Week 7 Ranking Wars: Northern Iowa vs Northern Arizona [Archive]

dbackjon

October 15th, 2018, 01:24 PM

Daytripper

October 15th, 2018, 01:26 PM

POD Knows

October 15th, 2018, 01:38 PM

SOS 1 for UNI and 14 for NAU.

UpstateBison

October 15th, 2018, 01:45 PM

I think SHSU and UND rankings are similar to this debate.

dbackjon

October 15th, 2018, 01:48 PM

SOS 1 for UNI and 14 for NAU.

You still have to win good games. Playing and losing to good teams gets you what?

- - - Updated - - -

I think SHSU and UND rankings are similar to this debate.

A few others as well.

clenz

October 15th, 2018, 03:00 PM

Mayville Bison

October 15th, 2018, 03:21 PM

In short, I don't see a reason to rank UNI but not NAU.

40-8

Yeah, Missouri State looks better this year, but you can't lose to Missouri State by 30+ and expect to get votes. I know Cookus was out for the game, but that would explain losing 21-8 not 40-8. There are other reasons as well, but that's the biggest reason there's a gap for me.

Other reasons include (in no particular order)
-Barely getting by Southern Utah at home right after losing to Missouri State.
-Giving up 50+ to Idaho State (they also look better this year, but are they for real?)
-UNI lost @ Montana by 3. Yes, the game was a story of two halves, but a 3-point loss on the road is really easy to justify into a "that's a win if they play at home" argument.
-NAU had a bye compared to UNI going to USD and getting a win. With as much changeover as there was this week, it could have been very easy to forget about NAU since they didn't play.

dbackjon

October 15th, 2018, 03:56 PM

dbackjon

October 15th, 2018, 03:58 PM

40-8

Yeah, Missouri State looks better this year, but you can't lose to Missouri State by 30+ and expect to get votes. I know Cookus was out for the game, but that would explain losing 21-8 not 40-8. There are other reasons as well, but that's the biggest reason there's a gap for me.

Other reasons include (in no particular order)
-Barely getting by Southern Utah at home right after losing to Missouri State.
-Giving up 50+ to Idaho State (they also look better this year, but are they for real?)
-UNI lost @ Montana by 3. Yes, the game was a story of two halves, but a 3-point loss on the road is really easy to justify into a "that's a win if they play at home" argument.
-NAU had a bye compared to UNI going to USD and getting a win. With as much changeover as there was this week, it could have been very easy to forget about NAU since they didn't play.

Other teams are getting the benefit of a doubt when they lose their QB.
Missouri State and Idaho State are looking to be solid, top 25 teams.
Montana is proving to be not very good - but you are giving UNI a benefit because they are traditionally a strong team, unlike Idaho State

And yet NAU has by far the best win of the two teams - the victory over Weber State, which you are ignoring.

BisonTru

October 15th, 2018, 04:06 PM

UNI is 15th, 8th, and 5th in the Massey Composite, Massey, and Sagarin

NAU is 37th, 29th, and 26th.

I do think Massey and Sagarin are too high on UNI, but every computer model has UNI over NAU.

dbackjon

October 15th, 2018, 04:09 PM

UNI is 15th, 8th, and 5th in the Massey Composite, Massey, and Sagarin

NAU is 37th, 29th, and 26th.

I do think Massey and Sagarin are too high on UNI, but every computer model has UNI over NAU.

Which is mainly due to strength of schedule, however UNI lost all of those tough games.

F'N Hawks

October 15th, 2018, 04:11 PM

UNI is 15th, 8th, and 5th in the Massey Composite, Massey, and Sagarin

NAU is 37th, 29th, and 26th.

I do think Massey and Sagarin are too high on UNI, but every computer model has UNI over NAU.

Heavy preseason conference bias, like usual. Nothing in their record says they are a Top 25 team. Yet.

semobison

October 15th, 2018, 04:12 PM

40-8

Yeah, Missouri State looks better this year, but you can't lose to Missouri State by 30+ and expect to get votes. I know Cookus was out for the game, but that would explain losing 21-8 not 40-8. There are other reasons as well, but that's the biggest reason there's a gap for me.

Other reasons include (in no particular order)
-Barely getting by Southern Utah at home right after losing to Missouri State.
-Giving up 50+ to Idaho State (they also look better this year, but are they for real?)
-UNI lost @ Montana by 3. Yes, the game was a story of two halves, but a 3-point loss on the road is really easy to justify into a "that's a win if they play at home" argument.
-NAU had a bye compared to UNI going to USD and getting a win. With as much changeover as there was this week, it could have been very easy to forget about NAU since they didn't play.

Agree with all of this! How you win and how you lose matter. EWU lost their QB and lost a close game. NAU lost their QB and got pounded!
NAU has time to right the ship and UNI has some very tough games upcoming.

Preferred Walk-On

October 15th, 2018, 04:23 PM

Disclaimer: I didn't put either team in my top 25

Northern Iowa re-entered the rankings (As I suspected they would) with 342 points while NAU stays with just 9 votes. But is that the proper split? Is there really that big of a gap?

The Facts:

Both are 3-3.

NAU Wins:
FBS UTEP (yes, most top 30 FCS teams would beat them)
#10 Weber State
1 D1 Win Southern Utah

UNI Wins:
1 D1 Win Hampton
1 D1 Win Indiana State
#32 South Dakota

Advantage NAU - better wins

NAU Losses:
#7 EWU
#21 Idaho State
#29 Missouri State

UNI Losses:
FBS Iowa
#36 Montana
#1 NDSU

Advantage: Neither - both lost to expected opponents, both lost on the road to ORV teams (although Missouri State is a top 25 team, IMHO).

In short, I don't see a reason to rank UNI but not NAU.

I am guilty of this, but I can get on board with this argument. Although, I might argue the wins are a bit closer than you make them appear.

Southern Utah and Hampton is probably a wash.

If most top 30 FCS teams would beat UTEP, then UTEP and South Dakota is also a wash (BTW, South Dakota took Kansas State to the limit).

Weber State over Indiana State is the only comparison I might put some stock in, although Indiana State is 6 points from having their only losses be to Louisville, and you guessed it, Northern Iowa (and that was a 33-0 a$$kicking).

So in short, I can see a reason to rank UNI but not NAU, but this definitely gives me another perspective to think about. If NAU and UNI can win 4 of their last 5, I think both should be playoff teams, and I would like to see this settled on the field. Best of luck to both teams.

BisonTru

October 15th, 2018, 04:24 PM

Which is mainly due to strength of schedule, however UNI lost all of those tough games.

Computers don't just rank you high because you have a strong SOS. Most of them base the result vs expected result. Take UNI's loss to NDSU which UNI gave the #1 team a tough game well into the fourth quarter. That result most likely helped them in the computer models because they performed better than expected. Whereas NAU only winning by one score against a weak SUU squad at home probably hurt them.

It's real simple minded to just look at Ws or Ls, but if you really want to be predictive as most computer models are very good at, you are going to have to delve in deeper into how those Ws and Ls came about and how was the relative competition.

F'N Hawks

October 15th, 2018, 04:28 PM

Computers don't just rank you high because you have a strong SOS. Most of them base the result vs expected result. Take UNI's loss to NDSU which UNI gave the #1 team a tough game well into the fourth quarter. That result most likely helped them in the computer models because they performed better than expected. Whereas NAU only winning by one score against a weak SUU squad at home probably hurt them.

It's real simple minded to just look at Ws or Ls, but if you really want to be predictive as most computer models are very good at, you are going to have to delve in deeper into how those Ws and Ls came about and how was the relative competition.

Are you telling us the computers know that UNI played well for 3 quarters vs NDSU and factored that in? Wtf.

They lost by 25 ****ing points. It's conference bias, 100%. Look at Massey at start of a season.

F'N Hawks

October 15th, 2018, 04:30 PM

For everyone scoring at home this thread has turned into another moral victory argument for the MVFC.

Southern Utah is the equivalent of Hampton now? Holy ****.

POD Knows

October 15th, 2018, 04:33 PM

For everyone scoring at home this thread has turned into another moral victory argument for the MVFC.

Southern Utah is the equivalent of Hampton now? Holy ****.So you think conference strength is meaningless?

F'N Hawks

October 15th, 2018, 04:34 PM

So you think conference strength is meaningless?

Where did I state that?

POD Knows

October 15th, 2018, 04:36 PM

Where did I state that?I read your mind.

BisonTru

October 15th, 2018, 04:43 PM

Are you telling us the computers know that UNI played well for 3 quarters vs NDSU and factored that in? Wtf.

They lost by 25 ****ing points. It's conference bias, 100%. Look at Massey at start of a season.

Every computer model is different but leading going into the fourth quarter could easily be a data point in consideration. I don't remember and I can't find an archived rankings to see if UNI dropped or rose or stayed put after the NDSU game, but anyone that understands football knows a team pulling away late in the fourth quarter and a team getting down by 25 early in the first quarter and never getting back into it are two completely different games even though the final score margin might be similar.

BisonTru

October 15th, 2018, 04:50 PM

For everyone scoring at home this thread has turned into another moral victory argument for the MVFC.

Southern Utah is the equivalent of Hampton now? Holy ****.

Do you think the computers just have a hard on for the MVFC? Does every computer nerd who puts these models together just secretly worship the MVFC?

Plus spare me your MVFC moral victory outrage. This is a ****ing debate thread posed by your fellow Big Sky buddy. You don't like it, don't read it champ.

semobison

October 15th, 2018, 05:01 PM

I read your mind.

Not hard to do, he says the same **** over and over.....

F'N Hawks

October 15th, 2018, 05:04 PM

Not hard to do, he says the same **** over and over.....

You got me there.

F'N Hawks

October 15th, 2018, 05:07 PM

Do you think the computers just have a hard on for the MVFC? Does every computer nerd who puts these models together just secretly worship the MVFC?

Plus spare me your MVFC moral victory outrage. This is a ****ing debate thread posed by your fellow Big Sky buddy. You don't like it, don't read it champ.

Not hard to figure out, runner-up.

MSUBobcat

October 15th, 2018, 05:23 PM

Every computer model is different but leading going into the fourth quarter could easily be a data point in consideration. I don't remember and I can't find an archived rankings to see if UNI dropped or rose or stayed put after the NDSU game, but anyone that understands football knows a team pulling away late in the fourth quarter and a team getting down by 25 early in the first quarter and never getting back into it are two completely different games even though the final score margin might be similar.

If that is in fact a data point, the computer models must then also account for things like UC-Davis being up 49-10 on NoCo with 11 minutes to play, Davis putting in 2nd and 3rd (I've even heard Davis fans saying 3rd and 4th) string players and giving up 26 straight points to make it a respectable looking 49-36 game, which it was not. For the computer to accurately judge how a game got to the end result.... it would pretty much have to WATCH the game. The football computers are becoming self-aware xeekx

That said, both teams have a terrible loss and a decent win and need to keep winning to enter the playoff picture, IMO.

POD Knows

October 15th, 2018, 05:38 PM

Not hard to do, he says the same **** over and over.....Yea, my mind reading skills are pretty rudimentary, the simpler the mind, the better. xnodx

Bison Fan in NW MN

October 15th, 2018, 06:02 PM

I didn't rank either team this week but my eye ball test in watching highlights of both and watching UNI for basically 2 full games....UNI is a lot better team than NAU.

BisonTru

October 15th, 2018, 06:21 PM

If that is in fact a data point, the computer models must then also account for things like UC-Davis being up 49-10 on NoCo with 11 minutes to play, Davis putting in 2nd and 3rd (I've even heard Davis fans saying 3rd and 4th) string players and giving up 26 straight points to make it a respectable looking 49-36 game, which it was not. For the computer to accurately judge how a game got to the end result.... it would pretty much have to WATCH the game. The football computers are becoming self-aware xeekx

That said, both teams have a terrible loss and a decent win and need to keep winning to enter the playoff picture, IMO.

I am not sure how all the puters do their rankings (they are all certainly a little different), but they should put some consideration into garbage time points and how irrelevant they really are.

UpstateBison

October 15th, 2018, 07:39 PM

For everyone scoring at home this thread has turned into another moral victory argument for the MVFC.

Southern Utah is the equivalent of Hampton now? Holy ****.

No. They are worse as they lost at home to tUNA. A transitional team in the FCS.

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Professor Chaos

October 15th, 2018, 08:25 PM

I'll also point out that Massey's "biased" algorithm is leading everyone in the CAA pick 'em by 4 games or more on the year right now.

Mayville Bison

October 15th, 2018, 10:12 PM

Other teams are getting the benefit of a doubt when they lose their QB.
Missouri State and Idaho State are looking to be solid, top 25 teams.
Montana is proving to be not very good - but you are giving UNI a benefit because they are traditionally a strong team, unlike Idaho State

And yet NAU has by far the best win of the two teams - the victory over Weber State, which you are ignoring.

I'm not ignoring anything. You posted the wins - I didn't realize you wanted me to list it again.

As for the traditional "powers", right or wrong, that's just the way it is for the time being. It's gonna take more than a half of a season to show losing at Montana is a worse loss than losing to Missouri State or Idaho St. In the past 10 years, Idaho St has more 1 win seasons than winning seasons, and Missouri St has just as many 1 win seasons as winning seasons.

dbackjon

October 16th, 2018, 09:23 AM

So you are admitting a bias to prior years. Gotcha.

F'N Hawks

October 16th, 2018, 10:38 AM

No. They are worse as they lost at home to tUNA. A transitional team in the FCS.

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You need to stop trying to talk knowledgeably about FCS football. Just stop.

MSUBobcat

October 16th, 2018, 11:54 AM

I am not sure how all the puters do their rankings (they are all certainly a little different), but they should put some consideration into garbage time points and how irrelevant they really are.

That's a whole lot of subjectivity that would seem very hard to come up with a formula to compute. You'd almost have to have the depth charts uploaded, have the computer know who's on the field, etc. Hell, you'd almost have to know if they were in prevent defense, willing to let the other team get chunk yardage as long as the clock kept ticking. Unless humans are going to code scores with "GT" for garbage time or something, I just don't see how a computer could evaluate the end score other than, this is what the model expected and this is what happened. I could be out to lunch, as I wasn't consulted for any of these models, but it would seem hard for a computer to look at a score and know how the game "felt". There's plenty of instances to be found where even the example you gave of a game where the team pulled away in the fourth and winning by 25 being a completely different game than one in which one team jumped out to a 25 point lead in the first and finished with the same margin. In both instances, it's possible that for 3 quarters both teams were evenly matched, but one team had a meltdown for 15 minutes. Why should it matter if you throw a pick-6, have a punt returned against you and some defensive letdowns in the 1st quarter vs. the 4th, yet played 3 other quarters fairly evenly against the opponent. In both cases the losing team would leave thinking, except for some epic mistakes that cost us the ball game, we hung well with the other team.

UpstateBison

October 16th, 2018, 12:22 PM

You need to stop trying to talk knowledgeably about FCS football. Just stop.

Southern Utah lost at home to University of North Alabama on 9/1/18 34-30. I think they are equivalent to Hampton.

Reign of Terrier

October 16th, 2018, 01:25 PM

Who gives a flying ****?

If it was UNI and Insert random Big South school Jon wouldn’t give a single squirt of piss.

The reality is if you are having to justify why you belong at the bottom of the poll you don’t really belong for any reason other than someone has to fill it.

UNI isn’t a top 25 team.

Does that make you happy Jon?

Take the spot. Hope it helps your base sleep at night.

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I have no idea how good UNI is, but the bolded is pretty spot on. Spots 20-25 are literally just homer spots and "this team did good this week." People should not get overly opinionated about spots 15-25 because at this level, they're usually unpredictive of anything. Top 15 is probably a better ranking system for FCS.

Now that I think of it, that kind of makes me want to go back to a 16 game playoff and just do a top 16 poll.

Schism55

October 20th, 2018, 05:19 PM

clenz

October 20th, 2018, 08:37 PM

You were saying Jon?

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20181021/5936f78a0683aac588dc66576980a323.pnghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20181021/c3b20558672305f770fd15b40cc2e9bb.png

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WestCoastAggie

October 20th, 2018, 08:40 PM

Well...

katss07

October 20th, 2018, 08:43 PM

STOOPID

semobison

October 20th, 2018, 09:08 PM

Funny... dback and F'n! The question now is if UNI is top 10. The way their defense played today I don't know if there is 10 teams in the country who can beat them.

clenz

October 20th, 2018, 09:44 PM

Funny... dback and F'n! The question now is if UNI is top 10. The way their defense played today I don't know if there is 10 teams in the country who can beat them.

UNI was down 2 starting OLB (one of whom is a OLB in the Jerry Rice list) and starting a kid at FS that was a WR 2 weeks ago....

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Panthers1995

October 20th, 2018, 09:55 PM

Funny... dback and F'n! The question now is if UNI is top 10. The way their defense played today I don't know if there is 10 teams in the country who can beat them.

In my mind, (may have a little bias but who cares, right?) UNI is a top 10 team no questions about it. The unfortunate part is that they will have to play SDSU or NDSU again on the road in the playoffs and we all know how that is going to turn out.

Bison Fan in NW MN

October 20th, 2018, 10:01 PM

In my mind, (may have a little bias but who cares, right?) UNI is a top 10 team no questions about it. The unfortunate part is that they will have to play SDSU or NDSU again on the road in the playoffs and we all know how that is going to turn out.

Not so sure about that. SDSU has to go to Ill State and they do not play well there traditionally.

- - - Updated - - -

In my mind, (may have a little bias but who cares, right?) UNI is a top 10 team no questions about it. The unfortunate part is that they will have to play SDSU or NDSU again on the road in the playoffs and we all know how that is going to turn out.

Not so sure about that. SDSU has to go to Ill State and they do not play well there traditionally.

Panthers1995

October 20th, 2018, 10:06 PM

Not so sure about that. SDSU has to go to Ill State and they do not play well there traditionally.

- - - Updated - - -

Not so sure about that. SDSU has to go to Ill State and they do not play well there traditionally.

This is far fetched, but does UNI have a shot at a seed if they win out and go 8-3? From what the committee has shown that is the only way that they will avoid running into another MVFC team in the playoffs.

Bison Fan in NW MN

October 20th, 2018, 10:12 PM

This is far fetched, but does UNI have a shot at a seed if they win out and go 8-3? From what the committee has shown that is the only way that they will avoid running into another MVFC team in the playoffs.

The Montana loss is a killer for UNI right now but if they finish 8-3 IMO, they would be in consideration for a seed depending how the rest of the FCS looks.

Panthers1995

October 20th, 2018, 10:17 PM

The Montana loss is a killer for UNI right now but if they finish 8-3 IMO, they would be in consideration for a seed depending how the rest of the FCS looks.

I think you are spot on with that, If UNI wins out that would add a win against ISUr and Missouri State. The Montana loss is most defiantly a bad loss at this point but it was in week one.

JayJ79

October 20th, 2018, 10:55 PM

This is far fetched, but does UNI have a shot at a seed if they win out and go 8-3? From what the committee has shown that is the only way that they will avoid running into another MVFC team in the playoffs.
Getting a seed wouldn't prevent them from running into another MVFC team. In that scenario, it wouldn't even surprise me if the committee put UNI as a #8 (thus a possible matchup in Fargo in the quarters), and put an unseeded MVFC team in the round 1 game that paired with that seed.

SDFS

October 21st, 2018, 01:10 AM

If Montana and UNI are both 7-4 - both on the bubble - who is in the playoffs?

Bison Fan in NW MN

October 21st, 2018, 08:36 AM

If Montana and UNI are both 7-4 - both on the bubble - who is in the playoffs?

Tough call.

Panthers1995

October 21st, 2018, 08:42 AM

Tough call.

I think with the recent trends of the teams if UNI loses to ISUr as their 4th loss UNI would have a huge advantage over Montana on the bubble. Montana did beat UNI head to head but they have also lost to some pretty bad teams while UNI only has loses to Montana, Iowa (Potential top 15 FBS team unfortunately) and NDSU.

Bison Fan in NW MN

October 21st, 2018, 08:48 AM

I think with the recent trends of the teams if UNI loses to ISUr as their 4th loss UNI would have a huge advantage over Montana on the bubble. Montana did beat UNI head to head but they have also lost to some pretty bad teams while UNI only has loses to Montana, Iowa (Potential top 15 FBS team unfortunately) and NDSU.

Montana is not a playoff team and if they squeak in because the committee wants a $$ playoff game then they will be a one and done team....but they will probably be on the road.

UNI has:

At WIU
Ill State at home
At YSU
MSU at home

4 winnable games with WIU and Ill State being tough games. Even at YSU will be tough.....Bozo will have them ready to go against UNI....maybe?

AmsterBison

October 21st, 2018, 09:59 AM

If Montana and UNI are both 7-4 - both on the bubble - who is in the playoffs?

Montana has played one ranked team (at home) and Drake. They have one ranked team left on the schedule (UC Davis.)
UNI has played 4 ranked teams, including two in the top 10 and Iowa. They have one ranked team left on the schedule (Illinois State.)

In addition, UNI is currently alone in second place in the MVFC. Montana is currently 5th in the Big Sky.

The answer is pretty obvious to me.

POD Knows

October 21st, 2018, 11:03 AM

Montana has played one ranked team (at home) and Drake. They have one ranked team left on the schedule (UC Davis.)
UNI has played 4 ranked teams, including two in the top 10 and Iowa. They have one ranked team left on the schedule (Illinois State.)

In addition, UNI is currently alone in second place in the MVFC. Montana is currently 5th in the Big Sky.

The answer is pretty obvious to me.This is balls on, it wouldn't be close for me either between these two teams.

clenz

October 21st, 2018, 11:07 AM

Montana has played one ranked team (at home) and Drake. They have one ranked team left on the schedule (UC Davis.)
UNI has played 4 ranked teams, including two in the top 10 and Iowa. They have one ranked team left on the schedule (Illinois State.)

In addition, UNI is currently alone in second place in the MVFC. Montana is currently 5th in the Big Sky.

The answer is pretty obvious to me.

7-4 still leaves UNI in second place in the MVFC other outright or winning most plausible tie break situations.

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AmsterBison

October 21st, 2018, 12:17 PM

7-4 still leaves UNI in second place in the MVFC other outright or winning most plausible tie break situations.

Yeah, the *worst* UNI would be at 7-4 is second place in the MVFC.

It seems like UND folks, from the administration to their media guys to their fanbase, still blame the MVFC for their 2015 7-4 team missing the playoffs. Which... yeah.

SDFS

October 21st, 2018, 12:25 PM

Montana has played one ranked team (at home) and Drake. They have one ranked team left on the schedule (UC Davis.)
UNI has played 4 ranked teams, including two in the top 10 and Iowa. They have one ranked team left on the schedule (Illinois State.)

In addition, UNI is currently alone in second place in the MVFC. Montana is currently 5th in the Big Sky.

The answer is pretty obvious to me.

So, we are saying head to head does not count?? I thought that I read that H2H matters? hmmmm

JayJ79

October 21st, 2018, 12:34 PM

Montana is not a playoff team and if they squeak in because the committee wants a $$ playoff game then they will be a one and done team....but they will probably be on the road.
Not sure what you're talking about with being on the road.
Home games in the first round are determined by geography and bid amounts ($$$), and Montana outbids everyone else due to their attendance.

AmsterBison

October 21st, 2018, 01:02 PM

So, we are saying head to head does not count?? I thought that I read that H2H matters? hmmmm

Yeah, head-to-head counts, but it is not the only factor. I know that UND fans have some sort of grievance against UNI, but it makes no sense. The reason that 2015 UND team didn't make the playoffs had nothing to do with the MVFC. Your boys just weren't that good. UND had 61 total yards against NDSU in 2015. They got blown out by the only other playoff team they played too. I'm going to generalize here: UND fans and media folks seems incredibly ignorant about the FCS. The FCS doesn't have anything against UND - you just aren't the relevant yet.

Yeah, UNI made the playoffs in 2015 and UND didn't. UNI also won their first round game by 36 points and ran over sixth-seeded Portland State before falling to NDSU in a close game. That year, UND had 61 yards of offense against NDSU. UND was not even close to UNI that year.

Luckily, you'll be in the MVFC soon and you can settle this on the field instead of whatever fantasy dimension UND fans inhabit now. And, once you're there, maybe you'll understand that second place in the MVFC is nothing to sneeze at.

Catbooster

October 21st, 2018, 01:22 PM

Montana is not a playoff team and if they squeak in because the committee wants a $$ playoff game then they will be a one and done team....but they will probably be on the road.
I agree with you, that Montana is not a playoff caliber team. Neither is Montana State. But it's entirely possible one of them will be in the conversation for bubble teams.

But if they make it, neither will be on the road. For them to generate money for the playoffs, they will have to win the bid for a game. And probably the only teams that can rival their attendance (and therefore bids) are teams that will likely have first round byes.

And both would likely be one and done teams, but you never know. It depends on who gets sent out here for the game. That team might also be a weak team (either bubble or weak auto-bid).

Catbooster

October 21st, 2018, 01:25 PM

Montana has played one ranked team (at home) and Drake. They have one ranked team left on the schedule (UC Davis.)
UNI has played 4 ranked teams, including two in the top 10 and Iowa. They have one ranked team left on the schedule (Illinois State.)

In addition, UNI is currently alone in second place in the MVFC. Montana is currently 5th in the Big Sky.

The answer is pretty obvious to me.
Agreed. This won't take the committee 5 minutes to debate. Unless UNI falls apart down the stretch and/or UM suddenly starts playing well. If current trends continue this is a no-brainer.

Catbooster

October 21st, 2018, 01:28 PM

So, we are saying head to head does not count?? I thought that I read that H2H matters? hmmmm
H2H counts, but not for much if it's the 1st game of the season and the rest of the season indicates the opposite result.

TheKingpin28

October 21st, 2018, 01:31 PM

I agree with you, that Montana is not a playoff caliber team. Neither is Montana State. But it's entirely possible one of them will be in the conversation for bubble teams.

But if they make it, neither will be on the road. For them to generate money for the playoffs, they will have to win the bid for a game. And probably the only teams that can rival their attendance (and therefore bids) are teams that will likely have first round byes.

And both would likely be one and done teams, but you never know. It depends on who gets sent out here for the game. That team might also be a weak team (either bubble or weak auto-bid).

If either Montana team makes it and San Diego wins the Auto, that will be the set up.

F'N Hawks

October 21st, 2018, 04:29 PM

Yeah, head-to-head counts, but it is not the only factor. I know that UND fans have some sort of grievance against UNI, but it makes no sense. The reason that 2015 UND team didn't make the playoffs had nothing to do with the MVFC. Your boys just weren't that good. UND had 61 total yards against NDSU in 2015. They got blown out by the only other playoff team they played too. I'm going to generalize here: UND fans and media folks seems incredibly ignorant about the FCS. The FCS doesn't have anything against UND - you just aren't the relevant yet.

Yeah, UNI made the playoffs in 2015 and UND didn't. UNI also won their first round game by 36 points and ran over sixth-seeded Portland State before falling to NDSU in a close game. That year, UND had 61 yards of offense against NDSU. UND was not even close to UNI that year.

Luckily, you'll be in the MVFC soon and you can settle this on the field instead of whatever fantasy dimension UND fans inhabit now. And, once you're there, maybe you'll understand that second place in the MVFC is nothing to sneeze at.

Wrong team, Ace. UNI wasn't the issue in 2015. Alot of blabber for nothing.

POD Knows

October 21st, 2018, 04:42 PM

Wrong team, Ace. UNI wasn't the issue in 2015. Alot of blabber for nothing.Yea, you would have been one and out that year just like you where when the handicap ward from Richmond showed up in your freaking building. You didn't deserve to be in the playoffs with that ****ty record against that ****ty schedule in year 0 for UND football.

SDFS

October 21st, 2018, 04:54 PM

I think with the recent trends of the teams if UNI loses to ISUr as their 4th loss UNI would have a huge advantage over Montana on the bubble. Montana did beat UNI head to head but they have also lost to some pretty bad teams while UNI only has loses to Montana, Iowa (Potential top 15 FBS team unfortunately) and NDSU.

But where is the quality win. The win over SDSU has * because of all the injuries. What else is on the resume? Your argument is who has better loses? When one there loses is to the team they are being measured against.

Wins: Hampton, ISU-B, USD, SDSU, WIU, YSU and MSU
Loses: UM, UI, NDSU, ISU-R

F'N Hawks

October 21st, 2018, 04:59 PM

Yea, you would have been one and out that year just like you where when the handicap ward from Richmond showed up in your freaking building. You didn't deserve to be in the playoffs with that ****ty record against that ****ty schedule in year 0 for UND football.

Ignore the point and go on a spazztick rant. Weirdo.

clenz

October 21st, 2018, 05:06 PM

But where is the quality win. The win over SDSU has * because of all the injuries. What else is on the resume? Your argument is who has better loses? When one there loses is to the team they are being measured against.

Wins: Hampton, ISU-B, USD, SDSU, WIU, YSU and MSU
Loses: UM, UI, NDSU, ISU-R

UNI was without 2 starting linebackers. Playing a WR at safety, had 2 OL that were about 79% healthy and were iffy going into the game. Does UNI get extra for the SDSU win because of the injuries we had?

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SDFS

October 21st, 2018, 05:12 PM

Yeah, head-to-head counts, but it is not the only factor. I know that UND fans have some sort of grievance against UNI, but it makes no sense. The reason that 2015 UND team didn't make the playoffs had nothing to do with the MVFC. Your boys just weren't that good. UND had 61 total yards against NDSU in 2015. They got blown out by the only other playoff team they played too. I'm going to generalize here: UND fans and media folks seems incredibly ignorant about the FCS. The FCS doesn't have anything against UND - you just aren't the relevant yet.

Yeah, UNI made the playoffs in 2015 and UND didn't. UNI also won their first round game by 36 points and ran over sixth-seeded Portland State before falling to NDSU in a close game. That year, UND had 61 yards of offense against NDSU. UND was not even close to UNI that year.

Luckily, you'll be in the MVFC soon and you can settle this on the field instead of whatever fantasy dimension UND fans inhabit now. And, once you're there, maybe you'll understand that second place in the MVFC is nothing to sneeze at.

Hmmmm - I was projecting both Montana and UNI finishing at 7-4 (which I think is very real). Not sure how you pulled your conclusions from that statement. NOTE: I believe UND was upset about a 6-5 WIU getting in the playoffs.

Bison Fan in NW MN

October 21st, 2018, 05:14 PM

Not sure what you're talking about with being on the road.
Home games in the first round are determined by geography and bid amounts ($$$), and Montana outbids everyone else due to their attendance.

Ya, you're right the Griz can outbid most if not all teams.

Bison Fan in NW MN

October 21st, 2018, 05:17 PM

Ignore the point and go on a spazztick rant. Weirdo.

The only "weirdo" seems to be you. You never enter a thread w/o a sh**show ensuing with your drivel. Happens with every other fan base in the Valley with you....what is the common factor in all of it.....You.

xcoffeex

SDFS

October 21st, 2018, 05:19 PM

UNI was without 2 starting linebackers. Playing a WR at safety, had 2 OL that were about 79% healthy and were iffy going into the game. Does UNI get extra for the SDSU win because of the injuries we had?

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Still looking for the quality wins... I did not see the game. Just going off of comments on this board from SDSU fans (3rd string running back and numerous injuries on the O-line). But, your team being injured is dually noted - thank you.

F'N Hawks

October 21st, 2018, 05:28 PM

The only "weirdo" seems to be you. You never enter a thread w/o a sh**show ensuing with your drivel. Happens with every other fan base in the Valley with you....what is the common factor in all of it.....You.

xcoffeex

Interesting. Almost like I don't give a ****.

What other fan base do I ever engage with?

Bison Fan in NW MN

October 21st, 2018, 05:31 PM

Interesting. Almost like I don't give a ****.

What other fan base do I ever engage with?

Can you read?

I said...."happens with every other fan base in the Valley".....Congrats Fawker!

TheKingpin28

October 21st, 2018, 05:32 PM

The only "weirdo" seems to be you. You never enter a thread w/o a sh**show ensuing with your drivel. Happens with every other fan base in the Valley with you....what is the common factor in all of it.....You.

xcoffeex

It is only going to get worse when they enter the Valley.

JayJ79

October 21st, 2018, 06:32 PM

And, once you're there, maybe you'll understand that second place in the MVFC is nothing to sneeze at.
Do you honestly think UND will ever be second place in the MVFC? (aside from occasions when one MVFC game is played before any of the others, and there is one team at 1-0, one team at 0-1, and everyone else "tied for second" at 0-0)

POD Knows

October 21st, 2018, 07:30 PM

Ignore the point and go on a spazztick rant. Weirdo.LOL, you are still butthurt from getting "shafted" from the playoffs with your weak 7-4 record. I addressed the point of your stupid post when you were trying to correct somebody but we all know what you were getting at, it was beat to death on here when it happened. Make the playoffs this year, prove something and maybe people wouldn't give you so much grief. You don't play Cal Davis or EWU this year (another cupcake schedule for UND) so you might have to win out to get in, that Sammy win isn't looking to good now, is it.

AmsterBison

October 22nd, 2018, 09:18 AM

Do you honestly think UND will ever be second place in the MVFC? (aside from occasions when one MVFC game is played before any of the others, and there is one team at 1-0, one team at 0-1, and everyone else "tied for second" at 0-0)

I'll never say never. Heck, maybe UND will make the playoffs and go on a run this year, but once UND gets in the MVFC, it's going to be impossible to hide weaknesses because the competition is good and there aren't the lopsided schedules that the large conferences can provide.

Professor Chaos

October 22nd, 2018, 11:48 AM

I'll never say never. Heck, maybe UND will make the playoffs and go on a run this year, but once UND gets in the MVFC, it's going to be impossible to hide weaknesses because the competition is good and there aren't the lopsided schedules that the large conferences can provide.
At least not for any of the Dakota schools with them all playing each other (and probably UNI) every year.

Things are going to start getting a little Big Sky-ish when say someone like Illinois St misses both NDSU and SDSU in the same year.