Patriot Leaguers Check this out

[Lehigh74]

An article on the front page of today's New York Times prominently features all 4 of the "core" patriot League schools. The article discusses the highly selective nature of the so called "second tier" schools. This type of publicity is great for the league.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

Oh, man... this is BEAUTIFUL.... this article flows seamlessly into what I'm going to be talking about on Friday... the Academic Index, and the effect of the higher standards on recruiting.

And did you notice this part of the article?


John Dunham, a senior at the private Delbarton School in Morristown, N.J., had trained his sights on Bucknell University and Lafayette College. He was rejected by Bucknell and put on the waiting list at Lafayette. His college counselor pushed him toward Kenyon College in Ohio, or as the counselor put it “the Williams of the Midwest.”

But Mr. Dunham, a solid student who played football and baseball in high school, decided to play baseball on an athletic scholarship at Central Connecticut State.

I don't know if this writer read any of my stuff, but his use of the word "realities" is really heartening.


Students have generally been quicker to adapt to the new realities than parents have been, many guidance counselors said.

High school guidance counselors have become the reality instructors, encouraging students and parents to think more broadly about colleges.

Overall, a very good piece.

[Go...gate]

As always, great work, Lehigh74!

[letsgopards04]

I read the article this morning just thinking to myself that even though I only graduated 3 years ago I probably would not be able to get into Lafayette now and I got rejected by Bucknell.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

I posted the following to their message board.


As a very proud Lehigh alumnus, I’m perplexed by the responses to the article, ranging from “The Ivies are a bunch of elitists” to “Lehigh’s not really that good” to “College admissions shouldn’t be so competitive”. I think all these people miss the point of the article, that (basically) if you measure the academic qualifications of incoming students, the gap between the Harvard/Yale/Princeton’s and the Lehigh/Lafayette/Colgate’s are closing. The people who whine here about the article’s focus on the Ivies should instead be cheering the fact that Lehigh, Lafayette, Kenyon, Middlebury and the like are becoming considered basically in the “same tier” as Harvard, Yale or Princeton. It’s all more competitive than ever, and none of the posters here seem to have an answer to how it could be made less competitive.

Having said that, there are other issues at play here. More graduates are applying to more schools, but what isn’t being discussed is the issue of grade inflation by high schools. When half an incoming class has a 3.5 or better and the high school doesn’t disclose class ranking, that’s going to skew the landscape in a major way. You could argue that certain academies are “crowding out” all the elite spots in the Ivies (and now the Lehigh’s and Bowdoin’s), leaving the high-achievers in lesser-regarded high schools in the cold.

I’ve been studying the effects of academic standards on athletics on my blog at lehighfootballnation.blogspot.com. What I’ve been discovering is that the students haven’t been getting any smarter; what’s been happening is that many high schools have been changing the way they report about their students, thus masking weaknesses (like less-than-challenging coursework) harder to detect. The students don’t seem to have changed much; but the numbers are different.

I think the key is to find better ways of ranking incoming students academically. High schools will always want to brag that they had so-and-so many students go to Harvard, Yale, and Princeton; it’s up to college administrators to find new, creative ways to find out what the kids are really made of academically, so they can truly get the best students.

[RichH2]

Read it on the train this AM. Great article that highlights again what most of us have been discussing off and on for the last 2 years with recruiting, the rising floor has made admits much more difficult and some kids we could have gotten 4 yrs ago are now going to Monmouth , Albany etc. The flip side of course is national rise for PL schools in apps and more importantly the accurate perception for the kids particularly that PL and many other fine schools belong in the same tier as Ivies

[RichH2]

LFN 's point on on High schools slanting academic issues to show a better profile has been going on for years but does seem to be becoming more extreme. Does this tie in with the alleged dumbing down of the SATs?

[Lehigh Football Nation]

LFN 's point on on High schools slanting academic issues to show a better profile has been going on for years but does seem to be becoming more extreme. Does this tie in with the alleged dumbing down of the SATs?

I believe this does. Tune in Friday... xnodx

[MDFAN]

My son is a football player and for the past three years he has been taking honors and AP courses so that he would look attractive to the Ivy and Patriot league schools. Come to find out when his school computes GPA there is very little "boost" for taking the harder classes than the average joe that takes general math vs. calculus. so instead of a class rank of 60/315 he could have been 20/315. What since does that make? I guess we have to make everyone happy, but, you get what you work for!!

[RichH2]

MD

Could not agree more but as my granma said "cream always rises".

Most schools and I know LU does have profiles on many HSs especially how their students did at LU. Lower class rank does hurt even tho it shouldn't as much with AP courses but it does. Hopefully your HS has a good track record with PL schools.

[colgate13]

The top schools take into account the strength of courses. Trust me, 4.0 joe average taking regular classes is not more competitive at PL/Ivy than 3.2 joe honors taking honors/AP classes. This things do matter.

[Pard4Life]

Yes, you are right 13.

I am an alum admissions rep and the first thing I tell parents/students is.. "Lafayette is primarily concerned with Honors/APs taken, your grades.. and then test scores etc..."

Lafayette was very tough this year. Girl I interviewed was fluent in Russian, first-gen American, good HS, honors/APs, leadership stuff, prestigous summer program (Gov School)... she was waitlisted... I was shocked. I felt like calling admissions and asking what the deal was, but I chilled out.

MDFAN - the GPA difference between an A in regular and AP is substantial... 4.0 vs. 5.0.. (at my old HS at least).

The NY Times article was dead-on. Only downside was seeing Lehigh as the feature xrotatehx ...but I am glad they mentioned Colgate, Bucknell, Lafayette in the same breath... who needs further proof we are all joined at the hip? My favorite quote: “Now a kid who is applying to Harvard, Yale, Princeton is also applying to the Lehighs and Lafayettes,” said Brett Levine, director of guidance at Madison High School in New Jersey. “It’s the same tier, basically.” ... and it's the most emailed article too!

I still feel confident that I'd get in though.. I was a close reject at Middlebury.. they asked if I'd be interested in being spring semester admit candidate (less apps, good admit percentage) and I declined... in retrospect.. stooopid... but hey, they don't have D-I football!! And I love Lafayette, so eh...

[PLLB]

Read it on the train this AM. Great article that highlights again what most of us have been discussing off and on for the last 2 years with recruiting, the rising floor has made admits much more difficult and some kids we could have gotten 4 yrs ago are now going to Monmouth , Albany etc. The flip side of course is national rise for PL schools in apps and more importantly the accurate perception for the kids particularly that PL and many other fine schools belong in the same tier as Ivies


i see this article in a totally different light. IMO it spells out the problem with athletics esp. football in the patriot league. the patriot league schools will not beat the IVY's on a football player, but that is who the PL schools have to recruit against, PL schools can not compete on the field nationally with the ivy league rejects (athletically) and NESCAC kids. So the quality of the league as a whole suffers.

[RichH2]

PLLB

That is the point. We have been debating this for over a yr. The problem while perhaps nice for the schools overall puts recruiting in a bind. As I think LFN noted ,the PL AI floor is higher than the Ivies. The PL is hiring an outside consultant to address the current system

[ngineer]

I'm an Alumini Outreach volunteer attending college fairs for the University each fall, and I know that we have been instructed by Admissions to stress to students who are Sophs and Juniors to not 'slack off' senior year. Lehigh wants to see AP and Honors courses that are challenging. They would rather see B's and Cs in AP courses than A's in some generic 'college prep' curriculum. There are so many more applicant's today in the competitve environment. Over 10,000 last year for 1100 slots, and you know the great majority wouldn't waste their time applying if they weren't qualified on paper. I have strong sense that I would have a tough time getting admitted in today's world, though I was recruited for football. Without that particular 'thing' to give Lehigh, together with alot of quality extracurriculars (two other sports, musicals, leadership posts) I wouldn't get a second look. A lot of kids have 'good grades' and scores, today's student has to make themselves standout. I'm glad that due attention is being given to the PL schools for I know in going around the region, the reputation for the PL is 'hot'. The fact that we can also put a quality athletic product on the field with such academic rigors says a lot for our institutions.

[Lehigh74]

The NY Times article was dead-on. Only downside was seeing Lehigh as the feature xrotatehx ...but I am glad they mentioned Colgate, Bucknell, Lafayette in the same breath... who needs further proof we are all joined at the hip? My favorite quote: “Now a kid who is applying to Harvard, Yale, Princeton is also applying to the Lehighs and Lafayettes,” said Brett Levine, director of guidance at Madison High School in New Jersey. “It’s the same tier, basically.” ... and it's the most emailed article too!


I admit, it was great to see Lehigh as the featured school in the story. However, as you point out, the 4 core Patriot League schools are joined at the hip. Therefore, anything that is good for any of the 4, is also good for all of them collectively. The old saying is, "a rising tide raises all ships".

[Pards Rule]

Great press for the "Pats"...(Pats = new Ivies)...When I saw Lehigh on the first page, I flipped to the continuation hoping for an LC mention and the quote from that Madison HS guy was excellent! Gotta love the Pats!