Thread: SoCon Week 7 Power Rankings/Pick 'Em

[SCPALADIN]

1. Furman
2. Wofford
3. Chattanooga
4. Samford
5. VMI
6. Mercer
7. The Citadel
8. ETSU
9. W. Carolina


SAMFORD vs VMI
W. Carolina vs The CITADEL

[rtzlunar]

1. Furman
2. Wofford
3. Chattanooga
4. Samford
5. VMI
6. Mercer
7. The Citadel
8. ETSU
9. W. Carolina


SAMFORD vs VMI
W. Carolina vs The CITADEL

Move Mercer to 8 and ETSU to 6.

[SCPALADIN]

Move Mercer to 8 and ETSU to 6.

Won't argue with that.

[apaladin]

1. Furman
2. Chattanooga
3. Wofford
4. VMI
5. Samford
6. Citadel
7. ETSU
8. Mercer
9. WCU

Samford at VMI
WCU at Citadel

[843yapterrier]

1. Furman (Class of the SoCon, clinical vs. Samford)
2. Wofford (O-line & Newman clicking w/o overthinking~Lang calling plays comfortably)
3. Chattanooga (Is this remotely accurate, hard to know yet)
4. Samford (NEED Oladokun 100 percent healthy)
5. Virginia Military (Samford game is huge opportunity to validate rise)
6. East Tennessee (Defense is elite EXCEPT against option)
7. Citadel (Gamecocks of the SoCon ⬇️ crashing back to borderline mediocrity reality after rambling GT)
8. Mercer (Invested $ in winning, not likely to reinvest in Lambduck)
9. Western Carolina (0 for SoCon, tell me where they win?)

Excited to join AGS and this weekly thread. Go Terriers!

Samford at VMI
WCU at Citadel

[gofurman]

1. Furman (class of the SoCon, clinical today)
2. Wofford (Offense line and Newman clicking w/o overthinking and Lang calling plays more comfortably)
3. Chattanooga (still unknown if this is remotely accurate)
4. Samford (only if Chris USF is 100 percent soon)
5. Virginia Military (Samford game/score will decide if they are no longer bottom tier)
6. East Tennessee (Defense makes them better than citadel but any option scheme should scare them after first half today)
7. Citadel (Gamecocks of the Socon still crashing back to borderline mediocrity reality after rambling Tech)
8. Mercer (invested in winning and looks like Lamb is a lame duck)
9. Western (don’t see where they win in conference)

Excited to join AGS and this weekly thread. Go Terriers!

Samford at VMI
WCU at Citadel

Yap, Good to have you. get more of your brethren on here so we can have more discussion! More Woff or any SoCon fans !

[bonarae]

VMI in a close game
The Citadel rebounds

[walliver]

Power ratings:
1) Furman - They are here until they lose
2-3) Wofford and Chatty both got off to bad starts, so it is hard to distinguish between the two, so I will do the honorable thing
2) Chattanooga - Offense seems to be finally scoring.
3) Wofford - one of only two SoCon teams with a winning record.
4) ETSU - If their receivers could catch the ball they would move up
5) VMI - a very under-rated team, but not a great team. No-one should overlook them.
6) Samford - Another Hatcher team. They've look good a few times this year, but couldn't stop the Citadel passing attack, and yesterday was bad
7) The Citadel - Brent Thompson was outraged when the coaches picked his team to finish 7th. The bulldogs are running a triple option missing several of the options. They will play with heart the rest of the season, but probably won't win often.
8) Mercer - There are no sure bet wins coming up this season. Maybe they regroup to play spoiler, but the end of the Bobby Lamb era is at hand.
9) Western Carolina - traditional bad defense, but now offense struggles. They haven't even gotten to the tough part of their schedule, and end the season at Alabama

This week:
VMI and Samford - never count out VMI, but Samford has something to prove and wins in a shootout 42-38
WCU at The Citadel - The bullpups are well-coached and disciplined. The Cants aren't, and that makes the difference. The Citadel wins 28-13

Playoffs:
Furman is in good shape for an auto bid or at-large. An FCS loss and they are still safe. 2 conference losses and they finish 8-4 (6-2), but 7-4 against D-1 competition - not a great record but the committee should let them in.
Chattanooga is unbeaten in conference and still controls their destiny
Samford will need help to win autobid, but if they win out (losing to Auburn), they would be 8-4 (7-1) and in good shape
Wofford can tie if they win out, and would beat out FU for autobid, unless Samford also wins out (in which case the points allowed factor comes into play). Winning out (other than Clemson) would put team in a good spot for an at-large at 8-3 (7-1). Losing an FCS game would produce a 7-4 (6-2) record which would definitely be on the bubble and would depend on who else is on the bubble.
There are likely scenarios for other teams to win the autobid,but none are likely to occur.

[youwouldno]

1. Furman
2. Wofford
3. Samford
4. Chattanooga
5. VMI
6. Citadel
7. ETSU
8. Mercer
9. WCU

Samford at VMI
WCU at Citadel

Tempted to pick VMI, but I don't buy into their defense . . . 45-38 sort of game. I overestimated Citadel against VMI but WCU is just bad.

[ElCid]

1. Furman
2. Wofford
3. Samford
4. Chattanooga
5. VMI
6. Citadel
7. ETSU
8. Mercer
9. WCU

Samford at VMI
WCU at Citadel

Tempted to pick VMI, but I don't buy into their defense . . . 45-38 sort of game. I overestimated Citadel against VMI but WCU is just bad.


VMI was due and we are just in a free fall. Our QB is gimpy, our BBack was out again, our secondary sucks, and we were missing one of our starting LBs the first half due to a seriously weak targeting call at Samford. We are simply disjointed right now. But I think VMI is being underestimated by many right now. Not sure what happened with them when they played Bob, but I think they are just starting to learn how to win again and the road is bumpy. They should be 4-2 and on their way to a winning season. It will be tough, but I would not doubt that VMI can do it. On the other hand, if we fall to WCU, then we are in serious trouble. The ship better be righted this coming weekend.

[FU_Paladin08]

1. Furman: No FCS losses. Still have to play UTC and Woffy, both on the road.
2. Samford: Only reason I have them here is due to the H2H win AT Wofford. Furman exposed that defense and they could drop multiple spots if VMI abuses that defense further.
3. Wofford: Are they back to their winning ways? I’m not sold yet. They are winning winnable games since losing to Samford. I’ll check back after the UTC game and look forward to the showdown with Furman.
4. Chattanooga: Nice to see them winning again.
5. VMI: Their ability to score keeps them in every game. Looking at 2-3 more SoCon losses though.
6. ETSU: This begins the “not winning the SoCon” teams.
7. The Citadel: Had such potential.
8. Mercer: Hate it for them, I really do.
9. W. Carolina: IDK, I guess they could get a win if Tyree caught fire one game...Maybe VMI or ETSU?


SAMFORD vs VMI: Samford bounces back.
W. Carolina vs The CITADEL: Call it a scrimmage
BYE vs FURMAN: Furman domination continues

[kdinva]

VMI was due .....Not sure what happened with them when they played Bob,....

team was still giddy after the ETSU win. When VMI dropped a sure INT in the gut early in the first period, I said: "Oh ohhhh".....then Wofford woke them up. Fell behind 35-10, but still fought back. Two TDs late in 2nd period, and another late in the 4th.

[PaladinFan]

Samford is probably going to be in for a firefight with VMI.

The Bulldogs have faced a handful of run-heavy teams to this point, and really hasn't seen a passing offense that may rival their own.

If Samford has playoff aspirations, they are going to have to tighten it up on defense.

[PaladinFan]

Looking at the numbers, Furman is second in the SoCon in scoring offense (by 1 ppg) and first in scoring defense. From what I can tell, the last time a SoCon team finished first in both categories was UTC's 2014 team.

Interestingly, that was also a one-bid year for the SoCon in the post season.

[SU DOG]

Samford is probably going to be in for a firefight with VMI.

The Bulldogs have faced a handful of run-heavy teams to this point, and really hasn't seen a passing offense that may rival their own.

If Samford has playoff aspirations, they are going to have to tighten it up on defense.

100% AGREE

[The Cats]

SAMFORD vs VMI
W. Carolina vs The CITADEL





1. (1) Furman (4-2, 3-0 SoCon)
Next: bye

2. (4) Wofford (3-2, 2-1 SoCon)
Next: bye

3. (5) Chattanooga (3-3, 2-0 SoCon)
Next: bye

4. (8) VMI (3-3, 2-1 SoCon)
Next: Samford

5. (2) Samford (3-3, 2-1 SoCon)
Next: at VMI

6. (3) The Citadel (2-4, 0-2 SoCon)
Next: Western Carolina

7. (6) ETSU (2-4, 0-3 SoCon)
Next: bye

8. (7) Mercer (2-4, 1-2 SoCon)
Next: bye

9. (9) Western Carolina (1-4, 0-2 SoCon)
Next: at The Citadel

[PaladinFan]

In the least surprising news of the day, Devin Wynn is named SoCon offensive player of the week. http://www.soconsports.com/ViewArticle.dbml?ATCLID=211813587&DB_OEM_ID=4000

I had heard this in the broadcast, but forgotten it - Furman now has 10 wins in their last 11 games against FCS competition. The only team to beat them during that span was Samford (last year).

[Mocs123]

Samford - 45
VMI - 35

Western Carolina - 28
The Citadel - 41

1.) Furman
2.) Wofford
3.) Chattanooga
4.) Samford
5.) The Citadel
6.) VMI
7.) ETSU
8.) Mercer
9. Western Carolina

D1 Wins possible ($ games not counted except The Citadel’s win over GT)
Furman – 9
Chattanooga – 9
Wofford – 8
Samford – 8
The Citadel- 8
Mercer – 7
VMI – 7
Western Carolina – 7
ETSU – 6 (out)

[Milktruck74]

In the least surprising news of the day, Devin Wynn is named SoCon offensive player of the week. http://www.soconsports.com/ViewArticle.dbml?ATCLID=211813587&DB_OEM_ID=4000

I had heard this in the broadcast, but forgotten it - Furman now has 10 wins in their last 11 games against FCS competition. The only team to beat them during that span was Samford (last year).

Very impressive performance. Anytime you eclipse 200 yards is impressive, but he did it on just a few carries. Chattanooga's Troy Boeck was the Defensive POW, and while his performance may not have been as noticeable as Wynn's, he did have 12 tackles, 2 TFLs and 2 forced fumbles, recovering one....and Mercer only had the ball for 22 minutes, so he did it on quite a few less plays than normal.

[Milktruck74]

Now, All of y'al are putting the Mocs at 3rd....STOP!!!! I love the Mocs and I want them to be there, but they haven't beaten anybody yet...the two worst teams in the conference...So, Earned 7th spot....give them a spot or two more, but third is a stretch....I think they can get there, bet they aren't there yet!!!

[Mocs123]

To be honest, you could probably rank, Chattanooga, Wofford, and Samford in any order right now in the 3-5 spots. None of them have really looked spectacular.

The same could be said of the sixth, seventh, and eighth spots, you could argue them in any order. I think the only two solid spot holders are Furman at #1 and Western at #9.

[gofurman]

To be honest, you could probably rank, Chattanooga, Wofford, and Samford in any order right now in the 3-5 spots. None of them have really looked spectacular.

The same could be said of the sixth, seventh, and eighth spots, you could argue them in any order. I think the only two solid spot holders are Furman at #1 and Western at #9.

Well, assuming VMI Citadel and ETSU are 6-8 I think you have to give some edge to VMI as they beat the other two H2H already - which is shocking! VMI coach has to be up for SoCon coach of the year...

[Scrappy94]

1. Furman
2. Chattanooga
3. Wofford
4. Samford
5. The Citadel
6. VMI
7. Mercer
8. ETSU
9. Western Carolina

Samford @ VMI
Western Carolina @ The Citadel

[PaladinFan]

Well, assuming VMI Citadel and ETSU are 6-8 I think you have to give some edge to VMI as they beat the other two H2H already - which is shocking! VMI coach has to be up for SoCon coach of the year...

The scary thought for the SoCon, though, is that VMI is starting to win games not because they are "better", but the conference competition is now down at their level.

[BlackNGoldR3v0lut10n]

I was 3-2 last week. VMI surprised me yet again while ETSU could not find a way to defend the option. Here's where I have it after this week.

1) Furman - vanquished another conference foe
2) Chattanooga - racked up another conference win
3) Samford - got the daylights beat out of them
4) Wofford - still the only conference foe ETSU has yet to beat since their return
5) VMI - brings the Silver Shako home for the first time in over a decade
6) The Citadel - had nothing to be ashamed of in the beginning, now dang
7) ETSU - quite possibly the best 0-3 team in conference play in FCS
8) Mercer - was slaughtered at home
9) Western Carolina - lost at home yet again

Week 7 Games
Samford @ VMI (Game of the Week) - Keydets defend this house
Western Carolina @ The Citadel​ - Bulldogs finally score their first conference win

[gofurman]

The scary thought for the SoCon, though, is that VMI is starting to win games not because they are "better", but the conference competition is now down at their level.

I know and agree THAT is worrisome. If we are all fighting off a standard VMI team that is nota good thing. I hope VMI is better but the Robert Morris game is not good so I guess I hope Samford wins this week or else our win isn't so great

[FU_Paladin08]

I think the only two solid spot holders are Furman at #1 and Western at #9.

Amen!

[PaladinFan]

How hot is Brett Thompson's seat?

Other than Bobby Lamb, I thought Thompson would be the hottest chair of any SoCon coach (though, for reasons known only to WCU's administration, not Mark Speir).

They had respectable showings against two ranked FCS teams, but lost. They beat Georgia Tech. Now they've lost consecutive SoCon games, including a rivalry game with VMI. They still have Wofford, Furman, and UTC on the schedule.

They are looking at a third straight losing record in Thompson's fourth season.

Not that anyone's looking, but Drew Cronic's Lenoir Rhyne team is 5-0 and ranked #8 in D2. I think he's 17-2 in two seasons in Hickory.

[Mocs123]

Well, assuming VMI Citadel and ETSU are 6-8 I think you have to give some edge to VMI as they beat the other two H2H already - which is shocking! VMI coach has to be up for SoCon coach of the year...

True, but I think that is offset by the fact that VMI lost to Robert Morris (#111 of 126 teams) and ETSU beat a decent Austin Peay Team (#52). In fact the Austin Peay win is sadly the "best" win the SoCon has had in the FCS OOC.

And yes, I would think that Scott Wachenheiem has to be in contention (probably with Clax Hendrix) for SoCon COY. To be honest, I think everyone else has underperformed, with the exception of perhaps Rusty Wright, who is about where we thought he would be.

[Mocs123]

The scary thought for the SoCon, though, is that VMI is starting to win games not because they are "better", but the conference competition is now down at their level.

With the way the SoCon performed in the OOC this year, I'm afraid of that too. It doesn't help that our best team - Furman played a pretty bad OOC schedule this year (I won't give too much crap because the Paladin's normally play a good schedule). Wofford and , and ETSU, who went to the playoffs last year, didn't play anyone either. Chattanooga and The Citadel played a good OOC schedule, but didn't beat the ranked FCS teams they (we) needed to beat to help the conference.

Our best FCS OOC win is Austin Peay, and we have teams that lost to Robert Morris and Tennessee Tech.

[gofurman]

How hot is Brett Thompson's seat?

Other than Bobby Lamb, I thought Thompson would be the hottest chair of any SoCon coach (though, for reasons known only to WCU's administration, not Mark Speir).

They had respectable showings against two ranked FCS teams, but lost. They beat Georgia Tech. Now they've lost consecutive SoCon games, including a rivalry game with VMI. They still have Wofford, Furman, and UTC on the schedule.

They are looking at a third straight losing record in Thompson's fourth season.

Not that anyone's looking, but Drew Cronic's Lenoir Rhyne team is 5-0 and ranked #8 in D2. I think he's 17-2 in two seasons in Hickory.

Don’t help Citadel look at Cronic. Please

[walliver]

Schools seem to have different expectations:
The Citadel historically seems happy with good teams every 4-6 years. Brent Thompson's tenure seems to be on a downhill trajectory. I don't know how hot his seat is, but he needs to turn things around quickly.
Mercer, although not long in the league, is quite aware of never having made the playoffs. I agree that Bobby Lamb is on the hot seat, and may need to look for a FBS coordinator gig.
WCU seems to have become accustomed to poor performance, so Speir's seat is not as hot as I would expect it be be. WCU's administration reminds me of CSU's - they want a football team and seem happy just having one.

[Mocs123]

I think beating Georgia Tech keeps Thompson safe for the year, no matter how the rest of the season ends up.

ETSU making the playoffs last year, probably didn't help the temperature of Lamb's seat. I actually thought Mercer started off out of the gate with a better program than ETSU, but last year ETSU seemed to pass Mercer.

I think WCU' administration just needs a FB team so the band has somewhere to play.

[BlackNGoldR3v0lut10n]

ETSU making the playoffs last year, probably didn't help the temperature of Lamb's seat. I actually thought Mercer started off out of the gate with a better program than ETSU, but last year ETSU seemed to pass Mercer.


Wonder why, you forgot that ETSU's win streak vs. Mercer started in the Torbush er(ror).

[SU DOG]

As a wise man once told me, "Coaches win games, but administrators win championships." With that said, IMO, Mercer will someday soon be your biggest threat in the SoCon. That may sound strange(time will tell), but their administration is determined for the Bears to excel. I say this from afar, but I think I am right. Don't fool yourself, there are lots of SoCon schools with top administrators who feel it is "NICE" when their school wins, but don't want any part of the hassle of fixing the problem when they lose. They will take no action until and unless they just have to. For example, a 6-5 season with a nice Homecoming crowd, and the year has been a success in their opinion. They do NOT hold the football program to the same standard that we fans do. We don't want to believe this, but hey....I'm just sayin. I believe this situation exists in MANY schools, and not just the SoCon. If your Pres, BOT, Chancellor, and other top administrators are as concerned about the football program as you are - you are very fortunate.

[Mocs123]

I feel you are right, Mercer wants to win, and will not be satisfied with 6-5 seasons. I would like to think that's the same at Chattanooga, but I'm not always so sure.

[BearDownMU]

As a wise man once told me, "Coaches win games, but administrators win championships." With that said, IMO, Mercer will someday soon be your biggest threat in the SoCon. That may sound strange(time will tell), but their administration is determined for the Bears to excel. I say this from afar, but I think I am right. Don't fool yourself, there are lots of SoCon schools with top administrators who feel it is "NICE" when their school wins, but don't want any part of the hassle of fixing the problem when they lose. They will take no action until and unless they just have to. For example, a 6-5 season with a nice Homecoming crowd, and the year has been a success in their opinion. They do NOT hold the football program to the same standard that we fans do. We don't want to believe this, but hey....I'm just sayin. I believe this situation exists in MANY schools, and not just the SoCon. If your Pres, BOT, Chancellor, and other top administrators are as concerned about the football program as you are - you are very fortunate.

I think this is accurate. Every time I've ever heard President Underwood speak, whether to a group, or to me personally, he is talking about championships. That's the goal. And it isn't just football. Baseball has been good for a long time. Coach Gibson doing a great job there. I think 11 straight years of at least 35 wins, reigning Socon champs.. Just hired Coach Gary from Purdue for men's basketball. Women's basketball is the reigning Socon champ. We are pumping resources into literally every sport with the goal being to win. All he talks about is winning. And he believes athletics is a huge driver to university visibility and attractiveness to all prospective students.

[chattownmocs]

Now, All of y'al are putting the Mocs at 3rd....STOP!!!! I love the Mocs and I want them to be there, but they haven't beaten anybody yet...the two worst teams in the conference...So, Earned 7th spot....give them a spot or two more, but third is a stretch....I think they can get there, bet they aren't there yet!!!

It'd be fair to put them at 2nd as far as I can tell. It's also hard to tell because Chattanooga has played a lopsided schedule with their losses to "good" teams(Tennessee obviously has a lot more talent than most FCS teams, Jacksonville State did beat EWU) and their wins over bad teams. You could also legitimately dock them for not having beaten anyone and not looking impressive at all against UT or JSU. The transitive property never has worked very well in FCS football in general but it will leave you scratching tour head if you even begin to try and apply it this season.

[chattownmocs]

I think the 2014 UTC comparison is interesting. It honestly feels like the league might have actually been a little tougher then to me...but I will also say that this Furman team could very well be better than that UTC team. I thought Furman would be tripped up but they might not even be challenged again the way things are looking.

[chattownmocs]

Btw, Ursus, I really hate that mobile posts get deleted when you try to edit them. It is soul crushing every time it happens. I guess I'll have to learn to proofread before I post.

[Mocs123]

Chattanooga has to date won the games they were supposed to win (#104 Eastern Illinois, #108 Western Carolina, and #91 Mercer), and lost the games they probably weren't supposed to win (#17 Jacksonville State, UTK, #2 James Madison). To be honest, I thought the game at JSU was closer then the final score, and it didn't feel like we were out of the JMU game until late. That just tells us that Chattanooga is somewhere between #17 and #91 in the country, so yes we could certainly be anywhere from 2nd to 7th. Wofford and Samford have both lost games they were "supposed" to win so you can use that against them, or you can ignore it. I don't think either way is right or wrong, just different. Honestly at this point in the season, we're just guessing on who goes where (other than Furman and WCU).

Currently Massey has the following (this is SAD):
#17 Furman
#43 Wofford
#45 Samford
#54 Chattanooga
#64 The Citadel
#79 ETSU
#82 VMI
#91 Mercer
#108 Western Carolina


The SoCon FCS OOC wins
#52 Austin Peay
#93 Charleston Southern
#93 Charleston Southern
#96 Gardner Webb
#98 Alabama A&M
#104 Eastern Illinois
#126 Presbyterian

The SoCon FCS OOC losses
#4 James Madison
#14 Towson
#15 Youngstown State
#39 Jacksonville State
#40 Elon
#52 Austin Peay
#60 Tennessee Tech
#66 South Carolina State
#80 Campbell
#96 Gardner Webb
#111 Robert Morris

[FU_Paladin08]

[QUOTE=SU DOG;2811346]Mercer will someday soon be your biggest threat in the SoCon. That may sound strange(time will tell), but their administration is determined for the Bears to excel./QUOTE]

Sounds right to me. I doubt they would have started up that program without a goal in mind. With the loss of GSU and App St the void has not been filled by ETSU, VMI, and Mercer. However, Mercer seems best suited to build something Based on the recruiting area.

[PaladinFan]

I think this is accurate. Every time I've ever heard President Underwood speak, whether to a group, or to me personally, he is talking about championships. That's the goal. And it isn't just football. Baseball has been good for a long time. Coach Gibson doing a great job there. I think 11 straight years of at least 35 wins, reigning Socon champs.. Just hired Coach Gary from Purdue for men's basketball. Women's basketball is the reigning Socon champ. We are pumping resources into literally every sport with the goal being to win. All he talks about is winning. And he believes athletics is a huge driver to university visibility and attractiveness to all prospective students.

Same. I've heard Underwood speak a number of times. He always talks about athletics and winning.

Granted, I think recruiting is more difficult for Mercer now that they are in the SoCon. They aren't the big fish they were in the A-Sun.

[PaladinFan]

True, but I think that is offset by the fact that VMI lost to Robert Morris (#111 of 126 teams) and ETSU beat a decent Austin Peay Team (#52). In fact the Austin Peay win is sadly the "best" win the SoCon has had in the FCS OOC.

And yes, I would think that Scott Wachenheiem has to be in contention (probably with Clax Hendrix) for SoCon COY. To be honest, I think everyone else has underperformed, with the exception of perhaps Rusty Wright, who is about where we thought he would be.

part of me still thinks that Furman's win over Charleston Southern may look better in retrospect. The Bucs got their first win of the season last week, but played top 25 NC A&T and the Citadel down to the wire.

They play Kennesaw this week. That'll be a game that could upset a lot of polls. I imagine pollsters will drop Kennesaw like a rock if and when they lose.

Of course, now KSU will win by 60.

[PaladinFan]

I think the 2014 UTC comparison is interesting. It honestly feels like the league might have actually been a little tougher then to me...but I will also say that this Furman team could very well be better than that UTC team. I thought Furman would be tripped up but they might not even be challenged again the way things are looking.

I don't feel confident to put Furman in the category of "dominant" front runner status like the 2008-10 App State teams, which, I think, lost 1 SoCon game in three years (on the road at Georgia Southern).

I do think they are the clearest front runner we've had in a few years. Last season, ETSU's point differential was negligible, and they rarely seemed like clearly the best team in any game. Wofford in 2017 won game after game by their chin hairs.

Furman feels a bit different to me this year. I wouldn't be shocked if they lost, but I also think that they'll be heavy favorites against everyone they face.

Even against ETSU. Furman didn't play well, but the Paladins still led the entire game and you never really got the impression the Bucs were going to take a lead. They struggled to cross midfield, and their only touchdown was after a turnover in Furman territory (sort of similar to Furman's game against UTC last season).

It reminded me of a game Furman played against Elon years ago. Ingle Martin's Paladin team won 10-0 against the Phoenix on the road. Elon never really threatened to win the game, but it was so strange to see that offense be slowed down against anyone, much less the league's worst team. Sometimes that sort of thing happens.

[Milktruck74]

Alright, Y'all shut up about Drew Cronic.....If he ends up at Mercer, we may all be playing for that second At large bid. The Guy is a gamer, and with Mercer's commitment to winning.....he may be the real deal. AndI can assure you he isn't coaching at LRC next season. Somebody will scoop him up.

[youwouldno]

Alright, Y'all shut up about Drew Cronic.....If he ends up at Mercer, we may all be playing for that second At large bid. The Guy is a gamer, and with Mercer's commitment to winning.....he may be the real deal. AndI can assure you he isn't coaching at LRC next season. Somebody will scoop him up.

I wouldn't go quite that far. I do think he's the favorite to take over for Lamb. Cronic's offensive chops are clear (he'd be the best play-caller in the conference without a doubt), but putting together a complete program at the FCS level is different than continuing existing success at the D-II level.

[BearDownMU]

I wouldn't go quite that far. I do think he's the favorite to take over for Lamb. Cronic's offensive chops are clear (he'd be the best play-caller in the conference without a doubt), but putting together a complete program at the FCS level is different than continuing existing success at the D-II level.

Who do we think is the favorite?

[Mocs123]

I don't feel confident to put Furman in the category of "dominant" front runner status like the 2008-10 App State teams, which, I think, lost 1 SoCon game in three years (on the road at Georgia Southern).

I do think they are the clearest front runner we've had in a few years. Last season, ETSU's point differential was negligible, and they rarely seemed like clearly the best team in any game. Wofford in 2017 won game after game by their chin hairs.

Furman feels a bit different to me this year. I wouldn't be shocked if they lost, but I also think that they'll be heavy favorites against everyone they face.

Even against ETSU. Furman didn't play well, but the Paladins still led the entire game and you never really got the impression the Bucs were going to take a lead. They struggled to cross midfield, and their only touchdown was after a turnover in Furman territory (sort of similar to Furman's game against UTC last season).

It reminded me of a game Furman played against Elon years ago. Ingle Martin's Paladin team won 10-0 against the Phoenix on the road. Elon never really threatened to win the game, but it was so strange to see that offense be slowed down against anyone, much less the league's worst team. Sometimes that sort of thing happens.

Furman is the most dominant team the SoCon has seen since the 2014 Chattanooga team. I'm not trying to say one is better than the other, but just that we have one team that seems clearly dominate in the conference, and that doesn't happen a lot.

[youwouldno]

Who do we think is the favorite?

Drew Cronic, head coach of Lenior-Rhyne. Based on zero inside knowledge, pure speculation based on Cronic's strong Georgia ties, starting up NAIA Reinhardt, dominant offensive season as OC at Furman, 2 seasons of dominance as D-II head coach.

[PaladinNation]

So… Drew Cronic or George Quarles??? BTW… we can thank Cronic for recruiting Darren Grainger.

I like Quarles 2019 play calling better than Cronic's 2017 play calling. Cronic inherited PJ who was ripe to be productive if you put some control on his game. Quarles is developing QBs and gradually opening the offense. I'm very excited about watching this offense develop.

I'll add one more I don't want to think about this as a Furman fan. Duane Vaughn is doing an amazing job as a first year DC. This defense is quietly playing dominate football, while building depth and playing freshmen all over the field. I'm hoping Vaughn stays off the radar of FBS schools.

[youwouldno]

So… Drew Cronic or George Quarles??? BTW… we can thank Cronic for recruiting Darren Grainger.

I like Quarles 2019 play calling better than Cronic's 2017 play calling. Cronic inherited PJ who was ripe to be productive if you put some control on his game. Quarles is developing QBs and gradually opening the offense. I'm very excited about watching this offense develop.

I'll add one more I don't want to think about this as a Furman fan. Duane Vaughn is doing an amazing job as a first year DC. This defense is quietly playing dominate football, while building depth and playing freshmen all over the field. I'm hoping Vaughn stays off the radar of FBS schools.

I think Quarles would be more of a factor with Tennessee programs (and I think he has been already). But he's certainly going to be on the radar around the SoCon at a minimum.

[PaladinFan]

So… Drew Cronic or George Quarles??? BTW… we can thank Cronic for recruiting Darren Grainger.

I like Quarles 2019 play calling better than Cronic's 2017 play calling. Cronic inherited PJ who was ripe to be productive if you put some control on his game. Quarles is developing QBs and gradually opening the offense. I'm very excited about watching this offense develop.

I'll add one more I don't want to think about this as a Furman fan. Duane Vaughn is doing an amazing job as a first year DC. This defense is quietly playing dominate football, while building depth and playing freshmen all over the field. I'm hoping Vaughn stays off the radar of FBS schools.

Quarles also has a lot more weapons at his disposal. Cronic had a league-leading offense with ill-fitting puzzle pieces. Quarles has a bunch of cards to play at any time.

[FUBeAR]

Alright, Y'all shut up about Drew Cronic.....If he ends up at Mercer, we may all be playing for that second At large bid. The Guy is a gamer, and with Mercer's commitment to winning.....he may be the real deal. AndI can assure you he isn't coaching at LRC next season. Somebody will scoop him up.#ReinhardtMade

[gofurman]

Quarles also has a lot more weapons at his disposal. Cronic had a league-leading offense with ill-fitting puzzle pieces. Quarles has a bunch of cards to play at any time.

you guys are all scaring me mentioning Furman guys- why doesn't Mercer take ETSU Randy Sanders and offer him lots of money.. of the Austin Peay or TTU coach etc. stay away from our Furman guys ! Or, yes. take Cronic but leave Furman alone. Good point above about Cronic being awesome with ill-fitting pieces: I think Quarles has more weapons at his disposal now than Cronic did. No doubt. And Cronic instantly changed FU's offense with the same guys who went 3-8 the year before he got there. Then had us go from 3 wins to 8 wins. Quarles has more recruits (Wynn, Watkins, Anderson etc) to play with I think and also ones that FIT the system they want to run ...

Take Cronic - stay away from Furman

[Mocs123]

If Mercer will wait a year or to, Tom Arth may be available. :)

[gofurman]

Chattanooga has to date won the games they were supposed to win (#104 Eastern Illinois, #108 Western Carolina, and #91 Mercer), and lost the games they probably weren't supposed to win (#17 Jacksonville State, UTK, #2 James Madison). To be honest, I thought the game at JSU was closer then the final score, and it didn't feel like we were out of the JMU game until late. That just tells us that Chattanooga is somewhere between #17 and #91 in the country, so yes we could certainly be anywhere from 2nd to 7th. Wofford and Samford have both lost games they were "supposed" to win so you can use that against them, or you can ignore it. I don't think either way is right or wrong, just different. Honestly at this point in the season, we're just guessing on who goes where (other than Furman and WCU).

Currently Massey has the following (this is SAD):
#17 Furman
#43 Wofford
#45 Samford
#54 Chattanooga
#64 The Citadel
#79 ETSU
#82 VMI
#91 Mercer
#108 Western Carolina


The SoCon FCS OOC wins
#52 Austin Peay
#93 Charleston Southern
#93 Charleston Southern
#96 Gardner Webb
#98 Alabama A&M
#104 Eastern Illinois
#126 Presbyterian

The SoCon FCS OOC losses
#4 James Madison
#14 Towson
#15 Youngstown State
#39 Jacksonville State
#40 Elon
#52 Austin Peay
#60 Tennessee Tech
#66 South Carolina State
#80 Campbell
#96 Gardner Webb
#111 Robert Morris

I do think you have to include that Furman lost to Georgia State by 6 and VTech(!) by 7 - yes, the VTech that just beat Miami by 7... Neither are Clemson but they are still 80+ scholarship FBS schools. w the arms race locker rooms etc.. And Cit beat GT !! I think you are shortin the conference by not including those games. Though I agree the SoCon needs to step up. If we had just beat SC State - for good riddance Woff - and TTU Samford that would be ok

[gofurman]

https://www.masseyratings.com/cf/compare1aa.htm

composite rankings, probably better than just Massey alone -
Furman 9
Wofford 34 (and I bet they keep climbing)
Samford 45
Chatt 62
CItadel 69
ETSU 73
VMI 82
Mercer 92
Wes 111

[ElCid]

https://www.masseyratings.com/cf/compare1aa.htm

composite rankings, probably better than just Massey alone -
Furman 9
Wofford 34 (and I bet they keep climbing)
Samford 45
Chatt 62
CItadel 69
ETSU 73
VMI 82
Mercer 92
Wes 111

Uhg. No. The composite has some very dubious computer polls. Go and open up a few of them see how jacked up some are. Pure Massey is way better. The stand dev on some teams is just mind numbing in the composite.

Now I realize that you like it because Furman is higher, but seriously, the composite is flawed.

[UpstateBison]

Uhg. No. The composite has some very dubious computer polls. Go and open up a few of them see how jacked up some are. Pure Massey is way better. The stand dev on some teams is just mind numbing in the composite.

Now I realize that you like it because Furman is higher, but seriously, the composite is flawed.

Furman is 17 in FCS Massey only. I have Furman in my top 10 AGS poll and have been high on Furman this year. Furman’s best “win” this year is losing to 2 very bad FBS teams. The Citadel has beat GT. This Saturday should be interesting.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[apaladin]

I never look at computer polls, as you can take numbers and have them say whatever you want. I would rather leave it up to humans, who don't have a clue and have their own agenda.

[gofurman]

Uhg. No. The composite has some very dubious computer polls. Go and open up a few of them see how jacked up some are. Pure Massey is way better. The stand dev on some teams is just mind numbing in the composite.

Now I realize that you like it because Furman is higher, but seriously, the composite is flawed.

It may well be flawed. I do not, however, like it bc Furman is higher.. I actually pointed (see my original post) to Wofford specifically who is 9 spots higher in composite that Massey. I personally think they are dangerous. Yes, Furman played VTech to the same deficit as MIAMI of FLORIDA !!! But I was really looking at Woff as they tried revamping their scheme and so lost to SC State.. then close w Samford .. then returned to run game and here we go --- beat snot out of bad Gwebb team.. then beat an 'ok' VMI team then beat an ETSU team way better than my Furman guys did. I think WOff is trending very well. That's 3 straight wins w each one more impressive than the last. Unfortunately for OOC ratings Woff played SC State with an experimental offense

[gofurman]

Furman is 17 in FCS Massey only. I have Furman in my top 10 AGS poll and have been high on Furman this year. Furman’s best “win” this year is losing to 2 very bad FBS teams. The Citadel has beat GT. This Saturday should be interesting.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Furman will NOT lose to Citadel.. I mean Georgia Tech lol. Upstate, which game is interesting this Saturday in particular? Not being mean, just that most of the SoCon is off this week

[FUBeAR]

If Mercer will wait a year or to, Tom Arth may be available. :)#FUATT

[PaladinFan]

Drew Cronic, head coach of Lenior-Rhyne. Based on zero inside knowledge, pure speculation based on Cronic's strong Georgia ties, starting up NAIA Reinhardt, dominant offensive season as OC at Furman, 2 seasons of dominance as D-II head coach.

I don't know this specifically, but I have always assumed that Cronic's move to LR was to help facilitate an FCS head coaching gig. LR is a D2 school, but has produced a number of FCS head coaches in the past few years, including Mike Houston.

In the SoCon, the most traditional route is for a school to select a guy with a former affiliation with the school as either a player or coach (Hendrix, Conklin, Wright, Speir). Chris Hatcher got his first FCS gig from the D2 ranks (Valdosta State), and Brent Thompson sort of did, as Mike Houston's OC. A few others like Wachenhiem and Sanders are FBS coaches with local ties who maybe were looking for a job.

At Mercer, they really aren't going to have a deep pool of former players/coaches to look at (the program just hasn't been around that long). So, they may look to the D2 head coach route (Cronic is an obvious one to look at) or potentially a FBS position coach/coordinator that wants a change of scenery. Georgia State, for instance, is chocked full of former SoCon guys on its coaching staff.

I also don't think you can totally rule out Chris Hatcher, who is from Macon. I do think the "Georgia-ness" will be important to Mercer in any hire. I would expect any head coach at Mercer will have deep ties to the state. That's less important at other schools.

[SCPALADIN]

#FUATT

Exactly...
...and Tom Arth will be at Akron for at least four years.

[FUBeAR]

I do think the "Georgia-ness" will be important to Mercer in any hire. I would expect any head coach at Mercer will have deep ties to the state. That's less important at other schools.”Georgia-ness” didn’t seem to matter in the least in Mercer’s recent Basketball Head Coaching Selection process.

https://mercerbears.com/news/2019/3/26/greg-gary-hired-to-lead-mercer-mens-basketball-program.aspx


If Mercer does a search for a new Head Football Coach after the 2019 season, “ties to Georgia” will be on the ‘nice to have’ list; not the ‘need to have’ one.

[PaladinFan]

”Georgia-ness” didn’t seem to matter in the least in Mercer’s recent Basketball Head Coaching Selection process.

https://mercerbears.com/news/2019/3/26/greg-gary-hired-to-lead-mercer-mens-basketball-program.aspx

Neither was Bob Hoffman. I just think it matters more to "middle Georgia's team."

FCS football also isn't a D1 men's bball gig.

[FUBeAR]

Neither was Bob Hoffman. I just think it matters more to "middle Georgia's team."

FCS football also isn't a D1 men's bball gig.As I said, it would be a ‘nice to have’ criterion, but not a required one.

If we keep talking about this, you’ll have Mercer hiring Rush Propst in a few more posts. Mercer wouldn’t hire Rush Propst. Samford, on the other hand, might if Coach Hatcher & the bullpups were to part ways in the future. He has ties in Alabama, y’know...multiple ties.

[PaladinFan]

As I said, it would be a ‘nice to have’ criterion, but not a required one.

If we keep talking about this, you’ll have Mercer hiring Rush Propst in a few more posts. Mercer wouldn’t hire Rush Propst. Samford, on the other hand, might if Coach Hatcher & the bullpups were to part ways in the future. He has ties in Alabama, y’know...multiple ties.

Nothing a quality academic institution needs more than a high school coach that's been fired from two jobs for noncompliance.

[BearDownMU]

Nothing a quality academic institution needs more than a high school coach that's been fired from two jobs for noncompliance.

I think you just made FUBeAR's point. Lol

[FU_Paladin08]

I do think the "Georgia-ness" will be important to Mercer in any hire. I would expect any head coach at Mercer will have deep ties to the state. That's less important at other schools.

I would think the decision comes down to recruiting territory and schemes. Lamb can recruit Georgia, and I believe Cronic has that same ability. A huge benefit Furman got in Hendrix was his SE presence PLUS adding some national reach with his Air Force ties and Quarles’ TN territory. If an AD feels talent is part of the issue they will look for a coach that can recruit better than Lamb.

Cronic scheme could be the other factor. Not all schools like a heavy run offense in this modern day of high flying passing teams. Just to be clear, I don’t care as long as games are won, but Mercer may be looking for a QB-centric offense? I think Cronic to Citadel would make much more sense based on offense ideology, but I don’t think Citadel is looking for a new HC yet.

I think it’s a matter of time before we see Cronic in FCS. I’d prefer Furman not have to play against him, however the SoCon does need some new life to boost the Conference identity.

[BearDownMU]

I would think the decision comes down to recruiting territory and schemes. Lamb can recruit Georgia, and I believe Cronic has that same ability. A huge benefit Furman got in Hendrix was his SE presence PLUS adding some national reach with his Air Force ties and Quarles’ TN territory. If an AD feels talent is part of the issue they will look for a coach that can recruit better than Lamb.

Cronic scheme could be the other factor. Not all schools like a heavy run offense in this modern day of high flying passing teams. Just to be clear, I don’t care as long as games are won, but Mercer may be looking for a QB-centric offense? I think Cronic to Citadel would make much more sense based on offense ideology, but I don’t think Citadel is looking for a new HC yet.

I think it’s a matter of time before we see Cronic in FCS. I’d prefer Furman not have to play against him, however the SoCon does need some new life to boost the Conference identity.

I'm thinking about recruiting the least. We have talent now. And we are in a great spot for access to talent, and (I think) have a great product to sell (the University, the investment by the administration, the value of the degree, lots of areas of study, etc.).

My biggest check boxes are 1) a coach that hold everyone accountable and, regardless of talent, makes sure every single player GETS AFTER IT EVERY PLAY, 2) we get more sophisticated on offense AND defense and 3) believes the fundamental success of any football team lies primarily with the performance of the offensive and defensive line, and recruits and coaches/trains accordingly.

Other than that, everything else is cream cheese.

[PaladinFan]

I'm thinking about recruiting the least. We have talent now. And we are in a great spot for access to talent, and (I think) have a great product to sell (the University, the investment by the administration, the value of the degree, lots of areas of study, etc.).

My biggest check boxes are 1) a coach that hold everyone accountable and, regardless of talent, makes sure every single player GETS AFTER IT EVERY PLAY, 2) we get more sophisticated on offense AND defense and 3) believes the fundamental success of any football team lies primarily with the performance of the offensive and defensive line, and recruits and coaches/trains accordingly.

Other than that, everything else is cream cheese.

Yes and no, in my opinion. Mercer has some talent, but it doesn't appear to have depth. Winning requires both.

I think looking at talent in Middle Georgia is sort of narrow. Mercer has access to Atlanta, but so does just about every other SoCon school. Mercer has some key selling points (that you outline), but so do other SoCon schools. Macon has a soft spot in my heart (lived there seven years), but it is a hard sell over Greenville, Birmingham, or Charleston all things being equal.

Those cities also have access to airports that can open recruiting beyond the normal footprint. Furman, for instance, is starting to pull kids out of Texas. It probably helps to have direct flights from Houston and Dallas.

Even then, you have to find and develop the talent. Devin Wynn - arguably the SoCon's best offensive player - is from Greensboro, GA, a short drive from Macon. I believe Furman was his only offer. Other schools have just as much access to the same players.

I don't disagree with you in terms of honing in on specific areas. The hardest position to recruit at the FCS level is defensive linemen. There just aren't that many guys that fall to FCS schools that aren't either (1) undersized or (2) come with injury history or other concerns. Offensive linemen are a bit easier to recruit, I think.

It still comes down to coaching. Most FCS schools are largely going to have the same access to the same players. They'll recruit most of the same schools in the same cities in the South. Most recruiting classes will look largely the same.

The key, in my view, is (1) getting the players in and (2) developing them. I think this is where Clay Hendrix is really good. Recruiting is good, but Furman doesn't have some massive advantage there. Where they are gaining the advantage is developing those players once they are in the program. Furman fans will tell you that our program started to slide down into mediocrity when Clay Hendrix left for Air Force. Coaching matters.

For Mercer, I think the writing was on the wall last offseason when a number of coaches departed the program. Continuity is a key aspect of recruiting - guys want to know the coach recruiting them is going to be there.

I don't know if a sophisticated offense or defense makes that much of a difference. I don't necessarily like single back/spread offenses, but some have success. You need guys that will line up and hit someone.

[BearDownMU]

My comment about location being good was not about focusing on central Georgia, but more that it's central location gives access to a lot of areas with good football players. North Georgia/Atlanta, South Carolina, Alabama, and North Florida are all reasonable drives if Mama, Daddy, and Uncle Earl want to come to all the games.

As far as the offense goes, this is just from watching a boat load of game recordings. I don't think we need Bill Walsh or anything, but what we are doing now, in my opinion, on both sides of the ball is too easy to prepare for. The Furman/Mercer game is a prime example. Outside of all the other factors that led to that result, look at the variability of things that were being done on offense between us and them. Furman is much more "sophisticated". That is how I was suing the term. Just to vanilla, right now, to me. But, to your point, guys have to get coached up and be developed if you are going to be more diverse or complex.

[kdinva]

The Citadel 27; WCU 22
VMI 35; Samford 26

[SUPharmacist]

Citadel and VMI for wins

[PaladinFan]

My comment about location being good was not about focusing on central Georgia, but more that it's central location gives access to a lot of areas with good football players. North Georgia/Atlanta, South Carolina, Alabama, and North Florida are all reasonable drives if Mama, Daddy, and Uncle Earl want to come to all the games.

As far as the offense goes, this is just from watching a boat load of game recordings. I don't think we need Bill Walsh or anything, but what we are doing now, in my opinion, on both sides of the ball is too easy to prepare for. The Furman/Mercer game is a prime example. Outside of all the other factors that led to that result, look at the variability of things that were being done on offense between us and them. Furman is much more "sophisticated". That is how I was suing the term. Just to vanilla, right now, to me. But, to your point, guys have to get coached up and be developed if you are going to be more diverse or complex.

I remember a number of years ago (2009 or 10, perhaps) griping that Furman's offense was TOO complicated. The team always appeared to be trying to get so fancy with their play calls that they lacked execution and pace.

Folks tend to gush over Furman's offense like they've reinvented the wheel or something. The Paladins are essentially running the same offense they did for years prior to Bruce Fowler - who ushered in more of a spread/single back look.

Example: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4vmtEhSTCaI

This is just a single play from Furman's 2006 game against UNC. Furman has a mobile QB with a big arm (Renaldo Gray). They come out with a double wing "option" look, play action, and hit a WR (Patrick Sprague) on a deep pass. one of the two wing backs is a WR (Justin Stepp). Literally the exact same stuff Furman is doing now. In 2006, both Bobby Lamb and Clay Hendrix were still at Furman.

[for grins, watch Jerome Felton obliterate an ACC defensive lineman].

Furman ran the same sort of stuff near the end of Lamb's tenure in Greenville, but recruiting had fallen off, Hendrix was at Air Force, and everything was just less crisp and well run. Fowler arrived and this offense got put back on the shelf.

Of course, there's nothing inherently wrong with a single back spread offense. I personally prefer watching a running backs put their hand in the ground and run over guys, but plenty of teams run that offense successfully. App State crushed teams for years in the SoCon running that offense. Talent, coaching, execution.

[FUBeAR]

FUBeAR is still in a FUnK over Mercer’s poor performance against Chatt, so he apologizes in advance for his lack of (attempted) levity this week.

Power Rankings

1. Furman - I heard we have contracted with a power wash company to do the stadium during the Saturday of the 1st round of the Playoffs, so it will be all shiny when our 2nd round victim comes in to end their season. Wondering who the 3rd round opponent coming into Paladium Stadium will be.

2. Samford’s Offense (with a healthy QB “O”)

3. ETSU’s Defense (as long as they are awake & playing with effort)

4. Wofford’s New (really old) Offense (as long as Newman stays vertical...and doesn’t throw more than 5x/game)

5. VMI - can pass & run IF they don’t fall behind early...and play a little D - BobbyMo loss is the only thing (right now) keeping the marsupial maelstrom from being a Playoff contendah

6. Chattanooga - meh, 2-0 ain’t gonna last long. I liked them better until I watched their games against JMU, WCU...and Mercer...meh, meh, meh

7. Mercer - I feel better about the Atlanta Braves right now than I do about the Bears

8. The Citadel - tell me again about how that “RaineyRunRightRaineyRunLeft Offense” is just fine

9. Wofford’s Defense - favorable schedule & their (old) O getting early leads has hidden this weakness. It will be exposed.

10. ETSU’s Offense (because they refuse to NOT pass the ball)

11. Samford’s Defense - heard they had improved; heard they were really good. They haven’t. They aren’t.

13. W. Carolina - As they say during a Presidential Election year with a much different tone & connotation, “FOUR MORE YEARS! FOUR MORE YEARS!”


Picks

SAMFORD vs VMI - 48-45 (IN OT)

W. Carolina vs The CITADEL - 31-14 bellhops scrap their new Zeppelin Raid O & send in the infantry to herd the hapless kitties

[ElCid]

The Citadel[/B] - tell me again about how that “RaineyRunRightRaineyRunLeft Offense” is just fine


Well, if he is healthy it is. But he isn't and neither is the BBack.

I really think the coach thought he could just practice a little more passing since he thought we could beat VMI. Then when we got behind, we had to pass and it didn't turn out well. We really should have sat him longer to heal and gone with backup. I really got a feeling that it was similar to the Wofford/SC State game in regard to passing. We will see what goes on today.

[chattownmocs]

I don't feel confident to put Furman in the category of "dominant" front runner status like the 2008-10 App State teams, which, I think, lost 1 SoCon game in three years (on the road at Georgia Southern).

I do think they are the clearest front runner we've had in a few years. Last season, ETSU's point differential was negligible, and they rarely seemed like clearly the best team in any game. Wofford in 2017 won game after game by their chin hairs.

Furman feels a bit different to me this year. I wouldn't be shocked if they lost, but I also think that they'll be heavy favorites against everyone they face.

Even against ETSU. Furman didn't play well, but the Paladins still led the entire game and you never really got the impression the Bucs were going to take a lead. They struggled to cross midfield, and their only touchdown was after a turnover in Furman territory (sort of similar to Furman's game against UTC last season).

It reminded me of a game Furman played against Elon years ago. Ingle Martin's Paladin team won 10-0 against the Phoenix on the road. Elon never really threatened to win the game, but it was so strange to see that offense be slowed down against anyone, much less the league's worst team. Sometimes that sort of thing happens.

UTC has had more than a few games over the years in which they jumped out early and then just kind of held on or purposely used good clock management to make it almost impossible for the other team to come back. That was actually a strength of Huesman's his last few years after some of the debacles in his first couple years. He just never could quite get over the hump in those close games against the top teams nationally. I don't know what the hell is going on now at Richmond. Bad move it appears.

[chattownmocs]

Not to get overly controversial, but if Mercer was that committed to winning championships, why is Bobby still there? He got that program up and running very quickly but it's been stuck in neutral for a long time.

[chattownmocs]

It probably won't be a few years but I expect that the name Joey King will start popping up for some some FCS jobs. Former Cartersville (Trevor Lawrence) high school coach. He's the WRs coach at Coastal now but he could come out of nowhere like Healy even and trap a job. Very likeable guy and judging by his work at Cartetsville, one hell of a recruiter.

[FUBeAR]

Not to get overly controversial, but if Mercer was that committed to winning championships, why is Bobby still there?
Appreciative of you extending your, now, 1 day streak of not getting “overly controversial.”

Knowing President Underwood, a bit, as I have had the pleasure of coming to do over the past 7 years, I can cross-my-heart-and-hope-to-die guarantee everyone that he is 100% committed to winning championships. But to address your postulate with Socratic method logic (rather than my opinion), when would you have made a Head Coaching change at Mercer?

After 2011 - hired new Head Coach, no Players, no season?

After 2012 - practice year with 108 walk-on players, no season?

After 2013 - 10-2 / 6-2 - 3rd place finish in PFL, 1 loss away from winning PFL & making Playoffs, playing with all R-FR Walk-ons, extended Head Coach’s contract thru 2019 season?

After 2014 - 6-6 / 1-6 - playing in SoCon with only about 20 recruited scholarship players on the roster, all true Freshmen; 4 of 6 SoCon losses were < 1 score games?

After 2015 - 5-6 / 2-6 - playing in SoCon with only about 40 recruited scholarship players, mostly FR or R-FR; 2 late-season SoCon wins, including defeating FCS #3 Chattanooga; 5 of 6 SoCon losses < 1 score games; doubled number of SoCon wins?

After 2016 - 6-5 / 4-4 - 1st year of playing in SoCon with almost an equal number of recruited scholarship Players as other Teams, albeit none older than JR’s; 1st winning season as a scholarship program while playing an All-D1 schedule; doubled # of SoCon wins from previous season; 3 of 4 SoCon losses to ranked Teams, 2 of those 3 were < 1 score games?

After 2017 - 5-6 / 4-4 - 1st year of lack of progress in SoCon record, but 2 SoCon wins over ranked Teams (CIT & WCU), 2 of 4 SoCon losses to ranked Teams, 1 of those a 1 point loss; 3 of 4 SoCon losses 1 score games; took FBS #15 Auburn down to the wire - 1 score game until halfway thru 4th quarter?

After 2018 - 5-6 / 4-4 - 2nd year of lack of progress in SoCon record, but 2 of 4 SoCon losses to ranked teams & 1 of those a < 1 score game; SoCon win over Top 10 (SAM); Due to injuries, final 4 games of season (all SoCon games) played mostly with a walk-on R-FR QB who didn’t start for his HS Team, 3 of those 4 games against SoCon Co-Champs, won the one that wasn’t & 2 of the 3 losses were < 1 score games, despite record 2018 Offense (prior to QB injuries) was clearly improved over 2017 Offense, though Defense regressed substantially & D-Coordinator was released?

During 2019 - Started 2-0 / 1-0, now 2-4 / 1-2. All losses to ranked or ORV FCS Teams. 2 SoCon losses to Teams undefeated in the SoCon?

[FUBeAR]

Well, if he is healthy it is. But he isn't and neither is the BBack.

I really think the coach thought he could just practice a little more passing since he thought we could beat VMI. Then when we got behind, we had to pass and it didn't turn out well. We really should have sat him longer to heal and gone with backup. I really got a feeling that it was similar to the Wofford/SC State game in regard to passing. We will see what goes on today.
Coach said he’s healthy. Didn’t see any signs of affected gait. Looked for heavy ankle taping, didn’t see any...could have missed it, I guess. Just saw a sleeve on 1 knee. What’s wrong with him & how is it affecting his results so dramatically? He is averaging 2.2 ypc since the Towson game.

Looked to me as if VMI took away the perimeter game by getting depth at snap with wide DE’s/OLB’s to just foul up blocking angles & timing. Really old-school DE play. They played & stopped the Dive & QB keep with 5 (not 8) others (3 DL & 2 LB’s) in the box...and cleaned up any ‘trash’ with the play side 2 deep Safety flying downhill hard AFTER ball was committed to that side AND clearly not a pass.

...but keep telling yourselves the problem is a tweaked QB. I’m good with that.

[ElCid]

Coach said he’s healthy. Didn’t see any signs of affected gait. Looked for heavy ankle taping, didn’t see any...could have missed it, I guess. Just saw a sleeve on 1 knee. What’s wrong with him & how is it affecting his results so dramatically? He is averaging 2.2 ypc since the Towson game.

Looked to me as if VMI took away the perimeter game by getting depth at snap with wide DE’s/OLB’s to just foul up blocking angles & timing. Really old-school DE play. They played & stopped the Dive & QB keep with 5 (not 8) others (3 DL & 2 LB’s) in the box...and cleaned up any ‘trash’ with the play side 2 deep Safety flying downhill hard AFTER ball was committed to that side AND clearly not a pass.

...but keep telling yourselves the problem is a tweaked QB. I’m good with that.

Knee is bad. He got his leg pinned back bad at GaTech. Tweaked it again at Samford. He is far from 100%.

[FUBeAR]

Knee is bad. He got his leg pinned back bad at GaTech. Tweaked it again at Samford. He is far from 100%.
OK - well WCU’s D has been miracle working healers for a lot of Offenses. Maybe, they’ll lay hands on Rainey today...so to speak.

[BearDownMU]

It probably won't be a few years but I expect that the name Joey King will start popping up for some some FCS jobs. Former Cartersville (Trevor Lawrence) high school coach. He's the WRs coach at Coastal now but he could come out of nowhere like Healy even and trap a job. Very likeable guy and judging by his work at Cartetsville, one hell of a recruiter.

I'm a Cartersville graduate. Lol. I don't know how much recruiting he did, but he's a good man and he won a ton of football games. And Trevor clearly thinks the world of him.

But, to your point, I think he could be a FCS head coach some day.

[ElCid]

OK - well WCU’s D has been miracle working healers for a lot of Offenses. Maybe, they’ll lay hands on Rainey today...so to speak.

He has obviously been getting better, but he was also obviously a little limited against Samford and even last week. He just didn't seem as spry as previous. He was being a little timid. Plus having our starting bback healthy has helped. But yes WCU's D has helped as well.

[chattownmocs]

Appreciative of you extending your, now, 1 day streak of not getting “overly controversial.”

Knowing President Underwood, a bit, as I have had the pleasure of coming to do over the past 7 years, I can cross-my-heart-and-hope-to-die guarantee everyone that he is 100% committed to winning championships. But to address your postulate with Socratic method logic (rather than my opinion), when would you have made a Head Coaching change at Mercer?

After 2011 - hired new Head Coach, no Players, no season?

After 2012 - practice year with 108 walk-on players, no season?

After 2013 - 10-2 / 6-2 - 3rd place finish in PFL, 1 loss away from winning PFL & making Playoffs, playing with all R-FR Walk-ons, extended Head Coach’s contract thru 2019 season?

After 2014 - 6-6 / 1-6 - playing in SoCon with only about 20 recruited scholarship players on the roster, all true Freshmen; 4 of 6 SoCon losses were < 1 score games?

After 2015 - 5-6 / 2-6 - playing in SoCon with only about 40 recruited scholarship players, mostly FR or R-FR; 2 late-season SoCon wins, including defeating FCS #3 Chattanooga; 5 of 6 SoCon losses < 1 score games; doubled number of SoCon wins?

After 2016 - 6-5 / 4-4 - 1st year of playing in SoCon with almost an equal number of recruited scholarship Players as other Teams, albeit none older than JR’s; 1st winning season as a scholarship program while playing an All-D1 schedule; doubled # of SoCon wins from previous season; 3 of 4 SoCon losses to ranked Teams, 2 of those 3 were < 1 score games?

After 2017 - 5-6 / 4-4 - 1st year of lack of progress in SoCon record, but 2 SoCon wins over ranked Teams (CIT & WCU), 2 of 4 SoCon losses to ranked Teams, 1 of those a 1 point loss; 3 of 4 SoCon losses 1 score games; took FBS #15 Auburn down to the wire - 1 score game until halfway thru 4th quarter?

After 2018 - 5-6 / 4-4 - 2nd year of lack of progress in SoCon record, but 2 of 4 SoCon losses to ranked teams & 1 of those a < 1 score game; SoCon win over Top 10 (SAM); Due to injuries, final 4 games of season (all SoCon games) played mostly with a walk-on R-FR QB who didn’t start for his HS Team, 3 of those 4 games against SoCon Co-Champs, won the one that wasn’t & 2 of the 3 losses were < 1 score games, despite record 2018 Offense (prior to QB injuries) was clearly improved over 2017 Offense, though Defense regressed substantially & D-Coordinator was released?

During 2019 - Started 2-0 / 1-0, now 2-4 / 1-2. All losses to ranked or ORV FCS Teams. 2 SoCon losses to Teams undefeated in the SoCon?

I'm not the one who said that they had an unmatched commitment to excellence. I appreciate your post but it's exactly as I described much more succinctly previously. Excuses can be made for literally any year that doesn't end the way you want it to. Injuries man? Come on now.

[FUBeAR]

He has obviously been getting better, but he was also obviously a little limited against Samford and even last week. He just didn't seem as spry as previous. He was being a little timid. Plus having our starting bback healthy has helped. But yes WCU's D has helped as well.Rainey looks exactly the same as he did last week.

Differences are WCU’s what’s-a-word-worse-than-horrendous Defense AND CIT actually running their real Offense instead of that pound ball crap they’ve been running. But don’t just take FUBeAR’s analysis of it, yer boy, Dom Allen, said it his own self. About halfway thru the 1st quarter, he said something along the lines of, ‘That’s the 1st play I’ve seen this year that CIT has run & executed all 3 elements of the triple option.’

[chattownmocs]

I'm a Cartersville graduate. Lol. I don't know how much recruiting he did, but he's a good man and he won a ton of football games. And Trevor clearly thinks the world of him.

But, to your point, I think he could be a FCS head coach some day.

I don't know either. It was a little tongue-in-cheek. I think Lawrence moved to Cartersville with him as a middle school student, don't know how that went down, but when you have the best QB prospect of all time coming with you, everything else is going to fall into place.

[FUBeAR]

I'm not the one who said that they had an unmatched commitment to excellence. I appreciate your post but it's exactly as I described much more succinctly previously. Excuses can be made for literally any year that doesn't end the way you want it to. Injuries man? Come on now.Providing data and asking you to express your opinion, based upon that data, couldn’t be further from “making excuses.” On the other hand, your reluctance / unwillingness to do so proves your initial postulate rather problematic.

[ElCid]

Rainey looks exactly the same as he did last week.

Differences are WCU’s what’s-a-word-worse-than-horrendous Defense AND CIT actually running their real Offense instead of that pound ball crap they’ve been running. But don’t just take FUBeAR’s analysis of it, yer boy, Dom Allen, said it his own self. About halfway thru the 1st quarter, he said something along the lines of, ‘That’s the 1st play I’ve seen this year that CIT has run & executed all 3 elements of the triple option.’

And you don't think that some of his limitations could have just dictated the play calling? Really? Hmm.

In any event we are running the standard play book today and it is working. Plus a flawlessly executed onside kick helped.

[FUBeAR]

And you don't think that some of his limitations could have just dictated the play calling? Really? Hmm.
ummm...no...he was hurt in game #3...

[ElCid]

ummm...no...he was hurt in game #3...

Yeah and he didn't play in game 4, and aggravated it again at Samford game #5 or he would have had a 100 yard game. What's your point? Bottom line is he has not been 100% the last 2 games. You can spin it all you want, but you, and everyone else, knows it to be true.

[FUBeAR]

Yeah and he didn't play in game 4, and aggravated it again at Samford game #5 or he would have had a 100 yard game. What's your point? Bottom line is he has not been 100% the last 2 games. You can spin it all you want, but you, and everyone else, knows it to be true.Fine - he’s hurt, but after his success last year, CIT dumbed their O down more & more, until it became not much more than you see in youth leagues. With his (predictable) injury, the bellhops O was castrated...until they, finally, this week returned to running an O that can be effective in college football, especially against a Defense that is worse than most HS Defenses.

[FUBeAR]

Picks

SAMFORD vs VMI - 48-45 (IN OT)

W. Carolina vs The CITADEL - 31-14 bellhops scrap their new Zeppelin Raid O & send in the infantry to herd the hapless kitties

Dang - I had it going to OT tied at 42, instead of 41. BAD miss.


EDIT - but I STILL overestimated Samford’s D.


BIG CONGRATS TO THE ROOS!

[ElCid]

Congrats to the Keydets on the win and the season. Now 4-3 with 3 more winnable games at least with a good or moderate chance. Dang that Bob game.

[walliver]

No-one should overlook VMI.
I doubt their defense can contain Furman or Army, but their offense can keep them in any game left on their schedule.

[youwouldno]

No-one should overlook VMI.
I doubt their defense can contain Furman or Army, but their offense can keep them in any game left on their schedule.

VMI has definitely improved, but a big part of this is how down the SoCon is. VMI is a favorite in 2 of their 4 remaining conference games, in my opinion (WCU is straightforward, Mercer could be argued).

Still, they have no realistic path to the post-season. So the bigger question for them is whether this season is a sort of turning point, or just a fluke against a depleted conference.

[BearDownMU]

VMI has definitely improved, but a big part of this is how down the SoCon is. VMI is a favorite in 2 of their 4 remaining conference games, in my opinion (WCU is straightforward, Mercer could be argued).

Still, they have no realistic path to the post-season. So the bigger question for them is whether this season is a sort of turning point, or just a fluke against a depleted conference.

They are 100% a favorite over us.

[kdinva]

Congrats to the Keydets on the win and the season. Now 4-3 with 3 more winnable games at least with a good or moderate chance. Dang that Bob game.

that looked like the 2017 VMI team that played against Bobby Mo.

I was in Lexington today, Alex Ramsey should be first team all SoCon.......reece was 37-46, no picks AGAIN. But I must add Samford QB Chris Oladokun, to me, is as good as Hodges. Sammy played very hard, executed successfully a fake punt on 4th and 12....xsmhx

Still can't figure Sammy's play call, in OT, with 4th and 3 from the 18. Instead of going for the 1st down, they ran a double reverse halfback pass, and the back missed a wide open WR in the end zone to end the game.

some say the SoCon is down, 1-9. I don't care, it's fun again in Lex Vegas.

[ElCid]

that looked like the 2017 VMI team that played against Bobby Mo.

I was in Lexington today, Alex Ramsey should be first team all SoCon.......reece was 37-46, no picks AGAIN. But I must add Samford QB Chris Oladokun, to me, is as good as Hodges. Sammy played very hard, executed successfully a fake punt on 4th and 12....xsmhx

Still can't figure Sammy's play call, in OT, with 4th and 3 from the 18. Instead of going for the 1st down, they ran a double reverse halfback pass, and the back missed a wide open WR in the end zone to end the game.

some say the SoCon is down, 1-9. I don't care, it's fun again in Lex Vegas.

Yup, your QB is the real deal. Glad to have a decent Keydets team again. I am not buying the only reason you are winning is because we are down. Also, we have had three one score losses (Towson, Elon, and Samford). You guys beat us by the most points do far.

As an oddity, our QB was 3-5 today...3 TDs. If you to throw completions, each one a TD is a good way to go.

Not ready to say we got our mojo back, especially against WCUs defense, but it was good to win again. Going to be tough next week for us. But some crazy crap is happening all over.

[gofurman]

congrats to VMI !!! also congrats to CItadel for today.. . but mainly to VMI on the year they are having so far!

[PaladinFan]

Open question - how warm is Chris Hatcher's seat? This is his 13th season as an FCS head coach.

He's made 2 playoff appearances and been bounced in the first round both times. This year will likely continue that trend.

Zero conference titles in his 8th season. Highly unlikely they'll win a SoCon title this year.

Samford went 6-5 last year with a pretty loaded roster. To go .500ish with a Payton Winner on your roster seems difficult. Most teams the last 20 years or so with a Payton Award winner are top 10 programs. There are a few exceptions (EWU finished 6-5 twice with a Payton Winner).

Hatcher's teams play very little defense. They improved a bit the last few years, but I think that was more of an "Ahmad Gooden effect" than anything. He graduates, and they go back to setting new marks for futility. It isn't good when your defense makes WCU's group look like the 1976 Steelers.

You look at Hatcher's career in the FCS, and he's been pretty mediocre. He's had more than 7 wins (8) only once.

According to their game notes, all but one of Samford's starting defensive players are juniors or seniors. Two of their starters were FBS transfers. This isn't a situation where they are breaking in guys on defense - they are an experienced group.