Dixie State D1 Feasibility Study - WAC Confirms Exploring Adding FCS Football

[superman7515]

Dixie State should only consider an invitation from the WAC if the conference is actively exploring adding a sponsorship of football as part of its membership portfolio. The WAC has confirmed to Collegiate Consulting it is initiating a study in the Fall 2018 to explore the options and opportunities of starting a FCS football conference.


https://s3.amazonaws.com/sidearm.sites/dixieathletics.com/documents/2018/10/11/DSU_Feasibility_Study_10_1.pdf

[Reign of Terrier]

Probably Cit Dogs favorite academic institution not in the south

[ST_Lawson]

https://s3.amazonaws.com/sidearm.sites/dixieathletics.com/documents/2018/10/11/DSU_Feasibility_Study_10_1.pdf

Really?...all those schools starting up DI football from scratch? Seems unlikely, but ok.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

The hugely interesting part of this possibility is that New Mexico State is already a member of the WAC and is playing FBS. This might mean they are headed back to FCS in this new conference.

Here's another interesting wrinkle. You'd need six Big Sky members all playing together in the same conference to have a conference autobid. I think that means that if the conference ended up something like this:

Cal Poly
UC Davis
Sac State
SUU
NAU
Weber
NMSU
Dixie State

They'd have an autobid right away.

[walliver]

The WAC would need to grab 5 or 6 members from the Big Sky to make this work. Would enough western members of the BSC want to move.

[ST_Lawson]

The WAC would need to grab 5 or 6 members from the Big Sky to make this work. Would enough western members of the BSC want to move.

UTRGV has talked about adding football, but I haven't heard much beyond the "we're doing a study" phase...they're already in the WAC. Obviously they'd still need some of the southern/western Big Sky teams to join them, but that's one less that they might need to convince to join.

[superman7515]

The hugely interesting part of this possibility is that New Mexico State is already a member of the WAC and is playing FBS. This might mean they are headed back to FCS in this new conference.

NMSU has never been FCS/1AA.

[wapiti]

The hugely interesting part of this possibility is that New Mexico State is already a member of the WAC and is playing FBS. This might mean they are headed back to FCS in this new conference.

Here's another interesting wrinkle. You'd need six Big Sky members all playing together in the same conference to have a conference autobid. I think that means that if the conference ended up something like this:

Cal Poly
UC Davis
Sac State
SUU
NAU
Weber
NMSU
Dixie State

They'd have an autobid right away.

I think Weber would stay in the Big Sky. Maybe Portland State or UNC would move to WAC or another California school starts up football.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

I think Weber would stay in the Big Sky. Maybe Portland State or UNC would move to WAC or another California school starts up football.

They could. But I believe if they wanted an instant autobid they'd have to include Portland State or UNC, then. I think the magic number is 6.

[WestCoastAggie]

A big sky split with the WAC makes sense. All of those teams have to weigh on the NCAA autobid payouts.

[Model Citizen]

Almost no full WAC members in that group. Perhaps they take a cue from Patty V and call it the WAFL. "Waffle," if you're not into the whole brevity thing.

[Model Citizen]

Trivia Question of the Day:

What is Patty V's middle initial?

[Laker]

https://s3.amazonaws.com/sidearm.sites/dixieathletics.com/documents/2018/10/11/DSU_Feasibility_Study_10_1.pdf

Wow. 90 pages long. If they went D1 it would be a pretty quick rise for a school that was a junior college not long ago.

[Catatonic]

D2 Tarleton State has actively pursued moving to D1. They would be a likely candidate for the WAC if the conference opts for FCS football.

[DFW HOYA]

D2 Tarleton State has actively pursued moving to D1. They would be a likely candidate for the WAC if the conference opts for FCS football.

It's a long, long way from Stephenville to St. George.

[cx500d]

It's a long, long way from Stephenville to St. George.
Even longer for ut riogrande to Seattle.

[Catatonic]

It's a long, long way from Stephenville to St. George.

true, but WAC members NMSU and UTRGV are not far from Stephenville.

[UNHWildcat18]

Anyone else not want another FCS conference, or is it just me still? Delaware vs North Dakota state sounds a lot better than tartlestonville university vs dixie chicks college of performing arts. These schools should just save their money. The FCS should also get tougher on teams moving up, such as no new leagues, stadium and attendance requirements and need a conference invite, if they don't already.

[ST_Lawson]

Anyone else not want another FCS conference, or is it just me still? Delaware vs North Dakota state sounds a lot better than tartlestonville university vs dixie chicks college of performing arts. These schools should just save their money. The FCS should also get tougher on teams moving up, such as no new leagues, stadium and attendance requirements and need a conference invite, if they don't already.

I'm fine with all of that. Although I'd like the NCAA to actually enforce the current requirements on some of the G5 FBS teams and make them come back down.
No, MAC teams...you can't average 10k-11k and still be a FBS team. You're FCS now.
Actually, make the whole conference FCS and we'll trade YSU for Northern Illinois.

[bobcathpdevil56]

I would be in favor of it, and maybe it's homerism, but clarifying the Big Sky by reducing teams is a good thing for the conference.

Maybe not good for the entire FCS, but good for the Big Sky

[Anthony215]

I'm fine with all of that. Although I'd like the NCAA to actually enforce the current requirements on some of the G5 FBS teams and make them come back down.
No, MAC teams...you can't average 10k-11k and still be a FBS team. You're FCS now.
Actually, make the whole conference FCS and we'll trade YSU for Northern Illinois.

The problem is most of the good MAC teams have had a 1 year run where they won 10-11 games and their administration is still living in the past ie: Northern Illinois & Kent State who both had great seasons in 2012 with them both winning 12 games including wins over BCS Conference Teams but haven't done much since that historical season.

[CappinHard]

Actually, make the whole conference FCS and we'll trade YSU for Northern Illinois.

Can we keep Bo and let him coach a different MVFC team though? I need his meltdowns in my life.

[ST_Lawson]

The problem is most of the good MAC teams have had a 1 year run where they won 10-11 games and their administration is still living in the past ie: Northern Illinois & Kent State who both had great seasons in 2012 with them both winning 12 games including wins over BCS Conference Teams but haven't done much since that historical season.

That's where the NCAA actually enforcing the rules thing comes in. They don't get to choose...if they don't meet the criteria, down they go.


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[ST_Lawson]

Can we keep Bo and let him coach a different MVFC team though? I need his meltdowns in my life.

Hmmm....maybe Nielson can retire soon and Bo can take over the Coyotes. Either that or set up an annual "rivalry game" ooc with the Penguins.


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[CappinHard]

Hmmm....maybe Nielson can retire soon and Bo can take over the Coyotes. Either that or set up an annual "rivalry game" ooc with the Penguins.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Yes, please... let Bo burn USD's football program to the ground and provide me entertainment along the way.

https://media.giphy.com/media/8fen5LSZcHQ5O/giphy.gif

[katss07]

This is interesting, I never thought the WAC would be a football conference again. Its a shame the FBS version shut down, that was a badass conference back in the day (mid 2000s). I would assume the Southern Half of the BSC would join?

An awesome yet outlandish scenario that I would be great for the FCS:
WAC
Southern Utah
Cal Poly
Sac St
UC Davis
San Diego (from Pioneer, they don’t have to add scholarships...see Gtown. Green Bay joins the Pioneer)
New Mexico St (they drop)
Weber St
Northern Arizona

That would be a strong conference that could compete with the established BSC out west. Just an idea.

[TheKingpin28]

Yes, please... let Bo burn USD's football program to the ground and provide me entertainment along the way.

https://media.giphy.com/media/8fen5LSZcHQ5O/giphy.gifAnd let Stig provide the jooseing? I can get behind that!

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[BucBisonAtLarge]

NMSU has a major donor propping up the their FBS football profile. I'm not sure that this is a solution they're seeking.

[I Bleed Purple]

This is interesting, I never thought the WAC would be a football conference again. Its a shame the FBS version shut down, that was a badass conference back in the day (mid 2000s). I would assume the Southern Half of the BSC would join?

An awesome yet outlandish scenario that I would be great for the FCS:
WAC
Southern Utah
Cal Poly
Sac St
UC Davis
San Diego (from Pioneer, they don’t have to add scholarships...see Gtown. Green Bay joins the Pioneer)
New Mexico St (they drop)
Weber St
Northern Arizona

That would be a strong conference that could compete with the established BSC out west. Just an idea.

Weber State wouldn't leave the Big Sky. It could be the only member and wouldn't leave it.

[superman7515]

The FCS should also get tougher on teams moving up, such as no new leagues, stadium and attendance requirements and need a conference invite, if they don't already.

But that defeats the entire purpose that 1AA football was founded on, a "cost containment" option to allow cheap schools to spend as little as they chose, even nothing at all if they found a way to do it, and still have a D1 program. Schools were supposed to move up if they didn't like cost containment, not try to force additional requirements that were antithetical to the entire foundation of the division.

[DFW HOYA]

San Diego (from Pioneer, they don’t have to add scholarships...see Gtown. Green Bay joins the Pioneer)


I think there were some in Patriot-land that thought Georgetown was bluffing on its no-scholarship vote and would come along as Lafayette and Bucknell did. Didn't happen for a lot of reasons (including, of all things, unfunded scholarships in the Big East), and until the past few weeks the PL has seen a team that was wholly uncompetitive in league play (4-26 in PL from 2013-17). Why would San Diego want to go down that path?

[wapiti]

This is interesting, I never thought the WAC would be a football conference again. Its a shame the FBS version shut down, that was a badass conference back in the day (mid 2000s). I would assume the Southern Half of the BSC would join?

An awesome yet outlandish scenario that I would be great for the FCS:
WAC
Southern Utah
Cal Poly
Sac St
UC Davis
San Diego (from Pioneer, they don’t have to add scholarships...see Gtown. Green Bay joins the Pioneer)
New Mexico St (they drop)
Weber St
Northern Arizona

That would be a strong conference that could compete with the established BSC out west. Just an idea.

I do not see Weber leaving the Big Sky.
Weber, EWU, UM, UI, ISU, and MSU are all within a day's drive of each other.

EWU to Weber would make for a long day, but it could be driven within one day.

[Model Citizen]

Full Big Sky members don't get to leave the conference for football. It's all or nothing.

Most likely for a football league administered by the WAC would be NMSU, Dixie, Tarleton, UT-RGV*, Cal Poly, and UC-Davis. All of those are talking to the WAC right now.

all-sports WAC members in bold.
* studying addition of football.

San Diego might get on board later.

[dbackjon]

Full Big Sky members don't get to leave the conference for football. It's all or nothing.

Most likely for a football league administered by the WAC would be NMSU, Dixie, Tarleton, UT-RGV*, Cal Poly, and UC-Davis. All of those are talking to the WAC right now.

all-sports WAC members in bold.
* studying addition of football.

San Diego might get on board later.

Link that UC Davis and Cal Poly are talking to the WAC?

[Thumper 76]

Hmmm....maybe Nielson can retire soon and Bo can take over the Coyotes. Either that or set up an annual "rivalry game" ooc with the Penguins.


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https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20181101/16c0ab92ad630f4d19f346903e382657.jpg

Unfortunately I think if BoBo goes to coach another school he wants nothing to do with playing in the Valley.



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[Model Citizen]

I need no validation from the InterWeb.

Look deeply into my eyebrows, and you will understand.

[ST_Lawson]

Unfortunately I think if BoBo goes to coach another school he wants nothing to do with playing in the Valley.

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I do believe that is the most likely scenario, assuming YSU doesn't give him an extension to continue running their program into the ground....because...reasons.

[dbackjon]

I need no validation from the InterWeb.

Look deeply into my eyebrows, and you will understand.

Ah, pulling stuff outta your ass!

[Model Citizen]

No. Outta my brain.

However, if you Google Cal Poly Wac football, you'll find discussion under the news link. Newspaper articles publish speculation, just like this message board. It doesn't make it true or false. But you should really think this through.

[dbackjon]

Googled it, no links.

[UNHWildcat18]

But that defeats the entire purpose that 1AA football was founded on, a "cost containment" option to allow cheap schools to spend as little as they chose, even nothing at all if they found a way to do it, and still have a D1 program. Schools were supposed to move up if they didn't like cost containment, not try to force additional requirements that were antithetical to the entire foundation of the division.


Ah superman! feel like I haven't seen you post in months. That's a very good point you make, I guess I really don't have a problem with the cost containment at the "top" its like you said, its really just the bottom I have a problem with. I guess I just feel there should be some baseline that some schools couldn't even make, and that they belong in divison 2/3

[Model Citizen]

Ryan Miller of the St. George Spectrum has done his homework on the Ut-Cal-NM schools, Dixie's non-interest in the Pioneer, and more. Mostly restating the obvious, but he is a skilled journalist.

[Catatonic]

Ryan Miller of the St. George Spectrum has done his homework on the Ut-Cal-NM schools, Dixie's non-interest in the Pioneer, and more. Mostly restating the obvious, but he is a skilled journalist.

What is his take on New Mexico State? Last I heard there was strong opposition among most NMSU stakeholder groups to dropping down to FCS for football. Part of the opposition was based on losing their closest and oldest rivals, UTEP and UNM.

[Model Citizen]

Last I heard there was strong opposition among most NMSU stakeholder groups to dropping down to FCS for football. Part of the opposition was based on losing their closest and oldest rivals, UTEP and UNM.

You are correct. Miller is skeptical that NMSU is in a hurry to drop down.

The WAC will get new all-sports members, with or without the football league. Dixie is willing to be a FCS indie, if necessary.

[uni88]

That's where the NCAA actually enforcing the rules thing comes in. They don't get to choose...if they don't meet the criteria, down they go.


Sent from my iPhone using TapatalkNIU would just schedule annual "home" games at Soldier Field against Iowa and the like to pad their attendance.

NIU isn't near what they once were but they had a string of good years under Kill and I think Doeren with the Orange Bowl being their best year.

[ST_Lawson]

NIU would just schedule annual "home" games at Soldier Field against Iowa and the like to pad their attendance.

NIU isn't near what they once were but they had a string of good years under Kill and I think Doeren with the Orange Bowl being their best year.

They can try, but if they only pull 10k on average at home, play 7 total "home" games with one being against Iowa at Soldier Field (drawing 52k like they did back in 2012...the year they made the Orange Bowl), then that's still only a 16k average. Sure, that's better than a lot of FCS teams are doing (WIU included), not really where I feel like an FBS team should be. Two years ago they played then 8-2 Toledo at the White Sox baseball stadium (no, I won't say the stadiums name...it's stupid) and drew barely over 10k.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

Full Big Sky members don't get to leave the conference for football. It's all or nothing.

Most likely for a football league administered by the WAC would be NMSU, Dixie, Tarleton, UT-RGV*, Cal Poly, and UC-Davis. All of those are talking to the WAC right now.

all-sports WAC members in bold.
* studying addition of football.

San Diego might get on board later.

Cal Poly and UC Davis would be giving up a league with a playoff spot for one without for five years. However, if Poly and Davis convince, say, Sac State, NAU, Southern Utah and one more (Northern Colorado or Portland State) to also join, the new league would have an autobid because six of its members have played in a playoff conference for five or more seasons.

[Model Citizen]

Cal Poly and UC Davis would be giving up a league with a playoff spot for one without for five years. However, if Poly and Davis convince, say, Sac State, NAU, Southern Utah and one more (Northern Colorado or Portland State) to also join, the new league would have an autobid because six of its members have played in a playoff conference for five or more seasons.

Good point on the wait for a playoff slot. But maybe worth waiting for?

So you're suggesting that NAU, et al. would risk getting kicked out of the Big Sky altogether for the sake of playing football in the WAC? And their all-sports conference would become (?)... If they move basketball and such to the WAC, they're playing Chicago State, UMKC, and Seattle. Dunno if that's what they want.

So much would have to happen before a WAC fb league could become reality.

[clenz]

WAC and Summit become one

UND
NDSU
SDSU
USD
Cal Poly
UC Davis
Dixie State

Then fill in with non football schools for whatever else you want

WIU goes OVC
Murray State all sports to the MVC/MVFC
The MVC gets smart and adds SFA

UNI
ISUr
ISUb
SIU
MOSU
MUSU
SFA
Maybe WIU if they go Horizon and do the YSU connection as the HL wants 14

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[ST_Lawson]

Update to this situation...sounds like Dixie State is going DI with football going FCS Independent: https://www.ksl.com/article/46464699/sources-dixie-state-to-go-division-i-will-join-the-western-athletic-conference

Official press conferences from the school and WAC on Friday.

[ursus arctos horribilis]

I think Weber would stay in the Big Sky. Maybe Portland State or UNC would move to WAC or another California school starts up football.

I also couldn't see Weber leaving with them being a charter member of the BSC.