rival. I'll be interested to see how the Bucs bounce back. I believe this has become a quality program...
- North Dakota has been a disappointment. They simply can't get over the hump. Despite what the Bison faithful will say, UND should be better...
- I have 3 Ivies ranked and will not apologize for it. They're legit...
- Delaware seems to be nearing the point of no return as a program. The 21st century EKU...
- VMI is finally "winning" me over...
- South Dakota might be the best team in the country RIGHT NOW. How is that possible?

[PantherRob82]

Few Thoughts...
- I didn't kill ETSU for what I consider a tough road loss to a rival. I'll be interested to see how the Bucs bounce back. I believe this has become a quality program...
- North Dakota has been a disappointment. They simply can't get over the hump. Despite what the Bison faithful will say, UND should be better...
- I have 3 Ivies ranked and will not apologize for it. They're legit...
- Delaware seems to be nearing the point of no return as a program. The 21st century EKU...
- VMI might finally be "winning" me over...
- South Dakota might be the best team in the country RIGHT NOW. How is that possible?

South Dakota played UNI so I'm not sure that counts. xlolx

[uofmman1122]

A good RB wouldn’t fix the problem that is your OL.

Furthermore, Knight is a good back, but he isn’t elite. He got a lot of TD’s because of goal line volume, but shoot, he only averaged 4.5 yards per carry for the season. He’s solid, but he’s not as good as you Griz think he is. Ifanse in Bozeman is easily the superior RB.

But anyways, y’all got a crappy OL, and a defense that relies on a lot of trickery to succeed. That’ll work for the first few games before a lot of tape is out, but as we’re seeing, it doesn’t last all season long. You’re headed toward a few more losses this season yet. Maybe even enough to get Bobby fired.
He is astronomically better than the guys who have played this season.

I don't give a single ***** about Ifanse. He has nothing to do with how awful our RBs are right now. Our OL was worse in 2019 than it is now.

Glad you joined the site to completely miss my point and be insufferable, though. You guys don't disappoint. xthumbsupx

[Go Green]

How do we know the Ivy’s are getting better the last few years? They play a rather limited schedule. Because Dartmouth beat UNH? The CAA and UNH sure aren’t what they used to bel.

Saying that Dartmouth "beat" UNH is being charitable. The game was never in doubt and Dartmouth dominated the Wildcats. While I agree that UNH has had better teams in the past, I'm not sure a lot of FCS teams would be able to do to UNH what Dartmouth did to them last Saturday...

[caribbeanhen]

Saying that Dartmouth "beat" UNH is being charitable. The game was never in doubt and Dartmouth dominated the Wildcats. While I agree that UNH has had better teams in the past, I'm not sure a lot of FCS teams would be able to do to UNH what Dartmouth did to them last Saturday...

Dartmouth is Villanova in green

[Bobcat99]

He is astronomically better than the guys who have played this season.

I don't give a single ***** about Ifanse. He has nothing to do with how awful our RBs are right now. Our OL was worse in 2019 than it is now.

Glad you joined the site to completely miss my point and be insufferable, though. You guys don't disappoint. xthumbsupx

You’re right. The Ifanse part was superfluous and unnecessary.

I’ll stick with the rest though. Knight is better than the others who have played, but he’s not some super great RB. Above average, and that’s about it.

[ursus arctos horribilis]

You’re right. The Ifanse part was superfluous and unnecessary.

I’ll stick with the rest though. Knight is better than the others who have played, but he’s not some super great RB. Above average, and that’s about it.

Agree with that. I think you pointed out earlier that the real problem is the O Line is having some trouble right now and I think this is a big problem as well. I don't know if it is illness or exactly what has gone on but right now those fellers are just not as forceful as they were early on.

[uofmman1122]

Agree with that. I think you pointed out earlier that the real problem is the O Line is having some trouble right now and I think this is a big problem as well. I don't know if it is illness or exactly what has gone on but right now those fellers are just not as forceful as they were early on.
Grizfan24 wrote a really great blog about everything that's going wrong with the offense right now (http://maroonbloodblog.com/2021/10/18/sacramento-state-rehash-what-happened-offensively/), and long story short, it's not just one thing. The O Line isn't playing as well as they should, but the simplified scheme is making their lives much harder.

Re: Knight, again though, he doesn't need to be an all american to unlock this offense. If any old RB could just easily score on short yardage situations, we wouldn't be having problems right now. He feasted on guys over-pursuing and cutting back for big chunks. Our guys now cannot do that.