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UNHWildcat18

June 5th, 2018, 01:55 PM

https://athlonsports.com/college-football/athlon-sports-preseason-fcs-top-25-2018

centennial

June 5th, 2018, 02:02 PM

UNH. Lmao. Barely squeezed into the playoffs and 3rd? All over bad ratings.

PaladinFan

June 5th, 2018, 02:15 PM

No kidding. This needs to be summarily ignored.

Having Elon as a top 10 team and not having Furman anywhere on the list (including "others to watch") is journalistic malpractice and indicates just how little understanding there is of the FCS landscape.

ursus arctos horribilis

June 5th, 2018, 02:17 PM

The article started great. First 3 words were very powerful. They probably should have refreshed the Griz part since Gresch is gone.

VandalBasher

June 5th, 2018, 02:21 PM

http://www.espn.com/college-football/game?gameId=400944827

I am certain #23 are relieved they won't be coming back to the Kibbie Dome this year. How they are ranked ahead is beyond me after a 28-6 drubbing. http://www.espn.com/college-football/game?gameId=400944827

If this is the prediction, the Vandals will be somewhere between 5-6 and 7-4. But, I don't see us losing to MSU. We don't play Sac. St, Weber St. or NAU this season.

Go Lehigh TU Owl

June 5th, 2018, 02:46 PM

No PL teams and deservedly so!

The Yo Show

June 5th, 2018, 02:52 PM

The article started great. First 3 words were very powerful. They probably should have refreshed the Griz part since Gresch is gone.

I noticed that too! Great point. Could use more name-dropping by these types of news organizations build the brand!

BEAR

June 5th, 2018, 02:56 PM

Thumper 76

June 5th, 2018, 02:58 PM

SDSU at 4 is........very wrong. Good lord. Mid teens at best until proven otherwise please.

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UNHWildcat18

June 5th, 2018, 03:06 PM

UNH. Lmao. Barely squeezed into the playoffs and 3rd? All over bad ratings.

We made it to quarters last year with a squad that was mostly sophomores, and juniors. 18 returning starters. How many teams would you put ahead of them? Yes I get that we didn't show up vs SDSU as SDSU didn't show up for JMU. But really enlighten all of us with your knowledge of who the top 10 should be based off all of the factors.

Also I agree I'm not sold on a number 3 slot but putting us way in the back or not in the top 25 would be nuts

GreenGlasses

June 5th, 2018, 03:26 PM

Not gonna name names but some of these rakings are based on name recognition alone and nothing else.

Redbird 4th & short

June 5th, 2018, 05:03 PM

We made it to quarters last year with a squad that was mostly sophomores, and juniors. 18 returning starters. How many teams would you put ahead of them? Yes I get that we didn't show up vs SDSU as SDSU didn't show up for JMU. But really enlighten all of us with your knowledge of who the top 10 should be based off all of the factors.

Also I agree I'm not sold on a number 3 slot but putting us way in the back or not in the top 25 would be nuts

doesn't have to be 3 or outside the top 20 ... it can be a bunch of spots in between. If it's true you have 18 starters returning, I can see close to top 10 to start season.

But as I've pointed out once before .. UNH was in no way a quarterfinal team in 2017 .. be very thankful for your good fortune last season. You got a bid 3 other teams deserved before you (Delaware, EWU, Montana). Then you drew the 2nd weakest team in field (ranked somewhere between 40 and 50) and barely beat them at home with their star QB out. You did beat UCA ... except they were by most accounts going thru the motions with their head coach having one foot out the door. Then you got destroyed by SDSU ... so 2 of 3 playoff games were bad games.

This just is not a quarterfinalist resume in any way shape or form .. and now all the subjective polls will treat UNH like they were deserving of it last season. Think about all the playoff appearances and how many first round pasties UNH has drawn over the years .. Patriot, NEC, and the like .. guaranteed playoff bids at 7-4 and near-guaranteed 1st round wins must be nice .. sure helps pad the playoff resume.

Welcome to Marty's UNH .. where 7-4 is a playoff lock !!!

TheKingpin28

June 5th, 2018, 05:44 PM

Oh this is terribad

JSUSoutherner

June 5th, 2018, 05:49 PM

EWU at 6? Wut...

katss07

June 5th, 2018, 05:56 PM

Luckily, this list doesn’t matter.

WestCoastAggie

June 5th, 2018, 06:40 PM

My question is how will AGS rank A&T this year? Our OOC schedule was definitely upgraded.

ursus arctos horribilis

June 5th, 2018, 06:51 PM

My question is how will AGS rank A&T this year? Our OOC schedule was definitely upgraded.

Like everyone else that upgrades, and does well, you will rise. You will not rise if you do not I would assume.

I've watched it internally every week for about 8 yrs. now and you can trust me on that one.

JacksFan40

June 5th, 2018, 06:53 PM

Didn’t we beat UNH 56-14? I don’t care that we had Goedert and Weineke, that game was never even remotely challenging. Kind of like the next round against JMU but now we were UNH.

JacksFan40

June 5th, 2018, 06:54 PM

SDSU at 4 is........very wrong. Good lord. Mid teens at best until proven otherwise please.

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Even without Goedert and Weineke, SDSU is still top 10 easily in my opinion. Still better than most other teams.

Model Citizen

June 5th, 2018, 06:58 PM

Unless South Dakota lost its entire team, they belong in the top-25.

Thumper 76

June 5th, 2018, 07:05 PM

Unless South Dakota lost its entire team, they belong in the top-25.

Streveler graduated, so basically yes.

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Thumper 76

June 5th, 2018, 07:06 PM

Even without Goedert and Weineke, SDSU is still top 10 easily in my opinion. Still better than most other teams.

And Onesorge. I am a believer that our offense won’t be falling off a cliff but we will need the defense to show up in a much bigger way than last year.

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Go...gate

June 5th, 2018, 07:26 PM

No PL teams and deservedly so!

Reputation points on that post. Hoping the PL members all have improved seasons in and outside the conference.

Go Lehigh TU Owl

June 5th, 2018, 07:44 PM

Reputation points on that post. Hoping the PL members all have improved seasons in and outside the conference.

Year 6 of the scholarship era and not a single team in the preseason Top 25. That's an absolute failure! Not a single PL poster 6 years ago would have imagined that imo...

This is not an "isolated" deal either. I don't see a PL team making it into the AGS, STAT's or Coaches Poll.

Gangtackle11

June 5th, 2018, 08:55 PM

Villanova is not deserving of 11. They may work their way towards that ranking with a healthy offense back, but no way this 5-6 team starts there. 21 maybe, 11 no.

KPSUL

June 5th, 2018, 09:02 PM

Didn’t we beat UNH 56-14? I don’t care that we had Goedert and Weineke, that game was never even remotely challenging. Kind of like the next round against JMU but now we were UNH.
Other than a handful of hardcore Jacks fans who travelled to Virginia, I'm probably the only person on the planet that attended both those games. So no, you were not "like" UNH in the UNH @ SDSU game, you were even worse! I never expect to see 10 interceptions thrown by one team in a game ever again.

KPSUL

June 5th, 2018, 09:17 PM

Wait so the transitive property is what this top 25 is based on? xlolx So UCA was #3, got dicked over by their coach the week of the playoffs, was beaten by UNH, so they take their spot? Interesting. xlolx

Nope, there's more to it than that laughing bear. Turns out UCA was over-rated last season, and I'd say at #3, so is UNH pre-season 2018. It must be something about the #3 ranking. The coach dicked us over argument is getting tiresome.

DFW HOYA

June 5th, 2018, 09:38 PM

Year 6 of the scholarship era and not a single team in the preseason Top 25. That's an absolute failure! Not a single PL poster 6 years ago would have imagined that imo... This is not an "isolated" deal either. I don't see a PL team making it into the AGS, STAT's or Coaches Poll.

The inconvenient truth: the players aren't significantly better in the scholarship era, they're just getting tuition from a different line item in the budget.

Iridebikes

June 5th, 2018, 10:12 PM

Maybe a bit high but not much. More seniority coming back on both sides then we've had in years.
EWU at 6? Wut...

- - - Updated - - -

Maybe a bit high but not much. More seniority coming back on both sides then we've had in years.
EWU at 6? Wut...

Thumper 76

June 5th, 2018, 10:21 PM

Other than a handful of hardcore Jacks fans who travelled to Virginia, I'm probably the only person on the planet that attended both those games. So no, you were not "like" UNH in the UNH @ SDSU game, you were even worse! I never expect to see 10 interceptions thrown by one team in a game ever again.

Hmmmm. 56-14 SDSU vs UNH and UNH had 2 turnovers. 51-16 JMU vs SDSU and SDSU had 10 turnovers. Seems like turnovers were the reason SDSU got walloped while UNH just got their asses handed to them straight up. If you just looked at the results of those two games it’s easier to predict a closer game where SDSU doesn’t have had many INTS as they had the entire season combined vs JMU, while UNH just got dominated to a much higher extent with SDSU putting up 56 without the aid of 10 turnovers. We may have performed worse compared to our talent, but if anything SDSU vs JMU certainly wasn’t worse than UNH vs SDSU.

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Schism55

June 5th, 2018, 10:49 PM

Maybe a bit high but not much. More seniority coming back on both sides then we've had in years.

- - - Updated - - -

Maybe a bit high but not much. More seniority coming back on both sides then we've had in years.
Agree with returning talent, getting that NT back is huge.
I'm more concerned if your head coach is any good?

Mike296

June 5th, 2018, 11:54 PM

EWU at 6? Wut...

You guys have no business being at 8 ffs.

BisonFan02

June 6th, 2018, 12:17 AM

Unless South Dakota lost its entire team, they belong in the top-25.

They did.

JSUSoutherner

June 6th, 2018, 12:52 AM

You guys have no business being at 8 ffs.

That's no way to talk your OVC daddy.

Didn't you guys get your first D1 win or something like that last year? :D

My question is how will AGS rank A&T this year? Our OOC schedule was definitely upgraded.

Was it tho?

BomberHarris

June 6th, 2018, 06:46 AM

TheKingpin28

June 6th, 2018, 07:10 AM

I love the people hating on UNH's win at UCA, uh, you guys do remember that UNH won that game despite their backup QB playing the entire 2nd half right? UCA's kids phoned it in that day? Sure looked like they were playing their guts out to me.

#3 is probably a bit too strong, but did this become an entire forum of Delaware fans? Yeesh.Completely setting aside that the coach bailed on them before the game and was already out the door, then sure good for you, but you also almost lost to a 3rd string QB at ccsu.

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OhioHen

June 6th, 2018, 07:34 AM

xlolx Maybe I'll take the lazy approach and make this my preseason poll. xsmhx

UNHWildcat18

June 6th, 2018, 08:24 AM

doesn't have to be 3 or outside the top 20 ... it can be a bunch of spots in between. If it's true you have 18 starters returning, I can see close to top 10 to start season.

But as I've pointed out once before .. UNH was in no way a quarterfinal team in 2017 .. be very thankful for your good fortune last season. You got a bid 3 other teams deserved before you (Delaware, EWU, Montana). Then you drew the 2nd weakest team in field (ranked somewhere between 40 and 50) and barely beat them at home with their star QB out. You did beat UCA ... except they were by most accounts going thru the motions with their head coach having one foot out the door. Then you got destroyed by SDSU ... so 2 of 3 playoff games were bad games.

This just is not a quarterfinalist resume in any way shape or form .. and now all the subjective polls will treat UNH like they were deserving of it last season. Think about all the playoff appearances and how many first round pasties UNH has drawn over the years .. Patriot, NEC, and the like .. guaranteed playoff bids at 7-4 and near-guaranteed 1st round wins must be nice .. sure helps pad the playoff resume.

Welcome to Marty's UNH .. where 7-4 is a playoff lock !!!

How many times are you going to make this clown ****ing argument. We are restricted by the NCAA regional rules, with who we have to play in the first round, not our fault. We also host over most PL/NEC teams due to better facilities and lights, again not our fault. Even so that's a first round game which yes has been easier than some other first round team wins. please tell me which teams in the playoffs deserved to be in the final 8 over UNH?

You keep making excuses, and saying bad games for every game. CCSU bottom line we won, UCA southland champs un-defeated in conference play, excuse is their coach was half way out the door, guess what we beat them with a back up QB that played the entirety of the second half. bottom line we won. SDSU yup got handled like children. Let me ask you this was SDSU not a semifinal team last year because they got destroyed 56-10 by JMU?

Oh so Montana EWU Delaware should have gotten in over UNH? NAU got a nod over EWU for some reason who knows why, NAU really showed how great the big sky is and apparently deserved 4-5 bids according to you. What about monmouth? or nicholls who beat no one good in the southland or ooc? strictly in due to 9 wins. Only argument you have is UD

Hey though at least you agree with UNH being a potentially top 10 team due to the amount of returning starters.

UNHWildcat18

June 6th, 2018, 08:31 AM

Completely setting aside that the coach bailed on them before the game and was already out the door, then sure good for you, but you also almost lost to a 3rd string QB at ccsu.

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How can you even make a statement like that? You hear rumblings from disgruntled fans, coaches were there, plays were being called, their coach was vocal and into the game, such a garbage argument. 2nd string QB* game wasn't ever a threat to being lost. regardless of peoples opinions of how hard they played and how bad we played.

UNHWildcat18

June 6th, 2018, 08:33 AM

Luckily, this list doesn’t matter.

^^^^^^^^^^^ just putting out Craig's opinion for people to see was all.

Gangtackle11

June 6th, 2018, 08:39 AM

Nova hasn’t seen UNH in a few seasons. Looking forward to playing them the next 2 seasons. Quality program with strong national reputation despite the usual nay sayers here. xpeacex

Bisonator

June 6th, 2018, 09:06 AM

So the only real question this year is who wants the next beating in Frisco?xcoffeex

UNHWildcat18

June 6th, 2018, 09:09 AM

So the only real question this year is who wants the next beating in Frisco?xcoffeex

every team is letting out a low chuckle.... that turns into a sob xbawlingx

Iridebikes

June 6th, 2018, 09:13 AM

Agree with returning talent, getting that NT back is huge.
I'm more concerned if your head coach is any good?
That's a fair thing to wonder about. This will only be his second year and he had a new coaching staff at just about every position last year including a new OC only a few weeks before the season started. With all that we lost four games to Texas Tech, NDSU, Weber and Southern Utah, all very good teams. I'm optimistic that he's going to be a good coach and continue to develop the program.

BEAR

June 6th, 2018, 11:32 AM

Hey I give UNH credit for taking what was given them. They played their @sses off. Watching their game the previous week I saw nothing but a battle for our team. I even spoke to a few UNH fans that travelled to UCA and was respectful about their team. I was impressed with their knowledge of our plays. Credit to their opponent scouting abilitites. But I also think after speaking to the players that watching a coach interview for another job the week of the game was disturbing to them.

But that was last season. UCA will have to prove itself again with only 12 seniors and a load of freshman. Head coach Nathan Brown has recruited where we need holes filled and watching some of the early practices we should be in contention for a top 25 early. Our away schedule is tough for such a young team but I'm sure they will do their best.

Go Bears!

Yote 53

June 6th, 2018, 11:57 AM

Streveler graduated, so basically yes.

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LOL. No. Just no. So many people are going to be eating crow this season. Yotes will be better than last year and will contend in the MVFC. It's fine with me if publications under rate USD, we haven't really done anything consistently to warrant a high ranking based on name alone. Just have to prove it on the field.

I would actually be more comfortable and confident about the upcoming season if I were a USD fan than an SDSU fan. USD loses an all-time great QB but the heir to the position has already demonstrated he can play, and play really well, coming in and winning two conference games last season. Physical maturity and upgrades in nearly every other position across the board, added depth, I feel really good about this team. The Jacks lost a ton from last year and it's going to be difficult to replace the losses. Lot more question marks at SDSU.

JSUSoutherner

June 6th, 2018, 12:16 PM

LOL. No. Just no. So many people are going to be eating crow this season. Yotes will be better than last year and will contend in the MVFC.

Has USD spent copious amounts of time pissed off in the weight room too?

UNHWildcat18

June 6th, 2018, 12:22 PM

Has USD spent copious amounts of time pissed off in the weight room too?

ugh my soul(if I had one) actually hurts from the burn UND is still getting over that.

clenz

June 6th, 2018, 12:29 PM

LOL. No. Just no. So many people are going to be eating crow this season. Yotes will be better than last year and will contend in the MVFC. It's fine with me if publications under rate USD, we haven't really done anything consistently to warrant a high ranking based on name alone. Just have to prove it on the field.

I would actually be more comfortable and confident about the upcoming season if I were a USD fan than an SDSU fan. USD loses an all-time great QB but the heir to the position has already demonstrated he can play, and play really well, coming in and winning two conference games last season. Physical maturity and upgrades in nearly every other position across the board, added depth, I feel really good about this team. The Jacks lost a ton from last year and it's going to be difficult to replace the losses. Lot more question marks at SDSU.

USD literally lost 90%+ of their offense with Streveler graduating. There was no threat on their offense outside of him. He was that good

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Yote 53

June 6th, 2018, 12:52 PM

USD literally lost 90%+ of their offense with Streveler graduating. There was no threat on their offense outside of him. He was that good

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Streveler was a huge part of the USD offense. Thing is, I've seen Simmons play and he's good. Came in and led USD to a 42-0 win over SIU. I'm not worried about replacing Streveler. But you all can keep on thinking the Coyotes lost the entire team and won't be any good. That's fine by me.

TheKingpin28

June 6th, 2018, 12:54 PM

LOL. No. Just no. So many people are going to be eating crow this season. Yotes will be better than last year and will contend in the MVFC. It's fine with me if publications under rate USD, we haven't really done anything consistently to warrant a high ranking based on name alone. Just have to prove it on the field.

I would actually be more comfortable and confident about the upcoming season if I were a USD fan than an SDSU fan. USD loses an all-time great QB but the heir to the position has already demonstrated he can play, and play really well, coming in and winning two conference games last season. Physical maturity and upgrades in nearly every other position across the board, added depth, I feel really good about this team. The Jacks lost a ton from last year and it's going to be difficult to replace the losses. Lot more question marks at SDSU.Cocaine is a hell of a drug

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CenMEBlackBearFan

June 6th, 2018, 01:09 PM

BisonFan02

June 6th, 2018, 02:20 PM

Mini-Tebow should have won the Payton last year, and the Yotes are a fraction of a team without him.

Thumper 76

June 6th, 2018, 03:00 PM

Streveler was a huge part of the USD offense. Thing is, I've seen Simmons play and he's good. Came in and led USD to a 42-0 win over SIU. I'm not worried about replacing Streveler. But you all can keep on thinking the Coyotes lost the entire team and won't be any good. That's fine by me.
Can’t think of any other quarterbacks who’ve looked good vs SIU.

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TheKingpin28

June 6th, 2018, 03:38 PM

Can’t think of any other quarterbacks who’ve looked good vs SIU.

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Let him keep going, I am enjoying this.

Yotes21

June 6th, 2018, 04:43 PM

Simmons is not Streveler by any means, but should be decent. I believe the WR corps and more importantly the OLine will be much improved this season, which hopefully will help the running game. The biggest upgrade has been building depth on the OL and DL which was a big problem. I could care less where USD is ranked in a pre-season poll which means nothing, hopefully other teams look past USD as much as you guys.

Bison Fan in NW MN

June 6th, 2018, 05:38 PM

KPSUL

June 6th, 2018, 06:59 PM

So the only real question this year is who wants the next beating in Frisco?xcoffeex

Pretty much the only pre-season prediction I'd be willing to bet on.

KPSUL

June 6th, 2018, 07:05 PM

I am psyched by UNH being rated #3 as we get to host you guys after losing by a missed xtra pt at your place last year. Gotta believe our coaching staff has this article pinned to the bulletin board and cannot think of anymore incentive as though there wasn't enough already to start the season.

Almost always a good one! Maine does have the home field advantage but playing the first game of the season should favor UNH - we have more returning from 2017. Plenty of motivation for both teams, I wouldn't be worried about what gets pinned to bulletin boards.

ElCid

June 6th, 2018, 08:06 PM

Well...while this is a new year and any poll is not a total reflection of last years final results, it seems to have a couple head scratchers. Trying to balance player losses, potential gains, coaching turmoil, injuries, schedule impacts/timing, and who knows what else, might have a few head scratchers. But this poll is hurting my scalp.

BisonFan02

June 6th, 2018, 11:16 PM

NDSU is a QB injury away from being very vulnerable....if Stick stays upright all year.....yeah....good luck.

Nickels

June 7th, 2018, 01:46 AM

NDSU is a QB injury away from being very vulnerable....if Stick stays upright all year.....yeah....good luck.
All sticks fall eventually.

Bisonoline

June 7th, 2018, 02:09 AM

NDSU is a QB injury away from being very vulnerable....if Stick stays upright all year.....yeah....good luck.

Very true. Plus I just dont know if we have somebody who can step in and be effective.

katss07

June 7th, 2018, 02:39 AM

Very true. Plus I just dont know if we have somebody who can step in and be effective.
Oh shut up your North Dakota State of course you do.

TheKingpin28

June 7th, 2018, 07:03 AM

Oh shut up your North Dakota State of course you do.This is the first year in awhile where it is actually true. 2 rFR this year going into camp with one having the slightly better arm and the other being slightly better at running. We will know more by Mid-August but if Stick goes down, it becomes an open field real quick.

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POD Knows

June 7th, 2018, 08:15 AM

NDSU is a QB injury away from being very vulnerable....if Stick stays upright all year.....yeah....good luck.Yea, NDSU would be in heap deep trouble if Stick goes down. Two RS Frosh as backups and neither one looks that impressive to date. Might have to go with Hendricks if Stick goes down, who knows.

Bisonator

June 7th, 2018, 11:20 AM

Yea, NDSU would be in heap deep trouble if Stick goes down. Two RS Frosh as backups and neither one looks that impressive to date. Might have to go with Hendricks if Stick goes down, who knows.
People were worried when Carson went down too. I wouldn't like to see Easton get hurt but Coach Hedberg does a great job with these guys and as long as Coach Mess doesn't try too much for them too early they could shine. Remember Easton was a RFr that did pretty good not long ago. Will be interesting to see who grabs that #2 spot in camp.

dewey

June 7th, 2018, 11:25 AM

People were worried when Carson went down too. I wouldn't like to see Easton get hurt but Coach Hedberg does a great job with these guys and as long as Coach Mess doesn't try too much for them too early they could shine. Remember Easton was a RFr that did pretty good not long ago. Will be interesting to see who grabs that #2 spot in camp.

Great point Bisonator. While the backups would not be nearly as good as Stick I think the Bison would simplify the game plan and place more emphasis on the running game like they did with Stick in 2015.

The defense is loaded again this year.

Dewey

JSUSoutherner

June 7th, 2018, 02:39 PM

Oh shut up your North Dakota State of course you do.

You're*

BisonFan02

June 7th, 2018, 04:50 PM

People were worried when Carson went down too. I wouldn't like to see Easton get hurt but Coach Hedberg does a great job with these guys and as long as Coach Mess doesn't try too much for them too early they could shine. Remember Easton was a RFr that did pretty good not long ago. Will be interesting to see who grabs that #2 spot in camp.

I had ALOT more faith in Stick than the guys we have now. Our resident scout "small" can attest to that when I gave him Sticks name before Wentz's senior season.

NDSU will have a QB problem after this year (unless we have an incoming freshman coming in)

andthehomeofthe-BIZON-

June 7th, 2018, 05:04 PM

I had ALOT more faith in Stick than the guys we have now. Our resident scout "small" can attest to that when I gave him Sticks name before Wentz's senior season.

NDSU will have a QB problem after this year (unless we have an incoming freshman coming in)

Not a Trey Lance fan?? Or is that what you were questioning/ referring too

This years battle for the backup will be fairly interesting, however, Next years battle for the starter will reallllly be interesting.

Schism55

June 7th, 2018, 05:19 PM

Not a Trey Lance fan?? Or is that what you were questioning/ referring too

This years battle for the backup will be fairly interesting, however, Next years battle for the starter will reallllly be interesting.
<--- This guy is. That kid has the potential to be phenomenal.

POD Knows

June 7th, 2018, 05:45 PM

People were worried when Carson went down too. I wouldn't like to see Easton get hurt but Coach Hedberg does a great job with these guys and as long as Coach Mess doesn't try too much for them too early they could shine. Remember Easton was a RFr that did pretty good not long ago. Will be interesting to see who grabs that #2 spot in camp.Good point, I just thought they looked a little weak at the spring game but who knows. Both have good size and I am sure the team is good enough to carry them if need be.

Bison Fan in NW MN

June 7th, 2018, 06:06 PM

Good point, I just thought they looked a little weak at the spring game but who knows. Both have good size and I am sure the team is good enough to carry them if need be.

Trey Lance will beat both the guys for the starter next year.

Bisonator

June 7th, 2018, 06:49 PM

I don't know how anybody can say what we have unless they've watched practice. The "spring game" isn't even a glorified scrimmage anymore.

TheKingpin28

June 7th, 2018, 07:11 PM

NoVABison

June 7th, 2018, 07:21 PM

Trey Lance will beat both the guys for the starter next year.

From what I understand, Trey Lance has "IT" when it comes to leadership ability... his skills are supposedly off the chart. As for his athletic abilities, we will know after he gets a couple of starts under his belt... but I am really excited about his potential. Randy Hedberg seems to do a great job of getting these young QBs ready.

IBleedYellow

June 7th, 2018, 07:47 PM

So what y'all are telling me is we reloaded at QB again?

I'm sure the rest of the FCS is happy to hear that.

Or the fact our first verbal commitment was a kid that had offers from P5 programs and choose to come to NDSU instead. Feels good.

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ST_Lawson

June 7th, 2018, 08:07 PM

With the RBs NDSU has, I feel like they could go completely without a QB, put 2-3 RBs in the back like a wildcat, and just change up who they direct snap it to every play. Who needs to throw when you've got those horses?

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BisonFan02

June 7th, 2018, 08:34 PM

Not a Trey Lance fan?? Or is that what you were questioning/ referring too

This years battle for the backup will be fairly interesting, however, Next years battle for the starter will reallllly be interesting.

That's what I'm questioning and referring to......wait and see, but he wouldn't (and shouldnt) be an answer this season.

Go Lehigh TU Owl

June 7th, 2018, 09:46 PM

BisonFan02

June 7th, 2018, 09:51 PM

Don't give them any ideas...lol

Not a new idea....its been and being done. xlolx

No wildcat though....they keep a QB out there to keep ya honest.

Derby City Duke

June 16th, 2018, 08:47 PM

Yea, NDSU would be in heap deep trouble if Stick goes down. Two RS Frosh as backups and neither one looks that impressive to date. Might have to go with Hendricks if Stick goes down, who knows.

This is an area the new redshirt rules will benefit NDSU. Klieman can feed both rFr snaps over the season to get them acclimated to the college game; that way they might buy some time if it's not a season-ender for Stick. All he really needs to do is hand off to any of the Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse...

Derby City Duke

June 16th, 2018, 08:51 PM

TheKingpin28

June 16th, 2018, 10:34 PM

This is an area the new redshirt rules will benefit NDSU. Klieman can feed both rFr snaps over the season to get them acclimated to the college game; that way they might buy some time if it's not a season-ender for Stick. All he really needs to do is hand off to any of the Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse...

This will be huge for Trey Lance. Both of our back-ups used their Redshirts last year so it will only benefit him, but we will get a good idea whether or not Trey will be QBing the Bison offense for a potential of 4 years or if one of the other two will be able to hold him off.

dewey

June 16th, 2018, 11:55 PM

Would call JMU a small reach at #2. In all honesty I'm not sure who to put there in the Dukes' place but they've got so many critical guys to replace. What hope it plays out as is the #2, 3, 6, or 7 seed come playoff time.

My objective opinion is they should be #4-6 here.

If NDSU is #1 and JMU were to be in the 4 to 5 range who would you put ahead of the Dukes? Just curious about your opinion.

Dewey

Derby City Duke

June 17th, 2018, 12:59 AM

If NDSU is #1 and JMU were to be in the 4 to 5 range who would you put ahead of the Dukes? Just curious about your opinion.

Dewey

I can see the following ahead of the Dukes (in no particular order):

Kennesaw State -- return the vast majority of its starters; defense was really good. In 2 road games in their first playoff run, beat JSU with the defense and made SHSU sweat in the quarters in Texas (had the benefit of a home game 1st round to get their feet wet). I'm not a 'how far' but rather a 'how well' in regard to the playoffs -- better measure of a team in my opinion.

Eastern Washington -- most players in critical positions return and the coach has his first year under his belt. Can't discount how far Gubrud could carry this team (see 2017 Streveler and USD). Think their 'snub' (my word, not an opinion to start a fight with anybody...:D) will be plenty of motivation to send a message early.

Weber State -- gave us everything we could handle last December (just re-watched the game this past week) from a defensive standpoint and Vollert was really a non-factor for them on the offensive side of the ball. Really good secondary. A good defense can carry a team a long way (see any Baltimore Ravens team, ever).

Don't get me wrong, I think JMU is going to be good by the end of the year. DiNucci is pushing Johnson hard in the QB race, they have a deep stable of RBs. Rashad Robinson and Jimmy Moreland will anchor the defensive backfield and the addition of the Ohio State xfer should add depth -- the kid may end up moving to safety, replacing one of the 2 graduated all-americans. WRs/TEs will have to step up as a group after losing Alls, Hyman, and Kloosterman. They have quality players in those slots, but only Stapleton really stood out (once he got healthy). The OL will miss Stinnie and they are relatively young (last year it was a real game of musical chairs at times). Patrick at C has the most experience, but they've got some guys who can play. The question is, can they gel and play well together?

I think the CAA overall will be better and deeper top to bottom. Wouldn't surprise me to see them make a real push for 5 in the playoffs this year. JMU was the 1st team to go undefeated in conference in back-to-back seasons. It would shock me if that happened for a 3rd straight year.

Hope this helps you understand how I got there.

katss07

June 17th, 2018, 03:36 AM

WeAreThePride

June 17th, 2018, 05:41 AM

PaladinFan

June 17th, 2018, 06:36 AM

I’m not sold on Kennesaw yet. I get why people like the potential, lots of returnees, good coach, made it far last year. Plus the great alumni support and good recruiting area.

Lucky for them, they have a schedule heavy with playoff teams (Monmouth, JSU and Samford). Will be interesting to see how far they can go.

I'm not sure they have great alumni support. KSU is a large commuter school with an enrollment of over 35,000. A whopping number of their alums live in the Atlanta area.

In spite of arguably having a large living alumni base, many of whom live in close proximity to the school, their attendance last year was just over 6,600. That's in line with, and even less than, many FCS schools with a tiny fraction of KSU's student population and alumni base.

That isn't to say the alumni did not support starting up the program and making intelligent hires. I don't think their alumns come out of the woodwork to back the football team, though.

WestCoastAggie

June 17th, 2018, 08:31 AM

Schism55

June 17th, 2018, 10:48 AM

There’s another team that plays a tough schedule and is in a less-respected conference, like Kennesaw, that should be getting more respect.
Win a playoff game?
Maybe?

NoVABison

June 17th, 2018, 11:05 AM

There’s another team that plays a tough schedule and is in a less-respected conference, like Kennesaw, that should be getting more respect.

A dominating win over JSU in the FCS kick off and I will take notice. Better yet... equal JMU's margin of victory over ECU and you definitely have my respect. Want to be an FCS titan? Do what FCS titan's do

WestCoastAggie

June 17th, 2018, 11:10 AM

cx500d

June 17th, 2018, 11:58 AM

There’s another team that plays a tough schedule and is in a less-respected conference, like Kennesaw, that should be getting more respect.

Who?

JSUSoutherner

June 17th, 2018, 05:44 PM

xwhistlex

https://media1.tenor.com/images/0d54f837436079d1cd815ec435a57aed/tenor.gif?itemid=4351333
Might want to chill till August and the results start rolling in. We haven't lost an FCS opener since 2007 and we've opened with better teams than A&T.

Terry2889

June 17th, 2018, 09:49 PM

UNH posted this on their website.... When I saw #3 I half cringed and half cried. We're not good enough to have a target on our back, regardless of how absurd the outlet it came from.

cx500d

June 17th, 2018, 09:50 PM

UNH posted this on their website.... When I saw #3 I half cringed and half cried. We're not good enough to have a target on our back, regardless of how absurd the outlet it came from.

Posted what?

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frozennorth

June 18th, 2018, 05:12 AM

Mini-Tebow should have won the Payton last year, and the Yotes are a fraction of a team without him.
Streveler was beater that Tebow

Serious post btw

clenz

June 18th, 2018, 01:34 PM

Streveler was beater that Tebow

Serious post btw

In college?

Rofl no.

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underdawg

June 18th, 2018, 01:39 PM

Streveler was a transfer--he has to be better

Schism55

June 18th, 2018, 01:40 PM

In college?

Rofl no.

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So much this. If you are making an all time college football team, I have zero problem if you picked Tebow as your qb. Dude was a nightmare for opponents.

BisonFan02

June 18th, 2018, 01:52 PM

So much this. If you are making an all time college football team, I have zero problem if you picked Tebow as your qb. Dude was a nightmare for opponents.

Tebow was a monster in college......Streveler played in the same vein/style, but you are on drugs if you compare them beyond that.

TheKingpin28

June 18th, 2018, 02:14 PM

So much this. If you are making an all time college football team, I have zero problem if you picked Tebow as your qb. Dude was a nightmare for opponents.He was on a whole different level. For the college game, he forced the box to be stacked which made the vertical game a cake walk. IMO one of the true first dual threat QBs of the 21st century. He'd make you pay regardless of what you did. 10k passing yards, 88 passing tds, almost 3000 rushing yds and 57 rushing tds. Just not fair.

I look back at the NCAA football games and he would wreck any opponent he could play against. It wasn't even fair if someone played as Florida and used him to run the offense.

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PaladinFan

June 18th, 2018, 02:44 PM

He was on a whole different level. For the college game, he forced the box to be stacked which made the vertical game a cake walk. IMO one of the true first dual threat QBs of the 21st century. He'd make you pay regardless of what you did. 10k passing yards, 88 passing tds, almost 3000 rushing yds and 57 rushing tds. Just not fair.

I look back at the NCAA football games and he would wreck any opponent he could play against. It wasn't even fair if someone played as Florida and used him to run the offense.

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I didn't follow the conversation in detail, but in my view, any proposed roster that doesn't have Tebow as the QB isn't worth reading. For my money, he had the best career of any collegiate QB in the history of the game. He would have dominated in any era against any competition.

TheKingpin28

June 18th, 2018, 02:48 PM

I didn't follow the conversation in detail, but in my view, any proposed roster that doesn't have Tebow as the QB isn't worth reading. For my money, he had the best career of any collegiate QB in the history of the game. He would have dominated in any era against any competition.Long story short, someone thought Streveler was better than Tebow and that was beyond laughable. Tebow is on his own level. Freak of nature who happened to be an elite COLLEGE QB who could also play pseudo-RB and truck the hell out of any defensive player trying to stop him.

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frozennorth

June 18th, 2018, 03:24 PM

So much this. If you are making an all time college football team, I have zero problem if you picked Tebow as your qb. Dude was a nightmare for opponents.
I always thought he was tremendously overrated. A great QB for Urban Meyers system? Absolutely.

PaladinFan

June 18th, 2018, 03:46 PM

I always thought he was tremendously overrated. A great QB for Urban Meyers system? Absolutely.

You must be joking. The guy was not a "system" QB. He dominated the NCAA for several years playing week in and week out what was then the top college football league in the country (by a country mile). He didn't play in some "fun and gun" or air raid offense in a league where nobody plays any defense.

Tebow didn't fit Urban Meyer's system. Urban Meyer built a system around the best athlete to ever play that position. Wouldn't you?

TheKingpin28

June 18th, 2018, 04:09 PM

JSUSoutherner

June 18th, 2018, 06:36 PM

PaladinFan

June 19th, 2018, 06:56 AM

Ehh. Give me Cam Newton.

Newton was elite for a single season. Tebow's numbers blow Newton's out of the water. I say that as an Auburn fan.

bigchocolate

June 19th, 2018, 08:56 AM

A dominating win over JSU in the FCS kick off and I will take notice. Better yet... equal JMU's margin of victory over ECU and you definitely have my respect. Want to be an FCS titan? Do what FCS titan's do

Are you serious?...to get consideration as a good team the Aggies must go in and dominate JSU and ECU? There is not a team in FCS football that can go into Greenville NC and do what JMU was able to do. That JMU team was not just good...that was a great team !!!! What unrealistic demands!

JSUSoutherner

June 19th, 2018, 09:25 AM

Newton was elite for a single season. Tebow's numbers blow Newton's out of the water. I say that as an Auburn fan.

Of course Tebow's numbers blow cam out of the water. Tebow played two more seasons than Cam did.

I'd still take Cam. Based on their pro careers I'd say it's a safe bet if Cam had three years in college his numbers would have gave Tebow a run for his money.

IBleedYellow

June 19th, 2018, 09:59 AM

Are you serious?...to get consideration as a good team the Aggies must go in and dominate JSU and ECU? There is not a team in FCS football that can go into Greenville NC and do what JMU was able to do. That JMU team was not just good...that was a great team !!!! What unrealistic demands!

They are wanting to be regarded as an elite FCS team. I can name two elite FCS squads right now. JMU and NDSU. What have they consistently done? Dominated the competition in all facets of the football game...no matter the opponent. Unless they play each other.

To be called elite isn't something everyone can achieve. That's the entire point.

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PaladinFan

June 19th, 2018, 10:23 AM

They are wanting to be regarded as an elite FCS team. I can name two elite FCS squads right now. JMU and NDSU. What have they consistently done? Dominated the competition in all facets of the football game...no matter the opponent. Unless they play each other.

To be called elite isn't something everyone can achieve. That's the entire point.

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I think the general point was that beating an FBS team on the road isn't necessarily an entrance marker to being an elite FCS team.

I have seen plenty of elite FCS teams struggle against top level FBS competition. Of course, I do not think ECU is a particularly good FBS team.

IBleedYellow

June 19th, 2018, 10:32 AM

I think the general point was that beating an FBS team on the road isn't necessarily an entrance marker to being an elite FCS team.

I have seen plenty of elite FCS teams struggle against top level FBS competition. Of course, I do not think ECU is a particularly good FBS team.An elite FCS squad should be able to beat anyone outside of the top 35 FBS programs.

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Redbird 4th & short

June 19th, 2018, 07:08 PM

An elite FCS squad should be able to beat anyone outside of the top 35 FBS programs.

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I was with you til this post ... anyone outside the top 35... that's pretty lofty considering there are about 125 FBS and 125 FCS teams. If forced to pick a FBS rank threshold for a an FCS team to be elite, I would start with something like this ... beating or competing with FBS teams ranked 30-50 makes you an elite team .. assuming you take care of business at FCS level. In 2016, ISUr beat what turned out to be a pretty good Northwestern team ... but we were maddeningly inconsistent on offense in 2016 (and 2017). So while we played at elite level at times in 2016 and 2017, we laid some serious eggs too .. several in 2016, and a couple in 2017.

Then there is always debate over "team" or "program" .. and I agree, there are only 2 "elite" programs right now .. NDSU and JMU. But there have been other elite "teams" in a given year and "programs" over multiple years.

Bison Fan in NW MN

June 19th, 2018, 07:30 PM

An elite FCS squad should be able to beat anyone outside of the top 35 FBS programs.

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Agree.

- - - Updated - - -

I was with you til this post ... anyone outside the top 35... that's pretty lofty considering there are about 125 FBS and 125 FCS teams. If forced to pick a FBS rank threshold for a an FCS team to be elite, I would start with something like this ... beating or competing with FBS teams ranked 30-50 makes you an elite team .. assuming you take care of business at FCS level. In 2016, ISUr beat what turned out to be a pretty good Northwestern team ... but we were maddeningly inconsistent on offense in 2016 (and 2017). So while we played at elite level at times in 2016 and 2017, we laid some serious eggs too .. several in 2016, and a couple in 2017.

Then there is always debate over "team" or "program" .. and I agree, there are only 2 "elite" programs right now .. NDSU and JMU. But there have been other elite "teams" in a given year and "programs" over multiple years.

There are always teams that catch lightening in a bottle for a year then come back down to earth. Ill State has done what since Roberson/Coprich?

TheKingpin28

June 19th, 2018, 08:01 PM

Agree.

- - - Updated - - -

There are always teams that catch lightening in a bottle for a year then come back down to earth. Ill State has done what since Roberson/Coprich?

Besides Spack having criminals on his team? xthumbsupx

Thumper 76

June 20th, 2018, 01:31 AM

Of course Tebow's numbers blow cam out of the water. Tebow played two more seasons than Cam did.

I'd still take Cam. Based on their pro careers I'd say it's a safe bet if Cam had three years in college his numbers would have gave Tebow a run for his money.
I think if it college success translated into the pros and vice versa Tom Brady and Aaron Rodgers would have been shoe ins for the Heisman...

They are wanting to be regarded as an elite FCS team. I can name two elite FCS squads right now. JMU and NDSU. What have they consistently done? Dominated the competition in all facets of the football game...no matter the opponent. Unless they play each other.

To be called elite isn't something everyone can achieve. That's the entire point.

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I know a team that hasn’t been dominated by ndsu recently :D

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Redbird 4th & short

June 20th, 2018, 09:41 AM

Agree.

- - - Updated - - -

There are always teams that catch lightening in a bottle for a year then come back down to earth. Ill State has done what since Roberson/Coprich?

That is my point, as a program ... ISUr was elite on the field for 2 years only.

Off the field in the class room, I would say Spack's program has most certainly been elite for the last 4 years .. at least by comparison to all other MVFC teams. Spack's 4 year avg APR from 2013-14 to 2016-17 is 971 ... no other MVFC team is even close .. not even schools with purported high "off the field" standards like UNI (962, 965, 963, 964) who averaged a 964 or NDSU (953, 951, 964, 975) which averaged 961.

What's even more impressive about Spacks performance in the class room is this .. do you have any idea how hard it is to get escaped convicts, murderers, rapists, and drug dealers to crack open a book or show up to class ... much less graduate on time, BETTER than any other MVFC team over the last 4 APR academic periods. I heard he puts those house arrest ankle bracelets on all of this players, just to make sure he knows when they are in class or library ... or the local crack house.

xdrunkyx

IBleedYellow

June 20th, 2018, 10:06 AM

I think if it college success translated into the pros and vice versa Tom Brady and Aaron Rodgers would have been shoe ins for the Heisman...

I know a team that hasn’t been dominated by ndsu recently :D

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You got dominated by the other elite team in the country, though ;)

IBleedYellow

June 20th, 2018, 10:14 AM

I was with you til this post ... anyone outside the top 35... that's pretty lofty considering there are about 125 FBS and 125 FCS teams. If forced to pick a FBS rank threshold for a an FCS team to be elite, I would start with something like this ... beating or competing with FBS teams ranked 30-50 makes you an elite team .. assuming you take care of business at FCS level. In 2016, ISUr beat what turned out to be a pretty good Northwestern team ... but we were maddeningly inconsistent on offense in 2016 (and 2017). So while we played at elite level at times in 2016 and 2017, we laid some serious eggs too .. several in 2016, and a couple in 2017.

Then there is always debate over "team" or "program" .. and I agree, there are only 2 "elite" programs right now .. NDSU and JMU. But there have been other elite "teams" in a given year and "programs" over multiple years.

Well hold on here. How does your 30-50 differ from my 35 number? Other than the fact yours has a little bit more room for error. Name some elite teams over the past 10-20 years. Almost all of them were beating their FBS competition during those years that they were known as being elite.

A true elite team is going to be looked at like it is damn near unstoppable - where the one or two games they lose they aren't really beaten, but they execute poorly (but still have a chance at winning the game) and it costs them.

clenz

June 20th, 2018, 10:31 AM

That is my point, as a program ... ISUr was elite on the field for 2 years only.

Off the field in the class room, I would say Spack's program has most certainly been elite for the last 4 years .. at least by comparison to all other MVFC teams. Spack's 4 year avg APR from 2013-14 to 2016-17 is 971 ... no other MVFC team is even close .. not even schools with purported high "off the field" standards like UNI (962, 965, 963, 964) who averaged a 964 or NDSU (953, 951, 964, 975) which averaged 961.

What's even more impressive about Spacks performance in the class room is this .. do you have any idea how hard it is to get escaped convicts, murderers, rapists, and drug dealers to crack open a book or show up to class ... much less graduate on time, BETTER than any other MVFC team over the last 4 APR academic periods. I heard he puts those house arrest ankle bracelets on all of this players, just to make sure he knows when they are in class or library ... or the local crack house.

xdrunkyx

It’s been clear for a while that you don’t understand APR. this just is the icing on the cake.

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clenz

June 20th, 2018, 11:08 AM

It’s also funny if we start looking at other sports - say men’s basketball - Illinois state is second to last in the MVC at 954. Meanwhile UNI is at 990. Women’s basketball UNI has a perfect 1000. Women’s track UNI is 992 ISU is 980. Volleyball UNI has never had anything other than a perfect 1000.

I’m not sure you want to start comping across the entire athletic department

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uni88

June 20th, 2018, 01:11 PM

Of course Tebow's numbers blow cam out of the water. Tebow played two more seasons than Cam did.

I'd still take Cam. Based on their pro careers I'd say it's a safe bet if Cam had three years in college his numbers would have gave Tebow a run for his money.Wasn't Cam Tebow's backup for one year at Florida? Why didn't he beat him out in the head-to-head?

Schism55

June 20th, 2018, 01:53 PM

Wasn't Cam Tebow's backup for one year at Florida? Why didn't he beat him out in the head-to-head?
Indeed, Cam transferred because he couldn't beat out Timmy Tebow.

JSUSoutherner

June 20th, 2018, 02:15 PM

Wasn't Cam Tebow's backup for one year at Florida? Why didn't he beat him out in the head-to-head?
Same reason Tua didn't start over Jalen Hurts last year. If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

Tua is obviously better than Hurts but Hurts was a veteran and they were winning so Tua rode the bench. No reason to mess with a winning formula.

PaladinFan

June 20th, 2018, 02:31 PM

Same reason Tua didn't start over Jalen Hurts last year. If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

Tua is obviously better than Hurts but Hurts was a veteran and they were winning so Tua rode the bench. No reason to mess with a winning formula.

You have all the hot takes right now.

Tagovailoa played sparingly this year and made key contributions on a national stage. He was probably a better matchup against UGA, who had a defense that would gobble up anyone's running game. Hurts is, what, 27-2 as a starter?

So, it's "obvious" that the backup, who didn't beat out Hurts for the starting job at any point last season, is the better QB? Based on what?

Mike296

June 20th, 2018, 02:32 PM

As for the best QB in college football thing is concerned, I’d go with one of three people. Peyton Manning, Russel Wilson or Michael Vick. If there’s any contention on this then oh well.

PaladinFan

June 20th, 2018, 02:33 PM

Wasn't Cam Tebow's backup for one year at Florida? Why didn't he beat him out in the head-to-head?

There is zero rational argument for putting Cam Newton ahead of Tim Tebow in the "who was a better college QB" discussion.

Take Newton's college career, do it for three more seasons, and you have Tebow's career.

PaladinFan

June 20th, 2018, 02:35 PM

As for the best QB in college football thing is concerned, I’d go with one of three people. Peyton Manning, Russel Wilson or Michael Vick. If there’s any contention on this then oh well.

Peyton Manning wasn't even the best QB in the SEC East his senior season. Danny Wuerffel was.

Daytripper

June 20th, 2018, 03:00 PM

As for the best QB in college football thing is concerned, I’d go with one of three people. Peyton Manning, Russel Wilson or Michael Vick. If there’s any contention on this then oh well.

I could make a case that three University of Houston QBs are better than those guys in college: Andre Ware, David Klingler, and Case Keenum.

But I think I am reinforcing your point....

Professor

June 20th, 2018, 04:29 PM

Indeed, Cam transferred because he couldn't beat out Timmy Tebow.

Whos laughing now tho

Professor

June 20th, 2018, 05:06 PM

There is zero rational argument for putting Cam Newton ahead of Tim Tebow in the "who was a better college QB" discussion.

Take Newton's college career, do it for three more seasons, and you have Tebow's career.

Tebow threw for less than 400 yards his freshman season. Leak led the Gators.

Redbird 4th & short

June 20th, 2018, 06:00 PM

Well hold on here. How does your 30-50 differ from my 35 number? Other than the fact yours has a little bit more room for error. Name some elite teams over the past 10-20 years. Almost all of them were beating their FBS competition during those years that they were known as being elite.

A true elite team is going to be looked at like it is damn near unstoppable - where the one or two games they lose they aren't really beaten, but they execute poorly (but still have a chance at winning the game) and it costs them.

I would have to dig in ... but it would depend on if/how well they dominated in a single year (Marshall 1997), or maybe didn't totally dominate any one year, but maybe won some championships over a period of time. I don't think Appy St needed to beat Michigan to be an elite team or program, but they were an elite program for a period of time. YSU was elite for a while under Tressell, though maybe no single team is in discussion as elite team in a single year .. but I would say they were an elite program for a period of time. Hard to say for Colonial from 2004-10 because they had a lot of very good teams that took turns ... so it's hard to say if any were elite teams or programs during that era.

Redbird 4th & short

June 20th, 2018, 06:23 PM

It’s been clear for a while that you don’t understand APR. this just is the icing on the cake.

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trolling with smoke screens again ... faced with facts, you still act like only your facts matter .. or your throw up ridiculous smoke screens .. or have a hissy fit.

I just put 100% facts in front of you, that show Spack knows why these kids go to college .. yet all you can do with that small narrow mind of yours is spew hate. You can't stop yourself, can you ?

Then you bring up basketball and all other sports at ISUr. Yes, basketball has a bad APR .. except I have never once posted about the basketball team or coach .. here or Redbird forum .. ok maybe once or twice on Redbird forum. But I have never defended their basketball program. In fact, privately I mostly criticize it for these very reasons. I just don't post because I don't follow them closely at all..

But you weren't done after distracting from ISUr football to basketball. You then called out "all other ISUr sports" into question ..,. didn't you ? Yet a further distraction from my post about Spack have the best APR in MVFC 3 of 4 years, and the best 4 year avg by far.

You can't stop your self, can you ? I have only posted about Spacks football program in defense of idiots like you, who have made their minds up. I have never posted about basketball or any other ISUr sports. Why are you now distracting from the topic. Probably because it doesn't fit the picture you have tried to paint of ISUr football .. people distract from the argument once they've lost, don't they ?

You need to stay focused with all your hateful BS. And be clear, I have never bashed your school or sports programs. I have only ever responded in comparison to your BS hate for all things ISUr .. right ??? Like the 3 star stud Spack kicked from team for grades issues, that UNI scooped right up a few years ago .. remember that one ? You rationalized that to death.

JSUSoutherner

June 20th, 2018, 09:04 PM

You have all the hot takes right now.

Tagovailoa played sparingly this year and made key contributions on a national stage. He was probably a better matchup against UGA, who had a defense that would gobble up anyone's running game. Hurts is, what, 27-2 as a starter?

So, it's "obvious" that the backup, who didn't beat out Hurts for the starting job at any point last season, is the better QB? Based on what?

The comeback against Georgia comes to mind. I'm guessing you didn't watch that game. It was night and day between Tua and Jalen. Tua's got himself one helluva an arm.

But you know, stats are the only thing that matters... Apparently.

FUBeAR

June 20th, 2018, 09:11 PM

Indeed, Cam transferred because he couldn't beat out Timmy Tebow.I don’t think Cam had a choice of whether to transfer or not. If I recall correctly, there was a stolen laptop that ended up as an incompletion out of Cam’s Dorm Room window when the UF Campus Police came-a-knockin’ one day. I believe there was an initial Felony charge also; hence, his sojourn off to JUCO for a while. Still wouldn’t have beat out Tebow...dude was amazing in college. I swear some NFL Coach shoulda been able to figger out how to win with St. Timothy leading their Team.

JSUSoutherner

June 20th, 2018, 09:25 PM

I don’t think Cam had a choice of whether to transfer or not. If I recall correctly, there was a stolen laptop that ended up as an incompletion out of Cam’s Dorm Room window when the UF Campus Police came-a-knockin’ one day. I believe there was an initial Felony charge also; hence, his sojourn off to JUCO for a while. Still wouldn’t have beat out Tebow...dude was amazing in college. I swear some NFL Coach shoulda been able to figger out how to win with St. Timothy leading their Team.

St. Timmy couldn't throw. His whole offense in college was dump offs to running backs, Percy Harvin, and Aaron Hernandez. Then they did all the heavy lifting. Yeah, Tebow was an electrifying running but his arm wasn't worth dick.

It's the same Urban Meyer dink and dunk offense that gave Curtis Samuel like 900 receiving yards out of the backfield in 2016 at OSU.

PaladinFan

June 21st, 2018, 07:56 AM

Tebow threw for less than 400 yards his freshman season. Leak led the Gators.

Correct, I'm just throwing his career in the Cam Newton light.

In his freshman and sophomore seasons, Newton threw for a total of 54 yards and had 4 touchdowns (all running). In his first two seasons as Florida, Tebow threw for 3500 yards and had 68 touchdowns (37 passing, 31 running).

I mean, there's just simply no comparison of the two careers. Newton had one phenomenal season at Auburn. Tebow effectively put together 3 of the same type of seasons at Florida and had far better success then Newton as a Freshman. Both were on the same team and Newton didn't play.

PaladinFan

June 21st, 2018, 08:09 AM

The comeback against Georgia comes to mind. I'm guessing you didn't watch that game. It was night and day between Tua and Jalen. Tua's got himself one helluva an arm.

But you know, stats are the only thing that matters... Apparently.

Watched every second of it. Tagovailoa is a good QB. I've watched enough football in my life to realize, though, that sometimes the backup QB is a tough matchup for a defense that has prepared for something different.

I'm challenging you on your statement that he is "obviously" a better QB than Hurts. Sure, he had a better game that day, but if he was "obviously" better why wasn't he the starter? Why was Nick Saban going with the "obviously" less talented QB in the national title game?

Maybe he's the best QB. I don't know. But it certainly isn't "obvious." At least it isn't "obvious" to Coach Saban.

JSUSoutherner

June 21st, 2018, 08:09 AM

Correct, I'm just throwing his career in the Cam Newton light.

In his freshman and sophomore seasons, Newton threw for a total of 54 yards and had 4 touchdowns (all running). In his first two seasons as Florida, Tebow threw for 3500 yards and had 68 touchdowns (37 passing, 31 running).

I mean, there's just simply no comparison of the two careers. Newton had one phenomenal season at Auburn. Tebow effectively put together 3 of the same type of seasons at Florida and had far better success then Newton as a Freshman. Both were on the same team and Newton didn't play.

Wow. Comparing two seasons where Tebow spent time as a starter to Cam Newton riding a bench. What an accurate and telling comparison.

You should compare Tim Tebow's 2011 Broncos season to Tom Brady's 2008 season. You'll see that Tebow is clearly the superior QB.

PaladinFan

June 21st, 2018, 11:43 AM

Wow. Comparing two seasons where Tebow spent time as a starter to Cam Newton riding a bench. What an accurate and telling comparison.

You should compare Tim Tebow's 2011 Broncos season to Tom Brady's 2008 season. You'll see that Tebow is clearly the superior QB.

You are either missing or intentionally obfuscating the point. This isn't about a single season, it's about a career. Newton had a great single season, but didn't have Tebow's career and, in fact, rode the bench while playing on the same team.

JSUSoutherner

June 21st, 2018, 11:47 AM

You are either missing or intentionally obfuscating the point. This isn't about a single season, it's about a career. Newton had a great single season, but didn't have Tebow's career and, in fact, rode the bench while playing on the same team.

Actually if you go back and read the thread this conversation is about who is a better player not who had the better career.

Thumper 76

June 21st, 2018, 01:05 PM

Actually if you go back and read the thread this conversation is about who is a better player not who had the better career.

Tebow was the better college player. Sorry. I’d take Vince Young over Cam as well.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

uni88

June 21st, 2018, 01:06 PM

Actually if you go back and read the thread this conversation is about who is a better player not who had the better career.I thought this line of discussion was about who was the better college QB. So by your comparison Cam's college career was like Tebow's pro career (1 great season) and Tebow's college career was like Brady's (sustained success).

JSUSoutherner

June 21st, 2018, 01:12 PM

Just because Tebow played more seasons doesn't make him better.

That's comparing Aaron Rodgers and Brett Farve's careers at the Packers. Farve currently has more accolades, more stats, and more wins.

But let's be real, we all know Rodgers is better.

PaladinFan

June 21st, 2018, 01:27 PM

JSUSoutherner

June 21st, 2018, 01:46 PM

It does. By virtually every objective measure, Tim Tebow was a better college player.

Just like Mark Ingram is better than Bo Jackson, right?

I mean Mark Ingram has more yards, touchdowns, pro bowls, wins, seasons. He's obviously better.

No. **** no. He just played longer.

Daytripper

June 21st, 2018, 01:53 PM

I think this is the very definition of "thread drift." This thread is about the FCS top 25.

JSUSoutherner

June 21st, 2018, 02:40 PM

It does. By virtually every objective measure, Tim Tebow was a better college player.

Hey, let's play a game of guess the QB!

I took Tebow's 07-09 seasons and Cam's 2010 season to get PER GAME stats.

QB A-
Passing Yards- 217.73
Passing TDs- 2.02
INTs- .366
Rating- 168.73

Rushing Yards- 60.4
Rushing TDs- 1.19
YPC- 4.1

Total Yards- 277.1
Total TDs- 3.21
Winning %- .875

QB B-
Passing Yards- 203.86
Passing TDs- 2.14
INTs- .5
Rating- 182

Rushing Yards- 105.21
Rushing TDs- 1.43
YPC- 5.6

Total Yards- 309.07
Total TDs- 3.57
Winning %- 1.00

PaladinFan

June 21st, 2018, 04:45 PM

Hey, let's play a game of guess the QB!

I took Tebow's 07-09 seasons and Cam's 2010 season to get PER GAME stats.

QB A-
Passing Yards- 217.73
Passing TDs- 2.02
INTs- .366
Rating- 168.73

Rushing Yards- 60.4
Rushing TDs- 1.19
YPC- 4.1

Total Yards- 277.1
Total TDs- 3.21
Winning %- .875

QB B-
Passing Yards- 203.86
Passing TDs- 2.14
INTs- .5
Rating- 182

Rushing Yards- 105.21
Rushing TDs- 1.43
YPC- 5.6

Total Yards- 309.07
Total TDs- 3.57
Winning %- 1.00

Again, you are changing the question to fit your answer. The point is not that Newton didn't have a great year. The point is that Tebow did what Newton did, but did it three times, not once.

JSUSoutherner

June 21st, 2018, 05:08 PM

Again, you are changing the question to fit your answer. The point is not that Newton didn't have a great year. The point is that Tebow did what Newton did, but did it three times, not once.

You really going to sit there and tell me you don't think Cam would have?

Literally the only thing you got going for Tebow is he played longer.

Iridebikes

June 21st, 2018, 05:14 PM

I think this is the very definition of "thread drift." This thread is about the FCS top 25.

I'll second your sentiment. This thread left the rails pages ago!!!

JSUSoutherner

June 21st, 2018, 05:17 PM

I'll second your sentiment. This thread left the rails pages ago!!!

I mean it's a thread based off an Athlon poll so it was pretty worthless to begin with.

PaladinFan

June 22nd, 2018, 07:59 AM

You really going to sit there and tell me you don't think Cam would have?

Literally the only thing you got going for Tebow is he played longer.

Uncle Rico would have been the greatest player in college football if he had played.

I can only go on what actually happened, not what didn't happen.

JSUSoutherner

June 22nd, 2018, 08:18 AM

Uncle Rico would have been the greatest player in college football if he had played.

I can only go on what actually happened, not what didn't happen.

So you're telling me Cam wasn't actually undefeated and put up better stats than Tebow? I just made that all up and it never actually happened?

PaladinFan

June 22nd, 2018, 08:33 AM

So you're telling me Cam wasn't actually undefeated and put up better stats than Tebow? I just made that all up and it never actually happened?

We will agree to disagree then.

JSUSoutherner

June 22nd, 2018, 08:45 AM

We will agree to disagree then.

I mean if you want to base it off of "he had the better career stats so he has to be better", Tebow isn't worthy of holding Case Keenum's jock strap.

WeAreThePride

June 22nd, 2018, 08:47 AM

I mean if you want to base it off of "he had the better career stats so he has to be better", Tebow isn't worthy of holding Case Keenum's jock strap.
It’s amazing someone can be this dense without reaching critical mass and detonating.

JSUSoutherner

June 22nd, 2018, 08:52 AM

It’s amazing someone can be this dense without reaching critical mass and detonating.

Literally I'm just going off his argument.

I show Cam is better per game than Tebow:

"Tebow had better career stats and played longer"

I use their logic and find the QB with the NCAA career total offense and TD records:

"You're just being stupid now"

So which is it? Is it based off career stats or how good he actually is?

PaladinFan

June 22nd, 2018, 12:45 PM

Literally I'm just going off his argument.

I show Cam is better per game than Tebow:

"Tebow had better career stats and played longer"

I use their logic and find the QB with the NCAA career total offense and TD records:

"You're just being stupid now"

So which is it? Is it based off career stats or how good he actually is?

No you aren't. You are creating a question that answers your conclusion.

- - - Updated - - -

It’s amazing someone can be this dense without reaching critical mass and detonating.

I was beginning to think it was just me.

JSUSoutherner

June 22nd, 2018, 12:55 PM

No you aren't. You are creating a question that answers your conclusion.

Really so you talking about how long Tim Tebow playedisn't actually your reasoning for why you think Tim Tebow is better?

So you say your argument isn't that longetevity equals quality?

So I guess I just misinterpreted all this then?

Newton was elite for a single season. Tebow's numbers blow Newton's out of the water.

Take Newton's college career, do it for three more seasons, and you have Tebow's career.

I mean, there's just simply no comparison of the two careers. Newton had one phenomenal season at Auburn. Tebow effectively put together 3 of the same type of seasons at Florida.

You are either missing or intentionally obfuscating the point. This isn't about a single season, it's about a career.

The point is that Tebow did what Newton did, but did it three times, not once.

uni88

June 22nd, 2018, 09:01 PM

Really so you talking about how long Tim Tebow playedisn't actually your reasoning for why you think Tim Tebow is better?

So you say your argument isn't that longetevity equals quality?

So I guess I just misinterpreted all this then?It isn't about longetivity but about sustained excellence.

frozennorth

June 22nd, 2018, 09:18 PM

Indeed, Cam transferred because he couldn't beat out Timmy Tebow.

Cam stole a laptop and transferred to avoid being expelled

frozennorth

June 22nd, 2018, 09:28 PM

You must be joking. The guy was not a "system" QB. He dominated the NCAA for several years playing week in and week out what was then the top college football league in the country (by a country mile). He didn't play in some "fun and gun" or air raid offense in a league where nobody plays any defense.

Tebow didn't fit Urban Meyer's system. Urban Meyer built a system around the best athlete to ever play that position. Wouldn't you?
meyer had been running that offense for years dude. I'm assuming you've heard of Alex Smith and that I don't have to explain this any further.

He played in a spread option system and was ideal for it. He's the definition of a system QB.

Are you really going to tell me that the best athlete ever at QB ever ran a 4.71? lololol he wasn't even the best athlete to play QB for Urban Meyer, nor was he (anywhere near) the best athlete at QB of his era, which would be Tyrell Pryor. Even Streveler ran a 4.52. Streveler smokes Tebow in a footrace.

JSUSoutherner

June 22nd, 2018, 09:57 PM

meyer had been running that offense for years dude. I'm assuming you've heard of Alex Smith and that I don't have to explain this any further.

He played in a spread option system and was ideal for it. He's the definition of a system QB.

Are you really going to tell me that the best athlete ever at QB ever ran a 4.71? lololol he wasn't even the best athlete to play QB for Urban Meyer, nor was he (anywhere near) the best athlete at QB of his era, which would be Tyrell Pryor.

This. Urban Meyer hangs his hat on turning mediocre QBs into greats.

Josh Harris
Braxton Miller
JT Barrett
Chris Leak
Cardale Jones

4 of the 5 guys on this list have championship rings, all of them had winning seasons, and none of them are anything spectacular. However, they all fit into Meyer's QB friendly system.

Tim Tebow was better than all those QBs but if you put him in any other type of offense he doesn't excel the way he did at UF. His arm was always suspect and his stats don't tell you about how he may have completely 66% of his passes, but an overwhelming majority of them were short throws to Percy Harvin and Aaron Hernandez as well as his running backs. People knew his arm wasn't great even before his Bronco days. Just read his combine profile. It was known.

Redbird 4th & short

June 22nd, 2018, 10:51 PM

It isn't about longetivity but about sustained excellence.
wait .. are we still talking about football or not ??

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PaladinFan

June 24th, 2018, 09:57 AM

meyer had been running that offense for years dude. I'm assuming you've heard of Alex Smith and that I don't have to explain this any further.

He played in a spread option system and was ideal for it. He's the definition of a system QB.

Are you really going to tell me that the best athlete ever at QB ever ran a 4.71? lololol he wasn't even the best athlete to play QB for Urban Meyer, nor was he (anywhere near) the best athlete at QB of his era, which would be Tyrell Pryor. Even Streveler ran a 4.52. Streveler smokes Tebow in a footrace.

The best athlete I ever saw play QB was Armanti Edwards at App State.

I didn't say Tebow was the best athlete to play QB. There are more athletic players. There are guys with more passing yards. That isn't the question.

Tebow was unstoppable during his career at Florida. Far supeiror to Alex Smith or JT Barrett, in my opinion. He also did it in the SEC, which is and most certainly was at that time the best football conference in the country. We aren't talking about a guy that lit up the Mountain West or Conference USA. We are talking about a guy that put up eye popping numbers against elite college teams nearly every single week for the better part of three seasons.

You can make the "system QB" argument for virtually any great QB at the college level with the possible exceptions of guys like Matthew Stafford and Andrew Luck, who played in one of the few true prostyle systems.

Bison Fan in NW MN

June 24th, 2018, 10:53 AM

This. Urban Meyer hangs his hat on turning mediocre QBs into greats.

Josh Harris
Braxton Miller
JT Barrett
Chris Leak
Cardale Jones

4 of the 5 guys on this list have championship rings, all of them had winning seasons, and none of them are anything spectacular. However, they all fit into Meyer's QB friendly system.

Tim Tebow was better than all those QBs but if you put him in any other type of offense he doesn't excel the way he did at UF. His arm was always suspect and his stats don't tell you about how he may have completely 66% of his passes, but an overwhelming majority of them were short throws to Percy Harvin and Aaron Hernandez as well as his running backs. People knew his arm wasn't great even before his Bronco days. Just read his combine profile. It was known.

Big deal what kind of passing game Florida had.

Tebow, hands down, was a better college QB then Cam.

Pro is another discussion.

cx500d

June 24th, 2018, 08:21 PM

JSUSoutherner

June 24th, 2018, 11:24 PM

What about Alex Smith?
Alex Smith was a good QB with or without Urban Meyer. He played well in the system but still had the tools available to excel elsewhere.