What declining attendance?!?

[The Boogie Down]

So yeah, there's another "Attendance is Down” thread but, surprisingly, this one wasn’t started by a Patsy League fan. Not so surprisingly,,, it does feature peeps venting about kids today, the softening of the game, technology, certain teams being too good, poor halftime bands and a lack of creativity in bringing more fans to alma mater. All while often tying into some "how much better things were 20-30 years ago” thinking. OTOH, official NCAA numbers show that for all the talk here, attendance is not down from what they were in the "Good Ol’ Days.” I know because of the many NCAA record books I used to collect back in the early and mid '90s. Anyhoo,,, being that "20 or 30" years ago is pretty arbitrary, I decided to pick 1993 to make my comparison. That's when the Dayton Rule greatly altered the I-AA landscape and reshaped the subdivision to what it is today.


First however, since Alabama was mentioned in that other thread, I’d like to give a sneak peek to the I-A teams too. Overall, and with just 106 teams to work with, the I-A/FBS world averaged 41,281 fans per game in 1993. That number increased to 42,108 in 2017. Doesn’t sound like much at first but that’s also while adding an extra 23 teams (mostly garbage ones at that) to the 1-A/FBS world! As for Alabama, well yeah they've lost a handful of fans since 2016 and another handful since 2015. But they still managed an average of 101,722 fans per game in 2017. Let’s all agree that’s “slightly" better than the 75,682 they averaged in 1993! Oh and they were coming off a national championship then too. So yeah, if you’re a P-5 team and if you’ve added way more seats to your stadium, then you’re doing much better now than back in 1993. The same is not exactly true for the G-5 teams although an array of those teams were either playing I-AA football in 1993 (like Boise State, Marshall, Georgia Southern), didn’t exist yet (like FIU, FAU, ODU) or still hadn’t been left off what would become the P-5 carousel (like BYU, Houston, Air Force). But, when looking at I-A/FBS teams that were "small time" then and continue to be "small time" now, attendance numbers are virtually the same. For instance, the MAC averaged 14,252 fans per game in 1993 and 15,394 teams in 2017. And that increase comes while adding 2 more teams to the league.


So that brings us to the I-AA/FCS world…


Yes, here numbers have dropped from what they were a generation ago. Back in 1993 average attendance was 8,599. By 2017 that dipped to 7,798. But take into account that many of the I-AA attendance leaders in 1993 (like the aforementioned Boise State, Marshall and Georgia Southern but also UCF, UAB, App State, Idaho, UConn) hadn’t yet jumped up a level. Other attendance leaders back in 1993 (and for the entire 1980s/early '90s era) were SWAC teams. To this day the SWAC still leads the FCS in attendance but that conference has noticeably dropped in terms of attendance since 1993. Back then the SWAC averaged 18,398 fans per game. They followed that with 23,000+ in 1994! For the most part though it’s been pretty much downhill since. 1998 was the first year ever (as a I-AA) they finished south of the 15,000 mark. They’ve been below that for most years since. Last year they averaged 13,694. Still good. More accurately, still good enough to yet again lead all of FCS. All that said, not quite as good as what the SWAC used to experience during the era that included stars like Jimmy Smith, Steve McNair and before that, Jerry Rice.


As for the rest of the FCS, it’s all pretty much the same. The Patriot League averaged 5,710 in 1993 and 4,926 (thanks Georgetown) in 2017. The Big Sky averaged 9,596 then and 9,927 now. The Colonial (as the Yankee) averaged 8,213 then and 9,825 now. The Ivy averaged 10,022 then and 8,229 now. The MEAC averaged an even 11,000 then and 9,450 now. The Missouri Valley (as the Gateway) was 7,942 then and is 10,697 now. The Ohio Valley averaged 6,015 then and 7,831 now. The Southland averaged 9,384 then and 7,872 now. Teams that make up what is now the Big South and NEC that were around playing I-AA ball in 1993 are all up now. In fact, although most of the MAAC is mercifully gone now, even the Pioneer (2,969 then and 3,008 now) is up ever so slightly from 1993.


Bottom line, only 2 conferences have seen noticeable gate declines since 1993. Those are the aforementioned SWAC, which for whatever the reason has been slowly declining and the SoCo (12,110 then and 7,827 now) which has lost more power members than any other conference since 1993. Every other conference however is just about where it was in 1993. Even with the cable TV explosion, beepers, AOL, text messengers, Friendster, MySpace, smart phones, Facebook, Instagram, Spotify and video on demand, people are still going to games just like they were in 1993. This, even while throwing in safe spaces, skinny jeans, Maroon 5, football-hating university presidents, the Obama presidency, targeting rules AND, my personal favorite, the “Man Cave” theory! This one apparently protects men from "venturing out in public with all the risks involved” while providing these same too-scared-to-go-out "men” a place to whine about the feminization of the US. And yet, even with all that PLUS the plethora of added cultural venues to cosmopolitan areas like Worcester, Mass since 1993, college attendance has still managed to be where it was way back then.


In fact, aside from the SWAC and SoCo, it’s mostly up. Mostly up across the I-A landscape as well. Way up in the pros too where, while adding 4 more teams, NFL attendance jumped from 47,485 in 1993 to 53,917 in 2017.


Oh and, surprise-surprise, but whether it be the NFL, P-5, G-5 or FCS, teams that usually play well, draw well. Just as teams that don’t win, don’t draw. There are some exceptions (like Penn, Howard, Dayton and Duquesne who have all dropped off a lot at the gate since 1993 despite still getting wins in their respective conferences) to the rule but for the most part it’s that simple. Win and the fans will come. Don’t win and they won't. Same as it ever was. Oh, and hope for good weather.

[WileECoyote06]

Some great research. Thank you for your effort.

[ASU33]

Good research! xnodx

[ASU33]

SWAC attendance has dropped for several reasons, the biggest has been matchups have changed. SWAC teams have given up rivalry home and home games for FBS pay days on the road. Back in the day Bama State used to host schools like FAMU, SC State, Morehouse, Albany State, Miles College and other traditional HBCU rivals which would draw HUGE numbers. Now outside of Tuskegee we don't have another traditional non-conference HBCU rival on the schedule. Southern/FAMU is another one, so is Alabama A&M and Morehouse. Our ADs struggle to schedule these games because it doesn't help the D2 teams get to playoff eligibility and more HBCUs are scheduling FBS contests. ASU played its first FBS contest in over 18 years in 2006 vs Troy, we played UAB in 2008, Eastern Michigan in 2011, and Kentucky in 2013. After that we didn't play another FBS game until 2016, and played Troy 2017. This year alone we've played Auburn and South Alabama which is odd for a school that has not played these games on a regular basis.

[Professor Chaos]

Real good stuff! One question I'd have though is regarding attendance over-reporting. I'm of the belief that it's pretty rampant in all FCS leagues right now and I think playoff attendance figures when we always hear people say "there was a least a few thousand more than that!" are evidence of the fact that we've been coached to think attendance is more than it is when we compare what our eyeballs see to what the reported attendance number is. Was that over-reporting as commonplace 25 years ago as it is now? I honestly have no idea.

[katss07]

Quality post. Some conferences are better than others attendance wise, but most keep a steady trend.

As a Bearkat fan, I can remember days where a good 3k would show up. I’m not one to complain about 8,000 fans showing up for a midseason game against some *****ty team. Could always be worse.

[caribbeanhen]

that was a good read, pretty funny as well

[ASU33]

The State Fair Classic this weekend had announced crowd of 47,921 which is significantly smaller than the 55k from last year but from all accounts this year's crowd was bigger. Most folks expected about 62k or more to be announced based on the crowd and the percentage of seats filled. Jackson State is notorious in the SWAC for Underreporting by a lot!

http://www.anygivensaturday.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=29145&stc=1

[Derby City Duke]

Good post! Made my head hurt a bit, but that's ok.

[The Boogie Down]

SWAC attendance has dropped for several reasons, the biggest has been matchups have changed. SWAC teams have given up rivalry home and home games for FBS pay days on the road. Back in the day Bama State used to host schools like FAMU, SC State, Morehouse, Albany State, Miles College and other traditional HBCU rivals which would draw HUGE numbers. Now outside of Tuskegee we don't have another traditional non-conference HBCU rival on the schedule. Southern/FAMU is another one, so is Alabama A&M and Morehouse. Our ADs struggle to schedule these games because it doesn't help the D2 teams get to playoff eligibility and more HBCUs are scheduling FBS contests. ASU played its first FBS contest in over 18 years in 2006 vs Troy, we played UAB in 2008, Eastern Michigan in 2011, and Kentucky in 2013. After that we didn't play another FBS game until 2016, and played Troy 2017. This year alone we've played Auburn and South Alabama which is odd for a school that has not played these games on a regular basis.

Thank you for explaining to me why SWAC numbers have gone down over the past 20 years or so. And many-many-many thanks to all the nice words from dudes appreciating the official NCAA (whether they were over-reported then, or are over-reported now, or both) numbers. Unfortunately not only does my wife not appreciate these numbers, she especially didn't appreciate me dragging out all these dusty, old books to begin with. Sooo, I'll be laying low now... But all jokes aside, thanks for the nice words xpeacex

[AmsterBison]

Real good stuff! One question I'd have though is regarding attendance over-reporting. I'm of the belief that it's pretty rampant in all FCS leagues right now and I think playoff attendance figures when we always hear people say "there was a least a few thousand more than that!" are evidence of the fact that we've been coached to think attendance is more than it is when we compare what our eyeballs see to what the reported attendance number is. Was that over-reporting as commonplace 25 years ago as it is now? I honestly have no idea.

FBS schools over-report too. Cripes, most MAC attendance numbers are complete fantasy, for example.

If schools want to increase attendance, the first thing they should do is play all their games on Saturday at predictable times.

MAC weekday games have pathetic attendance. Pretty sure that I've seen more people in a Target parking lot on a Sunday morning than were at that Thursday night NC A&T v SC State game which had an announced attendance of 11,000+.

I've never heard of under-reporting... other than some speculation that the band and free tickets don't count for playoff games. I wonder why a school would do that.

[Derby City Duke]

Real good stuff! One question I'd have though is regarding attendance over-reporting. I'm of the belief that it's pretty rampant in all FCS leagues right now and I think playoff attendance figures when we always hear people say "there was a least a few thousand more than that!" are evidence of the fact that we've been coached to think attendance is more than it is when we compare what our eyeballs see to what the reported attendance number is. Was that over-reporting as commonplace 25 years ago as it is now? I honestly have no idea.

I don't know either, but which # should be reported: turnstile clicks or tickets sold? I would submit that both #s should be reported and should note # of promotional tickets given away.

[JacksFan40]

FBS schools over-report too. Cripes, most MAC attendance numbers are complete fantasy, for example.

If schools want to increase attendance, the first thing they should do is play all their games on Saturday at predictable times.

MAC weekday games have pathetic attendance. Pretty sure that I've seen more people in a Target parking lot on a Sunday morning than were at that Thursday night NC A&T v SC State game which had an announced attendance of 11,000+.

I've never heard of under-reporting... other than some speculation that the band and free tickets don't count for playoff games. I wonder why a school would do that.
Those Wednesday MAC games on ESPN always make me laugh, 25k seat stadiums and under half full. Then again I wouldn’t want to watch Ball State vs Miami (Ohio).

[UAalum72]

Real good stuff! One question I'd have though is regarding attendance over-reporting. I'm of the belief that it's pretty rampant in all FCS leagues right now and I think playoff attendance figures when we always hear people say "there was a least a few thousand more than that!" are evidence of the fact that we've been coached to think attendance is more than it is when we compare what our eyeballs see to what the reported attendance number is. Was that over-reporting as commonplace 25 years ago as it is now? I honestly have no idea.The Ivy League Football Media Guide has a section on Series History. A large number of the games have attendance numbers ending in "000". I believe those as much as an accountant would believe expense account purchases that end in even dollars.

I also saw that until the 1970s, Ivies like Brown and Dartmouth played at Yale and Harvard for 40 or 50 years in a row, I assume because of the larger stadiums.

[Professor Chaos]

I don't know either, but which # should be reported: turnstile clicks or tickets sold? I would submit that both #s should be reported and should note # of promotional tickets given away.
Yeah, I think a lot of schools "sell" plenty of free tickets that don't get used and then count those in the attendance numbers. It's interesting how the official reported attendance seems to get a lot smaller in the playoffs when 75% of the face value of every ticket "sold" goes to the NCAA.

[Derby City Duke]

Yeah, I think a lot of schools "sell" plenty of free tickets that don't get used and then count those in the attendance numbers. It's interesting how the official reported attendance seems to get a lot smaller in the playoffs when 75% of the face value of every ticket "sold" goes to the NCAA.

I think the playoff #s are much closer to butts in seats. IIRC (and I don't do that much) JMU purchased a bunch of tickets for students and made them available for free. We averaged 16K or so for the playoffs last year which dropped our season average to just under 22K. Stadium holds 24,877, though we've had over 26K w/standing room tix. The problem I have in estimating based on TV is that the cameras are on the home side so I can never get a look at the south side of Bridgeforth. That side holds plus the west end zone holds roughly 18K.

[CHIP72]

I think many of the attendance concerns that various people, not just on this site, have raised are based on attendance patterns over the last 10 years, maybe 15 years, or so.

[bonarae]

Great post.... Thanks for researching.

Sent from my LG-H870DS using Tapatalk

[PaladinFan]

I don't know either, but which # should be reported: turnstile clicks or tickets sold? I would submit that both #s should be reported and should note # of promotional tickets given away.

I've looked into this question before and found that schools are permitted to disclose either.

As an example, Mercer in their restart of football made season tickets imminently affordable (cheap) to generate interest. They have no problem selling them, but those season ticket holders don't show up for every game. Mercer counts tickets sold in their reporting numbers, which will often show excess capacity crowds for a game with significantly less than that.

That's not a knock on Mercer, as many schools do that. They are just an obvious example because their reported attendance often significantly exceeds their stadium's reported capacity.

Furman does not sell as many season tickets, and generally (perhaps always) counts "fannies in the seats." You might see a large disparity between attendance figures for Furman and Mercer any one weekend while the actual crowds are roughly the same.

[Redbird 4th & short]

Good post! Made my head hurt a bit, but that's ok.
thanks for advance warning .. I'll pick this up this weekend when I have more time.

[AmsterBison]

Yeah, I think a lot of schools "sell" plenty of free tickets that don't get used and then count those in the attendance numbers. It's interesting how the official reported attendance seems to get a lot smaller in the playoffs when 75% of the face value of every ticket "sold" goes to the NCAA.

A 50 cent per attendee charge at regular season games would more than cover the entire cost of playoff travel even with 16 seeded teams and would end talk of cost-based playoff match-ups (regionalization.)

The only bad side effect, I believe, would be a dramatic drop in announced attendance figures.

Another dead horse I like to beat: "Percent of capacity" is meaningless because so many schools have announced that their attendance was, say, 150% of capacity. No, it wasn't (obviously.) Every time a school sets a new attendance record, the new figure is, by definition,their new capacity.

[ST_Lawson]

Another dead horse I like to beat: "Percent of capacity" is meaningless because so many schools have announced that their attendance was, say, 150% of capacity. No, it wasn't (obviously.) Every time a school sets a new attendance record, the new figure is, by definition,their new capacity.

That issue is kinda tricky and depends on the stadium, I think. I know what you mean...if you can fit X number of people in, then it's capacity is at least that. However, some stadiums (WIU, for example) have our actual seating, but then we also have hills around other sections of the field where people often sit. When we have our stadium's "capacity" listed (~16.3k), I'm pretty sure that's the actual seats/bleachers, but we have fit a lot more in there. Our record is ~19.8k at a game back in '73, and I've seen photos of it...I'd believe it. Every seat in the actual stands on both sides had a butt in it and the hillsides around the stadium...jam packed with people. The photos looked very similar to what it looked like when we had a Rams vs Bears scrimmage, which was estimated at ~20k people.

[IBleedYellow]

Good post! Made my head hurt a bit, but that's ok.

It's okay - we can't all be smart and go to Ivy League schools. xthumbsupx

[WileECoyote06]

A 50 cent per attendee charge at regular season games would more than cover the entire cost of playoff travel even with 16 seeded teams and would end talk of cost-based playoff match-ups (regionalization.)

The only bad side effect, I believe, would be a dramatic drop in announced attendance figures.

Another dead horse I like to beat: "Percent of capacity" is meaningless because so many schools have announced that their attendance was, say, 150% of capacity. No, it wasn't (obviously.) Every time a school sets a new attendance record, the new figure is, by definition,their new capacity.




We have an adjoining track and practice fields. On big game days (homecoming and against A&T), we rent screens and allow fans to watch from that field. Those games can push us over capacity, (11K-15K) but our stadium seats only 10K. 15K is not our new capacity.

[POD Knows]

So yeah, there's another "Attendance is Down” thread but, surprisingly, this one wasn’t started by a Patsy League fan. Not so surprisingly,,, it does feature peeps venting about kids today, the softening of the game, technology, certain teams being too good, poor halftime bands and a lack of creativity in bringing more fans to alma mater. All while often tying into some "how much better things were 20-30 years ago” thinking. OTOH, official NCAA numbers show that for all the talk here, attendance is not down from what they were in the "Good Ol’ Days.” I know because of the many NCAA record books I used to collect back in the early and mid '90s. Anyhoo,,, being that "20 or 30" years ago is pretty arbitrary, I decided to pick 1993 to make my comparison. That's when the Dayton Rule greatly altered the I-AA landscape and reshaped the subdivision to what it is today.


First however, since Alabama was mentioned in that other thread, I’d like to give a sneak peek to the I-A teams too. Overall, and with just 106 teams to work with, the I-A/FBS world averaged 41,281 fans per game in 1993. That number increased to 42,108 in 2017. Doesn’t sound like much at first but that’s also while adding an extra 23 teams (mostly garbage ones at that) to the 1-A/FBS world! As for Alabama, well yeah they've lost a handful of fans since 2016 and another handful since 2015. But they still managed an average of 101,722 fans per game in 2017. Let’s all agree that’s “slightly" better than the 75,682 they averaged in 1993! Oh and they were coming off a national championship then too. So yeah, if you’re a P-5 team and if you’ve added way more seats to your stadium, then you’re doing much better now than back in 1993. The same is not exactly true for the G-5 teams although an array of those teams were either playing I-AA football in 1993 (like Boise State, Marshall, Georgia Southern), didn’t exist yet (like FIU, FAU, ODU) or still hadn’t been left off what would become the P-5 carousel (like BYU, Houston, Air Force). But, when looking at I-A/FBS teams that were "small time" then and continue to be "small time" now, attendance numbers are virtually the same. For instance, the MAC averaged 14,252 fans per game in 1993 and 15,394 teams in 2017. And that increase comes while adding 2 more teams to the league.


So that brings us to the I-AA/FCS world…


Yes, here numbers have dropped from what they were a generation ago. Back in 1993 average attendance was 8,599. By 2017 that dipped to 7,798. But take into account that many of the I-AA attendance leaders in 1993 (like the aforementioned Boise State, Marshall and Georgia Southern but also UCF, UAB, App State, Idaho, UConn) hadn’t yet jumped up a level. Other attendance leaders back in 1993 (and for the entire 1980s/early '90s era) were SWAC teams. To this day the SWAC still leads the FCS in attendance but that conference has noticeably dropped in terms of attendance since 1993. Back then the SWAC averaged 18,398 fans per game. They followed that with 23,000+ in 1994! For the most part though it’s been pretty much downhill since. 1998 was the first year ever (as a I-AA) they finished south of the 15,000 mark. They’ve been below that for most years since. Last year they averaged 13,694. Still good. More accurately, still good enough to yet again lead all of FCS. All that said, not quite as good as what the SWAC used to experience during the era that included stars like Jimmy Smith, Steve McNair and before that, Jerry Rice.


As for the rest of the FCS, it’s all pretty much the same. The Patriot League averaged 5,710 in 1993 and 4,926 (thanks Georgetown) in 2017. The Big Sky averaged 9,596 then and 9,927 now. The Colonial (as the Yankee) averaged 8,213 then and 9,825 now. The Ivy averaged 10,022 then and 8,229 now. The MEAC averaged an even 11,000 then and 9,450 now. The Missouri Valley (as the Gateway) was 7,942 then and is 10,697 now. The Ohio Valley averaged 6,015 then and 7,831 now. The Southland averaged 9,384 then and 7,872 now. Teams that make up what is now the Big South and NEC that were around playing I-AA ball in 1993 are all up now. In fact, although most of the MAAC is mercifully gone now, even the Pioneer (2,969 then and 3,008 now) is up ever so slightly from 1993.


Bottom line, only 2 conferences have seen noticeable gate declines since 1993. Those are the aforementioned SWAC, which for whatever the reason has been slowly declining and the SoCo (12,110 then and 7,827 now) which has lost more power members than any other conference since 1993. Every other conference however is just about where it was in 1993. Even with the cable TV explosion, beepers, AOL, text messengers, Friendster, MySpace, smart phones, Facebook, Instagram, Spotify and video on demand, people are still going to games just like they were in 1993. This, even while throwing in safe spaces, skinny jeans, Maroon 5, football-hating university presidents, the Obama presidency, targeting rules AND, my personal favorite, the “Man Cave” theory! This one apparently protects men from "venturing out in public with all the risks involved” while providing these same too-scared-to-go-out "men” a place to whine about the feminization of the US. And yet, even with all that PLUS the plethora of added cultural venues to cosmopolitan areas like Worcester, Mass since 1993, college attendance has still managed to be where it was way back then.


In fact, aside from the SWAC and SoCo, it’s mostly up. Mostly up across the I-A landscape as well. Way up in the pros too where, while adding 4 more teams, NFL attendance jumped from 47,485 in 1993 to 53,917 in 2017.


Oh and, surprise-surprise, but whether it be the NFL, P-5, G-5 or FCS, teams that usually play well, draw well. Just as teams that don’t win, don’t draw. There are some exceptions (like Penn, Howard, Dayton and Duquesne who have all dropped off a lot at the gate since 1993 despite still getting wins in their respective conferences) to the rule but for the most part it’s that simple. Win and the fans will come. Don’t win and they won't. Same as it ever was. Oh, and hope for good weather. You need to work on your sarcasm detection, a while back somebody posted regarding the reason why they didn't go to the games and most of what I stated was "pulled" from that. My comments were more of a backhanded slap against such thought but carry on. Also, I have a buddy that used to go to the games until he turned half of his garage into a man cave with 3 50+" TV, a bar and all sorts of ****. He hides in there with some neighbors instead of trying to go to games, I think you would be surprised how many people are doing this. It is arm chair fandom but it is what it is.

[Ivytalk]

Blame Obama? Well, there you go.

Thoughtful post, packed with info.

[RootinFerDukes]

TL;DR

[RootinFerDukes]

Blame Obama? Well, there you go.

Thoughtful post, packed with info.

He went ahead and lodged that complaint so that other posters can not bother. You can’t derail a thread that derailed itself!

[Reign of Terrier]

So yeah, there's another "Attendance is Down” thread but, surprisingly, this one wasn’t started by a Patsy League fan. Not so surprisingly,,, it does feature peeps venting about kids today, the softening of the game, technology, certain teams being too good, poor halftime bands and a lack of creativity in bringing more fans to alma mater. All while often tying into some "how much better things were 20-30 years ago” thinking. OTOH, official NCAA numbers show that for all the talk here, attendance is not down from what they were in the "Good Ol’ Days.” I know because of the many NCAA record books I used to collect back in the early and mid '90s. Anyhoo,,, being that "20 or 30" years ago is pretty arbitrary, I decided to pick 1993 to make my comparison. That's when the Dayton Rule greatly altered the I-AA landscape and reshaped the subdivision to what it is today.


First however, since Alabama was mentioned in that other thread, I’d like to give a sneak peek to the I-A teams too. Overall, and with just 106 teams to work with, the I-A/FBS world averaged 41,281 fans per game in 1993. That number increased to 42,108 in 2017. Doesn’t sound like much at first but that’s also while adding an extra 23 teams (mostly garbage ones at that) to the 1-A/FBS world! As for Alabama, well yeah they've lost a handful of fans since 2016 and another handful since 2015. But they still managed an average of 101,722 fans per game in 2017. Let’s all agree that’s “slightly" better than the 75,682 they averaged in 1993! Oh and they were coming off a national championship then too. So yeah, if you’re a P-5 team and if you’ve added way more seats to your stadium, then you’re doing much better now than back in 1993. The same is not exactly true for the G-5 teams although an array of those teams were either playing I-AA football in 1993 (like Boise State, Marshall, Georgia Southern), didn’t exist yet (like FIU, FAU, ODU) or still hadn’t been left off what would become the P-5 carousel (like BYU, Houston, Air Force). But, when looking at I-A/FBS teams that were "small time" then and continue to be "small time" now, attendance numbers are virtually the same. For instance, the MAC averaged 14,252 fans per game in 1993 and 15,394 teams in 2017. And that increase comes while adding 2 more teams to the league.


So that brings us to the I-AA/FCS world…


Yes, here numbers have dropped from what they were a generation ago. Back in 1993 average attendance was 8,599. By 2017 that dipped to 7,798. But take into account that many of the I-AA attendance leaders in 1993 (like the aforementioned Boise State, Marshall and Georgia Southern but also UCF, UAB, App State, Idaho, UConn) hadn’t yet jumped up a level. Other attendance leaders back in 1993 (and for the entire 1980s/early '90s era) were SWAC teams. To this day the SWAC still leads the FCS in attendance but that conference has noticeably dropped in terms of attendance since 1993. Back then the SWAC averaged 18,398 fans per game. They followed that with 23,000+ in 1994! For the most part though it’s been pretty much downhill since. 1998 was the first year ever (as a I-AA) they finished south of the 15,000 mark. They’ve been below that for most years since. Last year they averaged 13,694. Still good. More accurately, still good enough to yet again lead all of FCS. All that said, not quite as good as what the SWAC used to experience during the era that included stars like Jimmy Smith, Steve McNair and before that, Jerry Rice.


As for the rest of the FCS, it’s all pretty much the same. The Patriot League averaged 5,710 in 1993 and 4,926 (thanks Georgetown) in 2017. The Big Sky averaged 9,596 then and 9,927 now. The Colonial (as the Yankee) averaged 8,213 then and 9,825 now. The Ivy averaged 10,022 then and 8,229 now. The MEAC averaged an even 11,000 then and 9,450 now. The Missouri Valley (as the Gateway) was 7,942 then and is 10,697 now. The Ohio Valley averaged 6,015 then and 7,831 now. The Southland averaged 9,384 then and 7,872 now. Teams that make up what is now the Big South and NEC that were around playing I-AA ball in 1993 are all up now. In fact, although most of the MAAC is mercifully gone now, even the Pioneer (2,969 then and 3,008 now) is up ever so slightly from 1993.


Bottom line, only 2 conferences have seen noticeable gate declines since 1993. Those are the aforementioned SWAC, which for whatever the reason has been slowly declining and the SoCo (12,110 then and 7,827 now) which has lost more power members than any other conference since 1993. Every other conference however is just about where it was in 1993. Even with the cable TV explosion, beepers, AOL, text messengers, Friendster, MySpace, smart phones, Facebook, Instagram, Spotify and video on demand, people are still going to games just like they were in 1993. This, even while throwing in safe spaces, skinny jeans, Maroon 5, football-hating university presidents, the Obama presidency, targeting rules AND, my personal favorite, the “Man Cave” theory! This one apparently protects men from "venturing out in public with all the risks involved” while providing these same too-scared-to-go-out "men” a place to whine about the feminization of the US. And yet, even with all that PLUS the plethora of added cultural venues to cosmopolitan areas like Worcester, Mass since 1993, college attendance has still managed to be where it was way back then.


In fact, aside from the SWAC and SoCo, it’s mostly up. Mostly up across the I-A landscape as well. Way up in the pros too where, while adding 4 more teams, NFL attendance jumped from 47,485 in 1993 to 53,917 in 2017.


Oh and, surprise-surprise, but whether it be the NFL, P-5, G-5 or FCS, teams that usually play well, draw well. Just as teams that don’t win, don’t draw. There are some exceptions (like Penn, Howard, Dayton and Duquesne who have all dropped off a lot at the gate since 1993 despite still getting wins in their respective conferences) to the rule but for the most part it’s that simple. Win and the fans will come. Don’t win and they won't. Same as it ever was. Oh, and hope for good weather.


Good stuff. It can't be understated how much Georgia Southern and App State leaving the Southern Conference has affected our overall attendance numbers. At their peak in the 2000s, you could expect them to turn out over 18k (forgive me, I don't have their stadium capacities memorized) for a home game and add at least 2-3K to an away game. They traveled well.

This post basically reiterates what I already believe to be true: this phenomenon of half-empty (at best) stadiums for most teams at the FCS level isn't anything new. Attendance isn't really part of the business model, so much as FBS teams.

It's further worth reiterating that in the Pac 12 and ACC and G5, it's rare to get more than 50k or so at a football game. I know there's Clemson and other exceptions, but the Big 10, Big 12, and SEC are the ones that carry the weight in terms of football attendance. Why is that the case? See my post in the other thread. History of success+lack of professional team in the region+time is the TL;DR

And most FCS teams won't grow to replace the programs that left in terms of attendance. Are there any D2 teams averaging 15k or more?

[ASU33]

Good stuff. It can't be understated how much Georgia Southern and App State leaving the Southern Conference has affected our overall attendance numbers. At their peak in the 2000s, you could expect them to turn out over 18k (forgive me, I don't have their stadium capacities memorized) for a home game and add at least 2-3K to an away game. They traveled well.

This post basically reiterates what I already believe to be true: this phenomenon of half-empty (at best) stadiums for most teams at the FCS level isn't anything new. Attendance isn't really part of the business model, so much as FBS teams.

It's further worth reiterating that in the Pac 12 and ACC and G5, it's rare to get more than 50k or so at a football game. I know there's Clemson and other exceptions, but the Big 10, Big 12, and SEC are the ones that carry the weight in terms of football attendance. Why is that the case? See my post in the other thread. History of success+lack of professional team in the region+time is the TL;DR

And most FCS teams won't grow to replace the programs that left in terms of attendance. Are there any D2 teams averaging 15k or more?

Nope. I think the higher averages at the D2 level are around the 11k mark. Tuskegee and Grand Valley State both got up close to 12k in recent years.

[Professor]

Its about matchups. Always has been. If i'm a PWI / FCS team in the south, I keep the HBCUs that are close by on the schedule. A&T has filled many a stadium