Do you guys think we'll see more conference realignment in FCS in the next 2-5 years?

[ASU33]

?

[BisonFan02]

yes

[kdinva]

Should Tennessee State take Savannah State's place in the MEAC? Although Nashville is closer to most of the SWAC schools....Monmouth needs a NE based league for its FB team....and need about 3 more FCS FB schools in the west, so NAU, SUU, Weber St, CPSLO, et al, can have their own, more geographically suited conference.

[Daytripper]

I have no idea.

[jmufan999]

I mean, none of us really has any idea. If you want to speculate, why not just go ahead with whatever you were thinking?

[citdog]

http://knotsosubtle.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/11/magic8ball.png

[BisonTru]

The Big 12 is the major domino to fall when they decide to expand, IMO. It will trickle down from there.

[jacksfan29]

The Big 12 is going to collapse and cease to exist. The better schools will get swallowed by the remaining P4, the rest will go to the AAC or MWC.

I think the biggest FCS changes will come in the west. The WAC are going to continue to look to D2 for expansion candidates. If they can get two or three D2 FB schools to bite, and NMSU finally get it and move down, expect the WAC to get serious about starting FCS FB. If that happens I would expect some of the southern tier of the BSC along with Poly and Davis to look to the WAC. The west could use a second FCS conference. In fact, its needed.

Weber

The Big 12 is the major domino to fall when they decide to expand, IMO. It will trickle down from there.

[BisonTru]

The Big 12 is going to collapse and cease to exist. The better schools will get swallowed by the remaining P4, the rest will go to the AAC or MWC.

I think the biggest FCS changes will come in the west. The WAC are going to continue to look to D2 for expansion candidates. If they can get two or three D2 FB schools to bite, and NMSU finally get it and move down, expect the WAC to get serious about starting FCS FB. If that happens I would expect some of the southern tier of the BSC along with Poly and Davis to look to the WAC. The west could use a second FCS conference. In fact, its needed.

Weber

I don't see the Big 12 collapsing as long as Texas is aboard, and Texas is making a lot of money off their exclusive TV deal which any other conference would likely make them give up. So I don't see them leaving. Plenty of schools are actively pushing to join. It's a matter of time and who, IMO.

[walliver]

The Big South may pick up a Pioneer team or two. Most of the Eastern and Southern conferences are fairly stable. The MVFC is in danger of becoming too big as is the Big Sky, and the two of them should split into 3 geographically reasonable conferences - but they probably won't.

[Anthony215]

The Big 12 is going to collapse and cease to exist. The better schools will get swallowed by the remaining P4, the rest will go to the AAC or MWC.

I think the biggest FCS changes will come in the west. The WAC are going to continue to look to D2 for expansion candidates. If they can get two or three D2 FB schools to bite, and NMSU finally get it and move down, expect the WAC to get serious about starting FCS FB. If that happens I would expect some of the southern tier of the BSC along with Poly and Davis to look to the WAC. The west could use a second FCS conference. In fact, its needed.

Weber

If the Big 12 did dissolve I believe Texas, Oklahoma and Oklahoma State would all head to the SEC, WVU would probably bolt for the ACC, Baylor & TCU would look to the PAC 10 along with Kansas, Texas Tech would probably look to the Mountain West and Kansas State & Iowa State both would look to be west imprints in the AAC where there basketball programs can flourish

[jacksfan29]

I don't see the Big 12 collapsing as long as Texas is aboard, and Texas is making a lot of money off their exclusive TV deal which any other conference would likely make them give up. So I don't see them leaving. Plenty of schools are actively pushing to join. It's a matter of time and who, IMO.
Oklahoma are still reported as wanting out, desperately. If they leave Texas won't have a choice.

As for the schools looking to join, the AAC and MWC schools who want to move up have one and only one shot left. The window is closing and they know it. The only problem is the Big 12 (namely Texas and OK) don't want them. Something which was made rather clear during the last round of Big 12 expansion talks.

[tierre]

I do believe there will be conference changes. The SWAC haven't had a new member addition in all sports since 1998 when Alabama A&M joined. I think that FAMU would leave the MEAC for the SWAC (Travel expenses has to be killing them). I am also concerned about a lot of MEAC schools future in FCS. I see that some MEAC schools and some schools in Virginia are charging over $1000 a year to students to fund their athletic programs.

[Bucs2016]

The Big South may pick up a Pioneer team or two. Most of the Eastern and Southern conferences are fairly stable. The MVFC is in danger of becoming too big as is the Big Sky, and the two of them should split into 3 geographically reasonable conferences - but they probably won't.

^ This.

[Bucs2016]

Oklahoma are still reported as wanting out, desperately. If they leave Texas won't have a choice.

As for the schools looking to join, the AAC and MWC schools who want to move up have one and only one shot left. The window is closing and they know it. The only problem is the Big 12 (namely Texas and OK) don't want them. Something which was made rather clear during the last round of Big 12 expansion talks.

The SEC should just pull the trigger and offer Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Kansas (hoops and KU/Mizzou rivalry) and Texas and tell em first 2 to accept are in and no more.

[ASU33]

I do believe there will be conference changes. The SWAC haven't had a new member addition in all sports since 1998 when Alabama A&M joined. I think that FAMU would leave the MEAC for the SWAC (Travel expenses has to be killing them). I am also concerned about a lot of MEAC schools future in FCS. I see that some MEAC schools and some schools in Virginia are charging over $1000 a year to students to fund their athletic programs.

It's more likely for us(Alabama State) and Alabama A&M to leave the SWAC for the MEAC than it would be for FAMU joining the SWAC.

[BisonTru]

Oklahoma are still reported as wanting out, desperately. If they leave Texas won't have a choice.

As for the schools looking to join, the AAC and MWC schools who want to move up have one and only one shot left. The window is closing and they know it. The only problem is the Big 12 (namely Texas and OK) don't want them. Something which was made rather clear during the last round of Big 12 expansion talks.

Why do they have one shot left and what do you mean the window is closing?

[UNHWildcat18]

Not sure what will happen in the north east. The CAA is stable and made a commitment to having not only 63 scholarships but stadium size requirements as well. Correct me if I'm wrong but pretty sure they told albany it need to be 8000k plus for them to join. Simply put no NEC team is close to having the brand name or stadium size to be in the CAA regardless if they said they would go 63. The PL doesn't look like it will change in terms of membership either. I don't see any D2 teams moving up to the NEC.

The only wild card is monmouth. better brand than NEC teams due to basketball, 63 scholarships and not allowed in NEC, nice new stadium but 4400k even if the CAA was looking would probably not get them in.

Northeast looks stagnant and stable.

[Mike296]

Looking at the current Conference pictures I can see a few possibilities:

1. The Big South grabbing 1-2 members from another conference, making the possibility for a few D2 schools to possibly move up to a conference like the MEAC or SWAC depending on who leaves.

The teams I currently think could jump ship from another conference goes as follows:

Florida A&M
Alabama A&M
Alabama State
Jville State(I'll explain this later)

Now as far as D2 teams moving up, this really is just teams that fit the Geography threshold for the Big South, MEAC and SWAC respectively.

North Alabama
Valdosta State
West Alabama
Florida Tech
SW Baptist
NW Missouri State

There's probably more but you get the idea.

2. Big South Folding all together:

The way the conference currently stands, it would hardly be a surprise to me if it goes under like the WAC did a few years ago in the FBS.

3. The WAC re-forming as an FCS conference:

This isn't out of the realm of possibility but it would take a lot of effort from everyone involved to pull this off.

If NMSU follow's in Idaho's steps we could see something interesting occur.

4. Teams forming teams in conferences they're already members of:

We've seen this twice already in Kennesaw State and ETSU.

With some convincing, there is a slight possibility of seeing a few new programs pop up in the near future.

5. Jacksonville State to MVFC

Before you guys start moaning at how dumb I am for even thinking this, let me explain first.

In recent years Jville State has outgrown the OVC as far as power level goes.

The last few seasons we've seen them consistently perform well against high level opposition. The one blemish being their title game defeat to NDSU, but I'll let that one slide considering how crazy good NDSU was that season compared to the rest of the FCS as a whole.

If Missouri State is a MVFC team, how far off is it to think that a team such as Jville State couldn't jump ship to the MVFC? It may involve several other changes to the MVFC as a whole but, as unrealistic as that may sound, Jville State are outgrowing their conference at a staggering level and it's only a matter of time before we see something occur whether the make the jump up to FBS like Coastal did, or we see them try and get into a conference that suits their level as a team.

[Cocky]

Would love to play those caliber of teams but my travel budget would not allow me to view many.
JSU has one difference than most schools in the OVC, we would like to win in all sports not just basketball.

[PaladinFan]

Would love to play those caliber of teams but my travel budget would not allow me to view many.
JSU has one difference than most schools in the OVC, we would like to win in all sports not just basketball.

I don't even know how accurate my opinion is on this, but I have always thought JSU was not an attractive conference partner simply because it never seemed like they were truly committed to the FCS. However, I've said that for 10 years and it may just be Jacksonville State is staying at the FCS level long term.

I'm still in favor of the SoCon trying to pick up Kennesaw State and Jacksonville State.

[Laker]

Now as far as D2 teams moving up, this really is just teams that fit the Geography threshold for the Big South, MEAC and SWAC respectively.

North Alabama
Valdosta State
West Alabama
Florida Tech
SW Baptist
NW Missouri State

Southwest Baptist??? As a D2 guy I'd like to know your reasoning on that. Too small of a school, no football success- just don't see that as a possibility.

My NW Mo State friends mostly say the same as Grand Valley- neither want to move up.

Florida Tech has the most potential of moving from the teams that you listed.

[Mike296]

Southwest Baptist??? As a D2 guy I'd like to know your reasoning on that. Too small of a school, no football success- just don't see that as a possibility.

My NW Mo State friends mostly say the same as Grand Valley- neither want to move up.

Florida Tech has the most potential of moving from the teams that you listed.

That one was a "longshot" pick to begin with, sure most of these probably won't move but I was choosing teams based on geography and SW Baptist would kinda fit in the SWAC if they ever got really good. They had a good season last year though so who's to say they couldn't keep the good streak going.

These picks were purely Geography based so if you look at it from that perspective SW Baptist does fit the profile for the SWAC.

As far as them being a small school:

I didn't really pick these schools based on size, when looking at the profiles of the SWAC and MEAC you have very little to choose from that makes sense travel wise

[BEAR]

Southwest Baptist??? As a D2 guy I'd like to know your reasoning on that. Too small of a school, no football success- just don't see that as a possibility.

My NW Mo State friends mostly say the same as Grand Valley- neither want to move up.

Florida Tech has the most potential of moving from the teams that you listed.

That didn't stop Houston Baptist...xlolx

[aceinthehole]

Not sure what will happen in the north east. The CAA is stable and made a commitment to having not only 63 scholarships but stadium size requirements as well. Correct me if I'm wrong but pretty sure they told albany it need to be 8000k plus for them to join. Simply put no NEC team is close to having the brand name or stadium size to be in the CAA regardless if they said they would go 63. The PL doesn't look like it will change in terms of membership either. I don't see any D2 teams moving up to the NEC.

The only wild card is monmouth. better brand than NEC teams due to basketball, 63 scholarships and not allowed in NEC, nice new stadium but 4400k even if the CAA was looking would probably not get them in.

Northeast looks stagnant and stable.

NEC expansion options are pretty limited, and most scenarios remain unlikely:

NEC - Marist (Pioneer), Delaware State (MEAC), Georgetown (Patriot), Morgan State (MEAC),

Potential D-II upgrades will most likely come from the NE-10 or PSAC:

Bentley (NE-10), Merrimack (NE-10), New Haven (NE-10)
West Chester (PSAC), Indiana, Pa (PSAC), Kutztown (PSAC)

[BisonBacker]

Just curious if any of the MVFC guys knows does the MVFC have a minimum stadium capacity?

[ElCid]

I don't even know how accurate my opinion is on this, but I have always thought JSU was not an attractive conference partner simply because it never seemed like they were truly committed to the FCS. However, I've said that for 10 years and it may just be Jacksonville State is staying at the FCS level long term.

I'm still in favor of the SoCon trying to pick up Kennesaw State and Jacksonville State.

Well, from a geographic standpoint, JSU would be alright, but as many have pointed out, I am not sure that it is good from an academic/institution type aspect. I think KSU has obvious FBS ambitions although the Atlanta market may be saturated and they could very well languish for years, so maybe. If the Big South, goes south in the near future, I would interested to see if some sort of mega SOCON growth is possible, or even desired.

[ST_Lawson]

Just curious if any of the MVFC guys knows does the MVFC have a minimum stadium capacity?

Not that I've ever heard. The smallest stadium in the conference currently is the DakotaDome at 10k seats (weren't they talking about expanding that a little when they were building the sports center right next to it?...or was that just for things like offices and stuff?), and then Indiana State's 1-sided field and UND's Alerus Center (once they officially join) are in the 12k+ range...everyone else is bigger than that.

Some of the other teams mentioned as possibly joining the MVFC if some crazy realignment happens include:
Murray State - 16.8k seats
Eastern IL - 10k seats
Jacksonville State (I don't really see that happening) - plenty big at 24k

I don't think any of the possibilities mentioned have less than a 10k seat stadium.

[Thumper 76]

Not that I've ever heard. The smallest stadium in the conference currently is the DakotaDome at 10k seats (weren't they talking about expanding that a little when they were building the sports center right next to it?...or was that just for things like offices and stuff?), and then Indiana State's 1-sided field and UND's Alerus Center (once they officially join) are in the 12k+ range...everyone else is bigger than that.

Some of the other teams mentioned as possibly joining the MVFC if some crazy realignment happens include:
Murray State - 16.8k seats
Eastern IL - 10k seats
Jacksonville State (I don't really see that happening) - plenty big at 24k

I don't think any of the possibilities mentioned have less than a 10k seat stadium.

I think the only way the MVFC expands is if the MVC adds a team that needs a home for their FCS team (Murray St). Otherwise I'm not sure they have much reason to. However the MVFC could possibly end up being the catalyst of major conference realignment in FCS. That all depends on what happens with who the MVC takes and what sort of chain reaction that causes to happen to the Summit League. If the end result is several (likely eastern) Summit teams to get grabbed by the Horizon, and worse case if its three teams, it could cause the Dakotas to start shopping themselves around possibly. Then who knows what happens. That could end up with all sorts of possibilities ranging from the unlikely like a new western conference of state schools to the Dakotas finding a different bball conference and staying put in the MVFC. If they did end up leaving then teams like JSU come into play, but realistically I don't see any of that happening.

[citdog]

I'm still in favor of the SoCon trying to pick up Kennesaw State and Jacksonville State.

We have the perfect number of members at present.

[BadlandsGrizFan]

The Big Sky is already way to big....Foolerton decided to focus on helping all the small **** programs like UNC, SUU, UCD etccc..... that he ended up crippling his bell cows in the Montanas. The BSC is so watered down its a joke.


The Big South may pick up a Pioneer team or two. Most of the Eastern and Southern conferences are fairly stable. The MVFC is in danger of becoming too big as is the Big Sky, and the two of them should split into 3 geographically reasonable conferences - but they probably won't.

[BadlandsGrizFan]

The SEC should just pull the trigger and offer Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Kansas (hoops and KU/Mizzou rivalry) and Texas and tell em first 2 to accept are in and no more.
Texas wouldnt bat an eye...theyre that arrogant...and powerful frankly.

[Anthony215]

NEC expansion options are pretty limited, and most scenarios remain unlikely:

NEC - Marist (Pioneer), Delaware State (MEAC), Georgetown (Patriot), Morgan State (MEAC),

Potential D-II upgrades will most likely come from the NE-10 or PSAC:

Bentley (NE-10), Merrimack (NE-10), New Haven (NE-10)
West Chester (PSAC), Indiana, Pa (PSAC), Kutztown (PSAC)

Being an avid D2 follower the only PSAC school with the resources and following to move up to FCS is IUP & West Chester. However IUP's football stadium would rank near the bottom of the NEC. WCU is well under 15 scholarships so they'd need an influx of donor support to get up to the NEC requirement of 40 scholarships. Kutztown's stadium is nice but on the small side and they have under 10 scholarships so they're out too.

[walliver]

Well, from a geographic standpoint, JSU would be alright, but as many have pointed out, I am not sure that it is good from an academic/institution type aspect. I think KSU has obvious FBS ambitions although the Atlanta market may be saturated and they could very well languish for years, so maybe. If the Big South, goes south in the near future, I would interested to see if some sort of mega SOCON growth is possible, or even desired.

I don't see a mega SoCon anytime soon. 12 teams in basketball didn't work out well before, and going to 16+ would be worse. The SoCon could have picked from anyone in the Big South when GSU, ASU, and that other school left, but chose only VMI.
9 football teams and 10 BB teams works out great for scheduling.

[Sader87]

I'm still of the belief that Villanova will go PL in football within the next 5 or so years.

[ElCid]

I don't see a mega SoCon anytime soon. 12 teams in basketball didn't work out well before, and going to 16+ would be worse. The SoCon could have picked from anyone in the Big South when GSU, ASU, and that other school left, but chose only VMI.
9 football teams and 10 BB teams works out great for scheduling.

Oh I agree, I am just trying to look into the future if the geography changes in the whole subdivision. I was really pondering, if consolidation starts across the board, would we sit it out or join in the fracas?

[cx500d]

Texas won't go to SEC because of Texas A&M.


Texas wouldnt bat an eye...theyre that arrogant...and powerful frankly.

[ST_Lawson]

I think the only way the MVFC expands is if the MVC adds a team that needs a home for their FCS team (Murray St)...

I agree with you. I don't think it's likely outside of Murray State if they get invited to the MVC.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[GodHelpTheBears]

Southwest Baptist??? As a D2 guy I'd like to know your reasoning on that. Too small of a school, no football success- just don't see that as a possibility.

My NW Mo State friends mostly say the same as Grand Valley- neither want to move up.

Florida Tech has the most potential of moving from the teams that you listed.

I'm trying to think of a word that would adequately describe a SBU-Missouri State rivalry without swearing and I can't do it.

As entertaining as it would be, we would both be anchored to the bottom of FCS, as there is not enough talent in the Ozarks to support even one team at this level.

[DFW HOYA]

I'm still of the belief that Villanova will go PL in football within the next 5 or so years.

And Holy Cross could join the Big East. Neither is happening.

In the past, a team might have considered the PL as one of three options: 1) cost-containment, 2) an easier path to an at-large bid, or 3) access to the Ivy League for scheduling. Today's it's none of the three. A PL budget and and a CAA budget are substantially the same except for Georgetown, the PL has not demonstrated of late it can earn multiple at-large bids as the CAA and Valley do, and the Ivy is moving to a a variety of conferences to fill out its schedule.

As to the Big East, look at what Xavier slowly but methodically did over the 15 years to elevate its program from the "who's that" to the "who's who" of the sport--from what is now known as the Horizon League to the A-10 to being a realistic Big East candidate. They ditched the Schmitt Fieldhouse, hired great young coaches, played games downtown, and scheduled all comers. Twelve NCAA bids in 13 seasons made them a strong choice to replace Cincinnati. If HC had any foresight, that would have been the blueprint for being Boston College's replacement instead of thinking that the Hart Center would make the case.

[Gangtackle11]

And Holy Cross could join the Big East. Neither is happening.

In the past, a team might have considered the PL as one of three options: 1) cost-containment, 2) an easier path to an at-large bid, or 3) access to the Ivy League for scheduling. Today's it's none of the three. A PL budget and and a CAA budget are substantially the same except for Georgetown, the PL has not demonstrated of late it can earn multiple at-large bids as the CAA and Valley do, and the Ivy is moving to a a variety of conferences to fill out its schedule.

As to the Big East, look at what Xavier slowly but methodically did over the 15 years to elevate its program from the "who's that" to the "who's who" of the sport--from what is now known as the Horizon League to the A-10 to being a realistic Big East candidate. They ditched the Schmitt Fieldhouse, hired great young coaches, played games downtown, and scheduled all comers. Twelve NCAA bids in 13 seasons made them a strong choice to replace Cincinnati. If HC had any foresight, that would have been the blueprint for being Boston College's replacement instead of thinking that the Hart Center would make the case.

Exactly. No reason to move now that you guys offer schollies & budgets are within reach of Villanova's current football budgets. The PL is at most a 2 team bid league while CAA is 3/4 team bid league most seasons.

It appears that Nova is very happy scheduling 2 PL teams a season.

[kdinva]

SoCon.....9 football teams and 10 BB teams works out great for scheduling.

xthumbsupx xhighfivex

[Go...gate]

And Holy Cross could join the Big East. Neither is happening.

In the past, a team might have considered the PL as one of three options: 1) cost-containment, 2) an easier path to an at-large bid, or 3) access to the Ivy League for scheduling. Today's it's none of the three. A PL budget and and a CAA budget are substantially the same except for Georgetown, the PL has not demonstrated of late it can earn multiple at-large bids as the CAA and Valley do, and the Ivy is moving to a a variety of conferences to fill out its schedule.

As to the Big East, look at what Xavier slowly but methodically did over the 15 years to elevate its program from the "who's that" to the "who's who" of the sport--from what is now known as the Horizon League to the A-10 to being a realistic Big East candidate. They ditched the Schmitt Fieldhouse, hired great young coaches, played games downtown, and scheduled all comers. Twelve NCAA bids in 13 seasons made them a strong choice to replace Cincinnati. If HC had any foresight, that would have been the blueprint for being Boston College's replacement instead of thinking that the Hart Center would make the case.

Like D-II Ohio Dominican.....

[Go...gate]

Exactly. No reason to move now that you guys offer schollies & budgets are within reach of Villanova's current football budgets. The PL is at most a 2 team bid league while CAA is 3/4 team bid league most seasons.

It appears that Nova is very happy scheduling 2 PL teams a season.

It does appear that some of the PL is moving to more frequent scheduling of the CAA in place of the Ivy. I'm not happy about it, but that seems to be the reality.

[dgtw]

9 football teams and 10 BB teams works out great for scheduling.

I agree it is a great situation. It gives you a 4/4 schedule in football and you can play a full round robin. Then the non-football school gives you even number for other sports.

I just want out of the hot mess that is the OVC and I see no escape.

[BadlandsGrizFan]

They havent had an issue with disregarding A&M before..lol


Texas won't go to SEC because of Texas A&M.

[Catatonic]

Texas wouldnt bat an eye...theyre that arrogant...and powerful frankly.

Texas won't go to the SEC because they would have to share decision making power and revenue more equitably than in the B12. The arrogance down in Austin has effectively strangled the B12.

[Daytripper]

Texas won't go to the SEC because they would have to share decision making power and revenue more equitably than in the B12. The arrogance down in Austin has effectively strangled the B12.

This is correct.

[jacksfan29]

Texas won't go to the SEC because they would have to share decision making power and revenue more equitably than in the B12. The arrogance down in Austin has effectively strangled the B12.

They can go Independent once Oklahoma bolts. In FB that is likely their best option. So then the question becomes, where do their other sports land?

[Sammy94]

Texas wouldnt bat an eye...theyre that arrogant...and powerful frankly.

Texas will go independent if the Big XII dissolves. They are arrogant and another conference will expect them to get rid of their network and that isn't going to happen. Oklahoma will leave only if Okie St goes with them, I think the Big XII will be around a bit longer.

[centennial]

Question to JSU fans. Y'all fine with placing 4th in the MVFC and becoming the new UNI? We are already as strong as the Sun Belt, MAC. What would be the point in going to a FBS level conference without additional investment? You'll have the same problems as the SEC West teams.

Now if in a distopian future we become a FBS conference. Then let's all band together and become the new AAC.

[Yote 53]

You guys haven't been keeping up with the latest developments on Big 12 realignment, have you? Just rolled out in an Oklahoma paper recently, a trial balloon, that OU #1) wants to make the Big 12 healthy and strong, but #2) since we all know it's just a matter of time for the B12, OU's first choice is the BIG and would go alone if invited, and #3) if the BIG does not offer would consider the SEC and PAC if there were certain concessions given (OSU is allowed to come along).

The major takeaway is that OU wants to go to the BIG and that they are not attached to OSU.

I think you can book KU and OU to the BIG in a couple of years.

[Yote 53]

As to FCS realignment, there is grumbling out of the Dakotas about the Summit situation. There is grumbling out of Montanas about the downgrading of the BSC in their eyes. I think we'll see a Big North conference emerge out a merging of the Summit and BSC. We'll end up with 3 FCS conferences in the west, which is probably what it should be.

[Laker]

As to FCS realignment, there is grumbling out of the Dakotas about the Summit situation. There is grumbling out of Montanas about the downgrading of the BSC in their eyes. I think we'll see a Big North conference emerge out a merging of the Summit and BSC. We'll end up with 3 FCS conferences in the west, which is probably what it should be.

Speculation with the MVC fans talked about a ripple effect if Murray State and Valpo are added. The Horizon could invite IUPUI and PUFW. There are so many "ifs" at this point- like if Chicago State can keep sports. Maybe we will find out more tomorrow.

[jacksfan29]

Speculation with the MVC fans talked about a ripple effect if Murray State and Valpo are added. The Horizon could invite IUPUI and PUFW. There are so many "ifs" at this point- like if Chicago State can keep sports. Maybe we will find out more tomorrow.

Chicago State will die in the WAC, go D3 or close their doors. That school will never set foot in the Summit again.

Oh, and I may be wrong but I think Adam's sources are good. The MVC are going to add one school, Valpo to replace WSU.

[cx500d]

Texas will go independent if the Big XII dissolves. They are arrogant and another conference will expect them to get rid of their network and that isn't going to happen. Oklahoma will leave only if Okie St goes with them, I think the Big XII will be around a bit longer.

Who actually watches this supposed longhorn network? I don't see how they can make money off viewership.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[uni88]

You guys haven't been keeping up with the latest developments on Big 12 realignment, have you? Just rolled out in an Oklahoma paper recently, a trial balloon, that OU #1) wants to make the Big 12 healthy and strong, but #2) since we all know it's just a matter of time for the B12, OU's first choice is the BIG and would go alone if invited, and #3) if the BIG does not offer would consider the SEC and PAC if there were certain concessions given (OSU is allowed to come along).

The major takeaway is that OU wants to go to the BIG and that they are not attached to OSU.

I think you can book KU and OU to the BIG in a couple of years.

Two questions that need to be asked when considering prospective B1G members. What markets do the prospective schools bring? Are they members of the Association of American Universities? Academics matter in B1G membership.

Oklahoma isn't a member of the AAU and it doesn't appear that they will be for quite some time so I'm not sure if the B1G will seriously consider them. KU is an AAU member but if the B1G wasn't interested in Missouri (St. Louis and Kansas City markets) why would they be interested in KU (Kansas City market) now? KU is a basketball power but football and markets drive P5 expansion and KU is in danger of drawing the short straw in realignment.

[Laker]

Who actually watches this supposed longhorn network? I don't see how they can make money off viewership.

I watched them when the Gophers won their softball tournament. Otherwise no.

[Hammerhead]

More G5 schools are going to drop "down" to FCS.

[Bisonoline]

[QUOTE=uni88;2477748]Two questions that need to be asked when considering prospective B1G members. What markets do the prospective schools bring? Are they members of the Association of American Universities? Academics matter in B1G membership.

Oklahoma isn't a member of the AAU and it doesn't appear that they will be for quite some time so I'm not sure if the B1G will seriously consider them. KU is an AAU member but if the B1G wasn't interested in Missouri (St. Louis and Kansas City markets) why would they be interested in KU (Kansas City market) now? KU is a basketball power but football and markets drive P5 expansion and KU is in danger of drawing the short straw in realignment.[/QUOTE

Nebraska isnt an AAU member.

[SDFS]

Nebraska isnt an AAU member.

More of a timing issue, NU was a AAU member. Then was voted out 1 year after joining the BIG.

http://www.chronicle.com/article/Ouster-Opens-a-Painful-Debate/127364

Much speculation centers with Texas since Berdahl (who is retiring from the AAU at the end of this month) was President at Texas during the 1990s when the Big 12 was formed. Perlman claims that Nebraska was supported by all the Big Ten and Big 12 institutions in the organization. Was Nebraska singled out for review by the AAU last February due to its announced change in athletic conferences last year?

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/693354-nebraska-sacked-was-expulsion-from-the-aau-reprisal-for-leaving-the-big-12

[Iridebikes]

As to FCS realignment, there is grumbling out of the Dakotas about the Summit situation. There is grumbling out of Montanas about the downgrading of the BSC in their eyes. I think we'll see a Big North conference emerge out a merging of the Summit and BSC. We'll end up with 3 FCS conferences in the west, which is probably what it should be.


Curious that you're hearing "grumblings" out of Montana about the Big Sky and it weakening, yet their teams have been part of the problem, not part of the solution.

[Bison Fan in NW MN]

As to FCS realignment, there is grumbling out of the Dakotas about the Summit situation. There is grumbling out of Montanas about the downgrading of the BSC in their eyes. I think we'll see a Big North conference emerge out a merging of the Summit and BSC. We'll end up with 3 FCS conferences in the west, which is probably what it should be.


The Montana schools and the Dakota schools should be in the same conference now. Add in Idaho and another to get to 8 teams. That would be a great FCS conference.

[Sader87]

And Holy Cross could join the Big East. Neither is happening.

In the past, a team might have considered the PL as one of three options: 1) cost-containment, 2) an easier path to an at-large bid, or 3) access to the Ivy League for scheduling. Today's it's none of the three. A PL budget and and a CAA budget are substantially the same except for Georgetown, the PL has not demonstrated of late it can earn multiple at-large bids as the CAA and Valley do, and the Ivy is moving to a a variety of conferences to fill out its schedule.

As to the Big East, look at what Xavier slowly but methodically did over the 15 years to elevate its program from the "who's that" to the "who's who" of the sport--from what is now known as the Horizon League to the A-10 to being a realistic Big East candidate. They ditched the Schmitt Fieldhouse, hired great young coaches, played games downtown, and scheduled all comers. Twelve NCAA bids in 13 seasons made them a strong choice to replace Cincinnati. If HC had any foresight, that would have been the blueprint for being Boston College's replacement instead of thinking that the Hart Center would make the case.

There's more to having an FCS program than making the "vaunted" FCS playoffs....I just think Villanova will ultimately join the PL for football due to institutional/geographical reasons.

[citdog]

There's more to having an FCS program than making the "vaunted" FCS playoffs....I just think Villanova will ultimately join the PL for football due to institutional/geographical reasons.

Says an also ran from the weakest conference not named the pioneer....

[Sader87]

Says an also ran from the weakest conference not named the pioneer....

Let's face it....hardly anyone cares about FCS football unless you're from Fargo or Missoula.....Villanova will ultimately decide they'd rather be in a conference with Fordham, Holy Cross and Lehigh rather than URI, Towson St and Elon.

[citdog]

Let's face it....hardly anyone cares about FCS football unless you're from Fargo or Missoula.....Villanova will ultimately decide they'd rather be in a conference with Fordham, Holy Cross and Lehigh rather than URI, Towson St and Elon.

PLENTY of people care about the playoffs. You say you don't care because you are an elitist prick who doesn't want to get his ass beat by directional schools. My advice???? GET BETTER OR TAKE YOUR CUTE LITTLE PROGRAM AND GET THE **** OUT. DON'T FORGET TO TAKE georgetown and le high WITH YOU.

[Sader87]

PLENTY of people care about the playoffs. You say you don't care because you are an elitist prick who doesn't want to get his ass beat by directional schools. My advice???? GET BETTER OR TAKE YOUR CUTE LITTLE PROGRAM AND GET THE **** OUT. DON'T FORGET TO TAKE georgetown and le high WITH YOU.

I want Holy Cross to be bettah and maybe with a new coach we will be someday.....that being said, very few people care about the FCS playoffs. That's not to say football at the FCS level isn't important, it is....but many people in the Northeast care more about league play, playing FBS schools who are similar to FCS schools in outlook (BC, Army, Navy etc) than they do about the FCS playoffs. This is why Villanova will ultimately go PL for football...bettah for the school in general to play UPenn or BC in Septembah than say Jacksonville St in Decembah.

[TheKingpin28]

The Montana schools and the Dakota schools should be in the same conference now. Add in Idaho and another to get to 8 teams. That would be a great FCS conference.

Idaho State would want in. That would be a solid conference. Northern Colorado would want in due to geographic footprint and then add Denver for the non-football aspect and for a travel partner since they are just over 1 hour away from each other and the conference would be able to get to 8 games for football each year with 9 teams and 10 teams for all other sports and let Denver still run their NCHC hockey program. It would be a win-win but UND would probably still complain about the travel somehow. Also they would want Denver in due to the hockey rivalry crossing over to all other sports.

[Go...gate]

I want Holy Cross to be bettah and maybe with a new coach we will be someday.....that being said, very few people care about the FCS playoffs. That's not to say football at the FCS level isn't important, it is....but many people in the Northeast care more about league play, playing FBS schools who are similar to FCS schools in outlook (BC, Army, Navy etc) than they do about the FCS playoffs. This is why Villanova will ultimately go PL for football...bettah for the school in general to play UPenn or BC in Septembah than say Jacksonville St in Decembah.

Colgate, Fordham and Lehigh certainly do. I'd hazard a guess that Lafayette does, as well.

No offense, Sader87, but HC's football approach sounds increasingly similar to the philosophy HC ice hockey employed when they did just enough to keep out of ECAC Hockey and remain in a weaker league, even though the ECAC wanted HC - BADLY - and they were a far better fit in the conference then Quinnipiac.

[Sader87]

In general, very few people really care about the FCS playoffs...particularly in the Northeast....it is what it is.

This thread is about what schools may realign in the near future...I speculated that Villanova would be a prime candidate for doing so in that the PL is a bettah overall fit for them in football institutionally and geographically....nothing more, nothing less.

What is keeping Villanova in the CAA? Playing before crowds of 5K so that they can play at Northern Iowa on Decembah 15th?

[Dane96]

I dunno, playing in a better football conference than the Patriot League?!

[citdog]

In general, very few people really care about the FCS playoffs...particularly in the Northeast....it is what it is.

This thread is about what schools may realign in the near future...I speculated that Villanova would be a prime candidate for doing so in that the PL is a bettah overall fit for them in football institutionally and geographically....nothing more, nothing less.

What is keeping Villanova in the CAA? Playing before crowds of 5K so that they can play at Northern Iowa on Decembah 15th?

PRIDE. WANTING TO COMPETE AGAINST GOOD COMPETITION EVERY WEEK AND NOT THE COLLECTION OF "WE CAN'T COMPETE SO WE'LL SAY WE DON'T CARE" THAT IS THE PATSY LEAGUE. WHY DON'T Y'ALL AND THE PIONEER JUST GO TO D-III WHERE YOU BELONG?

[UNHWildcat18]

In general, very few people really care about the FCS playoffs...particularly in the Northeast....it is what it is.

This thread is about what schools may realign in the near future...I speculated that Villanova would be a prime candidate for doing so in that the PL is a bettah overall fit for them in football institutionally and geographically....nothing more, nothing less.

What is keeping Villanova in the CAA? Playing before crowds of 5K so that they can play at Northern Iowa on Decembah 15th?

LOL this I find comical, with better TV deals in the CAA are they gonna keep playing UD JMU W&M or bucknell georgetown and lafayette? CAA is a better conference with better attendance with more exposure and a better chance to get to the NC. Villanova competes at the highest level in athletics besides football. They aren't going to downgrade a conference, downgrade exposure and downgrade to smaller more unknown schools. Also the "academic" argument is such crap. They play in the Catholic 7 based Big east conference for all sports. football is the only exception, why in gods name would they downgrade in every way just to say well our football team plays in a conference with slightly higher academic standards...gimme a break

[UNHWildcat18]

PRIDE. WANTING TO COMPETE AGAINST GOOD COMPETITION EVERY WEEK AND NOT THE COLLECTION OF "WE CAN'T COMPETE SO WE'LL SAY WE DON'T CARE" THAT IS THE PATSY LEAGUE. WHY DON'T Y'ALL AND THE PIONEER JUST GO TO D-III WHERE YOU BELONG?

I wish the pioneer meac and swac weren't even considered D1 but thats just me being a jerk.

[DFW HOYA]

What is keeping Villanova in the CAA? Playing before crowds of 5K so that they can play at Northern Iowa on Decembah 15th?

Two likely reasons:

1. Multiple at large bids in the CAA vs. no guarantee of at-large in the PL.
2. Playing Delaware and JMU still means more than playing Georgetown and Bucknell.

[Mocs123]

I agree the SoCon is just right now with 9FB and 10BB schools is perfect......however I would love to see JSU in the SoCon. I wouldn't be against KSU.

There are some at JSU that would like to move up but I am not sure they are in a position to do it right now. They are more GSU than App.

[Sader87]

PRIDE. WANTING TO COMPETE AGAINST GOOD COMPETITION EVERY WEEK AND NOT THE COLLECTION OF "WE CAN'T COMPETE SO WE'LL SAY WE DON'T CARE" THAT IS THE PATSY LEAGUE. WHY DON'T Y'ALL AND THE PIONEER JUST GO TO D-III WHERE YOU BELONG?

Holy Cross will have a football program at the D1 level long after many of the fly by night FCS schools go belly up football-wise in the next 10-20 years.

[citdog]

Holy Cross will have a football program at the D1 level long after many of the fly by night FCS schools go belly up football-wise in the next 10-20 years.


Ok Nostradouchebag tell us which of these programs is going belly up....

[Sader87]

Ok Nostradouchebag tell us which of these programs is going belly up....

Many....football is very cost-prohibitive....the FCS level is a very expensive level to uphold...no real revenue and very costly to keep at a D1 level...why you see many try to go the FBS route.....I doubt you'll see an FCS level actually in 10 or so years. It'll be D1 or no football. The schools that can afford it will keep it, those that are struggling to stay afloat will drop it.

[citdog]

Many....football is very cost-prohibitive....the FCS level is a very expensive level to uphold...no real revenue and very costly to keep at a D1 level...why you see many try to go the FBS route.....I doubt you'll see an FCS level actually in 10 or so years. It'll be D1 or no football. The schools that can afford it will keep it, those that are struggling to stay afloat will drop it.

FCS IS D1

[Sader87]

FCS IS D1

I know it is....my point is that there won't be an FCS/FBS split in 10 or so years...they'll all be D1 with many schools dropping football in the mean-time.

[citdog]

I know it is....my point is that there won't be an FCS/FBS split in 10 or so years...they'll all be D1 with many schools dropping football in the mean-time.

Maybe in the northeast.... Certainly not in the South.

[Go...gate]

PRIDE. WANTING TO COMPETE AGAINST GOOD COMPETITION EVERY WEEK AND NOT THE COLLECTION OF "WE CAN'T COMPETE SO WE'LL SAY WE DON'T CARE" THAT IS THE PATSY LEAGUE. WHY DON'T Y'ALL AND THE PIONEER JUST GO TO D-III WHERE YOU BELONG?

Citdog, sir, you are way off base.

[citdog]

Citdog, sir, you are way off base.


A little hyperbole never hurts xthumbsupx

[bonarae]

Many....football is very cost-prohibitive....the FCS level is a very expensive level to uphold...no real revenue and very costly to keep at a D1 level...why you see many try to go the FBS route.....I doubt you'll see an FCS level actually in 10 or so years. It'll be D1 or no football. The schools that can afford it will keep it, those that are struggling to stay afloat will drop it.

What about the Ivies, then? Going to become a NESCAC type league? OK, I'll find a new team to back besides ETSU as well.... xcoffeex

[Son of Eli]

What about the Ivies, then? Going to become a NESCAC type league? OK, I'll find a new team to back besides ETSU as well.... xcoffeex

The Ivy League will never go Division III in football. That would mean going Division III in basketball too. It will never happen.

I agree with Sader that there will be a reallignment in Division I Football. There will either be just one Division I, or a separation between the Power 5 Conferences and the rest of the current FBS and FCS. When that happens the Ivies will be in Division I where they've always been and historic rivaly series like Yale-Army and Yale-Uconn will be restored.

The purpose behind the splitting of Division I football in two was so the big schools could keep all the TV revenue. That will be less of a factor in the near future as cable cords continue to be cut. Or, in an effort to keep more of a shrinking pie, the Power 5 will break off from the NCAA and form their own Division. Either scenario will result in the end of the FCS and the reunification of NCAA Division I Football.

[DFW HOYA]

I know it is....my point is that there won't be an FCS/FBS split in 10 or so years...they'll all be D1 with many schools dropping football in the mean-time.

We've heard this claim for years and it hasn't panned out. Remember the schools that dropped football to (allegedly) refocus its efforts to build up bigger-time basketball? How that's working out at Boston U (two NCAA bids since dropping football in 1997), at Santa Clara (none since 1996), at Fairfield (none since dropping football in 2002)? They're invisible today.

The "Division IV" drumbeat runs afoul of the long-term NCAA basketball contract with CBS and Turner. It's also a contractual problem because the idea of a Division IV (think of it as a Champions League for your Anglophiles out there) won't work with 70 different teams, it needs to be no larger than 48, which means some difficult decisions to cut out the likes of Duke or Washington State or Iowa State or Boston College from the top tier against previously held "grant of rights" contractual matters.

[walliver]

Contractual issues with March Madness are not the P5's problem. If the Big Boys take their ball and go home, they have no obligation to CBS and Turner. They can set up their own championship and sell it to anyone they want. The remaining NCAA members may find themselves in a bind as CBS and Turner would be very unlikely to continue paying the big bucks for a watered-down NCAA tournament.

I find it very unlikely the P5 would just leave the NCAA. A more likely scenario is that they remove football from the NCAA and keep all their other sports where they are. They would still be bound to the ESPN contract for the "playoffs", but would be free to pay their players at-will. Most likely, the P5 will stay where they are and solicit more concessions from the NCAA. Staying with the organization gives them an excuse not to share their revenues with the players.

[TheKingpin28]

Contractual issues with March Madness are not the P5's problem. If the Big Boys take their ball and go home, they have no obligation to CBS and Turner. They can set up their own championship and sell it to anyone they want. The remaining NCAA members may find themselves in a bind as CBS and Turner would be very unlikely to continue paying the big bucks for a watered-down NCAA tournament.

I find it very unlikely the P5 would just leave the NCAA. A more likely scenario is that they remove football from the NCAA and keep all their other sports where they are. They would still be bound to the ESPN contract for the "playoffs", but would be free to pay their players at-will. Most likely, the P5 will stay where they are and solicit more concessions from the NCAA. Staying with the organization gives them an excuse not to share their revenues with the players.

The problem with all of this would start with Title IX. The school, according to certain groups of people, would claim they are using discriminatory actions to pay their men in football versus all other sports. It is either an all or none option. Sticking with just football and the rest in the NCAA would never happen. Also, the amount of lawsuits that would be in the courts would just further slow up our courts and prevent them handling more pressing matters.

[Yote 53]

The problem with all of this would start with Title IX. The school, according to certain groups of people, would claim they are using discriminatory actions to pay their men in football versus all other sports. It is either an all or none option. Sticking with just football and the rest in the NCAA would never happen. Also, the amount of lawsuits that would be in the courts would just further slow up our courts and prevent them handling more pressing matters.

Agree. First thing I thought of was Title 9 issues.

P5 will break off and have their own division, maybe they increase their scholarship levels higher so they can horde more talent and create a bigger disparity between themselves and the rest of D1.

[TheKingpin28]

Agree. First thing I thought of was Title 9 issues.

P5 will break off and have their own division, maybe they increase their scholarship levels higher so they can horde more talent and create a bigger disparity between themselves and the rest of D1.

If they want to break away, let them, more power to them. I see more talent in that mid-range level since athletes want to play and why would someone want to be 3rd string at a mediocre school like Minnesota when they can start at a G5/Top 10 FCS school? The scholarships will be nice but more people will go to the 2nd level of athletics who are borderline to ensure playing time and scouts noticing them.

[DFW HOYA]

The problem with all of this would start with Title IX. The school, according to certain groups of people, would claim they are using discriminatory actions to pay their men in football versus all other sports. It is either an all or none option. Sticking with just football and the rest in the NCAA would never happen. Also, the amount of lawsuits that would be in the courts would just further slow up our courts and prevent them handling more pressing matters.

There's a path around Title IX which some (but not all) of the I-A schools might entertain.

Title IX applies only to educational institutions. So if the Top 48 schools formed a football division outside of the NCAA, and created separately incorporated companies with a license from the school to use names and likenesses (think: "Florida State Football Club, LLC"), they could compete in the garnet and gold just as before but without the need to comply as a non-profit. This scenario also introduces the opportunity to pay "contractors" as opposed to employees, which would trigger benefits and workers comp. Not that this would happen, but...

[TheKingpin28]

There's a path around Title IX which some (but not all) of the I-A schools might entertain.

Title IX applies only to educational institutions. So if the Top 48 schools formed a football division outside of the NCAA, and created separately incorporated companies with a license from the school to use names and likenesses (think: "Florida State Football Club, LLC"), they could compete in the garnet and gold just as before but without the need to comply as a non-profit. This scenario also introduces the opportunity to pay "contractors" as opposed to employees, which would trigger benefits and workers comp. Not that this would happen, but...

Yes, but then how would they get around discriminatory pay? Who is to say that women's field hockey is not equal in talent and value to that of men's gridiron football. If equal pay for equal work, is something that America believes in, then the argument could be made that they deserve to be paid as "contractors" the same. Someone will always complain and bring litigation if it suits their interests or they stand to make a financial gain. Trying to keep this focused on the discussion at hand without bringing politics into it is damn near impossible, so I will not go down that road, but that is the next discussion in this issue.

[DFW HOYA]

Yes, but then how would they get around discriminatory pay? Who is to say that women's field hockey is not equal in talent and value to that of men's gridiron football. If equal pay for equal work, is something that America believes in, then the argument could be made that they deserve to be paid as "contractors" the same. Someone will always complain and bring litigation if it suits their interests or they stand to make a financial gain. Trying to keep this focused on the discussion at hand without bringing politics into it is damn near impossible, so I will not go down that road, but that is the next discussion in this issue.

In the above scenario, Florida State could argue that none of its student-athletes are paid. What the LLC does for football is their business because it's wholly separate from the university.

Granted, it's not a bridge that will be crossed anytime soon, but it's a bridge nonetheless.

[TheKingpin28]

In the above scenario, Florida State could argue that none of its student-athletes are paid. What the LLC does for football is their business because it's wholly separate from the university.

Granted, it's not a bridge that will be crossed anytime soon, but it's a bridge nonetheless.

I understand that they are separating themselves as they are not affiliated with each other and therefore separate entities. Each school will do what is necessary to benefit themselves at the end of the day, but the NCAA will not let them go quietly as they stand to lose billions of dollars if the process happens.

[Sycamore62]

I understand that they are separating themselves as they are not affiliated with each other and therefore separate entities. Each school will do what is necessary to benefit themselves at the end of the day, but the NCAA will not let them go quietly as they stand to lose billions of dollars if the process happens.

in this scenario wouldnt the NCAA (being the other P5 schools) be leaving with them? they clearly have all the power.

[walliver]

I understand that they are separating themselves as they are not affiliated with each other and therefore separate entities. Each school will do what is necessary to benefit themselves at the end of the day, but the NCAA will not let them go quietly as they stand to lose billions of dollars if the process happens.

The NCAA makes almost all of its income from March Madness. It makes no money from football and is not part of the "College Football Playoff". In fact, the NCAA probably loses money on football, flying teams around in the FCS, D2 and D3 playoffs. As long as the P5 keep basketball in the NCAA, the NCAA doesn't really care. If the P5 choose to leave completely, there is nothing the NCAA can do other than beg and grovel. For antitrust reasons, the P5 can't prohibit G5 schools from leaving, too, but they can make it so expensive the G5 schools cannot afford to move.

For now, the point is moot, since I doubt anything will happen until the CFP contract expires (or ESPN goes bankrupt), and even then, I suspect the NCAA will give the big boys whatever it takes to keep March Madness intact.

[ccd494]

In the above scenario, Florida State could argue that none of its student-athletes are paid. What the LLC does for football is their business because it's wholly separate from the university.

Granted, it's not a bridge that will be crossed anytime soon, but it's a bridge nonetheless.

Is Florida State Football, LLC going to wear garnet and gold and play on the campus of Florida State University, just like the athletic teams that represent Florida State University? Are profits from concessions, tickets, merchandising, television contracts, etc. going to inure in any way to Florida State University? Are you going to be required to be an enrolled student at Florida State University in order to be an independent contractor with Florida State Football, LLC?

I don't think "this is a wholly independent entity" would pass the straight faced test.

[DFW HOYA]

It's clearly conjecture, but...

"Is Florida State Football, LLC going to wear garnet and gold and play on the campus of Florida State University, just like the athletic teams that represent Florida State University?" Yes, per the license --FSU rents Doak Campbell Stadium and the practice facilities to the LLC.

"Are profits from concessions, tickets, merchandising, television contracts, etc. going to inure in any way to Florida State University?" Yes, per the contract

"Are you going to be required to be an enrolled student at Florida State University in order to be an independent contractor with Florida State Football, LLC?" No. An athlete could enroll at FSU, but it wouldn't be required.

(And on a unrelated issue, the fundraising arm of FSU athletics is a 501(c)(3) corporation and legally separate from the university.)

http://boosters.fsu.edu/

[TheKingpin28]

in this scenario wouldnt the NCAA (being the other P5 schools) be leaving with them? they clearly have all the power.

You would assume so, however, the FCS D2 and D3 schools would put up one hell of a fight in the courts to ensure this stops and never happens. The NCAA would be forced to let them walk for nothing or try and tie the P5 in the courts due to labor laws and contractual agreements.


The NCAA makes almost all of its income from March Madness. It makes no money from football and is not part of the "College Football Playoff". In fact, the NCAA probably loses money on football, flying teams around in the FCS, D2 and D3 playoffs. As long as the P5 keep basketball in the NCAA, the NCAA doesn't really care. If the P5 choose to leave completely, there is nothing the NCAA can do other than beg and grovel. For antitrust reasons, the P5 can't prohibit G5 schools from leaving, too, but they can make it so expensive the G5 schools cannot afford to move.

For now, the point is moot, since I doubt anything will happen until the CFP contract expires (or ESPN goes bankrupt), and even then, I suspect the NCAA will give the big boys whatever it takes to keep March Madness intact.

When ESPN goes bankrupt and Disney realizes the mistakes they have made are killing them, the NCAA will do everything in their power to secure the football rights. That contract is too lucrative to pass up. The thing is, the NCAA will have no power as Title IX freaks will lose their **** if men's sports are overpaid compared to women's sports. That is why the NCAA will do what they can to try and force all sports to remain under Title IX issues or they will lose everything. It is either an all or nothing secenario.

[Yote 53]

If they want to break away, let them, more power to them. I see more talent in that mid-range level since athletes want to play and why would someone want to be 3rd string at a mediocre school like Minnesota when they can start at a G5/Top 10 FCS school? The scholarships will be nice but more people will go to the 2nd level of athletics who are borderline to ensure playing time and scouts noticing them.

I can see your point, but you need to remember that these kids coming out of high school all think they are the best and will someday start. I mean, you have high level players willing to take a grey shirt to Alabama when they could easily be getting a full ride at another P5 school. Why? Because they truly believe they will get that scholarship. I can see the P5 hording talent and burying talented players 3 deep, it was once that way and will happen again if scholarship limits are raised. Plus, there are also those players who are talented, but realistic, and see that being a backup or third stringer on full ride is a good way to a free education from a Big Ten, ACC, or PAC 12 school. Those are players that would make a difference at the FCS level but are ones we will miss out on.

[ccd494]

It's clearly conjecture, but...

"Is Florida State Football, LLC going to wear garnet and gold and play on the campus of Florida State University, just like the athletic teams that represent Florida State University?" Yes, per the license --FSU rents Doak Campbell Stadium and the practice facilities to the LLC.

"Are profits from concessions, tickets, merchandising, television contracts, etc. going to inure in any way to Florida State University?" Yes, per the contract

"Are you going to be required to be an enrolled student at Florida State University in order to be an independent contractor with Florida State Football, LLC?" No. An athlete could enroll at FSU, but it wouldn't be required.

(And on a unrelated issue, the fundraising arm of FSU athletics is a 501(c)(3) corporation and legally separate from the university.)

http://boosters.fsu.edu/

Right but the catch is that Title IX doesn't just cover intercollegiate sports- it covers ALL university programs, be they athletic or not. If Florida State were only to license and contract with Florida State Football, LLC, and only rent Doak Campbell to Florida State Football, LLC, and Florida State Football, LLC only provides its (substantial) benefits to male students or non-students, Florida State University is providing opportunities to males that are not available to females.

[NorthChuckSouth]

Well, from a geographic standpoint, JSU would be alright, but as many have pointed out, I am not sure that it is good from an academic/institution type aspect. I think KSU has obvious FBS ambitions although the Atlanta market may be saturated and they could very well languish for years, so maybe. If the Big South, goes south in the near future, I would interested to see if some sort of mega SOCON growth is possible, or even desired.

have like an east/west divisions and the winner of each plays in a championship game? Don't know how that would go over.. especially trying to get into the playoffs

[Cocky]

I agree the SoCon is just right now with 9FB and 10BB schools is perfect......however I would love to see JSU in the SoCon. I wouldn't be against KSU.

There are some at JSU that would like to move up but I am not sure they are in a position to do it right now. They are more GSU than App.

I prefer JSU to be in a conference with the closest schools. OVC, SOCON, Big South, Sunbelt or CUSA doesnt matter as the collection of teams are similar but the amount of easy travel to away games is the key. Great gameday atmosphere comes from attendance from both schools fans, meeting new folks and giving each other a little hell.

[ASU33]

I prefer JSU to be in a conference with the closest schools. OVC, SOCON, Big South, Sunbelt or CUSA doesnt matter as the collection of teams are similar but the amount of easy travel to away games is the key. Great gameday atmosphere comes from attendance from both schools fans, meeting new folks and giving each other a little hell.

I'm shocked that UNA or tUNA as you guys call them didn't get the nod to get into the OVC.

[GodHelpTheBears]

I prefer JSU to be in a conference with the closest schools. OVC, SOCON, Big South, Sunbelt or CUSA doesnt matter as the collection of teams are similar but the amount of easy travel to away games is the key. Great gameday atmosphere comes from attendance from both schools fans, meeting new folks and giving each other a little hell.

I want the same thing, but it just won't happen at this level - there aren't enough schools in our region. So, as an outlier in any scenario, we have to choose - which conference's core fits us best? Is it the Dakotas and Iowa? Is it south Texas? Is it central Tennessee?

[Thumper 76]

I prefer JSU to be in a conference with the closest schools. OVC, SOCON, Big South, Sunbelt or CUSA doesnt matter as the collection of teams are similar but the amount of easy travel to away games is the key. Great gameday atmosphere comes from attendance from both schools fans, meeting new folks and giving each other a little hell.
Have to disagree with you there. The two best home atmospheres in FCS are Montana and NDSU where they don't have more than a couple hundred visiting fans. It's not visiting fans that make it fun, it's a full stadium. I enjoy meeting opposing fans and giving each other crap as much as the next guy, but that's not what makes an overall great gameday atmosphere. A full loud stadium is the key.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

I prefer JSU to be in a conference with the closest schools. OVC, SOCON, Big South, Sunbelt or CUSA doesnt matter as the collection of teams are similar but the amount of easy travel to away games is the key. Great gameday atmosphere comes from attendance from both schools fans, meeting new folks and giving each other a little hell.

This. Very much this. Same with Lehigh.

[RichH2]

Colgate, Fordham and Lehigh certainly do. I'd hazard a guess that Lafayette does, as well.

No offense, Sader87, but HC's football approach sounds increasingly similar to the philosophy HC ice hockey employed when they did just enough to keep out of ECAC Hockey and remain in a weaker league, even though the ECAC wanted HC - BADLY - and they were a far better fit in the conference then Quinnipiac.
Yup! Despite the recurring moaning from some Crusader fans about being in the PL, most have a parochial view of the FCS. Lehigh Gate and Fordham fans are not. Bucknell Cross and Pards may get more focused on reaching the playoffs if their programs achieve some consistent winning years.

[DFW HOYA]

Yup! Despite the recurring moaning from some Crusader fans about being in the PL, most have a parochial view of the FCS. Lehigh Gate and Fordham fans are not. Bucknell Cross and Pards may get more focused on reaching the playoffs if their programs achieve some consistent winning years.

(Sigh.)

https://i2.wp.com/www.ultimatesportstalk.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/10/GTownLehigh2016.jpg?fit=400%2C300&resize=350%2C200

[RichH2]

(Sigh.)

https://i2.wp.com/www.ultimatesportstalk.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/10/GTownLehigh2016.jpg?fit=400%2C300&resize=350%2C200
Sorry DFW. Didnt mean to step on that nerve. Perhaps someday.

[Hammerhead]

The NCAA says 81% of their revenue is from March Madness compared to 11% on championship tickets and merchandise. http://www.ncaa.org/about/resources/finances/revenue


The NCAA makes almost all of its income from March Madness. It makes no money from football and is not part of the "College Football Playoff". In fact, the NCAA probably loses money on football, flying teams around in the FCS, D2 and D3 playoffs. As long as the P5 keep basketball in the NCAA, the NCAA doesn't really care. If the P5 choose to leave completely, there is nothing the NCAA can do other than beg and grovel. For antitrust reasons, the P5 can't prohibit G5 schools from leaving, too, but they can make it so expensive the G5 schools cannot afford to move.

For now, the point is moot, since I doubt anything will happen until the CFP contract expires (or ESPN goes bankrupt), and even then, I suspect the NCAA will give the big boys whatever it takes to keep March Madness intact.