Strength Rankings of FCS Conferences

[SU DOG]

http://www.fcs.football/cfb/story.asp?i=20160606125413968645304

[Professor Chaos]

I wonder if Haley knows that NDSU's "veteran" team has something like 11 seniors this year?

[chattownmocs]

Craig's SOCON analysis

The good: everyone else

The bad and ugly: chattanooga

Reality

The good: chattanooga

The bad and the ugly: everyone else.

By the way craig, are you high?

[Catatonic]

My apologies to the rest of the SLC for our part in dragging down the strength of the SLC based on our less than optimal results last year.

[PaladinFan]

Craig's SOCON analysis

The good: everyone else

The bad and ugly: chattanooga

Reality

The good: chattanooga

The bad and the ugly: everyone else.

By the way craig, are you high?

The reality is the SoCon is largely level pegging, with the talent level being less than it was 10 or 15 years ago. The top of the conference is less good than it was, but the bottom is better than they have been.

[Daytripper]

My apologies to the rest of the SLC for our part in dragging down the strength of the SLC based on our less than optimal results last year.

You are forgiven. Just don't let it happen again...xnonox

[chattownmocs]

The reality is the SoCon is largely level pegging, with the talent level being less than it was 10 or 15 years ago. The top of the conference is less good than it was, but the bottom is better than they have been.

10-15 years??? Asu and GSU just left a couple years ago. Chattanooga lost to the numer 1 seed in very tight games the last 2 years. They've lost one game in the SoCon since app state and GSU left. And that was a massive upset. Almost every game that was supposed to be a challenge was all but over by halftime. How is chattanooga the problem with the southern conference?

[PaladinFan]

10-15 years??? Asu and GSU just left a couple years ago. Chattanooga lost to the numer 1 seed in very tight games the last 2 years. They've lost one game in the SoCon since app state and GSU left. And that was a massive upset. Almost every game that was supposed to be a challenge was all but over by halftime. How is chattanooga the problem with the southern conference?

I didn't say they were the problem. I said there was more parity.

The best team in the conference (UTC) is not as talented as the teams that dominated the SoCon from 2000-2007. Those were perennial title contenders. The talent level between those teams and the rest of the conference was a chasm. UTC has been the standard bearer recently, but still has never asserted itself as a legitimate threat to a national title.

Right now, the talent in the conference is far more evenly spread out. I think it makes for a more competitive conference, but the overall talent level is less than it was.

I think that is just a reality of 2016 college football, frankly. There are, what, a dozen more teams in the FCS/FBS in the SoCon footprint than there were? Other teams moving up to the FBS sucking up more scholarship players? Don't have to go to Wofford to figure out that if you add hundreds of more scholarship opportunities to play football, there is less opportunity for the majority of that talent to congregate in only a few schools.

[JSUSoutherner]

Craig's SOCON analysis

The good: everyone else

The bad and ugly: chattanooga

Reality

The good: chattanooga

The bad and the ugly: everyone else.

By the way craig, are you high?
If you weren't a total homer you would have noticed that it actually said:

Good: More depth in the conference

Bad: Chatty is consistently good, but they still aren't able to take that next step and compete for a title like App State and Southern could.

Unless you really do think you guys are Southern or App State (which, new flash, you aren't. Those teams actually know what it's like to get past the quarterfinals) sit down and quit complaining about nothing.

[Go Lehigh TU Owl]

Big South ahead of the PL without CCU? Maybe on the strength of Charleston Southern? Top to bottom I would take the PL at this point. With this said, Lehigh needs to take care of Monmouth to start the year....

[Twentysix]

mvfc so stronk. So stronk.

[McNeese72]

My apologies to the rest of the SLC for our part in dragging down the strength of the SLC based on our less than optimal results last year.

Nah, we all suck!!!

Doc

[Model Citizen]

OKAY...we've got the PFL right up at the top of a news article. That's the way it should be.

xembarrassedx

[chattownmocs]

If you weren't a total homer you would have noticed that it actually said:

Good: More depth in the conference

Bad: Chatty is consistently good, but they still aren't able to take that next step and compete for a title like App State and Southern could.

Unless you really do think you guys are Southern or App State (which, new flash, you aren't. Those teams actually know what it's like to get past the quarterfinals) sit down and quit complaining about nothing.

Newsflash: App State and georgia southern weren't that great. App state was a national title contender before they left. Chattanooga is a national title contender. They were the last 2 years and they will be this year. When was the last time georgia southern won a national championship? They were no better than chattanooga is before they left.

Just because they were ranked top 5 every year in the preseason and chattanooga is underrated, doesn't make it true. There is less parity now., we have an even larger talent advantage. Because mercer pulled a massive upset the conference is wide open? Please.

[Herder]

Mr. Craig, reminder.

App won 3 consecutive titles during a period where ndsu was not eligible for the FCS playoffs.

Ndsu won 3 consecutive titles while App & GS were FCS and eligible.

Dont go having a selective memory on us now.

[JSUSoutherner]

Newsflash: App State and georgia southern weren't that great. App state was a national title contender before they left. Chattanooga is a national title contender. They were the last 2 years and they will be this year. When was the last time georgia southern won a national championship? They were no better than chattanooga is before they left.

Just because they were ranked top 5 every year in the preseason and chattanooga is underrated, doesn't make it true. There is less parity now., we have an even larger talent advantage. Because mercer pulled a massive upset the conference is wide open? Please.
Georgia Southern had three straight appearances in the semifinals before they left. And App State won 3 national championships in the decade before they left.

Hell, App State has won more playoff games in Finley Staidum than Chattanooga has.

It's interesting how Chattanooga's first SoCon championship in almost 30 years came after App State and Georgia Southern left.

Another interesting note. In the period between UTC's 1984 SoCon championship and their 2013 championship, GSU and App had 22 SoCon championships and 9 national championships between the both of them. So yeah it's pretty safe to say that UTC hasn't matched their success yet.

[chattownmocs]

Georgia Southern had three straight appearances in the semifinals before they left. And App State won 3 national championships in the decade before they left.

Hell, App State has won more playoff games in Finley Staidum than Chattanooga has.

It's interesting how Chattanooga's first SoCon championship in almost 30 years came after App State and Georgia Southern left.

Another interesting note. In the period between UTC's 1984 SoCon championship and their 2013 championship, GSU and App had 22 SoCon championships and 9 national championships between the both of them. So yeah it's pretty safe to say that UTC hasn't matched their success yet.

Actually it didn't come after they left. Nice ****ing try. You don't know anything. Changing the argument to historic success is an admission of defeat. Chattanooga has replaced what georgia southern and app state were when they left. A decade ago+ has nothing to do with it. App state in particular, was no better in the years before they left. They were lucky chattanooga kept letting them off the hook then.

[JSUSoutherner]

Actually it didn't come after they left. Nice ****ing try. You don't know anything. Changing the argument to historic success is an admission of defeat. Chattanooga has replaced what georgia southern and app state were when they left. A decade ago+ has nothing to do with it. App state in particular, was no better in the years before they left. They were lucky chattanooga kept letting them off the hook then.
App State and Georgia Southern weren't eligible for the championship in 2013 because of their FBS transition. Before that you have to go all the way back to 2003 to find a year where GSU nor App State had a peice of the championship. But OK.

[Son of Eli]

The Ivy League should be rated over The Patriot League. The Ivy League had a 16-8 record against OOC opponents last year. They were 9-6 against the Patriot League. This includes a 2-1 record against the Patriot League Champion Colgate. Mid level Ivy League teams Yale and Princeton both beat Colgate. Yale did it on the road. Colgate barely beat last place Cornell. The Ivy League was even 4-0 against the CAA. This is a long term trend. Over the last 5 years the Ivy League is 39-37 against the Patriot League. Yes the three league champions are loosing a lot of players this year. But the Ivy League has some of the strongest incoming recruiting classes in all of FCS. 247 Sports ranked Yale with the number one recruiting class in the FCS. Yale's recruiting class was ranked higher than many FBS schools including Rice. Patriot League recruits are rated much lower.

[PaladinFan]

App State and Georgia Southern weren't eligible for the championship in 2013 because of their FBS transition. Before that you have to go all the way back to 2003 to find a year where GSU nor App State had a peice of the championship. But OK.

App State and GSU wouldn't have won the SoCon title even if they had been eligible. Both finished about middle of the back. UTC/Furman/Samford split the title. Of course, UTC was left home in the playoff selection.

[PaladinFan]

Newsflash: App State and georgia southern weren't that great. App state was a national title contender before they left. Chattanooga is a national title contender. They were the last 2 years and they will be this year. When was the last time georgia southern won a national championship? They were no better than chattanooga is before they left.

Just because they were ranked top 5 every year in the preseason and chattanooga is underrated, doesn't make it true. There is less parity now., we have an even larger talent advantage. Because mercer pulled a massive upset the conference is wide open? Please.

In all seriousness, what exactly makes UTC a title contender?

Title contenders beat good teams in the post season. They actually contend for the title. UTC has won one more playoff game than Furman has since 2013 for pete's sake, and we are awful.

[Gater]

I agree with Son of Eli that the Ivy League should be ranked higher than the Patriot League. That being said, I do think the PL is trending up (this will be the first year where everyone except Georgetown has four years of scholarship classes). The thing that will help the Ivies move up more than anything is the PL doing better out of conference. The Ivies basically never schedule up so there is no one to compare them with other than Patriot League schools and the occasional CAA team not named URI.

The Ivies will always be ranked lower than they deserve based of the teams they schedule. But they also don't deserve to be ranked any higher than they are based on who they schedule. It's kind of a shame that these really strong programs don't have the guts to take on anybody. Harvard playing at Montana would be a great game and great for the FCS--and would do nothing but improve the football program at Harvard and the football experience for the kids. Not sure if it will ever change (even with the Ivies having basically unlimited athletic scholarships) but it's pretty weak.

[JSUSoutherner]

App State and GSU wouldn't have won the SoCon title even if they had been eligible. Both finished about middle of the back. UTC/Furman/Samford split the title. Of course, UTC was left home in the playoff selection.
You bring a fair point.

However, in the years prior, they were both legit contenders for extended periods of time. In the decade before their transition App State had a playoff record of 16-5 and 3 championships. And in the 5 years before transition GSU had a playoff record of 7-3 and 3 trips to the semi-finals.

UTC has an all time playoff record of 2-3, never been past the quarterfinals and their best win in the postseason was the runner up for the Partriot League.

My point (or rather Craig Haley's point) isn't that UTC sucks or that they are "what's wrong with the SoCon. They don't suck and aren't a problem. It's just that they still lack the post season success that App State and GSU had.

[TheValleyRaider]

The Ivy League should be rated over The Patriot League. The Ivy League had a 16-8 record against OOC opponents last year. They were 9-6 against the Patriot League. This includes a 2-1 record against the Patriot League Champion Colgate. Mid level Ivy League teams Yale and Princeton both beat Colgate. Yale did it on the road. Colgate barely beat last place Cornell. The Ivy League was even 4-0 against the CAA. This is a long term trend. Over the last 5 years the Ivy League is 39-37 against the Patriot League. Yes the three league champions are loosing a lot of players this year. But the Ivy League has some of the strongest incoming recruiting classes in all of FCS. 247 Sports ranked Yale with the number one recruiting class in the FCS. Yale's recruiting class was ranked higher than many FBS schools including Rice. Patriot League recruits are rated much lower.

Doesn't that suggest that over the long term (if you mean 5 years as "long term"), the two leagues are about even? Or even that 2015 was an anomaly? That is, if the Ivies were +8 in 2015, doesn't follow that the PL was +6 over the previous 4 years?

I do think the Ivies are, on the whole, a little stronger, but nationally we're going to get the benefit of the doubt as a playoff conference with some more substantive OOC games. The Ivies' 4-0 against the CAA looks a little less impressive when 3 games were against Rhode Island and Maine (combined 4 wins). That same Colgate team you mention also won at New Hampshire and James Madison in the playoffs, which isn't too shabby.

[Son of Eli]

I agree with Son of Eli that the Ivy League should be ranked higher than the Patriot League. That being said, I do think the PL is trending up (this will be the first year where everyone except Georgetown has four years of scholarship classes). The thing that will help the Ivies move up more than anything is the PL doing better out of conference. The Ivies basically never schedule up so there is no one to compare them with other than Patriot League schools and the occasional CAA team not named URI.

The Ivies will always be ranked lower than they deserve based of the teams they schedule. But they also don't deserve to be ranked any higher than they are based on who they schedule. It's kind of a shame that these really strong programs don't have the guts to take on anybody. Harvard playing at Montana would be a great game and great for the FCS--and would do nothing but improve the football program at Harvard and the football experience for the kids. Not sure if it will ever change (even with the Ivies having basically unlimited athletic scholarships) but it's pretty weak.

Yale has the guts. They scheduled Cal Poly in 2013, Army in 2014 and Maine in 2015. They won all three games. Penn has also shown an appetite for aggressive scheduling with Villanova and William & Mary. Brown has scheduled Stony Brook, Dartmouth has played New Hampshire, Princeton has played The Citadel, Columbia has scheduled Fordham. Cornell is slated to play Delaware twice in the near future. Harvard is really the only Ivy school which has avoided challenging OOC opponents in recent years.

[Son of Eli]

Doesn't that suggest that over the long term (if you mean 5 years as "long term"), the two leagues are about even? Or even that 2015 was an anomaly? That is, if the Ivies were +8 in 2015, doesn't follow that the PL was +6 over the previous 4 years?

I do think the Ivies are, on the whole, a little stronger, but nationally we're going to get the benefit of the doubt as a playoff conference with some more substantive OOC games. The Ivies' 4-0 against the CAA looks a little less impressive when 3 games were against Rhode Island and Maine (combined 4 wins). That same Colgate team you mention also won at New Hampshire and James Madison in the playoffs, which isn't too shabby.

Not quite. It was two victories over Rhode Island, one over Maine and the fourth was over a nationally ranked Villanova team.

Also the Ivies were plus three against the Patriot League last year, not plus eight. Point taken though that it still leaves the Patriot League with a one game edge in the previous four years.

[Go...gate]

Newsflash: App State and Georgia Southern weren't that great. App state was a national title contender before they left. Chattanooga is a national title contender. They were the last 2 years and they will be this year. When was the last time georgia southern won a national championship? They were no better than chattanooga is before they left.

Just because they were ranked top 5 every year in the preseason and chattanooga is underrated, doesn't make it true. There is less parity now., we have an even larger talent advantage. Because mercer pulled a massive upset the conference is wide open? Please.

Say what?????

[Go...gate]

Yale has the guts. They scheduled Cal Poly in 2013, Army in 2014 and Maine in 2015. They won all three games. Penn has also shown an appetite for aggressive scheduling with Villanova and William & Mary. Brown has scheduled Stony Brook, Dartmouth has played New Hampshire, Princeton has played The Citadel, Columbia has scheduled Fordham. Harvard is really the only Ivy school which has avoided challenging OOC opponents in recent years.

Not to mention that, except for Penn, the rest of the Ivy has watered down their schedules a good bit.

[Gater]

Yale has the guts. They scheduled Cal Poly in 2013, Army in 2014 and Maine in 2015. They won all three games. Penn has also shown an appetite for aggressive scheduling with Villanova and William & Mary. Brown has scheduled Stony Brook, Dartmouth has played New Hampshire, Princeton has played The Citadel, Columbia has scheduled Fordham. Harvard is really the only Ivy school which has avoided challenging OOC opponents in recent years.

Son of Eli, it is what it is. Yes, Dartmouth has played UNH. Let's look at the other 17 out of league games they have scheduled since 2010.

They have played Holy Cross 5 times
Sacred Heart 4
Bucknell 2
Butler 2
Central Conn St. 2
Colgate 1
Georgetown 1

The Ivies have some very good teams. (I'm a Colgate fan and I think the Ivy League should be ranked above the Patriot League.) The problem is that the league schedules games not to be embarrassed instead of games where they can rise to the occasion, take on school they have no business playing, and shock the world. The Ivy League schedules guarantee that there will be no miracles. No #1 rankings. And also no drubbings. It's all very safe and I can't imagine a football fan from any of these schools feels very good about it.

[Son of Eli]

Son of Eli, it is what it is. Yes, Dartmouth has played UNH. Let's look at the other 17 out of league games they have scheduled since 2010.

They have played Holy Cross 5 times
Sacred Heart 4
Bucknell 2
Butler 2
Central Conn St. 2
Colgate 1
Georgetown 1

The Ivies have some very good teams. (I'm a Colgate fan and I think the Ivy League should be ranked above the Patriot League.) The problem is that the league schedules games not to be embarrassed instead of games where they can rise to the occasion, take on school they have no business playing, and shock the world. The Ivy League schedules guarantee that there will be no miracles. No #1 rankings. And also no drubbings. It's all very safe and I can't imagine a football fan from any of these schools feels very good about it.


I agree Gator that the recent Ivy trend is to increasingly schedule down. I would like to point out that Yale isn't following this trend. Yale hasn't played a Pioneer League team since 2006 and has never played a NEC team. Yale's future schedules are exclusively with Patriot and CAA teams (including Colgate in 2016 and 2018). I regret that the rest of the Ivy League is increasingly scheduling NEC teams and I especially regret the scheduling of Pioneer League teams. I strongly oppose this trend. In fairness to Dartmouth however I should note that they are scheduled to play Army in the future and are playing two CAA teams this year (Towson and New Hampshire).

[Gater]

As a Son of Eli, it's nice to see that Yale is willing to schedule better teams. I think the Ivies are at the beginning of an athletic arms race with advent of free tuition for so many and their football should only improve. (On a side note, It will be interesting to see if Stanford can take the next step in the BCS with free tuition for students whose parents make under $125k.) Hard to imagine the Ivies not doing well in sports like lacrosse (with it's limit of 12.6 scholarships per team) when they can have the entire team getting free rides (or having parents too rich to care).

[chattownmocs]

Say what?????

I said what

[chattownmocs]

In all seriousness, what exactly makes UTC a title contender?

Title contenders beat good teams in the post season. They actually contend for the title. UTC has won one more playoff game than Furman has since 2013 for pete's sake, and we are awful.

Their elite talent for this level that goes across the board. It's what allows chattanooga to bully teams like furman who can play with paper programs like coastal(who is considered betterthan chattanooga because of ignorance) but can't compete with UTC. We are going to have to go 10-1 to get the proper respect so we don't have to face number 1 or 2. The reason why is because they are going to rank Charleston southern, sam houston state, Montana, and possibly even the citadel ahead of utc, for no legitimate reason. Despite the fact that utc has some most experience returning in the country.

It's what allows craig haley to say make idi

[Professor Chaos]

Their elite talent for this level that goes across the board. It's what allows chattanooga to bully teams like furman who can play with paper programs like coastal(who is considered betterthan chattanooga because of ignorance) but can't compete with UTC. We are going to have to go 10-1 to get the proper respect so we don't have to face number 1 or 2. The reason why is because they are going to rank Charleston southern, sam houston state, Montana, and possibly even the citadel ahead of utc, for no legitimate reason. Despite the fact that utc has some most experience returning in the country.

It's what allows craig haley to say make idi
So UTC is a national title contender unless they have to play #1 or #2. Got it.

[PaladinFan]

You bring a fair point.

However, in the years prior, they were both legit contenders for extended periods of time. In the decade before their transition App State had a playoff record of 16-5 and 3 championships. And in the 5 years before transition GSU had a playoff record of 7-3 and 3 trips to the semi-finals.

UTC has an all time playoff record of 2-3, never been past the quarterfinals and their best win in the postseason was the runner up for the Partriot League.

My point (or rather Craig Haley's point) isn't that UTC sucks or that they are "what's wrong with the SoCon. They don't suck and aren't a problem. It's just that they still lack the post season success that App State and GSU had.

I don't disagree with that point. In my opinion, no current team in the SoCon would stay within 3 touchdowns of 2000, 2001, 2004 Georgia Southern, 2004 or 2005 Furman, or 2005-2007 App State. Those teams would just bludgeon the stuffing out of you for four quarters.

Would App's 2007 team lose to Mercer, struggle with Presbyterian, and beat VMI by six? In my opinion, no.

UTC is a good team. They are the best team in this iteration of the SoCon. They have a lofty ranking. Lofty rankings don't mean terribly much. Maybe it isn't a fair criticism, but if you call yourself a title contender, you should demonstrate an ability to win big games in the post season and actually contend for the title.

[Go Lehigh TU Owl]

Not quite. It was two victories over Rhode Island, one over Maine and the fourth was over a nationally ranked Villanova team.

Also the Ivies were plus three against the Patriot League last year, not plus eight. Point taken though that it still leaves the Patriot League with a one game edge in the previous four years.

Lehigh gets Penn, Princeton and Yale this year. The Hawks have definitely taken it on the chin the last two years from the IL but prior to that they went on a 3-4 year run of domination over the league.

Overall, I think the leagues are pretty even. The IL does recruit at a higher level but at the end the day the talent seems equal. Lehigh's better teams have always had an athletic advantage over the IL, even against Harvard.

[Son of Eli]

Lehigh gets Penn, Princeton and Yale this year. The Hawks have definitely taken it on the chin the last two years from the IL but prior to that they went on a 3-4 year run of domination over the league.

Overall, I think the leagues are pretty even. The IL does recruit at a higher level but at the end the day the talent seems equal. Lehigh's better teams have always had an athletic advantage over the IL, even against Harvard.



I agree that currently it is very close. That's what makes the Ivy-Patriot scheduling partnership so good. That and the long history of competition between the schools. I hope it continues long into the future. However, I still think that today the Ivy League has the edge.

Historically its not even close. If you want to get a really long term trend the Patriot League is 484-776-46 (tel:484-776-46) with a .388 winning % against the Ivy League across the 100+ year football history of the schools.

http://www.cfbdatawarehouse.com/data/div_iaa/patriot/vs_conf.php

[JSUSoutherner]

Their elite talent for this level that goes across the board. It's what allows chattanooga to bully teams like furman who can play with paper programs like coastal(who is considered betterthan chattanooga because of ignorance) but can't compete with UTC. We are going to have to go 10-1 to get the proper respect so we don't have to face number 1 or 2. The reason why is because they are going to rank Charleston southern, sam houston state, Montana, and possibly even the citadel ahead of utc, for no legitimate reason. Despite the fact that utc has some most experience returning in the country.

It's what allows craig haley to say make idi
Bully teams like Furman, VMI, and Mercer? :D

Let's put on our thinking caps and see why Chuck South and others were ranked above UTC or may be in the upcoming preseason:

Chuck South:
-10 win season? Check
-No FCS regular season losses? Check.
-Made it past the second round? Check.

Sam Houston:
- 10 win season? Check.
- Beat three conference champions? Check.
- Made it past the second round? Check.

El Cid, CCU, and Montana:
-Ended season ranked above UTC? Nope. Looks like Chattown is blowing smoke again.

Will they be above UTC in the preseason? (Not including Coastal because of their transition)

-Did either of them lose a QB who accounted for over 62% of their ENTIRE offense? Nope.

And before you inevitably bring up your overhyped recruiting class...
http://www.anygivensaturday.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=22587&stc=1
#MakeChattanoogaGreatAgain

-Do preseason rankings even matter anyway? Nope, just win baby.

Although it must be comforting knowing you guys actually have a shot at a 10 win regular season this year since we aren't on your schedule. :D

https://pbs.twimg.com/tweet_video/CVfqDRvVEAAVtbB.mp4

[UAalum72]

I agree Gator that the recent Ivy trend is to increasingly schedule down. I would like to point out that Yale isn't following this trend. Yale hasn't played a Pioneer League team since 2006 and has never played a NEC team.
Not never. Albany was in the NEC when they won at the Yale Bowl 23-20 in 2010.

[Daytripper]

Their elite talent for this level that goes across the board. It's what allows chattanooga to bully teams like furman who can play with paper programs like coastal(who is considered betterthan chattanooga because of ignorance) but can't compete with UTC. We are going to have to go 10-1 to get the proper respect so we don't have to face number 1 or 2. The reason why is because they are going to rank Charleston southern, sam houston state, Montana, and possibly even the citadel ahead of utc, for no legitimate reason. Despite the fact that utc has some most experience returning in the country.

It's what allows craig haley to say make idi

Respect is earned. Win some playoff games.

[KPSUL]

In all seriousness, what exactly makes UTC a title contender?

Title contenders beat good teams in the post season. They actually contend for the title. UTC has won one more playoff game than Furman has since 2013 for pete's sake, and we are awful.

In 2013 and 2015, NDSU was so much better than everyone else come playoff time, I'm not sure any other team could have been considered a title contender. In 2014 and 2015 Chattanooga was right in the thick of things, winning some playoff games and losing to very good teams by a thin margin both years. How one defines the term "title contender" is highly subjective, but IMO Chatty was a strong contender the last two seasons. With the loss of Jacob Huesman, it's hard to say whether or not they will be a "title contender" in 2016. Right now I'd put them slightly out of that elite category.

[TheValleyRaider]

Not quite. It was two victories over Rhode Island, one over Maine and the fourth was over a nationally ranked Villanova team.

Also the Ivies were plus three against the Patriot League last year, not plus eight. Point taken though that it still leaves the Patriot League with a one game edge in the previous four years.

My misreading on your naming "OOC" not "vs. PL"

I won't let you off the hook so easily for Nova, though. They may have been ranked when Penn played them, but finished 6-5 with 1 good win (Richmond) and out of the polls. The Penn team who beat them also lost to two PL teams (Lehigh and Fordham). Of course, Fordham also lost to Nova, so hurray for small sample sizes xrotatehx

[BisonFan02]

Their elite talent for this level that goes across the board. It's what allows chattanooga to bully teams like furman who can play with paper programs like coastal(who is considered betterthan chattanooga because of ignorance) but can't compete with UTC. We are going to have to go 10-1 to get the proper respect so we don't have to face number 1 or 2. The reason why is because they are going to rank Charleston southern, sam houston state, Montana, and possibly even the citadel ahead of utc, for no legitimate reason. Despite the fact that utc has some most experience returning in the country.

It's what allows craig haley to say make idi

Don't go a changin' chatty.... xlolx

[tierre]

I wouldn't be surprised that we (SWAC) are at next to last. We must start scheduling regional FCS schools and stop playing NAIA and DIII schools as OOC games.

[ngineer]

Fully agree with the observation that PL teams don't play enough defense....It's been horrible the past few years.

[Gangtackle11]

My misreading on your naming "OOC" not "vs. PL"

I won't let you off the hook so easily for Nova, though. They may have been ranked when Penn played them, but finished 6-5 with 1 good win (Richmond) and out of the polls. The Penn team who beat them also lost to two PL teams (Lehigh and Fordham). Of course, Fordham also lost to Nova, so hurray for small sample sizes xrotatehx

Kudos to Penn beating Nova. The Cats were reeling from losing returning Walter Payton award winning QB John Robertson the weekend before the Penn game.

The Cats turned to a RS frosh QB who had a positive season, but was definitely getting used to taking over the helm of a top 10 FCS team at the time that night. It didn't help that the game was moved up to a Thursday night to accommodate the Pope's visit.

Penn shocked Nova and got out to a 17-0 lead. It looked like Nova would eek out a win, but a fumble going in for a NovaTD turned into a 90 yard TD return for Penn sealed the Quakers 1st win over Nova since 1911.

Nova was never the same and battled all season to end what was to be a championship run into a 6-5 season.

Penn played with a swagger that night on the Main line & Nova was dead as door nail.

Fordham gave the Cats a game on a rainy night in the Bronx. Nova dominated the line of scrimmage that night, but the Rams kept them out of the endzone most of the night. 14-7 Nova win.

I think Nova was overrated last preseason mainly because the offense sustained a lot of injuries (OLine especially) & the final blow of JR going down exposed it all.

It was a very disappointing season, but with expectations not as high this season there is a good chance they may sneak up on the CAA/FCS this season.

[Son of Eli]

Kudos to Penn beating Nova. The Cats were reeling from losing returning Walter Payton award winning QB John Robertson the weekend before the Penn game.

The Cats turned to a RS frosh QB who had a positive season, but was definitely getting used to taking over the helm of a top 10 FCS team at the time that night. It didn't help that the game was moved up to a Thursday night to accommodate the Pope's visit.

Penn shocked Nova and got out to a 17-0 lead. It looked like Nova would eek out a win, but a fumble going in for a NovaTD turned into a 90 yard TD return for Penn sealed the Quakers 1st win over Nova since 1911.

Nova was never the same and battled all season to end what was to be a championship run into a 6-5 season.

Penn played with a swagger that night on the Main line & Nova was dead as door nail.

Fordham gave the Cats a game on a rainy night in the Bronx. Nova dominated the line of scrimmage that night, but the Rams kept them out of the endzone most of the night. 14-7 Nova win.

I think Nova was overrated last preseason mainly because the offense sustained a lot of injuries (OLine especially) & the final blow of JR going down exposed it all.

It was a very disappointing season, but with expectations not as high this season there is a good chance they may sneak up on the CAA/FCS this season.


it took Penn over 100 years to finally beat Villanova. I hope they resume the series shortly so it doesn't take Penn another 100 years to beat Villanova again.

[Gangtackle11]

it took Penn over 100 years to finally beat Villanova. I hope they resume the series shortly so it doesn't take Penn another 100 years to best Villanova again.

Coach Talley & previous Penn coach Al Bagnoli kept the series going. Prior to the last season's game it was starting to lose its luster since they were often 1 sided Villanova wins.

I think you will see Villanova opting for 2 Patriot League opponents like the next 2 seasons (Lehigh & Lafayette) for the foreseeable future before bringing Penn back on the schedule.

[BigHouseClosedEnd]

I believe this fall will be the strongest CAA in 5 years or more.

JMU seems to have hired a really good coach and a strong JMU is good for the league. The same can be said for Delaware. Hopefully, Brock proves himself one way or another for UD administrators this year.

The bottom of the conference should be improved too. Albany and Elon are both moving in a good direction, IMO.

[andthehomeofthe-BIZON-]

I believe this fall will be the strongest CAA in 5 years or more.

JMU seems to have hired a really good coach and a strong JMU is good for the league. The same can be said for Delaware. Hopefully, Brock proves himself one way or another for UD administrators this year.

The bottom of the conference should be improved too. Albany and Elon are both moving in a good direction, IMO.

Could you explain your opinion on this? No offense intended but I pretty much pay no attention to the middling to bottom teams in other conferences but agree that the top teams look like they are trending up. Richmond looks tough. Also curious why everyone in the CAA seems so down on Bill and Mary for next season.

[TribeNomad1]

Could you explain your opinion on this? No offense intended but I pretty much pay no attention to the middling to bottom teams in other conferences but agree that the top teams look like they are trending up. Richmond looks tough. Also curious why everyone in the CAA seems so down on Bill and Mary for next season.

Let me offer a guess. W&M has had a very solid defense the last few years, but saw slippage last year. Couple that with the loss of multi year stars at DT, LB and DB and folks are seeing '16 as a year where teams will run over and around the defense. I too have concerns, but hope some guys that played last year when starters were out with injuries, as well as the introduction of talented RF players will help fill the void.

On offense, barring injuries, we will play hell on other defenses, big, deep and experienced OL, senior QB, lots of talent at the skill positions. Oh yeah, kick ass punter and PK as well.

[andthehomeofthe-BIZON-]

Gracias senior

[BigHouseClosedEnd]

Could you explain your opinion on this? No offense intended but I pretty much pay no attention to the middling to bottom teams in other conferences but agree that the top teams look like they are trending up. Richmond looks tough. Also curious why everyone in the CAA seems so down on Bill and Mary for next season.

Elon and Albany both have good young coaches. I don't expect either to be in the playoffs but I do expect both of them will be more than a speed bump.

Regarding W&M, there's a ton of respect for that program but Jimmye seems incapable of surprising anyone with any of his stuff at this point.

[KPSUL]

Elon and Albany both have good young coaches. I don't expect either to be in the playoffs but I do expect both of them will be more than a speed bump.

Regarding W&M, there's a ton of respect for that program but Jimmye seems incapable of surprising anyone with any of his stuff at this point.

Skorsky (Elon) and Gatuso (Albany) are both in their 50s, so an argument could be made that they are neither young nor proven good at this point.

[MR. CHICKEN]

Elon and Albany both have good young coaches. I don't expect either to be in the playoffs but I do expect both of them will be more than a speed bump.

Regarding W&M, there's a ton of respect for that program but Jimmye seems incapable of surprising anyone with any of his stuff at this point.

........ALBANY WAS 3-8 LAST YEAR......HAVE 11 SENIORS DIS SEASON....ELON...WAS 4-7.....HAVE 9 SENIORS DIS YEAR......RAWAK!

[MR. CHICKEN]

Skorsky (Elon) and Gatuso (Albany) are both in their 50s, so an argument could be made that they are neither young nor proven good at this point.

.......GREG GATTUSO......WAS 97-32 AS HEAD COACH UH DUQUESNE.......PRETTY PROVEN...........DOODLE-DOO!

[KPSUL]

.......GREG GATTUSO......WAS 97-32 AS HEAD COACH UH DUQUESNE.......PRETTY PROVEN...........DOODLE-DOO!

5-11 as a CAA head coach. The Duquesne run ended in 2004, back when he really was young. The much beloved Delaware head coach, BRAWWK, is putting up better CAA numbers than that and most you Delaware fans want him tarred and feathered! (Sorry, bad analogy Mr. Chicken)