SoCon Pre-Season / "Camp Life" Thread

[PaladinFan]

Nevermind - I did it for you...apples to apples...and the answer is 10. Actually, it really could be 9 as Seth Hattaway was not a FR in 2016. He was actually a Mercer "Day1" and started in 2012, but he returned from his Mormon Mission in 2016. The NCAA 'stops the clock' for those though...so, he did not complete his 5 years (to play 4) of eligibility. So, he 'coulda' played in 2017 as a married 23 year old, graduated, 5th Team WR. I'll give him a pass on passing up his final 2 years.



#
FULL NAME
POS.
HT.
WT
YR
LTR
HOMETOWN
HIGH SCHOOL
PREVIOUS SCHOOL


69
Hudson Brett (https://mercerbears.com/roster.aspx?rp_id=708)
DL
6' 4"
230
R-Fr.
0
Gray, Ga.
Mount de Sales Academy



49
Jake Brooks (https://mercerbears.com/roster.aspx?rp_id=709)
LB
6' 2"
224
R-Fr.
0
Thomson, Ga.
Thomson H.S.



19
Julian Burris (https://mercerbears.com/roster.aspx?rp_id=714)
WR
5' 10"
186
Jr.
0
Marietta, Ga.
Kell H.S.
Butler CC


42
Seth Hattaway (https://mercerbears.com/roster.aspx?rp_id=2518)
DB
6' 1"
195
Fr.*
0
Macon, Ga.
Mount de Sales HS



83
Tres Hattaway (https://mercerbears.com/roster.aspx?rp_id=2519)
WR
6' 1"
180
Fr.
0
Macon, Ga.
Mount de Sales HS



12
Michael Haynes (https://mercerbears.com/roster.aspx?rp_id=731)
QB
6' 0"
199
R-Jr.
2
Sugar Hill, Ga.
North Gwinnett HS



26
Jeremy James (https://mercerbears.com/roster.aspx?rp_id=737)
DB
5' 9"
175
Jr.
2
Flowery Branch, Ga.
Flowery Branch HS



74
David Raschen (https://mercerbears.com/roster.aspx?rp_id=762)
OL
6' 5"
302
R-Jr.
2
Newnan, Ga.
Newnan HS



63
Stanley Smith (https://mercerbears.com/roster.aspx?rp_id=769)
OL
6' 3"
288
R-Fr.
0
Opelika, Ala.
Opelika H.S.



56
Nick Thompson (https://mercerbears.com/roster.aspx?rp_id=2532)
LB
5' 11"
190
Fr.
0
Roswell, Ga.
Fellowship Christian HS



NOTE1: Of these 10 young men, only Jeremy James ever saw any significant playing time for Mercer. He was a starting CB.
NOTE2: I'm confident over half of these 10 were not "Recruited Student Athletes" as defined by the NCAA
NOTE3: Both Haynes and Raschen, the only R-JR's on the list graduated from Mercer in the Spring of 2017.

So 10...or 9...or 10...can be classified as Mercer's "Roster Churn"..... 36 is still a whole lot greater than 10. Correct?

Thus, your disingenuous attempt to compare the ETSU situation with the Mercer situation is a BIG FAIL!

"Casualties" is the wrong word insofar as it assumes I am just talking about players forgoing their final year of eligibility. I mean that there is a large roster turnover in one season (whether from graduation, world travel, marriage, starting a business, etc.) It doesn't matter why they left, just that they left.

Mercer, ETSU, and every other start up program generally has a one time large exodus from the program. Maybe guys graduate. Maybe "Day 1" guys are supplanted by more talented underclassmen. Again, it doesn't matter. With a new coach and new recruiting class (i.e., the new coach's guys), it doesn't surprise me if some of the veteran players decide to go do something else.

ETSU, who restarted their program two years after Mercer is probably reaching that same spot that Mercer was in two years ago - losing a lot of their early crop of players. Again, the reason why they are losing them doesn't matter.

That such players may have only been reserves doesn't matter unless Mercer or ETSU are two of those programs that can run a practice with only the starters playing against one another. Someone else is out there running the scout team, getting water, and carrying the starter's shoulder pads.

[FUBeAR]

Again, the reason why they are losing them doesn't matter.

Welp...this is the exact opposite of the original point & questioning which precipitated the reason for my original post around this issue. I CLEARLY stated that I had removed the prior year Sr’s & R-Sr’s from the ETSU roster, so the entire focus of the original post was on the large number of UNEXPECTED departures.

1) You TRIED to intimate that Mercer had the same issue as ETSU has now with unexpected roster departures

2) I showed that Mercer ABSOLUTELY DID NOT have the same or even a similar issue. In fact, losing 9 or 10 Players unexpectedly, the majority of them walk-on’s, is probably a rather low number. 36 is very high.

3) Now, you’re just trying to obfuscate your original intent & change the original discussion with all of this talk about depth & scout Teams, etc.

4) Just admit it. You tried to sneak in a shot at Mercer & you were caught red-handed in the process.

5) In closure, ETSU seems to have some type of relatively major issue with unexpected Player departures before this season AND Mercer has never had even a similar issue.

[FUBeAR]

While the Math Nerds do the whole Money Ball thing to determine if the Mocs O-Line actually improved...I prefer the eyeball test....and competitiveness. Sacks was only one metric, 3 and outs were probably more detrimental to the team than sacks (albeit difficult to convert a 3rd and 24, after a big sack, so sacks have some bearing on the 3 and out issue))....The Mocs OL couldn't move the ball in the first part of the season. As it went on, they were able to start moving the ball down the field and compete with other teams. And since we have two charts above that show the OL IMPROVED as the season went on, and DIND NOT IMPROVE as the season went on...I'll end by saying there are Liars, Damn Liars, and then there are STATISTICIANS.
LOL - Absolutely agree with your final sentence, which, as an Econ major, parallels one of my favorite axioms, that “if you laid all of the Economists in the world end-to-end, they still wouldn’t reach a conclusion.”

I like to use both - eye test & stats. Didn’t see much of Chatt after they played Mercer though. So, gotta go with the stats, at least on PassPro improvement. At best, I think, “stayed about the same,” is all we can say.

[SU DOG]

I see today that the Chatty newspaper is listing 2 more transfers that the Mocs have added. These two are from the Memphis. Although one of them was a 2** listed player, I think that both were walk-ons for the Tigers. If my count is accurate, that is a total of 30 transfers on the UTC roster.xcoffeex Each school has their own unique situation, and I'm certainly not downing the Mocs. Samford has some really good xfers also, but 30 does seem like a little much IMO. Again, UTC is to me a mystery team going into this year. One thing I will admit, however, they sure seem to have our number regardless.:(

[PaladinFan]

Welp...this is the exact opposite of the original point & questioning which precipitated the reason for my original post around this issue. I CLEARLY stated that I had removed the prior year Sr’s & R-Sr’s from the ETSU roster, so the entire focus of the original post was on the large number of UNEXPECTED departures.

1) You TRIED to intimate that Mercer had the same issue as ETSU has now with unexpected roster departures

2) I showed that Mercer ABSOLUTELY DID NOT have the same or even a similar issue. In fact, losing 9 or 10 Players unexpectedly, the majority of them walk-on’s, is probably a rather low number. 36 is very high.

3) Now, you’re just trying to obfuscate your original intent & change the original discussion with all of this talk about depth & scout Teams, etc.

4) Just admit it. You tried to sneak in a shot at Mercer & you were caught red-handed in the process.

5) In closure, ETSU seems to have some type of relatively major issue with unexpected Player departures before this season AND Mercer has never had even a similar issue.

If I were interested in taking shots at Mercer, Macon, or the color orange I would do so plainly.

I used the word "casualty" when I should have just said "losses." My point is that ETSU is losing 30 someodd players. Mercer did a few years ago. Coastal Carolina did in 2006. Heck, Furman lost 20 something with their coaching change. You can think whatever you want about what I was intending.

[FUBeAR]

If I were interested in taking shots at Mercer, Macon, or the color orange I would do so plainly.

I used the word "casualty" when I should have just said "losses." My point is that ETSU is losing 30 someodd players. Mercer did a few years ago. Coastal Carolina did in 2006. Heck, Furman lost 20 something with their coaching change. You can think whatever you want about what I was intending.

If you add back ETSU’s lost R-SR’s & SR’s, I think it’s closer to 50 than it is to “30 someodd.” Mercer had 27 SR’s graduate & complete their eligibility in the year you referenced. 23 of those could be classified as ‘contributors.’ Add the 10 ‘unexpecteds’ (1 ‘Contributor’ among those 10) I noted and we’re at 37 (24 ‘Contributors’).

Still, significantly different from 50 AND, most importantly, a Program can Recruit around & plan well in advance for a large graduating class, as Mercer did. When almost 40 Players di di mau unexpectedly, a Program almost has to go into Fire Drill mode...which is why I wanted to see if anyone had any knowledge of the situation/Impact/response.

Your original intent was obvious to all.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[FUBeAR]

I see today that the Chatty newspaper is listing 2 more transfers that the Mocs have added. These two are from the Memphis. Although one of them was a 2** listed player, I think that both were walk-ons for the Tigers. If my count is accurate, that is a total of 30 transfers on the UTC roster.xcoffeex Each school has their own unique situation, and I'm certainly not downing the Mocs. Samford has some really good xfers also, but 30 does seem like a little much IMO. Again, UTC is to me a mystery team going into this year. One thing I will admit, however, they sure seem to have our number regardless.:(I had them at 30 transfers previously. So, if these 2 were not on the roster last week, they are now at 32. I believe they had 14 on the 2-deep. So, it’s realistic that they could have (many) more starters & backups that have transferred in than those recruited out of HS. As a HS recruit or the parent of a HS recruit, that might give me some pause when considering an offer from the Mocs.

[SU DOG]

Thirty is probably correct, as I think these guys were already on the roster. Newspaper releases are usually somewhat behind. Guessing what my own team will do this year is hard enough, but I just do not know how to predict UTC in the SoCon this season.

[Mocs123]

I suspect most of those transfers won’t see much time. The exceptions will be Orr, Tiano, and Moon - all three Chattanooga locals who came back home.

[Reign of Terrier]

Well, that will be an experiment, I guess. I don't see how that is going to be a good thing for Wofford in 2018.

I think modernizing the offense is a good idea, but I'm not sure they have the personnel to do it this season.

Not sure what you mean by this. We have quarterbacks that can throw, receivers and running backs who can catch, and offensive linemen who can block.

The problem we have (as all option teams have) with passing the ball is a matter of execution (completing the passes you throw in a game situation. Option teams have a hard time passing the ball because they do it so rarely that they can't build any sort of rapport with it. As anyone who studies team-building and habit formation can tell you, repetition is the key. When you're only throwing 9 passes a game (and 1/3 of those passes are thrown by your backup) you're not going to build that rapport.

If would be one thing if we were coming off 2012 with this offense (we threw it like 7 times per game that year), but we're coming off one of the best years we've had throwing the ball in the last decade or two.

[PaladinFan]

Not sure what you mean by this. We have quarterbacks that can throw, receivers and running backs who can catch, and offensive linemen who can block.

The problem we have (as all option teams have) with passing the ball is a matter of execution (completing the passes you throw in a game situation. Option teams have a hard time passing the ball because they do it so rarely that they can't build any sort of rapport with it. As anyone who studies team-building and habit formation can tell you, repetition is the key. When you're only throwing 9 passes a game (and 1/3 of those passes are thrown by your backup) you're not going to build that rapport.

If would be one thing if we were coming off 2012 with this offense (we threw it like 7 times per game that year), but we're coming off one of the best years we've had throwing the ball in the last decade or two.

Of course, developing a passing game is a matter of throwing the ball and a receiver catching it. That's the entire concept. Throwing the ball 20-25 times a game, though, requires developing a legitimate passing attack instead of "passing by surprise," which has typically been Wofford's MO.

I agree with you that last season Wofford had the best passing QB I can remember seeing in the last 15 years. That QB graduated, as did the leading receiver and much of the offensive line. So, it's a bit more complicated that just pointing to last year. That personnel is largely gone.

Essentially, it looks like Wofford is trying to do what Furman has done--be a 60-70% rushing team with a competent (in Furman's case, very good) passing attack. Wofford's OC has never really implemented that offense. Most of the Terriers' returning pass catchers are running backs. You can't throw 20+ times a game and 15 of them go to the HB. Defenses will eat that up.

I don't know what Newman would look like if called upon to throw that often. In limited passing attempts the last two seasons, a good chunk found grass and a significant percentage found the opposing defense.

[PaladinFan]

Thirty is probably correct, as I think these guys were already on the roster. Newspaper releases are usually somewhat behind. Guessing what my own team will do this year is hard enough, but I just do not know how to predict UTC in the SoCon this season.

Unless they get significantly better in a single season (it happens), they'll probably be worse than the top teams and better than the bottom teams.

I know they beat Samford, which might be why we keep vasciallting this preseason, but Furman, Western, and Mercer all pummeled (my characterization) the Mocs last season. UTC has to go to Greenville and Cullowhee this season. Unless they improve significantly, I'm not sure I see them winning either of those games.

[SU DOG]

Joe Newman can be a dangerous QB throwing or running. He ran through our defense last year like a hot knife through butter. Granted the game ending interception was not good, but he had shown in several prior passes that he had the talent to deliver the ball accurately. I am very grateful that Wofford threw that last pass, but I also have thought that it was a bad call on their part. IMO, our defense was gassed, and we would have lost that game in OT after an easy Wofford field goal. I guess you don't question an iconic coach like Ayers, but still.....

[FUBeAR]

I’ve seen Newman deliver some pretty bad throws, including watching him during warmups 3x last season. He’s a greasy-fast waterbug with his legs though.

On the other hand, I think this Transfer to Wofford (AKA, UTC-Upstate :D) can spin it pretty good.

https://www.hudl.com/profile/1760921/Miller-Mosley ...and he ain’t bad with his feet.

I expect we will see them both, and despite his amazing running abilities, I think Mosley at QB may be able to take the PorchYappers a bit further than Newman can...especially if they gonna chunk it 21x / game.

Similar, but different situation as Furman, but WAY less observation (by me, at least)...I think Lincoln can take the Paladins’ Offense further than Roberts.

All 4 are very talented athletes and, I hear, fine young men...so no knock on any of them & I’m sure whatever success these 2 Teams realize this year will depend on each of their significant contributions, regardless of their week-to-week roles.

[PaladinFan]

Joe Newman can be a dangerous QB throwing or running. He ran through our defense last year like a hot knife through butter. Granted the game ending interception was not good, but he had shown in several prior passes that he had the talent to deliver the ball accurately. I am very grateful that Wofford threw that last pass, but I also have thought that it was a bad call on their part. IMO, our defense was gassed, and we would have lost that game in OT after an easy Wofford field goal. I guess you don't question an iconic coach like Ayers, but still.....

Newman is an impressive QB. I just don't think you want him dropping back a bunch and throwing. Not only is his game not particularly well suited to do that, it will reduce the number of times he runs it, which is where he is truly dangerous.

Just as an example, Chris Hatcher--who wants to throw the ball than pretty much any coach in football--had Jayson Foster at Georgia Southern. Did Hatcher make Foster air it out? No, he did not. That would be dumb. Foster was the most electric player in the country running the ball. Throwing was not his strong suit and, in fact, made him less effective (because it meant he wasn't running).

[PaladinFan]

I’ve seen Newman deliver some pretty bad throws, including watching him during warmups 3x last season. He’s a greasy-fast waterbug with his legs though.

On the other hand, I think this Transfer to Wofford (AKA, UTC-Upstate :D) can spin it pretty good.

https://www.hudl.com/profile/1760921/Miller-Mosley ...and he ain’t bad with his feet.

I expect we will see them both, and despite his amazing running abilities, I think Mosley at QB may be able to take the PorchYappers a bit further than Newman can...especially if they gonna chunk it 21x / game.

Similar, but different situation as Furman, but WAY less observation (by me, at least)...I think Lincoln can take the Paladins’ Offense further than Roberts.

All 4 are very talented athletes and, I hear, fine young men...so no knock on any of them & I’m sure whatever success these 2 Teams realize this year will depend on each of their significant contributions, regardless of their week-to-week roles.

Hard to gauge Furman's QB battle. No one has really seen Lincoln play at this level besides the spring game.

Both guys have big arms. I agree with you though that if both guys are pretty even in the passing category, Lincoln's feet probably opens the offense up more. Roberts might be the guy you want down on the goalline, though. 6'4 210 is still useful to go to when you need a foot or two.

[Reign of Terrier]

Of course, developing a passing game is a matter of throwing the ball and a receiver catching it. That's the entire concept. Throwing the ball 20-25 times a game, though, requires developing a legitimate passing attack instead of "passing by surprise," which has typically been Wofford's MO.

I agree with you that last season Wofford had the best passing QB I can remember seeing in the last 15 years. That QB graduated, as did the leading receiver and much of the offensive line. So, it's a bit more complicated that just pointing to last year. That personnel is largely gone.

Essentially, it looks like Wofford is trying to do what Furman has done--be a 60-70% rushing team with a competent (in Furman's case, very good) passing attack. Wofford's OC has never really implemented that offense. Most of the Terriers' returning pass catchers are running backs. You can't throw 20+ times a game and 15 of them go to the HB. Defenses will eat that up.

I don't know what Newman would look like if called upon to throw that often. In limited passing attempts the last two seasons, a good chunk found grass and a significant percentage found the opposing defense.

Again, you're using apples and oranges here. Our running backs had lots of receptions because they were practically receivers. This may be controversial, but I don't think it's unfair to compare Blake Morgan to a Wofford-size Percy Harvin just because he makes plays out of the backfield, whether be catching it or running it. If your RB is lined up on the wing and most of his catches are streaking down the sideline or on a dig route, it's not the same as a flat route or a screen.

By this logic, it would have been completely reasonable for me to say that Furman's offense should have been bad last year because Blazejowski wasn't an option QB. There were plenty of examples of him running the ball well, but he wasn't a running QB. We all know what happened.


I’ve seen Newman deliver some pretty bad throws, including watching him during warmups 3x last season. He’s a greasy-fast waterbug with his legs though.

On the other hand, I think this Transfer to Wofford (AKA, UTC-Upstate :D) can spin it pretty good.

https://www.hudl.com/profile/1760921/Miller-Mosley ...and he ain’t bad with his feet.

I expect we will see them both, and despite his amazing running abilities, I think Mosley at QB may be able to take the PorchYappers a bit further than Newman can...especially if they gonna chunk it 21x / game.

Similar, but different situation as Furman, but WAY less observation (by me, at least)...I think Lincoln can take the Paladins’ Offense further than Roberts.

All 4 are very talented athletes and, I hear, fine young men...so no knock on any of them & I’m sure whatever success these 2 Teams realize this year will depend on each of their significant contributions, regardless of their week-to-week roles.

There were a lot of people on terrierfans who thought Newman should have started over Goodson over the course of last year.


Newman is an impressive QB. I just don't think you want him dropping back a bunch and throwing. Not only is his game not particularly well suited to do that, it will reduce the number of times he runs it, which is where he is truly dangerous.

Just as an example, Chris Hatcher--who wants to throw the ball than pretty much any coach in football--had Jayson Foster at Georgia Southern. Did Hatcher make Foster air it out? No, he did not. That would be dumb. Foster was the most electric player in the country running the ball. Throwing was not his strong suit and, in fact, made him less effective (because it meant he wasn't running).

You're moving the goal post here. Wofford's only looking to pass the ball about 10 more times a game than we average and from the looks of camp, it's coming from an RPO set. It's not like we're going to be Texas Tech or Hawaii out there. Newman doesn't need to have Aaron Rodgers' arm, he just needs to be able to read the defense effectively and be efficient for intermediate gains.

I'm not going to go back and look at all the passes he threw, but I remember he was pretty efficient at the intermediate range stuff (8-15 yards), but was more sketchy on the deep ball. Fine, I'll concede that.

In this thread, we've gravitated from "he can't pass deep" to "he can't pass at all" to "this is not going to be good." The first is true, the second is demonstrably not the case (he threw 47 TDs and 3200 yards in 2 years of HS) and the third does not account for the offense Wofford is purportedly running.

[FUBeAR]

I suspect most of those transfers won’t see much time. The exceptions will be Orr, Tiano, and Moon - all three Chattanooga locals who came back home.On the depth chart published by Chatt. Football - https://s3.amazonaws.com/sidearm.sites/utc.sidearmsports.com/documents/2018/6/26/Summer_Prospectus.pdf

...13 transfers listed on the 2 deep are...

C Moon (Mississippi State)
OT Schultheiss (Louisville)
TE Giberti (Tennessee Tech)
WR/PR/KR Parker (Wyoming)
QB Tiano (Mississippi State)
QB James (Valdosta State & Hutchinson CC)
RB Price (East Mississippi CC)
LS Nash (Western Kentucky)
DL Mahaffey (East Mississippi CC)
LB Schrider (Richmond)
LB Cooper (Carson-Newman)
CB Orr (Arizona State)
CB Turner (Nevada)

[Reign of Terrier]

it would seem that UTC wants to claim the title of Transfer U 2018

[Milktruck74]

On the depth chart published by Chatt. Football - https://s3.amazonaws.com/sidearm.sites/utc.sidearmsports.com/documents/2018/6/26/Summer_Prospectus.pdf

...13 transfers listed on the 2 deep are...

C Moon (Mississippi State)
OT Schultheiss (Louisville)
TE Giberti (Tennessee Tech)
WR/PR/KR Parker (Wyoming)
QB Tiano (Mississippi State)
QB James (Valdosta State & Hutchinson CC)
RB Price (East Mississippi CC)
LS Nash (Western Kentucky)
DL Mahaffey (East Mississippi CC)
LB Schrider (Richmond)
LB Cooper (Carson-Newman)
CB Orr (Arizona State)
CB Turner (Nevada)

I've never been a huge fan of transfers (even though I was one), I've seen too many "Big School hHros" hit the practice field and quickly become "zeros"...but Chattanooga needed a boost to make up for Arth first class... he had a little more than a month to put his staff together, assess the talent on the team, evaluate the needs of the team, assess the talent of the recruits and sell the kids on the school/program....He didn't come from a school that already recruited the traditional Chattanooga market, and being a D3 school, he wasn't really talking to the same caliber of athlete when recruiting for John Carrol...he didn't haveany relationships with HS coaches in the market, so he was forced to take what he could get...and often times, that was the kid that was left over...Not saying there weren't good players in that class, but I think they had to takea gamble and pray that a lesser player could develop.There was a pretty big exit of kids from that class this season? were they "processed"? Maybe. Or Maybe they realized they were not going to see the field because they just weren't that good, so they left on their own accord to go get playing time elsewhere. Anyway.....

A few points about these 13 guys

1. Are Recruited Jucos really Transfers? I guess technically, but.....
2. Half of them were on the roster last year, so it isn't like all of them came in at one time.
3. As mentioned, several are local Kids that just wanted to come home.
4. Half of them are walk-ons at Chattanooga.
5. None of them were trouble makers at their previous schools.
6. Most of them come in with 3 years left.

[PaladinFan]

By this logic, it would have been completely reasonable for me to say that Furman's offense should have been bad last year because Blazejowski wasn't an option QB. There were plenty of examples of him running the ball well, but he wasn't a running QB. We all know what happened.


I'm not sure I understand the comparison. Furman was not an option offense. Furman ran option as part of its offense, but it was by no measure a prominently option team.

I noted this on our forum earlier. People assume Furman was an "option" team because they used a lot of three-back looks as part of the offense (double wing). Rarely did Furman have 3 running backs on the field at one time. Often there were only two and sometimes one. This is a stark contrast to Wofford and the Citadel, who almost always operate with three backs.

An example--this is an "option look," but Furman has three WRs on the field and only 1 RB. There's option motion, but there's no option to it. It's a straight handoff.

https://twitter.com/PaladinFootball/status/1029721964963721216


There were a lot of people on terrierfans who thought Newman should have started over Goodson over the course of last year.


I'm not suggesting Newman isn't a good QB. He is (just my observation) better suited as a running option QB. I presume that's what he was recruited to Wofford to do.


I'm not going to go back and look at all the passes he threw, but I remember he was pretty efficient at the intermediate range stuff (8-15 yards), but was more sketchy on the deep ball. Fine, I'll concede that.


For his career, he's 10-26 (38%) for 194 yards, 0 touchdowns, and 2 interceptions.


Wofford's only looking to pass the ball about 10 more times a game than we average and from the looks of camp, it's coming from an RPO set.


An additional 10+ passes a game is not insignificant. Last season, Wofford averaged 62 plays per game. Only VMI averaged fewer. Wofford passed roughly 19% of the time. You are suggesting they are going to increase that to 35% of the time. That is a significant jump.


In this thread, we've gravitated from "he can't pass deep" to "he can't pass at all" to "this is not going to be good." The first is true, the second is demonstrably not the case (he threw 47 TDs and 3200 yards in 2 years of HS) and the third does not account for the offense Wofford is purportedly running.

High School numbers aren't terribly relevant. Most of these guys can single-handedly out-athlete most of their competition at that level. I also expect he can drop back and launch it. Most D1 QBs can. The question is whether he can do that and hit a Terrier receiver. I don't know if anyone knows the answer to that question at this stage.

[FUBeAR]

I'm not going to go back and look at all the passes he threw, but I remember he was pretty efficient at the intermediate range stuff (8-15 yards), but was more sketchy on the deep ball. Fine, I'll concede that.

In this thread, we've gravitated from "he can't pass deep" to "he can't pass at all" to "this is not going to be good." The first is true, the second is demonstrably not the case (he threw 47 TDs and 3200 yards in 2 years of HS) and the third does not account for the offense Wofford is purportedly running.
Well, it really wouldn’t take all that long, would it?

Career Passing Statistics



GP
CMP
ATT
INT
YDS
TD
Long
%
AVG/P


2016
5
2
7
0
27
0
26
.29
3.9
5.4


2017
11
8
19
2
167
0
37
.42
8.8
15.2


Total
16
10
26
2
194
0
37
.38
7.5
12.1



C’mon...you can’t really make any kind of reasonable assessment from this limited career sample size. That’s why I mentioned watching him throw in warmups 3x last season. I guarantee I watched him throw more than 9 passes in warmups in each of those 3 games.

He may be amazing, but no one has seen enough of him throwing it, in games, in college, yet...to provide a well informed opinion...even you. Again, I am so impressed at his running capabilities that I wanted to get some kind of gauge of his throwing...and it did not look good. Goodson did, for the most part, and Mosley did, as well. That’s all I can go on...and it’s hardly sufficient.

I guess we’ll see when he goes 11-27-0 for 195 yards & 1 TD vs. El Cid...in game 1...surpassing almost all of his career cumulative totals. If he can do that every week, with his running skills, he will be the 1st Team All-SoCon QB. Sorry Samford Fans.

[kdinva]

Those who follow/are Big Sky fans, know of the offense NAU ran last year under Coach Sheppard........now it's in Lexington.....

https://www.roanoke.com/sports/colleges/vmi-football-program-turns-to-up-tempo-air-raid-offense/article_1ef13e12-9a5f-505f-9865-f02936027d42.html

[FUBeAR]

Those who follow/are Big Sky fans, know of the offense NAU ran last year under Coach Sheppard........now it's in Lexington.....

https://www.roanoke.com/sports/colleges/vmi-football-program-turns-to-up-tempo-air-raid-offense/article_1ef13e12-9a5f-505f-9865-f02936027d42.htmlSo, VMI & Wofford will be running the same Offense this season. xsmiley_wix

[FUBeAR]

I see today that the Chatty newspaper is listing 2 more transfers that the Mocs have added. These two are from the Memphis. Although one of them was a 2** listed player, I think that both were walk-ons for the Tigers. If my count is accurate, that is a total of 30 transfers on the UTC roster.xcoffeex Each school has their own unique situation, and I'm certainly not downing the Mocs. Samford has some really good xfers also, but 30 does seem like a little much IMO. Again, UTC is to me a mystery team going into this year. One thing I will admit, however, they sure seem to have our number regardless.:(

"After further review..." it appears these 2 new transfers were NOT on the roster the last time I checked, so adding them would have taken UTC to 32 transfers, but a prior transfer from Birmingham Southern is no longer on the roster, so net-net, the Mocs now have 31 Transfers on their roster...



#
Fname
Lname
POS
HT
WT
YR
Hometown
ST
HIGH SCHOOL
Previous School


2
Kareem
Orr
DB
71
195
SR
Chattanooga
TN
Notre Dame HS
Arizona State


4
Joseph
Parker
WR
70
185
SR
Castle Rock
CO
Cherry Creek HS
Wyoming


5
Derek
Mahaffey
DL
74
310
SR
Oxford
AL
Oxford HS
East Central Miss CC


7
Alex
Gaca
DB
75
195
FR
Franklin
TN
Franklin HS
Memphis


7
Nick
Tiano
QB
77
240
JR
Chattanooga
TN
Baylor School
Mississippi State


8
Demarcus
Williams
WR
72
195
SO
Gainestown
AL

Minnesota


16
Dominic
Caldwell
QB
75
180
SO
Sarasota
FL
Riverview HS
Florida International


16
Cameron
Turner
DB
70
180
JR
Munford
AL
Munford HS
Nevada


17
Chris
James
QB
75
220
SO
Ellijay
GA
Gilmer HS
Hutchinson (Kan.) CC


23
Tyrell
Price
RB
72
220
JR
Abbeville
MS
Lafayette HS
East Mississippi CC


29
Andrew
Brown
DB
69
175
SR
Decatur
GA

Florida International


30
Torii
Hilbert
DB
72
165
JR
Long Beach
CA

Univ. of LaVern


34
Deandre
Alexander
RB
70
185
FR
Nashville
TN
Hillsboro HS
Memphis


36
Andrew
Hill
RB
72
225
SR
Jackson
TN
Jackson South Side HS
Bethel


38
Austin
Collier
RB
72
230
SO
Nashville
TN

Bethel


38
Jonathan
Stovall
RB
69
205
SO
Tullahoma
TN
Tullahoma HS
Carson-Newman


39
Blake
Lea
DB
73
195
JR
Mt. Juliet
TN
Wilson Central HS
Bethel


40
Marshall
Cooper
LB
72
225
JR
Hixson
TN
Hixson HS
Carson-Newman


42
Hawk
Schrider
LB
75
230
JR
Berkeley
CA
St. Mary's College
Richmond


55
Kyle
Miskelley
OL
73
295
JR
Trussville
AL

Minot State


58
Tyler
Cross
DL
74
285
JR
Douglasville
GA

Eastern Arizona


59
Jared
Nash
LS
72
215
JR
Fort Myers
FL
Fort Myers HS
Western Kentucky


62
Chris
Barnes
OL
75
288
SO
Leesburg
GA

Georgia


63
Dylan
Cole
OL
76
280
FR
Dalton
GA
Dalton HS
Tennessee Tech


66
Luke
Schultheiss
OL
75
280
SR
Canton
GA
Williamsburg
Louisville


67
Noah
Ramsey
OL
75
295
SO
Dalton
GA

Louisiana-Monroe


75
Harrison
Moon
OL
77
290
JR
Chattanooga
TN
Signal Mountain
Mississippi State


80
Cody
Swabek
WR
73
180
SR
Louisville
KY
Trinity HS
Louisville


83
Jordan
Giberti
TE
75
240
SO
Gainesville
FL
Gainesville HS
Tennessee Tech


84
Gage
Upshaw
TE
75
235
FR
Chattanooga
TN
Baylor School
Air Force Prep


96
Tristan
Mann
DL
74
235
JR
Tyrone
GA

Georgia Southern


31
31
31
31


31
31
31
22
31

[tenNesseeCat]

fubear, you might wanna take a look at our most updated roster, and update your socon OL numbers chart thing. it seems some of our fellas have been a eatin...

http://image.cdnllnwnl.xosnetwork.com/attachments1/files/12100/638307.pdf?DB_OEM_ID=12100&_ga=2.211215440.476031279.1534339079-873673703.1531917537

(http://image.cdnllnwnl.xosnetwork.com/attachments1/files/12100/638307.pdf?DB_OEM_ID=12100&_ga=2.211215440.476031279.1534339079-873673703.1531917537)

[Mocs123]

Of our transfers

7 are from Chattanooga (I know we offered at least 5 out of HS)

3 are recruited JUCOs (1 by Huesman, 2 by Arth)

1 from a prep school (we also offered him out of HS)

1 who was a UTC commit, flipped the day before signing day, coming to UTC after a redshirt year - I guess he felt like he made a mistake

At least 13 of these kids are walkons at UTC - most will play sparingly at best.

As as far as I can tell none of these kids got into trouble or had academic issues at their previous school.



Personally I liked Huesman’s approach of building a team with HS kids. He did take some kids from the Chattanooga area that wanted to come home. I also understand Arth picking up (for example: a JUCO RB to fill a big need for us this year) a transfer here and there to fill a specific need.

[PaladinFan]

Of our transfers

7 are from Chattanooga (I know we offered at least 5 out of HS)

3 are recruited JUCOs (1 by Huesman, 2 by Arth)

1 from a prep school (we also offered him out of HS)

1 who was a UTC commit, flipped the day before signing day, coming to UTC after a redshirt year - I guess he felt like he made a mistake

At least 13 of these kids are walkons at UTC - most will play sparingly at best.

As as far as I can tell none of these kids got into trouble or had academic issues at their previous school.



Personally I liked Huesman’s approach of building a team with HS kids. He did take some kids from the Chattanooga area that wanted to come home. I also understand Arth picking up (for example: a JUCO RB to fill a big need for us this year) a transfer here and there to fill a specific need.

My general thought is trying to build a roster through transfers is a bad idea. I think transfers are most useful when they fill one or two spots of need on a roster. If you are having to go hunt for wholesale ringers at multiple positions, you should probably look more closely at recruiting and what you are doing wrong. That's not specific to UTC, just a general statement.

I agree that a bunch of those guys are probably not pure transfers. They played at lower division schools and are likely walkons. They are transfers insofar as they played for another school last year, but perhaps not in the same way that we think of a transfer.

[Reign of Terrier]

Well, it really wouldn’t take all that long, would it?

Career Passing Statistics



GP
CMP
ATT
INT
YDS
TD
Long
%
AVG/P


2016
5
2
7
0
27
0
26
.29
3.9
5.4


2017
11
8
19
2
167
0
37
.42
8.8
15.2


Total
16
10
26
2
194
0
37
.38
7.5
12.1



C’mon...you can’t really make any kind of reasonable assessment from this limited career sample size. That’s why I mentioned watching him throw in warmups 3x last season. I guarantee I watched him throw more than 9 passes in warmups in each of those 3 games.

He may be amazing, but no one has seen enough of him throwing it, in games, in college, yet...to provide a well informed opinion...even you. Again, I am so impressed at his running capabilities that I wanted to get some kind of gauge of his throwing...and it did not look good. Goodson did, for the most part, and Mosley did, as well. That’s all I can go on...and it’s hardly sufficient.

I guess we’ll see when he goes 11-27-0 for 195 yards & 1 TD vs. El Cid...in game 1...surpassing almost all of his career cumulative totals. If he can do that every week, with his running skills, he will be the 1st Team All-SoCon QB. Sorry Samford Fans.

I guarantee he'll have a higher than 40% completion percentage.

[FUBeAR]

I guarantee he'll have a higher than 40% completion percentage.OK...well, 11-27 is 41%, which, as I noted, exceeds his current career completion % of 38%.

Your ”> 40% completion rate for Mr. Newman” opinion, expressed as a guarantee, is noted.

Questions...

1) Is it your opinion that Newman is the Starter vs. the bellhops on 9/1 and Mosley only plays if Newman is injured or the game is a rout?

2) If so, is it also your opinion that, barring injury to Mr. Newman, the QB participation structure, as described in Question 1, will continue until the end of Wofford’s 2018 season?

If your answer to either or both of the questions above is anything other than a purely unequivocal “Yes,” please describe, in your opinion, barring injuries, what the QB participation structure will be for Wofford this season.

[Milktruck74]

My general thought is trying to build a roster through transfers is a bad idea. I think transfers are most useful when they fill one or two spots of need on a roster. If you are having to go hunt for wholesale ringers at multiple positions, you should probably look more closely at recruiting and what you are doing wrong. That's not specific to UTC, just a general statement.

I agree that a bunch of those guys are probably not pure transfers. They played at lower division schools and are likely walkons. They are transfers insofar as they played for another school last year, but perhaps not in the same way that we think of a transfer.

I AGREE...MOSTLY...Not all transfers are the same. I don't like picking up problems from Big programs. You know, the SEC All Freshman that got kicked off the team and ends up at an FBS school next season is not the same as a kid who transfers back home because his grandmother is dying from cancer. I don't see too many of the former on our team.

[FUBeAR]

fubear, you might wanna take a look at our most updated roster, and update your socon OL numbers chart thing. it seems some of our fellas have been a eatin...

http://image.cdnllnwnl.xosnetwork.com/attachments1/files/12100/638307.pdf?DB_OEM_ID=12100&_ga=2.211215440.476031279.1534339079-873673703.1531917537

(http://image.cdnllnwnl.xosnetwork.com/attachments1/files/12100/638307.pdf?DB_OEM_ID=12100&_ga=2.211215440.476031279.1534339079-873673703.1531917537)

Done...WCU's REVISED OL Metrics
EDIT - Just noticed there were Height Changes too...and WCU's Starting OL got shorter since last year...Their average height is now down to 6' 4" making them the 5th Tallest Starting OL in the SoCon...tied with Mercer and ETSU. Only Wofford and The Citadel's Starting OLines are shorter.



Team
AVG Starting OL Height
AVG Starting OL Weight

AVG 2-Deep OL Height
AVG 2-Deep OL Weight

AVG ALL OL Height
AVG ALL OL Weight


WCU
6' 4"
306




6' 4"
297


1) Wow - an 18 LB AVERAGE increase on the OL - from 279 to 297...(almost) unbelievable

2) Starters jumped up an AVERAGE of 8 LBS - and are NOW...the 2nd heaviest Starting OL in the SoCon, behind Chattanooga

3) Samford's Roster Metrics Management Peeps..."Hold my beer..."


BTW - TC - can you tell your online peeps to update the website - wasn't easy pulling this stuff off that pdf. Yep - just have 'em dial up through that AOL connection they are using to Re-Create the WCU ATH Website and they can get those weights changed in no time...6 to 8 weeks or so.

[FUBeAR]

I agree that a bunch of those guys are probably not pure transfers. They played at lower division schools and are likely walkons. They are transfers insofar as they played for another school last year, but perhaps not in the same way that we think of a transfer.

19 Total D1 Transfers (16 FBS Transfers & 3 FCS Transfers)
3 JUCO Transfers
1 Prep School Transfer
8 “lower division school” Transfers

[Reign of Terrier]

OK...well, 11-27 is 41%, which, as I noted, exceeds his current career completion % of 38%.

Your ”> 40% completion rate for Mr. Newman” opinion, expressed as a guarantee, is noted.

Questions...

1) Is it your opinion that Newman is the Starter vs. the bellhops on 9/1 and Mosley only plays if Newman is injured or the game is a rout?

2) If so, is it also your opinion that, barring injury to Mr. Newman, the QB participation structure, as described in Question 1, will continue until the end of Wofford’s 2018 season?

If your answer to either or both of the questions above is anything other than a purely unequivocal “Yes,” please describe, in your opinion, barring injuries, what the QB participation structure will be for Wofford this season.

I think we'll see Moseley some. I think it's standard procedure to give good backup QBs a shot on the third possession. I'd say we'll see Newman in 70-80% of the time. Wofford has run dual-QB systems in the past and that's generally how it works and though we'll see changes in the approach since Ayers is no longer at the wheel, I have no reason to think it'll be much different.

There's lots of precedent in Wofford's history of splitting time and even having one QB come in to mix things up, and it's happened with QB's of varying passing ability. On the top of my head, Ben Widmyer was a better passer than Josh Collier in 2005-2008, but JC was the starter until he graduated in 2007. Widmeyer took over and was our best passer in the last 20 years (yes, better than Goodson). Meanwhile, Mitch Allen backed up Widmeyer and was an inferior passer but a much better runner. He came in and gave us a spark.

I imagine we're going to see something like one of the above with Newman/Mosley. The only thing that's frustrating about this methodology is that there are lots of circumstances where the coaching has either kept a QB that wasn't hot (I don't think Newman played against Mercer and that game was a cluster **** for 3 quarters) or blamed the QB for collective mistakes. A good example of the latter is the Samford game last year. We were moving the ball well, but not scoring because of turnovers. Those weren't Goodson's fault. Coaching staff took him out and Newman played great, but in a situation where we passed, he had that ill-advised throw that I don't think Goodson would have made.

I expect will see Mosley in enough to keep defenses honest. He's obviously a better passer than Newman but he can run some too. Both QBs I think are good enough to keep defenses off balance and if you brand one as the "passer" and one as the "runner" you'll get bit.

[FUBeAR]

I think we'll see Moseley some. I think it's standard procedure to give good backup QBs a shot on the third possession. I'd say we'll see Newman in 70-80% of the time. Wofford has run dual-QB systems in the past and that's generally how it works and though we'll see changes in the approach since Ayers is no longer at the wheel, I have no reason to think it'll be much different.

There's lots of precedent in Wofford's history of splitting time and even having one QB come in to mix things up, and it's happened with QB's of varying passing ability. On the top of my head, Ben Widmyer was a better passer than Josh Collier in 2005-2008, but JC was the starter until he graduated in 2007. Widmeyer took over and was our best passer in the last 20 years (yes, better than Goodson). Meanwhile, Mitch Allen backed up Widmeyer and was an inferior passer but a much better runner. He came in and gave us a spark.

I imagine we're going to see something like one of the above with Newman/Mosley. The only thing that's frustrating about this methodology is that there are lots of circumstances where the coaching has either kept a QB that wasn't hot (I don't think Newman played against Mercer and that game was a cluster **** for 3 quarters) or blamed the QB for collective mistakes. A good example of the latter is the Samford game last year. We were moving the ball well, but not scoring because of turnovers. Those weren't Goodson's fault. Coaching staff took him out and Newman played great, but in a situation where we passed, he had that ill-advised throw that I don't think Goodson would have made.

I expect will see Mosley in enough to keep defenses honest. He's obviously a better passer than Newman but he can run some too. Both QBs I think are good enough to keep defenses off balance and if you brand one as the "passer" and one as the "runner" you'll get bit.
Thanks - that’s pretty much what I expect also. The only thing is that I (with less faith in Newman’s passing ability than you have) think Mosley’s PT will increase as the season moves along...and I think Newman, as I believe he was mostly last season, will revert back to being that ‘change-up’ guy...and Defenses will know there’s a low (“low” NOT “no”) likelihood that he’s going to put it in the air. Maybe, like some of the WCU fans are predicting for Adams & Jones, and as Chatt did with Huesman & Robinson, we’ll them both on the field at the same time. Perhaps, we’ll even see the 1st-ever Double RPO System deployed!

[tenNesseeCat]

Maybe, like some of the WCU fans are predicting for Adams & Jones, and as Chatt did with Huesman & Robinson, we’ll them both on the field at the same time. Perhaps, we’ll even see the 1st-ever Double RPO System deployed!

That's like the 3rd time you've referenced this with WCU's offense for this year. I think you are more interested in this than any catamount fans. I could see Speir having it up his sleeve for a sneaky wrinkle, but nothing more. Most catamount fans just seem excited to have a high quality #2 QB with a bright future at WCU. It's Adam's job.

[PaladinFan]

Thanks - that’s pretty much what I expect also. The only thing is that I (with less faith in Newman’s passing ability than you have) think Mosley’s PT will increase as the season moves along...and I think Newman, as I believe he was mostly last season, will revert back to being that ‘change-up’ guy...and Defenses will know there’s a low (“low” NOT “no”) likelihood that he’s going to put it in the air. Maybe, like some of the WCU fans are predicting for Adams & Jones, and as Chatt did with Huesman & Robinson, we’ll them both on the field at the same time. Perhaps, we’ll even see the 1st-ever Double RPO System deployed!

I see it like you do. I think it will be Mosely with Newman as the changeup. If Newman is the primary guy, I don't think we'll see 20-25 throws a game.

[FUBeAR]

That's like the 3rd time you've referenced this with WCU's offense for this year. I think you are more interested in this than any catamount fans. I could see Speir having it up his sleeve for a sneaky wrinkle, but nothing more. Most catamount fans just seem excited to have a high quality #2 QB with a bright future at WCU. It's Adam's job.
C'mon - How cool would it be to see that behemoth OL split into 2 groups of 3 (including the TE) with Jones & Holloway behind the ball and 3 of them and Adams & Young behind the other 3 set to the field. Mathis is split to the boundary side. The ball is snapped to Jones who has an Run/Run/Pass/Lateral (quadruple) Option. He can hand it off to Holloway, keep it himself, or hit Mathis. If he doesn't like any of those options, he can lateral it across the field to Adams, who has 3 Options. He can run himself, hand it to Young, or pass to Cosenke (TE) or Mathis, who is continuing to run an adjusted route. 7 DIFFERENT OPTIONS on 1 Play - They wouldn't need any other plays - just that 1 - and no Defense could even hope to cover ALL of those options. I can't wait to see it!!!

[FUBeAR]

Hero Sports WCU Preview - https://herosports.com/fcs/football-2018-western-carolina-preview-preseason-ajaj

I think he meant this as an encouraging compliment...

"The defense could be helped out early by the offense being good for 40 points a game. If that happens, the defense will have time to grow and this could be quite a special year."

So...no worries, just go out and hang nearly half a hundred on Furman (2nd SoCon game) & Samford (3rd SoCon game)...and ALL IS WELL.



SCORING DEFENSE
G
TD
FG
XPT
2XP
DXP
Saf
Points
Avg/G


1.
Samford
8
17
5
16
0
0
0
133
16.6


2.
Furman
8
20
7
16
1
0
0
159
19.9






https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zDAmPIq29ro

[PaladinFan]

If one thing makes me nervous this season, its that WCU plays Furman early and does so after a really light opening schedule.

[Catamount87]

If one thing makes me nervous this season, its that WCU plays Furman early and does so after a really light opening schedule.

It makes me nervous because we have some holes to fill and Furman is more settled IMHO across the board. That pounding ground game against a defense that IMHO still needs some depth and better overall run defense.

[Milktruck74]

It makes me nervous because we have some holes to fill and Furman is more settled IMHO across the board. That pounding ground game against a defense that IMHO still needs some depth and better overall run defense.

If you have to play a pounding ground team with a lack of depth, best that is early when nobody is that banged up...

[PaladinFan]

It makes me nervous because we have some holes to fill and Furman is more settled IMHO across the board. That pounding ground game against a defense that IMHO still needs some depth and better overall run defense.

I do not disagree with those sentiments. I think the Paladins simply out bullied the Catamounts last season.

My concern is that while WCU is largely playing at home against a weak schedule, they can work in prep for Furman. Furman won't have that luxury, as they will be playing Clemson, two FCS playoff contenders, and a road game to ETSU.

[PaladinFan]

If you have to play a pounding ground team with a lack of depth, best that is early when nobody is that banged up...

As a football fan, it was a great game to watch last year (I say that as someone watching from home, of course). The weather was nasty and Furman just lined up and ran the fullback 40+ times. By the fourth quarter, WCU's defense had about all they wanted.

[Mocs123]

I’m not sure about every game last year, but I know Furman came in and bullied us. They were more physical on both sides of the ball. It looked more like the “old” Furman teams and we looked like the “old” Chattanooga teams - neither of which was a good thing for Chattanooga.

The defense didnt play play that bad last year overall considering that the offense was so bad, but our D didn’t make it out of the locker room for the Furman game.

[PaladinFan]

I’m not sure about every game last year, but I know Furman came in and bullied us. They were more physical on both sides of the ball. It looked more like the “old” Furman teams and we looked like the “old” Chattanooga teams - neither of which was a good thing for Chattanooga.

The defense didnt play play that bad last year overall considering that the offense was so bad, but our D didn’t make it out of the locker room for the Furman game.

Furman did that to a bunch of teams, not just UTC. As I've noted elsewhere, it wasn't really a matter of having superior athletes. It was a matter of just out executing teams and playing a physical brand of football.

The Paladins have a few holes to fill, but I think there can be improvement over last season's effort. Most of the OL returns, including all the reserves. Furman recruited more speed this offseason, and should go three deep with guys that can really run at key positions. Hopefully that will keep more aggressive defenses honest.

I think the biggest improvement this year will be Furman's defense. We were really young on that side of the ball last year and steadily improved as the season went on. We return virtually the entire two deep and have added more depth in behind those guys. Chad Staggs, Furman's DC, likes to play a downhill attacking style and, with that depth, can rotate a bunch of players and keep the pressure on for four quarters.

[FUBeAR]

Here's how the folks at STATS see the SoCon...http://www.fcs.football/cfb/story.asp?i=20180817114045481698604 (NOTE: It says "updated" 8/17 at the bottom - so this may have been posted previously...not sure...don't remember)

Following is a team-by-team breakdown of the 2018 SoCon race and STATS' predicted order of finish:
1. Samford
2. Wofford
3. Furman
4. Mercer
5. Chattanooga
6. Western Carolina
7. The Citadel
8. East Tennessee State
9. VMI

[FUBeAR]

Just noticed a couple of bellhops have gone "AWOL" from their roster since the last 'check' I did...

The 1st one...



27
Sean Dumas (http://citadelsports.com/roster.aspx?rp_id=4049)
DB
5-11
180
Fr.
New Orleans, La. / Archbishop Shaw



...is kind of 'curious' to me as he is also now not even listed on their online 2017 roster, even though he was one their 2018 online roster until very recently (as late as 7/27 for sure...maybe later)....but I found him listed on the online 2016 roster (from which the listing above was extracted) & that roster profile says this...

"REDSHIRT FRESHMAN (2017): Worked with the Bulldogs' scout team.
FRESHMAN (2016): Worked with the scout team while redshirting."

...but his 2017 Stats show this...
Career Defensive Statistics



Season
GP
UA
A
TOT
TFL
TFLY
PD
FF
FR
BLK


2017
11
2
5
7
0.0
0
1
0
0
0




....he Played in ALL 11 games, had 7 tackles and a pass deflection...that's a lot of game activity for a "Scout Team" Player. He is shown in their 2017 published stats, confirming the numbers above and he's also in their 2017 Game Notes. In fact, he's listed on the 2-Deep as the back-up "Rover" (Strong Safety) in all 11 games.

Back to this 'curious' one in a minute...the other one was a LB...



47
Jeremy Samuels (http://citadelsports.com/roster.aspx?rp_id=5425)
LB
6-0
230
Fr.
Winter Garden, Fla. / West Orange



...whose roster profile has the exact same wording as Mr. Dumas'

"REDSHIRT FRESHMAN (2017): Worked with the Bulldogs’ scout team.
FRESHMAN (2016): Worked with the scout team while redshirting."

Now Mr. Samuels does not show up in the Stats or the Game Notes (other than a roster listing)...so he was probably "with the Bulldogs' scout team" in 2017. So...probably not a major 'issue' as an unexpected departure.

....Back to Mr. Dumas...with his unexpected departure, I need to update my post of 7/27 (updates in bold)...

While the unexpected exodus of a number Players between 2016 & 2017 was rather well-publicized, I didn’t realize the bellhops also have a rather significant number of expected returnees from their 2017 depth chart who no longer appear on their online roster, particularly on Defense. I counted...

2 - 2nd Team OLinemen - a rising Sr. & Soph.
2 - 2nd Team DLinemen - a rising Soph & R-Soph
2 - Starting OLB’s - both rising Sr.’s & 1 of those also CIT’s top KO Returner
1 - 2nd Team OLB - a rising Soph
1 - 2nd Team CB - a rising Soph
1 - 2nd Team Safety - a rising R-Soph

So, 9 additional, unexpected losses off the 2-Deep; 7 of those on Defense. Add those 7 to the 7 ‘expected’ losses on the D 2-Deep and CIT is left with only 8 of their 2017 Top 22 on D returning this season.
* Only 2 of 8 in the Secondary, with 1 Starter.
* Only 4 of 8 LB’s, with 2 Starters
* Only 2 of 6 on the DL, but both of of those 2 are Returning Starters

Returning only 5 Starters on D isn’t great, but it’s not ‘the end of the world.’ On the other hand, only having 8 Players on the Defensive 2-Deep with any real college experience could be devastating in a “pivotal”...or maybe, “critical” season.

Hey Woffy...here's a hint: THROW IT!

....and I might have to change my projection in that game.

[Purpleglasses]

FUBeAR, that stats link is sloppy work by them. Check out their key returning players for Chatt.
Coleman has been gone for weeks.

[FUBeAR]

This SoCon Preview (Part 1 of 2) is written by long-time, former Greenville News Sportswriter, Scott Keeler. As this was published on the Official SoCon website, I guess we can consider it the 'Official' SoCon preview...

http://www.soconsports.com/ViewArticle.dbml?DB_OEM_ID=4000&ATCLID=211768419 - PART 1

CIT, ETSU, FU, MU, and SU covered in Part 1. Previews for Chatt (guess he's using Tennessee-Chatt. to alphabetize), VMI, WCU, and WC to follow in Part 2.

http://www.soconsports.com/ViewArticle.dbml?DB_OEM_ID=4000&ATCLID=211768569 - PART 2

Oddly enough...I decided to make a table of the "Returning Starters" data he's deduced...



Team
Offense
(6 or > = +)
Defense
(6 or > = +)
Total O & D
(12 or > = +)
Specialists
(3 or > = +)
Total
(15 or > = +)
+ or -


SU
10 (+)
6 (+)
16 (+)
4 (+)
20 (+)
+++++ = 5 +'s


ETSU
7 (+)
8 (+)
15 (+)
4 (+)
19 (+)
+++++ = 5 +'s


MU
7 (+)
8 (+)
15 (+)
3 (+)
18 (+)
+++++ = 5 +'s


Chatt
7 (+)
7 (+)
14 (+)
2 (-)
16 (+)
+++-+ =
4 +’s


CIT
9 (+)
4 (-)
13 (+)
3 (+)
16 (+)
+-+++ = 4+'s


VMI
7 (+)
5 (-)
12 (+)
3 (+)
15 (+)
+-+++ =
4 +’s


FU
5 (-)
9 (+)
14 (+)
1 (-)
15 (+)
-++-+ =
3 +'s


WCU
7 (+)
3 (-)
10 (-)
3 (+)
13 (-)
+--+- =
2 +’s


WC
5 (-)
6 (+)
11 (-)
2 (-)
13 (-)
-+ - - - =
1 +



Y’all can keep tellin’ me that WCU & Wofford have no concerns about their number of returning Starters, but when you stack it up like this, the comparisons just tell me they have HUGE question marks.

[PaladinFan]

I think if you are going to total them up, then there has to be a bit more in the analysis.

Your list (or Keeler’s) says Furman returns 1 specialist. Furman did graduate Jon Croft Hollingsworth, who lost his placekicking duties to Grayson Atkins but punted for Furman last season.

Other than that, the Paladins return their kicker (Atkins), holder (Roberts), snapper (Vaughan), top punt returner (Gordon), and most of the guys that returned kicks.

I’m not sure how he gets “1” returning specialist unless he takes a narrow view of that “position” to include just punters/kickers. Maybe you can count Hollingsworth as two lost starters because he also handled kickoffs.

[PaladinNation]

Furman returning only six players on offense is a little deceptive… granted the Dins have some big shoes to fill (Blaze, Wilcox, Schmidt, Bush, Schumpert, McCarter).

Dirks replaces Wilcox — Dirks is more explosive but can get dinged up. The Dins get a depth boost with 6-0 224 Deon Sanders ready to play this season. Sanders is a bit of a different player than Dirks - Sanders has excellent receiving skills. Carson Maples 5-11 240 should also get PT an AFA transfer.

Maybe I should be — but I'm not concerned about replacing Schmidt and Bush, both great players. As others have mentioned (Bear) Lusk is proving to be a great offensive line coach. Reed Kroeber replaces Schmidt and Jordan Harris replaces Bush.

Schumpert had a great season — his backup and now the starting tight end Jake Walker IMO is the most underrated starter for Furman. At 6-4 233 Walker can run routes like a wide-out, I'd bet Coach Quarles finds some interesting ways to get the ball in Walker's hands.

McCarter was a dependable quality wideout — nothing against Logan but sophomore Cam Burnette could have started as a true freshman. Cam is now 6-2 205, Burnette and Gordo make a dynamic duo, again I think Furman's receiving corps is underrated.

The big shoes to fill Blaze… I thought it was a battle between Harris Roberts and Jemar Lincoln. Not so fast, later today will be the Dins first public scrimmage. I'll go out on a limb — I think Hamp Sisson makes this a three-way battle to replace the Blaze.

[FUBeAR]

In this (apparent) race to early deaths from arteriosclerosis and to a complete lack of OLine athleticism, Chattanooga has updated their roster weights...

Below are the 3 front-runners in the SoCon Arms, er, I mean, Belly, Race...



Team
AVG Starting OL Height
AVG Starting OL Weight

AVG 2-Deep OL Height
AVG 2-Deep OL Weight

AVG ALL OL Height
AVG ALL OL Weight


Chattanooga
6' 5"
311

6' 5"
301

6' 4"
296


Samford
6' 6"*
301




6' 4"
279


WCU
6' 4"
306




6' 4"
297













Alabama
6' 5"
313

6' 4"
308

6' 4"
310


Georgia
6' 4"
310

6' 4"
311

6' 5"
313





These numbers will stand until the next online roster update...probably later today.

My money is on Samford to fire the next round in this 'contest.'


EDITED FOR FUBeAR RANTING PURPOSES: I added a couple of other Teams to this Table, using their 2-Deeps from last year's FBS National Championship Game.

So...depending on one's perspective, I guess it could be concluded that...

A) See...these SoCon schools are on the right track. They should emulate the metrics of the best FBS programs when it comes to OLmen and they are sure doing that. Heck, Chatt's O-Line is bigger than Georgia's!!!

OR

B) There are approximately 120 FBS Football Teams (I Like round numbers). Not always, but, as a general rule, kids are going to take an FBS Offer over an FCS Offer. There are about 20 OLmen on typical rosters (this is high...but I like round numbers). That means there are 2,400 OLmen on FBS Rosters. If I'm Coaching an OLine, I sure do not want the 2,401 best OLman, who happens to be 6'5" 305, on my Team over the BEST OLman that is 6' 3" 280. Give me the Kids who can PLAY vs. those that only look like they should be on the field in Tuscaloosa or Athens.

I firmly believe that FCS Coaches are, IN GENERAL, out there recruiting the #2,401 - #4,800 OLmen who are 6' 5" 305 (or so) and passing on the #1 - #2400 OLmen who are 6' 3" 280 (or so)...so that they can say they are winning this "Belly Race" and tell their Fans that they are "Bigger than Georgia!" I think that's a shame...and I also think that mentality has caused a RAFT of horrible OL Play that we see in FCS these days.

Though it may seem to be, the above is NOT a specific RANT against Chatt, WCU, and/or Samford. It's a RANT against (almost) ALL of 'em - not just SoCon either...ALL of FCS.

[PaladinFan]

This is a good write up on Furman's receiver group. http://furmanpaladins.com/sports/m-footbl/2018-19/releases/20180817q806jf

In my opinion, this will be the great equalizer for the Paladins this year. Furman is definitely a "run first" team, but threw it as well last year as any team in the league other than Samford (who is an outlier given their volume). I look at this receiver group and think it could be Furman's best since 2004 (Isaac West and Brian Bratton).

Thomas Gordon is one of the best receivers in the league and averaged nearly 20 yards per catch last season. I think Cam Burnette, at 6'2 210 lbs, is going to be a matchup nightmare for defenses given his size and speed. One difference this year is the addition of the diminutive Dejuan Bell, who by all accounts is lightning fast and catches everything in his zip code. When you watch his high school film, you see flashes of Jayson Foster and Davon Fowlkes in his ability to change direction in space and beat a defense to the spot.

Furman's offense moves receivers in and out of the formation to create matchup problems. There are three guys that can legitimately take the top off the defense. I think that will make defensive coordinators think twice before moving a safety into the box against Furman's run game.

[SU DOG]

In this (apparent) race to early deaths from arteriosclerosis and to a complete lack of OLine athleticism, Chattanooga has updated their roster weights...

Below are the 3 front-runners in the SoCon Arms, er, I mean, Belly, Race...



Team
AVG Starting OL Height
AVG Starting OL Weight

AVG 2-Deep OL Height
AVG 2-Deep OL Weight

AVG ALL OL Height
AVG ALL OL Weight


Chattanooga
6' 5"
311

6' 5"
301

6' 4"
296


Samford
6' 6"*
301




6' 4"
279


WCU
6' 4"
306




6' 4"
297




These numbers will stand until the next online roster update...probably later today.

My money is on Samford to fire the next round in this 'contest.'








IDK Matthew Pittarelli is having one heck of a fall camp. He will be pushing for a starting spot on that O-Line. He will certainly get lots of PT. He is 6-6, but is listed as 245 pounds. If he starts, that will bring that average weight way down. Doesn't matter to me, it's the blocking, NOT the weight that counts.

[FUBeAR]

IDK Matthew Pittarelli is having one heck of a fall camp. He will be pushing for a starting spot on that O-Line. He will certainly get lots of PT. He is 6-6, but is listed as 245 pounds. If he starts, that will bring that average weight way down. Doesn't matter to me, it's the blocking, NOT the weight that counts.
Good to know. Thanks!

I’ll watch for the online roster change “correcting” his weight to 285+ if he does become a Starter.

[SU DOG]

Good to know. Thanks!

I’ll watch for the online roster change “correcting” his weight to 285+ if he does become a Starter.

That will be a LONG watch. Won't happen.

[longtimemocfan]

FUBeAR, that stats link is sloppy work by them. Check out their key returning players for Chatt.
Coleman has been gone for weeks.


He was actually ineligible after the Spring semester and had fallen to third on the depth chart following Spring practice.

[FUBeAR]

FYI - I added a link to Part 2 of Scott Keeler's SoCon Preview and updated/re-sorted the "Returning Starters" data that Mr. Keeler derived in Post #300 in this thread

[PaladinFan]

Furman ran their first scrimmage yesterday. Sounds like the head ball coach wasn't terribly happy with it. https://youtu.be/Gk6IEXl7d9k

Of course, I've never heard a head coach glow about the squad's first scrimmage.

[Milktruck74]

In this (apparent) race to early deaths from arteriosclerosis and to a complete lack of OLine athleticism, Chattanooga has updated their roster weights...

Below are the 3 front-runners in the SoCon Arms, er, I mean, Belly, Race...



Team
AVG Starting OL Height
AVG Starting OL Weight

AVG 2-Deep OL Height
AVG 2-Deep OL Weight

AVG ALL OL Height
AVG ALL OL Weight


Chattanooga
6' 5"
311

6' 5"
301

6' 4"
296


Samford
6' 6"*
301




6' 4"
279


WCU
6' 4"
306




6' 4"
297













Alabama
6' 5"
313

6' 4"
308





Georgia
6' 4"
310

6' 4"
311







These numbers will stand until the next online roster update...probably later today.

My money is on Samford to fire the next round in this 'contest.'


EDITED FOR FUBeAR RANTING PURPOSES: I added a couple of other Teams to this Table, using their 2-Deeps from last year's FBS National Championship Game.

So...depending on one's perspective, I guess it could be concluded that...

A) See...these SoCon schools are on the right track. They should emulate the metrics of the best FBS programs when it comes to OLmen and they are sure doing that. Heck, Chatt's O-Line is bigger than Georgia's!!!

OR

B) There are approximately 120 FBS Football Teams (I Like round numbers). Not always, but, as a general rule, kids are going to take an FBS Offer over an FCS Offer. There are about 20 OLmen on typical rosters (this is high...but I like round numbers). That means there are 2,400 OLmen on FBS Rosters. If I'm Coaching an OLine, I sure do not want the 2,401 best OLman, who happens to be 6'5" 305, on my Team over the BEST OLman that is 6' 3" 280. Give me the Kids who can PLAY vs. those that only look like they should be on the field in Tuscaloosa or Athens.

I firmly believe that FCS Coaches are, IN GENERAL, out there recruiting the #2,401 - #4,800 OLmen who are 6' 5" 305 (or so) and passing on the #1 - #2400 OLmen who are 6' 3" 280 (or so)...so that they can say they are winning this "Belly Race" and tell their Fans that they are "Bigger than Georgia!" I think that's a shame...and I also think that mentality has caused a RAFT of horrible OL Play that we see in FCS these days.

Though it may seem to be, the above is NOT a specific RANT against Chatt, WCU, and/or Samford. It's a RANT against (almost) ALL of 'em - not just SoCon either...ALL of FCS.

The problem with your "average" is the input is such a small sample (only5), one man can skew the numbers drastically. The Mocs Recruited McClendon Curtis who took a RS last season. He entered school at 6'8" or ^'9" (depending on who was holding the tape) and 360#. HE would have changed the entire number....HE did bust his ass last year and dropped 40#...but still his height, kicks the average up quite a bit for the Mocs. I also think the Option teams do not want or need Big men, they need quick and consistent....that guard that can still pull and kick out a DE on the 9th play of a drive in the 4th qtr....generally a 310# man may have a little trouble with that at that point. SO, Yes...we are big, but what does that mean?

[kdinva]

VMI's 2nd scrimmage

http://www.vmikeydets.com/ViewArticle.dbml?DB_OEM_ID=9800&ATCLID=211768604 (http://www.vmikeydets.com/ViewArticle.dbml?DB_OEM_ID=9800&ATCLID=211768604)

[tenNesseeCat]

Some of our fr and r-fr OL

6'4" 265
6'3" 285
6'4" 285
6'2" 265
6'4" 285

We have a few over 300 but it looks like we have a good mix in the freshman class. Also, 4 of our guys listed over 300 are r-sr. That's 22-23 year old men vs 18 year old boys.
It seems like there is a presumption that a 285 guy is better than one at 310 for some reason. Also, that all fbs OL are better than all fcs OL. Western has a 300+ fr that chose us over coastal and was looked at by Virginia. Does that make him not as good just because of his decision to go fcs instead of fbs? Is it better to "build" a 260 fr into a 290 lb sr or "build" a 325 lb fr into a 310 lb sr? Just because a fella is an fcs OL that's 300+ doesn't mean he's the can of corn guy from the longest yard.

[tenNesseeCat]

28493

[FUBeAR]

It seems like there is a presumption that a 285 guy is better than one at 310 for some reason.

Notwithstanding the fact that you, apparently, overlooked the terms "as a general rule" and "IN GENERAL" (bolded & ALL CAPS) in my post, if your takeaway from what I wrote is what is shown above, then I did a HORRIBLE job of communicating my message.

BRIEFLY & (I hope) SIMPLY...

1) I believe that the #1 BEST 6-3/285 HS OLman is a far better Player than the #2401 best 6-5/305 HS OLman.
2) I believe many/most FCS Coaches would prefer to recruit the #2401 best 6-5/305 OLman over the #1 BEST 6-3/285 OLman
3) I think this is a shame
4) I think this mentality has led to AWFUL O-Line Play, especially in FCS Football

*In the examples above, "#1" and "#2401" and "6-3/285" and "6-5/305" are used for the purpose of illustrating a broad concept.

[tenNesseeCat]

I didn't miss any of your generalities. I'm just sayin that i would think most fcs coaches can judge players abilities. Therefore they too would rather have a 280 lb guy who can play over a 315 lb guy who is just big. I also think they would rather have a 315 guy who can play over a 280 lb guy who can play. I think they also bring on some projects oversized or undersized. Try to "work" them into what they need them to be. You say wcu, samford, and utc are in a belly race, but maybe they just landed some big players. In the case of wcu and samford, i think their recent offensive production supports that.

[FUBeAR]

I didn't miss any of your generalities. I'm just sayin that i would think most fcs coaches can judge players abilities. Therefore they too would rather have a 280 lb guy who can play over a 315 lb guy who is just big. I also think they would rather have a 315 guy who can play over a 280 lb guy who can play. I think they also bring on some projects oversized or undersized. Try to "work" them into what they need them to be. You say wcu, samford, and utc are in a belly race, but maybe they just landed some big players. In the case of wcu and samford, i think their recent offensive production supports that.
No. I said they are (almost) ALL in a race & those 3 are the current SoCon ‘leaders.’

“the above is NOT a specific RANT against Chatt, WCU, and/or Samford. It's a RANT against (almost) ALL of 'em - not just SoCon either...ALL of FCS.”

I’m assuming you are familiar with the psychological concept of “groupthink.” I believe that is what has taken over OLine ‘theory’ and is causing Coaches to recruit the best OL players they can get OF A CERTAIN SIZE, rather than the best OL players they can get.

But...this conversation is fairly pointless because, as evidenced by the multiple mischaracterizations of what I’ve (fairly) clearly stated, you seem to think you are (or have to be) ‘playing defense,’ which is keeping you from considering my position objectively. No worries, it’s a bit nuanced & I’ve expounded upon & defended it over many beers & many hours. This forum is probably not the best format in which to ‘try the case.’ So, this is the OFFICIAL end of my ‘Rant.’

BTW - I had the opportunity to view some end zone video of a recent WCU practice & thought Kaleb Spry looked very good in there at the Center position. At 6-3/305, if he plays this season like he looked on the video & barring injury (of course), I think he’ll have a shot to be in somebody’s NFL camp next Fall.

not the vid I was referring to, but here’s a nice vid of some of WCU’s 3rd scrimmage with multiple Player & Coach interviews...

http://www.catamountsports.com/mediaPortal/player.dbml?&db_oem_id=12100&id=6284398

[PaladinFan]

I didn't miss any of your generalities. I'm just sayin that i would think most fcs coaches can judge players abilities. Therefore they too would rather have a 280 lb guy who can play over a 315 lb guy who is just big. I also think they would rather have a 315 guy who can play over a 280 lb guy who can play. I think they also bring on some projects oversized or undersized. Try to "work" them into what they need them to be. You say wcu, samford, and utc are in a belly race, but maybe they just landed some big players. In the case of wcu and samford, i think their recent offensive production supports that.

A lot of it is relative, though I think there are some truisms.

Most coaches, I think, would prefer a bigger guy that can play over a smaller guy that can play if everything is equal. At the FCS level, though, teams are looking for market inefficiencies because most of our recruiting pool are guys that slide past the big programs. A 6'7 315 pounder gorilla who can do everything likely isn't going slip past those programs. So, FCS teams are often looking for guys that are a little shorter, slower, lighter, heavier, etc. than the ideal player.

That said, a lot of SoCon schools are looking for different characteristics. Samford's linemen are going to play a different sort of game than the Citadel's. A guy that fits one roster may not fit the other. Furman, for instance, has no interest in 300+ linemen. When Hendrix took over we had a number of 300+ pounders that immediately slimmed down to 280-290.

If you look at Furman's offensive line, a lot of these guys are built like big TEs. There's not much fat on them. That's how Hendrix wants things. Every coach wants it a little different.

https://twitter.com/PaladinFootball/status/1029417350884478978

[FUBeAR]

I think we'll see Moseley some. I think it's standard procedure to give good backup QBs a shot on the third possession. I'd say we'll see Newman in 70-80% of the time. Wofford has run dual-QB systems in the past and that's generally how it works and though we'll see changes in the approach since Ayers is no longer at the wheel, I have no reason to think it'll be much different.

There's lots of precedent in Wofford's history of splitting time and even having one QB come in to mix things up, and it's happened with QB's of varying passing ability. On the top of my head, Ben Widmyer was a better passer than Josh Collier in 2005-2008, but JC was the starter until he graduated in 2007. Widmeyer took over and was our best passer in the last 20 years (yes, better than Goodson). Meanwhile, Mitch Allen backed up Widmeyer and was an inferior passer but a much better runner. He came in and gave us a spark.

I imagine we're going to see something like one of the above with Newman/Mosley. The only thing that's frustrating about this methodology is that there are lots of circumstances where the coaching has either kept a QB that wasn't hot (I don't think Newman played against Mercer and that game was a cluster **** for 3 quarters) or blamed the QB for collective mistakes. A good example of the latter is the Samford game last year. We were moving the ball well, but not scoring because of turnovers. Those weren't Goodson's fault. Coaching staff took him out and Newman played great, but in a situation where we passed, he had that ill-advised throw that I don't think Goodson would have made.

I expect will see Mosley in enough to keep defenses honest. He's obviously a better passer than Newman but he can run some too. Both QBs I think are good enough to keep defenses off balance and if you brand one as the "passer" and one as the "runner" you'll get bit.
Looks like Woffy, at present, is likely to split time between the 2 QB’s

http://www.goupstate.com/news/20180819/quarterbacks-newman-mosley-both-expected-to-steer-wofford-offense

[tenNesseeCat]

No. I said they are (almost) ALL in a race & those 3 are the current SoCon ‘leaders.’

“the above is NOT a specific RANT against Chatt, WCU, and/or Samford. It's a RANT against (almost) ALL of 'em - not just SoCon either...ALL of FCS.”

I’m assuming you are familiar with the psychological concept of “groupthink.” I believe that is what has taken over OLine ‘theory’ and is causing Coaches to recruit the best OL players they can get OF A CERTAIN SIZE, rather than the best OL players they can get.

But...this conversation is fairly pointless because, as evidenced by the multiple mischaracterizations of what I’ve (fairly) clearly stated, you seem to think you are (or have to be) ‘playing defense,’ which is keeping you from considering my position objectively. No worries, it’s a bit nuanced & I’ve expounded upon & defended it over many beers & many hours. This forum is probably not the best format in which to ‘try the case.’ So, this is the OFFICIAL end of my ‘Rant.’

BTW - I had the opportunity to view some end zone video of a recent WCU practice & thought Kaleb Spry looked very good in there at the Center position. At 6-3/305, if he plays this season like he looked on the video & barring injury (of course), I think he’ll have a shot to be in somebody’s NFL camp next Fall.

not the vid I was referring to, but here’s a nice vid of some of WCU’s 3rd scrimmage with multiple Player & Coach interviews...

http://www.catamountsports.com/mediaPortal/player.dbml?&db_oem_id=12100&id=6284398


I AM considering your view...and I agree to an extent, but not wholeheartedly. That's why I mentioned a few other points. I'm not playing any defense, just presenting a differing opinion. No need to call the exchange pointless when I've made multiple points. You stated you've had to play defense for your position over many beers and hours, but I'm the one playing defense? I listed some of the WCU players because I'm a fan and I know their roster better than portland st., not because I thought you were attacking WCU. However, what I have seen on other rosters is similar to WCU. Some big guys and smaller guys. The point I'm trying to make is, maybe, just maybe, the 6'1" 255 lb center that Speir could have considered giving a scholarship to instead of Spry, just wasn't as good. Maybe everything else was equal and our staff thought they could do more with his size in our system. As paladinfan stated, and I've tried to as well, maybe he fit what WCU needed. Maybe he got the offer, not just because he's big. Maybe he's actually pretty good, as you alluded. If it happens at WCU for 4 of our probable starting 5 being over 300, I'm sure it happens at Samford, or UTC, or Central Arkansas. Maybe, there's a flaw in your "groupthink" general theory. As I was trying to point out before, WCU fit some of what you were claiming, except they have a good mix, as I stated. Maybe they are giving both types of guys a chance, and for WCU, alot of the bigger guys are winning out. Maybe for some of the other teams I've mentioned as well. I'll also add that, not because I feel the need to play defense, but because I think WCU is bucking the trend you speak of, and they are the team I know the best. Our Stats AA OL Weeks has worked his way up to 290 as a R-Sr, and is one of the best OL in the conference. As I tried to show before, I think there are a wide variety of guys getting shots.

[PaladinFan]

I AM considering your view...and I agree to an extent, but not wholeheartedly. That's why I mentioned a few other points. I'm not playing any defense, just presenting a differing opinion. No need to call the exchange pointless when I've made multiple points. You stated you've had to play defense for your position over many beers and hours, but I'm the one playing defense? I listed some of the WCU players because I'm a fan and I know their roster better than portland st., not because I thought you were attacking WCU. However, what I have seen on other rosters is similar to WCU. Some big guys and smaller guys. The point I'm trying to make is, maybe, just maybe, the 6'1" 255 lb center that Speir could have considered giving a scholarship to instead of Spry, just wasn't as good. Maybe everything else was equal and our staff thought they could do more with his size in our system. As paladinfan stated, and I've tried to as well, maybe he fit what WCU needed. Maybe he got the offer, not just because he's big. Maybe he's actually pretty good, as you alluded. If it happens at WCU for 4 of our probable starting 5 being over 300, I'm sure it happens at Samford, or UTC, or Central Arkansas. Maybe, there's a flaw in your "groupthink" general theory. As I was trying to point out before, WCU fit some of what you were claiming, except they have a good mix, as I stated. Maybe they are giving both types of guys a chance, and for WCU, alot of the bigger guys are winning out. Maybe for some of the other teams I've mentioned as well. I'll also add that, not because I feel the need to play defense, but because I think WCU is bucking the trend you speak of, and they are the team I know the best. Our Stats AA OL Weeks has worked his way up to 290 as a R-Sr, and is one of the best OL in the conference. As I tried to show before, I think there are a wide variety of guys getting shots.

Also, these weights are, in a way, artificial.

College programs have a desired weight for players, and player seek to maintain that weight. This is particularly true with the offensive line, many of whom are asked to add significant weight. While most of these men are big, they are not, in non-football life, THAT big.

As an example, a good friend of mine was an OT at Troy. In his playing days, he was 6'6 315. Today, he's still every bit of 6'6, but is a lean 250. Same guy. 250 is his natural weight. The program wanted him at 315, so that's where he was.

Point being, the exact same player could play for two different college programs and be asked to physically look different.

Actually, we have another good example of that. Tim Coleman was Furman's starting LT in 2016 as a true freshman. He was listed at 6'4 285. He transferred to Richmond and is now listed at 6'4 300. Same guy, 20 pounds heavier. There's virtually no chance he'd be 300 pounds if still at Furman. Different programs have different requirements.

[kdinva]

FootballScoop.com claims UTC's assoc. head coach has left for UT-Knxville.........very strange.......any news from Moc-land as to "why"?

http://footballscoop.com/the-scoop/


Tennessee: Sources confirm to FootballScoop University of Tennessee Chattanooga assistant head coach / outside linebackers Shelton Felton is stepping down and will join Jeremy Pruitt’s staff at Tennessee.

[FUBeAR]

FootballScoop.com claims UTC's assoc. head coach has left for UT-Knxville.........very strange.......any news from Moc-land as to "why"?

http://footballscoop.com/the-scoop/I would guess this to be true, based on a few posts on the Mocs Board. They have a thread for fans to ask the TFP Mocs ‘beat writer’ questions & one poster asked 2x, “Where’s Felton?” The writer finally responded that he would not comment and that it “was nothing bad.”

Nothing bad for Coach Felton & for the Vols, I assume he meant....cagily.

Hard to call, losing their LB Coach & Asst HC 2 weeks before the season starts, anything but BAD for the Mocs.

[tenNesseeCat]

Also, these weights are, in a way, artificial.

College programs have a desired weight for players, and player seek to maintain that weight. This is particularly true with the offensive line, many of whom are asked to add significant weight. While most of these men are big, they are not, in non-football life, THAT big.

As an example, a good friend of mine was an OT at Troy. In his playing days, he was 6'6 315. Today, he's still every bit of 6'6, but is a lean 250. Same guy. 250 is his natural weight. The program wanted him at 315, so that's where he was.

Point being, the exact same player could play for two different college programs and be asked to physically look different.

Actually, we have another good example of that. Tim Coleman was Furman's starting LT in 2016 as a true freshman. He was listed at 6'4 285. He transferred to Richmond and is now listed at 6'4 300. Same guy, 20 pounds heavier. There's virtually no chance he'd be 300 pounds if still at Furman. Different programs have different requirements.

I had a friend that played college OL. Worked hard to be a starter at 6'6" 265-270 by jr-sr years. He struggled to get big enough, and was never fat. I visited him for a game and got to eat with the team after the game. It was kinda crazy to see the amount of consumption, between him and his OL buddies, needed to sustain their body given the physical demand of lifting, practicing, and playing. He probably runs about 245 now and had to start changing his diet and workouts to get there. He'd always been a big eater, so dieting wasn't his thing. It was a lifestyle change from the OL life he'd known, since middle school really. Can't eat like that when you aren't constantly lifting and practicing.

Jordan Gross is another example. It's crazy to see the difference when a human isn't working their tails off at the table and the wieght room, vs when they were.

https://www.bing.com/th?id=OIP.FYfpko9kXQIOjC21TRujjwHaEo&w=300&h=187&c=7&o=5&pid=1.7

[PaladinNation]

All this talk of 300 pounders…on defense Furman doesn't have anyone close to that size. I know Wofford has some big d-linemen — it doesn't appear to be a strategy for Staggs. I'd say Furman has greatly improved its athletic ability on the defensive line. Note: Furman only has two seniors at the three d-line positions.

NG
Reid 5-11 278 SR
Stokes 6-1 270 SO
Coleman 6-3 285 FR
Taylor 6-1 257 SO
Furman loses zero - rotating Reid and Stokes if Coleman continues to develop Furman could have a three-man rotation at NG.

DT
Tibbs 6-3 274 JR
Hodge 5-9 255 FR
Sochovka 6-4 265 RSFR
Tibbs appears to have added weight and muscle, Hodge is the wildcard - he played a lot in the first scrimmage.

DE
Okonya 6-2 245 SR
Lawrence 6-3 255 SO
Hanff 6-4 243 JR
Seabrook 6-3 242 SO
If I'm guessing Okonya is a 250+ DE, this is easily the position with the most depth. Staggs now has four players to rotate, keep an eye out for Lawrence. Lawrence moved over from DT last season.

[PaladinFan]

All this talk of 300 pounders…on defense Furman doesn't have anyone close to that size. I know Wofford has some big d-linemen — it doesn't appear to be a strategy for Staggs. I'd say Furman has greatly improved its athletic ability on the defensive line. Note: Furman only has two seniors at the three d-line positions.

NG
Reid 5-11 278 SR
Stokes 6-1 270 SO
Coleman 6-3 285 FR
Taylor 6-1 257 SO
Furman loses zero - rotating Reid and Stokes if Coleman continues to develop Furman could have a three-man rotation at NG.

DT
Tibbs 6-3 274 JR
Hodge 5-9 255 FR
Sochovka 6-4 265 RSFR
Tibbs appears to have added weight and muscle, Hodge is the wildcard - he played a lot in the first scrimmage.

DE
Okonya 6-2 245 SR
Lawrence 6-3 255 SO
Hanff 6-4 243 JR
Seabrook 6-3 242 SO
If I'm guessing Okonya is a 250+ DE, this is easily the position with the most depth. Staggs now has four players to rotate, keep an eye out for Lawrence. Lawrence moved over from DT last season.


Furman appears to prefer their defensive linemen play more of a 1 gap technique. I presume this is to satisfy Coach Staggs' penchant for pressuring the backfield. Smaller and quicker linemen who will try to turn the offensive line and get them stepping the wrong direction.

I expect Furman's defense this year to be incredibly active in terms of putting pressure on the offense. They are much deeper at CB than they were a year ago, and that should free up some extra rushers and coverage looks.

[SU DOG]

There's lots of good points stated in these posts, but nothing is or even can be proven, as the parameter is just too great. I won't try to prove anything, but I just thought it would be interesting to see what the 2 current national champions(and best teams overall for several years) of D-1 football last year listed for their O-Lines. If my quick look-up is accurate:

NDSU - Average weight 303 pounds and just over 6-4.

Bama - Average weight 307 pounds and 6-5.

Not a tremendous difference you notice, BUT the Bama group consisted of one 3*** one 5***** and three 4**** Relevance of stars arguments not for this discussion.:)

[PaladinFan]

There's lots of good points stated in these posts, but nothing is or even can be proven, as the parameter is just too great. I won't try to prove anything, but I just thought it would be interesting to see what the 2 current national champions(and best teams overall for several years) of D-1 football last year listed for their O-Lines. If my quick look-up is accurate:

NDSU - Average weight 303 pounds and just over 6-4.

Bama - Average weight 307 pounds and 6-5.

Not a tremendous difference you notice, BUT the Bama group consisted of one 3*** one 5***** and three 4**** Relevance of stars arguments not for this discussion.:)

Some guys can also slip through the cracks.

Dakota Dozier, who is arguably the best offensive linemen in SoCon's history (44 starts, 3x All SoCon, 2x All American) was unranked by recruiting services and has now been in the NFL for 5 seasons.

[FUBeAR]

Dakota Dozier, who is arguably the best offensive linemen in SoCon's historyThis SoCon Jacobs Blocking Trophy winning Offensive Guard, 15 year NFL veteran, Super Bowl Champion, Super Bowl MVP, 6-time Pro Bowler, should-be-in-the-NFL-Hall-of-Famer may want to “argue” that point with you.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chuck_Howley

I wouldn’t argue with him...even if he is 82, but you feel free to have at it!

And, if you include TE’s, SoCon Jacobs Blocking Trophy winning, 14 year NFL veteran, 3 time Pro Bowler, Green Bay Packers’ Hall of Fame Member, and 2 time Super Bowl Champion, Carroll Dale, might like a word or 2 with you also.

[FUBeAR]

I thought this video was ‘cute.’ Mercer seems to have done even more ‘grass roots’ PR in Macon this Fall pre-season than in the past. And, they always done A LOT. Perhaps, they sense the ‘shine’ is off the ‘new toy’ in Year 6 and they need to ‘reconnect’ with the hometown peeps or maybe they just decided they wanted to.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AXBQVYDbQoo

I’ve also seen FU’s Players & Coaches out & involved in the Community a lot more than ever this pre-season. I’ll let Jackal post about that if he cares to. Regardless, it’s a GOOD thing & all schools should, IMO, endeavor to do as much of these kinds of things as they possibly can. Football is part of the school (in FCS, at least) & the school is part of the community. Friend-Raising always comes prior to Fund-Raising, IMO.

[PaladinNation]

Furman breaks camp, carefully crafted video — IMO — to not show offensive sets xthumbsupx

https://twitter.com/PaladinFootball/status/1032317547696349184/video/1

[Bisonoline]

I had a friend that played college OL. Worked hard to be a starter at 6'6" 265-270 by jr-sr years. He struggled to get big enough, and was never fat. I visited him for a game and got to eat with the team after the game. It was kinda crazy to see the amount of consumption, between him and his OL buddies, needed to sustain their body given the physical demand of lifting, practicing, and playing. He probably runs about 245 now and had to start changing his diet and workouts to get there. He'd always been a big eater, so dieting wasn't his thing. It was a lifestyle change from the OL life he'd known, since middle school really. Can't eat like that when you aren't constantly lifting and practicing.

Jordan Gross is another example. It's crazy to see the difference when a human isn't working their tails off at the table and the wieght room, vs when they were.

https://www.bing.com/th?id=OIP.FYfpko9kXQIOjC21TRujjwHaEo&w=300&h=187&c=7&o=5&pid=1.7


Correct.

As a matter of fact talk to about any lineman that had to pile in the food to stay at a certain weight and by the end of college ball they
are pretty much tired of having to over eat.

[FUBeAR]

Let's see if these links to eacch SoCon Team's Video "Preview"...produced by each school, including interviews with the Head Coach, & a Player from each side of the ball...posted by the SoCon on Twitter, Facebook, and on the good old SCDN. I guess these are part of not having a Media Day

VMI - https://twitter.com/SoConSports/status/1032249671899594757
SCDN Link - http://www.socondigitalnetwork.com/socon/video/socon-2018-socon-football-countdown-to-kickoff---vmi
Head Coach Scott Wachenheim


#
FName
LName
O/D/S
Pos1
Pos2
HT
WT
YR
EXP
Hometown
ST
High School
Previous School


11
Riuq
Trotman
D
DB
CB
69
165
SR
3.00
Virginia Beach
VA
Landstown



26
Mason
Dermott
O
WR

68
170
SR
3.00
Roanoke
VA
Hidden Valley






ETSU - https://twitter.com/SoConSports/status/1032308944360955909
SCDN Link - http://www.socondigitalnetwork.com/socon/video/socon-2018-socon-football-countdown-to-kickoff---etsu
Head Coach Randy Sanders


#
FName
LName
O/D/S
Pos1
Pos2
HT
WT
YR
EXP
Hometown
ST
High School
Previous School


7
Austin
Herink
O
QB

75
210
R-SR
3.50
Cleveland
TN
Cleveland HS



45
Nasir
Player
D
DL
DE
78
271
R-JR
2.50
Columbia
SC
Ridge View HS






The Citadel - https://twitter.com/SoConSports/status/1032643626147504128
SCDN Link - http://www.socondigitalnetwork.com/socon/video/socon-2018-socon-football-countdown-to-kickoff---the-citadel
Head Coach Brent Thompson


#
FName
LName
O/D/S
Pos1
Pos2
HT
WT
YR
EXP
Hometown
ST
High School
Previous School


10
Jordan
Black
O
QB

73
200
JR
2.00
Vidalia
GA
Vidalia



24
Aron
Spann III
D
DB
Rover
73
205
SR
3.00
Spartanburg
SC
Dorman







Mercer - https://twitter.com/SoConSports/status/1033019862933807106
SCDN Link - http://www.socondigitalnetwork.com/socon/video/socon-2018-socon-football-countdown-to-kickoff---mercer
Head Coach Bobby Lamb


#
FName
LName
O/D/S
Pos1
Pos2
HT
WT
YR
EXP
Hometown
ST
High School
Previous School


16
LeMarkus
Bailey
D
LB
OLB
71
199
R-SR
3.50
Marietta
GA
Hillgrove HS



28
Tee
Mitchell
O
RB

71
204
R-SR
3.50
Jacksonville
FL
The Bolles School
Air Force Prep





Chattanooga - https://twitter.com/SoConSports/status/1033353450271252480
SCDN Link - http://www.socondigitalnetwork.com/socon/video/socon-2018-socon-football-countdown-to-kickoff---chattanooga
Head Coach Tom Arth


#
FName
LName
O/D/S
Pos1
Pos2
HT
WT
YR
EXP
Hometown
ST
High School
Previous School


6
C.J.
Fritz
D
DB
CB
71
180
SR
3.00
Chattanooga
TN
McCallie School



7
Nick
Tiano
O
QB

77
240
JR
2.00
Chattanooga
TN
Baylor School
Mississippi State



Western Carolina - https://twitter.com/SoConSports/status/1033761137102344192
SCDN Link - http://www.socondigitalnetwork.com/socon/video/socon-2018-socon-football-countdown-to-kickoff---wcu
Head Coach Mark Speir


#
FName
LName
O/D/S
Pos1
Pos2
HT
WT
YR
EXP
Hometown
ST
High School
Previous School


29
Marvin
Tillman
D
DB
S
73
195
SR
3.00
Durham
NC
Southern Durham HS



63
Zach
Weeks
O
OL
OT
75
290
R-SR
3.50
Bryson City
NC
Swain County HS




Furman - https://twitter.com/SoConSports/status/1034090471512059904
SCDN Link - http://www.socondigitalnetwork.com/socon/video/socon-2018-socon-football-countdown-to-kickoff---furman
Head Coach Clay Hendrix


#
FName
LName
O/D/S
Pos1
Pos2
HT
WT
YR
EXP
Hometown
ST
High School
Previous School


75
Jaylan
Reid
D
DL
NG
71
278
R-SR
3.50
Marietta
GA
Hillgrove



89
Thomas
Gordon
O
WR
FLK
72
174
JR
2.00
Charlotte
NC
Mallard Creek






Wofford - https://twitter.com/SoConSports/status/1034440587515228160
SCDN Link - http://www.socondigitalnetwork.com/socon/video/socon-2018-socon-football-countdown-to-kickoff---wofford
Head Coach Josh Conklin


#
FName
LName
O/D/S
Pos1
Pos2
HT
WT
YR
Exp
Hometown
ST
High School
Previous School


29
Andre
Stoddard
O
RB
FB
70
240
SR
3.00
Greenville
SC
St. Joseph's



90
Miles
Brown
D
DL
NG
74
320
SR
3.00
Cheverly
MD
Sidwell Friends




Samford - https://twitter.com/SoConSports/status/1034805449688788993
SCDN Link - http://www.socondigitalnetwork.com/socon/video/socon-2018-socon-football-countdown-to-kickoff---samford
Head Coach Chris Hatcher


#
FName
LName
O/D/S
Pos1
Pos2
HT
WT
YR
Exp
Hometown
ST
High School
Previous School


8
Devlin
Hodges
O
QB

73
210
R-SR
3.5
Kimberly
AL
Mortimer-Jordan HS



99
Ahmad
Gooden
D
DL
DE ("Stud")
74
25
R-SR
3.5
Talladega
AL
Talladega HS

[PaladinFan]

Writeup on Furman's QB situation: http://furmanpaladins.com/sports/m-footbl/2018-19/releases/20180825cgu50r

Still not clear on whether the starter will be Harris Roberts or Jemar Lincoln, but Hendrix says both guys "will play." I don't know whether that means a pure two QB system or Furman is going to mix and match packages.

There's been some buzz out of camp related to Darren Grainger, a tall athletic player at the QB position. Hendrix says he probably has the best arm out of everyone, and perhaps flew under the radar in recruiting coming off an injury and only moving to QB as a senior.

[FUBeAR]

Writeup on Furman's QB situation: http://furmanpaladins.com/sports/m-footbl/2018-19/releases/20180825cgu50r

Still not clear on whether the starter will be Harris Roberts or Jemar Lincoln, but Hendrix says both guys "will play." I don't know whether that means a pure two QB system or Furman is going to mix and match packages.

There's been some buzz out of camp related to Darren Grainger, a tall athletic player at the QB position. Hendrix says he probably has the best arm out of everyone, and perhaps flew under the radar in recruiting coming off an injury and only moving to QB as a senior.

I think is a 'telling' quote from the article...added Hendrix. "We had him [Lincoln] ready to go in a couple of games when P.J. was banged up, but we never had to play him."

Tells me who Blazejowski's 'real' back-up was last year.

Lincoln will be the choice for the Paladins this year. Matthew McConaughey agrees.

[PaladinFan]

I think is a 'telling' quote from the article...added Hendrix. "We had him [Lincoln] ready to go in a couple of games when P.J. was banged up, but we never had to play him."

Tells me who Blazejowski's 'real' back-up was last year.

Lincoln will be the choice for the Paladins this year. Matthew McConaughey agrees.

I certainly think Lincoln is increasingly more likely now that Roberts has missed a good bit of practice the last week or so.

At the end of the day, if both guys give you roughly the same thing, it seems the better play is to go with the younger guy who is going to be around a few more years.

[PaladinNation]

I think Grainger is making this a battle… gotta feeling we will see him at Clemson, not saying he'll start but I'd bet he gets some snaps.

[wcugrad95]

There were numerous posts earlier on that had detail about WCU without a lot of Catamount "guys" commenting. Here is my take:

Offense:
Return Adams as an electrifying QB, along with 6 Seniors/RS Seniors and a RS Soph who will provide depth at O-line (and return the starting TE that I didn't count). The question marks that keep coming up are WR and RB with the loss of Robinson/Hill and Detrez Newsome. WR - we return Mathis as a starter from last year, have Mullen (transfer from Charlotte), Brad Swann (experience including a start last year), Daquan Patten (you might remember his dad David - 2 time Super Bowl champ with the Patriots), and 3 Frosh/RS Frosh who are at least 6'3" for depth. At RB, we move Connell Young back to RB from the slot - he was a stud HS runner who was recruited by some big schools and we had to get him on the field some way last season with the move to WR. We will also have Holloway (444 yards rushing and 7 TDs rushing last year - 105 yards and 2 TDs getting the start for an injured Newsome against Chatty) and Donovan Spencer (300 yards and 6 TDs rushing last year - 139 yards and 4 TDs getting the start for an injured Newsome and Holloway against ETSU). And did I mention Adams (746 yards rushing)? I know I wear purple-colored glasses, but I actually expect Western's offense on paper to be better this year. Let the rebuttals start about us not playing games on paper :-)

Defense:
We lost a lot of starters, especially at the LB position. But let's face it - WCU was not a very good defensive team the last 2 years. The bright spot is that our DC (Wiley - former DC at Appy State when they were on their run) was in his first year, and statistically we improved significantly from 2016 to 2017. We should be very strong in the defensive backfield (All-Socon and All-American mentioned Marvin Tillman anchors a group that has several guys with experience), and with the guys we have recruited I think we will fit what Wiley wants to do much better - we used athletic guys on the D-line and OLB/DEs, but now we have guys with athleticism and some more size. I expect Link to be 1st or 2nd team All-SoCon guy to anchor the D-line. The question is about experience and youth, but I think overall we have better defensive players. So I would expect (again speaking statistically) the defense to improve in Wiley's 2nd year. Time will tell about the youth.

Special teams:
Starts with Ian Berryman - pre-season All-American. Ian got a little banged up in a recent scrimmage, but after a big scare it sounds like he is going to be ok. That is not only a special team strength, but he is an actual weapon for the defense in being able to flip fields and/or drop balls inside the 20 (really inside the 10). We HAVE to find a healthy and consistent kicker (both FG and kickoff - we had like 4 guys attempt FGs last year). Newsome was an awesome returner, but with his injuries last year we had a "committee" for a return game and I don't know if anybody has stepped-up for that role. So outside of Punter, this is a question mark.

We have an extremely manageable start (Newberry, BYE, Gardner-Webb, VMI), but then the team will be defined by back-to-back games ON THE ROAD against Samford and Furman in weeks 5 and 6. If WCU gets through that at 5-0 they should be highly ranked. At 4-1 we should be ranked and be on the inside track for a playoff spot. If we are 3-2 it will partly depend on how those games played out, but it will be like last season and we would need to win the rest of the SoCon games with some tough competition still on the schedule. If we have 3 loses after week 6 no way the playoffs are a consideration. If we have more than 3 losses after week 6 it will be very bad.

My guess is we will be somewhere around that same place we have been 3 out of the last 4 seasons - around 7 wins, with less than 7 being a little disappointing, 7 leaving us as one of the last few on the outside looking in again, and 8 meaning we finally get into the playoffs. Unless there is a tremendous amount of parity at the top, I think most teams in the SoCon will need to be 6-2 or better in conference play to get in.

[Milktruck74]

Before it is reported that the world is ending in Chattanooga (one particular poster loves the doom and gloom from anything Chattanooga) It looks like the Mocs lost two freshmen recruits last night. Neither were projected starters, but they may have had an opportunity to contribute later in the season....and could also have developed into solid players down the road....but character counts, and you can’t be a moron and expect to play, or even stay.

Freshman RB Isaiah Cobb and LB Nyvin Nelson were arrested and taken to jail with charges of DUI, speeding, a minor in possession of alcohol and passion of a hand gun while intoxicated.. Cobb was the driver and the loaded 9mm Rugger was his..


maybe we we will see them at ICC next season.

[kdinva]

Before it is reported that the world is ending in Chattanooga (one particular poster loves the doom and gloom from anything Chattanooga) It looks like the Mocs lost two freshmen recruits last night. Neither were projected starters,

Freshman RB Isaiah Cobb and LB Nyvin Nelson were arrested and taken to jail with charges of DUI, speeding, a minor in possession of alcohol and passion of a hand gun while intoxicated.. Cobb was the driver and the loaded 9mm Rugger was his..


maybe we we will see them at ICC next season.

.

stupid decision making, what were they thinking?......their way of celebrating the end of "camp"?

[Milktruck74]

.

stupid decision making, what were they thinking?......their way of celebrating the end of "camp"?

Based on driving 65 in a 35 after drinking, while still being underage (so 0.00 is your legal limit), still having open containers in the vehicle, and having a loaded handgun on you.......I’d say they weren’t thinking!

[PaladinFan]

Before it is reported that the world is ending in Chattanooga (one particular poster loves the doom and gloom from anything Chattanooga) It looks like the Mocs lost two freshmen recruits last night. Neither were projected starters, but they may have had an opportunity to contribute later in the season....and could also have developed into solid players down the road....but character counts, and you can’t be a moron and expect to play, or even stay.

Freshman RB Isaiah Cobb and LB Nyvin Nelson were arrested and taken to jail with charges of DUI, speeding, a minor in possession of alcohol and passion of a hand gun while intoxicated.. Cobb was the driver and the loaded 9mm Rugger was his..


maybe we we will see them at ICC next season.




Good grief.

[FUBeAR]

Just so no one is confused...

I take absolutely no pleasure in learning this kind of news about any young men from ANY Team.
I feel similarly about injuries to any young man on ANY Team.
While either of these types of events may help the Team(s) I support win Football games, in almost all cases*, I am only saddened for the young men and their Families.

If anyone who says they are a Fan of FCS Football, where most Players are "genuine" STUDENT-Athletes, does take pleasure when either of these types of situations affect the young men on Teams other than the ones they support, then I am also sad for them.

* I'm always saddened with injuries, but, occasionally, if (alleged) offenses committed by young men are extraordinarily egregious, then my sadness is reserved for their Families.

[PaladinFan]

Just so no one is confused...

I take absolutely no pleasure in learning this kind of news about any young men from ANY Team.
I feel similarly about injuries to any young man on ANY Team.
While either of these types of events may help the Team(s) I support win Football games, in almost all cases*, I am only saddened for the young men and their Families.

If anyone who says they are a Fan of FCS Football, where most Players are "genuine" STUDENT-Athletes, does take pleasure when either of these types of situations affect the young men on Teams other than the ones they support, then I am also sad for them.

* I'm always saddened with injuries, but, occasionally, if (alleged) offenses committed by young men are extraordinarily egregious, then my sadness is reserved for their Families.

Certainly true. No university is immune to having their student-athletes making dumb (and sometimes really dumb) decisions.

Those two young men have a long road ahead of them, unfortunately.

[ETSUfan1]

ETSU QB Austin Herink, who has started all 33 games since ETSU restarted football has lost his job. Starting for the Bucs on week 1 is Temple transfer Logan Marchi.

[Reign of Terrier]

I think that's a little messed up with Herink

[ETSUfan1]

The problem hasn’t been behind center, that’s for sure.

[PaladinFan]

A couple of game week thoughts.

1. These conference games in Week 1 annoy me. I realize the SoCon slate is at the mercy of the ooc schedule, but I hope the SoCon pushes to move away from having a conference tilt in week 1. Week 1 games can often be sloppy, and while I get the "anytime anywhere" mentality, I think that conference games shouldn't start until Week 2 at the earliest.

2. I do not think we will know much about either Furman or Samford after this week. Neither team is facing an opponent that will likely provide a fair assessment.

3. If ETSU struggles with Mars Hill, it might be a long season for the Bucs.

4. UTC should feel urgency against Tenn. Tech. The SoCon needs to win ooc FCS contests. UTC needs a confidence building win.

5. There are a few new coaching staffs taking their first run at things. There are a lot of things in week 1 that can go wrong for a new staff that go well beyond simple x's and o's. Getting plays called, correct personnel, substitutions, and handling the increased pace and speed of the game is a lot different than practice. Football is, in my opinion, a bit unique from most sports in that it is really tough to practice at full game speed and in game-like conditions.

[FUBeAR]

Football is, in my opinion, a bit unique from most sports in that it is ABSOLUTELY IMPOSSIBLE to practice at full game speed and in game-like conditions.fyp

[Mocs123]

ETSU QB Austin Herink, who has started all 33 games since ETSU restarted football has lost his job. Starting for the Bucs on week 1 is Temple transfer Logan Marchi.


That’s suprising to me - I thought he was a pretty good QB.

[PaladinFan]

That’s suprising to me - I thought he was a pretty good QB.

Coach Sanders isn't the first new HC to put "his guy" under center instead of the guy that's fought all the battles to that point.

[PaladinFan]

https://twitter.com/PaladinFootball/status/1034075350282711041

Furman breaks camp.

I spy a deep downfield pass to the TE on that video.

[wcugrad95]

A couple of game week thoughts.

1. These conference games in Week 1 annoy me. I realize the SoCon slate is at the mercy of the ooc schedule, but I hope the SoCon pushes to move away from having a conference tilt in week 1. Week 1 games can often be sloppy, and while I get the "anytime anywhere" mentality, I think that conference games shouldn't start until Week 2 at the earliest.

2. I do not think we will know much about either Furman or Samford after this week. Neither team is facing an opponent that will likely provide a fair assessment.

3. If ETSU struggles with Mars Hill, it might be a long season for the Bucs.

4. UTC should feel urgency against Tenn. Tech. The SoCon needs to win ooc FCS contests. UTC needs a confidence building win.

5. There are a few new coaching staffs taking their first run at things. There are a lot of things in week 1 that can go wrong for a new staff that go well beyond simple x's and o's. Getting plays called, correct personnel, substitutions, and handling the increased pace and speed of the game is a lot different than practice. Football is, in my opinion, a bit unique from most sports in that it is really tough to practice at full game speed and in game-like conditions.

Good stuff in here. I totally agree about conference games happening on opening weekend. I also wish that the "money games" would go back to being early in the season rather than at the end - but same thing in we (the SoCon) don't get a lot of say in that and are at the mercy of the P5 teams that pay us. The SEC has become masterful at playing an FCS team (often a SoCon team) at the very end. I also agree that getting OOC wins is really important, as the conference becomes more competitive top to bottom not having some decent OOC wins makes it tough for a 5-3 SoCon team to make it into the playoffs. So I am pulling hard for UTC.

[PaladinFan]

Good stuff in here. I totally agree about conference games happening on opening weekend. I also wish that the "money games" would go back to being early in the season rather than at the end - but same thing in we (the SoCon) don't get a lot of say in that and are at the mercy of the P5 teams that pay us. The SEC has become masterful at playing an FCS team (often a SoCon team) at the very end. I also agree that getting OOC wins is really important, as the conference becomes more competitive top to bottom not having some decent OOC wins makes it tough for a 5-3 SoCon team to make it into the playoffs. So I am pulling hard for UTC.

I know Furman is a massive underdog against Clemson on Saturday, which is one of the 3 or 4 best college teams in the country. I am also glad that Furman can go ahead, get that game out of the way, and let any first game mistakes come against the least important game on our schedule.

[sudog03]

I'm interested to see how Bobby Lamb goes from play-calling HC to game-managing OC. That transition can be really tough for a HC to make. FuBear, you got any insight here on how that transition is going? Mercer going to stick with Riley or will Riddle get a shot? This seems to be a very important year for Coach Lamb at Mercer, given the resources that school puts into athletics. Think coach Lamb made the decision himself to give up play-calling?

[FUBeAR]

I'm interested to see how Bobby Lamb goes from play-calling HC to game-managing OC. That transition can be really tough for a HC to make. FuBear, you got any insight here on how that transition is going? Mercer going to stick with Riley or will Riddle get a shot? This seems to be a very important year for Coach Lamb at Mercer, given the resources that school puts into athletics. Think coach Lamb made the decision himself to give up play-calling?

Coach Lamb is still the Head Coach at Mercer.

Mercer hired a very experienced OC & QB Coach, Joe Pizzo, in the off-season. The bulk of Coach Pizzo's experience was with Gardner-Webb (when they were pretty good or at least had some pretty good years, especially on Offense) under former Furman Player & Asst Coach (GA), Steve Patton, who had been Coach Pizzo's HC when he played QB at Mars Hill, to which he had transferred, at the recommendation of Roman Gabriel, Pizzo's HS Coach (an NC native / NFL should-be-Hall of Fame QB, who knew Coach Patton from FCA work together), from Nevada after losing his starting job there to an injury situation. He actually started his college career at Cal-Poly, but they dropped football after his FR year, so he transferred to Nevada. From Mars Hill, he went to a few NFL Training camps and a couple of seasons with World League Teams as a QB. Anyway, after Coach Patton retired (or whatever), Coach Pizzo went to NC A&T as OC for a couple of years and then to D2 North Greenville for about 5 years.

So, I think Mercer brought on a lot of QB Coaching and OC'ing experience. When I heard this was going to 'go down,' that is exactly what I said they needed to go after - a well-established Coach, who is very comfortable in his own skin and it would be ideal if he also had strong QB Coaching 'chops.' So, Coach Pizzo fits the Hiring Profile that I would have created, if anyone asked me. Now, whether or not he will be good at Mercer; that remains to be seen...doesn't it?

I think Coach Lamb has reached the point in his career that he is 100% ready to cede Offensive play-calling to an experienced OC that he trusts; much like his relationship with the very-experienced Coach Kolakowski, Mercer's DC since Day 1. I have heard there was/were (a) week(s) last year when Coach Lamb stepped back from having quite as heavy involvement in Off. game planning & play calling, which did not go particularly well (no more details on that), but it does indicate to me that he WAS and IS ready to do it.

As far as how it's going and how it went in the Spring, I don't have quite the inside knowledge that I have had previously. I haven't heard anything negative, so I'm going to surmise that it's going well. I think we'll have a pretty good idea after Game 3.

Interesting that you ask if Mercer is going to 'stick with the SoCon Freshman of the Year' at QB.

Is Samford going to stick with Hodges or will Hatcher (the younger) get a shot?

But, to answer your question, I have heard nothing but great things about Riddle and we KNOW that Kaelan Riley was, as I mentioned, SoCon Freshman of the Year - so among all of the 60 or so kids that all 9 SoCon Teams recruited in 2017 & 2016...except for those that didn't redshirt those years, he was deemed to be the best - the best out of 500 or so. Let's not lose sight of that 'small' honor. I imagine both will have an opportunity to play with the 1st Team Offense in Games 1 & 2...and we'll see if Riddle is good enough to take away the job of the SoCon Freshman of the Year. (did I mention that already?). He may be...from what I'm hearing...but NO ONE knows until he steps on a real game field.

As to the decision-making process to hire a (play-calling) OC, I think Coach Lamb did a full 360 program review at the end of the season and I imagine he sought out the Leadership, guidance, and input of President Underwood in that process. I don't know how involved in Football Mercer's AD might be. He's more of a Baseball 'guy.' But if he is involved, then I'm sure Coach Lamb consulted with him as well. So, no, I don't think he made the decision himself. I think he made it in conjunction with at least one other extraordinarily visionary Leader.

[sudog03]

Sorry for typo on Lamb, appreciate your diligence. Really were just honest questions. I thought I remembered some comments from Mercer than it was more of an open competition between the two QB's. If that was the case, just curious how that competition was going. I think the OC's resume they hired is solid, and I definitely think Lamb would benefit from backing away from play calling. Just know that transition can be difficult, especially if the idea wasn't yours to begin with and let's say you happen to lose back to back games in an important year as it relates to your job security. Would I be incorrect to assume this is an important year for Lamb? Say, at least needs 7-4?

Feel free to check our depth chart released yesterday, no hatcher named.

[FUBeAR]

Sorry for typo on Lamb, appreciate your diligence. Really were just honest questions. I thought I remembered some comments from Mercer than it was more of an open competition between the two QB's. If that was the case, just curious how that competition was going. I think the OC's resume they hired is solid, and I definitely think Lamb would benefit from backing away from play calling. Just know that transition can be difficult, especially if the idea wasn't yours to begin with and let's say you happen to lose back to back games in an important year as it relates to your job security. Would I be incorrect to assume this is an important year for Lamb? Say, at least needs 7-4?

Feel free to check our depth chart released yesterday, no hatcher named.

Not necessarily. Let's look OOC 1st. Let's say they play Memphis similarly well as how they played Auburn last year, but lose a close one at the end. And Memphis goes 11-1 or 10-2, as projected. Then, let's say they demolish an improving Jacksonville in the Home Opener. Then, let's say, they go up to face a nationally-ranked, Ivy League Champion Yale Team that goes undefeated (Massey says they will be) and lose another close one. So, 1-2 OOC. Now let's say they improve to 5-3 in the SoCon this year, losing only hard-fought, close games to potential Top 10 Teams and Potential SoCon Tri-Champions, Samford, Wofford, and Furman - 2 of those on the road. 6-5/5-3 - Pretty sure it's about 100% certain that Coach Lamb is back in 2019 in that case. To be completely honest, I think Mercer should be a Playoff Team if it all plays out like that.

So, it is an important year. And I think if Mercer flops...let's say 4-7 and 3-5 in the SoCon, then, yeah, I think President Underwood probably makes a change. Between those numbers and the numbers you threw out, I think it all depends on how things play out.

[PaladinFan]

Sorry for typo on Lamb, appreciate your diligence. Really were just honest questions. I thought I remembered some comments from Mercer than it was more of an open competition between the two QB's. If that was the case, just curious how that competition was going. I think the OC's resume they hired is solid, and I definitely think Lamb would benefit from backing away from play calling. Just know that transition can be difficult, especially if the idea wasn't yours to begin with and let's say you happen to lose back to back games in an important year as it relates to your job security. Would I be incorrect to assume this is an important year for Lamb? Say, at least needs 7-4?

Feel free to check our depth chart released yesterday, no hatcher named.

I generally think coaches at schools like Mercer/Furman/Samford are going to have long leashes.

That said, I imagine there's at least some level of warmth under Bobby Lamb's seat. This is now Mercer's 5th year in the SoCon and one has to wonder if their president, who is an active supporter of the athletic programs, will abide another .500 season without changes.

Mercer may be looking around at some of its peer institutions and seeing coaching changes that are paying pretty quick dividends.

[wcugrad95]

From the numbers above, I would say a 6-5/5-3 record from any SoCon team will result in a missed opportunity at the playoffs. With some of the other conferences getting 5 and 6 teams in (deserved or not), I still think the only teams who could possibly afford to have 3 conferences losses are the ones who start out in the top-25 because teams tend to drop pretty slowly (Samford, Wofford, and Furman). And I would not expect more than one conference team to get in with 3 conference losses. For WCU, I fully expect the need for 6 conference wins and 8 total as the minimum playoff threshold.

That feeling comes from 3 of the last 4 year's experience for the Cats, who have finished with 5-3 SoCon marks but not made it in. That was primarily due to the OOC schedule. I would expect Mercer to be like WCU and not get the benefit of the doubt with such a conference record. Of course, if they won all their OOC games to get to 8 wins (including an FBS team) they are in. Mercer would be a serious contender if they were 7-4/5-3 with a win over Yale (depending on how Yale ends up). I'd say deserving in that scenario, but it would still be up-in-the-air until the teams are announced. I would not expect 6-5 to cut it.

In recent history, Samford has bucked the trend with a 7 win (with one of those against a D-II) playoff season. So who knows. But to feel comfortable, I am saying teams need to be 6-2 in SoCon play.

[FUBeAR]

From the numbers above, I would say a 6-5/5-3 record from any SoCon team will result in a missed opportunity at the playoffs. With some of the other conferences getting 5 and 6 teams in (deserved or not), I still think the only teams who could possibly afford to have 3 conferences losses are the ones who start out in the top-25 because teams tend to drop pretty slowly (Samford, Wofford, and Furman). And I would not expect more than one conference team to get in with 3 conference losses. For WCU, I fully expect the need for 6 conference wins and 8 total as the minimum playoff threshold.

That feeling comes from 3 of the last 4 year's experience for the Cats, who have finished with 5-3 SoCon marks but not made it in. That was primarily due to the OOC schedule. I would expect Mercer to be like WCU and not get the benefit of the doubt with such a conference record. Of course, if they won all their OOC games to get to 8 wins (including an FBS team) they are in. Mercer would be a serious contender if they were 7-4/5-3 with a win over Yale (depending on how Yale ends up). I'd say deserving in that scenario, but it would still be up-in-the-air until the teams are announced. I would not expect 6-5 to cut it.

In recent history, Samford has bucked the trend with a 7 win (with one of those against a D-II) playoff season. So who knows. But to feel comfortable, I am saying teams need to be 6-2 in SoCon play.Agree with you completely IRL. That's why I said "should be."...and they should if it played out like that, but they wouldn't be. You are correct.