From Big Sky Commish: New Automatic Bids = Expanded Playoff Discussion

[TexasTerror]

Significant FCS playoff news out of the Big Sky Conference media day... playoff expansion on the horizon?


https://twitter.com/SamHerderFCS/status/1419681463767687169

[SDFS]

So, they want to expand the field by 8 teams? or 4 teams with top #4 seeds getting a bye or 6 teams with top #2 seeds getting a bye. Seems like expand by 4 would be enough.

[Professor Chaos]

Don't like the idea... there would still be 12 autobids and 12 at-large with the new autos so it doesn't need to be expanded. The byes are well earned for the top 8 and playing 8 more playoff games on Thanksgiving weekend does not appeal to me at all. If they want to make the playoffs more "fair" they should keep the current format, de-regionalize it, and/or seed more teams. More teams in the playoffs will invariably lead to more regionalization in the playoffs.

[JSUSoutherner]

No.

There's enough teams in the playoffs that have no business being there already.

[VandalBasher]

Someone is looking to capture some of the potential money. This is good buzz for the FCS during a period of "SEC and P5 implosion" talk.

[POD Knows]

No.

There's enough teams in the playoffs that have no business being there already.Ditto X 1000

[DFW HOYA]

More at large= more bids for FCS's power five... and no one else.

[JacksFan40]

I’d say shrink the field but whatever.

[TheKingpin28]

I’d say shrink the field but whatever.

This!

I'd be down with going back to 20 teams, but if we cannot, 24 is more than enough.

Big Sky: 3-4
Big South: 2-3
CAA: 3-4
MVFC: 3-5
NEC: 1
OVC: 1
Patriot: 1
PFL: 1
SoCon: 1-3
Southland: 1
WACSUN: 2-3

19-27 teams every year with this model of projected AQs + ALs

MEAC probably does not get one now due to NCAT, BCU, and FAMU leaving
SWAC pseduo-abstains
Ivy abstains

[dgtw]

No.

There's enough teams in the playoffs that have no business being there already.

I agree, but it helps keep John Grass employed.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[KPSUL]

Reduce the number of autobids by requiring that a conference have nine or more football members. Conferences without nine, would be able to combine with another small conference to get 1 autobid - ala ASUN/WAC.

[NY Crusader 2010]

Keep it at 24.

[KPSUL]

Keep it at 24.

I agree. 20 makes no sense, you still need the same number of weekends. With 24 teams I like the bye weekend for the top 8 (seeded) teams and the 8 first round games for the remaining 16. In 2012 when there was a 20 team field there were only 4 1st round games, and it was hard to justify a 1st round bye for some of the teams (to include UNH).

16 worked well for years, but that genie is out of the lamp forever. No way are you going to get support from the vast majority of FCS schools for cutting the field by 1/3rd.

[Go Lehigh TU Owl]

I agree. 20 makes no sense, you still need the same number of weekends. With 24 teams I like the bye weekend for the top 8 (seeded) teams and the 8 first round games for the remaining 16. In 2012 when there was a 20 team field there were only 4 1st round games, and it was hard to justify a 1st round bye for some of the teams (to include UNH).

16 worked well for years, but that genie is out of the lamp forever. No way are you going to get support from the vast majority of FCS schools for cutting the field by 1/3rd.

I agree! I think 16 is the ideal number from a competitive standpoint but it's simply not going to happen at this point. I pray it stays at 24! I would hate to see the legit contenders, top 8 or so teams, have to play one or two or perhaps even three field fillers.

As bad as the PL has been top to bottom, I believe the league generally produces 7 or so teams a decade that have legit national aspirations. I hope those teams don't get lost in the shuffle. The PL is a "wonderful" enigma...

[DFW HOYA]

The PL is a "wonderful" enigma...

The last PL team with legit national aspirations was Colgate...in 2003.

[NY Crusader 2010]

The last PL team with legit national aspirations was Colgate...in 2003.

Lehigh in 2004 was very good. Lost at home to eventual champ JMU by a point, giving up go-ahead score on 4th and goal late.

Holy Cross in 2009 -- threw the kitchen sink at a definitely better all-around Villanova team that would ultimately win the FCS title. Had we managed to get a couple breaks that day and win that game, I really believe that we would've beaten UNH the next weekend in the snow and ended up in Williamsburg for a semi-final game. And I think that would've been a close loss. I also feel that our offenses in 2007 and 2008 were better than the one in '09 and had we won the league either year would've been a better rep for the Patriot League as far as being equipped to win a game.

Lehigh 2011 - this team was very good. Outclassed in the quarters by NDSU (who isn't) at the Fargo Dome after beating CAA champ Towson in Round of 16.

Colgate 2018 - the 2015 team kind of came out of nowhere to beat UNH and JMU and reach the quarters but the 2018 team was probably the best overall PL team since Lehigh in the mid-2000's or maybe even Colgate '03.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Fordham 2014 and 2015 (honorable mention) - made a lot of noise in regular season with a lot of scoring and FBS wins (Temple and Army) as well as Villanova but they never got that feather-in-the-cap playoff win. Beating the NEC champ SHU both years was nothing special at that time as a PL squad in the postseason. Eliminated by Towson and UNH those years and both games decided by north of 2 scores.

[Go Lehigh TU Owl]

The last PL team with legit national aspirations was Colgate...in 2003.

Sorry not even close. 2003 Colgate got a favorable draw which helped but there were other teams at that level imo that didn't get the path/home games.

2004 Lehigh and Lafayette were both nationally viable imo. Lehigh spent basically the entire year in the Top 10; lost to the eventual champ by 1 point. Lafayette was an excellent defensive team; pushed Delaware in Newark. (at large bid in a 16 team playoff equals national respect!)
2005 Lafayette imo was more formidable than Colgate. The 'Pards went down to Boone and played the eventual champ App State at a Top 10 level. (another at-large in a 16 team playoff)
2009 Holy Cross - Spent much of the year in the Top 20/15. Had a national name in Randolph at QB. Pushed eventual champ Villanova.

20-24 team playoff era
2011 Lehigh - Entered the season with lots of preseason hype after a very good 2010 season. Lived up the billing with a final Top 5 ranking in 2011 and had the Payton Award Runner-up in Lum. Could have made it to Frisco imo with a better path (not to Fargo) and no Spadola drama.
2013 Fordham - Beat Temple and Villanova, had a dynamic offense that garnered plenty of respect at the FCS level. Caught a hot Towson team in the playoffs in the second round on the road. The Rams were very much deserving of their at-large bid! And remains the PL's only at-large team during the 20/24 team expanded bracket.
2018 Colgate - One of the most dominant defenses ever in the PL. Could have advanced with a better draw, aka not having to travel to NDSU.

[Go Lehigh TU Owl]

Lehigh in 2004 was very good. Lost at home to eventual champ JMU by a point, giving up go-ahead score on 4th and goal late.

Holy Cross in 2009 -- threw the kitchen sink at a definitely better all-around Villanova team that would ultimately win the FCS title. Had we managed to get a couple breaks that day and win that game, I really believe that we would've beaten UNH the next weekend in the snow and ended up in Williamsburg for a semi-final game. And I think that would've been a close loss. I also feel that our offenses in 2007 and 2008 were better than the one in '09 and had we won the league either year would've been a better rep for the Patriot League as far as being equipped to win a game.

Lehigh 2011 - this team was very good. Outclassed in the quarters by NDSU (who isn't) at the Fargo Dome after beating CAA champ Towson in Round of 16.

Colgate 2018 - the 2015 team kind of came out of nowhere to beat UNH and JMU and reach the quarters but the 2018 team was probably the best overall PL team since Lehigh in the mid-2000's or maybe even Colgate '03.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Fordham 2014 and 2015 (honorable mention) - made a lot of noise in regular season with a lot of scoring and FBS wins (Temple and Army) as well as Villanova but they never got that feather-in-the-cap playoff win. Beating the NEC champ SHU both years was nothing special at that time as a PL squad in the postseason. Eliminated by Towson and UNH those years and both games decided by north of 2 scores.

Well said! 2013 Fordham was their best team imo! Beat Temple and Villanova and played with an edge all year. Fordham was never quite the same under Moorhead after Villanova beat them 50-6 in 2014.

I put 2014, 2015 Fordham and 2016 Lehigh under the same umbrella. Some really good wins, lots of talent but a sketchy defense and some untimely injuries cost them over the course of the season. All 3 teams were legit Top 20, maybe Top 15ish but had a couple ugly hiccups along the way....

Also, 2012 Lehigh spent basically the entire year in the Top 10, lost one game to Colgate and was left out of the playoffs with a 10-1 record. That was an egregious omission by the NCAA when you consider the context imo. The fact that Lehigh needed to go 3 straight years without a league loss was an absurd standard the playoff committee held the Mountain Hawks to. Especially, given the fact they'd proven themselves in 2010 and 2011.

Also forgot 2015 Colgate! Out kicked their coverage in the playoffs but still! Wins over UNH and JMU? They were far from a great team (escaped Lehigh and Fordham, lost 4 OOC games) but their playoff run created national equity.

[KPSUL]

Another incredible Thread interception by the Patriot League AGS Posters! Reminiscent of their dominant years 2012 - 2018!

[NY Crusader 2010]

Well said! 2013 Fordham was their best team imo! Beat Temple and Villanova and played with an edge all year. Fordham was never quite the same under Moorhead after Villanova beat them 50-6 in 2014.

I put 2014, 2015 Fordham and 2016 Lehigh under the same umbrella. Some really good wins, lots of talent but a sketchy defense and some untimely injuries cost them over the course of the season. All 3 teams were legit Top 20, maybe Top 15ish but had a couple ugly hiccups along the way....

Also, 2012 Lehigh spent basically the entire year in the Top 10, lost one game to Colgate and was left out of the playoffs with a 10-1 record. That was an egregious omission by the NCAA when you consider the context imo. The fact that Lehigh needed to go 3 straight years without a league loss was an absurd standard the playoff committee held the Mountain Hawks to. Especially, given the fact they'd proven themselves in 2010 and 2011.

Also forgot 2015 Colgate! Out kicked their coverage in the playoffs but still! Wins over UNH and JMU? They were far from a great team (escaped Lehigh and Fordham, lost 4 OOC games) but their playoff run created national equity.

I got the years mixed up with Fordham. I'm thinking of 2013 and 2014, not '14 and '15.

- - - Updated - - -


Another incredible Thread interception by the Patriot League AGS Posters! Reminiscent of their dominant years 2012 - 2018!

We should have posted this discussion in the Lafayette-UNH thread.

[atthewbon]

I really like 24. It rewards the top teams with a bye and makes it interesting by ensuring all of the best teams get a chance. As long as there are no more than 12 autobids I see no reason to change it.

[Libertine]

I think 24 is the perfect number for the same reasons as this guy ^^.

Also, 24 playoff teams out of 125 FCS programs is consistent with the ratio of participants in other NCAA championships at 19-23%. Nearly every other NCAA sport has been at that ratio of # of playoff participants / total # of teams for a while. FCS football was wildly under-represented at 16 teams (13%) for way too long.

[OhioHen]

The last PL team with legit national aspirations was Colgate...in 2003.

And they were on the losing end of the only Championship game shutout to date.

[ElCid]

I really like 24. It rewards the top teams with a bye and makes it interesting by ensuring all of the best teams get a chance. As long as there are no more than 12 autobids I see no reason to change it.

Yup.

I would have rather it stayed lower, but 24 has grown on me. A lot of folks think too many bad teams get in, but every conf deserves a chance with a slot. The large number of at larges also ensures that any team with a legit shot is not left out. No reason for more teams. As it is, about 1 in 5 of all teams are in, less for participating teams. Any talk or movement for more should be squashed. Why even play the season if you want nearly a third of participating teams in. Win during the season and you will get a shot.

[OhioHen]

Yup.

I would have rather it stayed lower, but 24 has grown on me. A lot of folks think too many bad teams get in, but every conf deserves a chance with a slot. The large number of at larges also ensures that any team with a legit shot is not left out. No reason for more teams. As it is, about 1 in 5 of all teams are in, less for participating teams. Any talk or movement for more should be squashed. Why even play the season if you want nearly a third of participating teams in. Win during the season and you will get a shot.

A question that should be posed to the NFL, NBA, and NHL. All of those leagues have far more than one third in the playoffs.

[TheKingpin28]

A question that should be posed to the NFL, NBA, and NHL. All of those leagues have far more than one third in the playoffs.

$$$

That's why they practically let in half of the field.

[Libertine]

And they were on the losing end of the only Championship game shutout to date.

After defeating A10 co-champ UMass, #6 Western Illinois from the Gateway and #4 (and FBS-bound) Florida Atlantic. Also, Delaware was just dominant and completely rolling over teams that year but got a wakeup call in the semifinals against Wofford, which was probably the worst thing that could have happened for Colgate. Colgate losing 40-0 in the national championship wasn't because the Patriot League hasn't been historically strong, it was because they went up against an opponent in the final that was strong on an historical level.

[NY Crusader 2010]

After defeating A10 co-champ UMass, #6 Western Illinois from the Gateway and #4 (and FBS-bound) Florida Atlantic. Also, Delaware was just dominant and completely rolling over teams that year but got a wakeup call in the semifinals against Wofford, which was probably the worst thing that could have happened for Colgate. Colgate losing 40-0 in the national championship wasn't because the Patriot League hasn't been historically strong, it was because they went up against an opponent in the final that was strong on an historical level.

The 2003 Delaware team was very good. Perhaps best in school history. But not one I'd put in the Top 10 all-time FCS. Outside of their I-AA playoff run, their signature win was against a decent Navy team that won 8-or-so games and went to a bowl game.