UND Athletics has a 1.4M shortfall. President is looking at options.

[Twentysix]

And here is the actual data... https://und.edu/president/_files/docs/ncaa-report-2015.pdf

You're welcome.

Holy **** UND football loses 2.7 million dollars a year after revenue? Mens Basketball loses 800k. Wow, without hockey their AD would be ****ing bankrupt. I think I just solved their problem... cut football and they will fix their budget issue with 1.3 million to put into their Men's Basketball program leftover.

NDSU's football program made $594k last year (without an FBS money game). Though, that doesn't factor in merchandise that was probably only sold because of the football team. NDSU Men's basketball lost 395k last year.

[nodak651]

Holy **** UND football loses 2.7 million dollars a year after revenue? Mens Basketball loses 800k. Wow, without hockey their AD would be ****ing bankrupt.

That's why it bugs me when people call hockey a money pit. Although, women's hockey defiantly is.

[Twentysix]

That's why it bugs me when people call hockey a money pit. Although, women's hockey defiantly is.

According to the UND document, UND is not getting any money from the Big Sky for Men's Basketball. How many years remain until UND gets part of the tournament money (I realize it is relatively small cause the Big Sky hasn't won any games lately)?

Also $410k in football ticket sales seems absolutely awful for an entire season. (not ragging, just analyzing what this document says)

NDSU's football ticket sales lists a ridiculously round $2.5 million for last year.

[nodak651]

It is baffling how hockey pays over $2,000,000 in facilities rental and debt service when the arena was paid for by Ralph Engelstad.

[Twentysix]

It is baffling how hockey pays over $2,000,000 in facilities rental and debt service when the arena was paid for by Ralph Engelstad.

So for some reason Hockey is lumped in with other sports in the document, but I would assume they represent 99.9% of revenue generated in the "other sports category".

Ticket sales
UND football $410k
UND MBasketball $107k
UND WBasketball $122k
UND hockey (and various other sports) $3.7 million

[nodak651]

According to the UND document, UND is not getting any money from the Big Sky for Men's Basketball. How many years remain until UND gets part of the tournament money (I realize it is relatively small cause the Big Sky hasn't won any games lately)?

Also $410k in football ticket sales seems absolutely awful for an entire season. (not ragging, just analyzing what this document says)

NDSU's football ticket sales lists a ridiculously round $2.5 million for last year.

It's too late at night for me to go read the report again, but I doubt UND will ever get any money from the Big Sky considering how much of a dumpster fire the conference tournament is and how many teams there are.

At least football has a lot of potential.

Both UND hockey and NDSU football seem to be at their ceiling for ticket sales, unfortunately.

[Twentysix]

Man looking at these documents is super depressing.

Like every single sport at NDSU (besides football) loses at least $400,000; except golf , which has a small budget to begin with. Though before student fees and merch sales, the whole AD only loses 2 million bucks. I guess that isn't that bad... with student fees alone it looks like it runs a profit. Though I feel weird as a student arguing a solvent AD when including (albeit reasonable) student fees.

[nodak651]

Man looking at these documents is super depressing.

Like every single sport at NDSU (besides football) loses at least $400,000; except golf , which has a small budget to begin with. Though before student fees and merch sales, the whole AD only loses 2 million bucks. I guess that isn't that bad... with student fees alone it looks like it runs a profit. Though I feel weird as a student arguing a solvent AD when including (albeit reasonable) student fees.


Keep in mind this data is for 2015 and counts all 21 sports. Hopefully we can get that cut down to 16 or 17 and that will help a lot.

[Twentysix]

Both UND hockey and NDSU football seem to be at their ceiling for ticket sales, unfortunately.

I mean, both sports can raise ticket prices, but yeah, more or less they are capped out.

I just bought tickets to a San Diego State game (vs UNH this saturday) and the tickets are 25% the price of NDSU tickets. My endzone-sideline ticket in row KK (crappy seat imo) to NDSU vs CSU was $50 face value. My tickets in row 16 on the 30 yardline in the section closest to the field at qualcomm were $15 face value. And to top it all off, SDSU is expecting to have their best team in their history this year.

[Thumper 76]

So for some reason Hockey is lumped in with other sports in the document, but I would assume they represent 99.9% of revenue generated in the "other sports category".

Ticket sales
UND football $410k
UND MBasketball $107k
UND WBasketball $122k
UND hockey (and various other sports) $3.7 million

According to NCAA Data that means they charge and average of $10 a ticket for football

[Twentysix]

According to NCAA Data that means they charge and average of $10 a ticket for football

Could be, there is no explanation provided as to what ticket sales includes. I would assume it is just single game tickets and season tickets, unless the AD charges the university for student tickets (but that seems unlikely).

[Laker]

UND committee looks at Big Sky & Summit requirements. Prof asks about going back to D2. With 16 members, someone would have to drop out of the NSIC if they did that.

http://www.grandforksherald.com/news/education/4104257-und-committee-looks-requirements-big-sky-summit-league

[UNDColorado]

That will not happen. That is a lib tard prof out of their depth.

The odds are sports will be cut (which I fully support as we have too many) or we eventually move conference. We are already title 9 compliant on the three levels (prongs) from what i have recently learned so I would bet on sports being cut.

ON the bubble: M&W swimming and diving, softball, soccer, womens hockey.

[IBleedYellow]

That will not happen.

We also were told that Division 1 wouldn't ever happen. Never say never. I can't believe you are underestimating the incompetence of your AD right about now.

I don't think UND goes D2, but it is an option, albeit a terrible option.

[UNDColorado]

We also were told that Division 1 wouldn't ever happen. Never say never. I can't believe you are underestimating the incompetence of your AD right about now.

I don't think UND goes D2, but it is an option, albeit a terrible option.

I hit enter too soon, early here and not at optimal coffee consumption yet. I finished my thought above.

Our AD does have his moments, but he is not this dumb. I was a fan of bringing in a non PHD president who has a strong business background and president Kennedy has stated that he wants to remain D1 as an institution. I also think that this committee approach is a buffer for Kennedy to slash sports and spread the blame around. Everyone knows we need to trim down but people will be mad regardless.

Here is a bold statement: If UND ever would move back to D2 you have a new Bison fan.

[IBleedYellow]

I hit enter too soon, early here and not at optimal coffee consumption yet. I finished my thought above.

Our AD does have his moments, but he is not this dumb. I was a fan of bringing in a non PHD president who has a strong business background and president Kennedy has stated that he wants to remain D1 as an institution. I also think that this committee approach is a buffer for Kennedy to slash sports and spread the blame around. Everyone knows we need to trim down but people will be mad regardless.

Here is a bold statement: If UND ever would move back to D2 you have a new Bison fan.

I believe that Kennedy will do well for UND, and his first line of business should be firing Brian Faison.

I don't think that AD ever made a good decision other than "Let's go to D1", and he even then screwed that up.


We're talking about an AD who went on the radio and publicly stated that "We're doing FCOA, it's happening, we just have no idea how we'll fund it yet." I still think the only reason UND said they'd do it was because NDSU stated we would.

He's just never given me the warm and fuzzies.

[UNDColorado]

I believe that Kennedy will do well for UND, and his first line of business should be firing Brian Faison.

I don't think that AD ever made a good decision other than "Let's go to D1", and he even then screwed that up.


We're talking about an AD who went on the radio and publicly stated that "We're doing FCOA, it's happening, we just have no idea how we'll fund it yet." I still think the only reason UND said they'd do it was because NDSU stated we would.

He's just never given me the warm and fuzzies.

I really don't like him either. I have a feeling his time is coming to an end at UND.

At this point I am happy that president kelley is gone. That guy was a piece of work...he cam from Berkely which says a lot in itself.

[Laker]

Here is a bold statement: If UND ever would move back to D2 you have a new Bison fan.

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_PLjNWOu-Zn0/ScpgE7diU0I/AAAAAAAAAd4/MR8l5f9sDtY/s400/shocked+to+find+gaming.jpg

[IndyTreeFan]

I believe that Kennedy will do well for UND, and his first line of business should be firing Brian Faison.

I don't think that AD ever made a good decision other than "Let's go to D1", and he even then screwed that up.


We're talking about an AD who went on the radio and publicly stated that "We're doing FCOA, it's happening, we just have no idea how we'll fund it yet." I still think the only reason UND said they'd do it was because NDSU stated we would.

He's just never given me the warm and fuzzies.

Faison was the AD at Indiana State when I was a student there. His tenure was best summed up by a statement he actually made on the radio regarding our men's basketball program - "Our goal is to be competitive every 3 or 4 years." Seriously? Just be competitive every 3 or 4 years? And that was the school's flagship sport. And he couldn't even achieve that. Sad way to run an athletic department...

[IBleedYellow]

Faison was the AD at Indiana State when I was a student there. His tenure was best summed up by a statement he actually made on the radio regarding our men's basketball program - "Our goal is to be competitive every 3 or 4 years." Seriously? Just be competitive every 3 or 4 years? And that was the school's flagship sport. And he couldn't even achieve that. Sad way to run an athletic department...

That explains everything I need to know about Faison.

[POD Knows]

That explains everything I need to know about Faison.

Yea, but he got Bubba and turned UND football into a pissed off, roided up powerhouse in the BSC or something.

[F'N Hawks]

Yea, but he got Bubba and turned UND football into a pissed off, roided up powerhouse in the BSC or something.

Seemed forced. xdeadhorsex

[BisonFan02]

Yea, but he got Bubba and turned UND football into a pissed off, roided up powerhouse in the BSC or something.

Yup.....that will be competitive every 3-4 years maybe. :D

- - - Updated - - -


Seemed forced. xdeadhorsex

Kinda like calling yourselves the Fighting Hawks with a straight face? xlolx

[POD Knows]

Seemed forced. xdeadhorsex

Yea, this schtick is getting kind of old. I am running out of material.

[IBleedYellow]

http://www.inforum.com/content/und-sees-no-reason-move-division-i

xcoffeex

[centennial]

http://www.inforum.com/content/und-sees-no-reason-move-division-i

xcoffeex
Imagine the collective butt hurt if they go back to D2. And then there are those UND fans that are claiming that the WAC is coming back and UND is going FBS. For now, if they've promised some kids FCOA they should watch for lawsuits.

[F'N Hawks]

Imagine the collective butt hurt if they go back to D2. And then there are those UND fans that are claiming that the WAC is coming back and UND is going FBS. For now, if they've promised some kids FCOA they should watch for lawsuits.

..and the imagine everything you just said not happening. Cool.

[centennial]

..and the imagine everything you just said not happening. Cool.

Well the WAC isn't coming back. xcoffeex

[jacksfan29]

I really don't like him either. I have a feeling his time is coming to an end at UND.

At this point I am happy that president kelley is gone. That guy was a piece of work...he cam from Berkely which says a lot in itself.

Didn't your new President already take away Faison's financial responsibility by having the Athletic Department's director of finance report directly to the President's office and his own VP of Finance? That would seem to indicate trust in Faison's ability to manage his department is rather low.

[UNDColorado]

Didn't your new President already take away Faison's financial responsibility by having the Athletic Department's director of finance report directly to the President's office and his own VP of Finance? That would seem to indicate trust in Faison's ability to manage his department is rather low.

You are correct. He moved it under the finance umbrella. That is one of a few indicators that Faisons time is coming to an end. Time for some new leadership in the athletic dept IMHO.

[IBleedYellow]

I think that Derrik T Sovak should be your new AD. He seems to know a lot about Athletic Departments.

xlolx


By Derrik T. Sovak
Published: Tuesday, August 31, 2004

I thought that I might have trouble writing this column. But after I reviewed all the facts surrounding our overzealous neighbors to the south at North Dakota State, I realized that talking **** about them just gets easier and easier.

On Saturday, NDSU hosted Valparaiso to a crowd of just over 18,000. They absolutely stomped Valpo to the tune of 52-0. As I watched local sports highlights and saw all of the Bison players patting each other's back for the ousting, I wondered how they were going to look at themselves in the mirror without laughing.

Note to NDSU: Valparaiso offers no scholarships to their players. That means that they have less of a recruiting pool than Bethune-Cookman. Valpo also plays in the Pioneer Football League, which is almost as prestigious as NDSU's Great West Conference. Both these conferences look like the island of misfit schools. And when you get two teams like the Bison and the Crusaders on the field it's almost a toss up.

The Bison were a sub-par team in Division II football last year, and the Crusaders finished 8-4 without a playoff appearance last season. So what happened in Fargo on Saturday was as far away from amazing as you can get without actually being at the Neverland Ranch.

Everyone is so excited around the NDSU campus. Football means something to these people. But I feel it my duty to be the asshole and let them in on a little secret. For the next decade, NDSU football will be as arbitrary as paying .40 cents for ranch at Buffalo Wild Wings after running up a $500 bar tab.

Saturday's matchup was between two unranked schools in leagues that mean nothing to anyone. A win is a win but when I'd still rather watch a team of midgets play a team of chimpanzees.

This is an old argument. I said it last year, and it's no secret that I think NDSU's move to DI was a terrible decision. So I don't want NDSU to get their hopes up too high. If they really think that every team they play in that other Division is going to lie down and take it like its their first time, they're wrong.

Just like when the Bison were getting crushed by DII teams every weekend, they will face a team that hands them a 52-0 loss and then we in Grand Forks will hear the griping and crying from the south. And I can say proudly that I saw it coming.

On the other hand, UND had a barn-burner against Delta State - the number 2 and 10 teams in the country - in GF on Saturday. I witnessed great things in that game and there's a chance that we could see those teams meet again in the near future. Valpo won't be back in Fargo unless either they or the Bison need to fill their already defunct schedules next season.

I feel all warm and fuzzy inside knowing that at UND football still has pride. I like knowing that, even though we're "only Division II" we still can watch two ranked teams play in a city like Grand Forks. It makes for good football, which we won't see in Fargo for a long time.

It also came to my attention that NDSU has revolutionized college football by introducing something called tailgating at their games.

Take this as you may, but your football program is not going to prosper any faster just because some freshman had a beer before the game. I don't know about the rest of you guys, but I'm going to wait with bated breath for the Montana Tech game in a couple of weeks.

R.I.P. Bison Athletics.




Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk

[POD Knows]

I think that Derrik T Sovak should be your new AD. He seems to know a lot about Athletic Departments.

xlolx


By Derrik T. Sovak
Published: Tuesday, August 31, 2004

I thought that I might have trouble writing this column. But after I reviewed all the facts surrounding our overzealous neighbors to the south at North Dakota State, I realized that talking **** about them just gets easier and easier.

On Saturday, NDSU hosted Valparaiso to a crowd of just over 18,000. They absolutely stomped Valpo to the tune of 52-0. As I watched local sports highlights and saw all of the Bison players patting each other's back for the ousting, I wondered how they were going to look at themselves in the mirror without laughing.

Note to NDSU: Valparaiso offers no scholarships to their players. That means that they have less of a recruiting pool than Bethune-Cookman. Valpo also plays in the Pioneer Football League, which is almost as prestigious as NDSU's Great West Conference. Both these conferences look like the island of misfit schools. And when you get two teams like the Bison and the Crusaders on the field it's almost a toss up.

The Bison were a sub-par team in Division II football last year, and the Crusaders finished 8-4 without a playoff appearance last season. So what happened in Fargo on Saturday was as far away from amazing as you can get without actually being at the Neverland Ranch.

Everyone is so excited around the NDSU campus. Football means something to these people. But I feel it my duty to be the asshole and let them in on a little secret. For the next decade, NDSU football will be as arbitrary as paying .40 cents for ranch at Buffalo Wild Wings after running up a $500 bar tab.

Saturday's matchup was between two unranked schools in leagues that mean nothing to anyone. A win is a win but when I'd still rather watch a team of midgets play a team of chimpanzees.

This is an old argument. I said it last year, and it's no secret that I think NDSU's move to DI was a terrible decision. So I don't want NDSU to get their hopes up too high. If they really think that every team they play in that other Division is going to lie down and take it like its their first time, they're wrong.

Just like when the Bison were getting crushed by DII teams every weekend, they will face a team that hands them a 52-0 loss and then we in Grand Forks will hear the griping and crying from the south. And I can say proudly that I saw it coming.

On the other hand, UND had a barn-burner against Delta State - the number 2 and 10 teams in the country - in GF on Saturday. I witnessed great things in that game and there's a chance that we could see those teams meet again in the near future. Valpo won't be back in Fargo unless either they or the Bison need to fill their already defunct schedules next season.

I feel all warm and fuzzy inside knowing that at UND football still has pride. I like knowing that, even though we're "only Division II" we still can watch two ranked teams play in a city like Grand Forks. It makes for good football, which we won't see in Fargo for a long time.

It also came to my attention that NDSU has revolutionized college football by introducing something called tailgating at their games.

Take this as you may, but your football program is not going to prosper any faster just because some freshman had a beer before the game. I don't know about the rest of you guys, but I'm going to wait with bated breath for the Montana Tech game in a couple of weeks.

R.I.P. Bison Athletics.




Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk

That letter is a timeless classic

[geaux_sioux]

I believe that Kennedy will do well for UND, and his first line of business should be firing Brian Faison.

I don't think that AD ever made a good decision other than "Let's go to D1", and he even then screwed that up.


We're talking about an AD who went on the radio and publicly stated that "We're doing FCOA, it's happening, we just have no idea how we'll fund it yet." I still think the only reason UND said they'd do it was because NDSU stated we would.

He's just never given me the warm and fuzzies.
Best moment in Faison's career was at the football banquet when he condescendingly said if the team won a conference title the year after going 3-8 the team would get rings. Well we went 8-3 and you should have seen the look on that fat piece of ****s face when he had to hand out over 100 rings to the football team and staff. Can't wait till we can his fat ass.

[Laker]

Have people at UND lost all of their marbles? Living in a tent by choice for social justice? Or is this a way to save money for the athletic department?

Progressive UND students get social justice-themed housing option


http://www.campusreform.org/?ID=8071

[Bisonoline]

Best moment in Faison's career was at the football banquet when he condescendingly said if the team won a conference title the year after going 3-8 the team would get rings. Well we went 8-3 and you should have seen the look on that fat piece of ****s face when he had to hand out over 100 rings to the football team and staff. Can't wait till we can his fat ass.


You guys certainly could have done better.

[Bisonoline]

Have people at UND lost all of their marbles? Living in a tent by choice for social justice? Or is this a way to save money for the athletic department?

Progressive UND students get social justice-themed housing option


http://www.campusreform.org/?ID=8071

"""UND currently has four other Living-Learning Communities (http://und.edu/student-life/housing/residence-halls/living-learning.cfm)—Aviation, Engineering & Mines, Wellness, and Honors—most of which primarily relate to academic interests.""""

So they now have one for confused whack jobs? xrotatehx

[geaux_sioux]

Best moment in Faison's career was at the football banquet when he condescendingly said if the team won a conference title the year after going 3-8 the team would get rings. Well we went 8-3 and you should have seen the look on that fat piece of ****s face when he had to hand out over 100 rings to the football team and staff. Can't wait till we can his fat ass.


You guys certainly could have done better.
A lot better is a vast understatement. He is about as hated as Kelley was. We had the trifecta from hell with Kelley Faison and Mussman. They should be referred to as the Axis of Evil in UNDs history.

[TheKingpin28]

And people wonder why this country gets **** on by other countries. Let's put all the fairies in one group so we can make them feel EXTRA special. ****ing idiots. They need to just go away and be somewhere that is not distracting from a legitimate learning environment.

[Thumper 76]

Have people at UND lost all of their marbles? Living in a tent by choice for social justice? Or is this a way to save money for the athletic department?

Progressive UND students get social justice-themed housing option


http://www.campusreform.org/?ID=8071

Please tell me they are staying in those tents year round. Please tell me that UND found a way to get them to sign something that says they agree to live in a tent all year and won't try to change their housing arrangements. Can you imagine living in a tent in Grand Forks in DECEMBER? With some asshole with a hose spraying your tent with water every night?

[Bison56]

I think that Derrik T Sovak should be your new AD. He seems to know a lot about Athletic Departments.

xlolx


By Derrik T. Sovak
Published: Tuesday, August 31, 2004

I thought that I might have trouble writing this column. But after I reviewed all the facts surrounding our overzealous neighbors to the south at North Dakota State, I realized that talking **** about them just gets easier and easier.

On Saturday, NDSU hosted Valparaiso to a crowd of just over 18,000. They absolutely stomped Valpo to the tune of 52-0. As I watched local sports highlights and saw all of the Bison players patting each other's back for the ousting, I wondered how they were going to look at themselves in the mirror without laughing.

Note to NDSU: Valparaiso offers no scholarships to their players. That means that they have less of a recruiting pool than Bethune-Cookman. Valpo also plays in the Pioneer Football League, which is almost as prestigious as NDSU's Great West Conference. Both these conferences look like the island of misfit schools. And when you get two teams like the Bison and the Crusaders on the field it's almost a toss up.

The Bison were a sub-par team in Division II football last year, and the Crusaders finished 8-4 without a playoff appearance last season. So what happened in Fargo on Saturday was as far away from amazing as you can get without actually being at the Neverland Ranch.

Everyone is so excited around the NDSU campus. Football means something to these people. But I feel it my duty to be the asshole and let them in on a little secret. For the next decade, NDSU football will be as arbitrary as paying .40 cents for ranch at Buffalo Wild Wings after running up a $500 bar tab.

Saturday's matchup was between two unranked schools in leagues that mean nothing to anyone. A win is a win but when I'd still rather watch a team of midgets play a team of chimpanzees.

This is an old argument. I said it last year, and it's no secret that I think NDSU's move to DI was a terrible decision. So I don't want NDSU to get their hopes up too high. If they really think that every team they play in that other Division is going to lie down and take it like its their first time, they're wrong.

Just like when the Bison were getting crushed by DII teams every weekend, they will face a team that hands them a 52-0 loss and then we in Grand Forks will hear the griping and crying from the south. And I can say proudly that I saw it coming.

On the other hand, UND had a barn-burner against Delta State - the number 2 and 10 teams in the country - in GF on Saturday. I witnessed great things in that game and there's a chance that we could see those teams meet again in the near future. Valpo won't be back in Fargo unless either they or the Bison need to fill their already defunct schedules next season.

I feel all warm and fuzzy inside knowing that at UND football still has pride. I like knowing that, even though we're "only Division II" we still can watch two ranked teams play in a city like Grand Forks. It makes for good football, which we won't see in Fargo for a long time.

It also came to my attention that NDSU has revolutionized college football by introducing something called tailgating at their games.

Take this as you may, but your football program is not going to prosper any faster just because some freshman had a beer before the game. I don't know about the rest of you guys, but I'm going to wait with bated breath for the Montana Tech game in a couple of weeks.

R.I.P. Bison Athletics.




Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk

I will never get tired of reading that xlolx

Anyone know what happened to the tool who wrote it?

[bri-dog]

I will never get tired of reading that xlolx

Anyone know what happened to the tool who wrote it?

Well, his name is right at the top of the story. If you have a facebook account, check him out (take out the "T"). You'll see just what kind of guy he is...

[smilo]

Well, his name is right at the top of the story. If you have a facebook account, check him out (take out the "T"). You'll see just what kind of guy he is...

Yep, I saw that coming from a mile away once I saw that he lacked critical thinking skills. What a genius

[taper]

In anticipation of the committee's results I was running some numbers based on the pdf report posted earlier. They're going to have a really hard time keeping Big Sky membership and women's hockey. One has to go. Otherwise they have to completely cut 3 of men's swimming and diving, women's soccer, softball, swimming and diving. If their announced $730k FCOA isn't part of the $1.4M then all have to go and even that might not be enough. Summit membership is not at all a given if requested, they'd almost certainly require men's baseball which is another $600k UND has to find. MVFC is unlikely. D2 costs far too much pride. Men's hockey is a sacred cow, cuts will be minimal and symbolic. They could try selling out their football team to 3 FBS paydays a year, but that eliminates any possibility of playoffs. Not convinced they could get 3 $500k+ paydays a year either. By far the best option is to cut women's hockey and spreading some money to other women's teams for Title IX compliance.

I'm sure the committee will come up some other ideas, they'll push some numbers around on the accounting sheet, and we'll go through this again within 4 years.

[F'N Hawks]

^^^^
Sounds like there is no way they can recover.

Anyway, did you happen to hear about the part where they are going to cut 3-4 sports? That will do it.

[dakotadan]

Have people at UND lost all of their marbles? Living in a tent by choice for social justice? Or is this a way to save money for the athletic department?

Progressive UND students get social justice-themed housing option


http://www.campusreform.org/?ID=8071

There is nobody living in tents at UND. I don't know why that website included a picture of tents with the article, tents were never mentioned once. They are simply dorms/wings that pair people up with similar interests or majors. The aviation one has been very popular for a long time among the prop heads.

That pic wasn't even taken on UND's campus.

[dakotadan]

Regarding Faison, he came to us from NMSU. Look what a great athletic department they have there.

[Redbird007]

MVFC is unlikely.


I don't have anything for or against UND so my comments that follow are from the angle of all MVFC schools....why would MVFC group as a whole want to add UND? Can not think of one advantage that would apply as respects to the members as a whole if they were to add UND to the conference. Yes it may be a potential nice rival for NDSU, SDSU, and UNI (?) and there could be some some additional expense savings and additional revenue for those same schools if UND travels well? But for the other MVFC members it adds absolutely NOTHING. No additional marketing/exposure benefit as NDSU already brings the entire state (also such a small population base to begin with), no increased revenue, no reduced costs (likely more expensive to travel for football), and no additional academic or athletic prestige. I think it would be a huge mistake to add UND. Getting too many schools from that region would be bad given the low population density. I can't imagine anyone at MVFC office would take the time to analyze adding UND as it is so apparent that as a whole it makes absolutely no sense.

[Bisonoline]

I don't have anything for or against UND so my comments that follow are from the angle of all MVFC schools....why would MVFC group as a whole want to add UND? Can not think of one advantage that would apply as respects to the members as a whole if they were to add UND to the conference. Yes it may be a potential nice rival for NDSU, SDSU, and UNI (?) and there could be some some additional expense savings and additional revenue for those same schools if UND travels well? But for the other MVFC members it adds absolutely NOTHING. No additional marketing/exposure benefit as NDSU already brings the entire state (also such a small population base to begin with), no increased revenue, no reduced costs (likely more expensive to travel for football), and no additional academic or athletic prestige. I think it would be a huge mistake to add UND. Getting too many schools from that region would be bad given the low population density. I can't imagine anyone at MVFC office would take the time to analyze adding UND as it is so apparent that as a whole it makes absolutely no sense.

Yeah here is a school thats a constant crapshow with huge money problems, has to cut sports, fans have said the MVFC and Summit are crappy and below the BSC---so why would you want that anchor around our necks? They bring nothing to the table but crap.

[Thumper 76]

There is nobody living in tents at UND. I don't know why that website included a picture of tents with the article, tents were never mentioned once. They are simply dorms/wings that pair people up with similar interests or majors. The aviation one has been very popular for a long time among the prop heads.

That pic wasn't even taken on UND's campus.

So tell me how this makes it better? Makes me want them even less in the Summit. WAFJ

[SUUTbird]

I voted that they will go back to the Summit/MVFC because honestly I think in the long run it fits the interest of the University. The teams in the MVFC already don't play everyone in their conference so adding one more won't be a big deal in that regard, and as mentioned it would give another regional rival for the other Dakota schools and UNI.

What would suck however is that it would leave the Big Sky right back to where it is now once Idaho drops down which would be 13 football schools and this time only 11 full-time members, makes me wonder if the Big Sky would pursue another team to try to make it 12 full-time members. The only options for that that I can think of (and bear with me I realize how unlikely several of these are) would be NMSU dropping down to FCS, having a D2 program and move up or trying to get San Diego to join.

[Bison56]

Well, his name is right at the top of the story. If you have a facebook account, check him out (take out the "T"). You'll see just what kind of guy he is...

LOL thanks

[Redbird007]

I voted that they will go back to the Summit/MVFC because honestly I think in the long run it fits the interest of the University. The teams in the MVFC already don't play everyone in their conference so adding one more won't be a big deal in that regard, and as mentioned it would give another regional rival for the other Dakota schools and UNI.

What would suck however is that it would leave the Big Sky right back to where it is now once Idaho drops down which would be 13 football schools and this time only 11 full-time members, makes me wonder if the Big Sky would pursue another team to try to make it 12 full-time members. The only options for that that I can think of (and bear with me I realize how unlikely several of these are) would be NMSU dropping down to FCS, having a D2 program and move up or trying to get San Diego to join.


Agree with your comments that UND going to Summit/MVFC makes sense for UND. However the conference members get NOTHING in return. Since the MVFC schools already do not play each other every year (as you noted) then adding another school only makes that issue worse so that is another strike against adding UND to the MVFC. I do not know the history of UND conference affiliations but it appears like they have done a horrible job of flailing about in Division I and now they have isolated themselves and there on real options for UND other than Division II football? I can't see anyone in Div I wanting them and that includes all 3 conferences (Big Sky/Summit/MVC) that have been discussed as the same fundamental issue applies universally...they bring NOTHING in return. If I am missing something let me know. What a dilemma but it appears to be somewhat self imposed.

[IBleedYellow]

Agree with your comments that UND going to Summit/MVFC makes sense for UND. However the conference members get NOTHING in return. Since the MVFC schools already do not play each other every year (as you noted) then adding another school only makes that issue worse so that is another strike against adding UND to the MVFC. I do not know the history of UND conference affiliations but it appears like they have done a horrible job of flailing about in Division I and now they have isolated themselves and there on real options for UND other than Division II football? I can't see anyone in Div I wanting them and that includes all 3 conferences (Big Sky/Summit/MVC) that have been discussed as the same fundamental issue applies universally...they bring NOTHING in return. If I am missing something let me know. What a dilemma but it appears to be somewhat self imposed.


Alright, I don't believe you're a Illinois State fan. What is your Bisonville username? xthumbsupx

[F'N Hawks]

Alright, I don't believe you're a Illinois State fan. What is your Bisonville username? xthumbsupx

Was gonna say, what message board am I on? Thankfully, college presidents are complete rubes.

[Redbird007]

Alright, I don't believe you're a Illinois State fan. What is your Bisonville username? xthumbsupx

LOL...Total Illinois State fan... alright my bad I was a little over analytical.

[FargoBison]

UND's problem is that their athletic department is best fit for DII, like the old NCC. Dump most of the money into hockey while saving cash by being in bus league for the less important sports. It is what SCSU, Duluth and other DII schools do.

When they went DI UND should have made some big changes, starting with dumping women's hockey. People here would be amazed at how much money UND just throws away on a sport that nobody gives a damn about.

Honestly as long as UND still has women's hockey I'm not sure they are really an attractive conference addition. It will forever be a budget ball and chain.

[IBleedYellow]

UND's problem is that their athletic department is best fit for DII, like the old NCC. Dump most of the money into hockey while saving cash by being in bus league for the less important sports. It is what SCSU, Duluth and other DII schools do.

When they went DI UND should have made some big changes, starting with dumping women's hockey. People here would be amazed at how much money UND just throws away on a sport that nobody gives a damn about.

Honestly as long as UND still has women's hockey I'm not sure they are really an attractive conference addition. It will forever be a budget ball and chain.


You're correct, but they don't want to hear this.

They want to have their cake and eat it too, but at this time they can't even afford the cake.

[AmsterBison]

UND's problem is that their athletic department is best fit for DII, like the old NCC. Dump most of the money into hockey while saving cash by being in bus league for the less important sports. It is what SCSU, Duluth and other DII schools do.

When they went DI UND should have made some big changes, starting with dumping women's hockey. People here would be amazed at how much money UND just throws away on a sport that nobody gives a damn about.

Honestly as long as UND still has women's hockey I'm not sure they are really an attractive conference addition. It will forever be a budget ball and chain.

Not sure that they'd save much money from dropping women's hockey.

Suppose you are skeptical that UND women's hockey really costs as much to run as a lot of FCS football programs, a counter-theory would be that the hockey arena folks are charging UND a ton of money for the REA and UND is just dividing that cost between the two programs. If so, dropping women's hockey will save only a fraction of their reported budget and the remaining balance will just shift to the men's hockey team expense section of their financial reports.

[IBleedYellow]

Not sure that they'd save much money from dropping women's hockey.

Suppose you are skeptical that UND women's hockey really costs as much to run as a lot of FCS football programs, a counter-theory would be that the hockey arena folks are charging UND a ton of money for the REA and UND is just dividing that cost between the two programs. If so, dropping women's hockey will save only a fraction of their reported budget and the remaining balance will just shift to the men's hockey team expenses.

So nothing would change - since Men's hockey is already the program that's bringing in money for the University.

The issue is it's basically maxed out on income unless they continue to raise prices (like NDSU football...).

[Schism55]

UND's problem is that their athletic department is best fit for DII, like the old NCC. Dump most of the money into hockey while saving cash by being in bus league for the less important sports. It is what SCSU, Duluth and other DII schools do.

When they went DI UND should have made some big changes, starting with dumping women's hockey. People here would be amazed at how much money UND just throws away on a sport that nobody gives a damn about.

Honestly as long as UND still has women's hockey I'm not sure they are really an attractive conference addition. It will forever be a budget ball and chain.
Sooo much this. Will their administration have the stones do what will be unpopular, but right?

[F'N Hawks]

Some people have been reading Siouxsports.

There is plenty of room in football, volleyball and the basketballs for revenue. Plus the costs would go way down in Summit, which will take UND in a second.

People are forgetting that the BB/Golf cut isn't included in the 1.4 million figure.

[Laker]

There is plenty of room in football, volleyball and the basketballs for revenue. Plus the costs would go way down in Summit, which will take UND in a second.

Do you think if the Summit required UND to reinstate baseball to get in that they would do it?

[FargoBison]

Not sure that they'd save much money from dropping women's hockey.

Suppose you are skeptical that UND women's hockey really costs as much to run as a lot of FCS football programs, a counter-theory would be that the hockey arena folks are charging UND a ton of money for the REA and UND is just dividing that cost between the two programs. If so, dropping women's hockey will save only a fraction of their reported budget and the remaining balance will just shift to the men's hockey team expense section of their financial reports.

I don't know. Duluth, U of MN and Wisconsin also lose a bundle on women's hockey but then again maybe they have similar shenanigans going on. Of course two of those schools can afford to lose a bundle on a nothing sport when they are part of a conference that prints money.

[F'N Hawks]

Do you think if the Summit required UND to reinstate baseball to get in that they would do it?

No. The Summit requires Basketball and five other sports. That's it. Very loose.

UND has talked with Douple multiple times per year. It obviously never came up as a future necessity.

[Da Bison]

Some people have been reading Siouxsports.

There is plenty of room in football, volleyball and the basketballs for revenue. Plus the costs would go way down in Summit, which will take UND in a second.

People are forgetting that the BB/Golf cut isn't included in the 1.4 million figure.

The additional $750,000 for FCOA isn't included either.

[WTFCollegefootballfan]

No. The Summit requires Basketball and five other sports. That's it. Very loose.

UND has talked with Douple multiple times per year. It obviously never came up as a future necessity.

I guess you don't listen. Summit needs schools that offer baseball. Und isn't getting into the Summit without baseball.

[F'N Hawks]

I guess you don't listen. Summit needs schools that offer baseball. Und isn't getting into the Summit without baseball.

Who told you that? I obviously never heard it.

[Thumper 76]

No. The Summit requires Basketball and five other sports. That's it. Very loose.

UND has talked with Douple multiple times per year. It obviously never came up as a future necessity.

Maybe it never came up as a necessity because UND had baseball and it wouldn't make a hell of a lot of sense to make a big deal out of what was nothing at the time?

I really feel like you're repeating the beginning of the argument we had. Do you have short term memory loss?

[F'N Hawks]

Maybe it never came up as a necessity because UND had baseball and it wouldn't make a hell of a lot of sense to make a big deal out of what was nothing at the time?

I really feel like you're repeating the beginning of the argument we had. Do you have short term memory loss?

Let me rephrase that, who officially said that UND needs to have baseball or they cannot get into the summit League? I am not talking about a bunch of lushes on a message board saying it.

[UNIFanSince1983]

Let me rephrase that, who officially said that UND needs to have baseball or they cannot get into the summit League? I am not talking about a bunch of lushes on a message board saying it.

Who said they could get in without a baseball team?

Works both ways you see.

[Thumper 76]

Let me rephrase that, who officially said that UND needs to have baseball or they cannot get into the summit League? I am not talking about a bunch of lushes on a message board saying it.

I haven't officially seen anywhere that UND has been frequently visited by Douple outside of you saying it either, but it makes sense they would have. Just because you don't like that people are saying it doesn't make it wrong. Most of these lushes are using logic and reasoning and you're using emotion.

[F'N Hawks]

I haven't officially seen anywhere that UND has been frequently visited by Douple outside of you saying it either, but it makes sense they would have. Just because you don't like that people are saying it doesn't make it wrong. Most of these lushes are using logic and reasoning and you're using emotion.

Yah, no negative emotion from the other side at all. Right.

Since when does the Summit care about baseball like you all say? Did you know they could have added UND a couple years ago and the powers that be said no? Much to the dismay of every coach in the league. No affiliates. That worked out well, they are in a ***** position and UND Baseball is extinct.

[WTFCollegefootballfan]

Yah, no negative emotion from the other side at all. Right.

Since when does the Summit care about baseball like you all say? Did you know they could have added UND a couple years ago and the powers that be said no? Much to the dismay of every coach in the league. No affiliates. That worked out well, they are in a ***** position and UND Baseball is extinct.

The Summit needs baseball to keep its Basketball autobid. It has been brought up many times on here already. I really think Thumper 76 is right you have short term memory loss.

[Thumper 76]

Yah, no negative emotion from the other side at all. Right.

Since when does the Summit care about baseball like you all say? Did you know they could have added UND a couple years ago and the powers that be said no? Much to the dismay of every coach in the league. No affiliates. That worked out well, they are in a ***** position and UND Baseball is extinct.

Since if they were to lose one school from the league for baseball they wouldn't have enough teams to qualify for the NCAA tournament, which would mean the Summit wouldn't sooner enough sports to be eligible for the NCAA basketball tournament autobid they receive.

And how long was a couple years ago? Was it for baseball only? Do you have a source other than somebody told me?

[F'N Hawks]

I full understand that the Summit needs teams. Just not sure how it keeps UND out of the the league. Its a full league, not just baseball.

Are there zero other baseball teams in the Midwest?

[F'N Hawks]

Since if they were to lose one school from the league for baseball they wouldn't have enough teams to qualify for the NCAA tournament, which would mean the Summit wouldn't sooner enough sports to be eligible for the NCAA basketball tournament autobid they receive.

And how long was a couple years ago? Was it for baseball only? Do you have a source other than somebody told me?

This is turning into BV. Asking for sources now like Tony...sigh.

Do Jeff Dodson and Brian DeVillers count? They both told me directly. Ask your baseball coach. He should tell you the same.

[Thumper 76]

Let me rephrase that, who officially said that UND needs to have baseball or they cannot get into the summit League? I am not talking about a bunch of lushes on a message board saying it.


This is turning into BV. Asking for sources now like Tony...sigh.

Do Jeff Dodson and Brian DeVillers count? They both told me directly. Ask your baseball coach. He should tell you the same.

Says the guy who literally did the same thing, and is doing the same thing, as everybody else. You are fhawking ridiculous you know that right.

[WTFCollegefootballfan]

This is turning into BV. Asking for sources now like Tony...sigh.

Do Jeff Dodson and Brian DeVillers count? They both told me directly. Ask your baseball coach. He should tell you the same.
You are beginning to sound more like the Und version of Lakes. He does the same thing you are doing. " I talked to this person. I talked to that person. I know this person. This person told me at a golf outing."

[F'N Hawks]

Says the guy who literally did the same thing, and is doing the same thing, as everybody else. You are fhawking ridiculous you know that right.

I gave you a damn good source.

I usually never ask but this thread is getting so f'hawking stupid that it needed to be done.

[clenz]

I full understand that the Summit needs teams. Just not sure how it keeps UND out of the the league. Its a full league, not just baseball.

Are there zero other baseball teams in the Midwest?
It is a full league, the problem for UND is that the Summit doesn't need other sports right now. It needs baseball. If the Summit loses it's baseball autobid it loses it's autobid in every sport. You ever heard of a conference surviving without an autobid for any sport? No? Didn't think so.

Adding a non baseball school doesn't solve anything. It adds to the issue because you're expanding a conference for the sake of expanding. That takes means NCAA unit money spread more thin. That hurts the conference members.


There aren't many baseball teams in the midwest...by that, I mean there are about 0 that don't belong to a "bigger" conference. For a bigger version of the photo below click here: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/e/e0/Baseball_d1.png

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/e/e0/Baseball_d1.png

[IBleedYellow]

It is a full league, the problem for UND is that the Summit doesn't need other sports right now. It needs baseball. If the Summit loses it's baseball autobid it loses it's autobid in every sport. You ever heard of a conference surviving without an autobid for any sport? No? Didn't think so.

Adding a non baseball school doesn't solve anything. It adds to the issue because you're expanding a conference for the sake of expanding. That takes means NCAA unit money spread more thin. That hurts the conference members.


There aren't many baseball teams in the midwest...by that, I mean there are about 0 that don't belong to a "bigger" conference. For a bigger version of the photo below click here: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/e/e0/Baseball_d1.png

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/e/e0/Baseball_d1.png

You're telling me that UND doesn't actually have leverage here?!

I'm SHOCKED, SHOCKED I tell you.

[IBleedYellow]

F'ing Hawks, do you know how NCAA money is divvied out? Just curious.

[F'N Hawks]

It is a full league, the problem for UND is that the Summit doesn't need other sports right now. It needs baseball. If the Summit loses it's baseball autobid it loses it's autobid in every sport. You ever heard of a conference surviving without an autobid for any sport? No? Didn't think so.

Adding a non baseball school doesn't solve anything. It adds to the issue because you're expanding a conference for the sake of expanding. That takes means NCAA unit money spread more thin. That hurts the conference members.


There aren't many baseball teams in the midwest...by that, I mean there are about 0 that don't belong to a "bigger" conference. For a bigger version of the photo below click here: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/e/e0/Baseball_d1.png

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/e/e0/Baseball_d1.png

Interesting. We will have to see what happens in next three months.

[F'N Hawks]

F'ing Hawks, do you know how NCAA money is divvied out? Just curious.

No I don't.

[WTFCollegefootballfan]

Men's golf back at Und........

http://kfgo.com/news/articles/2016/aug/31/mens-golf-program-to-be-reinstated-at-university-of-north-dakota/#.V8dORWpLYGA.facebook

[Laker]

Men's golf back at Und........

http://kfgo.com/news/articles/2016/aug/31/mens-golf-program-to-be-reinstated-at-university-of-north-dakota/#.V8dORWpLYGA.facebook

Too bad that they couldn't get enough support for a similar deal for baseball.

[clenz]

No I don't.
Read this...



http://www.forbes.com/sites/chrissmith/2014/03/20/how-a-single-ncaa-tournament-win-is-worth-1-6-million/#112fd20f26ca


Every team in the NCAA Tournament is fighting to win as many games as possible, even though tournament success often comes at a great financial cost. In fact, the better a team does on the court, the worse it will usually do financially. Just look at No. 1 seed Wichita State, which ordinarily nets an annual profit of $1 million but lost money last year thanks to a Final Four run.


Of course, the Shockers are more than happy to pay that cost, especially because the team will enjoy longterm financial upside from things like increased exposure and merchandise sales. Another way that the Shockers’ tournament run will generate revenue is from the NCAA’s conference distributions. The annual payouts include conference grants and the student assistance fund, but the biggest component is the basketball fund, which serves as a sort of prize money stash that rewards conferences for their tournament performances.


The NCAA’s basketball fund will distribute an estimated $194 million to the D1 conferences this year. That money is allocated according to each conference’s recent NCAA Tournament performances. The distribution is based on a six-year rolling period, and this year’s April payout will encompass the ongoing tournament as well as the previous five.


Conferences get a tournament unit for every non-championship game played by a conference member in those six tourneys. A tournament unit is projected to be worth $250,106 this year, up 1.9% from last year’s $245,500 unit value. So if teams from the Atlantic 10 played a combined 35 tournament games over those six years, then the conference would receive $8.75 million in April.

Perhaps the more interesting way to look at a unit’s value, however, is how much it nets a conference over its six-year life. Unit values change year to year, and next year’s per-unit payout is projected to be $255,379, a 2.1% growth over this year. Assuming an annual 2% increase every year thereafter, a single tournament unit won this year will accrue a total value of $1.58 million across the next six distributions.

That’s not a ton of money, especially once you start breaking it down at a per-school level – Wichita State’s Final Four run will only earn the school an extra $80,000 or so per year – but it adds up quickly when a major conference has multiple schools making deep runs. Take, for instance, the ACC, which last year took home $18 million – or nearly 10% of the total distribution – from the 74 tournament units its teams won over the previous six tournaments. The Big Ten, Big 12 and Big East (prior to splitting) all netted over $20 million.


This year the ACC has six teams in the big dance, which means the conference is assured $1.5 million this year and another $8 million over the next five just from this year’s tournament – and that’s assuming all of those teams lose their first-round games. If just one team makes a run to the Final Four, it will add another $1.1 million to the conference take in each of the next six years.




TL;DR version?

The more schools in the conference the less money each school gets unless it's a league that has multiple teams making the NCAA tournament and playing multiple games.

Thus, it hurts the summit to have an excess of basketball teams - especially teams without baseball that do nothing to secure a baseball autobid...thus a basketball autobid.

[IBleedYellow]

No I don't.

This is important: The basketball tournament is the only one that matters to the NCAA.

Each game that a team plays in (win or lose) gets their conference a "Tournament Unit." This year each unit is projected to be over $250k. Say a team wins 4 games - they earned their conference $1M...and that is paid PER YEAR for 6 YEARS! (So the conference will get 6M over the life of the Unit).

This is basketball only, and really it's the largest pot that the NCAA pays to schools. Period. The other 5 categories are: Academic Enhancement Fund, Grant-in-Aid Fund, Student Athlete Assistance Fund, Sports Sponsorship Fund and Conference Fund.

The other 5 funds barely equal the Basketball fund, combined.

So if UND would join The Summit, the share of each unit would remain the same, but each school would get less per unit. Each school would also have to increase their travel budgets with extra travel to Grand Forks for each sport.

Baseball currently has the bare minimum amount of scholarships, and if The Summit loses one program, it loses ALL autobids to all tournaments. AKA: A guarantee of at least one tournament unit per year. With upsets the conference can make more money.

So I ask you - what stability does UND bring to the Summit if they don't have baseball?

[F'N Hawks]

This is important: The basketball tournament is the only one that matters to the NCAA.

Each game that a team plays in (win or lose) gets their conference a "Tournament Unit." This year each unit is projected to be over $250k. Say a team wins 4 games - they earned their conference $1M...and that is paid PER YEAR for 6 YEARS! (So the conference will get 6M over the life of the Unit).

This is basketball only, and really it's the largest pot that the NCAA pays to schools. Period. The other 5 categories are: Academic Enhancement Fund, Grant-in-Aid Fund, Student Athlete Assistance Fund, Sports Sponsorship Fund and Conference Fund.

The other 5 funds barely equal the Basketball fund, combined.

So if UND would join The Summit, the share of each unit would remain the same, but each school would get less per unit. Each school would also have to increase their travel budgets with extra travel to Grand Forks for each sport.

Baseball currently has the bare minimum amount of scholarships, and if The Summit loses one program, it loses ALL autobids to all tournaments. AKA: A guarantee of at least one tournament unit per year. With upsets the conference can make more money.

So I ask you - what stability does UND bring to the Summit if they don't have baseball?

Thanks.

The Summit typically shares $27,800 then (one unit / 9 teams).

With UND it would be $25,000.

I could see how that would alarm some folks.

[clenz]

Thanks.

The Summit typically shares $27,800 then (one unit / 9 teams).

With UND it would be $25,000.

I could see how that would alarm some folks.
It would be less because the Summit still needs baseball stability.

By the time the dust settles, because 11 is a dumb conference membership number, you could be closer to 20,833 per school.

If you're going to drop the amount your getting the conference better be getting something in return

[IBleedYellow]

Thanks.

The Summit typically shares $27,800 then (one unit / 9 teams).

With UND it would be $25,000.

I could see how that would alarm some folks.
You didn't answer my question.

What value does UND bring for conference stability?

Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk

[F'N Hawks]

You didn't answer my question.

What value does UND bring for conference stability?

Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk

I can't think of anything off hand. Hopefully, the committee is told that so it isn't discussed anymore. Will save a lot of time for them, IMO.

[centennial]

We have no reason to share basketball money with UND. If they could increase the strength of the Summit maybe..

As it is right now UND is weaker than the average Summit team. I don't see that changing anytime soon. They would jump to a stronger league. The only basketball add that makes sense is a team that has top 50-100 wins. UND is not it. Only leverage is UND can bring baseball.

Also is the Big Sky going to let them keep football? MVFC is even a bigger reach than the Summit.

[Twentysix]

Too bad that they couldn't get enough support for a similar deal for baseball.

Pretty sure its a way different amount of money though. NDSU's 2015 baseball budget $712,317.00 (revenue $256,600.00), NDSU's 2015 men's golf budget $210,534.00 (revenue $65,100.00). These are not UNDs numbers, but I would expect they are relatively similar.

So baseball's budget is like -460k and golf is like -150k.

[Hammersmith]

Thanks.

The Summit typically shares $27,800 then (one unit / 9 teams).

With UND it would be $25,000.

I could see how that would alarm some folks.

Wrong. It's over the last six years. And NDSU won a game a couple years back, so the Summit is currently getting seven shares, or about $1.75M. The Summit keeps some of that to fund the conference office, but without that a Summit school's cut would be about $195k. With UND it would be $175k. So adding UND would cost the other Summit schools about $20k a year(and increasing), not to mention the added travel costs for most of the members.

With baseball, UND was a lock to get a Summit invitation. Without baseball, it's still likely, but no longer a lock.

[F'N Hawks]

Wrong. It's over the last six years. And NDSU won a game a couple years back, so the Summit is currently getting seven shares, or about $1.75M. The Summit keeps some of that to fund the conference office, but without that a Summit school's cut would be about $195k. With UND it would be $175k. So adding UND would cost the other Summit schools about $20k a year(and increasing), not to mention the added travel costs for most of the members.

With baseball, UND was a lock to get a Summit invitation. Without baseball, it's still likely, but no longer a lock.

Like I said, no idea. Thanks.

[clenz]

That moment IBY calls you out of the blue on your way home from work and before you answer the phone you know exactly why he is calling and the first words out of his mouth make you about crash your car in laughter because they are exactly what you expected to hear just minutes after this exchange

http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160901/ecfe6000b2d48568970c3024df206b84.jpg

[BISON Thunder]

Thought I read somewhere that South Dakota currently does not sponsor baseball? If the Summit League ever found itself in a bind, I would think it would be simpler to assist/urge SD to field a baseball team than to start looking for other schools to join the conference.

[Yote 53]

Agree with your comments that UND going to Summit/MVFC makes sense for UND. However the conference members get NOTHING in return. Since the MVFC schools already do not play each other every year (as you noted) then adding another school only makes that issue worse so that is another strike against adding UND to the MVFC. I do not know the history of UND conference affiliations but it appears like they have done a horrible job of flailing about in Division I and now they have isolated themselves and there on real options for UND other than Division II football? I can't see anyone in Div I wanting them and that includes all 3 conferences (Big Sky/Summit/MVC) that have been discussed as the same fundamental issue applies universally...they bring NOTHING in return. If I am missing something let me know. What a dilemma but it appears to be somewhat self imposed.

What many outside the Dakotas might not realize is that UND had a 100 year relationship with the other Dakota schools and several other schools, including UNI, as a part of the North Central Conference. The conference turmoil is a new thing for them since moving to D1. While many of us look at conferences as a "sport" thing the university presidents who make the decisions look at these situations differently. I will guarantee you that if UND asks for aid in conference affiliation the other Dakota school will go to bat for them. UND is a peer institution in the region and university presidents and others in the academic community have relationships with each other and are not going to kick dirt on UND or do anything to harm that school. In the end the adults will make the decisions, thankfully.

[Twentysix]

What many outside the Dakotas might not realize is that UND had a 100 year relationship with the other Dakota schools and several other schools, including UNI, as a part of the North Central Conference. The conference turmoil is a new thing for them since moving to D1. While many of us look at conferences as a "sport" thing the university presidents who make the decisions look at these situations differently. I will guarantee you that if UND asks for aid in conference affiliation the other Dakota school will go to bat for them. UND is a peer institution in the region and university presidents and others in the academic community have relationships with each other and are not going to kick dirt on UND or do anything to harm that school. In the end the adults will make the decisions, thankfully.

This is true. Also, I suspect USD can be forced to start a baseball program, as they would have just as much to lose as all the other summit schools.

UND+baseball to the summit and USD+baseball sure would be nice :\

[Hammerhead]

Maybe Wyoming will drop down and you could put them in place of Nebraska-Omaha. :)


The majority do. The Big Sky is pretty cool in a lot of ways but it just does't fit geographically. The Montanas are the only ones that seem like peers.

Here's my star2volley take on an ideal conference. UND NDSU SDSU USD UM MSU NIU UNC WIU UNO<- brings back football. Obviously it won't happen but that would be the ultimate FCS conference.

[IBleedYellow]

That moment IBY calls you out of the blue on your way home from work and before you answer the phone you know exactly why he is calling and the first words out of his mouth make you about crash your car in laughter because they are exactly what you expected to hear just minutes after this exchange

http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160901/ecfe6000b2d48568970c3024df206b84.jpg


The numbers you have in there...are you mocking me? :D\

You know I mainly called you for the fact to see if we could grab beers when we stroll through on our way to Iowa City...

[Thumper 76]

What many outside the Dakotas might not realize is that UND had a 100 year relationship with the other Dakota schools and several other schools, including UNI, as a part of the North Central Conference. The conference turmoil is a new thing for them since moving to D1. While many of us look at conferences as a "sport" thing the university presidents who make the decisions look at these situations differently. I will guarantee you that if UND asks for aid in conference affiliation the other Dakota school will go to bat for them. UND is a peer institution in the region and university presidents and others in the academic community have relationships with each other and are not going to kick dirt on UND or do anything to harm that school. In the end the adults will make the decisions, thankfully.

So, your reasoning is they don't really add anything to the conference but we've played each other a lot. Not sure that's a real sound logic IMO, but I wouldn't be surprised if it happens.

Seems to me the majority of the discussion about this has been a pretty adult and thought out discussion and the only ones who don't think so are the ones who don't like the reasons being thrown out for UND not bringing a whole lot to the table since dropping baseball.

The only argument I've been reading for UND being a shoe in from fans of schools not named UND has been that more schools makes the conference more stable. Which is just wrong. If the Summit had 20 schools in it but lost one baseball program the whole thing crumbles. It's just faulty logic.

If the adults are truly making the decisions I hope they are adult enough to look at more than past history and look at the current and future things that UND brings to the table. I'm not against UND being in the Summit at all. I just don't think they are as desirable as their fans and proponents seem to think they are. I am 10000000000000000000% against them in the MVFC though.

[Yote 53]

Thanks.

The Summit typically shares $27,800 then (one unit / 9 teams).

With UND it would be $25,000.

I could see how that would alarm some folks.

A couple of thousand dollars when we are talking about schools with $10 million+ athletic budgets. That's a drop in the bucket. What are we even arguing about here?

[clenz]

The numbers you have in there...are you mocking me? :D\

You know I mainly called you for the fact to see if we could grab beers when we stroll through on our way to Iowa City...
The number I wanted to put there I didn't think was appropriate to share...

Also, you may have called for that reason but it took until about minute 7 to get to that point

[clenz]

What many outside the Dakotas might not realize is that UND had a 100 year relationship with the other Dakota schools and several other schools, including UNI, as a part of the North Central Conference. The conference turmoil is a new thing for them since moving to D1. While many of us look at conferences as a "sport" thing the university presidents who make the decisions look at these situations differently. I will guarantee you that if UND asks for aid in conference affiliation the other Dakota school will go to bat for them. UND is a peer institution in the region and university presidents and others in the academic community have relationships with each other and are not going to kick dirt on UND or do anything to harm that school. In the end the adults will make the decisions, thankfully.
UNI hasn't shared a conference with UND since 1977...

UNI's head coach wasn't in middle school yet....he's 53 now.

[Yote 53]

So, your reasoning is they don't really add anything to the conference but we've played each other a lot. Not sure that's a real sound logic IMO, but I wouldn't be surprised if it happens.

Seems to me the majority of the discussion about this has been a pretty adult and thought out discussion and the only ones who don't think so are the ones who don't like the reasons being thrown out for UND not bringing a whole lot to the table since dropping baseball.

The only argument I've been reading for UND being a shoe in from fans of schools not named UND has been that more schools makes the conference more stable. Which is just wrong. If the Summit had 20 schools in it but lost one baseball program the whole thing crumbles. It's just faulty logic.

If the adults are truly making the decisions I hope they are adult enough to look at more than past history and look at the current and future things that UND brings to the table. I'm not against UND being in the Summit at all. I just don't think they are as desirable as their fans and proponents seem to think they are. I am 10000000000000000000% against them in the MVFC though.

I've said this before, do you really think schools like USD and other conference schools would just sit by and watch the conference lose their autobid, creating instability, and allow the conference to eventually dissolve? Welp, can't do anything about it, duh. No, if it was imminent, I'm positive USD would start a baseball program tomorrow. Wouldn't be a fancy one, would be pretty bare bones with a tight budget and would most likely play home games at Prentis Park in Vermillion, but it would be an official D1 team, which is really all that is required.

[F'N Hawks]

The number I wanted to put there I didn't think was appropriate to share...

Also, you may have called for that reason but it took until about minute 7 to get to that point


Do you guys call each other to talk about UND?

[Yote 53]

Thought I read somewhere that South Dakota currently does not sponsor baseball? If the Summit League ever found itself in a bind, I would think it would be simpler to assist/urge SD to field a baseball team than to start looking for other schools to join the conference.

Thank you. I don't know why some don't understand this.

[clenz]

I've said this before, do you really think schools like USD and other conference schools would just sit by and watch the conference lose their autobid, creating instability, and allow the conference to eventually dissolve? Welp, can't do anything about it, duh. No, if it was imminent, I'm positive USD would start a baseball program tomorrow. Wouldn't be a fancy one, would be pretty bare bones with a tight budget and would most likely play home games at Prentis Park in Vermillion, but it would be an official D1 team, which is really all that is required.
Right.

The issue is, UND just cut their program. That's why splitting the money extra ways for a team that doesn't offer stability is an issue. Especially when USD can restart their program.

I remember when they cut it.

[Yote 53]

UNI hasn't shared a conference with UND since 1977...

UNI's head coach wasn't in middle school yet....he's 53 now.

UNI may not be relative anymore, I don't know. I'm sure there are some 70-80 year old rich guys, former UNI footballers, that remember their days banging heads against the school up in Grand Forks. I know I've talked to some well heeled donors that remember the old days when USD used to play UNI way back when. Just saying that it only takes a couple of money guys reliving the olds days, remembering things how they used to be, and advocating for a return to that.

[clenz]

UNI may not be relative anymore, I don't know. I'm sure there are some 70-80 year old rich guys, former UNI footballers, that remember their days banging heads against the school up in Grand Forks. I know I've talked to some well heeled donors that remember the old days when USD used to play UNI way back when. Just saying that it only takes a couple of money guys reliving the olds days, remembering things how they used to be, and advocating for a return to that.
I know there are UNI guys with that memory. I've talked to a good number of them.

UNI just doesn't have the "NCC nostalgia" that the rest of the old NCC does because it's been 40 years since UNI left it. UNI fans, alum, staff, etc... at this point want to continue to push forward and see "rebuilding the NCC" as not part of that

[Yote 53]

I know there are UNI guys with that memory. I've talked to a good number of them.

UNI just doesn't have the "NCC nostalgia" that the rest of the old NCC does because it's been 40 years since UNI left it. UNI fans, alum, staff, etc... at this point want to continue to push forward and see "rebuilding the NCC" as not part of that

Fair enough.

[clenz]

Fair enough.

It's not to say in a world where nothing outside of "fun" matters I wouldn't mind a conference of

UNI
SIU
ISUr
Drake
WIU
NDSU
SDSU
USD
UND

[Redbird007]

What many outside the Dakotas might not realize is that UND had a 100 year relationship with the other Dakota schools and several other schools, including UNI, as a part of the North Central Conference. The conference turmoil is a new thing for them since moving to D1. While many of us look at conferences as a "sport" thing the university presidents who make the decisions look at these situations differently. I will guarantee you that if UND asks for aid in conference affiliation the other Dakota school will go to bat for them. UND is a peer institution in the region and university presidents and others in the academic community have relationships with each other and are not going to kick dirt on UND or do anything to harm that school. In the end the adults will make the decisions, thankfully.

Point well stated and agree with your comments. I just do not know how much pull the Dakota schools will have as respects to getting other MVFC school members to vote for NDU acceptance. I do not see the overall vote for acceptance happening as it is too much of a burden for the other MVFC schools to add UND with nothing in return, and even worse, increased costs. It also impacts the competitive landscape too. Meaning, the MVFC conference schedule already is incomplete in that one team does not play another team every year. If MVFC adds UND then you have two teams not playing each other every year and it becomes more likely that the conference champion is questionable due to the possibility of having a conference champ that played a much easier schedule. Think if an MVFC member like ISUr or SDSU did not have to play both UNI and NDSU this year.

[IBleedYellow]

Do you guys call each other to talk about UND?
No. We call each other to hangout and get beers together.

But we also make fun of UND fans, because they are crazier than even Lakesbison.

Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk

[SDFS]

Who said they could get in without a baseball team?

Works both ways you see.

Well, it appears that Denver, WIU and USD have all joined without baseball.

[F'N Hawks]

No. We call each other to hangout and get beers together.

But we also make fun of UND fans, because they are crazier than even Lakesbison.

Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk

Cool.

[SDFS]

Says the guy who literally did the same thing, and is doing the same thing, as everybody else. You are fhawking ridiculous you know that right.

I don't get all the revisionist history but here you go...

2013 - Oakland leaves taking baseball with them - baseball has 5 teams
2013 - DU joins the SL without baseball
2013 - UND baseball joins WAC for baseball - see quote about a request for membership below.
2014 - Oral Roberts joins with baseball - baseball has 6 teams

Link: http://www.thedickinsonpress.com/content/und-accepted-wac-baseball

Quote:

The Summit League, which includes North Dakota State and South Dakota State, was one option for UND baseball. But that option never materialized. "We had applied for the Summit but I never heard anything personally from them," Dodson said.

Does everyone understand that the Summit League has the min number of teams in 4 sports:

Currently SL men's sports has 6 teams competing in: Baseball, Swimming and Diving, Indoor Track and Outdoor Track. UND had teams in all those sports. Now only three of them, UND joining helps to strengthen the men's side of the sports ledger.

[SDFS]

It is a full league, the problem for UND is that the Summit doesn't need other sports right now. It needs baseball. If the Summit loses it's baseball autobid it loses it's autobid in every sport. You ever heard of a conference surviving without an autobid for any sport? No? Didn't think so.

Adding a non baseball school doesn't solve anything. It adds to the issue because you're expanding a conference for the sake of expanding. That takes means NCAA unit money spread more thin. That hurts the conference members.


There aren't many baseball teams in the midwest...by that, I mean there are about 0 that don't belong to a "bigger" conference. For a bigger version of the photo below click here: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/e/e0/Baseball_d1.png


NOTE: The Summit League has 9 Men's sports - 7 of them have less than 8 teams participating. UND would match up in 5 of those 7 sports even without baseball:

5 team plus 1 affiliate:
Men's Swimming and Diving

6 teams participating:
Baseball, Soccer, Indoor and Outdoor track and field.

7 teams participating:
Cross Country and Tennis

[Redbird007]

NOTE: The Summit League has 9 Men's sports - 7 of them have less than 8 teams participating. UND would match up in 5 of those 7 sports even without baseball:

5 team plus 1 affiliate:
Men's Swimming and Diving

6 teams participating:
Baseball, Soccer, Indoor and Outdoor track and field.

7 teams participating:
Cross Country and Tennis

Looking at the value of adding UND to Summit League now makes sense when considering all sports as the Summit is thin on numbers for many sports.

[SDFS]

UNI hasn't shared a conference with UND since 1977...

UNI's head coach wasn't in middle school yet....he's 53 now.

Are you saying the Men's basketball coaches doesn't know anything about UND????

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ben_Jacobson

After his senior year he was named 1989's North Dakota Mr. Basketball (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Dakota_Mr._Basketball). Jacobson went on to play collegiately at the University of North Dakota from 1989-1993. He was a four-year letterman for the Sioux, a two-year starter, and he ended his career as the school's all-time assist leader. UND made two Division 2 Elite Eight appearances and four regional appearances, along with winning two conference championships, during his career. He was team captain in 1991-92 and 1992–93, was named to the NCC's All-Academic Team in 1993, and was a player representative to UND's letterwinner's association from 1991-93.

Later he was an assistant coach at you guessed it UND.

Let's see how about the previous head coach at UNI - his name was Greg McDermott

McDermott began his coaching career as an assistant coach at North Dakota (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/University_of_North_Dakota_men%27s_basketball) between 1989 and 1994, and during his tenure helped lead the Fighting Sioux to five consecutive NCAA Division II (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Division_II_(NCAA)) tournaments.

[Thumper 76]

NOTE: The Summit League has 9 Men's sports - 7 of them have less than 8 teams participating. UND would match up in 5 of those 7 sports even without baseball:

5 team plus 1 affiliate:
Men's Swimming and Diving

6 teams participating:
Baseball, Soccer, Indoor and Outdoor track and field.

7 teams participating:
Cross Country and Tennis

See, that's some good info. I'm much more for adding UND, I didn't realize those others sports were that close too.

[UNIFanSince1983]

Well, it appears that Denver, WIU and USD have all joined without baseball.

What year did all those teams join? Was the league short on baseball, and in a place where if they lose one more team they lose the basketball auto bid?

Again not saying it can't happen. Not saying it won't happen just curious about these things.

[UNIFanSince1983]

Are you saying the Men's basketball coaches doesn't know anything about UND????

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ben_Jacobson

After his senior year he was named 1989's North Dakota Mr. Basketball (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Dakota_Mr._Basketball). Jacobson went on to play collegiately at the University of North Dakota from 1989-1993. He was a four-year letterman for the Sioux, a two-year starter, and he ended his career as the school's all-time assist leader. UND made two Division 2 Elite Eight appearances and four regional appearances, along with winning two conference championships, during his career. He was team captain in 1991-92 and 1992–93, was named to the NCC's All-Academic Team in 1993, and was a player representative to UND's letterwinner's association from 1991-93.

Later he was an assistant coach at you guessed it UND.

Let's see how about the previous head coach at UNI - his name was Greg McDermott

McDermott began his coaching career as an assistant coach at North Dakota (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/University_of_North_Dakota_men%27s_basketball) between 1989 and 1994, and during his tenure helped lead the Fighting Sioux to five consecutive NCAA Division II (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Division_II_(NCAA)) tournaments.

I believe he was saying he knows nothing of the history of UNI and UND being in the same conference.

Because as he said UNI and UND haven't been in the same conference since 1977 in which he would not even have been in middle school yet.

[clenz]

Are you saying the Men's basketball coaches doesn't know anything about UND????

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ben_Jacobson

After his senior year he was named 1989's North Dakota Mr. Basketball (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Dakota_Mr._Basketball). Jacobson went on to play collegiately at the University of North Dakota from 1989-1993. He was a four-year letterman for the Sioux, a two-year starter, and he ended his career as the school's all-time assist leader. UND made two Division 2 Elite Eight appearances and four regional appearances, along with winning two conference championships, during his career. He was team captain in 1991-92 and 1992–93, was named to the NCC's All-Academic Team in 1993, and was a player representative to UND's letterwinner's association from 1991-93.

Later he was an assistant coach at you guessed it UND.

Let's see how about the previous head coach at UNI - his name was Greg McDermott

McDermott began his coaching career as an assistant coach at North Dakota (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/University_of_North_Dakota_men%27s_basketball) between 1989 and 1994, and during his tenure helped lead the Fighting Sioux to five consecutive NCAA Division II (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Division_II_(NCAA)) tournaments.
1. This is a football topic. Our basketball coach has nothing to do with this. But since you brought it up. Yes, Jake played at UND and coached there. He also coached at NDSU with Greg. He's been at UNI since 2001...which is longer than the time he was at UND in any capacity - player or coach. He was an assistant to McDermott - a UNI grad. Obviously Jake knows UND. If you remember right, as I already pointed out in this thread, UNI plays UND in basketball - a lot. It's not because UNI needs to fill it's schedule. It's because of the connection with Jake. Hell, UNI has played UND 5 times since the start of the 09-10 season, Jake's 3rd as UNI head coach. UNI has won all 5 games. The average MOV in the series is something like 26 points. This past season UNI played at UND...won 97-51 and pulled the foot off the gas with about 10 minutes left in the first half. Coach Jake was born in 1970. He was 7 when UNI left the NCC. That means he was in 1st grade the last time UNI/UND played a conference game of any kind against each other. Now, Jake is a scholar of the game and played in the NCC, so he gets the NCC. He likely has no feelings of UNI and the NCC. Also, why the hell do you think UNI would ever consider anything conference wise if it meant being with UND? You want to give me a history lesson about UNI basketball and it's coaches? I gave more history on Jake and McDermott in the 20 seconds it took me to type that, off memory, than you did with the 15 minutes it took to you to think of that reply and research it.

2. Farley is 53. In 1976, the last conference game played, he would have been 13 so I guess I was wrong. He was likely 7th or 8th grade. Mark didn't grow up in Cedar Falls, he grew up in Waukon, Iowa - thus the Walk-on from Waukon title. The connection he has to UND is literally less than zero when it comes to conference alignment. Not that it pertains to this article, but Farley reading an article that came out on Farley from earlier this week Farley is closer wanting an FBS move than wanting UND in the MVFC.

3. Isn't it something to behold? The greatest non-hockey D1 accomplishment is Ben Jacobson played basketball here in the early 90s....piggy backing his UNI success.

[F'N Hawks]

1. This is a football topic. Our basketball coach has nothing to do with this. But since you brought it up. Yes, Jake played at UND and coached there. He also coached at NDSU with Greg. He's been at UNI since 2001...which is longer than the time he was at UND in any capacity - player or coach. He was an assistant to McDermott - a UNI grad. Obviously Jake knows UND. If you remember right, as I already pointed out in this thread, UNI plays UND in basketball - a lot. It's not because UNI needs to fill it's schedule. It's because of the connection with Jake. Hell, UNI has played UND 5 times since the start of the 09-10 season, Jake's 3rd as UNI head coach. UNI has won all 5 games. The average MOV in the series is something like 26 points. This past season UNI played at UND...won 97-51 and pulled the foot off the gas with about 10 minutes left in the first half. Coach Jake was born in 1970. He was 7 when UNI left the NCC. That means he was in 1st grade the last time UNI/UND played a conference game of any kind against each other. Now, Jake is a scholar of the game and played in the NCC, so he gets the NCC. He likely has no feelings of UNI and the NCC. Also, why the hell do you think UNI would ever consider anything conference wise if it meant being with UND? You want to give me a history lesson about UNI basketball and it's coaches? I gave more history on Jake and McDermott in the 20 seconds it took me to type that, off memory, than you did with the 15 minutes it took to you to think of that reply and research it.

2. Farley is 53. In 1976, the last conference game played, he would have been 13 so I guess I was wrong. He was likely 7th or 8th grade. Mark didn't grow up in Cedar Falls, he grew up in Waukon, Iowa - thus the Walk-on from Waukon title. The connection he has to UND is literally less than zero when it comes to conference alignment. Not that it pertains to this article, but Farley reading an article that came out on Farley from earlier this week Farley is closer wanting an FBS move than wanting UND in the MVFC.

3. Isn't it something to behold? The greatest non-hockey D1 accomplishment is Ben Jacobson played basketball here in the early 90s....piggy backing his UNI success.

xflamemadx Geez. Nothing on the actual facts presented, just this?

[ST_Lawson]

What year did all those teams join? Was the league short on baseball, and in a place where if they lose one more team they lose the basketball auto bid?

Again not saying it can't happen. Not saying it won't happen just curious about these things.

For WIU, we've always been. We're a founding member...the only one left, I think. And as far back as I can remember, we've always had baseball.

So I don't get his thing about Western joining without baseball.

[Schism55]

3. Isn't it something to behold? The greatest non-hockey D1 accomplishment is Ben Jacobson played basketball here in the early 90s....piggy backing his UNI success.

UND has muuuuuch more famous ex athletes than Ben Jacobson lol. *cough* Phil Jackson
Pains me to say it but they did win D2 natty in 01 as well.

[goyotes]

I know there are certain rules about the number of sports with a minimum number of teams that a conference must have in order to have the conference receive a automatic bid to the basketball Big Dance. Does anyone know the specifics?

[SDFS]

What year did all those teams join? Was the league short on baseball, and in a place where if they lose one more team they lose the basketball auto bid?

Again not saying it can't happen. Not saying it won't happen just curious about these things.

I had posted this previously, I will post here again. To answer your question, yes DU joined when SL had a waiver for 5 teams in baseball.

I don't get all the revisionist history but here you go...

2013 - Oakland leaves taking baseball with them - baseball has 5 teams
2013 - DU joins the SL without baseball
2013 - UND baseball joins WAC for baseball - see quote about a request for membership below.
2014 - Oral Roberts joins with baseball - baseball has 6 teams

Link: http://www.thedickinsonpress.com/con...d-wac-baseball (http://www.thedickinsonpress.com/content/und-accepted-wac-baseball)

Quote:

The Summit League, which includes North Dakota State and South Dakota State, was one option for UND baseball. But that option never materialized. "We had applied for the Summit but I never heard anything personally from them," Dodson said.

Does everyone understand that the Summit League has the min number of teams in 4 sports:

Currently SL men's sports has 6 teams competing in: Baseball, Swimming and Diving, Indoor Track and Outdoor Track. UND had teams in all those sports. Now only three of them, UND joining helps to strengthen the men's side of the sports ledger.

[SDFS]

I believe he was saying he knows nothing of the history of UNI and UND being in the same conference.

Because as he said UNI and UND haven't been in the same conference since 1977 in which he would not even have been in middle school yet.

Thanks for the clarification, he was talking Summit League stuff which is a basketball/Olympic sports only league and then used the general term head coach. I naturally assumed he was talking about mens basketball.

[SDFS]

1. This is a football topic. Our basketball coach has nothing to do with this. But since you brought it up. Yes, Jake played at UND and coached there. He also coached at NDSU with Greg. He's been at UNI since 2001...which is longer than the time he was at UND in any capacity - player or coach. He was an assistant to McDermott - a UNI grad. Obviously Jake knows UND. If you remember right, as I already pointed out in this thread, UNI plays UND in basketball - a lot. It's not because UNI needs to fill it's.....

I get it... this is a football message board but you were talking about the SL. I assumed you were talking about Men's basketball coach. And yes, I know that UNI has pounded UND in basketball lately. Maybe it's that ****ty coach we have that played at UNI. xrolleyesx



2. Farley is 53. In 1976, the last conference game played, he would have been 13 so I guess I was wrong. He was likely 7th or 8th grade. Mark didn't grow up in Cedar Falls, he grew up in Waukon, Iowa - thus the Walk-on from Waukon title. The connection he has to UND is literally less than zero when it comes to conference alignment. Not that it pertains to this article, but Farley reading an article that came out on Farley from earlier this week Farley is closer wanting an FBS move than wanting UND in the MVFC. That's fine what FBS conference - the American or the MAC?



3. Isn't it something to behold? The greatest non-hockey D1 accomplishment is Ben Jacobson played basketball here in the early 90s....piggy backing his UNI success.

Just to clarify - Ben played at UND and starting coaching at UND. He is currently coaching at UNI. I assume that you are saying that I am trying to piggy back on his success as a UNI coach. Which would be 1 NCAA run into the sweet 16 and 4 NCAA tournament appearances. All are a very nice list of accomplishments and something to be very proud of I agree. No intent to piggy back on that though. I did notice a very nice coaching tree at UNI - Norm Steward, McDermott, and Jacobson. UND has nothing in the area of basketball to talk about though you are correct.

Didn't mean to get you all wound up.. damn all this basketball talk - I have football game to watch.. wait, I am a UND fan - dam it when does hockey start?!?

[SDFS]

For WIU, we've always been. We're a founding member...the only one left, I think. And as far back as I can remember, we've always had baseball.

So I don't get his thing about Western joining without baseball.

Sorry about that I meant IUPUI - my mistake. Wow - WIU - is a charter member of the Summit League. I had no idea. UNI was a charter member also.

[mmiller_34]

I think that Derrik T Sovak should be your new AD. He seems to know a lot about Athletic Departments.

xlolx


By Derrik T. Sovak
Published: Tuesday, August 31, 2004

I thought that I might have trouble writing this column. But after I reviewed all the facts surrounding our overzealous neighbors to the south at North Dakota State, I realized that talking **** about them just gets easier and easier.

On Saturday, NDSU hosted Valparaiso to a crowd of just over 18,000. They absolutely stomped Valpo to the tune of 52-0. As I watched local sports highlights and saw all of the Bison players patting each other's back for the ousting, I wondered how they were going to look at themselves in the mirror without laughing.

Note to NDSU: Valparaiso offers no scholarships to their players. That means that they have less of a recruiting pool than Bethune-Cookman. Valpo also plays in the Pioneer Football League, which is almost as prestigious as NDSU's Great West Conference. Both these conferences look like the island of misfit schools. And when you get two teams like the Bison and the Crusaders on the field it's almost a toss up.

The Bison were a sub-par team in Division II football last year, and the Crusaders finished 8-4 without a playoff appearance last season. So what happened in Fargo on Saturday was as far away from amazing as you can get without actually being at the Neverland Ranch.

Everyone is so excited around the NDSU campus. Football means something to these people. But I feel it my duty to be the asshole and let them in on a little secret. For the next decade, NDSU football will be as arbitrary as paying .40 cents for ranch at Buffalo Wild Wings after running up a $500 bar tab.

Saturday's matchup was between two unranked schools in leagues that mean nothing to anyone. A win is a win but when I'd still rather watch a team of midgets play a team of chimpanzees.

This is an old argument. I said it last year, and it's no secret that I think NDSU's move to DI was a terrible decision. So I don't want NDSU to get their hopes up too high. If they really think that every team they play in that other Division is going to lie down and take it like its their first time, they're wrong.

Just like when the Bison were getting crushed by DII teams every weekend, they will face a team that hands them a 52-0 loss and then we in Grand Forks will hear the griping and crying from the south. And I can say proudly that I saw it coming.

On the other hand, UND had a barn-burner against Delta State - the number 2 and 10 teams in the country - in GF on Saturday. I witnessed great things in that game and there's a chance that we could see those teams meet again in the near future. Valpo won't be back in Fargo unless either they or the Bison need to fill their already defunct schedules next season.

I feel all warm and fuzzy inside knowing that at UND football still has pride. I like knowing that, even though we're "only Division II" we still can watch two ranked teams play in a city like Grand Forks. It makes for good football, which we won't see in Fargo for a long time.

It also came to my attention that NDSU has revolutionized college football by introducing something called tailgating at their games.

Take this as you may, but your football program is not going to prosper any faster just because some freshman had a beer before the game. I don't know about the rest of you guys, but I'm going to wait with bated breath for the Montana Tech game in a couple of weeks.

R.I.P. Bison Athletics.




Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk

Wow.

[Twentysix]

Wow.

We deal with unbounded stupidity. xcoffeex