4-Year Moratorium On New DI Members

[Hammersmith]

I haven't seen this posted anywhere yet. Apologies if it has.

Division I Board enacts four-year moratorium on accepting new members (http://tinyurl.com/yolxdb)

The Division I Board of Directors has enacted a four-year moratorium on permitting institutions to begin the process of joining the division – an action that among other things will prevent a school from moving from another division into Division I or moving between its subdivisions until August 2011.

Although the division recently enacted new Football Bowl Subdivision criteria and established procedural steps to become a Division I member, standards for Division I institutional and conference membership were not reviewed.

The moratorium, which is effective immediately, does not affect 20 institutions that already have entered the seven-year Division I provisional-membership process for new NCAA members or the five-year process to move from Division II -- including institutions that currently are officially exploring Division I membership.

[youwouldno]

Very interesting. Perhaps it should be accompanied by an (unofficial) AGS moratorium on baseless FCS-to-FBS chatter. A pipe dream, I know.

[RaiderInTheZone]

Very interesting. Perhaps it should be accompanied by an (unofficial) AGS moratorium on baseless FCS-to-FBS chatter. A pipe dream, I know.

xlolx You would think this would put a stop to any rumblings of schools moving from 1-AA to 1-A for at least most of that time on most 1-AA messageboards. Western Kentucky is the only school with a 1-AA football team that is moving up that will not be bound by the moratorium.

BUT, there is nothing in the moratorium that does not permit schools from realigning with different leagues. Not that this would happen, but it would be a huge blow to some 1-A hopefuls if there was some conference shifts to take place in the next 2-3 years down the road.

[bluehenbillk]

So ends any Big East expansion dreams for a while.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

Big, big stuff here to discuss:


The moratorium was endorsed by the NCAA Executive Committee Membership Working Group, a panel including representation from all three NCAA divisions that is studying the Association’s current three-division structure and considering steps to accommodate the NCAA’s continuing membership growth and related issues.

The panel suggested that a moratorium would give Division I an opportunity to re-evaluate criteria for achieving membership. The division’s current membership could consider during that period whether to revise standards for evaluating and granting membership to future provisional and/or reclassifying institutions – a step that could change Division I’s rate of growth.

The moratorium has Association-wide implications, because many of the institutions that recently have applied for Division I membership are reclassifying from Division II. The four-year length of the moratorium also fits a timeline established by the Executive Committee working group to propose and enact ways of managing an influx of new NCAA member institutions in Divisions II and III -- including possibly creating a fourth NCAA division or by subdividing Division III.

My immediate questions are the following:
1) This sounds like a fundamental rethink of D-I, II, III. Could this mean that the concept of "Division I non-scholarship football" could be on the outs, and into D-III?
2) Where will the Ivies wish to fall in this category? Will they cling to the fiction that they are "zero scholarships", or will ego dictate they should remain D-I?
3) Leagues that have been looking at expansion (such as the Patriot League) all of a sudden have those "dream sub-D-I candidiates" like Johns Hopkins, Gettysburg, etc. pulled right off the table. To say this narrows the expansion pool is putting it mildly. Maybe Marist and/or Bryant gets a much more serious look now.

[ButlerGSU]

This should not affect I-AA schools who are considering moving to I-A since the schools are already members of division I. This would only affect schools moving from division II to division I right?

[dungeonjoe]

This should not affect I-AA schools who are considering moving to I-A since the schools are already members of division I. This would only affect schools moving from division II to division I right?

article says:
another division into Division I or moving between its subdivisions until August 2011.

[Eyes of Old Main]

Very interesting. Perhaps it should be accompanied by an (unofficial) AGS moratorium on baseless FCS-to-FBS chatter. A pipe dream, I know.

I'm all for that!

[dungeonjoe]

Very interesting. Perhaps it should be accompanied by an (unofficial) AGS moratorium on baseless FCS-to-FBS chatter. A pipe dream, I know.

dang, I was hoping Wofford would be in the ACC by the end of the decade.:)

[BearsCountry]

Pretty stupid rule - you are going to have a ton of movement in 2011 then.

[dbackjon]

Interesting...

Looks like the UxD's just barely made it!

[BearsCountry]

BUT, there is nothing in the moratorium that does not permit schools from realigning with different leagues. Not that this would happen, but it would be a huge blow to some 1-A hopefuls if there was some conference shifts to take place in the next 2-3 years down the road.

No kidding on this part - it could hurt a few schools and conferences.

[greenG]

Pretty stupid rule - you are going to have a ton of movement in 2011 then.

Assuming the moratorium isn't extended. I read nothing in the article that says that 2011 is carved in stone. The NCAA may like the stability the moratorium brings and keeps it in place after that date.

[aceinthehole]

What teams have been "granfathered" in?

I know that the University of New Haven paid the NCAA fee ($15k) and will play the 2008-09 season as "explaoratory member," Did Bryant offically do the same?

Any others out there?

[Cocky]

Sounds like a lawsuit.

[dbackjon]

Sounds like a lawsuit.

How so?

[pcola]

What teams have been "granfathered" in?

I know that the University of New Haven paid the NCAA fee ($15k) and will play the 2008-09 season as "explaoratory member," Did Bryant offically do the same?

Any others out there?
From a post by Star2City on the Siouxsports (http://siouxsports.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=8933&st=0) website.

Exploratory year 2007-8
SIU-E
UND
USD
Seattle
Houston Baptist
Bryant
New Haven

4 more years:
Florida Gulf Coast
South Carolina- Upstate
NC Central
Presbyterian

3 more years:
Cal State-Bakersfield
Central Arkansas
Winston-Salem St

Two more years:
Kennesaw St
N Florida
Utah Valley
NJIT

One more year:
NDSU
SDSU

Already full members (but not core members):
UC-Davis
UNC
Longwood

[BearsCountry]

Sounds like a lawsuit.

I was thinking the same thing.

[aceinthehole]

This is the list of schools that who slipped in past the moratorium and are officially reclassifing from D-II to D-I the 2007-08 season:

Exploratory Year (eligible for D-II championships)
Bryant
Houston Baptist
New Haven
North Dakota
Seattle
South Dakota
SIU-Edwardsville

Transition Year 1 (does not count as D-I for RPI purporses)
Florida Gulf Coast
North Carolina Central
Presbyterian
South Carolina Upstate

Transition Year 2 (must meet all D-I scheduling requirements and counts for D-I RPI purposes)
Cal-Bakersfield
Central Arkansas
Winston-Salem State

Transition Year 3
Kennesaw State
New Jersey Inst of Tech
North Florida
Utah Valley State

Transition Year 4
North Dakota State
South Dakota State

Full NCAA D-I member (first year and eligible for NCAA D-I championships)
Cal-Davis
Longwood (VA)
Northern Colorado

xthumbsupx Just read pcola's post - thanks!

[Lehigh Football Nation]

Exploratory year 2007-8
SIU-E
UND
USD
Seattle
Houston Baptist
Bryant
New Haven

4 more years:
Florida Gulf Coast
South Carolina- Upstate
NC Central
Presbyterian

3 more years:
Cal State-Bakersfield
Central Arkansas
Winston-Salem St

Two more years:
Kennesaw St
N Florida
Utah Valley
NJIT

One more year:
NDSU
SDSU

Already full members (but not core members):
UC-Davis
UNC
Longwood

Bryant is the ONLY school here with a small chance of going Patriot League. That leaves the only other expansion possibilities as:

* private MAAC schools willing to play up to scholarship ball with AI restrictions
* private NEC schools " " " " " " " " " "
* private CAA schools which want to leave the conference (in the low likelihood this would happen, they would most likely be associate members) and are willing to live with AI restrictions

Furthermore, there's the issue with the A10/Big East football schools playing D-I football but not playing with the full allotment of funding. Let's say there's an option where schools like Dayton drop to D-III in football after four years in reclassification. What happens to G-Town in this case? Do they stay in the PL, or reclassify? Less likely, but can't be brought off the table, what about Villanova?

[WUTNDITWAA]

Forgive my ignorance, but what's a core member?

[downbythebeach]

This is the list of schools that who slipped in past the moratorium and are officially reclassifing from D-II to D-I the 2007-08 season:

Exploratory Year (eligible for D-II championships)
Bryant
Houston Baptist
New Haven
North Dakota
Seattle
South Dakota
SIU-Edwardsville

Transition Year 1 (does not count as D-I for RPI purporses)
Florida Gulf Coast
North Carolina Central
Presbyterian
South Carolina Upstate

Transition Year 2 (must meet all D-I scheduling requirements and counts for D-I RPI purposes)
Cal-Bakersfield
Central Arkansas
Winston-Salem State

Transition Year 3
Kennesaw State
New Jersey Inst of Tech
North Florida
Utah Valley State

Transition Year 4
North Dakota State
South Dakota State

Full NCAA D-I member (first year and eligible for NCAA D-I championships)
Cal-Davis
Longwood (VA)
Northern Colorado

xthumbsupx Just read pcola's post - thanks!

^^^^ and this is why, D-I is becoming too watered down who the freak are Utah Valley, NJIT, Kennesaw State, Presby (I know who they are, but that's a tiny school) SC Upcoast, New Haven.

If all this kept up all there would be no teams left in DII and DIII

[DFW HOYA]

1) This sounds like a fundamental rethink of D-I, II, III. Could this mean that the concept of "Division I non-scholarship football" could be on the outs, and into D-III?

Not likely. The talk is that Division III has grown too big (420 schools) and that some smaller schools want to subdivide it.



2) Where will the Ivies wish to fall in this category? Will they cling to the fiction that they are "zero scholarships", or will ego dictate they should remain D-I?

They stay Division I. Realistically, the only true Division I changes would occur if the BCS schools left the NCAA.



3) Leagues that have been looking at expansion (such as the Patriot League) all of a sudden have those "dream sub-D-I candidiates" like Johns Hopkins, Gettysburg, etc. pulled right off the table. To say this narrows the expansion pool is putting it mildly. Maybe Marist and/or Bryant gets a much more serious look now.

The old Middle Atlantic Conference was a hybrid of schools ranging from Temple to Gettysburg and included, at various times, three of the seven PL schools and three of the eight Ivies. Putting playoff issues aside, could multi-divisional conferences be possible today?

http://www.mascac.org/historyHarnahan.html

[aceinthehole]

Forgive my ignorance, but what's a core member?

That is not a recognized term. UC-Davis, Northern Colorado, and Longwood a full NCAA D-I members and eligible for NCAA championships.

[NDB]

core member refers to the classification of a institution within a conference.

a conference must have a minimum number of core members 6? to get basketball monies.

[youwouldno]

I do think its possible changes will be considered beyond D-III issues. If D-I football was not a factor at all, why freeze movement between the subdivisions? I see no reason why that would be necessary otherwise.

[Go...gate]

Not good news for the Patriot League, IMO. We have to hope nobody else leaves in the short term.

[PSUVikings]

Article Link (http://www.ncaa.org/wps/portal/%21ut/p/kcxml/04_Sj9SPykssy0xPLMnMz0vM0Y_QjzKLN4g3NPUESYGYxqb6kW hCjhgihqYeCDFfj_zcVH1v_QD9gtzQ0IhyR0UAE3AuRw%21%21/delta/base64xml/L3dJdyEvUUd3QndNQSEvNElVRS82XzBfMTVL?WCM_GLOBAL_CO NTEXT=/wps/wcm/connect/NCAA/NCAA+News/NCAA+News+Online/2007/Association-Updates/Division+I+Board+enacts+four-year+moratorium+on+accepting+new+members+-+08-09-07+update)

[Fresno St. Alum]

Texas St., Jacksonville St., and UMass have all formed FBS committee's do they get a pass or do they have to wait until 2011 to move if they want to go to the FBS?

Aceinthehole, Houston Baptist is NAIA not eligible for D-II titles, but I get what you mean.

[Go...gate]

Texas St., Jacksonville St., and UMass have all formed FBS committee's do they get a pass or do they have to wait until 2011 to move if they want to go to the FBS?

Aceinthehole, Houston Baptist is NAIA not eligible for D-II titles, but I get what you mean.


Former Division I member, however (NCAA BB Tournament 1983-84). Do they get special consideration for return to Division I, even though it has been a number of years?

[henfan]

As with every other piece of membership moratorium ever enacted by the NCAA, this should also be considered a soft moratorium, very soft.

The organization will have no legal ground to prohibit schools who are willing & able to meeting the membership criteria of a higher division from re-classifying. Expect waivers to be forthcoming for any school willing to put up the slightest challenge.

The more interesting issue here is the one of divisional realignment. It's long overdue.

[Maverick]

From what I understand of the article, only those 20 already in the process with the NCAA are covered. Exploring the idea as those schools mentioned (Texas St., Jacksonville St., and UMass ) are doing does not qualify them so they must wait to at least 2011 to even try to begin the process.

[colgate13]

Not likely. The talk is that Division III has grown too big (420 schools) and that some smaller schools want to subdivide it.

This is probably the biggest thing that is going to happen. Division III is too big and made up of schools that do things very different. Huge Wisconsin state schools compete against 1,000 person or less private schools in the east. The discrepancies are numerous.

I think D III gets split up. The interesting thing to think about are schools like Williams and Middlebury. They fall on the small side of the scale but their athletic programs are robust and successful. I don't know how it will shake out. xconfusedx

[Fresno St. Alum]

Former Division I member, however (NCAA BB Tournament 1983-84). Do they get special consideration for return to Division I, even though it has been a number of years?

Nope, they have a 7 year provisional membership instead of 5.

I was looking on wikipedia and the NCAA and it had HBU as a provisional and not an exploratory. Did they use 2006 as an exploratory or do they not have one because they're from the NAIA?

[Lehigh Football Nation]

This is probably the biggest thing that is going to happen. Division III is too big and made up of schools that do things very different. Huge Wisconsin state schools compete against 1,000 person or less private schools in the east. The discrepancies are numerous.

I think D III gets split up. The interesting thing to think about are schools like Williams and Middlebury. They fall on the small side of the scale but their athletic programs are robust and successful. I don't know how it will shake out. xconfusedx

There has also been talk in D-III land of including the D-I non-scholarships as part of their postseason, too. I don't have special information, but I've got to believe that it is possible that realignment of D-I non-schollies may be part of this discussion, as it has in the past.

What if they make a "Division IV", called it "private non-scholly", and gave the D-I schools an exemption to join? xeyebrowx

[Fresno St. Alum]

I always thought that the Wisconsin state schools should be D-II with UW-Parkside.

If D-III splits, bye bye NAIA, they should round up a lot of them. Plus D-II has dropped its provisional membership to 1 year.

[Fresno St. Alum]

2011 D-I could get these school knocking on the door.

N.Kentucky
S.Indiana
Bellarmine
Wayne St.(MI)
W.Georgia
Valdosta St.
UNC-Pembroke
C.Missouri

[Cocky]

How so?

Everybody likes to sue and the NCAA has money. I'm sure someone will feel victimized.

[aceinthehole]

I clarified and updated the list. Since HBU is a coming from NAIA, I think they dont become a full D-I member (and championship eligible) until the 2014-15 season.
-----

The following are the 20 schools that beat the moratorium and are currently reclassifing from D-II to D-I for the 2007-08 season:

Exploratory Year - eligible for D-II championships
1. Bryant
2. Houston Baptist* (7-year transition from NAIA)
3. New Haven
4. North Dakota
5. Seattle
6. South Dakota
7. SIU-Edwardsville

Transition Year 1 - does not count as D-I for RPI purposes
8. Florida Gulf Coast (Atlantic Sun)
9. North Carolina Central (MEAC in 2008-09)
10. Presbyterian (Big South in 2008-09)
11. South Carolina Upstate (Atlantic Sun)

Transition Year 2 - must meet all D-I scheduling requirements and counts for D-I RPI purposes
12. Cal-Bakersfield (Independent)
13. Central Arkansas (Southland)
14. Winston-Salem State (MEAC)

Transition Year 3
15. Kennesaw State (Atlantic Sun)
16. New Jersey Tech (Independent)
17. North Florida (Atlantic Sun)
18. Utah Valley State (Independent)

Transition Year 4
19. North Dakota State (Summit League)
20. South Dakota State (Summit League)

----------
Full NCAA D-I member - first year eligible for NCAA D-I championships
UC-Davis (Big West)
Longwood (Independent)
Northern Colorado (Big Sky)

[Fresno St. Alum]

A good thing that could happen from all of this is that conferences might not keep passing over the UTPA's of the world from the next school moving up. All of the Indy schools have a better chance to get into a conference.

[Polywog]

Transition Year 2 - must meet all D-I scheduling requirements and counts for D-I RPI purposes
12. Cal-Bakersfield (Independent)
13. Central Arkansas (Southland)
14. Winston-Salem State (MEAC)


It's actually Cal State-Bakersfield. It is a member of the CSU system, not the UC system. I only mention it because they have very strong athletics overall and there are rumblings in the Bako area to start football. I give it a slim chance due to the costs involved, but if there's any CSU school that could start a football program from scratch, its Bakersfield. Naturally they would start an FCS program if they can get something off the ground.

It is suspected that Cal State Bakersfield will apply for membership to the Big West Conference for non-football sports (of which Cal Poly and UC Davis are also members) and would almost certainly be accepted.

[StillJonesin]

As with every other piece of membership moratorium ever enacted by the NCAA, this should also be considered a soft moratorium, very soft.

The organization will have no legal ground to prohibit schools who are willing & able to meeting the membership criteria of a higher division from re-classifying. Expect waivers to be forthcoming for any school willing to put up the slightest challenge.

The more interesting issue here is the one of divisional realignment. It's long overdue.


So are the 30 year old criteria for moving to FBS they haven't enforced in 25 years. Raise them to 21 century standards and kick out the posers already in D1a.

[Fresno St. Alum]

CS Bakersfield should get into the Big West when their provisional period is up.

Like I said before they have a 20,000 seat stadium there, off campus that would be great for FCS football and the GWFC. I don't know if the school can afford it but High School football is big there.

[mrklean]

This SUXXX real bad. I guess we cant move to C-USA

[Hammersmith]

That is not a recognized term. UC-Davis, Northern Colorado, and Longwood a full NCAA D-I members and eligible for NCAA championships.

Core member(actually it's core institution) is a term recognized by the NCAA. It refers to schools that have been active members for eight years or more. The rule was modified in 1999, so schools that were in the process of transitioning to DI at the time(i.e. IPFW), were grandfathered in as core members. Schools that began their transition after 1999 need 13 years to reach that status(5 reclass + 8 active). In NDSU's case, we become an active member in 2008-9 but don't become a core institution until 2016-17.

[Hammersmith]

Sounds like a lawsuit.

Why? It's not like this is the first time this has happened. This current one is a little longer, but there was a 2-year moratorium put in place around 1999. I think it expired in 2002, which is why UC Davis and UNC moved at the same time. NDSU and SDSU almost moved then as well, but decided to wait a year to see if other NCC schools could be convinced to move also.

[Old Montana State Grad]

Other threads have examined the rise and fall of various conferences, teams and the reasons for these shifts. It's a fact of life Americans are transient and the population follows the shifting demographics.

If you look at how fast Elon, Wofford assimilated into the SoCon and ETSU disappeared and couple that with the fact that Georgia Southern has only had football for about 25 years, there's no doubt in my mind the folks at the NCAA headquarters can't keep up with the paperwork involved...perfect bureaucratsxlolx

How many Florida schools have made the jump to the FBS in the last ten years? Spanos funded tremendous upgrades in three California school's stadiums, we've got both Georgia State and Kennesaw State and there's the real possibility ETSU, Bakersfield and a number of programs that've dropped football are going to add the program to add to the headaches the clerks at the NCAA are already experiencing.

In other words, check out the compliance issues they're going to have to contend with, playoff ramifications of various sports and the obvious reality that some FCS conferences may have to forfeit their automatic seeds into the tournament and others may have a legitimate complaint for being excluded.

It's a huge nightmare trying to keep track of various conference affiliations and with the shifts in American population centers, it's only going to get worse.

I think it's a good thing they had the wherewithall to call timeout and see where we'll be in four years.

[colgate13]

What if they make a "Division IV", called it "private non-scholly", and gave the D-I schools an exemption to join? xeyebrowx

That won't be so easy of a division because of schools like Williams and Middlebury. Williams spends A TON on their athletic program and is very good. This is a school that has won a D III men's hoops championship in 2003 and numerous other national championships in stuff like tennis, crew, xc, soccer, etc. They won't want to bow out of competing against the best other nonscholarship schools have to offer.

Middlebury is similar in hockey with dual NCs from 04-06.

IF something does happen, it will be a gut check for some schools in determining which path they take.

[aztecjim]

Isn't Oklahoma City University in their first year or is/was 2008/2009 going to be?

[Hammersmith]

Isn't Oklahoma City University in their first year or is/was 2008/2009 going to be?

OCU didn't submit their paperwork by the 1 June deadline so, if they did decide to eventually move, they waited a year too long.

[Fresno St. Alum]

OCU decided to wait another year so now they have to wait until 2011. I think they should just move to D-II and the Heartland Conf.

[RaiderInTheZone]

From what I understand of the article, only those 20 already in the process with the NCAA are covered. Exploring the idea as those schools mentioned (Texas St., Jacksonville St., and UMass ) are doing does not qualify them so they must wait to at least 2011 to even try to begin the process.

The only current 1-AA school that made it past the moratorium is Western Kentucky because they have made their intent to move to 1-A official. Texas State, Jacksonville State, and UMass are not because they have not made that decision official. The NCAA does not consider a feasibility study as part of the "process" of moving divisions.

[dprichar]

Is this my paranoia or is anyone else worried they might chnage FBS to DI, FCS to DII, DII to DIII, and DIII to DIV? I've read many FBS schools are unhappy with the name change, and to the average fan FBS/FCS is just as confusing as DI-A/DI-AA.

[Fresno St. Alum]

No they shouldn't because that would mess up all other sports for D-I, the only one that could split is D-III, to become D-III & D-IV

[Poly Pigskin]

Is this my paranoia or is anyone else worried they might chnage FBS to DI, FCS to DII, DII to DIII, and DIII to DIV? I've read many FBS schools are unhappy with the name change, and to the average fan FBS/FCS is just as confusing as DI-A/DI-AA.

I'm sure FBS schools would love for this to happen, but it can't as long as our schools compete with their schools in every other DI sport. But then again we are talking about the NCAA, so I guess you never really know what to expect.

[JaxSinfonian]

Texas St., Jacksonville St., and UMass have all formed FBS committee's do they get a pass or do they have to wait until 2011 to move if they want to go to the FBS?

If we'd been ready to move tomorrow, this would slow us down. But I think this actually could help us. A lot needs to change in Jacksonville for a move to be successful, and it will take at least four years for that, IMO. This gives us some of the time we need to upgrade our program to compare with those FCS schools who could make the move tomorrow if they wanted. For example:

If there was one opening in an FBS conference today, and it came down to Appalachian State or Jacksonville State, who do you think the conference would take? Four years may not be enough time to turn JSU into a bona fide contender, but it's a start.

Of course, if at the end of the four years the standards for FBS are changed considerably, that could put a stop to things.

At least in the meantime we get to focus on building a quality FCS program.

[SoCon48]

xlolx You would think this would put a stop to any rumblings of schools moving from 1-AA to 1-A for at least most of that time on most 1-AA messageboards. Western Kentucky is the only school with a 1-AA football team that is moving up that will not be bound by the moratorium.

BUT, there is nothing in the moratorium that does not permit schools from realigning with different leagues. Not that this would happen, but it would be a huge blow to some 1-A hopefuls if there was some conference shifts to take place in the next 2-3 years down the road.


Maybe the NCAA will use this time to decide to kick some of those dinky programs down to to I-AA where they belong. Chances are the anemic programs admitted in the last few years are the reasons the NCAA found this measure to be necessary.

[rufus]

How does this impact non-football schools (I-AAA under the old naming system)? Are those schools allowed to start football programs before 2011? This could have an impact on CAA schools like Georgia State and George Mason, which have considered starting teams.

[aztecjim]

rufus,I had the same idea. But truthfully would a school like Georgia State be able to leapfrog from nothing to FBS by 2011? Any school that announced TODAY that it was starting a team would probably not be on the field until 2010.

[rufus]

I was talking about a school like Georgia State starting FCS football. I would consider I-AAA to I-AA a move between subdivisions (I'm using old names because I don't know the current term for I-AAA).

[catdaddy2402]

Maybe the NCAA will use this time to decide to kick some of those dinky programs down to to I-AA where they belong. Chances are the anemic programs admitted in the last few years are the reasons the NCAA found this measure to be necessary.
Maybe they'll boot some of the dinky programs from Div I period.

[rufus]

Also, what happens if a conference is raided and can't replace its lost members due to the moratorium? Say the MWC takes Boise and Fresno from the WAC, and leaves the WAC with only seven teams. It seems like the WAC would have a tough time finding a new member to meet the eight team FBS minimum, without being able to go after a team from FCS.

It also sounds like bottom-tier FBS teams are safe from the attendance minimum for at least four more years. If they can't move between subdivisions, I would imagine that they can't be kicked out of FBS.

I think this moratorium is interesting, but I can't see it holding up. I think we'll see the NCAA making excpetions within a year.

[walliver]

The NCAA is not anti-trust exempt, and has in fact lost many anti-trust lawsuits (some of us are old enough to remember when one ONE college football game was telecast nationally each week - the NCAA claims all rights to national telecasts). If any school really wants to move up, the NCAA will have to demonstrate in court that the NCAA has a good reason to stop them.

Off the top of my head, I don't see any I-AA school in a position to move prior to 2011. I suspect App State has plans, but will need to finish their facilities upgrades first. Georgia Southern would have a lot of work to do. It will be many years before Coastal has a big enough stadium to go. Other than Jacksonville State, I am not aware of any other school actively and openly looking into a move. Maybe it's a move by the MAC to keep YSU out.:D

I really don't see why the NCAA is so concerned about division changes. If Newberry College* wants to play FBS football, then let them. They will play 12 away games every year, finish 0-12 every year, and we can all make fun of them; but, why should the NCAA stop them.


* fill in your own local D-II/NAIA school

[Fresno St. Alum]

catdaddy, the NCAA is not going to kick schools out of D-I just because they suck. The schools would all sue and win.

Walliver, Jacksonville St.,Texas St., and UMass all have committees looking into a FBS move right now.

When IPFW & Binghamton came into D-I in 2001 they were the last 2 schools that went under the 3 year provisional membership. After the 2001 moratorium that ended in 2003. D-I allowed new members again but all the new schools had to wait 5 years with the 1+4 rule exploratory/provisional.
My thought are this, in 2011 rule will be a 7 year 1+6 rule.

[dbackjon]

If a school is already in a division, they can start/compete in any sport they like. So if Georgia State wanted to start a football team, this would not effect them.

[Ronbo]

A poster at eGriz stated that he was talking to a Montana AD person recently and he asked him if Montana was thinking of FBS because of the expansions and such. He was told that Montana is in FCS for the time being but that FCS is in serious financial difficulty and there has been talk it has about another 5 years before a complete reclassification. He said Montana has known for some time and we have been preparing for it so that we are ready when the time comes.

[89Hen]

FCS is in serious financial difficulty
xconfusedx What does that mean?

[Ronbo]

I would guess he meant schools losing money like Idaho State's article recently. I would guess there might be a push for a lower schollie ceiling in the future like Division II has done to make the Divison more competitive. Didn't DII go from 36 to 24 recently?

[greenG]

I would guess he meant schools losing money like Idaho State's article recently. I would guess there might be a push for a lower schollie ceiling in the future like Division II has done to make the Divison more competitive. Didn't DII go from 36 to 24 recently?

No. Fully funded D2 programs are still at 36. Many conferences, like the PSAC, allow only 24 and have pushed for lower scholarship limits. A vote on lowering the scholarship limit last year failed.

[89Hen]

I would guess he meant schools losing money like Idaho State's article recently. I would guess there might be a push for a lower schollie ceiling in the future...
I don't agree. Schools may need to decide for themselves, but I don't think the NCAA is going to force anyone up or down again. They did that in 1982 and it was a mistake then.

[Fresno St. Alum]

D-II used to have 45 then they dropped to 36 but some conferences only allow a max of 24. Some schools only play with 10.

If the FCS drops from 63 to 50, that would cause some schools to leave.

[TheBisonator]

D-II used to have 45 then they dropped to 36 but some conferences only allow a max of 24. Some schools only play with 10.

If the FCS drops from 63 to 50, that would cause some schools to leave.

NDSU for sure would leave the FCS if that ever happened.

[aztecjim]

Sorry I misunderstood. I still can't picture the NCAA telling a school it can't start football until 2011. On the other hand. Could a Fill In The Blank University announce TODAY it was starting football and be ready before 2011?

[colgate13]

NDSU for sure would leave the FCS if that ever happened.

Would NDSU or any other school really have that option?

I can see a scenario where the FBS makes membership tougher to attain and thereby makes it financially difficult for the NDSU's of the world to decide to go up to 85 from 63 instead of going down to 50 or whatever.

[FargoBison]

Would NDSU or any other school really have that option?

I can see a scenario where the FBS makes membership tougher to attain and thereby makes it financially difficult for the NDSU's of the world to decide to go up to 85 from 63 instead of going down to 50 or whatever.

I can tell you this, the school would put up a huge fight to make sure the FCS never drops scholarships. Many Bison supporters spent the last few decades or so watching our former division destroy itself by using reducing scholarships as a means to level the playing field. I'm sure the school would also try to do whatever it could to leave the FCS if it did start happening.

[TheBisonator]

I can tell you this, the school would put up a huge fight to make sure the FCS never drops scholarships. Many Bison supporters spent the last few decades or so watching our former division destroy itself by using reducing scholarships as means to level the playing field. I'm sure the school would also try to do whatever it could to leave the FCS if it did start happening.

Or maybe the Gateway (Missouri Valley by then??) would just move to FBS as a conference before that happens.

[Go...gate]

Would NDSU or any other school really have that option?

I can see a scenario where the FBS makes membership tougher to attain and thereby makes it financially difficult for the NDSU's of the world to decide to go up to 85 from 63 instead of going down to 50 or whatever.

I agree, 13 - I can see a scenario where members of the non - "Big Six" conferences are going to be under greater and greater scrutiny for FBS eligibility, since so much money is involved.

[FargoBison]

Or maybe the Gateway (Missouri Valley by then??) would just move to FBS as a conference before that happens.

I guess it all depends on when scholarships #s would get cut, some Gateway schools have some work to do regarding facilities and funding to make the move work.

[SO ILLmatic]

I agree, 13 - I can see a scenario where members of the non - "Big Six" conferences are going to be under greater and greater scrutiny for FBS eligibility, since so much money is involved.

What about the possibility of only the BCS bowl conference teams making up the entire i-a population? They would probably combine teams from the WAC & Mountain West to come with the "Big Six". Everybody else now in i-a would then either have to come down or play as an independent facing harsher regulations towards scholarships, football budgets, attendance, etc...

[UAalum72]

What about the possibility of only the BCS bowl conference teams making up the entire i-a population? They would probably combine teams from the WAC & Mountain West to come with the "Big Six". Everybody else now in i-a would then either have to come down or play as an independent facing harsher regulations towards scholarships, football budgets, attendance, etc...
Wouldn't that mean ten or fifteen bowl games have to either fold, accept teams with losing records (against current NCAA rule) or play on using newly-demoted or other FCS schools?

[Old Montana State Grad]

What about the possibility of only the BCS bowl conference teams making up the entire i-a population? They would probably combine teams from the WAC & Mountain West to come with the "Big Six". Everybody else now in i-a would then either have to come down or play as an independent facing harsher regulations towards scholarships, football budgets, attendance, etc...

Are you implying the WAC and MW are stronger conferences than the MAC and Conference USA top to bottom?

[ucdtim17]

Are you implying the WAC and MW are stronger conferences than the MAC and Conference USA top to bottom?

They are quite a bit better

[SO ILLmatic]

Wouldn't that mean ten or fifteen bowl games have to either fold, accept teams with losing records (against current NCAA rule) or play on using newly-demoted or other FCS schools?

Im saying that the newly demoted teams would still have an opportunity to play in the lower or mid-tier bowls. You would still have the big time bowls that the BCS conferences would play in. The lower bowls would be for the teams that couldnt make the FCS playoffs, or whatever the subdivison would be called to identify the non-BCS conferences plus the rest of division that sponsors football. It would also make it possible for more media attention to be focused towards the playoff championship game.

I dont know if anyone is familiar with the English Premiership Soccer league, but maybe this system should be employed in college football. At the end of the season, teams are relegated from the Premier league to the lower divisions. The teams that are at the top of the division directly below them, replace the relegated teams next season. Im not being completely serious, but it would be a way to get the teams in their right subdivisions and not playing just for pay days.

[colgate13]

Whatever happens, I think the biggest things schools need to be watching out for is the BCS conferences. This is about money. All of it. The desire to move up to the FBS, the moratorium, the divisions of I, II, III, etc.

There is a big paycheck for FBS football and I think they will do whatever they can to not have to divide it amongst all of the NCAA like they have to do with the Final Four stuff since it is an NCAA event.

[texcap]

While I don't doubt that football will have an impact on the discussions, the article at the link below places more emphasis on basketball as being the reason behind the moratorium. In particular the concern that too many DII programs are moving up to be able to play basketball at the DI level.

http://insidehighered.com/news/2007/08/15/ncaa

[AppMan]

Maybe the NCAA will use this time to decide to kick some of those dinky programs down to to I-AA where they belong. Chances are the anemic programs admitted in the last few years are the reasons the NCAA found this measure to be necessary.

Are you saying 1-aa is "dinky?"

[SoCon48]

Are you saying 1-aa is "dinky?"

I'm saying those programs are dinky by decent program I-A standards and need to move down to where they can succeed at the box office as well as on the field.

[SoCon48]

Anyway, back to the topic. I doubt in ASU's case, Cobb and Co. had no plans that would realistically place us in I-A in 4 years anyway.

[Cocky]

At yesterday's meeting, Jacksonville State's BOT announced they are sending the NCAA a letter stating their intentions to continue their move to FBS football. JSU's position is that the university was officially pursuing the move before the moratorium was in place and JSU is exempt from the 2011 deadline.

This was reported in the Anniston Star today but it is a paid site so no link. If the story comes avaiable thru an available link I will post the link.

[Punchykky]

Also, Old Dominion University is supposed to be starting a football team in 2009. How will this rule affect their division status, or whatever division they want to participate in? Since ODU is in the CAA for basketball, I would think it would want the same for it's upcoming football team.

[TheValleyRaider]

Also, Old Dominion University is supposed to be starting a football team in 2009. How will this rule affect their division status, or whatever division they want to participate in? Since ODU is in the CAA for basketball, I would think it would want the same for it's upcoming football team.

I think this is only for movement between divisions. ODU's program is going to be FCS Independent for a year or two, then they have a standing agreement to join the CAA. This shouldn't affect their status at all.

[Golden Eagle]

At yesterday's meeting, Jacksonville State's BOT announced they are sending the NCAA a letter stating their intentions to continue their move to FBS football. JSU's position is that the university was officially pursuing the move before the moratorium was in place and JSU is exempt from the 2011 deadline.

Heh. Nice try.

[Cocky]

http://www.gojaxstate.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=13918#13918

[Cocky]

Heh. Nice try.

We will find out soon I'm sure.

[TexasTerror]

So, Jax State is hoping C-USA gets some teams taken away meaning they go into the Sun Belt to add and then Jax State can get a spot?

See that the Sun Belt has increased their standards as of late?

[Cocky]

So, Jax State is hoping C-USA gets some teams taken away meaning they go into the Sun Belt to add and then Jax State can get a spot?

See that the Sun Belt has increased their standards as of late?

Yes, I saw that. It will take away a few money games, which I'm sure was part of the planned budget. I'm not sure the BOT so the new requirements.

[Casey_Orourke]

Just out of curiousity.....Does the moratorium also apply to schools which currently does not have a football program, but set up an exploratory commitee to set up one?

University of Texas- San Antonio have expressed an interest in setting up a program. For now they are talking about joining the Southland conference with an eventual move to the FBS. But unless the moratorium does not let them even start a team any plans are all for naught.

[DFW HOYA]

Just out of curiousity.....Does the moratorium also apply to schools which currently does not have a football program, but set up an exploratory commitee to set up one?


It applies to divisional membership, not sports sponsorship. UTSA (and the 80-odd schools without football) can certainly add programs as they see fit.

[EKU05]

It applies to divisional membership, not sports sponsorship. UTSA (and the 80-odd schools without football) can certainly add programs as they see fit.


However, aren't all DI schools required to at least start in FCS even if they intend to move up from the start (e.g. FAU, FIU, USF...). As I understand it, and current non-football Division I school would currently only have the option of FCS football...although by the time they're up and running this could all be over anyway.

[Fresno St. Alum]

What are you guys talking about if C-USA adds another member Jax St. can get in the Sun Belt. The Sun Belt has 13 right now if they want Jax St. they can take them without any other conference movement.

I hope Jax St. knows what they're doing. I'd love to have you in the FBS but make sure you can find a conference. Texas St. vs Jacksonville St. for the 14th spot in the Belt. Jax St. wants to get a head start over Texas St. that's why they are making the push now.

[Cocky]

Three Sunbelt members are non-football. South Alabama, New Orleans, and Denver.

[Tute79]

Well there arre actually 4 non-football schools in the Sun-Belt. UALR (Arkansas-Little Rock) is the 4th.
Since Western Kentucky is joining for football (moving their football from FCS Gateway to FBS Sun-Belt), there are 9 football schools and 4 non-football schools in the Sun-belt for a total of 13.

Denver is the real geographic out-lyer. They have reportedly expressed some interest in jumping to the WCC, since that conference doesn't sanction FB, however those schools are all in the Pacific Coastal States, and Denver doesn't fit well geographically there either..

[APPfreak]

I think there will be a new division made up of upper level FCS and lower level FBS

[saluki_in_ohio]

I think there will be a new division made up of upper level FCS and lower level FBS

I don't think that will go over very well at all.xrolleyesx

[BearsCountry]

I think there will be a new division made up of upper level FCS and lower level FBS

Quit dreaming.

[brownbear]

How long is the transition period for joining the FBS?

When Western Kentucky joins the FBS in 2009, will they be eligible for bowl games (Though they probably won't get the six wins they'd need), or is the transitional period not done at that time?

If the transitional period is about four years, that means the FBS will be capped at 120 members for about six years (2015?).

[TheValleyRaider]

It's a multi-stage transition, at least from D-II to D-I. I believe it goes like this:
Year 1: exploratory, still full D-II member
Year 2: provisional, D-I in name, count as D-II for scheduling
Year 3-6: probation, D-I but not eligible for postseason play
I could be wrong about the number of years.

For FCS to FBS, I think there's a 1 year transitional period where WKU is FBS, but ineligible for the postseason.

Someone is more than invited to correct anything I said that was wrong, please.

[TheBisonator]

It's a multi-stage transition, at least from D-II to D-I. I believe it goes like this:
Year 1: exploratory, still full D-II member
Year 2: provisional, D-I in name, count as D-II for scheduling
Year 3-6: probation, D-I but not eligible for postseason play
I could be wrong about the number of years.

For FCS to FBS, I think there's a 1 year transitional period where WKU is FBS, but ineligible for the postseason.

Someone is more than invited to correct anything I said that was wrong, please.

It's a 5 year transition to Division I, not a 6-year one. You have years 1 and 2 listed correctly, but it should be year 3-5 on the last part of your list. NDSU and SDSU are currently in "Year 5" and will be full-blown DI members about 10 months from now.

[TheValleyRaider]

It's a 5 year transition to Division I, not a 6-year one. You have years 1 and 2 listed correctly, but it should be year 3-5 on the last part of your list. NDSU and SDSU are currently in "Year 5" and will be full-blown DI members about 10 months from now.

Thanks xthumbsupx I thought 6 seemed just a bit too long.

[bandit]

http://www.gojaxstate.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=13918#13918

is JSU planning any stadium expansion prior to the move? What is their current attendence?

How would Troy view JSU's bid for Sun Belt membership - would they try and prevent it, or would they welcome it? And would the Sun Belt even want a 10th football member? I know Wright Waters said recently that 9 was ideal for football.

[FCSFAN]

I think there will be a new division made up of upper level FCS and lower level FBSI don't think there will be any changes made to D-I football. Just what they are proposing already.

[Cocky]

is JSU planning any stadium expansion prior to the move? What is their current attendence?

How would Troy view JSU's bid for Sun Belt membership - would they try and prevent it, or would they welcome it? And would the Sun Belt even want a 10th football member? I know Wright Waters said recently that 9 was ideal for football.

Expansion is approved, but I don't know the timetable.

Troy is pushing for us to go FBS and join the SunBelt and has been for several years.

[brownbear]

What are differences between qualifying for FCS and FBS

[Fresno St. Alum]

is JSU planning any stadium expansion prior to the move? What is their current attendence?

How would Troy view JSU's bid for Sun Belt membership - would they try and prevent it, or would they welcome it? And would the Sun Belt even want a 10th football member? I know Wright Waters said recently that 9 was ideal for football.

9 is good for football but 13 sucks for all other sports. I'd rather have 10/14 than 9/13. plus if a conference expands the Belt would get raided so you might want to keep membership up.

[Hammersmith]

What are differences between qualifying for FCS and FBS

FBS vs. FCS

1. 85 vs. 63 scholarships
2. Only full scholarships allowed vs. partials allowed
3. 77 scholarship minimum vs. no minimum
3. 15,000/game minimum home average vs. no minimum
4. 16 sport minimum vs. 14 sport minimum
5. 200(or $4M worth) in scholarships vs. lower minimum(complicated)

[lizrdgizrd]

FBS vs. FCS

1. 85 vs. 63 scholarships
2. Only full scholarships allowed vs. partials allowed
3. 77 scholarship minimum vs. no minimum
3. 15,000/game minimum home average vs. no minimum
4. 16 sport minimum vs. 14 sport minimum
5. 200(or $4M worth) in scholarships vs. lower minimum(complicated)
Is that 15K even actually observed?!?! Seems like there are some teams that aren't meeting that one. xeyebrowx

[JBB]

This may have already been suggested, but a solution could be to not allow moveups unless they had full conference affiliation. Leave it up to the conferences how much they want to share and how big they want to be. Dont allow any new conferences.

[aztecjim]

Is that 15K even actually observed?!?! Seems like there are some teams that aren't meeting that one. xeyebrowx

The NCAA claims that it now going to enforce the rule but still has laid down some pretty weak boundaries. It might be 6 years before any team is actually forced down

[EKU05]

Expansion is approved, but I don't know the timetable.

Troy is pushing for us to go FBS and join the SunBelt and has been for several years.


the Sunbelt is on record as saying they do not wish to add any more teams. They're hoping that Denver will eventually find a better home and then it will leave them with ideal numbers of 12 for basketball and nine for football.

I'm not saying they wouldn't make an exception for an old rival of Troy's, but I've seen Wright Waters state these things several different times. Any team wanting into the SBC will likely have to wait for some conference movement in addition to the end of the moratorium.

[SoCon48]

Is that 15K even actually observed?!?! Seems like there are some teams that aren't meeting that one. xeyebrowx

The 15K limit is a joke.

[Eastside Fan]

Bryant is the ONLY school here with a small chance of going Patriot League. That leaves the only other expansion possibilities as:

* private MAAC schools willing to play up to scholarship ball with AI restrictions
* private NEC schools " " " " " " " " " "
* private CAA schools which want to leave the conference (in the low likelihood this would happen, they would most likely be associate members) and are willing to live with AI restrictions

Furthermore, there's the issue with the A10/Big East football schools playing D-I football but not playing with the full allotment of funding. Let's say there's an option where schools like Dayton drop to D-III in football after four years in reclassification. What happens to G-Town in this case? Do they stay in the PL, or reclassify? Less likely, but can't be brought off the table, what about Villanova?

Don't forget there is also NJIT which is just as academically-qualified (Tier-2 National University in US News & World Reports 2008; conducts US$75 of research per year) and is in a more strategic geographical location than Bryant (would save most Patriot members time & traveling expenses).

It also offers the excellent facilities like the US$30 million Bears and Eagles Stadium (Baseball), the new Prudential Center (Basketball) and a new a all-weather soccer field.

This season, it is playing 5 out of 8 Patriot members (Army, Navy, Lehigh, Lafayee and American U) in Men's Basketball which is the most of any sports conference other than Independent (conference).

It probably is better known too because it carries the New Jersey state name.

Anyway, it does not matter now that Bryant has decided to join the NEC..... can't just say "I changed my mind and is not coming over" after signing a "Letter of Intention"...

[Eastside Fan]

^^^^ and this is why, D-I is becoming too watered down who the freak are Utah Valley, NJIT, Kennesaw State, Presby (I know who they are, but that's a tiny school) SC Upcoast, New Haven.

If all this kept up all there would be no teams left in DII and DIII

xrulesxIn case you do not know, NJIT is a state University that is rated as a Tier-2 National Univeristy by US News & World Report 2008. It currently conducts approximately US$75 million research per year.

xpeacexIt may seem like a weak sports school right now during this reclassification period but it is expected to improve as right now it could offer scholarships to athletics that avoided it because it was not Division 1.

xthumbsupxBesides these, it also has great facilities like the Bears and Eagles Stadium (baseball), the new Prudential Center (shares it with Seton Hall [main college tenant] and a new all-weather soccer field which was also used by Seton Hall University for an extended period last season when their conventional soccer field was unusable because of bad weather.

xrotatehxThe university is location in a talent-rich area which has 3 of the best basketball high-schools in the country including St Benedicts which is on the same street...

xoopsxMany of its sports program are still at the bottom of the league during this reclassification period but it is starting to show that it belongs to D1:


a) Men's Volleyball - Captured the EIVA Hay Division Championship and would play in the EIVA Tait Division which has a direct spot to NCAA Semi-Finals (equivalence of Final 4).

b) Women's Volleyball - RPI 258/324.

c) Men's Baseball - RPI 266/293

d) Women's Basketball - just beat last season's America East Regular Season Champion (UMBC) this week. Score 58-44.

e) Men's Tennis - won 3 of its 4 qualifying games against D1 opponents this season.

f) Women's Tennis - won all 3 of its qualifying games against D1 opponents this season.

xoopsxHowever it would be some time before all its sports program become respectable since they are still playing with D2 athletics and most of their players are still rookies..

xbowxFor example, the men's basketball team started with 2 rookies in the back-court (played their 2nd college game) and 6 rookies in the rotation when they played their first NIT Tip-off game in Washington in front of >8600 crowd. Needless to say, they lost the game with 29 turnovers against Brocman's team but they definitely would improve as they get more exposure.

:) Rome wasn't built in one day....

xcoffeexAs for having no teams in D2 and D3.....it shouldn't be a concern...there are many very regionally schools that only wants to focus on academics and do not feel that it is wise to waste the limited funds that they have on sports. Some schools like Rowan would rather stay in D3 to win National Titles than to upgrade to D1 and be mediocre or below-average. Other rich and reputable nerdy schools (like MIT and CMU) have loop-sided talents so staying D3 seems to be the best option. Schools that wish to upgrade to D1 feels that they could compete, are willing to invest the money in sports and most-likely are targeting better publicity which is probably what the students,staffs and alumni/alumnae want.

[Fresno St. Alum]

Good luck to you at NJ Tech. The NEC is taking Bryant over you as a 12th member but if/when C.Conn St. goes to the AEC there will be a spot for NJ Tech in the NEC or if Marist goes to the PL one of the non-fb schools will leave for the MAAC leaving a spot for NJ Tech.

[Eastside Fan]

Good luck to you at NJ Tech. The NEC is taking Bryant over you as a 12th member but if/when C.Conn St. goes to the AEC there will be a spot for NJ Tech in the NEC or if Marist goes to the PL one of the non-fb schools will leave for the MAAC leaving a spot for NJ Tech.

Well I certainly hope the public-status NJIT would be accepted by AE or Patriot which in my honest opinion are better profile fits especially now that the NEC has publicly indicated that it does not want NJIT and would rather take Bryant which is 3 years behind in reclassification process...

We would be in for more than the currently projected realignment when Big East fission's into Football and non-Football conferences sometime in the near future which would definitely trigger off some movements in A10, Colonia, Patriot AE, MAAC and NEC.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

Well I certainly hope the public-status NJIT would be accepted by AE or Patriot which in my honest opinion are better profile fits especially now that the NEC has publicly indicated that it does not want NJIT and would rather take Bryant which is 3 years behind in reclassification process...

We would be in for more than the currently projected realignment when Big East fission's into Football and non-Football conferences sometime in the near future which would definitely trigger off some movements in A10, Colonia, Patriot AE, MAAC and NEC.


I like your enthusiasm, but I'm not at all sure the Patriot League will be taking on NJIT anytime soon. Scheduling PL schools and joining the PL are two entirely different things - ask Marist.

Somebody did an analysis of graduation rates a while back, and NJIT (if I remember correctly) had a while to go before they got to the same level as the rest of the PL... PL schools look at that as much (some would say most of all) as nice facilities.

Didn't the students want football at one time?

[Eastside Fan]

I like your enthusiasm, but I'm not at all sure the Patriot League will be taking on NJIT anytime soon. Scheduling PL schools and joining the PL are two entirely different things - ask Marist.

Somebody did an analysis of graduation rates a while back, and NJIT (if I remember correctly) had a while to go before they got to the same level as the rest of the PL... PL schools look at that as much (some would say most of all) as nice facilities.

Didn't the students want football at one time?

The difference between NJIT and private schools is that they do not have to work to offset tuition fees...which partially explains on-time graduation rate in 4 or 5 years... I am under the impression that universities group together in sports conferences because of proximity and enough similarity.... Most of Patriot League universities are either tier 1 and tier 2 National Universities or top liberal arts colleges. Ultimately it would be left to the few representative members with voting rights to make the decision. What I feel is that NJIT would have to improve its RPI across the board to justify any invitation to any conference...one of the coaches indicated that this process could take up to 10 years...but they are really hoping to get into one where they really fit to solve all scheduling headaches and to be post-season eligible when the reclassification process is completed.

The students at NJIT voted for starting a Football program if the school intends to start a new sports but I seriously doubt its feasibility considering the cost and the student population needed to support it....many colleges in New Jersey including NJIT and Seton Hall terminated their Football program many years ago as they found it hard to support their teams without adequate funds and student population.... I believe Boston U terminated their program too......How much money is needed to support a competitive D1 Football team? I think there are other higher priority things ahead in the waiting list....The current US$128 million endowment fund isn't adequate for NJIT to embark on too many large-scale projects concurrently....

Recently the university just spent US$13 million preserving the oldest building on campus... (see http://www.njit.edu/publicinfo/press_releases/release_824.php), would be spending another US$78 million buying, preserving & renovating Central High School which sits between Rutgers Newark and NJIT (see http://media.www.njitvector.com/media/storage/paper1009/news/2007/10/16/News/Central.High.To.Be.Njit.Property-3038668.shtml ). It would also be building a Greek Village on campus (see http://gateway.njit.edu/index.php) and revitalizing neighboring parts of the city together with Rutgers Newark and the city of Newark.
See http://www.njit.edu/about/visit/njit-buildings.php to understand the situation better (the building without a tag is Central High School).

NJIT is not like other universities in sub-urban areas that could just spend a few tens of millions and built any sports facilities on existing land ....it has to buy the land and ensures that it blends into the surrounding.. judging from the amount of big projects that it would be under-taking in the near future, I doubt it could just straight away into Football. Prudential Center, Bears and Eagles Stadium and a new all weather soccer field would be all the school could offer until time is ripe for second-phase of the renovation of the on-campus Basketball/Volleyball gym for larger seating capacity...

Seton Hall university is a university that has roughly the same undergraduate student population as NJIT..... it has US$221 million endowment funds and charges higher tuition fees than NJIT.....if they also couldn't support Football, I doubt NJIT could....at least not in the near future....