Buckle Your Seat Belts

[acbearkat]

Realignment talks are heating up, and will be a bumpy ride. The Big 12 is essentially dead, as Texas and Oklahoma are leaving and likely headed to the SEC. We'll likely see more realignment at the FCS level as well. I think within the next five years, the Southland Conference will go the way of the Southwest Conference and cease to exist. Despite what Texas A&M is saying publicly, there is nothing they can do to prevent Texas from joining the SEC, especially at the highest levels of politics in Texas, as our governor, Greg Abbott, is a UT alum.

[Daytripper]

Eventually it will be 4 16-team super conferences. Everybody not part of that should, instead of whining, take the opportunity to start a new non-super conference D1 system from scratch. There has been enough learned throughout the years regarding what works and doesn't work with regard to conference alignments, playoff structures, scholarship limits, TV/media rights, etc. to be able to create a tight regional group of conferences by combining the leftover P5 schools, the G5 schools and the top tier FCS schools. What the G5 doesn't want to admit is that most of their AD programs are much farther away from the upper tier P5 programs than the upper FCS is away from them.

[JALMOND]

Realignment talks are heating up, and will be a bumpy ride. The Big 12 is essentially dead, as Texas and Oklahoma are leaving and likely headed to the SEC. We'll likely see more realignment at the FCS level as well. I think within the next five years, the Southland Conference will go the way of the Southwest Conference and cease to exist. Despite what Texas A&M is saying publicly, there is nothing they can do to prevent Texas from joining the SEC, especially at the highest levels of politics in Texas, as our governor, Greg Abbott, is a UT alum.


A good point was brought up on Portland sports radio the other day about Kansas. Would a conference (they of course used the Pac-12) be willing to take the Jayhawk basketball program knowing it would boost your conference basketball profile, while at the same time knowing the Jayhawk football program could hurt your conference football profile.

[NHwildEcat]

Just a thought, I assume the Big 12 will go after some AAC programs. Likely just two, but maybe four? To back fill the AAC, would JMU be a target?

JMU leaving the CAA would just be the first step in what may finally be the split of the conference, with the America East schools ending up w/ a AE football conference...

[Daytripper]

A good point was brought up on Portland sports radio the other day about Kansas. Would a conference (they of course used the Pac-12) be willing to take the Jayhawk basketball program knowing it would boost your conference basketball profile, while at the same time knowing the Jayhawk football program could hurt your conference football profile.

I think they would take Kansas for the basketball. It would add an easy conference win for the other football teams.

[Daytripper]

Just a thought, I assume the Big 12 will go after some AAC programs. Likely just two, but maybe four? To back fill the AAC, would JMU be a target?

JMU leaving the CAA would just be the first step in what may finally be the split of the conference, with the America East schools ending up w/ a AE football conference...

I think the Big XII will actually cease to exist. The remaining parts after UT and OU leave will be dispersed among the (now) P4. Texas Tech to the PAC 12. Oklahoma State and Kansas State to the Big 10. TCU and Baylor to the ACC?

[F'N Hawks]

The Big 10 President's are pretty snooty when it comes to academics. They held their nose when admitting Nebraska, will they have to do it again?

[Laker]

The Big 10 President's are pretty snooty when it comes to academics. They held their nose when admitting Nebraska, will they have to do it again?

Both Iowa State and Kansa are AAU members, although I don't know if the BIG needs another school in Iowa. Nebraska was an AAU school until 2011 and probably wouldn't have gotten into the BIG if they hadn't been. Here is a list of the 64 schools who are members.

Association of American Universities - Wikipedia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Association_of_American_Universities)

[F'N Hawks]

Daytripper mentioned K State and O State....not academic powerhouses haha

[Daytripper]

Daytripper mentioned K State and O State....not academic powerhouses haha

Now that you mention it....

[F'N Hawks]

Now that you mention it....
Mention what?

[DFW HOYA]

Daytripper mentioned K State and O State....not academic powerhouses haha

The Big 12, er...8 ranked, academically (US News):

76. Baylor
80. Texas Christian
118. Iowa St.
124. Kansas
170. Kansas St.
187. Oklahoma St.
214. Texas Tech
241. West Virginia

[Daytripper]

The Big 12, er...8 ranked, academically (US News):

76. Baylor
80. Texas Christian
118. Iowa St.
124. Kansas
170. Kansas St.
187. Oklahoma St.
214. Texas Tech
241. West Virginia

None are AAU members. Likely deal-breaker, at least for the B1G. ACC might be the place for Baylor. Their basketball would fit in well.

[SDFS]

None are AAU members. Likely deal-breaker, at least for the B1G. ACC might be the place for Baylor. Their basketball would fit in well.

ISU and Kansas are both AAU member schools

[Daytripper]

ISU and Kansas are both AAU member schools

My mistake.

[Sir William]

I see WVU in the ACC before Baylor. Baylor is a better school, but WVU is a lot closer and has immediate rivalries with Pitt, Louisville and VA Tech.

[JSUSoutherner]

The SEC only poached Texas and Oklahoma to try to keep up with the ASUN obviously. xcoffeex

[SFA 93]

The WAC have some openings :)

[katss07]

Long term, what does this mean for the FCS? As the effects of realignment trickle down, could the Sun Belt/CUSA/MWC look at FCS schools a few years down the line in hopes of replacing departed institutions? Or will the Big 12 just disperse amongst the Power 4 and call it a day.

[NY Crusader 2010]

Just a thought, I assume the Big 12 will go after some AAC programs. Likely just two, but maybe four? To back fill the AAC, would JMU be a target?

JMU leaving the CAA would just be the first step in what may finally be the split of the conference, with the America East schools ending up w/ a AE football conference...

JMU would be way WAY WAYYYYY down the list of potential targets for the AAC.

[Libertine]

Long term, what does this mean for the FCS? As the effects of realignment trickle down, could the Sun Belt/CUSA/MWC look at FCS schools a few years down the line in hopes of replacing departed institutions? Or will the Big 12 just disperse amongst the Power 4 and call it a day.

I don't know that either of those things necessarily happen (even assuming that the Texas state legislature doesn't once again complicate a conference move by the U of Texas).

First, the Big XII has been the Big 8 before with a lot of the same players and, unlike 1994, they've got agency over their own TV negotiations and, unlike 2005, there's no rule that says you have to have "X" number of members to stage a conference championship game. That's not to say that the Big XII won't expand back to 10 or 12 teams, just that they don't absolutely have to.

Second, if you're the Big XII, what does expansion really buy you? The conference obviously loses a ton of prestige without Texas and Oklahoma but they're not replacing that prestige, fan base or market by adding Houston, SMU, Cincinnati, etc., At that point, they'd be the American Conference 2.0 and basically admitting to not being a power conference. I think the Big XII is better off doubling down on their remaining membership because, when it comes to the money sports (football and men's basketball), Texas has been a bad bet for a long, long time. On the other hand, Baylor (FB/BB), Kansas (BB), Iowa State (FB/BB) and TCU (FB), have been money.

Third, since they're no longer required to have 12 members to host a championship game, the G5 conferences don't need to line up and raid each other and the FCS like they did before. And, even if someone does get poached, they all have enough membership numbers to absorb a couple losses. The AAC has 11, C-USA has 14, the MAC has 12, the Mountain West has 11 and the Sun Belt is so confident in their current 10 members that they booted two fairly recently.

[NY Crusader 2010]

Long term, what does this mean for the FCS? As the effects of realignment trickle down, could the Sun Belt/CUSA/MWC look at FCS schools a few years down the line in hopes of replacing departed institutions? Or will the Big 12 just disperse amongst the Power 4 and call it a day.

Interesting question. There will definitely be a few schools left behind. Hypothetically you could have the following take place:

1) Texas and Oklahoma to the SEC => the first domino
2) Texas Tech, OK State, Baylor and TCU join the Pac 12 to make it the Pac 16
3) We're left with the Big 6 => Kansas, Kansas State, Iowa State and West Virginia are left
4) Unless the Great Plains schools cater to them and look to join forces with some more Eastern schools (Cincinnati & Memphis perhaps), West Virginia is out IMO. They could lobby alongside UCONN to try and get the ACC to expand to 16, or they could go into the AAC.
5) Kansas, Kansas State and Iowa State, if left on an island, could try to keep the Big XII alive (maybe call it the Big Eight again since they won't get to 12 teams anytime soon) and bring in some combination of Boise State, Houston, SMU, BYU, UNLV, Colorado State and New Mexico. Wichita State football?
6) Kansas, IF they are lucky enough to get invited to the Big Ten, would be #15 there. Who would be #16? Could even be Iowa State.

There are so many dominoes here that could go a multitude of different ways that it's difficult to project how it all ends up. AAC could end up getting stronger (imagine if they got West Virginia in), or could get completely gutted. The Pac 12 hasn't formally invited the other Texas and OK schools yet. They could take none, they could take 2, they could take 4. We don't know. None of the other P5 conferences HAVE to expand to 16 just because the SEC does.

[DFW HOYA]

Maybe someone B1G might get interested.

https://twitter.com/MikeLeslieWFAA/status/1418749742150946816 (https://twitter.com/MikeLeslieWFAA/status/1418749742150946816)

[acbearkat]

Interesting question. There will definitely be a few schools left behind. Hypothetically you could have the following take place:

1) Texas and Oklahoma to the SEC => the first domino
2) Texas Tech, OK State, Baylor and TCU join the Pac 12 to make it the Pac 16
3) We're left with the Big 6 => Kansas, Kansas State, Iowa State and West Virginia are left
4) Unless the Great Plains schools cater to them and look to join forces with some more Eastern schools (Cincinnati & Memphis perhaps), West Virginia is out IMO. They could lobby alongside UCONN to try and get the ACC to expand to 16, or they could go into the AAC.
5) Kansas, Kansas State and Iowa State, if left on an island, could try to keep the Big XII alive (maybe call it the Big Eight again since they won't get to 12 teams anytime soon) and bring in some combination of Boise State, Houston, SMU, BYU, UNLV, Colorado State and New Mexico. Wichita State football?
6) Kansas, IF they are lucky enough to get invited to the Big Ten, would be #15 there. Who would be #16? Could even be Iowa State.

There are so many dominoes here that could go a multitude of different ways that it's difficult to project how it all ends up. AAC could end up getting stronger (imagine if they got West Virginia in), or could get completely gutted. The Pac 12 hasn't formally invited the other Texas and OK schools yet. They could take none, they could take 2, they could take 4. We don't know. None of the other P5 conferences HAVE to expand to 16 just because the SEC does.

Baylor to the Pac I believe is unlikely. In the last round of realignment, they refused BYU entry because of BYU’s stance on homosexuality. Baylor has the exact same stance.


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[acbearkat]

I don't know that either of those things necessarily happen (even assuming that the Texas state legislature doesn't once again complicate a conference move by the U of Texas).

First, the Big XII has been the Big 8 before with a lot of the same players and, unlike 1994, they've got agency over their own TV negotiations and, unlike 2005, there's no rule that says you have to have "X" number of members to stage a conference championship game. That's not to say that the Big XII won't expand back to 10 or 12 teams, just that they don't absolutely have to.

Second, if you're the Big XII, what does expansion really buy you? The conference obviously loses a ton of prestige without Texas and Oklahoma but they're not replacing that prestige, fan base or market by adding Houston, SMU, Cincinnati, etc., At that point, they'd be the American Conference 2.0 and basically admitting to not being a power conference. I think the Big XII is better off doubling down on their remaining membership because, when it comes to the money sports (football and men's basketball), Texas has been a bad bet for a long, long time. On the other hand, Baylor (FB/BB), Kansas (BB), Iowa State (FB/BB) and TCU (FB), have been money.

Third, since they're no longer required to have 12 members to host a championship game, the G5 conferences don't need to line up and raid each other and the FCS like they did before. And, even if someone does get poached, they all have enough membership numbers to absorb a couple losses. The AAC has 11, C-USA has 14, the MAC has 12, the Mountain West has 11 and the Sun Belt is so confident in their current 10 members that they booted two fairly recently.

The legislature is trying to prevent Texas from leaving the Big 12, but they won’t succeed. They’re in a special session right now, but can’t do much of anything, because the Democrats fled the state to avoid what will be certain defeat when it comes to the election bill. Greg Abbott is a Texas alum, and won’t do a thing to prevent Texas from leaving. The University of Texas, from the top down, is in the best shape it’s been in a long time. Everyone from the chancellor to the boosters are in lockstep, and that hasn’t happened in years. Everyone at UT is pulling in the same direction in terms of the football program. The baseball program, which is arguably as important as football on campus, was just three wins away last month from its seventh national championship.


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[atthewbon]

This definitely has the feeling that it could effect many fcs programs once the dominos fall. It seems like there have been a lot of secret discussions over the last several months and it’s all coming out now. I wouldn’t be surprised to see some “super” conferences forming. The SEC is already there but I could see the big ten trying to expand. Kansas and Iowa st make the most sense because they are AAU certified and it seems like they could be without a conference soon. But I’m not sure how much the big ten would actually want to do this. Sure Kansas helps out the basketball prestige but I don’t think either program will help get a better tv deal and make each school more money, which is what this is ultimately all about. I’ve heard rumors that the Big Ten has had talks with some pac12 schools (UCLA, USC, and Oregon) This makes sense because it gets the conference into a new a major market (LA) and the school already have a relation with FOX (same as the big ten).

I think there is a possibility nothing happens and the rest of the big 12 stays together because there is no incentive for power conferences to add someone just for the sake of adding someone, they would have to move the needle and make money. But I would also not be surprised if he see large national conferences (like the west coast teams joint the big ten) because this is ultimately all about money.

Whatever happens there is a good chance this will have an effect on the fcs. If 4 16-team super conferences form like some people are predicting I would not be surprised if they separate themselves from the ncaa or at least the current group of five. Then maybe the group of five along with what seem to be the top 5 fcs conferences (mvfc, caa, big Sky, ASUN, and, WAC) join together and play for a 24 team playoff with 10 auto bids. I know this isn’t likely to happen (most likely just a few individual teams will move up) but with how fast all of this is developing who knows?

[NY Crusader 2010]

Baylor to the Pac I believe is unlikely. In the last round of realignment, they refused BYU entry because of BYU’s stance on homosexuality. Baylor has the exact same stance.


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That makes sense. The really heavily religious institutions (BYU, Baylor, Liberty) definitely may continue to have trouble finding homes for that reason. Maybe the PAC 12 just takes TTU and OK State, stopping at 14.

Then you'd have 7 remaining Big XII schools => Baylor, TCU, Iowa State, Kansas, Kansas State, West Virginia.

Then you'd have enough meat on the bone to possibly create a 12-team league (or more), inviting some combination of UCF, USF, Cincinnati, Memphis, Colorado State, Boise State, BYU, Houston and SMU. Interesting.

[Daytripper]

That makes sense. The really heavily religious institutions (BYU, Baylor, Liberty) definitely may continue to have trouble finding homes for that reason. Maybe the PAC 12 just takes TTU and OK State, stopping at 14.

Then you'd have 7 remaining Big XII schools => Baylor, TCU, Iowa State, Kansas, Kansas State, West Virginia.

Then you'd have enough meat on the bone to possibly create a 12-team league (or more), inviting some combination of UCF, USF, Cincinnati, Memphis, Colorado State, Boise State, BYU, Houston and SMU. Interesting.

That would be a solid football conference, especially with Cincinnati, UH, BYU and SMU. It would be an excellent basketball conference. Maybe one of the best basketball conferences in the country.

[F'N Hawks]

Seems to me the big boys want to get to 4 super conferences. Tells me the Big 12 is gone.

[Go Green]

Baylor to the Pac I believe is unlikely. In the last round of realignment, they refused BYU entry because of BYU’s stance on homosexuality. Baylor has the exact same stance.


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That certainly was part of the story.

But the other parts were 1) BYU's refusal to play games on Sundays and 2) BYU's academic research programs weren't Pac-12 material.

[Go Lehigh TU Owl]

I'll try to expand upon this later when i have more time but Temple is in a tenuous spot if the AAC falls. We're a geographical outlier and somewhat of an institutional outlier given our urban, "commuterish" history which has always contributed to so-so alumni, student and local Philly support.

I do believe we align "somewhat" with the ACC but i simply can't see happening without a big push from PA legislature. And they've proven over and over that outside of PSU everyone is fighting their own battles....

Could Temple drop football and go all in on a basketball centric league? The idea was on the table 20 years ago...

[katss07]

That Mountain West logo will look pretty cool on the field at McLane Stadium up in Waco.

[Sitting Bull]

In terms of FCS consequences, I could see potentially the Eastern Seaboard version of the MAC.

it would be a mid tier “G5” that could include:
Army
Navy
UMass
UConn
Temple
Villanova
Delaware
JMU
W&M
Richmond
pick 2 more

[NY Crusader 2010]

Lehigh Owl / Sitting Bull -- I don't see the AAC getting blown apart that badly. They could possibly lose 4-5 schools at most but they have a lot of solid options to backfill and maintain a strong conference - I think the likes of Air Force (as FB affiliate), Rice, Southern Miss, UAB, Charlotte, Buffalo and Marshall could all be adequate additions there, if needed.

Temple will be fine. And Army and Navy would never play in an Eastern-seaboard-based MAC-level league. They actively choose schedules that consistently log as much travel as any schools in the country not named Hawaii. This is for military recruitment purposes and to play games close to active bases. Navy chose to be in the AAC West Division for this reason. And Army and Navy playing in a football conference together would create logistics issues for the Army-Navy game. Remember this game is played in a standalone television slot a week AFTER championship week.

[katss07]

I think it’s more likely that the CAA in it’s entirety gets “promoted” to the G5 when the big P5/P4 split happens than the AAC blowing up to such an extent that there’s a need for a new NE conference to form...

[UAalum72]

I think it’s more likely that the CAA in it’s entirety gets “promoted” to the G5 when the big P5/P4 split happens than the AAC blowing up to such an extent that there’s a need for a new NE conference to form...
Not unless they drop/suspend the attendance/stadium size requirements for FBS. Half the CAA stadiums are nowhere near big enough - Albany, Stony Brook, ‘nova, Rhode Island, W&M, Richmond, and Elon

[katss07]

Not unless they drop/suspend the attendance/stadium size requirements for FBS. Half the CAA stadiums are nowhere near big enough - Albany, Stony Brook, ‘nova, Rhode Island, W&M, Richmond, and Elon
If the P5/P4 do indeed breakaway, I believe that requirement would be dropped. I’m no insider, but I can’t imagine the current D1 football structure would remain in tact beyond that split.

[KPSUL]

I think it’s more likely that the CAA in it’s entirety gets “promoted” to the G5 when the big P5/P4 split happens than the AAC blowing up to such an extent that there’s a need for a new NE conference to form...

Interesting thought, but I don't think most of the team would want to move to G5 - I 'm virtual sure that UNH would not and even after not making the playoffs in 2018 or 19, we still have the 2nd best win/lost conference record during the past decade. JMU is the obvious exception. Except for JMU and Delaware, no one else has a stadium even close to the size required for FBS - Maine has donated funds that are probably sufficient to build a quality stadium that could exceed 20,000, but the experiences of Massachusetts and Connecticut should dissuade any New England team from moving to G5. Many schools have made recent investments in upgrading their stadium to better quality FCS size facilities this includes UNH, Richmond, W&M; URI is in the process now. SB already has a nice FCS size quality facility. URI a was considering moving to the NEC not all that long ago to cut down on travel and be more competitive W&M is showing up on several of the G5 speculation lists - I doubt they would have any interest, nor would Elon.

[DFW HOYA]

Could Temple drop football and go all in on a basketball centric league? The idea was on the table 20 years ago...

What would be gained by that? Is there a single example of a school that dropped Division I football and became a more prominent basketball program as a result? Because the evidence shows that a school which drops football tends to diminish sports in general.

Some examples:

Santa Clara (1992): No NCAA appearances since 1996.
Cal-State Fullerton (1993): Two NCAA tournament appearances since, first round losses.
Boston University (1997): Two NCAA tournament appearances since, first round losses.
Cal-State Northridge (2001): Two NCAA tournament appearances since, first round losses.
Fairfield (2002): No NCAA basketball appearances since dropping football
St. John's (2003): While not a direct correlation with football, St. John's has posted just three NCAA bids in the last 18 years.
St. Peter's (2006): One NCAA appearance since.
LaSalle (2007): One NCAA appearance since.
Hofstra (2007): No NCAA basketball appearances since dropping football.
Northeastern (2009): Two NCAA tournament appearances since, first round losses.
Evansville (2012): No NCAA basketball appearances since dropping football.
Jacksonville (2019): No NCAA basketball appearances since dropping football.

Playing in the A-10 again isn't worth it.

[Sitting Bull]

Not unless they drop/suspend the attendance/stadium size requirements for FBS. Half the CAA stadiums are nowhere near big enough - Albany, Stony Brook, ‘nova, Rhode Island, W&M, Richmond, and Elon

I don’t believe there is a stadium size requirement or attendance anymore. It was 30,000 when the original split to 1AA was created but it didn’t stop the MAC where less than half the teams even met that, many still don’t. ODU moved up with a stadium that seats 19,000 still today. W&M is 13,000 and could add back end zones up to 18,000 if they needed.

Of those you mention, UAlbany, Richmond and URI would be biggest issues with all their stadiums below 9,000.

[Sitting Bull]

Lehigh Owl / Sitting Bull -- I don't see the AAC getting blown apart that badly. They could possibly lose 4-5 schools at most but they have Kopp a lot of solid options to backfill and maintain a strong conference - I think the likes of Air Force (as FB affiliate), Rice, Southern Miss, UAB, Charlotte, Buffalo and Marshall could all be adequate additions there, if needed.

Temple will be fine. And Army and Navy would never play in an Eastern-seaboard-based MAC-level league. They actively choose schedules that consistently log as much travel as any schools in the country not named Hawaii. This is for military recruitment purposes and to play games close to active bases. Navy chose to be in the AAC West Division for this reason. And Army and Navy playing in a football conference together would create logistics issues for the Army-Navy game. Remember this game is played in a standalone television slot a week AFTER championship week.

If you look at Army’s future schedules, you could argue playing in a league like this would be an upgrade.

For Navy, they will hang on as long as they can but with this latest change toward semi pro status, they will eventually run out of power teams to play.

Temple, UMass and UConn really don’t have many options. A league like this would actually help them. So take out Navy, add ODU and maybe 2 other teams, it could be viable. Maybe UNH.

[NY Crusader 2010]

I don’t believe there is a stadium size requirement or attendance anymore. It was 30,000 when the original split to 1AA was created but it didn’t stop the MAC where less than half the teams even met that, many still don’t. ODU moved up with a stadium that seats 19,000 still today. W&M is 13,000 and could add back end zones up to 18,000 if they needed.

Of those you mention, UAlbany, Richmond and URI would be biggest issues with all their stadiums below 9,000.

This is correct. And the attendance "requirement" hasn't been enforced in 35 years.

[NY Crusader 2010]

I think it’s more likely that the CAA in it’s entirety gets “promoted” to the G5 when the big P5/P4 split happens than the AAC blowing up to such an extent that there’s a need for a new NE conference to form...

I don't think this is going to happen. The "split" is already there. What's left of the Big XII, MWC and the AAC will ride the coattails of the P4 into the semi-pro world as much as they can, and currently have enough schools with sufficient clout to do so. But the MAC, Sun Belt and C-USA are already marginalized, if not on paper. These conference champs, even if undefeated, wouldn't be considered for the CFP. And even their dreams of getting bowl games against legacy programs is a farce. The bowl system is rigged to have all the G5 schools just playing each other.

Look at Coastal Carolina last year. Had a once-in-a-generation type season. Went 11-0 in the regular season, including a win over #13 BYU. And they got rewarded with an appearance in the Cure Bowl against LIBERTY. Might as well have just re-named the game the BIG SOUTH CHAMPIONSHIP.

[ursus arctos horribilis]

Realignment talks are heating up, and will be a bumpy ride. The Big 12 is essentially dead, as Texas and Oklahoma are leaving and likely headed to the SEC. We'll likely see more realignment at the FCS level as well. I think within the next five years, the Southland Conference will go the way of the Southwest Conference and cease to exist. Despite what Texas A&M is saying publicly, there is nothing they can do to prevent Texas from joining the SEC, especially at the highest levels of politics in Texas, as our governor, Greg Abbott, is a UT alum.

Great discussion to have you bring to AGS but it is not FCS so please make sure in the future to place these sorts of topics in the Other Sports area.xthumbsupx

[NY Crusader 2010]

I think they would take Kansas for the basketball. It would add an easy conference win for the other football teams.

Here's my question. If the Big Ten hasn't found the need to add mighty Kansas before 2021, why now? At any point over the last 30 years the Big Ten could've invited Kansas and they would have jumped. KU didn't even come up in conversation the last 2 rounds of expansion. Why would they invite them now only because they feel bad that the school has nowhere else to go? Kansas be may about to become the UCONN of Middle America.

Again, there's nothing FORCING the other power conferences to expand to 16. SEC is doing it because Texas and Oklahoma are kicking in their front door, 2 of the top 10 most prestigious CFB programs in the country. Much different than Kansas and Iowa State crawling to the back patio of the Big Ten begging for a handout. As far as Texas Tech and OK State going to the Pac 12, at least there were talks of this taking place during the last round of expansion in 2013. But ultimately it didn't take place as the Big XII schools decided to fall in line behind Texas.

[WestCoastAggie]

Here's my question. If the Big Ten hasn't found the need to add mighty Kansas before 2021, why now? At any point over the last 30 years the Big Ten could've invited Kansas and they would have jumped. KU didn't even come up in conversation the last 2 rounds of expansion. Why would they invite them now only because they feel bad that the school has nowhere else to go? Kansas be may about to become the UCONN of Middle America.

Again, there's nothing FORCING the other power conferences to expand to 16. SEC is doing it because Texas and Oklahoma are kicking in their front door, 2 of the top 10 most prestigious CFB programs in the country. Much different than Kansas and Iowa State crawling to the back patio of the Big Ten begging for a handout. As far as Texas Tech and OK State going to the Pac 12, at least there were talks of this taking place during the last round of expansion in 2013. But ultimately it didn't take place as the Big XII schools decided to fall in line behind Texas.

It's going to be "get in where you fit in," as these P5 schools get in formation as they leave the NCAA to form their own super league for football and basketball. This will leave major fissures in American amateur athletics.

[Panther88]

The thread can be closed from the ut-austin side of the house.

baylor/tx tech alums/et al state legislators (33?) had a closed door session w/ the ut-austin alum governor where a bill was proposed late last week detailing that "no state public school will be allowed to change athletic conference affiliation w/out state legislative approval." So, ut-austin having a potential move to the SEC will require tx legislative approval. Cannot speak for what OU will do.

I find it truly laughable how tx public schools, not penned d-1 FBS, are irrelevant and unimportant in the overall state landscape, for the most part. SFA, SHSU, Lamar changed athletic conference affiliation almost over night w/out a mere mention on the major airways about texas yet alone garner attention from local legislative branches. xlolx

[acbearkat]

The thread can be closed from the ut-austin side of the house.

baylor/tx tech alums/et al state legislators (33?) had a closed door session w/ the ut-austin alum governor where a bill was proposed late last week detailing that "no state public school will be allowed to change athletic conference affiliation w/out state legislative approval." So, ut-austin having a potential move to the SEC will require tx legislative approval. Cannot speak for what OU will do.

I find it truly laughable how tx public schools, not penned d-1 FBS, are irrelevant and unimportant in the overall state landscape, for the most part. SFA, SHSU, Lamar changed athletic conference affiliation almost over night w/out a mere mention on the major airways about texas yet alone garner attention from local legislative branches. xlolx

The bill will never see the light of day. It requires the governor to put on the special session docket, and from what I’ve heard, Governor Abbott has been in on this thing from the start. The move has the approval of the governor, and he’s not stopping it. All the legislature is doing is grandstanding, and right now, that’s all they can do because they can’t vote on anything.


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[Go Green]

What would be gained by that? Is there a single example of a school that dropped Division I football and became a more prominent basketball program as a result? Because the evidence shows that a school which drops football tends to diminish sports in general.

Some examples:

Santa Clara (1992): No NCAA appearances since 1996.
Cal-State Fullerton (1993): Two NCAA tournament appearances since, first round losses.
Boston University (1997): Two NCAA tournament appearances since, first round losses.
Cal-State Northridge (2001): Two NCAA tournament appearances since, first round losses.
Fairfield (2002): No NCAA basketball appearances since dropping football
St. John's (2003): While not a direct correlation with football, St. John's has posted just three NCAA bids in the last 18 years.
St. Peter's (2006): One NCAA appearance since.
LaSalle (2007): One NCAA appearance since.
Hofstra (2007): No NCAA basketball appearances since dropping football.
Northeastern (2009): Two NCAA tournament appearances since, first round losses.
Evansville (2012): No NCAA basketball appearances since dropping football.
Jacksonville (2019): No NCAA basketball appearances since dropping football.

Playing in the A-10 again isn't worth it.

While I acknowledge that the weight of evidence is on your side, proponents of the "drop football to help basketball" theory usually cite St. Mary's.

[Go Lehigh TU Owl]

While I acknowledge that the weight of evidence is on your side, proponents of the "drop football to help basketball" theory usually cite St. Mary's.

I think it comes down to what the AAC looks like once the dust settles. For a program like Temple, there has to be justification to continue on from an institutional and state level. The idea of an on-campus stadium was shot down so Temple is relegated to being extorted for Jeffrey Lurie and the Eagles for what appears to be "ever". The state has offered Temple (or any state schools not named Penn State) very little financial backing or at the very least, "positive public sentiment". Right now 6 of the PSAC schools are currently transitioning into 2 new centrally governed institutions.

If Temple is forced to join a league with FIU, FAU, Georgia State, Tulsa, JMU, Marshall, East Carolina, UMass, Coastal Carolina etc I don't see it as a sustainable model. We lack the student, alumni and community support to make it work. The program is already teetering on returning to its 1990s losing ways to due constant coaching turnover and lack of leadership at the top; new President and still no permanent AD (Fran Dunphy is our acting one and he has zero ambition). The basketball program has also been nothing more than Bubblish/NITish for the last 20 years too. It hasn't spent a week in the Top 25 in 9 years (first week of March 2012).

[Panther88]

The bill will never see the light of day. It requires the governor to put on the special session docket, and from what I’ve heard, Governor Abbott has been in on this thing from the start. The move has the approval of the governor, and he’s not stopping it. All the legislature is doing is grandstanding, and right now, that’s all they can do because they can’t vote on anything.


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The human in the governor seat of texas certainly is in an odd position, considering. His legislative buds - baylor/tx tech/tcu alums are up in arms regarding ut-austin's possible departure from the big xii. Naturally, this is a pushback move and the non-orange people do not want the orange people to leave their current conference.

It's interesting watching both sides at play pushing their own narrative. Any guess for the near future is just that, a guess.

[NY Crusader 2010]

What would be gained by that? Is there a single example of a school that dropped Division I football and became a more prominent basketball program as a result? Because the evidence shows that a school which drops football tends to diminish sports in general.

Some examples:

Santa Clara (1992): No NCAA appearances since 1996.
Cal-State Fullerton (1993): Two NCAA tournament appearances since, first round losses.
Boston University (1997): Two NCAA tournament appearances since, first round losses.
Cal-State Northridge (2001): Two NCAA tournament appearances since, first round losses.
Fairfield (2002): No NCAA basketball appearances since dropping football
St. John's (2003): While not a direct correlation with football, St. John's has posted just three NCAA bids in the last 18 years.
St. Peter's (2006): One NCAA appearance since.
LaSalle (2007): One NCAA appearance since.
Hofstra (2007): No NCAA basketball appearances since dropping football.
Northeastern (2009): Two NCAA tournament appearances since, first round losses.
Evansville (2012): No NCAA basketball appearances since dropping football.
Jacksonville (2019): No NCAA basketball appearances since dropping football.

Playing in the A-10 again isn't worth it.

Your 1000% correct.

St. Mary's and Pacific are really the only examples that would provide contrarian evidence to your point. And Pacific really only had a quick moment in the Sun with Olowakandi. They got into the WCC but haven't been anything special.

And of course a little school called Villanova is doing JUST FINE competing at the highest level both in major college basketball and FCS football.

[Go Lehigh TU Owl]

What would be gained by that? Is there a single example of a school that dropped Division I football and became a more prominent basketball program as a result? Because the evidence shows that a school which drops football tends to diminish sports in general.

Some examples:

Santa Clara (1992): No NCAA appearances since 1996.
Cal-State Fullerton (1993): Two NCAA tournament appearances since, first round losses.
Boston University (1997): Two NCAA tournament appearances since, first round losses.
Cal-State Northridge (2001): Two NCAA tournament appearances since, first round losses.
Fairfield (2002): No NCAA basketball appearances since dropping football
St. John's (2003): While not a direct correlation with football, St. John's has posted just three NCAA bids in the last 18 years.
St. Peter's (2006): One NCAA appearance since.
LaSalle (2007): One NCAA appearance since.
Hofstra (2007): No NCAA basketball appearances since dropping football.
Northeastern (2009): Two NCAA tournament appearances since, first round losses.
Evansville (2012): No NCAA basketball appearances since dropping football.
Jacksonville (2019): No NCAA basketball appearances since dropping football.

Playing in the A-10 again isn't worth it.

None of those schools had to pay an exorbitant fee to rent a stadium 20 minutes from campus. Temple would draw 5-10k for games against FIU, FAU, UMass, Buffalo etc. I just don't see how Temple football stays afloat in a watered down league at this point.

[JacksFan40]

If Texas and Oklahoma go to the SEC I’d bet the house that West Virginia joins the ACC. I’d imagine the Big 12 would invite Houston, SMU, and possibly Boise State to try and make up the losses. That’s assuming nobody else tries to jump to the PAC-12 or Big 10.
In another impossibly impossible scenario NDSU and SDSU jump straight to the Big 12 as they are already wrestling members. Again I said impossible but let me dream dammit.

[walliver]

The Big Ten, ACC, and PAC-12 don't need to add anyone at this time.
The ACC would love Notre Dame as a full member, but West Virginia doesn't add much to the conference.
The Big Ten network is doing well financially, and picking up Big XII leftovers doesn't add much.
The PAC-12 could expand its footprint picking up a Texas school, but a conference in three time zones is a stretch.

I suspect the Big XII brings in Houston and maybe UCF. The AAC has no real need to replace them. Notre Dame continues as an ACC affiliate in football, but not full member. Clemson and FSU stay in the ACC

[tigonian02]

I think the Big XII will actually cease to exist. The remaining parts after UT and OU leave will be dispersed among the (now) P4. Texas Tech to the PAC 12. Oklahoma State and Kansas State to the Big 10. TCU and Baylor to the ACC?

The B12 will remain alive. The SEC will have their 16 teams. The B10 won’t take any schools not in AAU status. The Pac12 may take a few schools…maybe. Point is, there will be schools left in the B12, and those schools will raid the AAC. Even with a depleted media contract, it will still be a little more than the AAC contract. The same won’t be said for the AAC contract once Memphis, Houston, Cincy, and UCF go away. I think the AAC will still be able to pull from CUSA and maybe the Sunbelt, but it wouldn’t be as easy as before. Also, if the AAC goes after markets again, they will turn into CUSA 3.0, making the Sunbelt arguably the best G5 at that point.

[tigonian02]

Long term, what does this mean for the FCS? As the effects of realignment trickle down, could the Sun Belt/CUSA/MWC look at FCS schools a few years down the line in hopes of replacing departed institutions? Or will the Big 12 just disperse amongst the Power 4 and call it a day.

I can’t speak for CUSA or MWC, but the Sunbelt is making moves not to be the fcs call up conference anymore. Will it work? (Shrugs)… ultimately the belt is looking to pull in 2 of Marshall, USM, UAB if they aren’t taken by the AAC. CUSA has 14 schools and so they are 4 schools over maximizing CFP playoff money. They can afford to lose quite a bit.

[tigonian02]

Lehigh Owl / Sitting Bull -- I don't see the AAC getting blown apart that badly. They could possibly lose 4-5 schools at most but they have a lot of solid options to backfill and maintain a strong conference - I think the likes of Air Force (as FB affiliate), Rice, Southern Miss, UAB, Charlotte, Buffalo and Marshall could all be adequate additions there, if needed.

Temple will be fine. And Army and Navy would never play in an Eastern-seaboard-based MAC-level league. They actively choose schedules that consistently log as much travel as any schools in the country not named Hawaii. This is for military recruitment purposes and to play games close to active bases. Navy chose to be in the AAC West Division for this reason. And Army and Navy playing in a football conference together would create logistics issues for the Army-Navy game. Remember this game is played in a standalone television slot a week AFTER championship week.
No one from the MWC is moving to the AAC, especially after they lose any of Houston, Cincy, UCF, Memphis. Long story short, the money won’t add up. In multiple ways. The only real options that the AAC have are pretty much in the MAC, CUSA, and SBC….and once gutted, that might not be as straightforward as it would be today.

[JacksFan40]

It’s officially official.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.foxnews.com/sports/oklahoma-texas-sec-2025.amp

The Southeastern Conference (SEC) announced Friday it has granted membership to the University of Oklahoma and the University of Texas at Austin starting on June 1, 2025.

Both Texas and Oklahoma’s board of regents unanimously voted to allow the schools to leave the Big 12 Conference and join the SEC at that time. The SEC later confirmed it will allow the schools to take part in athletic competitions starting the 2025-26 academic school year.

[NY Crusader 2010]

No one from the MWC is moving to the AAC, especially after they lose any of Houston, Cincy, UCF, Memphis. Long story short, the money won’t add up. In multiple ways. The only real options that the AAC have are pretty much in the MAC, CUSA, and SBC….and once gutted, that might not be as straightforward as it would be today.

Only MWC school that would possibly be a target for AAC would be Air Force as I indicated, as a football-only affiliate. They could play minor sports in Summit or MWC if they would keep them.

Colorado State and Boise States would be obvious targets for a Big 12 looking to continue to exist. Talks now about a possible Pac 12/Big 12 merger...interesting but I don't think it will happen. I ultimately see Texas Tech and OK State going west, possibly with Baylor and/or TCU joining them if the Pac 12 can get over the religion thing.

West Virginia remains a Big 12 member which gets interesting because they all of a sudden gain a lot of clout relative to the other schools who would be left behind in that league. So if a merger of some kind with the Pac 12 doesn't happen, I could see the Big 12 expanding eastward to make WVU less of an outlier -- think the likes of Cincinnati, Memphis, UCF and USF.

[acbearkat]

Only MWC school that would possibly be a target for AAC would be Air Force as I indicated, as a football-only affiliate. They could play minor sports in Summit or MWC if they would keep them.

Colorado State and Boise States would be obvious targets for a Big 12 looking to continue to exist. Talks now about a possible Pac 12/Big 12 merger...interesting but I don't think it will happen. I ultimately see Texas Tech and OK State going west, possibly with Baylor and/or TCU joining them if the Pac 12 can get over the religion thing.

TCU is a secular university, Baylor is not. SMU is also very much a secular university, despite having a seminary on campus, as does TCU.


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[bonarae]

B1G, ACC and Pac-12 alliance to be announced soon. Less money games for the G5 and us? xchinscratchx

https://www.cbssports.com/college-football/news/big-ten-acc-pac-12-alliance-could-be-announced-in-coming-weeks-as-leagues-combat-sec-expansion/

[NY Crusader 2010]

B1G, ACC and Pac-12 alliance to be announced soon. Less money games for the G5 and us? xchinscratchx

https://www.cbssports.com/college-football/news/big-ten-acc-pac-12-alliance-could-be-announced-in-coming-weeks-as-leagues-combat-sec-expansion/

Maybe SLIGHTLY less. But remember, home games are a CASH COW for many of these schools. And when these schools play us, it's always at home. The P5 powers are still going to want 7-8 home games/year. If anything, I could see the alliance as a way to block OOC opportunities for the SEC. I think you'll see some neutral-site kickoff events between these conferences but you're not for example going to see an ACC team play a non-conference slate consisting of 2 Big Ten and 2 Pac 12 teams. Won't happen.

[walliver]

Most of the P5 play an FCS games and a non-AAC G5 game. That isn't likely to change.

The real losers will be the AAC. They will have great difficulty getting home-and-home series with ACC, B1G, and PAC-12 teams.

It will be interesting to see how the scheduling alliance works out. Will we see Clemson-Penn State and Florida State vs. Stanford? Or will we see Wake Forest at Ohio State and Northwestern at Oregon?

As for the SEC, I see how adding Oklahoma and Texas adds to the money, but what good is a conference where you only play certain conference members every decade or so?

[NY Crusader 2010]

Most of the P5 play an FCS games and a non-AAC G5 game. That isn't likely to change.

The real losers will be the AAC. They will have great difficulty getting home-and-home series with ACC, B1G, and PAC-12 teams.

It will be interesting to see how the scheduling alliance works out. Will we see Clemson-Penn State and Florida State vs. Stanford? Or will we see Wake Forest at Ohio State and Northwestern at Oregon?

As for the SEC, I see how adding Oklahoma and Texas adds to the money, but what good is a conference where you only play certain conference members every decade or so?

The SEC will need to go to a 9-game conference schedule. 7 in-division games + 2 out of the other 8 teams. That makes the most sense in my opinion. The SEC right now still has a bizarre system of cross-division primary partners, the only P5 football conference that does this, meaning that you play the other teams in the opposite division even less. The rivalries are:

Tennessee-Alabama
Florida-LSU
Missouri-A&M
Arkansas-South Carolina
Vanderbilt-Ole Miss
Kentucky-MS State
Auburn-Georgia

I would imagine this system will get dumped when the league expands. Otherwise, yea you might as well consider the East and West divisions separate conferences.

[acbearkat]

The SEC will need to go to a 9-game conference schedule. 7 in-division games + 2 out of the other 8 teams. That makes the most sense in my opinion. The SEC right now still has a bizarre system of cross-division primary partners, the only P5 football conference that does this, meaning that you play the other teams in the opposite division even less. The rivalries are:

Tennessee-Alabama
Florida-LSU
Missouri-A&M
Arkansas-South Carolina
Vanderbilt-Ole Miss
Kentucky-MS State
Auburn-Georgia

I would imagine this system will get dumped when the league expands. Otherwise, yea you might as well consider the East and West divisions separate conferences.

A&M/South Carolina
Arkansas/Missouri

You had them flipped.


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[wapiti]

https://www.kbzk.com/sports/usc-ucla-in-talks-to-join-the-big-ten-reports-say

USC and UCLA in talk to move to Big 10.

What will the trickle down effects be if this comes to fruition?

[JacksFan40]

https://www.kbzk.com/sports/usc-ucla-in-talks-to-join-the-big-ten-reports-say

USC and UCLA in talk to move to Big 10.

What will the trickle down effects be if this comes to fruition?
The PAC-12 is toast. The SEC, Big 12 and Big 10 will poach the ACC and what is left of the PAC-12. College sports are being killed off before our eyes, all for profit.

[Professor Chaos]

The PAC-12 is toast. The SEC, Big 12 and Big 10 will poach the ACC and what is left of the PAC-12. College sports are being killed off before our eyes, all for profit.
The same thing has been said twice about the Big 12 and they've survived. I suspect the Pac-12, like the Big 12, will back fill (probably with MWC schools) and have a full complement of schools with a smaller TV contract. There will be trickle down though and for the first time the western G5 (ie MWC) will be impacted so there will be some opportunities for FCS schools to make the jump to FBS. Hoping NDSU is in the group ideally with SDSU and the Montana schools.

[acbearkat]

The PAC-12 is toast. The SEC, Big 12 and Big 10 will poach the ACC and what is left of the PAC-12. College sports are being killed off before our eyes, all for profit.

The USC and UCLA moves make zero sense. Texas and Oklahoma moving to the SEC makes more sense geographically, and Texas and Oklahoma now have the one thing that can help them beat Texas A&M in recruiting, as the Aggies main recruiting pitch is gone.


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[The Boogie Down]

Not sure who the Pac-12 can get that is even remotely close to being as big as UCLA/USC. Worse, I doubt Oregon, Washington, Arizona & Stanford even care all that much. They're each probably far more interested in positioning themselves into the B1G once the next round of expansion happens. Crippling body blow for Pac 12 but the ACC & Big 12 took a hit too. The divide between the true power conferences (P-2) and everyone else just got wider.

[JacksFan40]

The same thing has been said twice about the Big 12 and they've survived. I suspect the Pac-12, like the Big 12, will back fill (probably with MWC schools) and have a full complement of schools with a smaller TV contract. There will be trickle down though and for the first time the western G5 (ie MWC) will be impacted so there will be some opportunities for FCS schools to make the jump to FBS. Hoping NDSU is in the group ideally with SDSU and the Montana schools.
The Big 12 was still in good position to continue on as they kept the rest of the conference intact, the PAC-12 doesn’t look like they’ll have that luxury. Reportedly Washington and Oregon are trying to get into the Big 10, and the Big 12 is looking to poach the Arizona’s, Utah, and Colorado. All that would be left is Wazzu, Oregon State, Cal, and Stanford. At that point it may not even be worth it for MWC teams to jump over.

[Go Lehigh TU Owl]

The TV dictatorship of college sports is fascinating. It's exactly what happened to NASCAR just 20 years later......

[walliver]

Just about every P5 conference has some underperforming programs. How long before Vanderbilt, Wake Forest, Northwestern and others are asked to leave? In the post-Coach-K era, Duke May be much less attractive.

[bonarae]

Just about every P5 conference has some underperforming programs. How long before Vanderbilt, Wake Forest, Northwestern and others are asked to leave? In the post-Coach-K era, Duke May be much less attractive.

And where will they go? Will they drop down a subdivision in football, too?

[The Boogie Down]

And where will they go? Will they drop down a subdivision in football, too?

There could be a few more G-5's that drop but a P-5? Even a bad P-5? No way!!! I think the way things are set up now, the historic bottom feeders (for instance, as mentioned above, Vanderbilt, Wake Forest & Northwestern) will continue to collect their P-5 checks while hoping for the occasional break out year. NW has had several over the decades and WF just had one last season. Going forward though, I think UCLA/USC made it plenty clear that we're headed towards a P-2 world. B1G for the old Union States, SEC for the Confeds.

Vandy and NW are already where you need to be, so both are safe. Wake OTOH? Ehhh.... Should the B1G and SEC set their sights on the ACC, it's hard to see either wanting Wake. In fact, lots of fat could be trimmed off the Big 12 and Pac-12 as well. From NC State, to Iowa St, to Oregon State, I think more than a few schools will lose out in a P-2 world. But to go back to Wake...

Again, I can never see them dropping to the subdivision but, if they didn't make a possible P-2 cut, I could see them being part of a new league consisting of other private elites. W/everyone else chasing the B1G and SEC an FBS version of the Ivy League or Patriot League would be refreshingly interesting. Especially if, like the Ivies & Patsies, the schools (think Tulane, SMU, Rice and although not as elite, Tulsa, + the service academies) stuck together in remaining above the fray and off the constant carousel of realignment.

[JacksFan40]

Looks like the Big 12 will grab Colorado, Arizona, Arizona State, and Utah. That leaves 6 teams in the PAC-12, with the possibility of Oregon and Washington being on the move in the future.

If the PAC can still survive and grab some MWC teams, it’ll be interesting to see who the MWC would try to grab to fill those spots.

[ngineer]

There could be a few more G-5's that drop but a P-5? Even a bad P-5? No way!!! I think the way things are set up now, the historic bottom feeders (for instance, as mentioned above, Vanderbilt, Wake Forest & Northwestern) will continue to collect their P-5 checks while hoping for the occasional break out year. NW has had several over the decades and WF just had one last season. Going forward though, I think UCLA/USC made it plenty clear that we're headed towards a P-2 world. B1G for the old Union States, SEC for the Confeds.

Vandy and NW are already where you need to be, so both are safe. Wake OTOH? Ehhh.... Should the B1G and SEC set their sights on the ACC, it's hard to see either wanting Wake. In fact, lots of fat could be trimmed off the Big 12 and Pac-12 as well. From NC State, to Iowa St, to Oregon State, I think more than a few schools will lose out in a P-2 world. But to go back to Wake...

Again, I can never see them dropping to the subdivision but, if they didn't make a possible P-2 cut, I could see them being part of a new league consisting of other private elites. W/everyone else chasing the B1G and SEC an FBS version of the Ivy League or Patriot League would be refreshingly interesting. Especially if, like the Ivies & Patsies, the schools (think Tulane, SMU, Rice and although not as elite, Tulsa, + the service academies) stuck together in remaining above the fray and off the constant carousel of realignment.

For years I thought of a conference made up of the schools known more for their academics while still being 'decent' in football: Wake Forest, Vanderbilt, Duke, Northwestern, Rice, Stanford, Tulane, Notre Dame, Boston College, plus the three Academies.

[caribbeanhen]

For years I thought of a conference made up of the schools known more for their academics while still being 'decent' in football: Wake Forest, Vanderbilt, Duke, Northwestern, Rice, Stanford, Tulane, Notre Dame, Boston College, plus the three Academies.

of all people to forget the Coast Guard ... but yes, all kidding aside that makes a lot sense

[wapiti]

https://theanalyst.com/na/2022/06/as-conference-realignment-turns-2022-fcs-changes-and-beyond/

[JayJ79]

of all people to forget the Coast Guard ...
and the Merchant Marine Academy

[caribbeanhen]

and the Merchant Marine Academy

Delaware actually played the Merchant Marine Academy in 1979, beat them 65-0

This was the year Delaware won the Division II national championship behind future NFL quarterback, Scott Brunner

only loss was to pretty good Temple team that lost to Pitt 10-9

[JayJ79]

Delaware actually played the Merchant Marine Academy in 1979, beat them 65-0
This was the year Delaware won the Division II national championship behind future NFL quarterback, Scott Brunner
only loss was to pretty good Temple team that lost to Pitt 10-9
Both the Coast Guard Academy and the Merchant Marine Academy have athletics programs at the NCAA Division 3 level.
Not really relevant to the discussion of Division I conference restructuring, as neither academy is going to move their athletics to D-I
but if you're going to mention the CGA, might as well include the MMA too

[caribbeanhen]

Both the Coast Guard Academy and the Merchant Marine Academy have athletics programs at the NCAA Division 3 level.
Not really relevant to the discussion of Division I conference restructuring, as neither academy is going to move their athletics to D-I
but if you're going to mention the CGA, might as well include the MMA too

Sailor you’re lecturing a retired Chief 😂

[bonarae]

Idaho HC thinks that the realignment saga is a "runaway train"....

https://247sports.com/Article/Conference-realignment-Idaho-coach-Jason-Eck-says-Power-5-football-a-runaway-train-FCS-has-more-purity-189883230/

[bonarae]

At least the SEC is currently resting.... xwhistlex

https://footballscoop.com/news/sec-reportedly-reaches-expansion-decision

[FUBeAR]

At least the SEC is currently resting.... xwhistlex

https://footballscoop.com/news/sec-reportedly-reaches-expansion-decision

Maybe…for a while…they have BIGGER plans though…

https://twitter.com/3yearletterman/status/1546954310671650816

:)

[bonarae]

No merger of Big 12 / Pac 12. But the former is still trying to stay afloat... xcoffeex

https://www.cbssports.com/college-football/news/big-12-pac-12-nix-talks-of-potential-merger-or-partnership-with-big-12-still-considering-all-options/

[bonarae]

The ACC says "everything is on the table"... what gives? xchinscratchx

https://www.cbssports.com/college-football/news/acc-media-days-2022-jim-phillips-says-everything-is-on-the-table-amid-changing-college-football-landscape/

[bonarae]

More Pac 12 to B1G?

https://www.cbssports.com/college-football/news/big-ten-evaluating-cal-oregon-stanford-and-washington-from-pac-12-as-further-expansion-considered/

[ngineer]

of all people to forget the Coast Guard ... but yes, all kidding aside that makes a lot sense


Hah. Been away for a bit as my new 'retirement' seems to have made me busier! I certainly meant no 'dis' to the USCG...indeed I was recruited there, then failed the physical...on 3 counts!! I played four sports in high school. Really? Talk about selective..smh. However, as you recognize, The Coasties, as well as Merchant Marine, are D-3 schools. But some kind of college football division that takes football seriously, but not as seriously as its academics, should be considered. I am actually less and less interested in the FBS games these past couple years, and am growing even less interested. I feel like it's not college football at all, and like Triple A baseball, elevated minor league football.

[bonarae]

It's all about media... xcoffeex

https://www.cbssports.com/college-football/news/conference-realignment-amazon-interest-may-affect-big-ten-big-12-pac-12-composition-as-talks-continue/

[bonarae]

Aztecs moving to Pac-12?

https://www.cbssports.com/college-football/news/with-a-sparkling-stadium-and-surging-program-san-diego-state-makes-an-easy-case-for-pac-12-expansion/

[bonarae]

Is the Pac-12 nearing its end?

https://www.cbssports.com/college-football/news/will-the-pac-12-break-up-where-each-team-would-go-if-league-disintegrates-over-media-rights-deal/