Everyone from the Southern Conference!!!!

[jsualum97]

Just a simple yes or no. Who is looking forward to Samford joining the Southern Conference. Don't need any debate, or arguements for or against, just a simple yes or no.

[proasu89]

No

[OL FU]

Sorry but there is very little in this world that is a simple yes or noxeyebrowx

They do not appear to be an attractive football candidate. Hopefully, they will prove me wrong in the future.

[AppGuy04]

No

[AZGrizFan]

Hey, every conference needs their Northern Colorado or Indiana State. xeyebrowx xcoolx

[OL FU]

and another thing. this is not an accurate reflection of how the SoCon might think about Samford. The people on this site are football fans from football schools. ASU, FU WC and GSU. There are four more football playing schools and three other schools that don't play football.

[MYTAPPY]

NOxnonono2x

[dbackjon]

and another thing. this is not an accurate reflection of how the SoCon might think about Samford. The people on this site are football fans from football schools. ASU, FU WC and GSU. There are four more football playing schools and three other schools that don't play football.


You really can't just say yes or no, can ya? :p

[OL FU]

You really can't just say yes or no, can ya? :p

No:p :D

[jsualum97]

OK,

Let's amend the original thread. Give your arguements for or against Samford joining the Southern Conference. I personally don't want Samford to join. But, I am looking at it from a JSU perspective. They are a great rivalry for us both athletically and geographically. I just don't see them bringing anything to the table in the Southern Conference as far as athletics. The only advantage is that it will make Chattanooga happy.
What is in it for Samford?? having other private schools in a conference! Samford has been doing very well in the OVC. Being the OVC's only private school has not been an obstacle for them.
I wish they would stay.

[furman94]

NADA!xlolx

[OL FU]

OK,

Let's amend the original thread. Give your arguements for or against Samford joining the Southern Conference. I personally don't want Samford to join. But, I am looking at it from a JSU perspective. They are a great rivalry for us both athletically and geographically. I just don't see them bringing anything to the table in the Southern Conference as far as athletics. The only advantage is that it will make Chattanooga happy.
What is in it for Samford?? having other private schools in a conference! Samford has been doing very well in the OVC. Being the OVC's only private school has not been an obstacle for them.
I wish they would stay.

OK since you put it that way, for JSU sake, I wish they would stay:o


xsmiley_wix xsmiley_wix xsmiley_wix xsmiley_wix


But after all the hoopla, it would sure be an embarrassment if we invite and they decide to stay

[AppGuy04]

Hey, every conference needs their Northern Colorado or Indiana State. xeyebrowx xcoolx
We have Elonxnodx

[jsualum97]

Once again I amend the original question. Which had you rather have Samford, Jacksonville State, or both???

I would love to go to the Southern Conference but, obviously either the Southern Conference doesn't want us, or Chattanooga made it clear that they do not want JSU.
It seems as though Chattanooga has a lot of pull in the Southern Conference. Do they have some incriminating pictures or something??

[OL FU]

Once again I amend the original question. Which had you rather have Samford, Jacksonville State, or both???

I would love to go to the Southern Conference but, obviously either the Southern Conference doesn't want us, or Chattanooga made it clear that they do not want JSU.
It seems as though Chattanooga has a lot of pull in the Southern Conference. Do they have some incriminating pictures or something??

I would be surprised if it is Chattanooga. It is more likely Furman, Wofford and the other smaller sometimes private schools that are pushing for another smaller private school. Just a guessxchinscratchx

[AZGrizFan]

We have Elonxnodx

I was going to say that, but didn't want to offend anyone.... xsmiley_wix xsmiley_wix

[WUTNDITWAA]

No.

I would like Jax State though.

[El_Cid_99]

The only plus that I can see right now is getting the chance to go visit friends in Birmingham once every couple of years, and eat at Nikki's West while I'm there.

Besides, we already have a Bulldog mascot in the conference.

[AppGuy04]

I was going to say that, but didn't want to offend anyone.... xsmiley_wix xsmiley_wix

yeah, I don't carexsmiley_wix

[seantaylor]

Big No.

[atlGAmocs]

No, I would have preferred Jax St. Chattanooga needs somebody to take ETSU's place and I don't think Samford fits the bill.

[OL FU]

Sounds unanimous.

I guess we should ask the SoCon what they hell they think they are doingxeekx

[GSUhooligan]

Jack St. Hell Yes!

Samford HELL NO!

but I would go for both, Jack St. to improve the conference, and Samford to appease the whine and cheese crowd.

[lizrdgizrd]

Not excited about Samford. JSU maybe.

[BigApp]

no.

[GaSouthern]

NO!

[Mountaineer]

Definitely not. xcoffeex xbawlingx

We already have an Elon, we don't need another. :p

[catamount man]

Yes. Welcome Samford!xthumbsupx

GO CATAMOUNTS!!!

[GaSouthern]

...coming from the winless socon team of 2006

ohhhhhhhh i'm just kidding, GSU has NO room to talk after last season either ;)

[PaladinFan]

I don't think anyone is jumping for joy at the prospect of Samford. However, money talks and the SoCon is going to expand to a major market where ONLY Furman has any kind of SoCon footprint.

If Samford comes out and pulls their weight, I don't think you will find too many arguements. Yeah, Elon hasn't been gangbusters in football, but they have one of the better baseball teams. I look at the addition of Samford as an "overall" choice, not just a football one.

I think Furman was the last SoCon team to square off with SU and they played us pretty tough. I don't see them as a slouch, but they will probably come in and get hammered early with the teams we play.

All that said, if they get their stuff together, bring em on. This conference is on the way up as a lot of the bottom dwellers are starting to really look a lot better. Hopefully they can fit right into that.

One word, though. Birmingham.

[AppGuy04]

I don't think anyone is jumping for joy at the prospect of Samford. However, money talks and the SoCon is going to expand to a major market where ONLY Furman has any kind of SoCon footprint.

If Samford comes out and pulls their weight, I don't think you will find too many arguements. Yeah, Elon hasn't been gangbusters in football, but they have one of the better baseball teams. I look at the addition of Samford as an "overall" choice, not just a football one.

I think Furman was the last SoCon team to square off with SU and they played us pretty tough. I don't see them as a slouch, but they will probably come in and get hammered early with the teams we play.

All that said, if they get their stuff together, bring em on. This conference is on the way up as a lot of the bottom dwellers are starting to really look a lot better. Hopefully they can fit right into that.

One word, though. Birmingham.

They stink at the money making sports. How does that really help. Seriously, who in the SoCon actually makes money off sports other than football and basketball

[Mountaineer]

Two more words: Auburn - Alabama

Are the folks in Birmingham gonna care about Samford and the SoCon when they have the Tigers and Crimson Tide? xconfusedx

[dbackjon]

As an unbiased outsider, I really fail to see how this helps the SoCon in any way, shape or form.

Might help the OVC, if they now decide to expand by two.

[BigApp]

Samford brings us the Birmingham market even less than Davidson gives us the Charlotte market.

[GaSouthern]

As an unbiased outsider, I really fail to see how this helps the SoCon in any way, shape or form.

Might help the OVC, if they now decide to expand by two.

supposed to be for scheduling

[JaxSinfonian]

Honestly, I think you'd get more out of the Birmingham market with JSU than Samford. JSU is IN the Birmingham television market, and TV stations already give the Gamecocks and Bulldogs roughly equal coverage (that is to say, the scraps left over after UAT, Awfulburn and UAB). Being a public school of at least some size, JSU actually has an alumni base in the region (including Atlanta and western Georgia). Samford, the small, selective, religious-affiliated school? Not so much. Then there's the championship football tradition.

If it sounds like I'm jealous, yeah, guilty as charged. I like the OVC fine with Samford in it. If they leave, the conference becomes a lot less geographically interesting for JSU, and there are no really suitable replacements we could bring in. Meanwhile, a SoCon with Samford as a member suddenly looks like the best possible home for JSU too. I sure wish they'd invite us both, like the OVC just a few years ago.

[appsfan]

Jack St. Hell Yes!

Samford HELL NO!

but I would go for both, Jack St. to improve the conference, and Samford to appease the whine and cheese crowd.
I agree with your sentiments.

[74AppState]

No

[PaladinFan]

Agree, I don't see how this helps the conference, but I don't necessarily see how it hurts it either. The SoCon probably sits as the third best FCS football conference, and that is predominately ridden on the back of three teams and a plethora of national championships. Samford doesn't add much to that, but they don't necessairly take away from it.

[PaladinFan]

Oh, I should also point out that Samford just beat Alabama in baseball tonight.

[thirdgendin]

No

[The Gadfly]

Coastal or Samford?

xrulesx Just sign right here SoCon . . . mmmmwahahaaha!

[ncguitarplyr]

no way

coastal carolina is infinitly better....we're not the ivy league here...the bigger school is the better and at least coastal has a lot of potential

[Purple Knight]

Jax State and/or Coastal - Yes.

[CCU97]

Well unfortunately we can wish all we want for the time being Gad but we aren't invited to the party....

[OL FU]

Honestly, I think you'd get more out of the Birmingham market with JSU than Samford. JSU is IN the Birmingham television market, and TV stations already give the Gamecocks and Bulldogs roughly equal coverage (that is to say, the scraps left over after UAT, Awfulburn and UAB). Being a public school of at least some size, JSU actually has an alumni base in the region (including Atlanta and western Georgia). Samford, the small, selective, religious-affiliated school? Not so much. Then there's the championship football tradition.

If it sounds like I'm jealous, yeah, guilty as charged. I like the OVC fine with Samford in it. If they leave, the conference becomes a lot less geographically interesting for JSU, and there are no really suitable replacements we could bring in. Meanwhile, a SoCon with Samford as a member suddenly looks like the best possible home for JSU too. I sure wish they'd invite us both, like the OVC just a few years ago.

I am not a fan of 10 team football conference, but in the case......me too:o

[youwouldno]

The SoCon commish probably wants a big conference, division-style. I oppose that. The SoCon however needs at least 1 team for scheduling reasons.

Fans tend to underestimate the importance of academics in conference affiliations. That would be an issue for JSU. Plus, JSU is better than Samford in football right now but conference decisions are not just made on the basis of a couple seasons. Obviously no one wants another Elon situation but that could happen to JSU just as easily as Samford.

[Eaglegus2]

Hell No!!!!!!!

Give me Coastal Carolina or give me death!xnodx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx

[tke504oa]

they are preparing for Apps move to the FBS so they have to have a team to fill that spot after the championship next yearxsmiley_wix

[GGASU]

No

Could be the straw that breaks the conference.

ASU, GSU, Furman, Citadel........could leave together

[lizrdgizrd]

No

Could be the straw that breaks the conference.

ASU, GSU, Furman, Citadel........could leave together
I think it would more likely be ASU, GSU, UTC, WCU, Citadel leaving (public schools) to found a new conference. Pick up JSU and Coastal and we'd be on the way.

[Cocky]

they are preparing for Apps move to the FBS so they have to have a team to fill that spot after the championship next yearxsmiley_wix

That not a good trade Samford for ASU.

[JDC325]

NO, NO and NO. Makes absolutely NO sense to add ANOTHER small private no growth potential school. Jax. State would have made a ton more sense. Makes no sense for ASU and GSU to stay if this is the direction the SoCon wants to take. I know the majority of GSU fans do want part of a private school conference.

[OL FU]

I think it would more likely be ASU, GSU, UTC, WCU, Citadel leaving (public schools) to found a new conference. Pick up JSU and Coastal and we'd be on the way.

Citadel is public in name only. They generally vote with the privates.

But let's get real, there is not going to be a mass exodus because of this. If schools leave, it is because they were going to leave anyway. xrolleyesx

[lizrdgizrd]

Citadel is public in name only. They generally vote with the privates.

But let's get real, there is not going to be a mass exodus because of this. If schools leave, it is because they were going to leave anyway. xrolleyesx
Of course, I didn't say it would be likely that any schools would leave the conference over this. Just that it's less likely that Furman would leave along with ASU & GSU. I think there will come a point that splitting the conference will make sense. Just not very soon. xtwocentsx

[OL FU]

Of course, I didn't say it would be likely that any schools would leave the conference over this. Just that it's less likely that Furman would leave along with ASU & GSU. I think there will come a point that splitting the conference will make sense. Just not very soon. xtwocentsx

I don't see that happening unless it involves a move to FCS. and, of course, Furman will not make that jump. niether will Citadel.

[The Cats]

NO !!!!

[lizrdgizrd]

I don't see that happening unless it involves a move to FCS. and, of course, Furman will not make that jump. niether will Citadel.
I think you're right on both counts. Your first reason is why I don't think it's going to happen anytime soon. xnodx

[PaladinFan]

Nobody is leaving anywhere right now. Honestly, how much does this change?

Football will come down to Furman, GSU, and App until someone leaves the conference. Adding Samford just gives us one more conference game to contend with, but it isn't like the SoCon just got a major facelift.

I would, however, like to hear the committees reasons. I am of the impression they wouldn't select Samford 'just cause'

[Blueandwhitefightfight]

NO!!!xmadx xmadx xmadx

[Blueandwhitefightfight]

BTW, over on TSC it was stated that it was a unanimous vote to let Samford in. All the Presidents of SoCon institutions voted YES to Samford...

What is going on???

[BigApp]

you guys need to start pumping up Savannah State to join the SoCon as your "travel partner" (whatever the h*ll that means) now

[goasu984Life]

Not looking forward to it at all.

[mtnralum]

It's official. The announcement is posted on the SoCon site. From a quick glance it looks like most of the comments are concerning Samford's academic instead of athletic prowess. Even has a quote from Ken Peacock at ASU about the fact that Samford expands the "footprint" of the conference. Now Charlie Cobb (AD at ASU) won't have to worry about adding a DII school to fill the schedule because we have Samford. Of course strength of schedule could become an issue with DII schools (Samford, Elon, & WCU) in the conference. Too bad that they didn't call on Coastal. We had the start of a nice rivalry, albeit one-sided (30 - 3, 45 - 28).

Maybe after App wins the third in a row, the administration will wise up and move up to FCS. A move that would include ASU, GSU, and Coastal might be attractive. With this latest move, maybe the SunBelt wouldn't be that bad afterall!

[lizrdgizrd]

It's official. The announcement is posted on the SoCon site. From a quick glance it looks like most of the comments are concerning Samford's academic instead of athletic prowess. Even has a quote from Ken Peacock at ASU about the fact that Samford expands the "footprint" of the conference. Now Charlie Cobb (AD at ASU) won't have to worry about adding a DII school to fill the schedule because we have Samford. Of course strength of schedule could become an issue with DII schools (Samford, Elon, & WCU) in the conference. Too bad that they didn't call on Coastal. We had the start of a nice rivalry, albeit one-sided (30 - 3, 45 - 28).

Maybe after App wins the third in a row, the administration will wise up and move up to FCS. A move that would include ASU, GSU, and Coastal might be attractive. With this latest move, maybe the SunBelt wouldn't be that bad afterall!
xnonono2x

[OL FU]

xnonono2x

I am not the only one with typoaffliction:o

[lizrdgizrd]

I am not the only one with typoaffliction:o
I'm hoping you're right. xnodx

[mtnralum]

Of course I meant FBS. Thanks.

[Eyes of Old Main]

Is Samford my first choice, no. Are they a bad choice, maybe, but it's too soon to tell. Really, what matters is what happens next. If further additions (or departures) are going to happen, then it is good. If things will stand pat with the current schools plus Samford, then I think better choices could have been made.

[BULLDOG8180]

They stink at the money making sports. How does that really help. Seriously, who in the SoCon actually makes money off sports other than football and basketball

Can you say Citadel Baseball?

[chattanoogamocs]

Originally Posted by AppGuy04
They stink at the money making sports. How does that really help. Seriously, who in the SoCon actually makes money off sports other than football and basketball

Chattanooga women's basketball earns more revenue (and sells more tickets) than a number of SoCon men's basketball teams. Two years ago, they had the 5th best attendance in the league...men or women (I am not sure if that says a lot about the LMs or little about the rest of the league) :(

[ChickenMan]

The addition of Samford doesn't do much to improve the quality of the SoCon.. just another 'weak sister' for the big three (assuming GSU returns) to get fat on.

[SoCon48]

From a Delaware fan..that post hits the nail on the head.

[Saint3333]

The only thing Samford does for me is give ASU another FCS home game every other year, something that is HARD to come by this year...

Samford will help basketball, but that's about it athletically.

JSU would have been my first choice, but I didn't get a vote.

[Laserlips]

Everybody's gotta be somewhere.... xpeacex


J. Pomeroy

[GaSouthern]

The addition of Samford doesn't do much to improve the quality of the SoCon.. just another 'weak sister' for the big three (assuming GSU returns) to get fat on.

As long as there are still test and football in school there will always be prayer xthumbsupx xlolx

[BigApp]

I wonder what Danny Morrison thinks about this?? I bet he's smiling

[Eyes of Old Main]

I wonder what Danny Morrison thinks about this??

He's probably wondering why his name is being thrown around in this debate. Wouldn't the addition of Samford be the beginning of a "Iamarino/Small Private School Conspiracy"?

Why is it that ASU fans specifically all seem to have such a problem with Danny Morrison? I would've understood it 10 years ago when we were towards the bottom of the league (never finished last), but Wofford was better during his tenure as Commissioner and we aren't slouches now. I understand that you could blame him for Elon, but isn't it time to move on from that? The man has moved on to another job, let it go, you are starting to sound like Oliver Stone.

[BigApp]

my question was really regarding the idea that Samford is outside the 'footprint'. But, thanks for your thoughts.

[Eyes of Old Main]

my question was really regarding the idea that Samford is outside the 'footprint'.

Understood.

But, isn't expanding the footprint a good thing? Depending on who you talk to, one of the major reasons against letting Coastal Carolina in was that their location was too close to The Citadel, Wofford and Furman and would thus make recruiting against them harder if those schools didn't have a conference membership advantage. Academics might have been an issue too, but this was also prominently discussed.

Also, if Samford comes in now, doesn't that make it easier to get Jacksonville State later?

[lizrdgizrd]

Also, if Samford comes in now, doesn't that make it easier to get Jacksonville State later?
That is true. With both schools UTC would have plenty of company on that end of the footprint. xnodx

[JaxSinfonian]

Also, if Samford comes in now, doesn't that make it easier to get Jacksonville State later?

Yes. The OVC as it stood was pretty comfortable for Jax State. Samford aside, the leagues are about even for us, geographically speaking.

As I've said elsewhere, Samford's departure has to have the powers at Jax State looking at their options. If the SoCon came calling soon, I bet we'd answer. That might not have been true a year ago.

[T-Dog]

Two more words: Auburn - Alabama

Are the folks in Birmingham gonna care about Samford and the SoCon when they have the Tigers and Crimson Tide? xconfusedx

Yeah, but it's like that everywhere. Everyone outside Statesboro roots for the Dawgs before GaSo. Everyone outside Greenville and Spartanburg is either a Tiger or a Gamecock before hte Terriers or the Dins, etc.

As for the original question, NO! (At least it's a shorter drive than to GaSo, but I'd prefer to go to a ASU/GaSo game in Statesboro than a ASU/Samford game in Birmingham)

[ButlerGSU]

no

[JaxSinfonian]

Yeah, but it's like that everywhere. Everyone outside Statesboro roots for the Dawgs before GaSo. Everyone outside Greenville and Spartanburg is either a Tiger or a Gamecock before hte Terriers or the Dins, etc.

Hmm. Based on your description, it may be different here.

Everyone in this state, including most everyone in Birmingham, Troy, Jacksonville, etc., is an Auburn or Alabama fan first. People like me, who prefer to support the teams of the school they actually attended to the exclusion of any others, are a tiny, insignificant minority. Case in point: there's a Hibbet's Sports store in Jacksonville, less than a mile from the JSU campus. They occasionally stock Gamecock baseball caps, which can be hard to find among the racks upon racks of Tide and Tigers T-shirts, jerseys, sweatbands, jock straps, etc. Iron Bowl weekend is an absolutely neauseating time to be in this state, especially if your FCS alma mater is playing at home.

I've lived in South Carolina, and I remember people getting worked up for Clemson & USC. This is different. I wish you could have seen the local media hype over the Shula-firing/Saban-hiring, the mob scene at the airport when Saban landed in Tuscaloosa ... watching it, I thought of the coverage of the selection of the new pope a year or two ago. I kept expecting to see white smoke rising from Bryant-Denney Stadium.

Samford is a small school in the state's largest city. If you polled people in Birmingham on their favorite team, even UAB would finish a very, very distant third. I'm not sure Samford would even be fourth.

I don't mean this to disparage the Bulldogs. It's simply an unfortunate truth, one that affects my school as well.

[Purple Knight]

Conference affilation for academic reasons means very little, except maybe for the Ivey League. Furman is going to do academically what they want to do regardless of what the other conference schools want to do, so low or high academics doesn't affect their mission. The conference schools don't share faculty, facilities, students or revenues, so what? Can a lower academic school in the conference lower Furman's reputation? I doubt it.

This has to be an athletic decision. This conference 'footprint' is a concept that aludes me. The Birmingham market will not increase the conference revenues by more that $100, if that much. I believe Furman's only interest in Birmingham is for athletic recruiting. We have already made inroads there, more a result of Jax State than Samford and our recruiting coaches than either school.

If you want to improve the conference 'footprint', add a quality school or one that will be there in a short period of time.
In GA = nada
In SC = Coastal, SC State
In NC = nada
In AL = Jax State
In FL = ???
In TN = ??
In VA = Richmond, W & M, James Madison

FOOTPRINT, my big old fat a**. These college President need a size 13 FOOTPRINT buried deep in 'the valley with no shadows'.

[BigApp]

wow! I find myself agreeing with a Palamuffin!

[OL FU]

I can't buy into the argument that academics do not matter at all. I don't think they should the absolute number one factor as they are in the Patriot League, but I don't think it would work for the academics to be so far apart that the league had nothing in common other than playing sports.

[SoCon48]

Just a simple yes or no. Who is looking forward to Samford joining the Southern Conference. Don't need any debate, or arguements for or against, just a simple yes or no.

hell NO!

[JDC325]

Conference affilation for academic reasons means very little, except maybe for the Ivey League. Furman is going to do academically what they want to do regardless of what the other conference schools want to do, so low or high academics doesn't affect their mission. The conference schools don't share faculty, facilities, students or revenues, so what? Can a lower academic school in the conference lower Furman's reputation? I doubt it.

This has to be an athletic decision. This conference 'footprint' is a concept that aludes me. The Birmingham market will not increase the conference revenues by more that $100, if that much. I believe Furman's only interest in Birmingham is for athletic recruiting. We have already made inroads there, more a result of Jax State than Samford and our recruiting coaches than either school.

If you want to improve the conference 'footprint', add a quality school or one that will be there in a short period of time.
In GA = nada
In SC = Coastal, SC State
In NC = nada
In AL = Jax State
In FL = ???
In TN = ??
In VA = Richmond, W & M, James Madison

FOOTPRINT, my big old fat a**. These college President need a size 13 FOOTPRINT buried deep in 'the valley with no shadows'.


Amen. Our footprint may have gotten bigger but now some Samford dog crap on it. Jax State was the obvious pick. Until the SoCon forces all the atheletes to compete on college jeopardy who gives a flying rats butt about their APR. Nothing they do academically affects any other SoCon school on or off the field.

[OL FU]

Amen. Our footprint may have gotten bigger but now some Samford dog crap on it. Jax State was the obvious pick. Until the SoCon forces all the atheletes to compete on college jeopardy who gives a flying rats butt about their APR. Nothing they do academically affects any other SoCon school on or off the field.


Can't exactly go that far. It is one thing to have a preference, quite another to say academics don't matter in the least. If academics don't matter in the least, then forget the college part entirely. xrolleyesx

[lizrdgizrd]

Can't exactly go that far. It is one thing to have a preference, quite another to say academics don't matter in the least. If academics don't matter in the least, then forget the college part entirely. xrolleyesx
I'm with OL FU on this one. The quality of academics that your athletes display is a direct reflection on the quality of your university. Universities have as their main goal the education of their students. Athletes are students at their universities too and should reflect well on the school in every respect. xtwocentsx

[JDC325]

Can't exactly go that far. It is one thing to have a preference, quite another to say academics don't matter in the least. If academics don't matter in the least, then forget the college part entirely. xrolleyesx

HUH? It is not like any other of the "likely" candidates were community colleges with horrible academics. Give me a break no way to spin how adding Samford is a good thing for the SoCon. Especially over a PUBLIC GROWING school like Jax State. 10 years from now Samford is still going to be averaging 5300 per home game and still have a small alumni base and student population. Jax State on the other hand will more than likely have more students and averaging well over the 10,000+ they drew in last season. We would be better off playing the away games with Samford at a local highschool stadium and that is NO joke or smack.. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hoover_Metropolitan_Stadium / Capacity 10,800 Samford 6700 TOTAL.

[OL FU]

HUH? It is not like any other of the "likely" candidates were community colleges with horrible academics. Give me a break no way to spin how adding Samford is a good thing for the SoCon. Especially over a PUBLIC GROWING school like Jax State. 10 years from now Samford is still going to be averaging 5300 per home game and still have a small alumni base and student population. Jax State on the other hand will more than likely have more students and averaging well over the 10,000+ they drew in last season. We would be better off playing the away games with Samford at a local highschool stadium and that is NO joke or smack.. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hoover_Metropolitan_Stadium / Capacity 10,800 Samford 6700 TOTAL.


Nothing they do academically affects any other SoCon school on or off the field.

I was referring specifically to your comment that hinted that academics did not matter in the least. xrolleyesx

I have said before I would have preferred JSU, did not happen. I am fine with it. Now you can be bitter about how horrible the SoCon isxrolleyesx

[JDC325]

.

I was referring specifically to your comment that hinted that academics did not matter in the least. xrolleyesx

I have said before I would have preferred JSU, did not happen. I am fine with it. Now you can be bitter about how horrible the SoCon isxrolleyesx


Well it certainly did not get better today or 10 years from now with the Samford addition. Hopefully the SoCon will not be a long term issue for GSU. xcoffeex

[Eyes of Old Main]

Hopefully the SoCon will not be a long term issue for GSU. xcoffeex

It sure does make Georgia Southern's opinion more important to the conversation since you are so quick to point out your desire to leave.

If you guys want to go so badly, then go enjoy the Sun Belt and an occasional trip to the New Orleans Bowl. No matter what you think of your school, I don't think the ACC, SEC or C-USA are interested.

[The Gadfly]

Good luck with the new addition boys. I do have to ask the question: When GSU and ASU leave, what would be the benefits then for Coastal joining? The only thing left would be Furman. The Citadel? We already have a crappy military girls' school in the "Black Sheep" Conference. It certainly wouldn't be for the football if they leave (Furman xthumbsupx , WCU xwhistlex , La Cid xlolx , Elon xoopsx , Chatty xnutsx , Wofford xcoolx , and Samford xboringx ). WOW, where do we sign xrulesx xrolleyesx .
Winthrop's still in the tourney, Davidson is not. Baseball in the SoCon is pretty good, but the Black Sheeps have 2 teams in Collegiate Baseball's top 30 (CCU & VMI), SoCon zip. Plus, the Thunderin' Beach Chickens are 15th nationally in Baseball America's Top 25 and last I checked (late Feb.) 6th in the nation in golf. Agreed, our basketball is so so, but for having such a tiny gym to recruit with we are doing quite well. But I understand the politics behind the decision. I just hope the Coastal admins remember this as a slap in the face.

[youwouldno]

CCU fans sure have a sense of entitlement.

[PaladinFan]

Georgia Southern isn't going anywhere anytime soon.

[appfan2008]

Georgia Southern isn't going anywhere anytime soon.
App unfortunately will be toooo soon

[appfan2008]

NO

[The Gadfly]

CCU fans sure have a sense of entitlement.

No, just me. . . I think? xeyebrowx

I'm just trying to look at the big picture here so I can decipher whether it will be a good or bad idea to join the SoCon in the future. xreadx

[OL FU]

Good luck with the new addition boys. I do have to ask the question: When GSU and ASU leave, what would be the benefits then for Coastal joining? The only thing left would be Furman. The Citadel? We already have a crappy military girls' school in the "Black Sheep" Conference. It certainly wouldn't be for the football if they leave (Furman xthumbsupx , WCU xwhistlex , La Cid xlolx , Elon xoopsx , Chatty xnutsx , Wofford xcoolx , and Samford xboringx ). WOW, where do we sign xrulesx xrolleyesx .
Winthrop's still in the tourney, Davidson is not. Baseball in the SoCon is pretty good, but the Black Sheeps have 2 teams in Collegiate Baseball's top 30 (CCU & VMI), SoCon zip. Plus, the Thunderin' Beach Chickens are 15th nationally in Baseball America's Top 25 and last I checked (late Feb.) 6th in the nation in golf. Agreed, our basketball is so so, but for having such a tiny gym to recruit with we are doing quite well. But I understand the politics behind the decision. I just hope the Coastal admins remember this as a slap in the face.


The benefit will be you will still be playing Presbyterian:p

[OL FU]

No, just me. . . I think? xeyebrowx

I'm just trying to look at the big picture here so I can decipher whether it will be a good or bad idea to join the SoCon in the future. xreadx

No need for you to decipher.:p :p

[Eyes of Old Main]

The benefit will be you will still be playing Presbyterian:p

Maybe CCU's team enjoys playing with Hose.

[CID1990]

Good luck with the new addition boys. I do have to ask the question: When GSU and ASU leave, what would be the benefits then for Coastal joining? The only thing left would be Furman. The Citadel? We already have a crappy military girls' school in the "Black Sheep" Conference. It certainly wouldn't be for the football if they leave (Furman xthumbsupx , WCU xwhistlex , La Cid xlolx , Elon xoopsx , Chatty xnutsx , Wofford xcoolx , and Samford xboringx ). WOW, where do we sign xrulesx xrolleyesx .
Winthrop's still in the tourney, Davidson is not. Baseball in the SoCon is pretty good, but the Black Sheeps have 2 teams in Collegiate Baseball's top 30 (CCU & VMI), SoCon zip. Plus, the Thunderin' Beach Chickens are 15th nationally in Baseball America's Top 25 and last I checked (late Feb.) 6th in the nation in golf. Agreed, our basketball is so so, but for having such a tiny gym to recruit with we are doing quite well. But I understand the politics behind the decision. I just hope the Coastal admins remember this as a slap in the face.

You slam VMI, and then in the same post use them as a justification for why the BS is somehow better than the SoCon. xeyebrowx

[JDC325]

It sure does make Georgia Southern's opinion more important to the conversation since you are so quick to point out your desire to leave.

If you guys want to go so badly, then go enjoy the Sun Belt and an occasional trip to the New Orleans Bowl. No matter what you think of your school, I don't think the ACC, SEC or C-USA are interested.

A guy from Wofford talking about the post season and what is better HHHIIIILLLAARIIOUSSSS!!! xlolx Sorry your school will be in the exact same 50 years from now athletically as it is today with no real hope of ever being a consitent cotender for anything. xlolx

[JDC325]

Georgia Southern isn't going anywhere anytime soon.


How do you know? I garuntee you if App goes we go.

[gomountaineers]

No.

[Eyes of Old Main]

Sorry your school will be in the exact same 50 years from now athletically as it is today with no real hope of ever being a consitent cotender for anything. xlolx

If given the choice between staying the same or following GSU's recent trend, I'll chose to stay the same.

Maybe you guys should figure out how to beat a small private college with 1200 students before you dream about beating large public universities with over 25000 students.

In short, here's some basic math for you:
4 out of 5 "ON THE FIELD" > ANY smack you can Wofford's way

[PaladinFan]

Wofford dude is right. The Terriers have flat owned the Eagles.

[JDC325]

If given the choice between staying the same or following GSU's recent trend, I'll chose to stay the same.

Maybe you guys should figure out how to beat a small private college with 1200 students before you dream about beating large public universities with over 25000 students.

In short, here's some basic math for you:
4 out of 5 "ON THE FIELD" > ANY smack you can Wofford's way


I will give you that but yet what have you done all those years you beat us? NOTHING! I am glad we have more to be proud of than a winning record over one team oh wait just out of the last five. 5-7 against GSU. Lets not get into the scores when we did beat you either.xeekx

[Eyes of Old Main]

I will give you that but yet what have you done all those years you beat us? NOTHING! I am glad we have more to be proud of than a winning record over one team oh wait just out of the last five. 5-7 against GSU. Lets not get into the scores when we did beat you either.xeekx

As if GSU has done so much more over than same span of the last 5 years.

Don't be like the Citadel fans and try to refute recent results with past records. We know you guys have lots of flags and we don't compare our tradition to yours in any way, but don't act like we don't belong on the same field with you guys either. Wofford has earned its right to sit at the SoCon football table.

[JDC325]

As if GSU has done so much more over than same span of the last 5 years.

Don't be like the Citadel fans and try to refute recent results with past records. We know you guys have lots of flags and we don't compare our tradition to yours in any way, but don't act like we don't belong on the same field with you guys either. Wofford has earned its right to sit at the SoCon football table.

Yes the option is a powerful tool. However, just because you have managed to figure us out recently does NOT mean you have been a better team except for last year. Wofford has established itself as a good team these last few years but still far from replacing GSU as a member of the big three and as far as Samford they have done nothing in the OVC to merit an invite to the SoCon not one thing WHEN other teams would have made great additions.

[OL FU]

Well it certainly did not get better today or 10 years from now with the Samford addition. Hopefully the SoCon will not be a long term issue for GSU. xcoffeex

Go on and get out so you can be 3-8 in Conference USA:p xrolleyesx

[walliver]

I've always felt that knowing what ASU and GSU are really up to (not just what fans want) is important to know before adding new members. If ASU and GSU are leaving then Samford is a good choice as it fits in better with the remaining members. If ASU and GSU are staying, then JSU or Coastal would bring better balance. Now, whether the conference leadership actually took all that into consideration is another thing altogether.:D

A lot of ASU and GSU fans would like to "move up", but neither school seems to be a good fit for C-USA (of course Greenville NC isn't exactly a prime C-USA market, either). I don't see either school moving up unless they can form a new BS subdivision conference (or bite the big one and go with the Sunbelt).

Samford would be a better addition to most SoCon schedules than the NAIA, D-II, and transitional teams that have replaced ETSU on most SoCon teams schedules (or in ASU's case, the two empty dates they are having trouble filling.)xtwocentsx

[JDC325]

Go on and get out so you can be 3-8 in Conference USA:p xrolleyesx


I was thinking of following the Boise model. Either one has the same probability based leadership, coaching, recruiting, luck and support. It is not going to happen anytime soon with our AD so no worries. However, if App jumps I dont think we would have much of a choice not to follow. That would only leave Furman in the SoCon that are fans would care about hard core. That is not intended as smack we just have alot more history with the Furples. xlolx

[OL FU]

I was thinking of following the Boise model. Either one has the same probability based leadership, coaching, recruiting, luck and support. It is not going to happen anytime soon with our AD so no worries. However, if App jumps I dont think we would have much of a choice not to follow. That would only leave Furman in the SoCon that are fans would care about hard core. That is not intended as smack we just have alot more history with the Furples. xlolx

With the bravado aside, I don't want you to go. I don't want ASU to go. I fully expect that both of you will at some time. And I will cheer you on when you do. I just have a real difficult time when fans constantly bitch about where they are at the momentxcoolx

[lizrdgizrd]

With the bravado aside, I don't want you to go. I don't want ASU to go. I fully expect that both of you will at some time. And I will cheer you on when you do. I just have a real difficult time when fans constantly bitch about where they are at the momentxcoolx
I hope neither of us go anywhere unless it was to a better conference. It's tough to beat the SoCon and winding up in the 'Belt isn't my idea of a step up.

[Bark first then Bite]

Shouldn't be a shock that most ASU & GSU fans weighing in here prefer JSU to Samford. They've already enumerated the reasons & a few are undeniably obvious: JSU has had more recent FB success, JSU has a bigger stadium, JSU puts a few more behinds in that Stadium.

So why was Samford the chosen one & JSU fans left with nothing more to do than come on here & stir the pot?

Here's a few ideas: 1) JSU has Sun Belt ambitions. In it's heart of hearts, it wants to be like Troy. (Frankly it has the will, but lacks the means to follow its dreams.) JSU needs to settle it's long term goals before it contemplates another conference move. Samford, on the other hand, knows who & what it is & where it wants to go. The SoCon is it's ultimate destination conference.

2) Money. Samford's endowment is expected to reach one billion dollars in the coming years. Samford's leadership has made it clear they are willing to invest an appropriate & growing amount in athletics. JSU is heavily dependent on the revenues of the treasury of the State of Alabama. There is no lottery money in Alabama. In lean years, funding can get pretty tight. Athletic programs at the smaller public schools (ie, everyone except UA & AU) can be among the first to feel the pain. Look at Samford's new indoor/outdoor Tennis Center, Baseball Stadium, Arena (to be completed this fall) for evidence.

3) Coaches. Samford just hired Pat Sullivan as the new FB coach. That situation was broken & it sure looks like it's been fixed. Jimmy Tillette is Samford's well respected Basketball coach - 2 NCAA tourney appearances in recent years. Wins against several high majors including 'Bama, LSU, and Tulane. Casey Dunn - Samford's young baseball coach has helped raise the bar in that sport as well. Last year, for the first time, we were OVC regular season champs - although give credit where it's due - the JSU yard birds took the tourney title. Ask JSU fans about their true feelings regarding their FB & Basketball coaches. I assume they are pretty happy with their Baseball guy.

4) AD. Samford's AD has really elevated the program during his tenure. He is well respected. He has had opportunites to take bigger jobs, but he likes Samford & its future. JSU's AD - I don't know - he's an old 'Bama assistant FB coach - probably does an OK job - he'll be at JSU till he retires.

5) Location. Location. Location. Samford is in a very nice suburban location just South of Birmingham. Just a couple of miles off the Interstate. Also good access via airport. Surrounded by nice restaurants, shopping, hotels - a very attactive area for visiting teams & fans. JSU - well, first, it's hard to get there. Second - not too many places you'd want to eat in Jacksonville & those parts - unless you like to hunt. :) And if you have a big crowd, you'll be driving a long way to find a hotel unless you book into the Motel 6 well in advance. :D

6) Media. I've got to ask my JSU friend who posted that they get the same Birmingham Media coverage as Samford if he was referring to the Birmingham New's utility in the outhouse. :p He may be close to right when it comes to print coverage of FB. However, this has been during a period of JSU being a winner & Samford - not so much so. However, if you look at any of the other sports - Samford gets much better coverage - I'd say close to UAB & way more than anyone else other than UA & AU. This includes radio, TV & print. It ain't even close. And with the Pat Sullivan angle, you just wait & see what happens with FB coverage when the Dogs start winning again.

Well, I've just touched on a few of the reasons your fearless leaders may have selected Samford. I'll make a bold prediction - we'll be just fine in men's & women's basketball, women's soccer, and baseball from day one.
Give Pat Sullivan a couple of years & we'll once again be contending for a playoff spot in FB.

[OL FU]

First Nice post and don't be a stranger.


Well, I've just touched on a few of the reasons your fearless leaders may have selected Samford. I'll make a bold prediction - we'll be just fine in men's & women's basketball, women's soccer, and baseball from day one.
Give Pat Sullivan a couple of years & we'll once again be contending for a playoff spot in FB.

The bolded part of the paragraph is what it will take for Samford to get some respect in the SoCon. Of course, you will be hated more but respected. xsmiley_wix xnodx

[walliver]

First Nice post and don't be a stranger.


Quote:
Well, I've just touched on a few of the reasons your fearless leaders may have selected Samford. I'll make a bold prediction - we'll be just fine in men's & women's basketball, women's soccer, and baseball from day one.
Give Pat Sullivan a couple of years & we'll once again be contending for a playoff spot in FB.


The bolded part of the paragraph is what it will take for Samford to get some respect in the SoCon. Of course, you will be hated more but respected.

Even the bolded part won't get you much respect unless you win a national championship.

[BigApp]

Even the bolded part won't get you much respect unless you win a national championship.

that's for sure.

To contend for a playoff spot in the OVC, you'll have to beat one conference team, maybe 2, Top 25-30 teams. Thats an entirely different scenario than contending for one in the SoCon, where you'll have to beat 3 or 4 (occasionally 5) to contend. Not to mention winning your OOC games too.

[Bark first then Bite]

It's going to be a wild ride! We will no doubt have to eat a slice or two of humble pie early on, but HS FB is great in Alabama & there is no reason why the right coach can't win at Samford against top competition (see Bowdens, Terry & PaPa). Our committment level is headed to a much higher level than it ever was for either of those guys. I can hardly wait to get started!

[Mountaineer]

It's going to be a wild ride! We will no doubt have to eat a slice or two of humble pie early on....

Oh, you'll probably want to build a bakery....

:D xsmashx xthumbsupx

[Sir William]

Bark First then Bite,

Thank you for the insights a few logs back. With those insights, I'm feeling much better about the addition of Samford (especially in light of JSU). xcoolx

Still hoping that ETSU comes back home one day, also.

Oh yeah, I also agree with Mountaineer...build yourself a big ol' bakery there in B'ham! And add on to your stadium while you're at it! xthumbsupx

[WLU78]

that's for sure.

To contend for a playoff spot in the OVC, you'll have to beat one conference team, maybe 2, Top 25-30 teams. Thats an entirely different scenario than contending for one in the SoCon, where you'll have to beat 3 or 4 (occasionally 5) to contend. Not to mention winning your OOC games too.

That's hilarious, you are two years removed from trying to run off your coach and now you demand championships for respect!!!xsmiley_wix xsmiley_wix

[OL FU]

That's hilarious, you are two years removed from trying to run off your coach and now you demand championships for respect!!!xsmiley_wix xsmiley_wix

xeyebrowx Last time I looked they are two year championsxeyebrowx

[proasu89]

That's hilarious, you are two years removed from trying to run off your coach and now you demand championships for respect!!!xsmiley_wix xsmiley_wix
And you are? xrolleyesx If I don't recognize the helmet in your avatar I suspect that respect might be a problem your team is familiar with. And please explain to us just who and exactly how many alums and supporters wanted to run off Coach Moore. There are those in any fan base, in any given year, who think that somebody else could do a better jobxtwocentsx

[PaladinFan]

His helmet has the logo for Washington and Lee (who I don't know if they even have a program).

He is right though, if you read the mmb prior to '05 there was a pretty substantial contingent calling for Moore's retirement. Good move that App fans have less say in their hirings and firings than GSU fans ;)

[proasu89]

His helmet has the logo for Washington and Lee (who I don't know if they even have a program).

He is right though, if you read the mmb prior to '05 there was a pretty substantial contingent calling for Moore's retirement. Good move that App fans have less say in their hirings and firings than GSU fans ;)

I'm going w/ vocal minority on that issue. xsmiley_wix Any of us here should realize that even if 50% of the MMB was in NOMOORE's corner, that would still only represent a small % of the total fan base.

[MarkCCU]

His helmet has the logo for Washington and Lee (who I don't know if they even have a program).

He is right though, if you read the mmb prior to '05 there was a pretty substantial contingent calling for Moore's retirement. Good move that App fans have less say in their hirings and firings than GSU fans ;)

Hopefully the same can be said about Coastal basketball. Most of our fans seem to want ole Buzz out after, what, 2 seasons xrolleyesx ? Fans just need to hold back back and let the thing grow to full potential.

[The Gadfly]

Sorry guys, above statement was mine, not Catfish's. He has auto-log whenever I get on here. :o

[MarkCCU]

I was about to say, I don't recall posting that.

[BigApp]

That's hilarious, you are two years removed from trying to run off your coach and now you demand championships for respect!!!xsmiley_wix xsmiley_wix

do a little research before you come on here smackin' (you too PF, and you should know better).

What you are referring to was a symptom of a much larger problem-our AD and Chancellor. Many had wanted them gone for more than a decade. It festered up until many were ready to throw lahdee-dahdee everybody out just for the sake of change.

2 years ago, our voices were (finally) heard, and the AD and Chancellor were replaced. The results speak for themselves across the board.

Carry on.

[AppMan]

Definitely not. xcoffeex xbawlingx

We already have an Elon, we don't need another. :p

NO! NO! NO! NO! ....BTW, as a '77 grad I love your avitar!

[WLU78]

do a little research before you come on here smackin' (you too PF, and you should know better).

What you are referring to was a symptom of a much larger problem-our AD and Chancellor. Many had wanted them gone for more than a decade. It festered up until many were ready to throw lahdee-dahdee everybody out just for the sake of change.

2 years ago, our voices were (finally) heard, and the AD and Chancellor were replaced. The results speak for themselves across the board.

Carry on.


My my what short memories we have. What research? xreadx Your board was rife with get rid of Jerry, not the chancellor and AD. It was filled up with "the game has passed him by" and ad nauseum. But then a 6-5 season can do that to you. xsmiley_wix I can't remember any posts you reference.

[AppMan]

Shouldn't be a shock that most ASU & GSU fans weighing in here prefer JSU to Samford. They've already enumerated the reasons & a few are undeniably obvious: JSU has had more recent FB success, JSU has a bigger stadium, JSU puts a few more behinds in that Stadium.

As per each schools web site.
2006 attendance: JSU 10,444 - Samford 5,320
I'd say twice as many is a tad more than "a few."

[AppMan]

[QUOTE=WLU78]My my what short memories we have. What research? xreadx Your board was rife with get rid of Jerry, not the chancellor and AD. It was filled up with "the game has passed him by" and ad nauseum. QUOTE]

It went much deeper than W's & L's. The trend for the five years prior to '05 wasn't pretty. L's were on the increase and W's... well you figure it out. In '04 we lost every road game and blew a decent lead in the last 5 minutes and lost to a poor Western Carolina team. Team discipline was on the decline and far too many mental mistakes were being made. I know people have their own opinion, but the truth of the matter is the turn around can be attributed to an exceptional group of upper classmen. These kids went to the staff and demanded more discipline and toughness be expected of the team. They set rules among themselves and policed them. Those kids willed that national championship into happening. I'm not saying the staff didn't have anything to do with the success, but they greatly benefited from the leadership on that team.

[Eyes of Old Main]

...just because you have managed to figure us out recently does NOT mean you have been a better team except for last year. Wofford has established itself as a good team these last few years but still far from replacing GSU as a member of the big three...

So beating your team doesn't mean our team is better? So you are saying that GSU is just the unfortunate victim of a series of upsets? I have never suggested that Wofford had displaced GSU as a part of the "Big 3". I haven't even said that it was now a "Big 4". At best, I would classify it as "the Big 3 and Wofford". Wofford has not had the level of success or consistency to warrant the honor of "Big 4" status nor has GSU fallen far enough for an extended enough period of time to lose their "Big 3" status. But, why is it SO HARD for some GSU fans to accept that Wofford has gotten better and been a better team over the past few years?

[Eyes of Old Main]

I was thinking of following the Boise model.

However, if App jumps I dont think we would have much of a choice not to follow.

If it were only as easy as saying you wanted to duplicate Boise's success. If you guys figure that out, bottle it and sell it to the rest of the Sun Belt and all your money worries will be over.

As for following Appalachian if they move, I thought Eagles soard alone?

[Cocky]

Shouldn't be a shock that most ASU & GSU fans weighing in here prefer JSU to Samford. They've already enumerated the reasons & a few are undeniably obvious: JSU has had more recent FB success, JSU has a bigger stadium, JSU puts a few more behinds in that Stadium.

So why was Samford the chosen one & JSU fans left with nothing more to do than come on here & stir the pot?

Here's a few ideas: 1) JSU has Sun Belt ambitions. In it's heart of hearts, it wants to be like Troy. (Frankly it has the will, but lacks the means to follow its dreams.) JSU needs to settle it's long term goals before it contemplates another conference move. Samford, on the other hand, knows who & what it is & where it wants to go. The SoCon is it's ultimate destination conference.

2) Money. Samford's endowment is expected to reach one billion dollars in the coming years. Samford's leadership has made it clear they are willing to invest an appropriate & growing amount in athletics. JSU is heavily dependent on the revenues of the treasury of the State of Alabama. There is no lottery money in Alabama. In lean years, funding can get pretty tight. Athletic programs at the smaller public schools (ie, everyone except UA & AU) can be among the first to feel the pain. Look at Samford's new indoor/outdoor Tennis Center, Baseball Stadium, Arena (to be completed this fall) for evidence.

3) Coaches. Samford just hired Pat Sullivan as the new FB coach. That situation was broken & it sure looks like it's been fixed. Jimmy Tillette is Samford's well respected Basketball coach - 2 NCAA tourney appearances in recent years. Wins against several high majors including 'Bama, LSU, and Tulane. Casey Dunn - Samford's young baseball coach has helped raise the bar in that sport as well. Last year, for the first time, we were OVC regular season champs - although give credit where it's due - the JSU yard birds took the tourney title. Ask JSU fans about their true feelings regarding their FB & Basketball coaches. I assume they are pretty happy with their Baseball guy.

4) AD. Samford's AD has really elevated the program during his tenure. He is well respected. He has had opportunites to take bigger jobs, but he likes Samford & its future. JSU's AD - I don't know - he's an old 'Bama assistant FB coach - probably does an OK job - he'll be at JSU till he retires.

5) Location. Location. Location. Samford is in a very nice suburban location just South of Birmingham. Just a couple of miles off the Interstate. Also good access via airport. Surrounded by nice restaurants, shopping, hotels - a very attactive area for visiting teams & fans. JSU - well, first, it's hard to get there. Second - not too many places you'd want to eat in Jacksonville & those parts - unless you like to hunt. :) And if you have a big crowd, you'll be driving a long way to find a hotel unless you book into the Motel 6 well in advance. :D

6) Media. I've got to ask my JSU friend who posted that they get the same Birmingham Media coverage as Samford if he was referring to the Birmingham New's utility in the outhouse. :p He may be close to right when it comes to print coverage of FB. However, this has been during a period of JSU being a winner & Samford - not so much so. However, if you look at any of the other sports - Samford gets much better coverage - I'd say close to UAB & way more than anyone else other than UA & AU. This includes radio, TV & print. It ain't even close. And with the Pat Sullivan angle, you just wait & see what happens with FB coverage when the Dogs start winning again.

Well, I've just touched on a few of the reasons your fearless leaders may have selected Samford. I'll make a bold prediction - we'll be just fine in men's & women's basketball, women's soccer, and baseball from day one.
Give Pat Sullivan a couple of years & we'll once again be contending for a playoff spot in FB.

1) Your close to right
2) Samford is a long ways from a Billion and several million from a good football field.
3) FB coach has improved JSU. Some don't care for him but others send him more money than any other coach in Alabama minus UAT and Auburn.
4) Our AD is a true UAT fan no more no less.
5) More people are willing to go to Jacksonville on a fall Saturday than Homewood. Jacksonville is a small college town same as Auburn, Clemson, Boone, or Statesboro. Some people prefer a college town some prefer a big city. Give me the college experience over the working man's big city.
6) JSU gets more coverage than Samford in B'ham. Samford isn't in the same league with UAB on coverage (neither is JSU). I'm talking all media not only the paper.

[SoCon48]

[QUOTE=WLU78]My my what short memories we have. What research? xreadx Your board was rife with get rid of Jerry, not the chancellor and AD. It was filled up with "the game has passed him by" and ad nauseum. QUOTE]

It went much deeper than W's & L's. The trend for the five years prior to '05 wasn't pretty. L's were on the increase and W's... well you figure it out. In '04 we lost every road game and blew a decent lead in the last 5 minutes and lost to a poor Western Carolina team. Team discipline was on the decline and were made far too many mental mistakes. I know people have their own opinion, but the truth of the matter is the turn around can be attributed to an exceptional group of upper classmen. These kids went to the staff and demanded more discipline and toughness be expected of the team. They set rules among themselves and policed them. Those kids willed that national championship into happening. I'm not saying the staff didn't have anything to do with the success, but they greatly benefited from the leadership on that team.

but they greatly benefited from the leadership on that team.

As does any successful team.

[WLU78]

[QUOTE=WLU78]My my what short memories we have. What research? xreadx Your board was rife with get rid of Jerry, not the chancellor and AD. It was filled up with "the game has passed him by" and ad nauseum. QUOTE]

It went much deeper than W's & L's. The trend for the five years prior to '05 wasn't pretty. L's were on the increase and W's... well you figure it out. In '04 we lost every road game and blew a decent lead in the last 5 minutes and lost to a poor Western Carolina team. Team discipline was on the decline and were made far too many mental mistakes. I know people have their own opinion, but the truth of the matter is the turn around can be attributed to an exceptional group of upper classmen. These kids went to the staff and demanded more discipline and toughness be expected of the team. They set rules among themselves and policed them. Those kids willed that national championship into happening. I'm not saying the staff didn't have anything to do with the success, but they greatly benefited from the leadership on that team.

Now that is a great post!! .

[Bark first then Bite]

Cocky, you make some valid points, I'd still like the priviledge of rebuttal:

1) I hope JSU will decide to stay in the championship division join Samford in the SoCon.
2) I didn't say we were close to a billion, I said we're expecting it in the coming years. Our new Pres. has gone on record to that effectIt will happen. By the way, we have an outstanding new football field (turf) - don't you guys have the same one? The Stadium is an awesome place to watch a FB game - we do need more seats. The needs in basketball, baseball & tennis were just more glaring. One things is for sure, when we do it, it will be first class.
3) xsmiley_wix
4) We've seen a number of home crowds over 10,000 - lots of camp chairs, temporary bleachers, blankets atop the hill in the end zone. There's plenty of convenient, safe parking. I've been to several of those games & it's a great atmosphere. The problem has been that most of our OVC opponents did not travel well plus our team was poor last year. We generally got 1 big visiting crowd each year - either JSU or TSU. There have been years where we averaged right at our stadium capacity - but not last year.
5) To each his own. Samford is definitely not a big city environment like you'd see at Georgia Tech, Vandy, or UAB. Homewood, Mountain Brook, and Vestavia Hills (the area surrounding Samford) are small, affluent suburban towns south of Birmingham. I have been to Jacksonville, Auburn, Tuscaloosa & Legion Field - all have their nice points - well, not sure about Legion Field anymore... I'll take Samford every time. You wait & see what happens to our attendance when we start winning again!
6) I read the paper every day, listen to various local sports talk radio shows, and watch local TV sports. I don't have the time or inclination to document it, but I am confident of my statement. I'm not just talking about box scores or game recaps - which are probably pretty even in print. I'm talking about features on players & coaches & even more so about columnists who quote Samford coaches (especially Tillette).

I'll let you have the last word - I am finished barking for a while. It's time to go make some money & help my alma mater get to that first Billion. :D

[WLU78]

His helmet has the logo for Washington and Lee (who I don't know if they even have a program).

He is right though, if you read the mmb prior to '05 there was a pretty substantial contingent calling for Moore's retirement. Good move that App fans have less say in their hirings and firings than GSU fans ;)

Very good eye! You might have considered W&L prior to FU.

and yes we do have a program, dating back to the 1880's as a matter of fact and currently are the 2006 ODAC champions. Our DC has gone to Elon as a DB coach. http://www.collegesportingnews.com//article.asp?articleid=84067

[OL FU]

Very good eye! You might have considered W&L prior to FU.
and yes we do have a program, dating back to the 1880's as a matter of fact and currently are the 2006 ODAC champions. Our DC has gone to Elon as a DB coach. http://www.collegesportingnews.com//article.asp?articleid=84067

Too close to VMI But I do like Lexington xthumbsupx

[SU Jag]

Cocky, you make some valid points, I'd still like the priviledge of rebuttal:

1) I hope JSU will decide to stay in the championship division join Samford in the SoCon.
2) I didn't say we were close to a billion, I said we're expecting it in the coming years. Our new Pres. has gone on record to that effectIt will happen. By the way, we have an outstanding new football field (turf) - don't you guys have the same one? The Stadium is an awesome place to watch a FB game - we do need more seats. The needs in basketball, baseball & tennis were just more glaring. One things is for sure, when we do it, it will be first class.
3) xsmiley_wix
4) We've seen a number of home crowds over 10,000 - lots of camp chairs, temporary bleachers, blankets atop the hill in the end zone. There's plenty of convenient, safe parking. I've been to several of those games & it's a great atmosphere. The problem has been that most of our OVC opponents did not travel well plus our team was poor last year. We generally got 1 big visiting crowd each year - either JSU or TSU. There have been years where we averaged right at our stadium capacity - but not last year.
5) To each his own. Samford is definitely not a big city environment like you'd see at Georgia Tech, Vandy, or UAB. Homewood, Mountain Brook, and Vestavia Hills (the area surrounding Samford) are small, affluent suburban towns south of Birmingham. I have been to Jacksonville, Auburn, Tuscaloosa & Legion Field - all have their nice points - well, not sure about Legion Field anymore... I'll take Samford every time. You wait & see what happens to our attendance when we start winning again!
6) I read the paper every day, listen to various local sports talk radio shows, and watch local TV sports. I don't have the time or inclination to document it, but I am confident of my statement. I'm not just talking about box scores or game recaps - which are probably pretty even in print. I'm talking about features on players & coaches & even more so about columnists who quote Samford coaches (especially Tillette).

I'll let you have the last word - I am finished barking for a while. It's time to go make some money & help my alma mater get to that first Billion. :D

You have? When were these 10,000+ games? All I can remember from last year was the Miles game and over 1/2 of those fans were Miles fans. Attendance wise you guys arent good at all, infact most of the d2s in Alabama outdraw yall. I went to a few Samford games over the past 2-years and it aint a pretty site. Samford has a nice campus, its a nice school, but I dont see how a move from the OVC will benefit you guys. You guys will be the Vandy of the SoCon.

[JaxSinfonian]

You have? When were these 10,000+ games? All I can remember from last year was the Miles game and over 1/2 of those fans were Miles fans.

At least one of them involved Jax State. Guess which school brought the crowd?

[PaladinFan]

Don't forget, that the SoCon is overall one of the best traveling conference in FCS football. Those attendance numbers will rise when they get homegames against GSU, Furman, App, etc.

I would wager more Samford fans would come out to watch GSU than to see Murray State. No offense Racer fans.

[Bark first then Bite]

Jag, where did I say those crowds were last year? xreadx

In fact, I stated that we basically have had one good visiting crowd per year. When your team is weak - as ours has been the past few years and your oponnents - by & large - don't travel...well you get the picture. But in this case, don't expect the past to be prologue. :)

[JaxSinfonian]

Bark,

Nice to see some Samford fans finally checking out the Internet. Where have you guys been all these years?

SU is to be congratulated for earning the SoCon invite, and they did the best thing for the program in accepting it. And yes, for the record, I’m jealous they’re going and JSU’s not. You and your fellow fans are right to celebrate this, but I think you got a little carried away in your analysis above.


1) JSU has Sun Belt ambitions. In it's heart of hearts, it wants to be like Troy.

First, is it even proper to call desire for the Sun Belt "ambition"? On Troy ... I think the only thing JSU wants in relation to the Trojans is to play them on a regular basis and win more than we lose. If that means going BS ... well, we'll need better reasons to move up than that. Basing the direction of the program on what Troy does (or what Samford does, for that matter) is putting the cart before the horse. That's not to say a move won't happen, but I've yet to hear a peep out of anyone beyond a few screen names at gojaxstate.com about BS. Besides, can the Sun Belt really absorb Western Kentucky, Georgia Southern, Appalachian State and JSU (assuming all the rumors are true) in such a short time span?


JSU needs to settle it's long term goals before it contemplates another conference move. Samford, on the other hand, knows who & what it is & where it wants to go. The SoCon is it's ultimate destination conference.

A JSU to SoCon move would, I think, settle this question. If JSU seriously pursues the SoCon, or vice cersa, you can expect the Gamecocks to be FCS for the forseeable future, and I hope this is what happens. The OVC held a lot of advantages for us just one short year ago, but they're quickly evaporating. There now are no league teams closer to Jacksonville than a three-hour drive. In the SoCon, there now are two within two hours.


2) JSU is heavily dependent on the revenues of the treasury of the State of Alabama. ... Athletic programs at the smaller public schools (ie, everyone except UA & AU) can be among the first to feel the pain.

No public school in this state can be said to depend "heavily" on state funding anymore. JSU doesn't get much more than a third of its funding from the state. And what public schools have cut their funding for athletics in recent years? UAB and Troy both have financed moves up and JSU has been investing heavily. The only example I can think of where an Alabama college's athletic programs have suffered because of money is Samford's neighbor, small, private, religious-affiliated Birmingham Southern, which just dropped all its programs from D-I to D-III.


5) Location. Location. Location. Samford is in a very nice suburban location just South of Birmingham. Just a couple of miles off the Interstate. Also good access via airport. Surrounded by nice restaurants, shopping, hotels - a very attactive area for visiting teams & fans. JSU - well, first, it's hard to get there.

So much in this part of your post is either mistaken, or just outright lies I don’t know where to start (I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and assume you're just wrong). Jacksonville is 18 miles from Interstate 20, and 23 miles from Interstate 759 (the Gadsden spur to I-59). Everyone in the SoCon will have to drive an hour or past Jacksonville to get to Homewood. The drive from the Interstate to the campus is no wrose than from downtown Greenville to Furman. If it's hard for you to get here it's probably got more to do with your navigation ability than with Jacksonville's location.


Second - not too many places you'd want to eat in Jacksonville & those parts - unless you like to hunt. file:///C:/DOCUME%7E1/BENCUN%7E1/LOCALS%7E1/Temp/msohtml1/01/clip_image001.gifAnd if you have a big crowd, you'll be driving a long way to find a hotel unless you book into the Motel 6 well in advance. file:///C:/DOCUME%7E1/BENCUN%7E1/LOCALS%7E1/Temp/msohtml1/01/clip_image002.gif

Are you sure you’ve been here? There's plenty of dining and hotels in Calhoun County. If you want well-known chains, the area around I-20 is littered with them. Oxford alone has 1,500 hotel rooms, and there’s plenty more between here and there. If we can handle the crowds for Talladega twice a year, I don’t think SoCon fans need to worry about finding a nice room. And food? On a game day, I’ll take our own Cooter Brown’s Rib Shack over anything near Seibert. But then, I’m more likely to be tailgating anyway, so restaurants don’t really factor into the equation. But you won’t go hungry in our area no matter what you want to eat (except Indian or Thai food ... we could really use some!) No, Jacksonville is not Homewood, and thank goodness for that. At least here you can tell it’s gameday.


6) Media. I've got to ask my JSU friend who posted that they get the same Birmingham Media coverage as Samford if he was referring to the Birmingham New's utility in the outhouse.

I stand by what I said, for broadcast and print. JSU and Samford both are relegated to whatever time is left after the UAT & AU segments, and the token report from UAB. Camera crews from the B’ham TV station are regular visitors to JSU games, practices and games.

Many of your predictions depend on the phrase “when we start winning again.” Sullivan is an upgrade, but he’s yet to put his first Bulldog squad on the field. Until he’s got a couple games under his belt, I’d make that “if we start winning again.” It’s a shame he’ll only get one shot against Jax State, but at least your guys won’t have to suffer any more 55-7 thumpings at the hands of the Gamecocks. That’ll be the Paladins’, Mountaineers’ and Eagles’ job now. I will miss having Samford on our schedule.

[Bark first then Bite]

I said I'd let Cocky have the last word, but I guess I'll let you have the honor. Don't agree with much of what you said, but this discussion is dragging on & I imagine our new SoCon friends are already tired of the Calhoun County vs. Greater B'ham debate. So I'll spare them another retort. You did ask about Samford fans checking out the Internet, so I will give you our fans' website address - it's been around for years: http://www.samfordbulldogs.com/

[SU Jag]

At least one of them involved Jax State. Guess which school brought the crowd?


I'll take Jacksonville State for $500 Alex!:D

[SoCon48]

I said I'd let Cocky have the last word, but I guess I'll let you have the honor. Don't agree with much of what you said, but this discussion is dragging on & I imagine our new SoCon friends are already tired of the Calhoun County vs. Greater B'ham debate. So I'll spare them another retort. You did ask about Samford fans checking out the Internet, so I will give you our fans' website address - it's been around for years: http://www.samfordbulldogs.com/

Has it zoomed along at 3 posts a week all those years??

[catdaddy2402]

With the bravado aside, I don't want you to go. I don't want ASU to go. I fully expect that both of you will at some time. And I will cheer you on when you do. I just have a real difficult time when fans constantly bitch about where they are at the momentxcoolx
You have to look at this thru App State and GSU's eyes though. What does Samford do to strengthen the moneymaker sport at these two schools? Nothing other than filling a spot on the schedule. They don't strengthen the schedule...if anything they weaken it. They will not bring droves of fans when they visit....in fact they will not bring droves of fans when they play at home. Samford has nothing in common with these two schools except that they play FCS football and are located in the south....pretty much the pattern of expansion when they have added football programs of late.
When you look at it from the eyes of an App St or GSU fan you have to start to wonder if maybe the SoCon isn't trying to reform itself into the southern Ivy league and what kind of future both teams have in it.

[youwouldno]

App St at least, and possibly GSU, supported Samford over CCU (or anyone else). So it's disingenuous to play this off as a loss for them.

[catdaddy2402]

App St at least, and possibly GSU, supported Samford over CCU (or anyone else). So it's disingenuous to play this off as a loss for them.
The vote was unanimous, but what public votes concerning conference matters aren't? TCU voted to add SMU, Rice, and Tulsa to CUSA....then jumped to the MWC in large part to distance themsleves from the very schools they supported, publically at least.

[youwouldno]

I don't think App St wanted CCU. Maybe GSU secretly did, but even so they probably want to keep UTC around, and Samford serves that interest.

[chattanoogamocs]

Has it zoomed along at 3 posts a week all those years??

As with many boards around the SoCon, they have upgraded board over the years...that current Samford board has been up only since Jan of '05.

It will be interesting to see how much board traffic increases over on the Samford board with a jump to the SoCon. The individual OVC fans bases have not seemed to embrace the fan board concept as much as SoCon schools have (Murray and Samford have the two more active boards...along with JSU and EKU...then APSU and TSU)

SoCon has a very strong messageboard presence (I find it a source of pride that all 11...12...SoCon schools have decent to outstanding messageboards...at least in terms of use, with ASU and GSU leading the way...then Furman, and I guess my little ole board for Chattanooga would be next).

[chattanoogamocs]

I don't think App St wanted CCU. Maybe GSU secretly did, but even so they probably want to keep UTC around, and Samford serves that interest.

If the rest of the conference really wanted CCU, they could have voted for them...Chattanooga would have still been there. For whatever reason, they just didn't seem to have much support at this time.

I still get the sense that people think Chattanooga was rallying around Samford for inclusion...that just isn't true. Given a choice between CCU and Samford, well sure, I am sure they supported the closer school...and I don't think many mocfans were unhappy of having a close by school now in the conference. We are generally supportive.

But it is not like it was a Samford or else decision...it is not like UC and SU have some huge rivalry (in the last 30-40 years they have played 5 times in football and 5 times in basketball).

[OL FU]

You have to look at this thru App State and GSU's eyes though. What does Samford do to strengthen the moneymaker sport at these two schools? Nothing other than filling a spot on the schedule. They don't strengthen the schedule...if anything they weaken it. They will not bring droves of fans when they visit....in fact they will not bring droves of fans when they play at home. Samford has nothing in common with these two schools except that they play FCS football and are located in the south....pretty much the pattern of expansion when they have added football programs of late.
When you look at it from the eyes of an App St or GSU fan you have to start to wonder if maybe the SoCon isn't trying to reform itself into the southern Ivy league and what kind of future both teams have in it.

I understand the fans perspective. I also understand that their schools voted to support the addition. Their fans should take their anger out on their school administrations not on the fans on the message board that belong to their conferencexrolleyesx

Also, I am sick and tired of "Well hopefully we won't be in the SoCon long enough to worry about this"
NaNaNA. I understand schools desire to move up and don't have a problem with it. Just don't **** where you and I currently eat.

[SoCon48]

I understand the fans perspective. I also understand that their schools voted to support the addition. Their fans should take their anger out on their school administrations not on the fans on the message board that belong to their conferencexrolleyesx

Also, I am sick and tired of "Well hopefully we won't be in the SoCon long enough to worry about this"
NaNaNA. I understand schools desire to move up and don't have a problem with it. Just don't **** where you and I currently eat.

Can't speak for GSU, but I imagine ASU and Chance Peacock "voted" simply because of wanting to keep harmony and avoid resentment. It was a done deal from the commish on down. ASU abstained in the Elon vote and all it did was create hostility. Nothing more.
As far as moving up..it would be a case, too of just moving out. The SoCon has done nothing in recent years that suits ASU. Instead, the emphasis has gone to SC, private schools and creating a travel scenario that hurts. Samford is a money drain and weakens the strength of the SoCon. We'll hear a lot more of that top heavy crap again and move down the ranks in I-AA attendance for conferences.

[SoCon48]

As with many boards around the SoCon, they have upgraded board over the years...that current Samford board has been up only since Jan of '05.

It will be interesting to see how much board traffic increases over on the Samford board with a jump to the SoCon. The individual OVC fans bases have not seemed to embrace the fan board concept as much as SoCon schools have (Murray and Samford have the two more active boards...along with JSU and EKU...then APSU and TSU)



The Samferd admission certainly boosted SoCon boards' activity. (and the AGS):D

[SoCon48]

I don't think App St wanted CCU. Maybe GSU secretly did, but even so they probably want to keep UTC around, and Samford serves that interest.

Certainly didn't keep Elon out when ASU opposed them. Sorry, App just doesn't make a good scapegoat in the CCU scenario. You need to look toward the privates for that excuse.

[OL FU]

One other thing, the SoCon historically was a conference of equal numbers of small and large schools. The conference that ASU joined was made up of the following

( I may have some of the schools wrong)
Large - - ASU, WCU, ECU, Chatt
Small - W&M, Davidson, Richmond, VMI, Citadel, Furman

The conference that GSU entered was tilted a little more to large schools but that was more because the SoCon had not replaced many of the 70's departures of the smaller schools from the conference and Davidson's departure from football.

The conference is mantaining its diverse status not changing it.

[OL FU]

Can't speak for GSU, but I imagine ASU and Chance Peacock "voted" simply because of wanting to keep harmony and avoid resentment. It was a done deal from the commish on down. ASU abstained in the Elon vote and all it did was create hostility. Nothing more.
As far as moving up..it would be a case, too of just moving out. The SoCon has done nothing in recent years that suits ASU. Instead, the emphasis has gone to SC, private schools and creating a travel scenario that hurts. Samford is a money drain and weakens the strength of the SoCon. We'll hear a lot more of that top heavy crap again and move down the ranks in I-AA attendance for conferences.

Other schools would have been my preference. I have said that before. But the choice has been made. But there is a difference in stating an opinion and making comments that brought on most of my posts such as" Hopefully we won't be here much longer"

PS Please see my post below (now above) on what the SoCon looked like when you joined. If you have outgrown it I understand. Move on.

[OL FU]

Certainly didn't keep Elon out when ASU opposed them. Sorry, App just doesn't make a good scapegoat in the CCU scenario. You need to look toward the privates for that excuse.

I think MR. C has suggested APP did not want CCU ( I hope I am not putting words in his mouth)

We love conjecture don't we:D

[SoCon48]

One other thing, the SoCon historically was a conference of equal numbers of small and large schools. The conference that ASU joined was made up of the following

( I may have some of the schools wrong)
Large - - ASU, WCU, ECU, Chatt
Small - W&M, Davidson, Richmond, VMI, Citadel, Furman

The conference that GSU entered was tilted a little more to large schools but that was more because the SoCon had not replaced many of the 70's departures of the smaller schools from the conference and Davidson's departure from football.

The conference is mantaining its diverse status not changing it.

Chatt and WCU joined after ASU did. We ran Bill&Bill and Richmond off by joining.

[SoCon48]

I think MR. C has suggested APP did not want CCU ( I hope I am not putting words in his mouth)

We love conjecture don't we:D

Like I said, we couldn't keep Ellen out so what's it matter? It's been a long time since the SoCon gave a crap what ASU wanted.

[OL FU]

Chatt and WCU joined after ASU did. We ran Bill&Bill and Richmond off by joining.

Thanks for the correction xthumbsupx But the point is the same. This is not a new direction for the SoCon. A balance between large and small has always existed. It may have been the reason larger schools ( SEC and ACC) left and sometimes why smaller schools ( WM and Richmond) left. But the SoCon model since the 20's has been small and large.

Everyone needs to either get over it or do like Clemson and Richmond:D

[OL FU]

Like I said, we couldn't keep Ellen out so what's it matter? It's been a long time since the SoCon gave a crap what ASU wanted.

xbabycryx

[lizrdgizrd]

xbabycryx
xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx

Since when did this become the ASUCon? Just because we've had great success the past couple years doesn't mean this is our conference to run the way we want. All the conference members have equal say (at least theoretically) in conference decisions.

Like it or not, Samford is our newest member. Let's suck it up and show them what real football is supposed to be then help them get up to speed ASAP. If they don't have good game-day atmosphere, bring ours with us so they'll know it when they see it.

I think you're a nut job to want to go FBS, but you're entitled to your opinion, I-AA 2006.

[Laserlips]

Well, I've just touched on a few of the reasons your fearless leaders may have selected Samford. I'll make a bold prediction - we'll be just fine in men's & women's basketball, women's soccer, and baseball from day one.
Give Pat Sullivan a couple of years & we'll once again be contending for a playoff spot in FB.

Hey... I've said it before, everybodys got to be somewhere, so welcome to the SOCON and best of luck against everybody but my GSU Eagles... xthumbsupx

Hey, if your new head coach doesn't work out I can recommend a great new Head Coach for you... Right now he's an asst. defensive coach for the Atlanta Falcons, but he changes jobs about every two years so he'll be available shortly. He's hot stuff... Just ask him.

xrolleyesx

J. Pomeroy

[The Moody1]

xbabycryx

Is that you Bobby?

[AppMan]

One other thing, the SoCon historically was a conference of equal numbers of small and large schools. The conference that ASU joined was made up of the following

( I may have some of the schools wrong)
Large - - ASU, WCU, ECU, Chatt
Small - W&M, Davidson, Richmond, VMI, Citadel, Furman

The conference that GSU entered was tilted a little more to large schools but that was more because the SoCon had not replaced many of the 70's departures of the smaller schools from the conference and Davidson's departure from football.

The conference is mantaining its diverse status not changing it.

You have it a tad wrong there my friend. ASU was admitted in 1971, Marshall, UTC & Western were admitted in 1976. Richmond left in 1976, ECU & W&M left in 1977. Richmond and W&M made it clear they thought the trend in admitting large regional universities diluted the academic quality of the conference and didn't want to be associated with the likes of ASU, WCU, UTC, and Marshall (who was admitted in 1978). ECU left to play big time football.

[Eyes of Old Main]

Since when did this become the ASUCon? Just because we've had great success the past couple years doesn't mean this is our conference to run the way we want. All the conference members have equal say (at least theoretically) in conference decisions.

Like it or not, Samford is our newest member. Let's suck it up and show them what real football is supposed to be then help them get up to speed ASAP. If they don't have good game-day atmosphere, bring ours with us so they'll know it when they see it.

Great post. There aren't enough rep points in the AGS universe to send your way, lizrdgizrd.

[GreatAppSt]

Are you kidding me? NO!:(

[Mr. C]

I think MR. C has suggested APP did not want CCU ( I hope I am not putting words in his mouth)

We love conjecture don't we:D
There are a lot of schools that don't want CCU in the league. ASU has had some issues with CCU football recruiting, as WCU has, too (this is something that has been confirmed by both SoCon and Big South sources and I had FOUR different schools from the leagues tell me the exact same story). The South Carolina schools want no part of CCU in the SoCon. But the fact is CCU has NEVER been considered a serious candidate by anyone in the SoCon. Folks at Coastal Carolina have told me they have never been asked for any information on their school, or program by SoCon officials.

[OL FU]

You have it a tad wrong there my friend. ASU was admitted in 1971, Marshall, UTC & Western were admitted in 1976. Richmond left in 1976, ECU & W&M left in 1977. Richmond and W&M made it clear they thought the trend in admitting large regional universities diluted the academic quality of the conference and didn't want to be associated with the likes of ASU, WCU, UTC, and Marshall (who was admitted in 1978). ECU left to play big time football.

It is not the first time:o

Point is still the same. We are a conference of large and small and always have been. Bitching about Samford doesn't change the fact that we probably always will be:)

[OL FU]

You have it a tad wrong there my friend. ASU was admitted in 1971, Marshall, UTC & Western were admitted in 1976. Richmond left in 1976, ECU & W&M left in 1977. Richmond and W&M made it clear they thought the trend in admitting large regional universities diluted the academic quality of the conference and didn't want to be associated with the likes of ASU, WCU, UTC, and Marshall (who was admitted in 1978). ECU left to play big time football.

How the mighty have fallenxlolx

[The Gadfly]

How the mighty have fallenxlolx

I think Skip will change that trend soon. Maybe it's his "shady recruiting tactics". xrolleyesx

[ButlerGSU]

I would have prefered Jacksonville State University, personally.

[citdog]

no

[Laserlips]

Piedmont College was my first choice, but if they got hosed and didn't get the call Samfords ok by me... xthumbsupx


J. Pomeroy

[Fresno St. Alum]

No, CCU or JSU were both better options

[Death Dealer]

No. I was really pulling for CCU.

[MarkCCU]

no

Dang, how can you argue with that?


xsmiley_wix :D

[AppMan]

How the mighty have fallenxlolx

Lets see....

ECU's 2006 schedule: USF, NC STATE, RICE, MARSHALL, UCF, SOUTHERN MISS, SMU, TULSA, VIRGINIA, WEST VIRGINIA, MEMPHIS, UAB, NAVY

Looks to me they are still playing at fairly high level and had a winning record.

[OL FU]

Lets see....

ECU's 2006 schedule: USF, NC STATE, RICE, MARSHALL, UCF, SOUTHERN MISS, SMU, TULSA, VIRGINIA, WEST VIRGINIA, MEMPHIS, UAB, NAVY

Looks to me they are still playing at fairly high level and had a winning record.

xrolleyesx WestVirginia was pretty goodxnodx


some just can't take a jokexrolleyesx

[PaladinXpatriate]

YES . . .{hmm, I wonder where xpatriate lives? . . .}

[OL FU]

YES . . .{hmm, I wonder where xpatriate lives? . . .}

Welcome X, you must live somewhere west of Ga and east of Mississippixconfusedx

[SoCon48]

Lets see....

ECU's 2006 schedule: USF, NC STATE, RICE, MARSHALL, UCF, SOUTHERN MISS, SMU, TULSA, VIRGINIA, WEST VIRGINIA, MEMPHIS, UAB, NAVY

Looks to me they are still playing at fairly high level and had a winning record.

I never have given a big crap what ECU does. I wouldn't want ASU to pattern themselves after that Marshall-like bunch.

[OL FU]

I never have given a big crap what ECU does. I wouldn't want ASU to pattern themselves after that Marshall-like bunch.

xthumbsupx

[ErkPeterson]

NO !!!!!!

[BigApp]

wow. Counting only yes/no's from SoCon posters, it's 32-3 saying "No". http://planetsmilies.net/shocked-smiley-9456.gif

[jsualum97]

I am the original author of this thread. Now, ask yourselves would you like Jacksonville State University. If a good many say yes, then put it to your respective schools to invite JSU.

[AppMan]

I never have given a big crap what ECU does. I wouldn't want ASU to pattern themselves after that Marshall-like bunch.

I have heard this generalization a million times and I want to know what exactly do you mean by that?

[AppMan]

The last three schools admitted to the SoCon.

Wofford - Enrollment 1100, Stadium size 13,000, ave '06 attendance 8334
Elon - Enrollment 5230, Stadium size 8,020, ave '06 attendance - 6671
Samford - Enrollment 2941, Stadium size 6700, ave '06 attendance - 6320


ASU - Enrollment 13,447 (undergrads), stadium size 16,500 - soon to be 23,000+, average attendance 22,589 (reg season)

Now, can somebody tell me what we have in common with these schools?

[Bark first then Bite]

Not granting that it matters, but according to Samford's website (www.samford.edu), there are approx. 2600 undergrads & 4500 total students enrolled at Samford. Still less than most big state schools, I know. Just curious, are Appy's numbers undergrad only? Either way, I'm sure we're fewer in number.

[walliver]

The last three schools admitted to the SoCon.

Wofford - Enrollment 1100, Stadium size 13,000, ave '06 attendance 8334
Elon - Enrollment 5230, Stadium size 8,020, ave '06 attendance - 6671
Samford - Enrollment 2941, Stadium size 6700, ave '06 attendance - 6320


ASU - Enrollment 13,447 (undergrads), stadium size 16,500 - soon to be 23,000+, average attendance 22,589 (reg season)

Now, can somebody tell me what we have in common with these schools?

Number of players on the field at one time:

Wofford - 11
Elon - 11
Samford - 11

AND

Appalachian State - 11
Georgia Southern - 11
Florida - 11
Ohio State - 11

[OL FU]

The last three schools admitted to the SoCon.

Wofford - Enrollment 1100, Stadium size 13,000, ave '06 attendance 8334
Elon - Enrollment 5230, Stadium size 8,020, ave '06 attendance - 6671
Samford - Enrollment 2941, Stadium size 6700, ave '06 attendance - 6320


ASU - Enrollment 13,447 (undergrads), stadium size 16,500 - soon to be 23,000+, average attendance 22,589 (reg season)

Now, can somebody tell me what we have in common with these schools?


The same thing you had in common with Furman Davidson, Citadel and VMI when you joinedxrolleyesx

[OL FU]

Number of players on the field at one time:

Wofford - 11
Elon - 11
Samford - 11

AND

Appalachian State - 11
Georgia Southern - 11
Florida - 11
Ohio State - 11

Number of Times Furman has beat App State 21
Number of Times ASU has beat Furman 15

[james_lawfirm]

Number of Times Furman has beat App State 21
Number of Times ASU has beat Furman 15

Ouch! Say it ain't so! Nooooooooooooooooooooooooooo.

[OL FU]

Ouch! Say it ain't so! Nooooooooooooooooooooooooooo.

Unfortunately the margin has decreased significantly lately:o xsmiley_wix

But the point is still the same. Appalachian State entered a SoCon conference made up of mostly equal numbers of large and small schools. And now some fans don't want it to be that way.xrolleyesx

[youwouldno]

The only thing that matters is money. The only thing. App St is, from a financial perspective, solidly FCS in football. Indeed, FCS football was created for programs serious about football but unable to match the financial resources of the power conferences. They haven't outgrown anything where it counts.

If App St turns their admittedly large fan base into big dollars, they may achieve the mid-major FBS status many of them seek. But institution size and even attendance are not fundamental to college football, except insofar as the latter is related to overall revenue (a huge exception, but the principle remains the same).

Furman is really not very different institutionally from Tulsa, who is currently a C-USA member with an impressive athletic tradition in a number of sports. The difference between Furman and Tulsa is mostly context; so too between App St and ECU (or whoever).

[JDC325]

Number of players on the field at one time:

Wofford - 11
Elon - 11
Samford - 11

AND

Appalachian State - 11
Georgia Southern - 11
Florida - 11
Ohio State - 11


Same goes for pop warner football... does not mean a thing. xnonox

[appfan2008]

Yes the size of our schools are different as are the size of stadiums and attendance but in the 70s when we joined the socon we knew what we were getting into and it hasnt changed one bit...i will have to side with the furman fans here

[lizrdgizrd]

Unfortunately the margin has decreased significantly lately:o xsmiley_wix

But the point is still the same. Appalachian State entered a SoCon conference made up of mostly equal numbers of large and small schools. And now some fans don't want it to be that way.xrolleyesx
I think the concern from most App fans (outside those who hate small schools) is that Samford doesn't bring much to the table athletically - especially in football. That's not to say that they won't improve over time, but I'm sure there are other private schools of similar size that have much better football teams that aren't already in the Socon.

[OL FU]

I think the concern from most App fans (outside those who hate small schools) is that Samford doesn't bring much to the table athletically - especially in football. That's not to say that they won't improve over time, but I'm sure there are other private schools of similar size that have much better football teams that aren't already in the Socon.

Wake Forestxnodx

[OL FU]

I think the concern from most App fans (outside those who hate small schools) is that Samford doesn't bring much to the table athletically - especially in football. That's not to say that they won't improve over time, but I'm sure there are other private schools of similar size that have much better football teams that aren't already in the Socon.

I don't disagree. As I said Samford would not have been my first choice. But and this is typical, instead of thinking of reasons that actually mean something, too many people just holler "Small Privates, Small Privates Small Privates"

And all I can think of is , "Don't share you personal problems with us"xeekx xrolleyesx

[lizrdgizrd]

I don't disagree. As I said Samford would not have been my first choice. But and this is typical, instead of thinking of reasons that actually mean something, too many people just holler "Small Privates, Small Privates Small Privates"

And all I can think of is , "Don't share you personal problems with us"xeekx xrolleyesx
xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx xlolx

[appfan2008]

It isnt just football that isnt very good with Samford... its all their sports

[CopperCat]

It isnt just football that isnt very good with Samford... its all their sports

What do you have to complain about? Its another easy W for you.

[youwouldno]

Samford is pretty decent in basketball and has a rising baseball program (not a big NCAA sport in general but it is the SoCon's best).

[Bark first then Bite]

Yep - several of the olympic sports have been good in recent years & several are good this year - at least by OVC standards. Our girls' soccer team has won the OVC the last four years. Two years ago we upset Vandy in the first round of the NCAA's. I believe it's the only time in OVC history that a women's soccer team advanced past the first round. Not that most folks on here care too much about those sports, but it's just not correct to say Samford is not good in "all their sports". You can legitimately beat us up for our performance on the gridiron over the past few years. But don't just make things up or repeat someone's lies out of ignorance. xnonox

[Cocky]

Samford will be at or near the top in MBB

[MarkCCU]

Would you like Stony Brook or CCU in exchange for Samford?

[AppMan]

The same thing you had in common with Furman Davidson, Citadel and VMI when you joinedxrolleyesx

You can not compare the two era's. In late 60's & early 70's the landscape of college athletics was entirely different. Remember, Davidson was a top ten basketball team and schools from Tallahasee and Miami Florida were football doormats. Times change.

[AppMan]

Number of players on the field at one time:

Wofford - 11
Elon - 11
Samford - 11

AND

Appalachian State - 11
Georgia Southern - 11
Florida - 11
Ohio State - 11

So, using that logic we are now to assume Wofford and Samford are on the same level as Ohio State & Florida?

[AppMan]

Number of Times Furman has beat App State 21
Number of Times ASU has beat Furman 15

Since we are playing the numbers game, you wanna go for the number of National Championships???

[AppMan]

Wake Forestxnodx

2006 was a fluke. It was the second ACC championship in the history of the school and it came in one of the worst overall seasons in ACC football history. Kinda like when Wofford won the SoCon title a few years back. FYI, Wake is 378-574-33 all time and 101-235-5 in the ACC.

[SoCon48]

So, using that logic we are now to assume Wofford and Samford are on the same level as Ohio State & Florida?

ROFL.

[T-Dog]

Number of times Bobby Lamb has beaten App: 1*
Number of times App has beaten Bobby Lamb: 5*
Number of temper tantrums Lamb has thrown at KBS: At least 2 on the field (1 for penalty), countless on the sideline.
Number of times Lamb has seen the goalpost(s) torn down at KBS: 3

*in five years

[Purple Knight]

Children! Children! Simmerdown!

[OL FU]

You can not compare the two era's. In late 60's & early 70's the landscape of college athletics was entirely different. Remember, Davidson was a top ten basketball team and schools from Tallahasee and Miami Florida were football doormats. Times change.

Sure I can. The SoCon has been a diverse group since the '30's. I don't think the option is for App fans to change the Socon.

[lizrdgizrd]

What do you have to complain about? Its another easy W for you.
Who wants an easy W that'll pull down your SOS? We'd love for Samford to be a quality team who beats everyone but us. xsmiley_wix

[JaxSinfonian]

It isnt just football that isnt very good with Samford... its all their sports

I look forward to seeing Samford crushed in football by SoCon teams, but I also will take pleasure in seeing their men's basketball program surprise those who don't know anything about them.

[Jiggs]

Let's see...currently in baseball, App State has two losses to an SEC school (South Carolina) and Samford has 1 win (Alabama) and 2 losses (Auburn, Mississippi State).

[Cocky]

Samford will not be in the cellar in football either. Samford will be somewhere in the middle come the end of the 2008 football season. If everything goes great for Samford they could be compariable to Wofford and have some real good seasons.

[AppMan]

Sure I can. The SoCon has been a diverse group since the '30's. I don't think the option is for App fans to change the Socon.

I have to respectfully disagree, If what you say is true then let's go even further back when unc-ch, dook, nc-state, and weak forest played folks like Davidson, Lenoir Rhyne, and others they wouldn't dream of playing today. You simply can not compare situations from 30+ years ago to today.

[rokamortis]

Samford will not be in the cellar in football either.

Why do you say that? Samford has been at the bottom of the OVC which isn't nearly as strong as the SoCon. What makes you think that they'll be much more improved?

[JaxSinfonian]

Why do you say that? Samford has been at the bottom of the OVC which isn't nearly as strong as the SoCon. What makes you think that they'll be much more improved?

Samford has never been at the bottom of the OVC. Since joining the league in 2003, they've finished third (7-4), sixth (4-7), fourth (5-6), and had a remarkably bad 2006 season, finishing eighth (3-8) in the nine-team league (hence the new coach). If we're looking for a label, the best one is "middle of the pack." That's probably where they'll reside in the SoCon standings, too.

[appfan2008]

Samford has never been at the bottom of the OVC. Since joining the league in 2003, they've finished third (7-4), sixth (4-7), fourth (5-6), and had a remarkably bad 2006 season, finishing eighth (3-8) in the nine-team league (hence the new coach). If we're looking for a label, the best one is "middle of the pack." That's probably where they'll reside in the SoCon standings, too.
if you think just because you were middle of the pack in the ovc then you will be middle of the pack in the socon... you are terribly wrong... these two conferences dont even compare the socon is so much better and so much tougher than the ovc

[rokamortis]

Samford has never been at the bottom of the OVC. Since joining the league in 2003, they've finished third (7-4), sixth (4-7), fourth (5-6), and had a remarkably bad 2006 season, finishing eighth (3-8) in the nine-team league (hence the new coach). If we're looking for a label, the best one is "middle of the pack." That's probably where they'll reside in the SoCon standings, too.

Perhaps I should have stated it differently, you are right that they are in the middle of the pack but look at the yearly average and you'll see that they averaged 5.25 which is still the bottom half of 9 teams.

Which is more relevent: 3rd place 4 years ago or 8th place last year?

[Cocky]

Why do you say that? Samford has been at the bottom of the OVC which isn't nearly as strong as the SoCon. What makes you think that they'll be much more improved?

Because the bottom of the SOCON is weaker than the bottom of the OVC. The SOCON is stronger on the topside but the bottom team aren't very good.

[JaxSinfonian]

Which is more relevent: 3rd place 4 years ago or 8th place last year?
Neither is more relevant. Both will be ancient history by 2008. My point was to show what their program is capable of under the current resources and former staff. Now they've (most would agree) traded up on staff and are committing more resources to football. I expect they'll at least be able to match the efforts of the 2003 squad. Getting past the SoCon's elite, though, is another matter.

And appfan2008, beyond that elite, there shouldn't be any chest-thumping. I won't go as far as my friend Cocky and say the bottom half of the OVC is stronger than the SoCon's cellar, because it's not. But they're comparable. What makes the SoCon special is the top three teams (or top two? I believe Ga. Southern will return). From there down the leagues look a lot alike, at least in the GPI.

If Samford can return to form, they'll be able to contend with the likes of Elon, Western Carolina and The Citadel.

ps - I can't believe I just spent that much effort defending Samford. I need to go take a shower now ...

[rokamortis]

Because the bottom of the SOCON is weaker than the bottom of the OVC. The SOCON is stronger on the topside but the bottom team aren't very good.

Thanks for the reply. I don't know enough to compare the bottom teams from both conferences to agree or disagree with your statement, but seems reasonable.

[rokamortis]

Neither is more relevant.

Yeah, you're right. Good luck to the Bulldogs.

[SoCon48]

Neither is more relevant. Both will be ancient history by 2008. My point was to show what their program is capable of under the current resources and former staff. Now they've (most would agree) traded up on staff and are committing more resources to football. I expect they'll at least be able to match the efforts of the 2003 squad. Getting past the SoCon's elite, though, is another matter.

And appfan2008, beyond that elite, there shouldn't be any chest-thumping. I won't go as far as my friend Cocky and say the bottom half of the OVC is stronger than the SoCon's cellar, because it's not. But they're comparable. What makes the SoCon special is the top three teams (or top two? I believe Ga. Southern will return). From there down the leagues look a lot alike, at least in the GPI.

If Samford can return to form, they'll be able to contend with the likes of Elon, Western Carolina and The Citadel.

ps - I can't believe I just spent that much effort defending Samford. I need to go take a shower now ...

Western will beat the hockey out of the bulldogs and Citadel will make them wish they hadn't shown up.

[JaxSinfonian]

Western will beat the hockey out of the bulldogs and Citadel will make them wish they hadn't shown up.

Oh.

[Cocky]

Samford is pretty decent in basketball and has a rising baseball program (not a big NCAA sport in general but it is the SoCon's best).

Baseball is next to last in the Conference standings. Samford had a good year last year.

http://www.ovcsports.com/standings/Standings.dbml?&DB_OEM_ID=6200&SPID=2437&DB_OEM_ID=6200&KEY?&SPSID=30969

[Laserlips]

Samford has never been at the bottom of the OVC. Since joining the league in 2003, they've finished third (7-4), sixth (4-7), fourth (5-6), and had a remarkably bad 2006 season, finishing eighth (3-8) in the nine-team league (hence the new coach). If we're looking for a label, the best one is "middle of the pack." That's probably where they'll reside in the SoCon standings, too.


JaxSinforian:

Please don't mention any 3-8 seasons.. Those particular numbers make GSU fans extremely depressed, and I be one of them.. xbabycryx

Hopefully under the tuteledge of our new head Coach, Chris Hatcher, our Eagles can climb back on that bus BVG threw the whole program under during his one season stint as the most incompetent football coach to ever try to lead the GSU football team..

Best Wishes,

J. Pomeroy

[Sir William]

Samford has never been at the bottom of the OVC. Since joining the league in 2003, they've finished third (7-4), sixth (4-7), fourth (5-6), and had a remarkably bad 2006 season, finishing eighth (3-8) in the nine-team league (hence the new coach). If we're looking for a label, the best one is "middle of the pack." That's probably where they'll reside in the SoCon standings, too.

With all due respect to OVC members, "middle of the pack" in the OVC and "middle of the pack" in the SoCon are two distinctly different things.

If Samford finishes in the SoCon middle of the pack in their first year, it will speak highly of the Bulldogs. I strongly doubt it will happen. They may not finish dead last, but they will have to play consistently tough to avoid it.

[appfan2008]

With all due respect to OVC members, "middle of the pack" in the OVC and "middle of the pack" in the SoCon are two distinctly different things.

If Samford, shows up in the SoCon middle of the pack in their first year, it will speak highly of the Bulldogs. But I ain't counting on it to happen. They may not finish dead last, but they will have to play consisitently tough to avoid it.
I said the same thing a few posts ago and the socon is so on a different level from the ovc...

your position in the ovc translates to about 2 positions down in the socon

[ButlerGSU]

I said the same thing a few posts ago and the socon is so on a different level from the ovc...

your position in the ovc translates to about 2 positions down in the socon

That seems acurate.

[JaxSinfonian]

With all due respect to OVC members, "middle of the pack" in the OVC and "middle of the pack" in the SoCon are two distinctly different things.
Absolutley. In the SoCon, it means you finished "best of the rest", behind the real contenders for the league crown. In the OVC It means you finished behind the eventual winners, but probably had a legitimate chance at the title.

Again, the SoCon's best two or three teams are among the national elite, a notch or two above what the OVC's best can handle right now (JSU's close finishes against Furman the last two years notwithstanding). Get below that, and the leagues probably match up pretty well.


your position in the ovc translates to about 2 positions down in the socon

Read my reasoning again, and you'll see that this statement gels pretty well with what I've said.


If Samford finishes in the SoCon middle of the pack in their first year, it will speak highly of the Bulldogs. I strongly doubt it will happen.
Me too. 2008 may be a bit early to expect the Bulldogs' rebuilding program to bear fruit, especially in a new league. I never said it would happen in their first year. Beyond that, I expect fininshing in the 4-7 range to be Samford's usual accomplishment.

[youwouldno]

I've said all along I think Samford has some upside with Sullivan at the helm. But 2008 will be tough for them. I think JaxSinfonian has a point in that the top of the OVC is kind of muddled... there are a bunch of OK teams that fight it out, without huge differences in talent. That said, the SoCon is still stronger throughout... WCU was a horrible team last year, 0-7 in the SoCon, and they beat 5-3 EKU, Chatty was one of the worst SoCon teams, 2-5, and smashed a 4-4 OVC team while also losing by 3 to JSU, a 5-3 team.

So I don't think Samford is just going to feast on weaker SoCon teams, not by a longshot.

[JaxSinfonian]

That said, the SoCon is still stronger throughout... WCU was a horrible team last year, 0-7 in the SoCon, and they beat 5-3 EKU, Chatty was one of the worst SoCon teams, 2-5, and smashed a 4-4 OVC team while also losing by 3 to JSU, a 5-3 team.

It always gets tricky when you try to take it down to the game-by-game level and to almost-beats, though. The 5-3 JSU team that needed Rodney Allison's help to win at Chatty also took 6-1 Furman to the wire for the second year in a row. The TTU team the Mocs waxed was making its season debut just a few weeks after losing its head coach. EKU ... well, was its own special ball of dysfunction. They only lost by three to WCU, who got stomped by Furman, who nearly lost to JSU, who shut EKU out 28-0 ... see where I'm going?

This is all fun, of course, but the question we're arguing over is how Samford will do in the SoCon. We seem to agree that 2008 will be tough on the Bulldogs. For all the points we're all making about order of finish in 2006 and who beat who, it's going to be 4-5 years before we know who was right. As for how the OVC and the SoCon stack up, I don't think we've got enough head-to-head evidence. The best measuring stick we're gonna get, I think, is how badly Samford gets beat in the OVC this year, against how badly they're beaten in the SoCon in '08. :D

[thirdgendin]

Number of times Bobby Lamb has beaten App: 1*
Number of times App has beaten Bobby Lamb: 5*
Number of temper tantrums Lamb has thrown at KBS: At least 2 on the field (1 for penalty), countless on the sideline.
Number of times Lamb has seen the goalpost(s) torn down at KBS: 3

*in five years

Fortunately for us, Jerry Moore is 3-5 in Greenville and 10-9 against the Paladins overall. We need to even up his record this year! :D