Georgia Southern's offense?????

[SU Jag]

What will the GSU offense look like this fall? Will it be the return of the option attack?

[GaSouthern]

Yeah, tell the coaches we will run every play and get ready for a smashmouth game! ;)

[GaSouthern]

Were going to the Air Raid Offense ala Texas Tech; Troy; and my mind slips me of who else is running it.

[bobbythekidd]

VA Tech.

[bobbythekidd]

and my mind slips me of who else is running it.
Va Tech

[MplsBison]

Everyone in the damn country.

[bobbythekidd]

Everyone in the damn country.
Dude you rail against the 3-O, claiming it is not effective b/c the Pros don't use it. Then when we go to a pro style offense (NOT productive) and you remain silent. We move to a passing attack and you whine about it again.

Are you BVG? Are you a Pro coach? What's your deal?

[pete4256]

Think Hall Mumme's offense at Kentucky with Tim Couch, Dusty Bonner, and Jared Lorenzen.

That's the base scheme.

[MplsBison]

What's your deal?

My deal is that NDSU runs one of the best pro style offenses in FCS.


Everyone else is either running or wants to run some form of the chuck n duck and it kills me to see teams passing the ball on 1st and 2nd down every time!

[AppGuy04]

My deal is that NDSU runs one of the best pro style offenses in FCS.


Everyone else is either running or wants to run some form of the chuck n duck and it kills me to see teams passing the ball on 1st and 2nd down every time!

Yes, b/c we should all run the same offense?xrolleyesx

[MplsBison]

There are only X number of plays that work at the DI level.

Everyone is running some form of those.



It pains me to see teams in 4 wide shotgun all day!

[Mr. C]

It's worked pretty well for the two-time national champs in 2005-06.

[Mr. C]

Yes, b/c we should all run the same offense?xrolleyesx
That's one of the things I hate about the NFL.

[Mr. C]

Think Hall Mumme's offense at Kentucky with Tim Couch, Dusty Bonner, and Jared Lorenzen.

That's the base scheme.
Chris Hatcher played for Hal Mumme at Valdosta State and later coached with Mumme, too. Don't forget Mumme also used that offense pretty effectively at Southeast Louisiana and now is at New Mexico State. Marvin Hankins and Felton Huggins made it work pretty good for the Lions.

[*****]

Yep, it's Hatch Attack time for the Eagles. Lots of passing and don't forget the solid running part of his offense.

[MplsBison]

That's one of the things I hate about the NFL.


Weird, when millions of dollars ride on your success, every single team does exactly the only thing it can do: what works the best.

[Mr. C]

Yep, it's Hatch Attack time for the Eagles. Lots of passing and don't forget the solid running part of his offense.
You don't usually see much emphasis on the run in Hal Mumme's version of the offense, so the running game is something that should make Hatcher's version even better.

BTW, this offense is basically a hybrid of what Mouse Davis, the new Portland State OC, has done for years with the Run and Shoot.

[MplsBison]

this offense is basically a hybrid of what Mouse Davis, the new Portland State OC, has done for years with the Run and Shoot.


....

and..?




Usually when you say "hybrid" it's a mix of two things.

[Mr. C]

A hybrid doesn't have to be just two things. Mouse Davis introduced the Run and Shoot to college football at Portland State and many others have added their creative juices to it over the years, like Hal Mumme and Chris Hatcher, hence a hybrid.

[MplsBison]

So the hybrid was a mix of the run and shoot and...?

[Mr. C]

Quit being your usual Troll self. I already answered your question.

[pete4256]

Weird, when millions of dollars ride on your success, every single team does exactly the only thing it can do: what works the best.


Apparently, you really misunderstand the differences between offense in the NFL and offense in NCAA football.

NFL teams don't use the "pro-style" offense because it's the most dangerous.

They use it for the following two reasons:

1) The play the percentages. A team doesn't have to go undefeated to make the playoffs or win a championship. All they have to do is wind up on the right side of a 23-21 score more than half of the time. Mixing strong defensive play with an offense that controls the ball and kicks lots of FGs is the key to winning in a game of cautiously playing the percentages. Pro-style offenses fit in with this philosophy.

2) In the 2nd millenium of the NFL, players move around a lot. That necessitates a "whitewashing" of schemes and personnel philosophy. In college, coaches build a program with a unique philosophy and recruit based on that. They choose between thousands of potential players for who can best fit their scheme for the next FIVE years. NFL GMs choose from a much-smaller pool of players, and they need to know who can do what before they risk their jobs on a player who'll be around for a couple of years before moving on to a new team.

I think GSU fans at this point might be the best folks to ask about the difference between the two approaches, as they witnessed both a "contrarian" offense in 2005 and a pro-style "attack" in 2006.

[MplsBison]

NFL teams don't use the "pro-style" offense because it's the most dangerous.

Indeed, what works best not to run the most dangerous play (long bomb pass down the field) every time.


All they have to do is wind up on the right side of a 23-21 score more than half of the time.

I've never heard of a team that got extra wins because they won by a large margin.

A win is a win.


So basically, all you just said was "all you have to do is win more than half the time".


Wow, that is deep.

You need to hit the seminar circuits. Why are you wasting your time here?



That necessitates a "whitewashing" of schemes and personnel philosophy.


No it doesn't.

Simply, the teams that win all run the plays and the formations that work the best.

[pete4256]

Indeed, what works best not to run the most dangerous play (long bomb pass down the field) every time.



I've never heard of a team that got extra wins because they won by a large margin.

A win is a win.


So basically, all you just said was "all you have to do is win more than half the time".


Wow, that is deep.

You need to hit the seminar circuits. Why are you wasting your time here?





No it doesn't.

Simply, the teams that win all run the plays and the formations that work the best.

If a coach goes 6-5 or 7-4 every year at NDSU, how long will he keep his job?

If, on the other hand, he goes 9-7 or 10-6 every year in Miami, he's Don Shula.

That's a real difference, not a shallow one.

If a team ran the option in the NFL, where would they get quarterbacks? How many guys out there on the free agent or in the draft that could step in and be a productive part of the roster without being developed?

Pardon me for my reasoning abilities.

Teams in the NFL will run the plays which keep them in games and the schemes for which they are able to find players most easily.

Why do you think the true run and shoot died when modern NFL free agency began in the early '90s?

Aything to get them to 9-7 or better. FBS is slowly following this pattern, as the SEC schools increasingly fight over the same players and lots of institutions just hope to win six games and go to a bowl game.

[Laserlips]

My deal is that NDSU runs one of the best pro style offenses in FCS.


Everyone else is either running or wants to run some form of the chuck n duck and it kills me to see teams passing the ball on 1st and 2nd down every time!


Sorry the passing overflow hit you.. The obvious plan was to pass the football on 1st and 2nd downs "every time" to cause your defense problems. xthumbsupx

FWIW: There are some diehard 3/O folks left here at GSU, but lets face it, that train has left the station.. I think the Hatch Attack under the tuteledge of Coach Chris Hatcher will bring back some of the excitement that was absent last season under the Head Coach EGO who is presently hiding out in Atlanta.


Best Wishes,

J. Pomeroy

[*****]

Yeah, you have to discount what pros and FBS do when comparing them to championship NCAA football.

[Laserlips]

....

and..?




Usually when you say "hybrid" it's a mix of two things.


Unless of course you are referring to a stork, Egret, Emu, Ostrich, etc.? :D
J. Pomeroy

[MplsBison]

If the FCS were the NFL, every FCS team would be Montana.

If you play against competition that good all year long, going 6-5 or 7-4 would be good enough to get you into the playoffs.


At our level, at least 5 games are "should wins" every year.



If NFL teams simply drafted players that fit their schemes the easiest, why are they ever drafting players from the SEC? They all run the chuck n duck. But they draft them anyway.

Vince Young certainly didn't run the Titans offense at Texas.

[pete4256]

If the FCS were the NFL, every FCS team would be Montana.

If you play against competition that good all year long, going 6-5 or 7-4 would be good enough to get you into the playoffs.


At our level, at least 5 games are "should wins" every year.



If NFL teams simply drafted players that fit their schemes the easiest, why are they ever drafting players from the SEC? They all run the chuck n duck. But they draft them anyway.

Vince Young certainly didn't run the Titans offense at Texas.

Apparently you don't watch much SEC football. But, to play your game, I think it's significant that the SEC produces very few NFL QBs. Most SEC players in the NFL are defensive players.

Yeah . . . about Vince Young . . . nary a second-guesser as he came from college . . . xeyebrowx

Thanks for playing, but I think it's obvious that my logic trumps yours.

[AppGuy04]

Who gives a crap what offense someone runs. It's not what you run, its how you run it.

[MplsBison]

Yeah, JaMarcus Russell, who's that?

Probably won't get drafted.


Jay Cutler? Huh?

[MarkCCU]

Weird, when millions of dollars ride on your success, every single team does exactly the only thing it can do: what works the best.

you don't think success brings in money in College football?xrolleyesx

That statement says that if the triple option works for 10 teams than the 3-O isthe best thing.

[pete4256]

Yeah, JaMarcus Russell, who's that?

Probably won't get drafted.


Jay Cutler? Huh?

There are more starting QBs from the MAC in the NFL than there are from the SEC.

But another question deserves to be answered: How many true "chuck and duck" teams are there in the SEC? Name them.

[PaladinFan]

Mpls, come on down to Furman and we'll show you what a pro-style offense looks like.

[GaSouthern]

Mpls, come on down to Furman and we'll show you what a pro-style offense looks like.
I thought FU was running a option O with lots of passing (but not out of wishbone sets)? The last time I saw them play was back in 2005 though.

[PaladinFan]

I thought FU was running a option O with lots of passing (but not out of wishbone sets)? The last time I saw them play was back in 2005 though.

People for some reason say we run option, but it really is a rarity. I guess the more appropriate term is "multiple" offense. We ran a lot more shotgun with Ingle Martin because he was a Florida guy. Still, most of the time you'll see Furman line up in the I with a tight end or two. They are still a run first, between the tackles offense.

[citdog]

People for some reason say we run option, but it really is a rarity. I guess the more appropriate term is "multiple" offense. We ran a lot more shotgun with Ingle Martin because he was a Florida guy. Still, most of the time you'll see Furman line up in the I with a tight end or two. They are still a run first, between the tackles offense.


I KNOW WHO DINGLEBERRY WAS, WHO IS THIS INGLE YOU SPEAK OF?xlolx

[Mr. C]

Furman has opened the passing game up under Bobby Lamb a bit, but still basically runs that Art Baker I-Formation option. Furman's idea of getting creative is putting the slot receiver in motion and running him across the field.

[Mr. C]

People for some reason say we run option, but it really is a rarity. I guess the more appropriate term is "multiple" offense. We ran a lot more shotgun with Ingle Martin because he was a Florida guy. Still, most of the time you'll see Furman line up in the I with a tight end or two. They are still a run first, between the tackles offense.
Furman ran more option last year than it had in several years, because it had a better QB to do so with, Renaldo Gray. Justin Hill had been the last QB that was more of an option-type QB. When Sorrells goes into the lineup, then Furman will go back to more of the offense it ran with Billy Napier and Ingle Martin, featuring more shotgun and sprintouts etc. The option is definitely a intrigal part of the Furman offensive package and has been since the 1970s.

[pete4256]

Furman ran more option last year than it had in several years, because it had a better QB to do so with, Renaldo Gray. Justin Hill had been the last QB that was more of an option-type QB. When Sorrells goes into the lineup, then Furman will go back to more of the offense it ran with Billy Napier and Ingle Martin, featuring more shotgun and sprintouts etc. The option is definitely a intrigal part of the Furman offensive package and has been since the 1970s.


Don't forget Bo Moore back in 2003, who was an option QB. Wasn't that his name?

[Mr. C]

Bo Moore was pretty insignificant in the scheme of things. He only started about half of a year before severely spraining an ankle against Appalachian State. He was a better option QB than Napier, but wasn't like Hill, Braniff Bonaventure, Philly Jones and those further back as a runner.

[GaSouthern]

Furman ran more option last year than it had in several years, because it had a better QB to do so with, Renaldo Gray. Justin Hill had been the last QB that was more of an option-type QB. When Sorrells goes into the lineup, then Furman will go back to more of the offense it ran with Billy Napier and Ingle Martin, featuring more shotgun and sprintouts etc. The option is definitely a intrigal part of the Furman offensive package and has been since the 1970s.

So your saying they molded the team to the players?!?!?! WOW someone should have told Brian VanRetard about that last year xnonono2x xoopsx xwhistlex

[GaSouthern]

Also, about GSU's O

Expect us to actually make 1/2 time adjustments this year!

[Peems]

There are more starting QBs from the MAC in the NFL than there are from the SEC.

But another question deserves to be answered: How many true "chuck and duck" teams are there in the SEC? Name them.

looks like MplsBison doesn't know the answer? aah shucks

[MarkCCU]

looks like MplsBison doesn't know the answer? aah shucks

What's that MplsBison?...

[Mr. C]

So your saying they molded the team to the players?!?!?! WOW someone should have told Brian VanRetard about that last year xnonono2x xoopsx xwhistlex
They did. BVG just isn't a very good listener.

[PaladinFan]

Don't forget Bo Moore back in 2003, who was an option QB. Wasn't that his name?

Bo Moore, nice guy, but he would have been the #3 quarterback on nearly every other team we've had. Maybe it looked like option, but it was more the "run away and save yourself" offense. It is a crying shame that we wasted a defense that was that good on an offense that was that bad. Moore had Brian Bratton and Ike West at his disposal and we still couldn't move the football.

[PaladinFan]

Furman ran more option last year than it had in several years, because it had a better QB to do so with, Renaldo Gray. Justin Hill had been the last QB that was more of an option-type QB. When Sorrells goes into the lineup, then Furman will go back to more of the offense it ran with Billy Napier and Ingle Martin, featuring more shotgun and sprintouts etc. The option is definitely a intrigal part of the Furman offensive package and has been since the 1970s.

I would rather us not run it nearly at all. Personally, a healthy Renaldo Gray is more important to me than running our old offense.

Also, I think you will see it phased out of Furman's gameplan. Next year (or sooner) the reigns will be handed over to Sorrells and then eventually to Cody Worely. Both have cannon arms but neither is blessed with footspeed.

Martin ran the option occassionally. One of the vivid plays that sticks out in my head was a keeper he took around the end against Samford. He went 70 yrds outrunning their entire defensive backfield untouched. You could almost see the "I had no idea he was that fast" look in their eyes.

[Mr. C]

The reason Furman runs the option with Gray is it makes him more of a threat as a QB. If you are not going to run the option, you might as well just throw Sorrells in there and not even play Gray. The thing that makes Gray a better QB than Sorrells is his running ability. The option also makes Jerome Felton more effective, because you have that threat of Felton running the dive on almost every play and you have to load up the box to stop that.

Furman may de-emphasize the option, if it has QBs like Jordan Sorrells who are not great runners. But it will always be lurking there, giving teams something else to have to prepare for. That is a major reason for keeping it as part of the package.

[Mr. C]

Bo Moore, nice guy, but he would have been the #3 quarterback on nearly every other team we've had. Maybe it looked like option, but it was more the "run away and save yourself" offense. It is a crying shame that we wasted a defense that was that good on an offense that was that bad. Moore had Brian Bratton and Ike West at his disposal and we still couldn't move the football.
Of course, freshman Josh Stepp was the QB for a large part of the season after Moore hurt his ankle against App State. I think that injury probably kept Furman from winning the SoCon title that year. That 13-10 ASU win at Greenville was one of the hardest hitting games I've seen in college.

[PaladinFan]

Of course, freshman Josh Stepp was the QB for a large part of the season after Moore hurt his ankle against App State. I think that injury probably kept Furman from winning the SoCon title that year. That 13-10 ASU win at Greenville was one of the hardest hitting games I've seen in college.

Furman lost 4 conference games that year by a combined 10 points. Had a five point loss at Southern, three points to ASU, and one point losses to Citadel and Wofford. Heck, we even played Clemson tough.

However, can't win if you can't score.

[JohnStOnge]

The SEC is not a "chuck and duck" league. It is a run-oriented league. See http://www.secsports.com/new/sports/fbc/06stats/confstat.htm .

Overall, last season, SEC teams ran the ball 55% of the time (5,224 running plays to 4,303 passing plays). Only two teams, Kentucky and Tennessee, had more passing plays than running plays.

The better teams in the league for the past season all leaned to the run in terms of play selection.

Florida ran to ball 476 times while passing it 399 times. LSU ran the ball 450 times while passing it 368 times. Auburn ran it 470 times while passing it 282 times. Arkansas ran it 502 times while passing it 302 times.

Not a "chuck and duck" league at all.

[PantherRob82]

So the hybrid was a mix of the run and shoot and...?

Each coaches personal ideas. xthumbsupx

[JohnStOnge]

I'm sure most of you already realized this but I just thought I'd mention that the defending FCS champ was a very run oriented team. App was ranked fourth in FCS in rushing offense as compared to 70th in passing offense. The Mountaineers had 664 rushing attempts to only 342 passing attempts.

I know it's kind of stating the obvious but running primarily out of the shotgun, as Florida did in FBS and App did in FCS, does not necessarily mean you're a pass oriented team. Both Florida and App had a pretty solid lean towards running the ball in their play selection. App especially.

[Kill'em]

Yep, it's Hatch Attack time for the Eagles. Lots of passing and don't forget the solid running part of his offense.
The only running BVG did well was from the truth.

[PaladinFan]

There is a lot of talk of that Hamilton (I think) kid at running back. Who's going to be catching the ball in this air attack?

[Kill'em]

He and Lewis will share time at RB.

[Mr. C]

What will become of Covington?

[rokamortis]

What will become of Covington?

He was moved to DB.

[pete4256]

What will become of Covington?

Covington is a safety now. Depending on how well he learns the position, he'll either start or be part of the rotation. He's automatically among the fastest and strongest safeties in the conference, so at this point it looks like a good move to increase depth on the defensive side of the ball.

On a related note, former QB phenom Chris Griffin and highly-touted speedster Lionel McGriff have also joined the defense as cornerbacks, where they look to provide depth behind Brandon Jackson and Carson Hill.

That's a serious influx of athleticism into the defensive backfield. I hope they can pick things up fast enough to contribute this year.

[blueballs]

Covington will probably wind up playing a strong safety/rover type of position. I don't think anybody can question his talent/athleticism. The only question is how soon he can learn/master the mental aspects of the position to make a significant contribution this year.

[Kill'em]

I almost feel sorry for the receiver who crosses the middle. xnodx

[AppGuy04]

Covington is a safety now. Depending on how well he learns the position, he'll either start or be part of the rotation. He's automatically among the fastest and strongest safeties in the conference, so at this point it looks like a good move to increase depth on the defensive side of the ball.

On a related note, former QB phenom Chris Griffin and highly-touted speedster Lionel McGriff have also joined the defense as cornerbacks, where they look to provide depth behind Brandon Jackson and Carson Hill.

That's a serious influx of athleticism into the defensive backfield. I hope they can pick things up fast enough to contribute this year.

yeah, but if he can't pick up things back there, he becomes a liability that speed can't cover up

[flexbone]

I would agree but we have to do something to bolster our defense. I like the moves we are making getting athletes to compete for playing time at positions of weakness. Instead of backlogging certain positions with all the talent/athleticism. Lets get our athletes on the field or at least pushing others to step up their game.

[Kill'em]

Griffin and Rogers looked good in the secondary during the Spring Game. Unfortunately, we didn't get to see Covington because he was in a car wreck earlier and was held out because of his injuries. From what I have heard he was doing well before the wreck.

[pete4256]

yeah, but if he can't pick up things back there, he becomes a liability that speed can't cover up


Yep. Noted in my post. If he's a liability, he won't play (I hope).

[blueballs]

Covington played DB in HS so perhaps the learning curve won't be as steep as we all think it will.xsmiley_wix

[Laserlips]

Coach Hatcher said on day one that he would adjust his team play to the talent he has to draw from.

If we have so many running backs that Covington won't see much playing time, and if HE wants to play on the defensive side of the ball, more power to him..

It was said that Coach Hatcher asked each player individually what postion he would prefer to play, and it would naturally follow the discussion would lead to " well, what's your second choice"?

I know it was reported the Jayson Foster expressed no interest in the qb position for this senior season. We keep having fans asking why Jayson isn't being treated fairly, but in fact he is.

I think Jayson will do great things in the upcoming football season, and while he probably will take snaps from the qb postion from time to time we will see him more in pass receiver/kickoff/punt runback type situations.

From all I hear the players are enjoying football again, and while some may say thats not a big deal, I think it is... If you are having fun at what you are doing you do a better job of it.. Just human nature.

I don't think GSU can kick everybodys butt this season, but I'll betcha' we'll spoil the party for somebody else before the season is over.. xthumbsupx

JMOFO

J. Pomeroy

[AppGuy04]

The vast array of offenses in this conference may be difficult for a guy that has only seen high school offenses. IMO, he will be a liability, atleast until playing a handful of games.

[pete4256]

The vast array of offenses in this conference may be difficult for a guy that has only seen high school offenses. IMO, he will be a liability, atleast until playing a handful of games.

Thanks. At least now we all know what to expect from Covington. xrolleyesx

[Peems]

The vast array of offenses in this conference may be difficult for a guy that has only seen high school offenses. IMO, he will be a liability, atleast until playing a handful of games.

you could have replaced offense with defense and been talking about Armanti last year. Depending on his assignments he can easily adjust to the college game. It's not hard if you have talent and skill. Adjusting from college to the NFL is a different thing all together though