Conference year end grades

[taper]

With the season done aside from the chipper let's review how each conference did. I'll list non-conference records, playoff results,# of teams in the final AGS poll, and my grade of the overall conference. Non-conference games against conference teams are not counted in the FCS numbers. I've listed Coastal Carolina as FBS.

Sagarin conference rankings:
MVFC
Southern
Big Sky
CAA
Big South
OVC
Southland
Patriot
NEC
Ivy
SWAC
MEAC
Pioneer


Big Sky
10-4 FCS
1-15 FBS
6-1 non-D1
2-4 playoffs
4 in AGS
Grade: D

Geography limits their non-conference scheduling but I see a lot of body bag games(in both directions). EWU was a season long contender for the championship and only a stellar game from YSU stopped their trip to Frisco. However, 1 team does not make a conference. Playoffs were an abysmal failure, which is becoming a pattern. As long as the selection committee keeps rewarding great records against bad teams you'll get plenty of teams in a 24 slot field. The bottom half of this conference is really, really bad.

Unfortuantely with EWU as the only team worth anything, I officially demote the Big Sky as a power conference. Have 2 or more teams win at least 1 playoff game each against scholarship teams for 2 years in a row and you're back in. I expect some strong responses to this. I've started another thread for that (http://www.anygivensaturday.com/showthread.php?190329-Big-Sky-a-power-conference), please keep this thread to overall conference results.

Big South
12-6 FCS
1-12 FBS
4-0 non-D1
0-1 playoffs
1 in AGS
Grade: B-

Losing Coastal really hurt this up and coming group. Charleston Southern has built a solid program out of very little and Kennesaw looks like it might be doing the same. The addition of Campbell next year stabilizes the membership numbers. The bottom is still pretty bad though. Not saying this is a future power conference but they'll make some noise.


CAA
17-4 FCS
2-11 FBS
1-0 non-D1
7-3 playoffs, in title game
5 in AGS
Grade: A

Undisputed power conference for as long as anyone can remember. Champion cruised to Frisco, taking down NDSU at home. Other 3 teams were very respectable. We all wonder what Richmond could have done if they hadn't lost half their team. Not much else to say, other than the bottom 2 don't really belong.

Ivy
12-12 FCS
Grade: C

I have a hard time calling the Ivy FCS. They play the Patriot League, a few other eastern schools, and that's about it. Refuse to play a full 11 game schedule or even think about the playoffs. They're so disconnected from everyone else it's difficult to tell how good their top teams actually are. Doesn't stop some people from voting for them.


MEAC
0-9 FCS
1-19 FBS
3-0 non-D1
0-1 playoffs
2 in AGS

Grade: C
These guys suck just as bad as the SWAC, but without the party atmosphere. Main difference is they embarrassed themselves in the playoffs rather than stick to their own game. It's sad that 2 teams from here placed in the final AGS poll, but even sadder that we couldn't find anyone better.


MVFC
14-5 FCS(dammit UNI..)
4-6 FBS
1-0 non-D1
7-3 playoffs, in title game
4 in AGS

Grade: A-

NDSU has overshadowed the rest the last few years but I'd put this top half against their peers in any conference and expect wins.
Easily the highest percentage of FCS non-conference games played of the power conferences. No bonus to the grade for this but I'm a big fan of FCS matchups instead of FBS/D2 money games. 4-6 FBS speaks for itself. 2 teams in the semis and 1 on to Frisco, just not the 1 everybody was expecting. Giving a (-) for not sealing the deal on several non-conference games they should have won. That 14-5 is a disappointment is strange to say.

NEC
9-14 FCS
0-5 FBS
6-1 non-D1
0-1 playoffs

Grade: B

Just keeping on keeping on. Meets expectations, which aren't that high. Why do these guys get an autobid again? With limited scholarships these aren't FBS counters, which says something about the FBS that scheduled them.

OVC
4-8 FCS
2-10 FBS
3-0 non-D1
0-1 playoffs
1 in AGS

Grade: B
Jacksonville St and everyone else, though UT-Martin was probably better than some teams that were allowed in the playoffs. Another meets expectations. If the OVC was regarded as a power conference it would be a much lower grade. JSU didn't live up to the hype but they played a respectable non-conference schedule. Their loss to YSU doesn't look as bad now as it did at the time.

Patriot League
14-17 FCS
0-3 FBS
1-0 non-D1
0-1 playoffs
1 in AGS

Grade: B

Seem to have a scheduling arrangement with the Ivy League, very limited strength of schedule in those FCS wins. Conference appears to be getting better as a whole since introducting scholarships. Colgate's surprise run last year wasn't repeated but you still get a solid B for improvement the last few years.

Pioneer League
2-15 FCS
13-1 non-D1
1-1 playoffs

Grade: C

Almost as many sub-D1 as non-conference FCS games. With current NCAA rules I understand needing a place for teams that want basketball but won't fully fund a football team. That said, why the heck do they get an autobid? San Diego could probably handle moving to a real conference from a competition standpoint but the rest is garbage. Meets expectations but a little drop since I don't like pretenders.

Southern Conference
10-1 FCS
0-10 FBS
6-0 non-D1
3-4 playoffs
4 in AGS

Grade: A

The SoCon is back! Been a rough few years since some high profile defections. Shame the NCAA put your top 2 teams against each other right away. Would have liked some more SoS in those 10 FCS wins and fewer sub D1, but it's still 10-1.


Southland
2-3 FCS
1-11 FBS
4-1 non-D1
2-2 playoffs
2 in AGS

Grade: B-

Very limited non-conference FCS schedule, and not very impressive. SHSU and Central Ark are head and shoulders above the rest of the conference. They each won a playoff game against full scholarship teams so that's respectable. Bottom is terrible, though you can't expect instant success from recently formed teams. Absorbing that many hurts them overall. They're running out of time to use the newly formed team excuse though.


SWAC
0-5 FCS
0-11 FBS
1-1 non-D1
1 in AGS

Grade: B

The SWAC does what the SWAC does. Football is really just a reason to party, and in that they were successful. Non-conference records don't really matter. Based on their consistently high attendance, conference records don't seem to matter either.

[citdog]

Very Instructive

[TheRevSFA]

Southland = D-

[DFW HOYA]

With current NCAA rules I understand needing a place for teams that want basketball but won't fully fund a football team. That said, why the heck do they get an autobid?

Your comment bears a response--what Division I school doesn't want basketball? Yes, there were times a few decades ago when you could be a D-I school and not play basketball (Miami, USF, Tulane, etc.) but every D-I school now plays basketball.

If you're suggesting that PFL schools play football to remain in D-I, that's misleading as well. Division I membership is based on a minimum number of sports (14) which many D-II and D-III schools do not offer. Here are the number of Division I sports sponsored by each PFL school:

Butler: 19
Davidson: 18
Dayton: 16
Drake: 18
Jacksonville: 18
Marist: 23
Morehead St.: 18
San Diego: 17
Stetson: 18
Valpo: 21

Put another way, none are playing football to maintain minimum status for Division I basketball.

[taper]

Your comment bears a response--what Division I school doesn't want basketball? Yes, there were times a few decades ago when you could be a D-I school and not play basketball (Miami, USF, Tulane, etc.) but every D-I school now plays basketball.

If you're suggesting that PFL schools play football to remain in D-I, that's misleading as well. Division I membership is based on a minimum number of sports (14) which many D-II and D-III schools do not offer. Here are the number of Division I sports sponsored by each PFL school:

Butler: 19
Davidson: 18
Dayton: 16
Drake: 18
Jacksonville: 18
Marist: 23
Morehead St.: 18
San Diego: 17
Stetson: 18
Valpo: 21

Put another way, none are playing football to maintain minimum status for Division I basketball.

I'm not sure what you're asking. I haven't said anything about other sports requirements, just why the PFL gets an autobid.

[PAllen]

Clearly has no clue about the PL.

[taper]

Clearly has no clue about the PL.

Then enlighten us with your reviews.

[Go Lehigh TU Owl]

The PL should be given a solid D.

Lafayette and Georgetown were among the worst teams in FCS. The league as a whole had a dreadful OOC. Lehigh and Fordham had some nice wins but the rest not so much. Lehigh's playoff performance was basically an utter disgrace. To go into the UNH game as the favorite and perform like that was a huge black eye for a the league. Colgate's season was basically over the first week of October due to poor scheduling. Fordham likely would have been a playoff team if their defense wasn't terrible. Holy Cross once again disappointed and retained Gilmore for some unknown reason. Bucknell continues to be themselves. They care just enough to question how much they actually care....

[Redbird 4th & short]

Need to consider strength of schedule. Massey makes it easier to display than Sagarin does .. so it is linked below - you can sort based on SOS by clicking column header.

http://www.masseyratings.com/rate.php?s=cf2016&sub=11605

MVFC has top 7 spots in SOS, and then all 10 teams in top 12 fro SOS. They don't separately rank SOS for non-conf, so not easy to rank non-conf SOS.

Sagarin is similar, but doesn't make it easy to show SOS Below link ranks all D-I conferences, MVFC is 16th, putting it ahead of 4 FBS conferences. Southern is 20, Big Sky is 21, CAA is 22

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/ncaaf/sagarin/2016/conference/



Here is Massey Composite .. MVFC is clearly top conference by far.

http://www.masseyratings.com/cf/compare1aa.htm

So according to Massey, Sagarin, and the Massey Composite of 42 different polls/ranking systems, MVFC is clearly #1 in 2016. Whats interesting about the Massey Composite is if you scroll to bottom right, it shows the Mean Ranking cores. The Massey Composite has MVFC #1 wth mean of 25, well ahead of #2 Southern with a mean score of 41. But if you look at SNW/Stats, FCP, and AGS .. they rank MVFC 4, 3, and 3 respectively.

Same thing happened to some degree in 2011, 2012, 2013. We were consensus #1 in 2014 and 2015, but had to destroy the non-conf field and playoffs to get that consensus from FCP, SNW, and AGS. But fell back to old ways in 2016 .. and we're still sitting 7-3 in playoffs.

[Gangtackle11]

Need to consider strength of schedule. Massey makes it easier to display than Sagarin does .. so it is linked below - you can sort based on SOS by clicking column header.

http://www.masseyratings.com/rate.php?s=cf2016&sub=11605

MVFC has top 7 spots in SOS, and then all 10 teams in top 12 fro SOS. They don't separately rank SOS for non-conf, so not easy to rank non-conf SOS.

Sagarin is similar, but doesn't make it easy to show SOS Below link ranks all D-I conferences, MVFC is 16th, putting it ahead of 4 FBS conferences. Southern is 20, Big Sky is 21, CAA is 22

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/ncaaf/sagarin/2016/conference/

Here is Massey Composite .. MVFC is layout in front.

http://www.masseyratings.com/cf/compare1aa.htm

So according to Massey, Sagarin, and the Massey Composite of 42 different polls/ranking systems, MVFC is clearly #1 in 2017.

Garbage in. Garbage out. SOS doesn't mean much if you go 4-7.

MVFC best conference we get it. Still the best from the other power conferences can & have beat the best of the MVFC. NDSU was/is the difference not SOS.

[Daytripper]

Overly generous with most conferences, especially the Southland. Overly critical of the Big Sky.

[PAllen]

The PL should be given a solid D.

Lafayette and Georgetown were among the worst teams in FCS. The league as a whole had a dreadful OOC. Lehigh and Fordham had some nice wins but the rest not so much. Lehigh's playoff performance was basically an utter disgrace. To go into the UNH game as the favorite and perform like that was a huge black eye for a the league. Colgate's season was basically over the first week of October due to poor scheduling. Fordham likely would have been a playoff team if their defense wasn't terrible. Holy Cross once again disappointed and retained Gilmore for some unknown reason. Bucknell continues to be themselves. They care just enough to question how much they actually care....

This, plus he talks about Colgate's playoff run last year as if it has any bearing on this year.

[centennial]

Overly generous with most conferences, especially the Southland. Overly critical of the Big Sky.

He is grading on expectations vs performance. Clearly, there are some good and bad leagues in the FCS. By that standard the MEAC, and the SWAC should get F.

[BEAR]

Wait..the SWAC wins ONE game and you grade them higher than the Southland who had two teams in the playoffs? Pure genious. xeyebrowx

[Redbird Ray]

Garbage in. Garbage out. SOS doesn't mean much if you go 4-7.

MVFC best conference we get it. Still the best from the other power conferences can & have beat the best of the MVFC. NDSU was/is the difference not SOS.

Selling the MVFC a bit short here. The league typically has 2-4 FBS wins each year, including 3 wins against P5 schools this year. In 2014 and 2015, the MVFC pretty much dominated competition from other FCS conferences.

[taper]

Wait..the SWAC wins ONE game and you grade them higher than the Southland who had two teams in the playoffs? Pure genious. xeyebrowx

Expectations, like another poster said. If you go strictly by achievement then everybody except the MVFC and CAA get an F. Not that exciting to talk about.

[dgtw]

Thank you for researching all the data and posting it here. A fun and interesting read.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Gangtackle11]

Selling the MVFC a bit short here. The league typically has 2-4 FBS wins each year, including 3 wins against P5 schools this year. In 2014 and 2015, the MVFC pretty much dominated competition from other FCS conferences.

Maybe. In the end wins over NIU, Northwestern, & Iowa are nice, but it resulted in WIU not making the playoffs, ISUr beaten by UCA (finished 2nd to SHSU who lost 65-7 to JMU)& finally someone beating NDSU (JMU from what conference?). So SOS got you what?


The team that made it to the finals from the MVFC had OOC wins over NEC opponents Duquesne & Robert Morris.

So what's your point about SOS again??

Several MVFC posters here have treated YSU like a red headed step child in the past. Now you take credit for them. Smh.

MVFC maybe the dominant FCS conference, but I'm not ready to give in to the hype when JMU beats @ NDSU, Richmond beats @ ISUr in '15 playoffs, & Villanova takes your conference champ SDSU to the final seconds in some glorified cow field in Brookings, SD. (It was a nice stadium-comment for effect)

At best, they are slightly more dominant than the CAA. SLIGHTLY.

The rest of you folks can argue for your conferences.

[Cocky]

Our conference pretty much sucks and has no desire to get better, unless your talking basketball.

[MR. CHICKEN]

.....SOUTHERN CONF.........B-.......AT BEST.......NOT EVEN CLOSE..........TA CAA...........BROCCO!

[Catatonic]

Taper or another AGS poster with good analytical skills should take on grading FCS new coaching hires as a project. I'd like to see how the FCS community assess the changes.

[NY Crusader 2010]

Thanks for this -- very well done.

Agree with LFN that PL season was extremely disappointing. Our top two finishers lost to Monmouth, the last place team in the Big South. Obviously our ONE playoff appearance, against what was likely "last team in" to the field, was a disaster. 0-6 against the CAA during the regular season as well. I give the PL a C-.

With regards to gauging the relative strength of the Ivy League, let me tell you from a perspective of someone in the Ivy/PL fold, that conference SUCKED this year. Harvard and Yale were both awful and conference champ Princeton got spanked by the PL champ. Strangely, the last place team in the Ivy went 2-0 in the CAA.

[FUBeAR]

.....SOUTHERN CONF.........B-.......AT BEST.......NOT EVEN CLOSE..........TA CAA...........BROCCO!

http://www.screenseven.com/en/img/prv/crazy-chicken-tales_nl.jpg

[citdog]

.....SOUTHERN CONF.........B-.......AT BEST.......NOT EVEN CLOSE..........TA CAA...........BROCCO!


http://pictures.food.com/api/file/TIQJfGuQuSs2L2kAqbPj-crispy-fried-chicken.jpg/convert?loc=/pictures.food.com/recipes/10/83/64/OeYIPAoYSOi7XN3lUNvO_crispy%20fried%20chicken.jpg&width=555&height=416&fit=max&flags=progressive&quality=95

[JMUisat14]

Thanks for this -- very well done.

Agree with LFN that PL season was extremely disappointing. Our top two finishers lost to Monmouth, the last place team in the Big South. Obviously our ONE playoff appearance, against what was likely "last team in" to the field, was a disaster.

Uhhhh that's definitely wrong. The committee is on record saying UNH wasn't even one of the last 4 in. That title would belong to CalPoly, Weber or NC A&T.

UNH gave us a better game than Soft Houston.

[centennial]

Maybe. In the end wins over NIU, Northwestern, & Iowa are nice, but it resulted in WIU not making the playoffs, ISUr beaten by UCA (finished 2nd to SHSU who lost 65-7 to JMU)& finally someone beating NDSU (JMU from what conference?). So SOS got you what?


The team that made it to the finals from the MVFC had OOC wins over NEC opponents Duquesne & Robert Morris.

So what's your point about SOS again??

Several MVFC posters here have treated YSU like a red headed step child in the past. Now you take credit for them. Smh.

MVFC maybe the dominant FCS conference, but I'm not ready to give in to the hype when JMU beats @ NDSU, Richmond beats @ ISUr in '15 playoffs, & Villanova takes your conference champ SDSU to the final seconds in some glorified cow field in Brookings, SD. (It was a nice stadium-comment for effect)

At best, they are slightly more dominant than the CAA. SLIGHTLY.

The rest of you folks can argue for your conferences.

I look at the difference between CAA vs MVFC as mostly similar with the top 3 especially this year. After that it's not that close. FCS teams have limited depth, NDSU was quite depleted vs the team that beat Iowa or EWU. Not making excuses JMU did a number on NDSU, and NDSU got out coached, and out played. The playoffs favor strong teams from relatively weaker conferences(SHSU 2011-2014), they keep their depth more than a team that has to fight for every game in conference. I would expect even SIU, or Missouri State to take out maybe the bottom 2 out of the field of 24, more for UNI or WIU, or South Dakota.

The average team in the MVFC and the competition is unmatched for the rest of the FCS. YSU got put in the weaker side of the bracket, and they have improved quite a bit. I am still not sure how good they are. Both NDSU and SDSU beat them easily. YSU also kept it respectable vs FBS number 16 WVU. Let's talk when other conferences in the FCS have 3 P5 wins.

[MR. CHICKEN]

http://www.anygivensaturday.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=24264&stc=1http://www.anygivensaturday.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=24265&stc=1.........RECHECKED DUH NUMBERS....SOGONE C+....xnodx..............BROCCO!

[Gangtackle11]

I look at the difference between CAA vs MVFC as mostly similar with the top 3 especially this year. After that it's not that close. FCS teams have limited depth, NDSU was quite depleted vs the team that beat Iowa or EWU. Not making excuses JMU did a number on NDSU, and NDSU got out coached, and out played. The playoffs favor strong teams from relatively weaker conferences(SHSU 2011-2014), they keep their depth more than a team that has to fight for every game in conference. I would expect even SIU, or Missouri State to take out maybe the bottom 2 out of the field of 24, more for UNI or WIU, or South Dakota.

The average team in the MVFC and the competition is unmatched for the rest of the FCS. YSU got put in the weaker side of the bracket, and they have improved quite a bit. I am still not sure how good they are. Both NDSU and SDSU beat them easily. YSU also kept it respectable vs FBS number 16 WVU. Let's talk when other conferences in the FCS have 3 P5 wins.

Teams are always depleted when the mighty MVFC loses. JMU played without 7 players including their leading tackler & WR. No excuses from them.

Congrats on your 3 FBS wins. It got you eliminated in each case. Lots of respect for NDSU run, but the rest is a bunch of excuses as usual.

[centennial]

Teams are always depleted when the mighty MVFC loses. JMU played without 7 players including their leading tackler & WR. No excuses from them.

Congrats on your 3 FBS wins. It got you eliminated in each case. Lots of respect for NDSU run, but the rest is a bunch of excuses as usual.

JMU thoroughly outplayed NDSU. The MVFC had 4 FBS wins (Iowa, Iowa State, Northwestern, NIU). There were two MVFC teams in the semi finals, only one for the CAA. 2014 had 2 MVFC teams in the finals. Middle through bottom the MVFC vs the CAA aren't close. Top of the conferences are similar depending on the year. There is a reason the computers don't even rate the CAA as the 2nd strongest FCS (it's the 4th).

[MR. CHICKEN]

I look at the difference between CAA vs MVFC as mostly similar with the top 3 especially this year. After that it's not that close. FCS teams have limited depth, NDSU was quite depleted vs the team that beat Iowa or EWU. Not making excuses JMU did a number on NDSU, and NDSU got out coached, and out played.The playoffs favor strong teams from relatively weaker conferences(SHSU 2011-2014), they keep their depth more than a team that has to fight for every game in conference. I would expect even SIU, or Missouri State to take out maybe the bottom 2 out of the field of 24, more for UNI or WIU, or South Dakota.

The average team in the MVFC and the competition is unmatched for the rest of the FCS. YSU got put in the weaker side of the bracket, and they have improved quite a bit. I am still not sure how good they are. Both NDSU and SDSU beat them easily. YSU also kept it respectable vs FBS number 16 WVU. Let's talk when other conferences in the FCS have 3 P5 wins.


......POPPYCOCK!.............PLAYERS CAN GET HURT ANYTIME......GEEESSHHH!...WE USED TA LOSE GUYS...IN DUH WEST CHESTER GAMES.........STONY BROOK/MAINE/ALBANY.......WOODAH BEEN CAPABLE TOO!....BROCCO!

[Gangtackle11]

JMU thoroughly outplayed NDSU. The MVFC had 4 FBS wins (Iowa, Iowa State, Northwestern, NIU). There were two MVFC teams in the semi finals, only one for the CAA. 2014 had 2 MVFC teams in the finals. Middle through bottom the MVFC vs the CAA aren't close. Top of the conferences are similar depending on the year. There is a reason the computers don't even rate the CAA as the 2nd strongest FCS (it's the 4th).

Computers? Garbage in, Garbage out.

Massey should be ashamed of his rankings with UNI ranked 10th in the country. That right there shows it's a BS ranking that takes into account SOS instead of winning football games.

MVFC is the best conference. I'll give you that, but it's weighted by NDSU dominance mainly.

Missouri State is ranked 44th is laughable too. 4-7 with wins over Southwestern State (Alabama of the NAIA?) & Murray State. (Is this a school for accountants?)

Come on that's freaking weak, but because the computer says it's great we all should bow down & believe the MVFC hype.

Computers say NDSU won their 6th straight. Someone forgot to tell JMU.

[Go...gate]

The PL should be given a solid D.

Lafayette and Georgetown were among the worst teams in FCS. The league as a whole had a dreadful OOC. Lehigh and Fordham had some nice wins but the rest not so much. Lehigh's playoff performance was basically an utter disgrace. To go into the UNH game as the favorite and perform like that was a huge black eye for a the league. Colgate's season was basically over the first week of October due to poor scheduling. Fordham likely would have been a playoff team if their defense wasn't terrible. Holy Cross once again disappointed and retained Gilmore for some unknown reason. Bucknell continues to be themselves. They care just enough to question how much they actually care....

Sorry. Just because we dropped one game from the schedule against an NEC school, that is not "poor scheduling". One more game against the NEC, home or away, was not going to make or break Colgate.

[Go Lehigh TU Owl]

Sorry. Just because we dropped one game from the schedule against an NEC school, that is not "poor scheduling". One more game against the NEC, home or away, was not going to make or break Colgate.

Scheduled an unwinnable FBS game, played a 10 game schedule and played 5 out of the first 6 games on the road. That is terrible scheduling.....

[citdog]

Scheduled an unwinnable FBS game, played a 10 game schedule and played 5 out of the first 6 games on the road. That is terrible scheduling.....


They UNI'd themselves for sure.

[FUBeAR]

http://www.anygivensaturday.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=24264&stc=1http://www.anygivensaturday.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=24265&stc=1.........RECHECKED DUH NUMBERS....SOGONE C+....xnodx..............BROCCO!


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kAuvvn4F9yU

[Houndawg]

Maybe. In the end wins over NIU, Northwestern, & Iowa are nice, but it resulted in WIU not making the playoffs, ISUr beaten by UCA (finished 2nd to SHSU who lost 65-7 to JMU)& finally someone beating NDSU (JMU from what conference?). So SOS got you what?


The team that made it to the finals from the MVFC had OOC wins over NEC opponents Duquesne & Robert Morris.

So what's your point about SOS again??

Several MVFC posters here have treated YSU like a red headed step child in the past. Now you take credit for them. Smh.

MVFC maybe the dominant FCS conference, but I'm not ready to give in to the hype when JMU beats @ NDSU, Richmond beats @ ISUr in '15 playoffs, & Villanova takes your conference champ SDSU to the final seconds in some glorified cow field in Brookings, SD. (It was a nice stadium-comment for effect)

At best, they are slightly more dominant than the CAA. SLIGHTLY.

The rest of you folks can argue for your conferences.


Envy is an ugly emotion

[Go...gate]

Scheduled an unwinnable FBS game, played a 10 game schedule and played 5 out of the first 6 games on the road. That is terrible scheduling.....

Colgate didn't think it was unwinnable. We were coming off an NCAA Quarterfinal appearance and had most of the team back. Just because Colgate has the willingness to play stretch games, and is willing to go on the road to play better opponents (something Colgate athletics has traditionally done, as I have discussed with you ad nauseum) that is not "terrible" or "bad" scheduling. I'm sorry Colgate's and Lehigh's approaches to scheduling are dissimilar, but that is the way it is.

[Go...gate]

They UNI'd themselves for sure.

citdog, do you have any regrets that The Citadel played North Carolina?

[citdog]

citdog, do you have any regrets that The Citadel played North Carolina?

Nope. Those games are great for the players and fans. Every once in a while The 'Dogs will bite one of the 'big boys' directly in the buttocks.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aXnSl3nFlZI

[Go Lehigh TU Owl]

Colgate didn't think it was unwinnable. We were coming off an NCAA Quarterfinal appearance and had most of the team back. Just because Colgate has the willingness to play stretch games, and is willing to go on the road to play better opponents (something Colgate athletics has traditionally done, as I have discussed with you ad nauseum) that is not "terrible" or "bad" scheduling. I'm sorry Colgate's and Lehigh's approaches to scheduling are dissimilar, but that is the way it is.

I know we'll debate this until the end of time. Until Colgate proves they can actually be competitive with FBS teams they are certainly unwinnable. They were once again run by a rather poor Syracuse team. The Syracuse-Colgate series in general has been horrific the last 40 years. The games simply are not competitive. This year Colgate has a shot again Buffalo.

I believe red-shirting matters significantly in these early season FBS games. As a result the PL will usually get their butts kicked against anyone by the dregs of FBS...

Colgate going 5-5 and regressing significantly from last year did not help the league. Bottom line.

[Go Lehigh TU Owl]

Nope. Those games are great for the players and fans. Every once in a while The 'Dogs will bite one of the 'big boys' directly in the buttocks.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aXnSl3nFlZI

The Citadel at least has won against a FBS team recently! Look at Colgate's recent FBS results! Men vs Boys...

[DFW HOYA]

The Citadel at least has won against a FBS team recently! Look at Colgate's recent FBS results! Men vs Boys...

At least Colgate is playing such teams. Sure beats playing Davidson, don't you think?

[PAllen]

At least Colgate is playing such teams. Sure beats playing Davidson, don't you think?

Or Monmouth.

[Gangtackle11]

Envy is an ugly emotion

Sorry bud, but nothing to envy from what I see.

I went to Brookings, SD. I saw nothing that would lead me to be envious. I give them credit for living in such desolate locations & in horrible weather for a good chunk of the year. I get it that the FCS can dominate one's mind in such a dark & dreary existence. Nothing to do, but to stare out for endless miles of flat land can get to you I'm sure. Warp your thought process to the point you believe everything you say about the only thing you have.

Shame on me for trying to bring your warped thought process back to reality. I get it. Too many winters in sub zero temps have brought you to the point to actually believe there is nothing but MVFC football. Large state universities that couldn't cut it with the big boys isn't something any of us out this way get envious about.

Most of us out this way are prestigious academic institutions or smaller state universities playing FCS for one reason or another. Our large state universities play in the FBS.

I know you won't understand any of this. I don't expect to change a mind frozen in time. The MVFC is the best FCS conference. I've written that here over & over. It's not as dominant as your frozen mind may lead you to believe. NDSU was/is dominant. The rest have benefited from their rising tide. Your others are good, but nothing that scares any of us.

You want to call that envy so be it.

[Lehigh'98]

Maybe. In the end wins over NIU, Northwestern, & Iowa are nice, but it resulted in WIU not making the playoffs, ISUr beaten by UCA (finished 2nd to SHSU who lost 65-7 to JMU)& finally someone beating NDSU (JMU from what conference?). So SOS got you what?


The team that made it to the finals from the MVFC had OOC wins over NEC opponents Duquesne & Robert Morris.

So what's your point about SOS again??

Several MVFC posters here have treated YSU like a red headed step child in the past. Now you take credit for them. Smh.

MVFC maybe the dominant FCS conference, but I'm not ready to give in to the hype when JMU beats @ NDSU, Richmond beats @ ISUr in '15 playoffs, & Villanova takes your conference champ SDSU to the final seconds in some glorified cow field in Brookings, SD. (It was a nice stadium-comment for effect)

At best, they are slightly more dominant than the CAA. SLIGHTLY.

The rest of you folks can argue for your conferences.



This is very true. Most of the time, the MVFC wants zero to do with YSU

[Bison Fan in NW MN]

Sorry bud, but nothing to envy from what I see.

I went to Brookings, SD. I saw nothing that would lead me to be envious. I give them credit for living in such desolate locations & in horrible weather for a good chunk of the year. I get it that the FCS can dominate one's mind in such a dark & dreary existence. Nothing to do, but to stare out for endless miles of flat land can get to you I'm sure. Warp your thought process to the point you believe everything you say about the only thing you have.

Shame on me for trying to bring your warped thought process back to reality. I get it. Too many winters in sub zero temps have brought you to the point to actually believe there is nothing but MVFC football. Large state universities that couldn't cut it with the big boys isn't something any of us out this way get envious about.

Most of us out this way are prestigious academic institutions or smaller state universities playing FCS for one reason or another. Our large state universities play in the FBS.

I know you won't understand any of this. I don't expect to change a mind frozen in time. The MVFC is the best FCS conference. I've written that here over & over. It's not as dominant as your frozen mind may lead you to believe. NDSU was/is dominant. The rest have benefited from their rising tide. Your others are good, but nothing that scares any of us.

You want to call that envy so be it.


Midwest: Best people and place to live. Weather is a bonus....keeps the riff-raff away.....xthumbsupx

[caribbeanhen]

Sorry bud, but nothing to envy from what I see.

I went to Brookings, SD. I saw nothing that would lead me to be envious. I give them credit for living in such desolate locations & in horrible weather for a good chunk of the year. I get it that the FCS can dominate one's mind in such a dark & dreary existence. Nothing to do, but to stare out for endless miles of flat land can get to you I'm sure. Warp your thought process to the point you believe everything you say about the only thing you have.

Shame on me for trying to bring your warped thought process back to reality. I get it. Too many winters in sub zero temps have brought you to the point to actually believe there is nothing but MVFC football. Large state universities that couldn't cut it with the big boys isn't something any of us out this way get envious about.

Most of us out this way are prestigious academic institutions or smaller state universities playing FCS for one reason or another. Our large state universities play in the FBS.

I know you won't understand any of this. I don't expect to change a mind frozen in time. The MVFC is the best FCS conference. I've written that here over & over. It's not as dominant as your frozen mind may lead you to believe. NDSU was/is dominant. The rest have benefited from their rising tide. Your others are good, but nothing that scares any of us.

You want to call that envy so be it.

Lots of truth here, I have long compared the MVFC to Paul McCartney and Wings, we all know who the McCartney is, but who were Wings again?....... but this year Paul caught a cold when JMU came to town, so one of the long forgotten warm up bands the Valley Boys couldn't stand to listen too for a decade will get an opportunity on Center stage... haha,

[uni88]

Sorry bud, but nothing to envy from what I see.

I went to Brookings, SD. I saw nothing that would lead me to be envious. I give them credit for living in such desolate locations & in horrible weather for a good chunk of the year. I get it that the FCS can dominate one's mind in such a dark & dreary existence. Nothing to do, but to stare out for endless miles of flat land can get to you I'm sure. Warp your thought process to the point you believe everything you say about the only thing you have.

Shame on me for trying to bring your warped thought process back to reality. I get it. Too many winters in sub zero temps have brought you to the point to actually believe there is nothing but MVFC football. Large state universities that couldn't cut it with the big boys isn't something any of us out this way get envious about.

Most of us out this way are prestigious academic institutions or smaller state universities playing FCS for one reason or another. Our large state universities play in the FBS.

I know you won't understand any of this. I don't expect to change a mind frozen in time. The MVFC is the best FCS conference. I've written that here over & over. It's not as dominant as your frozen mind may lead you to believe. NDSU was/is dominant. The rest have benefited from their rising tide. Your others are good, but nothing that scares any of us.

You want to call that envy so be it.
Delaware, New Hampshire, Maine, Rhode Island, New Jersey (Rutgers might be in the FBS but do they really play in it)? :D

Before you nitpick that you stated "large," all of those states are more populous than South Dakota.

And Dawg probably lives south of any CAA football school campuses other than W&M, Richmond and Elon.

[Gangtackle11]

Delaware, New Hampshire, Maine, Rhode Island, New Jersey (Rutgers might be in the FBS but do they really play in it)? :D

Before you nitpick that you stated "large," all of those states are more populous than South Dakota.

And Dawg probably lives south of any CAA football school campuses other than W&M, Richmond and Elon.

I did some research & stand corrected. Most of the MVFC schools have approximately 15k in enrollment. That is similiar to Maine, UNH, URI. Illinois St. & Delaware are over 20k. Missouri State is 26k.

I allow the MVFC to stay in the FCS based on my findings. ✌️

[Thumper 76]

You CAA guys are a joke. The year that NDSU doesn't make the title the MVFC still has a team in it, but you're still arguing NDSU coattail riding? So much for your prestigious educations in your lands of wonder and joy that are the crime infested ****holes you live in.


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[Gangtackle11]

You CAA guys are a joke. The year that NDSU doesn't make the title the MVFC still has a team in it, but you're still arguing NDSU coattail riding? So much for your prestigious educations in your lands of wonder and joy that are the crime infested ****holes you live in.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Take credit now for them. Chastise them when they bring no value to the MVFC.

You'd be surprised where some of us live in this area. I have farms all around me in one of the wealthiest counties on the east coast. Quite beautiful. Come visit.

PS: at least JMU doesn't need to cry about being in the same region as NDSU. I didn't cry when SDSU beat Nova. How about you? Still whining about going to Fargo?

[Redbird 4th & short]

Computers? Garbage in, Garbage out.

Massey should be ashamed of his rankings with UNI ranked 10th in the country. That right there shows it's a BS ranking that takes into account SOS instead of winning football games.

MVFC is the best conference. I'll give you that, but it's weighted by NDSU dominance mainly.

Missouri State is ranked 44th is laughable too. 4-7 with wins over Southwestern State (Alabama of the NAIA?) & Murray State. (Is this a school for accountants?)

Come on that's freaking weak, but because the computer says it's great we all should bow down & believe the MVFC hype.

Computers say NDSU won their 6th straight. Someone forgot to tell JMU.
Do you even know what garbage in garbage out means ? Or do you just like to say things that sound cool ? There is zero garbage associated with the data. The data is what it is ... a whole bunch of fact based data points .. all facts in .. not garbage in. NDSU is weighted the same as the teams at bottom of conference. What you may have intended to say is you don't accept their formula .. which you don't even know, since it is proprietary .. so I have no idea what you meant by garbage in garbage out.

And how convenient for you to ride the coat tails of a very good JMU team .. as if this one team's impressive season makes it an official trend line favoring CAA .. very selective reasoning there.

As for you cherry picking YSU non-conference schedule .. they also played FBS top 15 WVU and lost by 17 .. but they were tied at half, down just 10 in Q4 before giving up late TD. So you aren't impressed with their SOS .. as if their 2 NEC games is indicative of all 10 MVFC teams nonconf schedule. Yet somehow win 4 playoff games against Samford, at #3 JSU, Wofford, and at #2 EWU .. yet your argument is to question their SOS as they enter the championship game ??

Good argument you have going there !!

Oh and lets look at Villanova non-conf schedule: Lehigh, Lafayette, and Pitt ... how is that any different than YSU playing Duquense, Rob Morris, and WVU ??

Remind me of your point ... if you have one ?

[Gangtackle11]

Do you even know what garbage in garbage out means ? Or do you just like to say things that sound cool ? There is zero garbage associated with the data. The data is what it is ... a whole bunch of fact based data points .. all facts in .. not garbage in. NDSU is weighted the same as the teams at bottom of conference. What you may have intended to say is you don't accept their formula .. which you don't even know, since it is proprietary .. so I have no idea what you meant by garbage in garbage out.

And how convenient for you to ride the coat tails of a very good JMU team .. as if this one team's impressive season makes it an official trend line favoring CAA .. very selective reasoning there.

As for you cherry picking YSU non-conference schedule .. they also played FBS top 15 WVU and lost by 17 .. but they were tied at half, down just 10 in Q4 before giving up late TD. So you aren't impressed with their SOS .. as if their 2 NEC games is indicative of all 10 MVFC teams nonconf schedule. Yet somehow win 4 playoff games against Samford, at #3 JSU, Wofford, and at #2 EWU .. yet your argument is to question their SOS as they enter the championship game ??

Good argument you have going there !!

Oh and lets look at Villanova non-conf schedule: Lehigh, Lafayette, and Pitt ... how is that any different than YSU playing Duquense, Rob Morris, and WVU ??

Remind me of your point ... if you have one ?

Any system that has a 5-6 team ranked 10th is flawed whether I or you have the recipe to their formula.

UNI lost 45-24 at home to SDSU the week before Villanova lost 10-7 to SDSU in Brookings. A 9-4 Villanova team sits behind a 5-6 UNI in the Massey ratings. Spin it anyway you like. Bad rating system, but it's good for you middling MVFC teams to come on here & say how great you all are.

My point about YSU OOC was it doesn't have to be filled with top teams to get you to the top game. I wasn't being judgmental at all about it.

You are just another MVFC shill. Angry that JMU stole the show so all you "just like the rest of us" MVFC teams can't get away telling us how powerful you think you are because you might have beaten NDSU in October.

I'll write it again. MVFC very good FCS conference, but except for NDSU you guys are all just MVFC tough guys who come on here and push your "look at me too just not NDSU" propaganda. That is until u see the big bad wolf NDSU then you crawl up into a fetal position and cry regionalization!!!!

[MR. CHICKEN]

xpopcornx

[Thumper 76]

Any system that has a 5-6 team ranked 10th is flawed whether I or you have the recipe to their formula.

UNI lost 45-24 at home to SDSU the week before Villanova lost 10-7 to SDSU in Brookings. A 9-4 Villanova team sits behind a 5-6 UNI in the Massey ratings. Spin it anyway you like. Bad rating system, but it's good for you middling MVFC teams to come on here & say how great you all are.

My point about YSU OOC was it doesn't have to be filled with top teams to get you to the top game. I wasn't being judgmental at all about it.

You are just another MVFC shill. Angry that JMU stole the show so all you "just like the rest of us" MVFC teams can't get away telling us how powerful you think you are because you might have beaten NDSU in October.

I'll write it again. MVFC very good FCS conference, but except for NDSU you guys are all just MVFC tough guys who come on here and push your "look at me too just not NDSU" propaganda. That is until u see the big bad wolf NDSU then you crawl up into a fetal position and cry regionalization!!!!

Ok, here's the deal. No MVFC person is angry about JMU knocking off NDSU. Congrats to them, a lot of MVFC fans are relieved, whether they admit it or not we were as tired if not more tired of NDSU than other folks. And stop banging on the Nova game. SDSU played like dog****. Sorry. I watched every SDSU game this year, and while I don't think they put up 40 on Nova, if they play decent they have at least 24. SDSU wasn't playing nearly as well to end they year as they did at the start. From what I saw is Nova is about on par with UNI and YSU back when SDSU played them, the difference is TC played poorly, that's the reality. His throws didn't have the accuracy they did at the start of the year for the last 4-5 games. So stop with this constant referencing that game and belittling the Brookings area. It's not going to change the fact that your legend coaches career went out to die in "the glorified cornfield in the middle of nowhere". Nova had a good defense and dog**** offense that got a pass heavy SDSU offense in a snowstorm and performed exactly as well as UNI or YSU pre offensive production would have there. Get over it. The ISUr guys are definitely the worst about banging the MVFC drum, oh well. Nobody else is. Guess what, our "big bully" got knocked out and the MVFC STILL has a team in the championship. The MVFC has had a rep in the championship the last four years and 3 different teams total in those four years. So just stop. As for MVFC backing YSU after they actually provide value, I bet the CAA bitching about Elon would die down if they made the chipper. So just stop, seriously. Every rational MVFC fan has already admitted that the top of the CAA and some others can play with the top of the MVFC. I don't think anybody has denied that. So wtf are you trying to prove at this point?


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[Gangtackle11]

We'll agree to disagree on the Villanova-SDSU game. Our defense had as much to do with stopping your offense as the off day you claim your "stud" QB had. 7 yards total rushing. Less than 200 yards total.

I can site several plays & a bad non-call that most likely sent you packing, but in the end you guys won 10-7. I accept that. I will agree that our offense is dogcrap against quality opponents. Hopefully, it gets fixed.

As for the rest, there are plenty of posters here from the MVFC who constantly post if we only didnt have regionalization we would have won too comments. Just go back and read some of these threads over the days, months, years. It's as borish to us as my responses are to you. There is no evidence any MVFC team would have won if NDSU didn't exist including ISUr in 2014.

I write for the CAA fan that I am. The CAA has a very small sample of games with the MVFC. I could care less about the OOC history that some of your fans hang on to with wins over your western counterparts mostly or a record skewed by total NDSU domination.

Recently, Richmond has won at ISUr, JMU @ NDSU. Forget that Nova lost 10-7 on a FG off the upright @ SDSU. Rarely is the CAA home for these BTW.

All leads me to believe that this MVFC is the only game in town mentality because of some flawed computer ranking & the NDSU run is as tired to me as my responses fighting back are to you.

Any computer ranking that has UNI #10 & quality teams like Villanova or Richmond behind UNI is worthless.

I could care less if you guys think Missouri State is far superior than Rhody or Elon. Who cares if your pond scum is better than ours?

As for Brookings.....I really enjoyed Cubby's. The stadium is awesome, but I was disappointed not to see a packed house given all I've been lead to believe about the Mecca of FCS on this forum.

Glad we went. Wished we had won although Fargo with sub zero temps & crazy airfare pricing it was OK you guys went instead. It allows SDSU fans to continue with "if we only didn't have to go to Fargo" we would be somebody too comments.

[BEAR]

I wonder what the TEAM year end grades for each conference would look like? Maybe time to start that thread. xthumbsupx

[Redbird 4th & short]

Any system that has a 5-6 team ranked 10th is flawed whether I or you have the recipe to their formula.

UNI lost 45-24 at home to SDSU the week before Villanova lost 10-7 to SDSU in Brookings. A 9-4 Villanova team sits behind a 5-6 UNI in the Massey ratings. Spin it anyway you like. Bad rating system, but it's good for you middling MVFC teams to come on here & say how great you all are.

My point about YSU OOC was it doesn't have to be filled with top teams to get you to the top game. I wasn't being judgmental at all about it.

You are just another MVFC shill. Angry that JMU stole the show so all you "just like the rest of us" MVFC teams can't get away telling us how powerful you think you are because you might have beaten NDSU in October.

I'll write it again. MVFC very good FCS conference, but except for NDSU you guys are all just MVFC tough guys who come on here and push your "look at me too just not NDSU" propaganda. That is until u see the big bad wolf NDSU then you crawl up into a fetal position and cry regionalization!!!!
I didn't say the statistical ranking systems are perfect. I am saying they are completely objective and the "data in" is 100% fact-based not "garbage in" as you stated. But Massey has way outperformed the FCS selection committee, the FCP coaches poll, Stats/SNW, and AGS over the years. For you to pick on the UNI ranking in isolation is rather conveniently selective.

So here's my main point about the MVFC and why some of us feel we don't get the credit we deserve. Per my other post on a different thread .. Look at what happened from 2011-13. Answer couple questions:

1. was Massey wrong when it had the CAA dominating their computerized rankings in 2010 & prior ? CAA dominated and Massey reflected that.
2. why was Massey suddenly getting it wrong from 2011-13, when it had MVFC as the strongest conference ?
3. why did MVFC have to go 23-1 OOC in 2014 before we got the love from FCP and Stats pollsters and the FCS selection committee .. 23-1, then 10-4 in playoffs with 3 losses coming from our own MVFC .. so 7-1 against OOC in playoffs
4. why did MVFC only get 2 teams in 2013 .. just 1 year earlier .. did we really just finally get dominant in 2014 ? Really ?

So from our perspective, fduring 2011-13, several MVFC teams deserving of playoff bids stayed home, while other conferences and teams got at large bids. Let's look at 2013 .. just 1 year prior to MVFC dominating the entire fielding 2014.

http://www.masseyratings.com/cf/arch/compare1aa2013-13.htm

In 2013, MVFC had 5 teams in the top 18 using Massey Composite of 40 polls/systems .. not the Massey system, the Massey composite. Here's # of playoff teams by conference that year:

- Big Sky got 4 teams, despite conference ranking 6th using Massey Composite .. they crapped bed in playoffs, other than EWU.
- CAA got 3 teams .. did well in playoffs
- OVC got 3 teams .. did ok in playoffs
- Southland got 3 teams .. did poorly in playoffs

So 4 conferences got more bids than the top ranked MVFC conference. So here is list of all the conferences that got 2 teams:

- 2 teams: MVFC, Southern (post Appy St and Georgia Southern exodus), Patriot
- 1 team: NEC, Big South, Pioneer .. so we got 1 more team than these doormat conferences

5 teams in top 18 per Massey composite in 2013 .. and we get just 2 playoff teams. One year later in 2014, we have to go 23-1 before selection committee is forced to show us love that CAA and Big Sky gets without question .. and we know what happened in 2014 playoffs.

Went from just 2 teams to 5 teams in one year ??

Similar situations in 2011 and 2012. Look at it objectively and you'll understand why MVFC fans have a bit of chip on our shoulders.

[Gangtackle11]

I wonder what the TEAM year end grades for each conference would look like? Maybe time to start that thread. xthumbsupx

Lol. I'm sorry to be a major offender to hijacking. Guilty as charged, but I'm not alone. xpeacex

[Thumper 76]

We'll agree to disagree on the Villanova-SDSU game. Our defense had as much to do with stopping your offense as the off day you claim your "stud" QB had. 7 yards total rushing. Less than 200 yards total.

I can site several plays & a bad non-call that most likely sent you packing, but in the end you guys won 10-7. I accept that. I will agree that our offense is dogcrap against quality opponents. Hopefully, it gets fixed.

As for the rest, there are plenty of posters here from the MVFC who constantly post if we only didnt have regionalization we would have won too comments. Just go back and read some of these threads over the days, months, years. It's as borish to us as my responses are to you. There is no evidence any MVFC team would have won if NDSU didn't exist including ISUr in 2014.

I write for the CAA fan that I am. The CAA has a very small sample of games with the MVFC. I could care less about the OOC history that some of your fans hang on to with wins over your western counterparts mostly or a record skewed by total NDSU domination.

Recently, Richmond has won at ISUr, JMU @ NDSU. Forget that Nova lost 10-7 on a FG off the upright @ SDSU. Rarely is the CAA home for these BTW.

All leads me to believe that this MVFC is the only game in town mentality because of some flawed computer ranking & the NDSU run is as tired to me as my responses fighting back are to you.

Any computer ranking that has UNI #10 & quality teams like Villanova or Richmond behind UNI is worthless.

I could care less if you guys think Missouri State is far superior than Rhody or Elon. Who cares if your pond scum is better than ours?

As for Brookings.....I really enjoyed Cubby's. The stadium is awesome, but I was disappointed not to see a packed house given all I've been lead to believe about the Mecca of FCS on this forum.

Glad we went. Wished we had won although Fargo with sub zero temps & crazy airfare pricing it was OK you guys went instead. It allows SDSU fans to continue with "if we only didn't have to go to Fargo" we would be somebody too comments.

I feel ya on being tired of some of the overboard posts about how tough the MVFC is. As to your point of not being able to know if another MVFC team would have won the Championship if not for NDSU, you can't be sure they wouldn't have either. UNI is not a top ten team, period. They are a decent team, but not even close to top ten, I 100% agree with you. The computors always have a head scratcher every year. I don't think it means you have to completely disregard them. As to SDSU fans complaining, I think the majority have just accepted that it is the way it is, but you can't look at the facts objectively and not see that no other team in the country has been sent to the same opponent in the playoffs even half as much as SDSU has in the last 7-10 years. I pick 10 years to give other teams a better chance to reach the halfway point of it. To have your road go through Fargo 4 of the last 6 years is insane, but thats the way it goes and the way it will be. Can't change it apparently. If Nova had to go to UD or JMU that many times in that short of a period I would bet you wouldn't be thrilled about it. Hell the guys in the Carolinas are pissed that they have had to be in the same group two years. If you can't understand how frustrating it is to have happen when you're sent to the team that wins 5 straight for 3 of the years, then it is what it is. I'm not in the group who thinks SDSU wins a natty without being sent to Fargo or that they would have even made it, but it would be nice to see if it could happen. SDSU is 4-3 in the playoffs when not sent to Fargo, and considering that only two of those games were at home, I would like to see what could happen. As for the attendance in Brookings, I think if you paid any attention to what SDSU fans or NDSU fans were saying you wouldn't have expected a great crowd. The attendance was still disappointing, but our fanbase is young and growing. Give it 5-10 years and I would bet its a much different story. Right now we are in the beginning of the first time SDSU has been nationally relevent or even competing for conference championships for the first time in 60 years. We don't have the generational thing that NDSU has where kids have been going to games with their parents, grew up around it, and are now taking their familys. We had an atrotious stadium (when I first saw a picture I thought it was a DIII school before I went there) and a mediocre team at best. Our fanbase also is extremely unfamiliar with having a home playoff game and aren't conditioned to go yet. When you have two home games in 7 playoff appearances you don't have much to have built a playoff mentality yet, and a lot of that was due to limitations of our bidding due to old CAS. Hopefully it changes, and I believe it will. We set our home attendance record this season and it wasn't even a rivalry game. Since we transitioned to FCS our attendance has grown pretty well, from averaging under 10,000 per game up to averaging 15,000 during the regular season this year. Anyways, I have well wandered from my main point, that nobody who is familiar with SDSU was expecting any more than a half full stadium for that game at best. We have an outdoor stadium in an area where every other team has a dome, so we need a more hardcore base of fans to get them to show up in the snow and cold. I think we will get there, but until then we will continue to be mocked by NDSU fans.

[Bison Fan in NW MN]

Take credit now for them. Chastise them when they bring no value to the MVFC.

You'd be surprised where some of us live in this area. I have farms all around me in one of the wealthiest counties on the east coast. Quite beautiful. Come visit.

PS: at least JMU doesn't need to cry about being in the same region as NDSU. I didn't cry when SDSU beat Nova. How about you? Still whining about going to Fargo?



xlolx

A "farm" on the east coast is probably a tiny hobby farm here in the Midwest.

[Gangtackle11]

Thanks for the SDSU background. I'm sure you guys will be a top 20 program with facilities like that to offer recruits.

As for playing Delaware or JMU it's what I expect given the structure of the FCS playoffs. The irony of all this regionalization is Richmond blows a tire vs. W&M last game of the season. Allows UND to slip into a bye & sends Villanova to SDSU instead of a rematch with Richmond. Shame on those Spiders, but then again never would have gone to Cubby's.

[POD Knows]

Thanks for the SDSU background. I'm sure you guys will be a top 20 program with facilities like that to offer recruits.

As for playing Delaware or JMU it's what I expect given the structure of the FCS playoffs. The irony of all this regionalization is Richmond blows a tire vs. W&M last game of the season. Allows UND to slip into a bye & sends Villanova to SDSU instead of a rematch with Richmond. Shame on those Spiders, but then again never would have gone to Cubby's.

I am pretty sure that is an insult but I like it. xthumbsupx For the record, I hate every MVFC team and couldn't care less whether they win or lose any particular game

[BEAR]

Lol. I'm sorry to be a major offender to hijacking. Guilty as charged, but I'm not alone. xpeacex

xlolxNo it wasnt toward any poster but rather something I had thought about for the SLC myself for weeks. The idea of a conference year end grades made me think of how the SLC should be graded...

[Go...gate]

I know we'll debate this until the end of time. Until Colgate proves they can actually be competitive with FBS teams they are certainly unwinnable. They were once again run by a rather poor Syracuse team. The Syracuse-Colgate series in general has been horrific the last 40 years. The games simply are not competitive. This year Colgate has a shot again Buffalo.

I believe red-shirting matters significantly in these early season FBS games. As a result the PL will usually get their butts kicked against anyone by the dregs of FBS...

Colgate going 5-5 and regressing significantly from last year did not help the league. Bottom line.

Yes, I am sure we will have this argument for many years to come.

We had an off year. Lehigh and every other PL program has had them over the years.

[KPSUL]

xlolx

A "farm" on the east coast is probably a tiny hobby farm here in the Midwest.

The word "farm" has a totally different meaning in most of the Mid-Atlantic region. A farm has nothing to do with agriculture. It's a multi-million dollar home on about 10 acres of rolling hills with 3 or 4 dressage horses and several miles of white wooden fences that get painted every two years.

[Thumper 76]

The word "farm" has a totally different meaning in most of the Mid-Atlantic region. A farm has nothing to do with agriculture. It's a multi-million dollar home on about 10 acres of rolling hills with 3 or 4 dressage horses and several miles of white wooden fences that get painted every two years.

So he was right xlolx


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[mmiller_34]

Envy is an ugly emotion



Sorry bud, but nothing to envy from what I see.

I went to Brookings, SD. I saw nothing that would lead me to be envious. I give them credit for living in such desolate locations & in horrible weather for a good chunk of the year. I get it that the FCS can dominate one's mind in such a dark & dreary existence. Nothing to do, but to stare out for endless miles of flat land can get to you I'm sure. Warp your thought process to the point you believe everything you say about the only thing you have.

Shame on me for trying to bring your warped thought process back to reality. I get it. Too many winters in sub zero temps have brought you to the point to actually believe there is nothing but MVFC football. Large state universities that couldn't cut it with the big boys isn't something any of us out this way get envious about.

Most of us out this way are prestigious academic institutions or smaller state universities playing FCS for one reason or another. Our large state universities play in the FBS.

I know you won't understand any of this. I don't expect to change a mind frozen in time. The MVFC is the best FCS conference. I've written that here over & over. It's not as dominant as your frozen mind may lead you to believe. NDSU was/is dominant. The rest have benefited from their rising tide. Your others are good, but nothing that scares any of us.

You want to call that envy so be it.

Gee. He really told that Southern Illinois fan off.

Dont worry Dawg, I don't think your brain is frozen.

[caribbeanhen]

I watched every SDSU game this year, and while I don't think they put up 40 on Nova, if they play decent they have at least 24. SDSU wasn't playing nearly as well to end they year as they did at the start. From what I saw is Nova is about on par with UNI and YSU back when SDSU played them, the difference is TC played poorly, that's the reality. His throws didn't have the accuracy they did at the start of the year for the last 4-5 games.

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I watched one SDSU game this year, your high powered offense got dominated... I don't think it was as much to do with the weather as you say. Nova has a pretty good Defense (understatement) and took you out of your game, talent is the great equalizer.....Congrats on pulling out the victory...

[Bison Fan in NW MN]

The word "farm" has a totally different meaning in most of the Mid-Atlantic region. A farm has nothing to do with agriculture. It's a multi-million dollar home on about 10 acres of rolling hills with 3 or 4 dressage horses and several miles of white wooden fences that get painted every two years.


Could be.

I took 2 college buddies (one from New York and the other from Mass) pheasant hunting out in western ND. We were on a high school friend of mine's "farm" and they farmed a total of 4K acres......and that is now considered small by farming standards now here in the Midwest.

[Gangtackle11]

I watched one SDSU game this year, your high powered offense got dominated... I don't think it was as much to do with the weather as you say. Nova has a pretty good Defense (understatement) and took you out of your game, talent is the great equalizer.....Congrats on pulling out the victory...

Geez c-hen don't start this. xsmiley_wix

These Jackrabbit fans couldn't understand why they couldn't put up 40 on us. (Go check their Jackrabbit fan forum) Our defense had nothing to do with the 7 yards they got rushing or the 190 yards of total offense. Their TE is a stud. The rest of that vaunted offense is pretty pedestrian for what I've seen over the years. Slow at skilled positions. The QB has happy feet when his big TE is covered. That said kudos to them putting up the 10 they needed to win. Heck, we even played the whole 1st half with our NFL to be DE getting his busted thumb patched up.

Their defense played strong against our much maligned offense. We had trouble with those big farm boys upfront. They won & that's the bottom line, but it wasn't just SDSU having an off day offensively. They had no run game & the QB looked like he had taken the points from Cubby's bookie that day, but Nova had nothing to do with it. xconfusedx

It was the weather they say. The entire roster is from SD & MN. They aren't used to 35 degrees and light snow? Please......

Nova just couldn't overcome an offense that in their 4 losses to Pitt, Richmond, JMU, & SDSU scored a total of 21 points. Of course that 9-4 record ranks them behind UNI in the Massey ratings. Smh.

Like I say. They are good these NDSU wanna bees, but nothing we can't play with every day of the week. Don't let them bully you into thinking differently!

[kalm]

Could be.

I took 2 college buddies (one from New York and the other from Mass) pheasant hunting out in western ND. We were on a high school friend of mine's "farm" and they farmed a total of 4K acres......and that is now considered small by farming standards now here in the Midwest.

I would easily live in either Dakota. The prairie is gorgeous.

[MR. CHICKEN]

I would easily live in either Dakota. The prairie is gorgeous.

......ROCKS 'N WEEDS.......BACK EAST.......DAT'S UH....VACANT LOT................BROCCO!

[caribbeanhen]

Geez c-hen don't start this. xsmiley_wix

These Jackrabbit fans couldn't understand why they couldn't put up 40 on us. (Go check their Jackrabbit fan forum) Our defense had nothing to do with the 7 yards they got rushing or the 190 yards of total offense. Their TE is a stud. The rest of that vaunted offense is pretty pedestrian for what I've seen over the years. Slow at skilled positions. The QB has happy feet when his big TE is covered. That said kudos to them putting up the 10 they needed to win. Heck, we even played the whole 1st half with our NFL to be DE getting his busted thumb patched up.

Their defense played strong against our much maligned offense. We had trouble with those big farm boys upfront. They won & that's the bottom line, but it wasn't just SDSU having an off day offensively. They had no run game & the QB looked like he had taken the points from Cubby's bookie that day, but Nova had nothing to do with it. xconfusedx

It was the weather they say. The entire roster is from SD & MN. They aren't used to 35 degrees and light snow? Please......

Nova just couldn't overcome an offense that in their 4 losses to Pitt, Richmond, JMU, & SDSU scored a total of 21 points. Of course that 9-4 record ranks them behind UNI in the Massey ratings. Smh.

Like I say. They are good these NDSU wanna bees, but nothing we can't play with every day of the week. Don't let them bully you into thinking differently!

Yes Sir!

I thought the Richmond victory last year at Illi State would open some eyes..... another warm up band sent back to the empty warehouse on the strip mall. These Farm Boys have kind of taken over the place and huff and puff when someone dares to offer a difference of opinion on yet another one of there threads...or even worse, prove one of em wrong. They are actively practicing Asch experiment principles on here..... let 5 MFVC fans pick a game and the next 5 will fall right in line...remember, it was to cold out there to complete a pass in our outdoor stadium.... haha

[Gangtackle11]

Yes Sir!

I thought the Richmond victory last year at Illi State would open some eyes..... another warm up band sent back to the empty warehouse on the strip mall. These Farm Boys have kind of taken over the place and huff and puff when someone dares to offer a difference of opinion on yet another one of there threads...or even worse, prove one of em wrong. They are actively practicing Asch experiment principles on here..... let 5 MFVC fans pick a game and the next 5 will fall right in line...remember, it was to cold out there to complete a pass in our outdoor stadium.... haha


Asch Experiment:
Solomon Asch (1951) conducted an experiment to investigate the extent to which social pressure from a majority group could affect a person to conform. If the participant gave an incorrect answer it would be clear that this was due to group pressure.
(He used the MVFC posters as a test group ) xbowx

[Professor]

Pretty interesting thread

[Gangtackle11]

Pretty interesting thread

All in good fun there Professor. The non-NDSU boys out in the plains need to be brought down to earth every once in awhile.

If not their heads get too big & they are mistaken for Bison.

[caribbeanhen]

All in good fun there Professor. The non-NDSU boys out in the plains need to be brought down to earth every once in awhile.

If not their heads get too big & they are mistaken for Bison.

xlolx

[uni88]

These Farm Boys have kind of taken over the place and huff and puff when someone dares to offer a difference of opinion on yet another one of there threads...or even worse, prove one of em wrong.

True but 10 years ago the roles were reversed and it was the pampered eastern elites who were puffing out their chests, strutting around like pigeons and taking offense whenever anyone questioned their obvious (to them) superiority. These things go in cycles.

[Lehigh'98]

This thread will get real ugly if YSU blows out JMU.

[Gangtackle11]

This thread will get real ugly if YSU blows out JMU.

Maybe, but JMU has already achieved a major victory defeating the Fargo dragon that the wannabes could not do.

Could be a very cold winter for the wannabes if JMU takes YSU to the woodshed. xpeacexxpeacex

[uni88]

Maybe, but JMU has already achieved a major victory defeating the Fargo dragon that the wannabes could not do.

Could be a very cold winter for the wannabes if JMU takes YSU to the woodshed. xpeacexxpeacex

It's going to be a cold winter regardless of what happens in a football game in Frisco, TX. It will probably be a little more annoying if JMU takes YSU to the woodshed and the CAA homers spend the offseason slobbering on JMU's knobs just like MVFC homers have slobbered on NDSU's for the past 5 years. xcoolx

[POD Knows]

It's going to be a cold winter regardless of what happens in a football game in Frisco, TX. It will probably be a little more annoying if JMU takes YSU to the woodshed and the CAA homers spend the offseason slobbering on JMU's knobs just like MVFC homers have slobbered on NDSU's for the past 5 years. xcoolx

Maybe it is just me but I have NO loyalty to any conference foe of NDSU, none, zero, zip, nada. I am a Steeler fan, what, am I supposed to support the freaking Ravens if they make the playoffs, screw that. I get the SOS argument and the conference strength ratings, blah, blah, blah but I couldn't care less if YSU wins, hell, if JMU curb stomps them, it makes the Bison look better.

I understand that conference allegiance is different in college vs. the pros but I don't care.

That being said, I will support YSU just to make this Alexale guy eat some crow. xnodx

[Bison Fan in NW MN]

Geez c-hen don't start this. xsmiley_wix

These Jackrabbit fans couldn't understand why they couldn't put up 40 on us. (Go check their Jackrabbit fan forum) Our defense had nothing to do with the 7 yards they got rushing or the 190 yards of total offense. Their TE is a stud. The rest of that vaunted offense is pretty pedestrian for what I've seen over the years. Slow at skilled positions. The QB has happy feet when his big TE is covered. That said kudos to them putting up the 10 they needed to win. Heck, we even played the whole 1st half with our NFL to be DE getting his busted thumb patched up.

Their defense played strong against our much maligned offense. We had trouble with those big farm boys upfront. They won & that's the bottom line, but it wasn't just SDSU having an off day offensively. They had no run game & the QB looked like he had taken the points from Cubby's bookie that day, but Nova had nothing to do with it. xconfusedx

It was the weather they say. The entire roster is from SD & MN. They aren't used to 35 degrees and light snow? Please......

Nova just couldn't overcome an offense that in their 4 losses to Pitt, Richmond, JMU, & SDSU scored a total of 21 points. Of course that 9-4 record ranks them behind UNI in the Massey ratings. Smh.

Like I say. They are good these NDSU wanna bees, but nothing we can't play with every day of the week. Don't let them bully you into thinking differently!


Maybe, just maybe the less than ideal weather might have had something to do with the ineffective offensive production also....xcoffeex

- - - Updated - - -


Maybe it is just me but I have NO loyalty to any conference foe of NDSU, none, zero, zip, nada. I am a Steeler fan, what, am I supposed to support the freaking Ravens if they make the playoffs, screw that. I get the SOS argument and the conference strength ratings, blah, blah, blah but I couldn't care less if YSU wins, hell, if JMU curb stomps them, it makes the Bison look better.

I understand that conference allegiance is different in college vs. the pros but I don't care.

That being said, I will support YSU just to make this Alexale guy eat some crow. xnodx



YSU all the way for me.....xthumbsupx

[DirtyDukes]

This thread will get real ugly if YSU blows out JMU.

Won't happen. Dukes will win by 30.

[Gangtackle11]

[QUOTE=Bison Fan in NW MN;2443549]Maybe, just maybe the less than ideal weather might have had something to do with the ineffective offensive production also....xcoffeex

- - - Updated - - -


More excuses from winter wonder land. Maybe our defense would have been more dominating. I hear a lot of football experts say the advantage is to the offense in bad weather. (It wasn't that bad btw)

Funny how an entire team from that part of the country comes up with weather as an excuse. The #1 rated FCS defense (by the NCAA not me) had nothing to do with the SDSU offense being shut down.

Bizarro world.

[Gangtackle11]

Won't happen. Dukes will win by 30.

I have it as a slow death for YSU. It will look like a game, but in the end it will be 31-10 or 3 Tds pick the score for JMU.

[KPSUL]

Based on the fact that the majority of my FCS football viewing is of the CAA, it is the only conference I'd want to comment on regarding how much stronger or weaker it became during the 2016 season. I do think it is incrementally stronger, and that is the result of many of the teams playing better defense. W&M, SB and Maine have traditionally been known for having effective defenses, but several other CAA teams including JMU, UNH and Albany had significantly better defenses than anytime in recent memory. Of course Villanova's D played lights out in may of their games through- out the season.
No question JMU was the standout team in the CAA throughout the season, maybe the best CAA team in a decade. But their conference schedule was far from a cake walk. During the regular season, they beat Maine by 9, W&M by 7, UNH by 3, and Richmond by 4. They won at Villanova by 13, but the game was not clinched until JMU scored a TD with 2 minutes remaining. so I don't think it is accurate to conclude that the rest of the conference is sliding along, and claiming improvements, on the coattails of one strong team.

[Gangtackle11]

I have it as a slow death for YSU. It will look like a game, but in the end it will be 31-10 or 3 Tds pick the score for JMU.

I'll go light on you MVFC guys. Most are true gentlemen (a stretch maybe), but a few have agendas and try to shout down my views on here.

For them:

Hmmm....maybe you some of you arrogant MVFC fans (you can decide who you are) should have listened.

Its now 2-2 against the "Wings" in the FCS playoffs since the NDSU run (not the MVFC dynasty).

[F'N Hawks]

CAA got a 'C' grade. xlolx

[Fox 94]

PFL exceeded expectations by a long way. A+


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[RichH2]

The PL should be given a solid D.

Lafayette and Georgetown were among the worst teams in FCS. The league as a whole had a dreadful OOC. Lehigh and Fordham had some nice wins but the rest not so much. Lehigh's playoff performance was basically an utter disgrace. To go into the UNH game as the favorite and perform like that was a huge black eye for a the league. Colgate's season was basically over the first week of October due to poor scheduling. Fordham likely would have been a playoff team if their defense wasn't terrible. Holy Cross once again disappointed and retained Gilmore for some unknown reason. Bucknell continues to be themselves. They care just enough to question how much they actually care....

D might be a bit harsh but a B is not at all reasonable. PL is improving but there is at present a wide divide between the top 3 and the rest of the PL. Expect the gap will close gradually. I look for Lafayette to start climbing back up with the new coaching staff. Fordham and Lehigh will be at the top and with improved Ds could be nationally relevant.

[GodHelpTheBears]

I'll go light on you MVFC guys. Most are true gentlemen (a stretch maybe), but a few have agendas and try to shout down my views on here.

For them:

Hmmm....maybe you some of you arrogant MVFC fans (you can decide who you are) should have listened.

Its now 2-2 against the "Wings" in the FCS playoffs since the NDSU run (not the MVFC dynasty).

I never understood the "conference" schtick - in most cases, it's a bunch of schools piggy backing off the accomplishments of one program.

We've absolutely blown at football for the past 25 years. No one considers us "better" because of a patch on the jerseys.