A non Jack Ass look at the "Weak" Southland Confernce

[fmrbearkat]

I posted this on another the JMU/NH thread but since its basketball season up there nobody looks at that thread and want to hear your thoughts on this. This is in no way a troll post but instead of looking at records in a column lets break down how weak our conference really was.

Nicholls State 0-2 Loss to FBS Georgia 24-26 and FBS South Alabama 41-40
Incarnate Word 0-2 with an FBS Loss
McNeese State 1-1 with a close loss to an FBS Louisiana Lafayette
SFA 1-1 With an FBS loss
UCA 1-1 with an FBS Win and Loss to Samford
Abilene Christian 0-2 with an FBS loss and 1 pt. loss to Northern Colorado
Lamar 0-2 with and FBS loss to Houston and an FCS loss to Coastal Carolina
Northwestern State 1-1 with an FBS Loss
Houston Baptist 1-1 with an FBS loss
Southeastern Louisiana 0-2 FBS loss and close loss to Southern Utah

Non Conference win Loss 5 wins and 15 losses with 10 of those losses to FBS teams several of which were extremely close games. Only one of the FCS losses was blowout.

So unless everybody in our conference decides to not take a money game and schedule 2 non competitive fcs teams a 9 game conference schedule will always look like a weak conference. Not that hard to understand.

To me it looks like the league is pretty equal but when you have 1 powerhouse that blows everybody out and a 2nd strong team in UCA that shut every offense down then it makes the average team appear weak.

[JSUSoutherner]

#ButtNicholls

[fmrbearkat]

#ButtNicholls

Again this is not a troll post. If you want to back up your assertion that its a weak overall conference then post some facts.

[JSUSoutherner]

Conferences as ranked by Sagarin.

http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161129/c1179df059cd3dec0dadd1d261487b96.png








*Wouldn't post as table so I took a screenshot instead

[Catatonic]

I'll add to your point by noting that 2-9 ACU scored more points against Northern Colorado than FCS offensive power Eastern Washington from the Big Sky.

[PantherRob82]

I posted this on another the JMU/NH thread but since its basketball season up there nobody looks at that thread and want to hear your thoughts on this. This is in no way a troll post but instead of looking at records in a column lets break down how weak our conference really was.

Nicholls State 0-2 Loss to FBS Georgia 24-26 and FBS South Alabama 41-40
Incarnate Word 0-2 with an FBS Loss
McNeese State 1-1 with a close loss to an FBS Louisiana Lafayette
SFA 1-1 With an FBS loss
UCA 1-1 with an FBS Win and Loss to Samford
Abilene Christian 0-2 with an FBS loss and 1 pt. loss to Northern Colorado
Lamar 0-2 with and FBS loss to Houston and an FCS loss to Coastal Carolina
Northwestern State 1-1 with an FBS Loss
Houston Baptist 1-1 with an FBS loss
Southeastern Louisiana 0-2 FBS loss and close loss to Southern Utah

Non Conference win Loss 5 wins and 15 losses with 10 of those losses to FBS teams several of which were extremely close games. Only one of the FCS losses was blowout.

So unless everybody in our conference decides to not take a money game and schedule 2 non competitive fcs teams a 9 game conference schedule will always look like a weak conference. Not that hard to understand.

To me it looks like the league is pretty equal but when you have 1 powerhouse that blows everybody out and a 2nd strong team in UCA that shut every offense down then it makes the average team appear weak.

I'll bite. Who were the 5 wins?

[dewey]

According to the Massey rankings the Southland is the 7th best FCS conference.

Individual team rankings
SHSU=5
UCA=10
SELA=42
McNeese=46
Nicholls=56
SFA=66
Lamar=84
Houston Baptist=86
Abilene Christian=97
Incarnate Word=98
NWLA=11

Link.
http://www.masseyratings.com/cf/compare1aa.htm

This is out of 125 teams and 13 conferences.

The Southland is a WEAK conference. Does this mean that SHSU is not good? Not at all. SHSU could very well win the National Championship but it doesn't prove that the Southland is a good conference.

When the Southland has a 9 game conference schedule takes FBS games and then plays cupcakes it is hard to gauge how good the conference really is.

Dewey

[BisonTru]

Let's breakdown those 5 wins, 3 against sub D1 competition and 1 win vs. the SWAC.

UCA is the only team that has done absolutely anything outside of the Southland.

[Daytripper]

I posted this on another the JMU/NH thread but since its basketball season up there nobody looks at that thread and want to hear your thoughts on this. This is in no way a troll post but instead of looking at records in a column lets break down how weak our conference really was.

Nicholls State 0-2 Loss to FBS Georgia 24-26 and FBS South Alabama 41-40
Incarnate Word 0-2 with an FBS Loss
McNeese State 1-1 with a close loss to an FBS Louisiana Lafayette
SFA 1-1 With an FBS loss
UCA 1-1 with an FBS Win and Loss to Samford
Abilene Christian 0-2 with an FBS loss and 1 pt. loss to Northern Colorado
Lamar 0-2 with and FBS loss to Houston and an FCS loss to Coastal Carolina
Northwestern State 1-1 with an FBS Loss
Houston Baptist 1-1 with an FBS loss
Southeastern Louisiana 0-2 FBS loss and close loss to Southern Utah

Non Conference win Loss 5 wins and 15 losses with 10 of those losses to FBS teams several of which were extremely close games. Only one of the FCS losses was blowout.

So unless everybody in our conference decides to not take a money game and schedule 2 non competitive fcs teams a 9 game conference schedule will always look like a weak conference. Not that hard to understand.

To me it looks like the league is pretty equal but when you have 1 powerhouse that blows everybody out and a 2nd strong team in UCA that shut every offense down then it makes the average team appear weak.

Give it up. You are wasting your time with this. You are not changing anybody's mind.

[TheRevSFA]

I'll bite. Who were the 5 wins?

One FBS - UCA beat Arky State
SFA, McNeese, NW State beat D2 schools.
HBU beat Texas Southern
Sam beat D2 OPSU and Texas Southern

Let us also not forget Incarnate Word losing to D2 Texas A&M Kingsville.

You can try to fluff us up all you want, but our 7 OOC wins were against **** opponents

[PantherRob82]

Can't most conferences say most of their losses were FBS and some of them were close?

[Daytripper]

One FBS - UCA beat Arky State
SFA, McNeese, NW State beat D2 schools.
HBU beat Texas Southern
Sam beat D2 OPSU and Texas Southern

Let us also not forget Incarnate Word losing to D2 Texas A&M Kingsville.

You can try to fluff us up all you want, but our 7 OOC wins were against **** opponents

But that doesn't mean that they couldn't/wouldn't beat great OOC opponents. Extrapolating weak OOC wins to obvious OOC losses to strong teams is illogical. We can only play who is on the schedule. This whole argument has sucked up way too much life from AGS posters....

Move on.

[Thumper 76]

I'll bite. Who were the 5 wins?
How about how many of the 5 wins weren't SWAC, MEAC, or DII? The Southland has created this problem themselves by enforcing 9 conference games and only allowing for two OOC. Then the teams compound it by playing DII games and weak competition in general if they aren't playing a FBS. Add to it bringing in a bunch of start up teams, you end up with a conference that is going to look weak when their traditional powers aren't all good, and no way to prove the start ups are worth a **** because they don't get the opportunity to go out and play good FCS competition due to the scheduling restraints forced upon them, creating a much more difficult stigma to shat off.

Also, propping up performances against FBS only works to a point. UNI had a P5 win this year and had a losing record, and there are plenty of examples of teams playing FBS teams close or even beating them and going on to have a trash season. Sure it can mean something, if the team backs it up throughout the year with a decent season. But if you push a FBS to the limit and end up having a 3-8 or 5-6 season, it takes away the impressiveness of it.

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[TheRevSFA]

But that doesn't mean that they couldn't/wouldn't beat great OOC opponents. Extrapolating weak OOC wins to obvious OOC losses to strong teams is illogical. We can only play who is on the schedule. This whole argument has sucked up way too much life from AGS posters....

Move on.

It's not that they couldn't, it's that they didn't. Whether they didn't have the opportunity or whether they failed in their opportunity, at the end of the day, the OOC results suck ass for the conference.

I don't think anyone is actively discrediting Sam, but there are questions about just how good they are because, with the exception of the UCA game, they haven't played a tough schedule.

I mean, Sam could win a Natty and there will be a lot of crow eaten, but if Sam loses to Chatty, are the Sam fans going to stick around to do the same?

[Daytripper]

It's not that they couldn't, it's that they didn't. Whether they didn't have the opportunity or whether they failed in their opportunity, at the end of the day, the OOC results suck ass for the conference.

I don't think anyone is actively discrediting Sam, but there are questions about just how good they are because, with the exception of the UCA game, they haven't played a tough schedule.

I mean, Sam could win a Natty and there will be a lot of crow eaten, but if Sam loses to Chatty, are the Sam fans going to stick around to do the same?

I get it. But there are probably a dozen threads on this forum that deal with this very same argument. Nobody has changed anybody's mind. AGS lacks creativity in creating new and interesting topics. Much like Hollywood, they repackage old stuff and try to pass it off as original.

Yawn.

[fmrbearkat]

Give it up. You are wasting your time with this. You are not changing anybody's mind.

I don't expect to. I enjoy the banter and every year I usually end up right.

[dewey]

I don't expect to. I enjoy the banter and every year I usually end up right.

How about 2011, 2012 and 2014? Were you right those years?

Dewey

[TheRevSFA]

I don't expect to. I enjoy the banter and every year I usually end up right.

You mean you predicted Sam losing in the Natty twice, and getting blown out by JSU?

****ing Nostradamus here.

[BisonTru]

I get it. But there are probably a dozen threads on this forum that deal with this very same argument. Nobody has changed anybody's mind. AGS lacks creativity in creating new and interesting topics. Much like Hollywood, they repackage old stuff and try to pass it off as original.

Yawn.

You do realize it was a BearKat fan that brought this up, and constantly it's Bearkat fans coming on here trying to convince everyone their schedule is tougher than we thought.

[Thumper 76]

I get it. But there are probably a dozen threads on this forum that deal with this very same argument. Nobody has changed anybody's mind. AGS lacks creativity in creating new and interesting topics. Much like Hollywood, they repackage old stuff and try to pass it off as original.

Yawn.
I eagerly await your fascinating new topics to discuss. Considering there are 8 games and 16 teams involved, what new material are you expecting.

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[BisonTru]

How about 2011, 2012 and 2014? Were you right those years?

Dewey

You can also add '13 and '15. Those two, IMO, were their weakest performances.

[fmrbearkat]

One FBS - UCA beat Arky State
SFA, McNeese, NW State beat D2 schools.
HBU beat Texas Southern
Sam beat D2 OPSU and Texas Southern

Let us also not forget Incarnate Word losing to D2 Texas A&M Kingsville.

You can try to fluff us up all you want, but our 7 OOC wins were against **** opponents

But my point is that schedules are made in advance. We couldn't control ours. Nicholls needs money and nearly beat two FBS teams. Most of our schools need money. Thats why nearly every one plays an FBS team and is almost guarenteed a loss with a couple exceptions every year. They add that weak school to try to guarantee a 1-1 non conference schedule. Most if they didn't get that payday would be in a MAJOR shortfall financially. Hell SHSU is one of the better off schools and it hit us hard not getting the expected pay day from New Mexico.

Until we get rid of this 9 game conference schedule WE WILL HAVE THIS SAME CONVERSATION EVERY YEAR BECAUSE MOST SCHOOLS DOWN HERE NEED MONEY TO KEEP FOOTBALL GOING!!!!

After representing better than any other conference that doesn't have NDSU in it over the last 5 years you would think the "weak" talk would go away but it doesn't.

[JSUSoutherner]

I'll bite. Who were the 5 wins?
From what I could gather (by briefly looking at schedules, I may have missed a game or two) the Southland's regular season OOC wins consisted of:

DII OK-Panhandle State (SHSU)
Texas Southern (SHSU)
FBS Arkansas State (UCA)
DII Tarelton State (McNeese)
DII West Alabama (SFA)
Texas Southern (HBU)
DII Kentucky Wesleyan (NWSU)

Incarnate Word also had a DII 22-31 loss to TAMU-Kingsville.


Also, remember when he said those FBS losses were close games?

I found 11 FBS losses and I'm including Coastal on this next stat (who was the best FCS OOC team anyone in the Southland played)

The average margin of loss to those 11 FBS teams and Coastal was 29 points.

The only two games games decided by less than 7 points were Nicholls' UGA and USA losses. Take out those two games and the average margin jumps to 34.4 points.

There was also an 8 point loss to ULL by McNeese but after that the next closest losses are 16 points to Air Force (ACU) and 21 to Texas State (IWU).

[UNIFanSince1983]

Well the MVFC schools need their money too. They play money games every year. They are not pigeon holed with 9 conference games, but they schedule money games as well as good solid OOC competition (well most teams *cough* YSU *cough*). The "we need paydays" isn't unique to the SLC. That is an FCS thing.

[fmrbearkat]

You mean you predicted Sam losing in the Natty twice, and getting blown out by JSU?

****ing Nostradamus here.
Do you think this is a Christmas to the Natty conversation here or what? You don't think the same thing has been said all season long every single year? Are you conveniently forgetting about the 13 -5 with 2 losses in the Natty and 2 losses in the Semi's.

Every year at the start of the playoffs its Weak this and Weak that!! Then we blow through the playoffs and get stopped by teams that win the Natty or go to the Natty??

[Sam_Kats]

Sam fans going to stick around to do the same?

Depends on which month it is xdrunkyx

[TheRevSFA]

Do you think this is a Christmas to the Natty conversation here or what? You don't think the same thing has been said all season long every single year? Are you conveniently forgetting about the 13 -5 with 2 losses in the Natty and 2 losses in the Semi's.

Every year at the start of the playoffs its Weak this and Weak that!! Then we blow through the playoffs and get stopped by teams that win the Natty or go to the Natty??

Out of your 5 year run, this is the weakest schedule you've played, and most remember your last showing vs JSU, where they hung 60 on you. That's why you're getting it.

You have a lot to prove. This is a test Saturday. Chatty doesn't suck by any means.

[BisonTru]

But my point is that schedules are made in advance. We couldn't control ours. Nicholls needs money and nearly beat two FBS teams. Most of our schools need money. Thats why nearly every one plays an FBS team and is almost guarenteed a loss with a couple exceptions every year. They add that weak school to try to guarantee a 1-1 non conference schedule. Most if they didn't get that payday would be in a MAJOR shortfall financially. Hell SHSU is one of the better off schools and it hit us hard not getting the expected pay day from New Mexico.

Until we get rid of this 9 game conference schedule WE WILL HAVE THIS SAME CONVERSATION EVERY YEAR BECAUSE MOST SCHOOLS DOWN HERE NEED MONEY TO KEEP FOOTBALL GOING!!!!

After representing better than any other conference that doesn't have NDSU in it over the last 5 years you would think the "weak" talk would go away but it doesn't.

With a nine game conference schedule you have 5 home conference games every other year. I get the need for FBS paydays, but my scheduling goals as an AD would be an FBS every year and a home and home with another decent FCS team hopefully with the away trip on years you have 5 conference home games.

DII games do not count towards playoff eligibility. They should be absolutely last choice. I know many in the MVFC and Big Sky are looking for games.

[TheRevSFA]

Depends on which month it is xdrunkyx

I almost spat out my drink when I read this.

[fmrbearkat]

Well the MVFC schools need their money too. They play money games every year. They are not pigeon holed with 9 conference games, but they schedule money games as well as good solid OOC competition (well most teams *cough* YSU *cough*).

The "we need paydays" isn't unique to the SLC. That is an FCS thing.

But we are hamstrung by the 9 game schedule and our schools need the money. My point again is its stupid to say a conference with basically 9 games to prove itself as weak over and over. Just like every conference has a few bottom dwellers that show up when your breaking it down to 9 or 10 games total for an entire conference.

[JSUSoutherner]

Can't most conferences say most of their losses were FBS and some of them were close?
Based on the Average margin of loss by Southland Teams to FBS teams JSU was closer to beat LSU than a majority of the Southland was to beating their G5 opponents.

[FUBeAR]

Again this is not a troll post. If you want to back up your assertion that its a weak overall conference then post some facts.

* Northwestern State was 1-10 with their only win coming over D2 Kentucky Wesleyan, who was 3-8
* Abilene Christian was 2-9 with their only wins coming over the other bottom 2 Teams in the SLC. And an OOC loss to N. Colorado, who lost to Cal Poly...and we all saw how (not) good C-P is
* UIW was 3-8 with their only wins coming against 1, 3, & 4 win SLC Teams. OOC loss to a D2 Team and a 2-9 FBS Team that was blown out in every game except UIW and Ohio
* Lamar was 3-8 with no OOC wins and 1 'good' SLC win over SELA. OOC, blown out 42-0 in FBS game and by FCS CCU 38-14
* Houston Baptist was 4-7. 'So-So' win in SLC vs. SFA. Blown out in 2 OOC FBS G5 games; 50-3 by WKU & 42-10 by 4-8 UTEP. Only OOC win over SWAC bottom-feeder TexSou. barely 24-20
* SFA was 5-6. 'So-So' win in SLC over McNeese. OOC - blown out by 5-7 TexTech 69-12 & narrow 6 point win over a D2 Team
* Nicholls was 5-6. 'So-So' win in SLC over SFA. No OOC wins. Good OOC Loss to a 7-5 Georgia Team & 'So-So' loss to a South Alabama Team that has only 3 FBS wins this year
* McNeese was 6-5. 'So-So' win in SLC over Nicholls. OOC win over 5-6 D2 Team. 'So-So' OOC loss to 5-6 G5 LA-Laf.
* SELA was 7-4. 'So-So' wins in SLC over McNeese, Nicholls, and SFA. OOC blowout by OKSt 61-7. OOC loss to 6-5 S. Utah who lost to Weber...and we all saw how (not) good Weber is

UCA's & SHSU's have already been sufficiently chewed around, so I'll stop fact-posting now...

[Katfan]

As long as we play 9 conference games, there will be limited data from ooc games to get a clear understanding of where teams in SLC stack up until the playoffs. I personally like MASSEY rankings a lot but until the end of the season there's just not enough good data to evaluate the better SLC teams based on the rankings. With 1 game left we were ranked something like 9th and UCA was favored to win by 2.5 based on the computer rankings. After beating UCA and their subsequent win over isu we're ranked 3rd. Doesn't mean the SLC is good it just means it is really hard to evaluate where SHSU and UCA are until the playoffs. Most years,there's just not enough quality game results to tell.

[beerkat]

If you want to make a non-jackass post you should try somewhere else beside a field full of jackasses.

[fmrbearkat]

From what I could gather (by briefly looking at schedules, I may have missed a game or two) the Southland's regular season OOC wins consisted of:

DII OK-Panhandle State (SHSU)
Texas Southern (SHSU)
FBS Arkansas State (UCA)
DII Tarelton State (McNeese)
DII West Alabama (SFA)
Texas Southern (HBU)
DII Kentucky Wesleyan (NWSU)

Incarnate Word also had a DII 22-31 loss to TAMU-Kingsville.


Also, remember when he said those FBS losses were close games?

I found 11 FBS losses and I'm including Coastal on this next stat (who was the best FCS OOC team anyone in the Southland played)

The average margin of loss to those 11 FBS teams and Coastal was 29 points.

The only two games games decided by less than 7 points were Nicholls' UGA and USA losses. Take out those two games and the average margin jumps to 34.4 points.

There was also an 8 point loss to ULL by McNeese but after that the next closest losses are 16 points to Air Force (ACU) and 21 to Texas State (IWU).

Or you could say 3 of those fbs losses were by a total of 11 points when you add an 8 point FBS loss to ULL.

Also add in that 2 of them were HUGE blowouts by current top top 25 teams Houston and Oklahoma State (both of which put those numbers up against most FBS teams they played) which you can and did use to skew your numbers dramatically

[UNIFanSince1983]

But we are hamstrung by the 9 game schedule and our schools need the money. My point again is its stupid to say a conference with basically 9 games to prove itself as weak over and over. Just like every conference has a few bottom dwellers that show up when your breaking it down to 9 or 10 games total for an entire conference.

5 of the 11 teams finished with a record of 4-7 or worse. It jumps to 7 of the 11 had losing records. Sure there are FBS losses, but every single conference has FBS losses. Every conference has some bad teams, but the SLC has a few more than the conferences they would like to consider their peers.

Also how did HBU only play 8 conference games?

[JSUSoutherner]

Or you could say 3 of those fbs losses were by a total of 11 points when you add an 8 point FBS loss to ULL.

Also add in that 2 of them were HUGE blowouts by current top top 25 teams Houston and Oklahoma State (both of which put those numbers up against most FBS teams they played) which you can and did use to skew your numbers dramatically
#ButtNicholls



I could cherry pick stats that would make the OVC look like the B1G but I don't because that would be misleading, just like the notion that the Southland isn't a terrible conference.

[Big Duke]

But we are hamstrung by the 9 game schedule and our schools need the money. My point again is its stupid to say a conference with basically 9 games to prove itself as weak over and over. Just like every conference has a few bottom dwellers that show up when your breaking it down to 9 or 10 games total for an entire conference.
But you were the one that came on our thread and said how weak the CAA was and how we only played "softies". My point was for you to get out of your glass house.
You all could make a deep run this year our even win your first Natty, but don't trash other teams or conferences when yours has performed worse.

[bisonboone11]

I posted this on another the JMU/NH thread but since its basketball season up there nobody looks at that thread and want to hear your thoughts on this. This is in no way a troll post but instead of looking at records in a column lets break down how weak our conference really was.

Nicholls State 0-2 Loss to FBS Georgia 24-26 and FBS South Alabama 41-40
Incarnate Word 0-2 with an FBS Loss
McNeese State 1-1 with a close loss to an FBS Louisiana Lafayette
SFA 1-1 With an FBS loss
UCA 1-1 with an FBS Win and Loss to Samford
Abilene Christian 0-2 with an FBS loss and 1 pt. loss to Northern Colorado
Lamar 0-2 with and FBS loss to Houston and an FCS loss to Coastal Carolina
Northwestern State 1-1 with an FBS Loss
Houston Baptist 1-1 with an FBS loss
Southeastern Louisiana 0-2 FBS loss and close loss to Southern Utah

Non Conference win Loss 5 wins and 15 losses with 10 of those losses to FBS teams several of which were extremely close games. Only one of the FCS losses was blowout.

So unless everybody in our conference decides to not take a money game and schedule 2 non competitive fcs teams a 9 game conference schedule will always look like a weak conference. Not that hard to understand.

To me it looks like the league is pretty equal but when you have 1 powerhouse that blows everybody out and a 2nd strong team in UCA that shut every offense down then it makes the average team appear weak.

I'm pretty sure you could use this same argument for any weak conference. For example, I quickly checked what the Pioneer League has done against non-conference teams this year and they are 16-17 (0.485). Not much different from the 0.500 (excluding FBS losses) that the Southland has accomplished. I haven't read through a lot of the threads on here, but I don't see a lot of people trying to talk about the strength of the Pioneer League. I'm not saying that SHSU is a bad team by any means, but using the information that you did to try to tout the strength of the conference really doesn't show much.

[FUBeAR]

Conferences as ranked by Sagarin.

http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161129/c1179df059cd3dec0dadd1d261487b96.png








*Wouldn't post as table so I took a screenshot instead

So...the Patriot League is stronger than the Southland Conference...and we saw what the 3rd to 6th best (hard to say) Team (New Hampshire) in the 4th strongest Conference (CAA) did to the best Team from the Patriot League (Lehigh) last week - thrashed them 64-21.

The SoCon is the 2nd strongest Conference and Chatt is the 3rd best Team in the SoCon.

Hmmmm????

[beerkat]

So...the Patriot League is stronger than the Southland Conference...and we saw what the 3rd to 6th best (hard to say) Team (New Hampshire) in the 4th strongest Conference (CAA) did to the best Team from the Patriot League (Lehigh) last week - thrashed them 64-21.

The SoCon is the 2nd strongest Conference and Chatt is the 3rd best Team in the SoCon.

Hmmmm????

Sagarin said it so it must be true.

[Terry2889]

This might require a separate thread, but it is food for thought. I haven't looked over the other rosters in the Southland, but I checked Sam Houston's roster and they have 23 FBS transfers/ JUCO's on their team. I understand that this is accepted practice (Taken to the extreme by Keeler always), but is it more common in the Southland for teams to snatch FBS transfers? Im not saying it doesn't happen in the CAA, but it seems much less frequent. Long story short, SHSU better dominate their conference. They virtually have an FBS roster! : )

P.S. Bearkats I dont fault you for drinking the Keeler-aid, it's certainly intriguing!

[fmrbearkat]

Can't most conferences say most of their losses were FBS and some of them were close?

No because we have 11 teams. That ONLY GIVES US 22 Non conference games TOTAL! Every team had at least 1 FBS except us and they backed out on us. So on a normal year knock that down to 11 games to prove if your weak or not.

Until we get rid of the 9 games or have a conference wide ban on d2/fbs games we will always look weak as a whole unless you start taking into acct past playoff records how else are we going to ever appear strong. I had a lengthy discussion with our AD about it at the UCA game. He obviously doesn't like how he has to schedule. There is not a single p5 FBS team close to us that would schedule us. He's called every one of them every year. We would like to get more FCS powers to come in and I think in general SHSU has done a descent job of scheduling good schools. Between NDSU a few years back, EWU, Richmond next year i know they are trying.

Lets take SHSU out of it though.

Bottom dweller teams that don't feel they are a top FCS program don't want to play an FBS money game and a game against a top 5-10 FCS school and go 0-2 out of conference. They aren't scheduling for the playoffs, they are scheduling to try and look better to recruits and anybody who wants to donate money. They want to put money in the bank and try to get into conference with 1-1 record. And when there is 11 teams 3/4 of them are going to actually be bottom dwellers and 2/3 of them are going to appear to be. Add in a couple average teams and a couple good teams and you have the makeup of every conference out there.

[Daytripper]

I eagerly await your fascinating new topics to discuss. Considering there are 8 games and 16 teams involved, what new material are you expecting.

Sent from my RCT6303W87M7 using Tapatalk

Anything except the SHSU strength of schedule please. I never said that I wasn't one of the AGSers that has no originality. I rarely have an original thought. But good god, this topic is tired.

[Thumper 76]

If you want to make a non-jackass post you should try somewhere else beside a field full of jackasses.

If you want everyone to slobber on SHSU's balls go to your safe space of your home board and botch about it. Otherwise, expect some conversation that doesn't fit your orange filled kool aide glass.



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[Thumper 76]

Anything except the SHSU strength of schedule please. I never said that I wasn't one of the AGSers that has no originality. I rarely have an original thought. But good god, this topic is tired.
Well its being continually brought up now by SHSU fans since UCA won and in the SHSU Chatty thread. There are other threads where it isn't a thing. You should try them

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[beerkat]

If you want everyone to slobber on SHSU's balls go to your safe space of your home board and botch about it. Otherwise, expect some conversation that doesn't fit your orange filled kool aide glass.



Sent from my RCT6303W87M7 using Tapatalk

If you want everyone to slobber on the MVFC’s balls go to your safe space. Oh wait, you’re already here.

[Terry2889]

Anything except the SHSU strength of schedule please. I never said that I wasn't one of the AGSers that has no originality. I rarely have an original thought. But good god, this topic is tired.

There are those who believe that original thought is impossible. I once thought that myself....

[Thumper 76]

If you want everyone to slobber on the MVFC’s balls go to your safe space. Oh wait, you’re already here.
I'm not the one throwing a tantrum about how people talk about my conference am I? Try again. Don't know if you noticed (I expect not, they likely put a limit on how much time the nurse reads things for you) but there are a pretty good amount of posters who aren't MVFC fans and enjoy when they lose just as much as you do.

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[Mocs123]

I want to say that I think SHSU is a good team, so is JSU but both come from conferences that's proceved (rightly or wrongly) as weak.

JSU is a legit top 10 team year in and year out.

The Southland is hamstrung by having to play 9 confrence games giving just one OOC game after $ games, but the Southland has scheduled poorly in those 1 OCC game.

The SoCon (who didn't have a stellar OOC this year) was 11-1 vs FCS competition, 4-0 vs D2, and 0-10 vs FBS competition.

By playing only one OOC game and playing weak teams, the Southland has become isolated and thus are perceived as a weak conference.

The Ivy League is similar.

As much as I hate all the NDSU chest bumping in addition to having an amazing 5 straight NC run (which may never be equaled) but look at their record vs FBS teams in that same timespan. Pretty impressive.

That being said I would be happy if all the MVFC teams lose this week. :)

[Daytripper]

Well its being continually brought up now by SHSU fans since UCA won and in the SHSU Chatty thread. There are other threads where it isn't a thing. You should try them

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I AM speaking to them, and you, and everybody else. I know it may not appropriate to call out people for discussion topics, but I don't really give a ****. But we have been talking about this since the beginning of the season.

https://media.giphy.com/media/26tnnpcYVRNJGlHy0/giphy.gif

[fmrbearkat]

But you were the one that came on our thread and said how weak the CAA was and how we only played "softies". My point was for you to get out of your glass house.
You all could make a deep run this year our even win your first Natty, but don't trash other teams or conferences when yours has performed worse.

2011 SHSU beat Stony Brook and SLC in Championship
2012 No games but SLC in Championship
2013 New Hampshire beat SELA CAA made it further
2014 SHSU beats Vilanova and SLC and CAA both exit in Semi’s
2015 No matchup other than JMU getting embarrassed by Colgate followed by Colgate getting embarrassed by SHSU. SLC once again goes to the Semis

3-1 and basically 4-1 head to head

3-1-1 on better playoff showings overall

If you want to talk about the ENTIRE Northeast basketball schools it gets worse.

And in reply to your other comment on your thread...Yes that Nova team may not have been the same. Hasn't mattered on here that we played JSU last year with a QB making his second start so why should it matter that Nova lost their qb?

[beerkat]

I'm not the one throwing a tantrum about how people talk about my conference am I? Try again. Don't know if you noticed (I expect not, they likely put a limit on how much time the nurse reads things for you) but there are a pretty good amount of posters who aren't MVFC fans and enjoy when they lose just as much as you do.

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Not throwing a tantrum = posting more than anybody about it. Got it.

[McNeese72]

With a nine game conference schedule you have 5 home conference games every other year. I get the need for FBS paydays, but my scheduling goals as an AD would be an FBS every year and a home and home with another decent FCS team hopefully with the away trip on years you have 5 conference home games.

DII games do not count towards playoff eligibility. They should be absolutely last choice. I know many in the MVFC and Big Sky are looking for games.

I don't know about the other SLC schools but we make enough money on home games that we want that extra home game every year that scheduling a D-II game brings. It helps pay the bills. Playing a home and home means we would completely lose one payday every other year and then have travel expenses on top of that. With all the budget cuts to higher education in Louisiana, we need to money just to stay afloat.

[fmrbearkat]

I'm pretty sure you could use this same argument for any weak conference. For example, I quickly checked what the Pioneer League has done against non-conference teams this year and they are 16-17 (0.485). Not much different from the 0.500 (excluding FBS losses) that the Southland has accomplished. I haven't read through a lot of the threads on here, but I don't see a lot of people trying to talk about the strength of the Pioneer League. I'm not saying that SHSU is a bad team by any means, but using the information that you did to try to tout the strength of the conference really doesn't show much.

Maybe because they won their first playoff game ever last weekend. Oh and it was to the big fluffy's #2 team.

[FargoBison]

After representing better than any other conference that doesn't have NDSU in it over the last 5 years you would think the "weak" talk would go away but it doesn't.

Well this is what happens when only one team in your conference actually does anything in the playoffs. Having one dominate team and nobody else doing anything really significant is going to make your conference appear weak.

[Thumper 76]

Not throwing a tantrum = posting more than anybody about it. Got it.
Go ahead and look up how many posts I've made today regarding the MVFC and its perceived strength, I'll wait. I have been posting in this thread, about, GASP-the topic of the thread! MY GOD! HOW DARE I! OUTRAGE!

Seriously, if you don't want people to post about this then don't have a thread for the discussion. Last I checked the threads aren't by invite only.

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[bisonboone11]

Maybe because they one their first playoff game ever last weekend. Oh and it was to the big fluffy's #2 team.
True, but using the same metric that was stated in the first post in this thread, the Pioneer and Southland are pretty even.

[UNIFanSince1983]

No because we have 11 teams. That ONLY GIVES US 22 Non conference games TOTAL! Every team had at least 1 FBS except us and they backed out on us. So on a normal year knock that down to 11 games to prove if your weak or not.

Until we get rid of the 9 games or have a conference wide ban on d2/fbs games we will always look weak as a whole unless you start taking into acct past playoff records how else are we going to ever appear strong. I had a lengthy discussion with our AD about it at the UCA game. He obviously doesn't like how he has to schedule. There is not a single p5 FBS team close to us that would schedule us. He's called every one of them every year. We would like to get more FCS powers to come in and I think in general SHSU has done a descent job of scheduling good schools. Between NDSU a few years back, EWU, Richmond next year i know they are trying.

Lets take SHSU out of it though.

Bottom dweller teams that don't feel they are a top FCS program don't want to play an FBS money game and a game against a top 5-10 FCS school and go 0-2 out of conference. They aren't scheduling for the playoffs, they are scheduling to try and look better to recruits and anybody who wants to donate money. They want to put money in the bank and try to get into conference with 1-1 record. And when there is 11 teams 3/4 of them are going to actually be bottom dwellers and 2/3 of them are going to appear to be. Add in a couple average teams and a couple good teams and you have the makeup of every conference out there.

And who other than SHSU has looked strong in the playoffs?

[JSUSoutherner]

These threads never disappoint.

https://media0.giphy.com/media/l0MYP185fZVA5NUS4/200w.gif

[beerkat]

Go ahead and look up how many posts I've made today regarding the MVFC and its perceived strength, I'll wait. I have been posting in this thread, about, GASP-the topic of the thread! MY GOD! HOW DARE I! OUTRAGE!

Seriously, if you don't want people to post about this then don't have a thread for the discussion. Last I checked the threads aren't by invite only.

Sent from my RCT6303W87M7 using Tapatalk

Post about it all you want. Just don’t act like you aren’t having a tantrum about it when you have more posts about SHSU/Southland in the last 6 weeks than I have had on this forum in 11 years. Sorry if I triggered you. I will leave you alone so you can go to your safe space.

[Thumper 76]

I AM speaking to them, and you, and everybody else. I know it may not appropriate to call out people for discussion topics, but I don't really give a ****. But we have been talking about this since the beginning of the season.

https://media.giphy.com/media/26tnnpcYVRNJGlHy0/giphy.gif

xlolx I feel ya now


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[fmrbearkat]

True, but using the same metric that was stated in the first post in this thread, the Pioneer and Southland are pretty even.

Agree completely. Except one conference has a fairly long pedigree of being successful in the playoffs and one has done nothing. Both appear to be weak on paper but one thing is not like the other. Between SFA and McNeese back in the day, SHSU in the early 2000's and the last 6 years; we have had our fair share of really good teams thoughout the years and we are being compared with a conference that's never done anything and conference that outside of JSU the last 3 years has never really done anything. The southland winner usually represents very well in the playoffs with the exception of a few years.

[JSUSoutherner]

Agree completely. Except one conference has a fairly long pedigree of being successful in the playoffs and one has done nothing. Both appear to be weak on paper but one thing is not like the other. Between SFA and McNeese back in the day, SHSU in the early 2000's and the last 6 years; we have had our fair share of really good teams thoughout the years and we are being compared with a conference that's never done anything and conference that outside of JSU the last 3 years has never really done anything. The southland winner usually represents very well in the playoffs with the exception of a few years.
One good team doesn't not make a conference good.

[fmrbearkat]

Well this is what happens when only one team in your conference actually does anything in the playoffs. Having one dominate team and nobody else doing anything really significant is going to make your conference appear weak.

Problem with playoff regionalization!!! Leaving the valley out of this conversation. We all know yall are legit and don't need to question it.

Again....the southland rep has usually gone far. The 2nd or 3rd southland team has usually gotten beat out by the southland rep.

[fmrbearkat]

One good team doesn't not make a conference good.

Its been 1 good team for the past 6 years but going back to the early 90's McNeese, SFA, and SHSU. Then to add Troy in there who was always in it before they moved up.

[JSUSoutherner]

Its been 1 good team for the past 6 years but going back to the early 90's McNeese, SFA, and SHSU. Then to add Troy in there who was always in it before they moved up.
Still when 9 of the 11 teams in your conference are total ass your conference isn't good.

[beerkat]

One good team doesn't not make a conference good.

That “one good team” is punished for it though. We are not judged by our performance and how good we are, we are judged by how Abilene Christian did versus Northern Colorado and Nicholls did versus South Alabama, because a computer said that’s bad, and we are going to let the computer do the thinking for us since we can’t critically analyze a team for ourselves.

[JSUSoutherner]

That “one good team” is punished for it though. We are not judged by our performance and how good we are, we are judged by how Abilene Christian did versus Northern Colorado and Nicholls did versus South Alabama, because a computer said that’s bad, and we are going to let the computer do the thinking for us since we can’t critically analyze a team for ourselves.
Nobody is "punishing" you. We're just waiting for you to back up your rhetoric against someone that's not a DII or SWAC school. If you guys throttle Chatty I guarentee you people will start giving the Bearkats all the respect the deserve.

[fmrbearkat]

Still when 9 of the 11 teams in your conference are total ass your conference isn't good.

So by that standard we would need to have 5 or 6 teams go 0-9 in conference and of the remaining 6 teams 3 to 4 would have 8-3/7-4 records and 2 teams have 9-2 or better.

Instead you have two stud teams and those same 8-3 7-4 ( like Nicholls McNeese and SELA) team looks like **** because you add in a 1-1 or 0-2 non conference record when you play an fbs and an average to descent fbs team.

[JSUSoutherner]

So by that standard we would need to have 5 or 6 teams go 0-9 in conference and of the remaining 6 teams 3 to 4 would have 8-3/7-4 records and 2 teams have 9-2 or better.

Instead you have two stud teams and those same 8-3 7-4 ( like Nicholls McNeese and SELA) team looks like **** because you add in a 1-1 or 0-2 non conference record when you play an fbs and an average to descent fbs team.
Or they could just win their FCS and D-II OOC games like the SoCon or the MVFC.

Beating each other in conference play is going to happen. It happens in the MVFC but the MVFC wipes the floor with most of their OOC games so they are percieved as a better conference despite not having everyone finish with 10 wins every season.

[fmrbearkat]

I want to say that I think SHSU is a good team, so is JSU but both come from conferences that's proceved (rightly or wrongly) as weak.

JSU is a legit top 10 team year in and year out.

The Southland is hamstrung by having to play 9 confrence games giving just one OOC game after $ games, but the Southland has scheduled poorly in those 1 OCC game.



The SoCon (who didn't have a stellar OOC this year) was 11-1 vs FCS competition, 4-0 vs D2, and 0-10 vs FBS competition.

By playing only one OOC game and playing weak teams, the Southland has become isolated and thus are perceived as a weak conference.

The Ivy League is similar.

As much as I hate all the NDSU chest bumping in addition to having an amazing 5 straight NC run (which may never be equaled) but look at their record vs FBS teams in that same timespan. Pretty impressive.

That being said I would be happy if all the MVFC teams lose this week. :)

They have fielded 3 good teams in how many years and they are legit year in and year out?? Best joke of this whole thread.

[Thumper 76]

They have fielded 3 good teams in how many years and they are legit year in and year out?? Best joke of this whole thread.

I was thinking that too when I read that....


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[McNeese72]

The Southland is hamstrung by having to play 9 confrence games giving just one OOC game after $ games, but the Southland has scheduled poorly in those 1 OCC game.



By playing only one OOC game and playing weak teams, the Southland has become isolated and thus are perceived as a weak conference.



I don't know about the Texas SLC schools, but due to the budget cuts to higher education in Louisiana, McNeese needs the one FBS payday and the one extra home game a year that a Div II game gives us to help us keep afloat financially.

We would love to have the luxury of a home and home with a FCS school but the only ones close to us are the SWAC teams. Playing a decent FCS school home and home, we would completely have to miss one home payday every other year and on that we would have travel expenses (probably a charter flight plus a hotel bill) to pay another decent FCS school.

This is one reason the SLC schools were for a 12 game season every year. This would give us a little more wiggle room in our scheduling.

[UNIFanSince1983]

I don't know about the Texas SLC schools, but due to the budget cuts to higher education in Louisiana, McNeese needs the one FBS payday and the one extra home game a year that a Div II game gives us to help us keep afloat financially.

We would love to have the luxury of a home and home with a FCS school but the only ones close to us are the SWAC teams. Playing a decent FCS school home and home, we would completely have to miss one home payday every other year and on that we would have travel expenses (probably a charter flight plus a hotel bill) to pay another decent FCS school.

This is one reason the SLC schools were for a 12 game season every year. This would give us a little more wiggle room in our scheduling.

If all the schools in the SLC are for the 12 game season due to "wiggle room" why aren't they fighting harder against the conference mandate of 9 conference games? I mean right now it isn't like you play a round robin with 11 teams in the conference anyway.

Also I asked earlier, but no one said why was HBU able to play only 8 conference games this year? Some sort of probation or something?

[beerkat]

If all the schools in the SLC are for the 12 game season due to "wiggle room" why aren't they fighting harder against the conference mandate of 9 conference games? I mean right now it isn't like you play a round robin with 11 teams in the conference anyway.

Also I asked earlier, but no one said why was HBU able to play only 8 conference games this year? Some sort of probation or something? 11 teams can’t play 9 games each so 1 team only plays 8. Or if HBU played 9 games someone would have to play 10.

[JSUSoutherner]

They have fielded 3 good teams in how many years and they are legit year in and year out?? Best joke of this whole thread.
We sucked. Then we kicked Cap'n Jack to the curb and have gone 33-5 under Grass with three of those losses to Michigan State, LSU, and Auburn in OT.

Since Grass stepped up the only team in the FCS with a better win percentage than us is NDSU.

Grass has as many wins as Keeler and 4 fewer losses.

And unlike the Keeler led Bearkats, we've been to Frisco.

[McNeese72]

If all the schools in the SLC are for the 12 game season due to "wiggle room" why aren't they fighting harder against the conference mandate of 9 conference games? I mean right now it isn't like you play a round robin with 11 teams in the conference anyway.

Also I asked earlier, but no one said why was HBU able to play only 8 conference games this year? Some sort of probation or something?

Believe me when I say all the SLC fans and probably all the SLC coaches hate the 9 game mandate. But we only have so much power.

[fmrbearkat]

We sucked. Then we kicked Cap'n Jack to the curb and have gone 33-5 under Grass with three of those losses to Michigan State, LSU, and Auburn in OT.

Since Grass stepped up the only team in the FCS with a better win percentage than us is NDSU.

Grass has as many wins as Keeler and 4 fewer losses.

The Crowe era and the Grass era are two COMPLETELY different things.Having a quarterback like Eli is probably more of a reason than grass. How many games has Eli won you just because he's a superior athlete.

[JSUSoutherner]

Having a quarterback like Eli is probably more of a reason than grass. How many games has Eli won you just because he's a superior athlete.
Please. We could have beat you senseless last year with our backup QB.

Plus, I think it's funny how you point to us only being good since 2013 considering you've only been good since 2011. It's not like Sam Houston is some team that hasn't had a losing season in 10 years.

Also, who do you think made Eli the QB he is today? Eli played safety when Grass got here.

[UNHWildcat18]

I posted this on another the JMU/NH thread but since its basketball season up there nobody looks at that thread and want to hear your thoughts on this. This is in no way a troll post but instead of looking at records in a column lets break down how weak our conference really was.

Nicholls State 0-2 Loss to FBS Georgia 24-26 and FBS South Alabama 41-40
Incarnate Word 0-2 with an FBS Loss
McNeese State 1-1 with a close loss to an FBS Louisiana Lafayette
SFA 1-1 With an FBS loss
UCA 1-1 with an FBS Win and Loss to Samford
Abilene Christian 0-2 with an FBS loss and 1 pt. loss to Northern Colorado
Lamar 0-2 with and FBS loss to Houston and an FCS loss to Coastal Carolina
Northwestern State 1-1 with an FBS Loss
Houston Baptist 1-1 with an FBS loss
Southeastern Louisiana 0-2 FBS loss and close loss to Southern Utah

Non Conference win Loss 5 wins and 15 losses with 10 of those losses to FBS teams several of which were extremely close games. Only one of the FCS losses was blowout.

So unless everybody in our conference decides to not take a money game and schedule 2 non competitive fcs teams a 9 game conference schedule will always look like a weak conference. Not that hard to understand.

To me it looks like the league is pretty equal but when you have 1 powerhouse that blows everybody out and a 2nd strong team in UCA that shut every offense down then it makes the average team appear weak.

not basketball season? It's called no one wants to talk in it when you start talking about your own conference and trying to put down ours..... since 2000 the CAA has 4 national titles and 4 runners up. SLC since 2000 3 runners up. End of story.

[IBleedYellow]

I was promised non-jackass.

I was lied to.

[JSUSoutherner]

I was promised non-jackass.

I was lied to.
Are you mad about it though?

[UNIFanSince1983]

11 teams can’t play 9 games each so 1 team only plays 8. Or if HBU played 9 games someone would have to play 10.

Interesting. I wonder if 8 games doesn't work with 11 teams then either. So maybe the whole thing goes back to the SLC have 11 teams. That is just an awkward number for sure.

[McNeese72]

Interesting. I wonder if 8 games doesn't work with 11 teams then either. So maybe the whole thing goes back to the SLC have 11 teams. That is just an awkward number for sure.

Most of the long time SLC fans weren't happy with the last expansion of the conference and some of the teams that were added.

[IBleedYellow]

Are you mad about it though?

I laughed quite a bit.

SHSU's self-worth should not be based upon their conference.

However, their conference holds them back.

Catch-22, baby!

[WrenFGun]

I think SHSU's resume sucks, but lets not look at this and say "it's only them" and "only the SLC" that does this. Even teams who play 8 conference games generally look for the easiest wins possible, because they don't want to be UNI at the end of the season.

Look at the CAA -- typically you see an FBS game, and then games between the NEC, IVY, MEAC and Patriot. Villanova probably challenged themselves the most, with their standard game against Penn and a game against a good PL team in Lehigh, but you can play that same type of schedule against far worse competition [0-fer Dartmouth, mediocre Holy Cross in the case of UNH]. I think a lot of us act like that extra game tells us anything, when it really doesn't. With the exception of a few teams [Montana, EWU, NDSU, UNI, etc.] most teams aren't really trying to challenge themselves in non-conference.

A lot of teams in the CAA, MVFC and Big Sky get the benefit of past successes from more than one team in the conference [MVFC can point to ISU-R, NDSU, CAA can point to numerous deep runs, including UNH's in 2013 and 14, Towson's, Villanova's, Richmond's, etc., Big Sky can cling to Montana along with EWU but I think they're getting closer and closer to SLC territory]. That is, IMO, what's driving that bus. No one within the SLC besides SHSU has done anything. Maybe UCA can change that.

[McNeese72]

11 teams can’t play 9 games each so 1 team only plays 8. Or if HBU played 9 games someone would have to play 10.

I have heard that UIW will be the team only playing 8 conference games the next two seasons.

[caribbeanhen]

According to the Massey rankings the Southland is the 7th best FCS conference.

Individual team rankings
SHSU=5
UCA=10
SELA=42
McNeese=46
Nicholls=56
SFA=66
Lamar=84
Houston Baptist=86
Abilene Christian=97
Incarnate Word=98
NWLA=11

Link.
http://www.masseyratings.com/cf/compare1aa.htm

This is out of 125 teams and 13 conferences.

The Southland is a WEAK conference. Does this mean that SHSU is not good? Not at all. SHSU could very well win the National Championship but it doesn't prove that the Southland is a good conference.

When the Southland has a 9 game conference schedule takes FBS games and then plays cupcakes it is hard to gauge how good the conference really is.

Dewey

The thread should of ended right here..... it's not that hard! Dewey get's it!

[milleniumkat]

Conferences as ranked by Sagarin.

http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161129/c1179df059cd3dec0dadd1d261487b96.png








*Wouldn't post as table so I took a screenshot instead

Sagarin is a known labrador rapist.


www.MKsavedAGS.com

[JSUSoutherner]

Sagarin is a known labrador rapist.


www.MKsavedAGS.com

Oh, well in that case here is the Massey Composite Rankings.

http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161130/a2bf6aa39db6ea170a619a484cdba194.png

[milleniumkat]

Oh, well in that case here is the Massey Composite Rankings.

http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161130/a2bf6aa39db6ea170a619a484cdba194.png

Massey has three nipples.


www.MKsavedAGS.com

[milleniumkat]

Sorry FMRBKT for messing up your thread. You know how i get.


www.MKsavedAGS.com

[cx500d]

You hit the nail on the head. Its hard to tell where you all stack up, so don't get offended and uptight when you aren't evaluated where you think you should be.


As long as we play 9 conference games, there will be limited data from ooc games to get a clear understanding of where teams in SLC stack up until the playoffs. I personally like MASSEY rankings a lot but until the end of the season there's just not enough good data to evaluate the better SLC teams based on the rankings. With 1 game left we were ranked something like 9th and UCA was favored to win by 2.5 based on the computer rankings. After beating UCA and their subsequent win over isu we're ranked 3rd. Doesn't mean the SLC is good it just means it is really hard to evaluate where SHSU and UCA are until the playoffs. Most years,there's just not enough quality game results to tell.

[fmrbearkat]

not basketball season? It's called no one wants to talk in it when you start talking about your own conference and trying to put down ours..... since 2000 the CAA has 4 national titles and 4 runners up. SLC since 2000 3 runners up. End of story.

They don't seem to show up to playoff games either....and I said last couple years notice. Not last 16 years.

[Katfan]

You hit the nail on the head. Its hard to tell where you all stack up, so don't get offended and uptight when you aren't evaluated where you think you should be.
I'm not offended at all. I recognize the difference between a weak conference and a good team and the limitations it puts on computer rankings.

[Red & Black]

I'll add to your point by noting that 2-9 ACU scored more points against Northern Colorado than FCS offensive power Eastern Washington from the Big Sky.

Dude...we ran out our last 3 possessions on offense as to not embarrass them IIRC.

[Terry2889]

Oh, well in that case here is the Massey Composite Rankings.

http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161130/a2bf6aa39db6ea170a619a484cdba194.png

The only time my computer gets down to 8% is when ___(Insert inappropriate joke)______.

[beerkat]

Interesting. I wonder if 8 games doesn't work with 11 teams then either. So maybe the whole thing goes back to the SLC have 11 teams. That is just an awkward number for sure.

8 games would work for 11 teams and it would all be even

[fmrbearkat]

Sorry FMRBKT for messing up your thread. You know how i get.


www.MKsavedAGS.com (http://www.MKsavedAGS.com)


I love it....eff em...let them talk ��. I'm just anticipating the floundering and new excuses when we smack Chatty by 3-4 touchdowns xnodxxnodxxasswhipxxasswhipx

[fmrbearkat]

Dude...we ran out our last 3 possessions on offense as to not embarrass them IIRC.

Like we did EVERY game as evident by Briscoe's whopping 40 pass attempts in the 4th qtr!

[fmrbearkat]

I'm not offended at all. I recognize the difference between a weak conference and a good team and the limitations it puts on computer rankings.

Again who's to judge a weak conference.

Lets take 10 teams to get rounds nd numbers forced to play a 9 game schedule.

somebody has to win and somebody has to lose a game so that's 55-55 conference record. Throw in 11 losses to fcs and 11 wins vs anybody else. 66-66 record.

averaged out to 5 6-5 teams and 5 5-6 teams one team runs the table and 1 team loses. 1 game.

11-0
9-2

two teams suck and go 0-9 1-8 in conference

1-10
2-9

the rest beat each other up and take a split down the middle

6-5
5-6
5-6
4-7
4-7

unless we get rid of FBS games or have half the teams be 2-9 or 3-8 we will ALWAYS be talked about being weak as a conference. This started out as a conference topic and if you notice I left SHSU out of it originally.

[fmrbearkat]

http://www.anygivensaturday.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=23980&stc=1
I did that without looking at the final standings but hey guess what...it's pretty close. So until we get an 8 game schedule or quit scheduling FBS then nothing is ever going to change in ANY year.

So even if we win the natty this year and bring nearly everybody back you jack asses are going to say the same thing next year!!

Besides Richmond who'd they beat?

[Scooter]

OK... SHSU kills everyone in this conference and scores what, 40 ppg every year yet have scored 22 points in the last 3 games vs NDSU. Not saying SHSU is sub par this year but you can certainly see where those who know FCS football would view the conference as being relatively weak. 30+ points less than what you average during the season not once but three times in a row is pretty damning when talking about conference strength perceptions.

[fmrbearkat]

OK... SHSU kills everyone in this conference and scores what, 40 ppg every year yet have scored 22 points in the last 3 games vs NDSU. Not saying SHSU is sub par this year but you can certainly see where those who know FCS football would view the conference as being relatively weak. 30+ points less than what you average during the season not once but three times in a row is pretty damning when talking about conference strength perceptions.

And your point..that's what NDSU does to nearly EVERY team including Towson and JSU. Conference games are going to be a lot easier for an under dog to win than a playoff game due to familiarity. The same team beat everybody else minus JSU with our backup QB (which matters for Nova apparently but not SHSU) NDSU isn't part of the conversation and this is not an SHSU conversation. It's a conference perception discussion.

[Professor Chaos]

A 9 game conference schedule is a horrible idea for FCS leagues. End of story. Until the SLC fixes that they're going to continue to be **** on with seedings.

[Scooter]

And your point..that's what NDSU does to nearly EVERY team including Towson and JSU. Conference games are going to be a lot easier for an under dog to win than a playoff game due to familiarity. The same team beat everybody else minus JSU with our backup QB (which matters for Nova apparently but not SHSU) NDSU isn't part of the conversation and this is not an SHSU conversation. It's a conference perception discussion.The rest of the country is spot on in respect to the Southland overall strength.

[Nickels]

Bearkat fans are the best thing to ever happen to AGS. This thread began when I started lunch. By 3:30 it was seven pages long. These guys could save Champion Subdivision if they wanted to.

[SFA 93]

Hopefully we can contribute more in football NEXT season, always NEXT season. Axe'Em

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CyhckPiUAAAIj-Y.jpg
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Cyc2RjrVEAA1_Nj.jpg

[milleniumkat]

OK... SHSU kills everyone in this conference and scores what, 40 ppg every year yet have scored 22 points in the last 3 games vs NDSU. Not saying SHSU is sub par this year but you can certainly see where those who know FCS football would view the conference as being relatively weak. 30+ points less than what you average during the season not once but three times in a row is pretty damning when talking about conference strength perceptions.

And you can certainly see how we would laugh at those people when they try to use current SOS yet refuse to stop mentioning PAST scores from games 3-4 years ago?


www.MKsavedAGS.com

[Red & Black]

Like we did EVERY game as evident by Briscoe's whopping 40 pass attempts in the 4th qtr!

Geez, go back and re-read what I was responding to. Hint - it wasn't about SHSU.

[UNHWildcat18]

Geez, go back and re-read what I was responding to. Hint - it wasn't about SHSU.

Hey now, it's just hard for him to read......Its probably pretty hard for anyone to read when scarfing down a McTriple

[Bearkat90]

We sucked. Then we kicked Cap'n Jack to the curb and have gone 33-5 under Grass with three of those losses to Michigan State, LSU, and Auburn in OT.

Since Grass stepped up the only team in the FCS with a better win percentage than us is NDSU.

Grass has as many wins as Keeler and 4 fewer losses.

And unlike the Keeler led Bearkats, we've been to Frisco.


Whats his head to head record against Keeler? With all games played at JState
Oh it's 1-1

[kalm]

Maybe because they won their first playoff game ever last weekend. Oh and it was to the big fluffy's #2 team.

Actually, Poly was tied in the conference for #4 at 5-3 with SUU...a team that beat the Southland #3. Poly also had a win against a seed. Upsets happen, didn't SHSU lose to a DII within the last couple years? When was the last time the SLC #4 beat a team that would go on to be seeded?

Trolling posts aside, SHSU is widely respected and it would surprise very few if they win it all this year.

The initial point of this thread seemed to be to elevate the SLC's reputation. SHSU's recent success in the playoffs has much to do with the respect they've garnered, but that also has very little to do the strength of the conference. It has also been used by Bearkat posters regarding seeding arguments. Again, it has very little to do with that argument either. You guys should shy away from it unless you are comparing overall success of your program vs. other programs (rather than conference strength and seeding arguments).

The SLC is about where it's historically been. The 5th-7th best conference with a peak into the top 3 or 4 while the SoCon was down and SELA, McNeese, and UCA were playing well.

This year it's down due to a very weak OOC. The 9 game thing is an understandable factor but it really doesn't change the reality of who you've played and you haven't.

[Thumper 76]

Hey now, it's just hard for him to read......Its probably pretty hard for anyone to read when scarfing down a McTriple
http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161201/7344a0a75b6d86e3679d08c7b82ba707.jpg

Sent from my RCT6303W87M7 using Tapatalk

[Bearkat90]

Well Kalm at least you admit to having some respect for a our program and its playoff success
and you make some valid points

[fmrbearkat]

Hey now, it's just hard for him to read......Its probably pretty hard for anyone to read when scarfing down a McTriple

I'm a vegetarian....

[fmrbearkat]

Geez, go back and re-read what I was responding to. Hint - it wasn't about SHSU.

You were responding to a comment that stated your offense might not quite be as good as advertised. My comment was stating ours is as good as advertised. We didn't have to rely on the refs to beat a .500 portland state. If that interception was called right yall lose that game and would have been seeded at most a 7. We didn't struggle against anybody. We got out to big leads and then our backups gave up some points. You played up to your good opponents and down to your bad opponents. How's that going to work out for you when you have 3-4 good opponents in a row. My response was relative to this whole thread in actuality.

Yes I'm also aware that our scenario could be a problem if we do get behind by a couple and start to press. I'm not saying I don't see it happening in the right scenario. Like at Fargo, or vs EWU or JSU in Frisco, or even at home vs SDSU. It very well could in those scenarios and our guys may press to hard and make more mistakes. I haven't seen any signs that would happen so obviously i'm fired up. The chemistry on this team as well as the almost professional way they go about things is special. Its unlike any of the teams from the last 5 years. I couldn't imagine a more fun game than getting to watch a match up between any of the 4 teams above. Win or lose it would be great football to watch.

[UNIFanSince1983]

All these SHSU fans must not have been here when everyone was giving Montana crap for playing in the Big Fluffy.

[kalm]

All these SHSU fans must not have been here when everyone was giving Montana crap for playing in the Big Fluffy.

And during that era you still had EWU picking off a couple of seeds and MSU and Weber getting playoff wins.

SLC needs some more of what SELA had going...

[POD Knows]

Well Kalm at least you admit to having some respect for a our program and its playoff success
and you make some valid points

SHSU is the second best team the Bison have played in Frisco

[fmrbearkat]

SHSU is the second best team the Bison have played in Frisco

No arguments here. ISU was a good team no question.

[fmrbearkat]

And during that era you still had EWU picking off a couple of seeds and MSU and Weber getting playoff wins.

SLC needs some more of what SELA had going...

But that's kind of my point. If we had a 7-4 team with 2 conference losses to SHSU and UCA. That's 3 teams beating every other team. If a couple of those others teams play an FBS and the beat each other you have 3-4 teams with a 5-6 4-7 record and a couple teams in the dregs at 1-10 or 9-2.

Overall the the conference will appear weak no matter what if 9/10 add an FBS loss. There not enough wins to go around if 2/3 teams run the table in conference.