I Am Furious At UAB

[SU DOG]

I hope this is allowed on this forum. I certainly want this hair-brain deed to get as much BAD publicity as possible. What they did to a Samford Sports Information Director(of 14 years)is incomprehensible. I realize that sometimes cuts have to be made, but to derail the career of a good, competent, hard-working man like Zac Schrieber has to be a shining example of POOR leadership. I know Zac personally, and he did NOT deserve this. Please click on this link:

https://www.al.com/sports/index.ssf/2018/07/amid_less_cusa_revenue_uab_for.html

[JSUSoutherner]

What a bunch of pricks.

[FormerPokeCenter]

That's terrible. This couldn't have snuck up on the AD. He KNEW he was facing these cuts in plenty of time to keep that guy from quitting his job at Samford.

That's just nuts. He should sue them. Tortious interference with a contractual agreement, or something like that.

[Bisonoline]

Wow they really ****ed that guy over. Hope he sues the **** out of them.

[Lion1983]

This smells of the University of Alabama in Tuscaloosa. Could they be retaliating for the return of football? Would UAB be better off dropping football to FCS?

[JSUSoutherner]

This smells of the University of Alabama in Tuscaloosa. Could they be retaliating for the return of football? Would UAB be better off dropping football to FCS?
The answers to this are yes and yes.

[FUBeAR]

This smells of the University of Alabama in Tuscaloosa. Could they be retaliating for the return of football? Would UAB be better off moving football up to FCS?
FYP

[Lion1983]

FYP

Your right....my bad

[kdinva]

I hope this is allowed on this forum. I certainly want this hair-brain deed to get as much BAD publicity as possible. What they did to a Samford Sports Information Director(of 14 years)is incomprehensible. I realize that sometimes cuts have to be made, but to derail the career of a good, competent, hard-working man like Zac Schrieber has to be a shining example of POOR leadership. I know Zac personally, and he did NOT deserve this. Please click on this link:

https://www.al.com/sports/index.ssf/2018/07/amid_less_cusa_revenue_uab_for.html

total BS from a wannabee school..........1AA is where they belong, football-wise.

Hey, schedule them in baseball next March. The first UAB batter gets one in the ribs.....and then the pitcher proclaims: "that's for Mr. Schrieber!"

[IBleedYellow]

Holy...crap.

[Lion1983]

total BS from a wannabee school..........1AA is where they belong, football-wise.

Hey, schedule them in baseball next March. The first UAB batter gets one in the ribs.....and then the pitcher proclaims: "that's for Mr. Schrieber!"

That's funny, but I'm sure nobody playing in athletics at UAB likes this either. They are probably thinking cuts may hit them as well.

[Outsider1]

Complete immoral crap from UAB. There are other ways to reduce expenses, as well as increase revenue, and still do what is morally and ethically right.

[TheKingpin28]

What scumbags. Knowing what they knew and the pulling this crap. Yeah, that is immoral.

[PaladinFan]

Complete immoral crap from UAB. There are other ways to reduce expenses, as well as increase revenue, and still do what is morally and ethically right.

Read the article yesterday and can't help but think UAB is just one more program that doesn't need to be at the FBS.

If you can't afford to do something, you ought not do it.

[ASU33]

This has the UA BOT written all over it!

[Go Green]

Tortious interference with a contractual agreement, or something like that.

Detrimental reliance from breach of contract may be the theory you're looking for.

[dewey]

WOW! UAB clearly knew this was coming and totally F'd the guy. Can he get his old job back at Samford or has the position already been filled? Can he file for unemployment?

Dewey

[Derby City Duke]

The 'Roll Tide' boys couldn't destroy football, so they are working to gut the athletic department at its system of schools not located in Tuscaloosa.

Shame the governor doesn't have the stones to intervene and force 'Roll D@mn Tide' to share SEC TV revenue with the system of schools within the state. Then again, one thing I learned while teaching at a large state-supported university is that state university presidents have tremendous power -- often more than any elected state official.

However, you know why Virginia Tech is in the ACC? The governor essentially threatened to make UVa's life miserable if they maintained their anti-VT to the ACC stance.

As if most of the college world needs another reason to despise Nick Saban U.

[dgtw]

The governor has zero power to make Alabama do anything with their TV money. It has nothing to do with her having stones. She didn’t have the stones to not endorse Roy Moore even though she believed he dated underage girls.

Screw UAB and their ****ty program and their idiotic fans. All five of them.

Roll Tide.


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[RootinFerDukes]

Wait, budget problems? If only a certain sports program had been allowed to be cut after all that tends to be really expensive...

[JSUSoutherner]

The governor has zero power to make Alabama do anything with their TV money. It has nothing to do with her having stones. She didn’t have the stones to not endorse Roy Moore even though she believed he dated underage girls.

Screw UAB and their ****ty program and their idiotic fans. All five of them.

Roll Tide.


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Lol. If JSU was FBS what would be the difference between us and them? Hell their football coach is part of the reason we aren't still a perennial dumpster fire. Guess we know who shows up to JSU games in Bama gear now.

[dgtw]

Lol. If JSU was FBS what would be the difference between us and them? Hell their football coach is part of the reason we aren't still a perennial dumpster fire. Guess we know who shows up to JSU games in Bama gear now.

I wear JSU clothing while attending games. I am at every home game at least one road game per season. I own and wear more JSU stuff than Bama.

I would hardly call the program a dumpster fire before Dollar Bill came and went.

I am sorry I root for other teams along with Jax State.


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[Derby City Duke]

The governor has zero power to make Alabama do anything with their TV money. It has nothing to do with her having stones. She didn’t have the stones to not endorse Roy Moore even though she believed he dated underage girls.

Screw UAB and their ****ty program and their idiotic fans. All five of them.

Roll Tide.


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'Lighten up, Francis.' -- SFC Hulka

[FormerPokeCenter]

Detrimental reliance from breach of contract may be the theory you're looking for.

Hence "something like that" ;)

[GreenGlasses]

This smells of the University of Alabama in Tuscaloosa. Could they be retaliating for the return of football? Would UAB be better off dropping football to FCS?

Seriously why should they drop down. Even after the Alabama Trustee's tried to kill them and couldn't but for 2 years they came back in their 1st season and had an 8-5 season.


total BS from a wannabee school..........1AA is where they belong, football-wise.

Hey, schedule them in baseball next March. The first UAB batter gets one in the ribs.....and then the pitcher proclaims: "that's for Mr. Schrieber!"

And the VMI Keydets don't belong in IAA. VMI has less than 80 wins since the 1983 season, 77 wins to be exact. That's 77 win in 368 games Shew what a powerhouse, you wouldn't even make a good DII team, you belong in DIII or NAIA.

At least UAB had 8 wins last year after being screwed over by UA.

VMI hasn't won 7 games since 1977 and have never won 8 since Ive been alive (Born 1971), you have to go all the way back to 1959 to find that feat.

[FUBeAR]

Seriously why should they drop down. Even after the Alabama Trustee's tried to kill them and couldn't but for 2 years they came back in their 1st season and had an 8-5 season.



And the VMI Keydets don't belong in IAA. VMI has less than 80 wins since the 1983 season, 77 wins to be exact. That's 77 win in 368 games Shew what a powerhouse, you wouldn't even make a good DII team, you belong in DIII or NAIA.

At least UAB had 8 wins last year after being screwed over by UA.

VMI hasn't won 7 games since 1977 and have never won 8 since Ive been alive (Born 1971), you have to go all the way back to 1959 to find that feat.VMI COULD win 8 games in Conference USuck. Maybe they swap with UAin’tBama

[SU DOG]

WOW! UAB clearly knew this was coming and totally F'd the guy. Can he get his old job back at Samford or has the position already been filled? Can he file for unemployment?

Dewey

Good questions. I don't know all the legalities and rules, but it is not so easy now as just giving him his position back. The HR dept. has completed his termination and relisted the job for applicants. As most firms/schools do, I am guessing it is probably advertised at some lesser rate than what Zac was making. I think there is also some necessary time period involved before a person can be named. IF they(UAB) had just called him about 4 hours earlier, as stated in the article, he would have been retained. Surely UAB could have had some idea of what was going to happen, and prevented this major screwup. Unbelievable and bush-league for sure!!

[Daytripper]

Weak sauce.... They knew this was in the pipeline and ****ed over those people consciously. I hope Ingram gets an STD.

[NoVABison]

This is what happens when you move up to the FBS without a sustainable plan... I remember reading about UAB when they dropped football -- they weren't sponsoring the minimum amount of athletic teams at that time -- they clearly were in over their heads... so the responsible thing happened, the football program was dropped. Then the public outcries came-- lots of gnashing of teeth to restart the program, but where were the funds to back up that outrage?

If a school can't afford to play at a particular level of football, they either need to drop down or eliminate football all together! There are too many crappy FBS teams already -- claiming to play at the "highest level" but doing it on the backs of students, and the schools funds that are better spent on academic programs.

[lucchesicourt]

UAB is now going to hve a real difficult time filling positions. They may need to give a signing bonus before anyone comes to work for them. These guys cannot be trusted to do the right thing. It's typical CEO mentality, as long as it doesn't affect my money, it's all right with me.

[katss07]

Assholes. UAB needs to move on down. They wouldn’t even win the Big South. Just a crap situation overall.

[JSUSoutherner]

I wear JSU clothing while attending games. I am at every home game at least one road game per season. I own and wear more JSU stuff than Bama.

I would hardly call the program a dumpster fire before Dollar Bill came and went.

I am sorry I root for other teams along with Jax State.


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Oh yeah those 6-5 Crowe teams that spent half the time on acedemic restrictions were good times I'm sure.

I just think it's funny you would support a school that is so full of pricks that it took a state resolution and the threat of witholding their funding for them to even play Auburn. Alabama has a track record of being douchebags who can't stand the idea of sharing the state with anyone else. Why do you think the state has no pro sports teams?

[unknown3]

Nearly every post on this thread is pretty silly

[unknown3]

Assholes. UAB needs to move on down. They wouldn’t even win the Big South. Just a crap situation overall.

Why do you all continue to make stupid, and blatantly BS statements like this? lol. Seriously. Quit acting like FCS football is the P5.

[JSUSoutherner]

Why do you all continue to make stupid, and blatantly BS statements like this? lol. Seriously. Quit acting like FCS football is the P5.
Have you seen UAB? Something tells me Kennesaw would beat Alabama's 7th best football team.

[RootinFerDukes]

Good questions. I don't know all the legalities and rules, but it is not so easy now as just giving him his position back. The HR dept. has completed his termination and relisted the job for applicants. As most firms/schools do, I am guessing it is probably advertised at some lesser rate than what Zac was making. I think there is also some necessary time period involved before a person can be named. IF they(UAB) had just called him about 4 hours earlier, as stated in the article, he would have been retained. Surely UAB could have had some idea of what was going to happen, and prevented this major screwup. Unbelievable and bush-league for sure!!

It’s not an ideal situation but at least they hadn’t hired and started his replacement. He can re-apply and hopefully get it back easily.
With news of it hitting the media too, other applicants are going to realize they shouldn’t bother to apply to a position that’s not really there.
In the meantime, he can file for unemployment and also sue UAB for a decent settlement. They can put in FOIA requests to obtain any information that might reveal UAB officials new far earlier than 4:29pm the day they called and acted negligently.

[RootinFerDukes]

Oh yeah those 6-5 Crowe teams that spent half the time on acedemic restrictions were good times I'm sure.

I just think it's funny you would support a school that is so full of pricks that it took a state resolution and the threat of witholding their funding for them to even play Auburn. Alabama has a track record of being douchebags who can't stand the idea of sharing the state with anyone else. Why do you think the state has no pro sports teams?

Maybe because it lacks a major city? What is the most populous city in Alabama and how does it compare to even the smallest metro areas that have at least one of the major four pro sports?

[JSUSoutherner]

Maybe because it lacks a major city? What is the most populous city in Alabama and how does it compare to even the smallest metro areas that have at least one of the major four pro sports?

There's 1.3 million people in the Birmingham Metro. Alabama is the most populus state in the country lacking a pro sports team and there are at least 5 states by my count with a smaller population than Alabama who have a pro team of some variety.

[Iridebikes]

That is really low. A no class move by UAB.

[FUBeAR]

Have you seen UAB? Something tells me Kennesaw would beat Alabama's 7th best football team.
Guessing that debating with a G5 Apologist/Troll, most likely a fan of a fairly recent failed/failing FCS to G5-move-downer will prove fruitless; but have at it, if you like.

[RootinFerDukes]

There's 1.3 million people in the Birmingham Metro. Alabama is the most populus state in the country lacking a pro sports team and there are at least 5 states by my count with a smaller population than Alabama who have a pro team of some variety.

I'm being facetious here because I know there's a major city literally right across the border from northern virginia, but your statement isn't technically true. Virginia is more populous and lacks a major pro sports team in any of its cities. :)
In fact, I've heard that the VA Beach/Tidewater region is the largest metro area in the country without a major pro sports franchise. They were rumored to be courting an NBA franchise, but it never ended up happening.

There are cities with a major franchise that are as populous or less populous than Birmingham, AL.

OKC Thunder - 1.3M
Memphis Grizzles - 1.3M
Raleigh NC (Hurricanes NHL) - 1.3M
New Orleans (Saints and Pelicans) - 1.2M
SLC (Jazz and Real Salt Lake MLS) - 1.1M
Buffalo (Bills and Sabres) - 1.1M
Green Bay WI - 300K

[Go Green]

I'm being facetious here because I know there's a major city literally right across the border from northern virginia, but your statement isn't technically true. Virginia is more populous and lacks a major pro sports team in any of its cities. :)
In fact, I've heard that the VA Beach/Tidewater region is the largest metro area in the country without a major pro sports franchise. They were rumored to be courting an NBA franchise, but it never ended up happening.



Orioles owner Peter Angelos lobbied hard for Norfolk, VA to get the Expos when they were considering moving to Washington, DC.

Nobody took him seriously.

[Southern Bison]

Orioles owner Peter Angelos lobbied hard for Norfolk, VA to get the Expos when they were considering moving to Washington, DC.

No folks took him seriously.

FYP...😆

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[ccd494]

It’s not an ideal situation but at least they hadn’t hired and started his replacement. He can re-apply and hopefully get it back easily.
With news of it hitting the media too, other applicants are going to realize they shouldn’t bother to apply to a position that’s not really there.
In the meantime, he can file for unemployment and also sue UAB for a decent settlement. They can put in FOIA requests to obtain any information that might reveal UAB officials new far earlier than 4:29pm the day they called and acted negligently.

I'm confused by all this "He should sue!!!" stuff. Isn't this America, home of at will employment, where any employee can be fired or laid off for any reason at any time?

[Redbird 4th & short]

That's terrible. This couldn't have snuck up on the AD. He KNEW he was facing these cuts in plenty of time to keep that guy from quitting his job at Samford.

That's just nuts. He should sue them. Tortious interference with a contractual agreement, or something like that.

This !!!! And any doubt they are scumbags was removed when they did this 1 minute before closing their office for the weekend.

That is some gutless incompetent and unethical sh-t by their AD !!

[dgtw]

Oh yeah those 6-5 Crowe teams that spent half the time on acedemic restrictions were good times I'm sure.

I just think it's funny you would support a school that is so full of pricks that it took a state resolution and the threat of witholding their funding for them to even play Auburn. Alabama has a track record of being douchebags who can't stand the idea of sharing the state with anyone else. Why do you think the state has no pro sports teams?

A winning record is not a dumpster fire. Not saying Crowe was the reincarnation of Knute Rockne, but he wasn’t as horrible as people make him out to be. He wasn’t good enough a coach to get us to the next level, but wasn’t bad enough to get fired too quickly. He was just mediocre. His saving grace was he was in the OVC, where mediocrity can get you in the top three of the league most years.

My parents were Bama grads so I grew up watching and following them. I didn’t go to college there but will always root for them. My JSU connection is being married to a Marching Southerners alum.


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[RootinFerDukes]

I'm confused by all this "He should sue!!!" stuff. Isn't this America, home of at will employment, where any employee can be fired or laid off for any reason at any time?

It depends on the specifics of the situation. Was he an employee on a signed contract stipulating all the details or did he only receive an offer letter of when employment would begin? Many athletics employees are on contracts to my knowledge, not necessarily just coaches.

If there's no contract, then yeah, there's not much he can do other than speak to the media who gladly blasts UAB for the sheer sleazy ****tiness of the entire situation. Good luck encouraging quality candidates to apply moving forward when word gets out.

[FUBeAR]

It depends on the specifics of the situation. Was he an employee on a signed contract stipulating all the details or did he only receive an offer letter of when employment would begin? Many athletics employees are on contracts to my knowledge, not necessarily just coaches.

If there's no contract, then yeah, there's not much he can do other than speak to the media who gladly blasts UAB for the sheer sleazy ****tiness of the entire situation. Good luck encouraging quality candidates to apply moving forward when word gets out.I AM NOT A LAWYER...In my lay opinion though...there does not have to be a written employment contract for him to bring action against UAB...See below...

Detrimental reliance is an important component of many causes of action relating to breach of contract. Detrimental reliance is required when proving misrepresentation, negligent misrepresentation, violation of the Unfair Practices Act (or UPA), and enforcing an oral contract under the theory of promissory estoppel.
Promissory estoppel may apply when the following elements are proven:


A promise was made
Relying on the promise was reasonable or foreseeable
There was actual and reasonable reliance on the promise
The reliance was detrimental (i.e. some sort of harm was suffered)
Injustice can only be prevented by enforcing the promise

Detrimental reliance requires reasonable reliance, which is evaluated on case-by-case basis, taking all provable factors into consideration.

I think all of these ‘bullets’ are present in this case. The breached ‘contract’ was not an Employment Contract (necessarily). It was the ‘contract’ created when they ‘promised’ to Employ him & he took action (detrimental to him) based upon that promise.

Now if UAin’tBama had fulfilled their promise (probably contained with an Offer Letter) & actually hired/employed Mr. Schreiber to start on a Monday & learned on that Tuesday that they needed to cut him, then Employment-At-Will would apply. But, since they never actuallly employed him & he relied on their promise of employment to decide to voluntarily leave his job at Samford, he has been harmed.

I think he has a case.

I AM NOT A LAWYER.

[Outsider1]

I AM NOT A LAWYER...In my lay opinion though...there does not have to be a written employment contract for him to bring action against UAB...See below...

Detrimental reliance is an important component of many causes of action relating to breach of contract. Detrimental reliance is required when proving misrepresentation, negligent misrepresentation, violation of the Unfair Practices Act (or UPA), and enforcing an oral contract under the theory of promissory estoppel.
Promissory estoppel may apply when the following elements are proven:


A promise was made
Relying on the promise was reasonable or foreseeable
There was actual and reasonable reliance on the promise
The reliance was detrimental (i.e. some sort of harm was suffered)
Injustice can only be prevented by enforcing the promise

Detrimental reliance requires reasonable reliance, which is evaluated on case-by-case basis, taking all provable factors into consideration.

I think all of these ‘bullets’ are present in this case. The breached ‘contract’ was not an Employment Contract (necessarily). It was the ‘contract’ created when they ‘promised’ to Employ him & he took action (detrimental to him) based upon that promise.

Now if UAin’tBama had fulfilled their promise (probably contained with an Offer Letter) & actually hired/employed Mr. Schreiber to start on a Monday & learned on that Tuesday that they needed to cut him, then Employment-At-Will would apply. But, since they never actuallly employed him & he relied on their promise of employment to decide to voluntarily leave his job at Samford, he has been harmed.

I think he has a case.

I AM NOT A LAWYER.

ALL good and valid points. Even if it was technically legal it doesn't mean a civil case couldn't be brought. Legal precedent could be changed with cases like this and it may be the only way he could get some compensation. I am also not a lawyer. Still, legal doesn't equate to either ethical or moral. You would hope people would know/remember that, but with UAB I am once again reminded that they don't. So, it seems they need reminded. I doubt a few of us making comments would accomplish that.....

[ccd494]

ALL good and valid points. Even if it was technically legal it doesn't mean a civil case couldn't be brought. Legal precedent could be changed with cases like this and it may be the only way he could get some compensation. I am also not a lawyer. Still, legal doesn't equate to either ethical or moral. You would hope people would know/remember that, but with UAB I am once again reminded that they don't. So, it seems they need reminded. I doubt a few of us making comments would accomplish that.....

Well, I am a lawyer.

Alabama is an "at will" state. Like pretty much all states. That means that both the employee and the employer can leave the agreement at any time, for any reason. This benefits the employee a bit but not much (if you get a better job offer you can just leave) and the employer a lot (if revenues are down, or they just don't like the cut of your jib, they can just get rid of you). Absent some sort of discriminatory intent (i.e., they offered him the job, found out he was black, then pulled the offer) or fraud in inducing him to take the job (they knew the job was disappearing before he AGREED to take the job, not after he accepted), he probably can't get any lost wages or anything. If he had already physically moved from Georgia to Alabama, maybe he can get some moving costs. Maybe. But I wouldn't imagine Alabama courts are very pro-worker.

Those bringing up how a coach gets paid if he gets fired- that is because the coach's contract SPECIFICALLY SPELLS OUT the terms of separation, in all matters. Both parties negotiate this prior to the acceptance of employment. When a coach takes a job, he wants to make sure he isn't fired in two years and out of luck, so he will negotiate severance. "School A will owe Coach X the $1M remaining on his contract" means that Coach X and School A put in the employment contract or term sheet that in the event of firing without cause, the coach will still receive full payment. Also, the school wants to make sure that if the coach gets a better job, they get compensated and aren't holding the bag. "Per the terms of Coach X's contract, he will owe School A $1M for severing his contract and agreeing to coach at School B."

If this guy had a negotiated severance package, or notice period, sure he can sue to enforce that. I would be SHOCKED if UAB were out negotiating tailor made contracts for SID staff. That's the kind of job where they offer you a uniform, cookie cutter employment contract. You can maybe negotiate starting salary, but they aren't going to need to hire an SID from Samford badly enough that they are going to quibble over the fine print on the contract. They'd just hire the guy from South Alabama or wherever instead.

The problem with saying "DETRIMENTAL RELIANCE!" is that the remedy for detrimental reliance is the enforcement of the breached contract terms. The contract here undoubtedly provided for the at will employment of this dude. Therefore, UAB didn't breach the contract- they just acted per the contract's terms to end his employment, which was at will. So, it doesn't matter that he hadn't started yet.

None of this is to say this doesn't suck for this dude. I absolutely agree that legally, morally, ethically, UAB shouldn't be able to do this. But in the employer-friendly times we live, employers can fire you for any reason, at any time, and if your contract doesn't provide for severance, or a notice period, or other protections, well, you are SOL. Don't like it? Vote for Democrats to strengthen labor laws. Or join a union that will negotiate a better uniform contracts for all employees.

[Outsider1]

Good input ccd494.

[FUBeAR]

Well, I am a lawyer.

The problem with saying "DETRIMENTAL RELIANCE!" is that the remedy for detrimental reliance is the enforcement of the breached contract terms. The contract here undoubtedly provided for the at will employment of this dude. Therefore, UAB didn't breach the contract- they just acted per the contract's terms to end his employment, which was at will. So, it doesn't matter that he hadn't started yet.
.
Thanks Counselor. I was “yeah, but-ting” you until I got to this part. If the remedy was to compensate for damages vs. enforcement; then, maybe,it would be worth pursuing. But I guess that actually going to Law School & passing the bar stuff really pays off.

[ccd494]

Thanks Counselor. I was “yeah, but-ting” you until I got to this part. If the remedy was to compensate for damages vs. enforcement; then, maybe,it would be worth pursuing. But I guess that actually going to Law School & passing the bar stuff really pays off.

Yeah, buried the lede a bit I guess. They also teach you to stretch what you could answer in one sentence out to nine or ten.

[ursus arctos horribilis]

This is about UAB, and other FBS stuff so in the future please throw these up on the "other sports" forum if you would SU.

[FUBeAR]

They also teach you to stretch what you could answer in one sentence out to nine or ten.
As Alec Baldwin would have said on his Mission of Mercy from Mitch & Murray if it was down-on-their-luck Law Office movie instead of a Real Estate Sales Movie, “ABB, A...Always, B...Be, B...Billing. ALWAYS BE BILLING!”

[SU DOG]

This is about UAB, and other FBS stuff so in the future please throw these up on the "other sports" forum if you would SU.

I didn't really know where it should go, as indicated in my first sentence. I very grateful. however. that it wasn't moved immediately, because I accomplished my mission - which was to publicize how rotten this was to a good man in the Samford Athletic Dept. The many responses from FCS brethren across the land were so welcomed and appreciated.